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[Back 4 Blood] from the developers of L4D, Out Now and on Game Pass!

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Posts

  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    Was playing around with a melee build last night with a friend while doing the golden skulls and I didn't realize how many cards melee has. I have Face Your Fears which gives 3 temp health whenever I kill a ridden within 2 meters, Vanguard which gives 1 temp health to me and nearby teammates when I do a melee kill, Battle Lust which gives 2 health per melee kill, and Ignore the Pain which gives 20% melee damage against mutations and when I deal melee damage to a mutation I gain 1 temp health and recover 3 stamina.

    I basically never die with enough ridden around and the farther down it goes I pretty much never run out of stamina and I attack crazy fast.

    I do feel like I need to probably drop some melee specific cards for movement speed though. I have trouble keeping up with the team if they sprint because I've been using Mean Drunk so I can't sprint. I could just not use Mean Drunk but getting 75% melee damage is pretty awesome.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
  • drunkenpandarendrunkenpandaren Slapping all the goblin ham In the top laneRegistered User regular
    Whoa. This is going to be a long post since I started replying to several people throughout the day but never had time to finish the post.

    Stragint wrote: »
    I'm goofing around with a dual primary weapon deck that uses the admin reload for the reload when a weapon is stowed but I get 15% less ammo capacity and ammo stash which gives my secondary infinite ammo but my secondary weapon reloads 20% slower.

    It has been fun so far with some reload speed to offset ammo stash.
    I guess if you're having fun with it then don't fix it, but my knee jerk reaction to that combination is that you have some anti-synergy going on there.

    Ammo stash provides infinite ammo for the sidearm, which IMO looks like a potentially strong effect. But the effect is lost if you replace the sidearm with a second primary weapon. At least that's what I've observed when I tried pairing dual primaries + infinite secondary ammo in a bot match to test out how the cards interacted.

    I also question the +reload speed boosts alongside admin reload. They both hasten reloads but they don't really compliment each other. I have to wonder if it would be more efficient to double down on admin reload with +weapon swap speed boosts.

    But if it's working for you, then don't fix what's not broke.
    Moridin889 wrote: »
    One card that I definitely want to play around more with is "Adrenaline Fueled." I'm not sure if the card is amazing or a trap. It provides a +100% boost to stamina capacity and additionally it regenerates 10 stamina instantly upon kill and an additional 10 of 5 seconds after that kill, but the downside is that it nerfs your passive stamina regeneration rate by 75%. It obviously has some synergy with "Run and Gun" by providing a means to regenerate stamina while sprinting, but I'm unsure if it is something that might be worth running on its own. On paper the payoff is that if lots of zeds are chasing you, you can burst the pack down with automatic fire to get a big spike of stamina. But is that worth the passive generation loss?

    If you are Holly and run a melee build you never run out of stamina as long as you are hitting trash. It can also be mitigated by some mobility perks pretty easily which tend to give stamina regen and movement speed and overall stamina so I like them anyways
    Yeah, Holly with adrenaline fuelled and the heal on melee kill can basically stand and swing a bat through a mob of any size as long as other people keep the specials off her

    Reading back I realized that I didn't properly articulate my concerns about adrenaline fueled. I agree with you both that it looks like it has strong synergy with melee builds and some other cards. To take a second attempt at voicing my concern, I'm concerned about whether or not the card is worth running in a vacuum as a deck's only stamina related card? Is that effect worth it on its own, or is it something that you only want to take if you can synergize it with something else?

    Zomro wrote: »
    The same Hag carried me away twice in the same game! If we hadn't bailed on that group, I'd have probably been more annoyed at it, but the Hag just kept coming for me and I couldn't help but laugh at its persistence.

    Flashbangs are a HUGE help in this situation. I highly recommend carrying some if you know that the mission will contain a hag, such as that one mission near the end of act 1. Someone was being eaten by a Hag last night and a flashbang made her abort the devour animation and spit them back out. Then she retreated after the flashbang wore off. I don't know if the retreat was part of a normal response to the flashbang or if we had DPS'd her below her retreat threshold during the stun duration. I'm also unsure if she'd spit them out after completing the devour animation or not.
    eMoander wrote: »
    I started this up a few days ago, but I think I finally understand the people saying recruit is too easy. My first several runs with randoms were just painful, with no coordination and people just dying left and right for indiscernable reasons. My first group last night was Act 1-4 (I think), where you have to put the explosives on the cruise ship. It took several tries just to get to the ship since people kept randomly getting downed which then set up a chain reaction of others getting downed trying to get the first guys up again. Once we get to the base, me and one other guy pick up the explosives and go to set them on the ship... but the other two guys don't bother to come help and just hang out at the base shooting stuff. Luckily we were able to 2-man setting the explosives and pass it, and then they dropped so I got a new group.

    I've seen this too. A lot of players seemingly clueless to the genre. A big issue is with people charging ahead oblivious to the fact that the person at the back of the group will get slowed when attacked by zeds. This leads to splitting the party and all of the problems associated with that. The chain reaction that you describe is what I refer to as a failure cascade. Where one failure can quickly lead to multiple failures as player judgement starts to falter and the team loses the capability to recover with every warm body lost. When things start getting hectic, it's important to keep your head on your shoulders like first responders do IRL. You can't save somebody until you verify that the situation is first under control, otherwise you are at risk of being hurt yourself and then there are TWO people that need saving. If somebody gets downed, it's important to secure the area before attempting to rez them. Maybe that means postponing the rez until a threat like a Hocker is first removed. Maybe that means waiting for a third player to cover you while you rez. Maybe that means tossing out a pipebomb or flashbang to buy some time for a rez. Sometimes you need to let them die since a heroic attempt to intervene would most likely result in two deaths instead of one.

    For the ferry mission that you mentioned, IMO it does make sense for someone to stay behind. They can provide covering fire with the chaingun to cover your escape from the boat. I don't think that two people need to stay behind though.

    Below is how I've been trying to carry random PUGs, although I'm not fully satisfied with this generalist build since I've still only used it in recruit and I'll probably be playing recruit for a few more days due to a friend of mine just starting out and he'll probably want to wait a bit before going to vet.
    1. My primary weapon of choice is an LMG, preferably an RPK due to higher damage per shot, due to how I perceive it as providing the potential to both deal with swarms and concentrate firepower on specials/bosses. I prioritize compensator/acog/stumble ammo/ADS boosting stock. I might take a different ammo if it's a gold double-ammo. Ammo conservation is a bit of a concern with LMGs though.
    2. I always carry toolkits with me since loot rooms tend to contain ammo, a medicine cabinet, and loot to help refresh the team.
    3. Flashbangs are my offensive consumable of choice since they can defang bosses and stop point blank tallboys in their tracks. Flashbangs/fireworks get honorable mention for helping secure an area for a rez though.
    4. I ideally run Hoffman since his ammo drop passive helps the team with ammo sustain, and the extra grenade helps keep sticky situations locked down. If someone else runs him though, then no big deal. The ammo will be dropping regardless. Maybe Jim or Doc for secondary choices for the extra aim speed or the teamwide heals/trauma resist?
    5. Avoid buying weapons/modules/gear at the shop unless it would provide a massive boost. Flashbangs before a boss fight, finally grabbing an ADS stock for my LMG, etc. The teamwide boosts provide better snowballing power by upgrading our gear.

    This is the current deck that I'm running, although it's still a big work in progress.

    4h0rhvq3a5sj.jpg

    The rationale behind the cards
    • 1-2: Get the economic cards rolling early so that they can snobwall into teamwide buff purchases and lategame affluence. I'm unsure if the "copper spawns more frequently" aspect of copper scavengers stacks with teammates or not. I've read conflicting opinions. However this is a PUB build, so it's assumed that teammates can't be depended upon to run copper scavenger.
    • 3-4: The combat knife has been nice for helping ration ammo by simply stabbing ambient trash instead of wasting bullets on them. Battle lust combined with the hunting knife provides a respectable amount of self-health sustain by healing me for dozens of HP per level. However I do wonder if it would be better to run ammo scavenger to provide more ammo, and whatever the name of the healing item scavenger card is to force more healing items to spawn> I don't have those cards yet though.
    • 5: Breakout. Simply put, pubs cannot be relied upon to free me from grabs. Since my quick-slot is occupied by a toolkit to reap the rewards of opening locked rooms, I'm stuck with this as my self-escape option.
    • 6: Steady aim: LMGs have poor ADS speed. This helps with that.
    • 7: Admin reload is here to help with the poor reload speeds of LMGs. I just unlocked this and used to run reload speed boosting cards here instead.
    • 8: Poultice provides what I feel to be a noticeable boost to early game low quality healing items, and makes late game rapid use bandages a desirable alternative to medkits.
    • 9: I FINALLY start grabbing some offensive boosting cards. Reckless strategy is currently the most potent weakpoint card that I own. I wish that damage came online sooner, but I feel like the above bases need to be covered a bit better if my teammates are playing like headless chickens in the earlier maps.
    • 10: More damage. In my eyes confident killer is effectively +15% global damage. It takes time to ramp up, but not that long.
    • 11: MOAR DAMAGE. I originally was going to run silver bullets here, but for LMGs I think tactical vests may be the better choice. I don't know if the extra bullet pen of silver bullets would be worth it.
    • 12: I'm not sure if grenade pouch is worth the deck slot. I'm torn between running something else, or running the "everyone on the team gets +1 grenade slot" card.
    • 13: I question if wounded animal is worth a slot. I'm continuing to experiment with it.
    • 14: Ridden slayer is more elite/monster weakpoint damage.
    • 15: I'm still just experimenting with adrenaline fueled. If I end up liking it, I may end up including it earlier in the list.


    Some idle thoughts:
    • Very few people are using sniper rifles and to a lesser extent shotguns. Assault rifle ammo is often in high demand, which means that there is a push to take efforts to ration LMG ammo.
    • I don't think that I can use a sniper rifle with pugs. The bolt action rifles seem like very viable weapons, but I need more potential to burst down masses of enemies when babysitting pugs. My knee-jerk reaction to the semi-auto snipers is that they fall into an awkward worst of both worlds position between ARs and the bolt actions, but I will need to try them again later.
    • I don't think that I can use shotguns with pugs either since Hockers are such a threat and I need the potential to reach out and delete them
    • I've heard reports that +accuracy effects tighten the spread of shotguns to the point that you effectively are shooting laser accurate slugs at very high accuracy values. I think that I eventually need to experiment with that once I have sufficient +accuracy cards.

    eMoander wrote: »
    So anyways, at this point it is absolutely clearly 100% the players that are creating the difficulty, at least on recruit. I'm enjoying being the melee tank on Holly. As far as I can tell, does melee not do friendly fire damage? Every once in a while I think I might hit someone, but often I'm just swinging into the horde with cleaners nearby and there is clearly no issue.

    There is no friendly fire on recruit, although players will complain about FF. I'm unsure about melee friendly fire, but I imagine that it's not present due to melee normally being friendly fire safe in this type of game and due to the fact that I've never heard the characters play FF voice lines when I turn around and stab a teammate in the face with my hunting knife.

    I suggest experimenting with a no ADS build for LMGs. As I found out by accident, LMGs get more accurate when you fire them from the hip as you sustain fire. With a decent laser sight on it, you're basically carrying a big SMG with more innate bullet pen.

    Origin: HaxtonWasHere
    Steam: pandas_gota_gun
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    edited October 2021
    Stragint wrote: »
    Was playing around with a melee build last night with a friend while doing the golden skulls and I didn't realize how many cards melee has. I have Face Your Fears which gives 3 temp health whenever I kill a ridden within 2 meters, Vanguard which gives 1 temp health to me and nearby teammates when I do a melee kill, Battle Lust which gives 2 health per melee kill, and Ignore the Pain which gives 20% melee damage against mutations and when I deal melee damage to a mutation I gain 1 temp health and recover 3 stamina.

    I basically never die with enough ridden around and the farther down it goes I pretty much never run out of stamina and I attack crazy fast.

    I do feel like I need to probably drop some melee specific cards for movement speed though. I have trouble keeping up with the team if they sprint because I've been using Mean Drunk so I can't sprint. I could just not use Mean Drunk but getting 75% melee damage is pretty awesome.

    Yeah the burst of speed when you get hit by a ridden card would be useful too.

    urahonky on
  • General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Stragint wrote: »
    What do the golden skulls in the game give? My friend and I got them all but we don't know what we got besides achievements.

    I don't know firsthand, but some google searches suggest that it's just achievements. Maybe those achievements might unlock some cosmetics? I think that there is a spray or banner that depicts those gold skulls.
    my wall of text

    I suggest experimenting with a no ADS build for LMGs. As I found out by accident, LMGs get more accurate when you fire them from the hip as you sustain fire. With a decent laser sight on it, you're basically carrying a big SMG with more innate bullet pen.

    At the time I didn't have any of the no ADS cards, but now I've gotten some of them. I kind of want to try a no ADS shotgun build first though.

    I'm not in a proper position to definitively judge balance yet, but IMO a lot of these cards are going to need to be looked at in terms of their advantages and disadvantages. No ADS is one of them. A lot of the downsides on these cards are written in that if you take one then it's not good, and doubling down on that downside makes things really rotten. Stuff like decreased stamina efficiency or damage resistance just get more potent in terms of downside the more that you stack. But no ADS? Stacking more of those doesn't hurt you any more than the first. The only penalty to losing ADS is that ADS is more accurate than hipfire. But that penalty goes away entirely once you get accuracy high enough, especially with that +accuracy card that disables ADS. The no-ADS build gains even more of a boon since it also sidesteps the "minus movement speed while ADS" penalty like you see on cards like Hyper-focused. Maybe hyperfocused should be rewritten so that it is no longer "+50% weakpoint damage, -75% ADS move speed" to "+50% weakpoint damage WHILE ADS, -75% move speed." Maybe "Quick Kill" should lose its "penalty" of "Disables ADS" in exchange for some other penalty so that a No-ADS build has to eat a penalty in the first place?

    I don't know. Maybe needing to dedicate those slots for the +accuracy cards in the first place is sufficient penalty in itself. I think it's just something that an eye will have to be kept on as more players become accustomed to the game and a meta starts to formulate.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
  • General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited October 2021
    I started trying out the no-ADS cards tonight. Mathematically they're stupid strong but thematically I like aiming down sights. It also still just rubs me the wrong way that some of the most potent effects are stapled to "downsides" that are 100% ignored when running a hipfire build. Meanwhile negative effects that get really painful when stacked like reduced HP, damage resistance, or stamina efficiency are all stapled to cards with weaker upsides. You don't even miss out on accuracy with the hipefire build since those no-ADS "downside" cards let you stack accuracy to the point where you're just a pinpoint precise railgun from the hip. The one big downside to the hipfire builds is that they can't really run "Run-like-hell" for an easy 15% movement speed boost.

    I used an LMG that I found in the first few levels until I found a blue AA-12, and then my teammates all bailed on the match. I swear that 99% of the console players that I've played with will abandon an act 30-50% of the way through the run. I wish that crossplay wasn't on by default since the matchmaker fails to find teammates and just starts the match with bots when I try to queue up a match with crossplay turned off.

    I've started running the Shredder card pretty early in my deck and I've noticed it being pretty impactful. It applies a stacking debuff to the target for each bullet hit where it takes more damage from all sources. 1% more damage per bullet up to 15%. I'm unsure if the effect stacks with other players running Shredder, but IMO it makes a noticeable difference in the team downing tallboys in the early stages where the team lacks good weapons and helps accelerate early ogre/breaker kills.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Had several good pugs this weekend so it must be the weekday crowd that is just plain awful at the game.

    General_Armchair
  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    Same dude who has the hip fire build has a money build and I want to try it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA588sbtnzs

    Also ended up getting purple offensive items on the diner defense mission in act 1 and we surrounded a corner with fuck tons of razor wire and only had to shoot special ridden. The normals died in the razor wire. I also love that as the rarity goes up the chance to not use up the item when using it goes up.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
    PreacherdrunkenpandarenGeneral_Armchair
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    urahonky wrote: »
    Had several good pugs this weekend so it must be the weekday crowd that is just plain awful at the game.

    Or as people try and suck at the game they quit thus leaving the better players?

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    urahonky wrote: »
    Had several good pugs this weekend so it must be the weekday crowd that is just plain awful at the game.

    Or as people try and suck at the game they quit thus leaving the better players?

    Fuck em!

    Preacher
  • TalithTalith 変態という名の紳士 Miami, FLRegistered User regular
    The difficulty is just wildly all over the place, which is definitely off-putting. Finally cleared act 4, but the inconsistency of the difficulty is causing those I play with to consider waiting on the devs to patch and balance before playing further.

    7244qyoka3pp.gif
  • drunkenpandarendrunkenpandaren Slapping all the goblin ham In the top laneRegistered User regular
    Stragint wrote: »
    Same dude who has the hip fire build has a money build and I want to try it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA588sbtnzs

    A copper build seems neat but it's really a pug build through and through. Playing in a group, copper doesn't seem to be that much of an issue since people are already tossing money on the ground to pool up for the 1500 purchases instead of buying whatever Garbo is on the vendor at the start of a map.

    Origin: HaxtonWasHere
    Steam: pandas_gota_gun
    General_Armchair
  • General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Honestly, with the current state of balance, IMO all that you need to go big on money are Copper Scavenger and Money Grubbers. Those two, especially combined, just dramatically outperform the other economic cards. I think only compound interest competes if you have a team pooling their cash onto you, but that's pretty much overkill. The rest of the economic cards in the build have some serious diminishing returns on your reward compared to your card investment.

    So far my prefered start is Copper Scavenger>Money Grubbers>Shredder. That seems to get the economic engine running and helps a lot with helping the team deal with crunchy targets in the early game when your weapons all suck. Beyond that flex into your favored cards I guess. I guess skip shredder if you're intending to run bolt action and to a lesser extent semi-auto sniper rifles.

    The only hard part is convincing pugs to give you some cash to buy a toolkit so that the team can raid the loot room on the first level. It's objectively a smart investment for the team as a whole since you'll get your money back, but not many listen and it's often not worth trying to explain. I suppose playing as Karlee solves that issue. I'll probably give her a try eventually. I've mostly been playing Hoffman to help keep ammo flowing.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
    drunkenpandaren
  • General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited October 2021
    Apparently the damage math behind the damage calculation is completely pants on head. This is worth a read/watch if you like to min/max this sort of stuff.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qg2575/damage_calculation_is_all_kinds_of_crazy/
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWpmxuSKBug


    edit:
    The information in the above may be faulty. Things are confusing.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Just finished Act 2 with a decent pug. We were able to quickly run through the finale.

    Feels good to start with 20 supply points and end with like 750.

    General_ArmchairPreacher
  • UrQuanLord88UrQuanLord88 Registered User regular
    Apparently the damage math behind the damage calculation is completely pants on head. This is worth a read/watch if you like to min/max this sort of stuff.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qg2575/damage_calculation_is_all_kinds_of_crazy/

    I really hate this game for how much information is hidden

    http://steamcommunity.com/id/urquanlord88
    urquanlord88.png
    Streaming 8PST on weeknights
    General_ArmchairTalithMoridin889drunkenpandarenEndaro
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited October 2021
    We had a great pug tonight, moved fast and sniped well

    And then at the end of act 2 scene 2 I blew up a boomer on the stairs under him and he flew eighty feet off the boat into the water and died instantly

    I feel pretty bad but also I survived, so

    Evil Multifarious on
    DixonFencingsaxurahonky
  • eddizhereeddizhere Scrubber Than A Sponge Scrubtown, USARegistered User regular
    Side note: in game chat wasn’t working for me on Xbox and I couldn’t figure out why for about two weeks. Saw someone mention unplugging their Kinect and it fixing their issue. I had a rocksmith usb cord plugged in (with nothing attached to the other side) and just decided to unplug it and reboot the game. Game chat works perfectly. Game is 1000x better now that I can communicate freely

    League of Legends: Plutoniumwombat
    Smite: Plutoniumwombat
    urahonky
  • General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Apparently the damage math behind the damage calculation is completely pants on head. This is worth a read/watch if you like to min/max this sort of stuff.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qg2575/damage_calculation_is_all_kinds_of_crazy/

    I really hate this game for how much information is hidden

    Apparently some people did some more testing and maybe "knowledge is power" itself is bugged and that things may work even differently still. It's spaghetti all the way down as far as I'm concerned.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    edited October 2021
    Veteran has been impossible with a PUG so far. Veteran also keeps throwing 3-4 big spewer special infected at us and it is such a giant pain in the ass to deal with those.

    People also can't seem to avoid birds, even when they are pinged.

    Stragint on
    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
    urahonkyPreacherdrunkenpandarenGeneral_Armchair
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Stragint wrote: »
    Veteran has been impossible with a PUG so far. Veteran also keeps throwing 3-4 big spewer special infected at us and it is such a giant pain in the ass to deal with those.

    People also can't seem to avoid birds, even when they are pinged.

    I never hate on people for fucking up birds because I've done it myself. THough I did learn you can kill them before they react. Like if the group all focus fires they die before they fly off, or a grenade will take care of them.

    Though anytime I'm in a group and the objective is "don't trigger anything" I know that one is not getting done.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Stragint wrote: »
    Veteran has been impossible with a PUG so far. Veteran also keeps throwing 3-4 big spewer special infected at us and it is such a giant pain in the ass to deal with those.

    People also can't seem to avoid birds, even when they are pinged.

    I never hate on people for fucking up birds because I've done it myself. THough I did learn you can kill them before they react. Like if the group all focus fires they die before they fly off, or a grenade will take care of them.

    Though anytime I'm in a group and the objective is "don't trigger anything" I know that one is not getting done.

    I don't get annoyed if someone shoots them by accident or something like that but when we are just walking along without anything to really mess with us and someone pings the birds but they still get activated I get annoyed. I've set off alarm cars and doors and birds plenty of times by accident when shooting and not realizing they were there or even if I knew they were there and I accidently shot towards them. I just feel like if we aren't being actively swarmed and someone pings them it shouldn't be hard to at least not walk right through them.

    I've failed a lot of runs because people keep setting off the birds when we aren't in danger and now we are in danger.

    I'm also not sure how many people know about grenades getting rid of birds. I only saw it in a video but it also seems really counter intuitive that the grenade gets rid of the birds. Like a big explosion not drawing a ton of infected but the birds do.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Every time I see the "increased birds" card show up I audibly growl because I know there's always one fucking idiot that just runs headstrong into them and causes 10 more hordes than we should.

  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Just ran a melee only build through act one. Man that was fun times. Sad that it ended up just being me and one other person because the other two couldn't handle the awesome.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    I feel like high bullet penetration might be bad specifically because of birds.

  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    I feel like high bullet penetration might be bad specifically because of birds.

    Them, sneetches, and any car. I know this because my gun builds all use bullet pen and I routinely trigger shit.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • SummaryJudgmentSummaryJudgment Grab the hottest iron you can find, stride in the Tower’s front door Registered User regular
    edited November 2021
    I'd be done for some sweaty tryhard Act 3 veteran attempts in about an hour

    Veteran Act 3 has me foiled; I found a group in Discord one day and we ran the entirety of A3 Part 1 as a one-shot and I didn't think much of it

    Been trying since and uh...I guess that was a really good group because goddamn I've just been struggling through it since (and I haven't found anyone up to Friend in Need, so we're starting at Act 3 Begin every time)

    SummaryJudgment on
    Some days Blue wonders why anyone ever bothered making numbers so small; other days she supposes even infinity needs to start somewhere.
    urahonky
  • SummaryJudgmentSummaryJudgment Grab the hottest iron you can find, stride in the Tower’s front door Registered User regular
    edited November 2021
    Currently running:

    Steady Aim (+80% aim speed, -50% ADS movement speed)
    Reckless Strategy (30% weakpoint dmg, -5% damage resist)
    Silver Bullets
    Ammo scavenger (this makes a huge difference, way more ammo spawns than the other scavenger cards spawn weapons or items)
    Marked for death (free 40% damage i.e. 10x4%, plus highlighted mutations)
    Fleet of foot (10% runspeed, -5% DR)
    Cocky (75% weapon swap speed, accuracy debuff when hit)
    Two is One and One is None
    Shredder
    Confident Killer
    Run Like hell (15% runspeed, accuracy debuff when hit)
    In the Zone (reload speed on precision kills)
    Screwdriver
    Cold Brew Coffee
    Hydration Pack

    Idea is to be kind of non-type-locked DPS, building into a LMG plus a nice stagger alternate - a Barrett sniper or a shotgun with stagger mods

    Any suggestions?

    SummaryJudgment on
    Some days Blue wonders why anyone ever bothered making numbers so small; other days she supposes even infinity needs to start somewhere.
    Preacher
  • drunkenpandarendrunkenpandaren Slapping all the goblin ham In the top laneRegistered User regular
    Currently running:

    Steady Aim (+80% aim speed, -50% ADS movement speed)
    Reckless Strategy (30% weakpoint dmg, -5% damage resist)
    Silver Bullets
    Ammo scavenger (this makes a huge difference, way more ammo spawns than the other scavenger cards spawn weapons or items)
    Marked for death (free 40% damage i.e. 10x4%, plus highlighted mutations)
    Fleet of foot (10% runspeed, -5% DR)
    Cocky (75% weapon swap speed, accuracy debuff when hit)
    Two is One and One is None
    Shredder
    Confident Killer
    Run Like hell (15% runspeed, accuracy debuff when hit)
    In the Zone (reload speed on precision kills)
    Screwdriver
    Cold Brew Coffee
    Hydration Pack

    Idea is to be kind of non-type-locked DPS, building into a LMG plus a nice stagger alternate - a Barrett sniper or a shotgun with stagger mods

    Any suggestions?

    I'd probably drop Screwdriver for Multitool, and maybe Silver Bullets for something else like that one card that makes more throwables spawn. Grenades everyday.

    Origin: HaxtonWasHere
    Steam: pandas_gota_gun
  • SummaryJudgmentSummaryJudgment Grab the hottest iron you can find, stride in the Tower’s front door Registered User regular
    Anyone around right now for Act 3 Vet?

    Some days Blue wonders why anyone ever bothered making numbers so small; other days she supposes even infinity needs to start somewhere.
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Sorry Summary I'm dead tired due to walking the kids around for Halloween.

  • General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Currently running:

    Steady Aim (+80% aim speed, -50% ADS movement speed)
    Reckless Strategy (30% weakpoint dmg, -5% damage resist)
    Silver Bullets
    Ammo scavenger (this makes a huge difference, way more ammo spawns than the other scavenger cards spawn weapons or items)
    Marked for death (free 40% damage i.e. 10x4%, plus highlighted mutations)
    Fleet of foot (10% runspeed, -5% DR)
    Cocky (75% weapon swap speed, accuracy debuff when hit)
    Two is One and One is None
    Shredder
    Confident Killer
    Run Like hell (15% runspeed, accuracy debuff when hit)
    In the Zone (reload speed on precision kills)
    Screwdriver
    Cold Brew Coffee
    Hydration Pack

    Idea is to be kind of non-type-locked DPS, building into a LMG plus a nice stagger alternate - a Barrett sniper or a shotgun with stagger mods

    Any suggestions?

    You're running a lot of the cards that I'm running. I haven't really taken the time to try to herd cats with the build in veteran though since I started getting fed up with pugs so now I'm mostly just playing the game when my friends want to, so consider the following simply food for thought.
    • If you can consider running some economic cards early, then those can snowball pretty hard into the later levels in an act. A lot of maps are a lot easier if you have a fat pocket full of firecrackers/flashbangs/razor wire. It's definitely not necessary though. It's just disheartening seeing 90% of pugs simply spending all of their money on guns and attachments each map. With some economic cards (mostly Money Grubbers being ridiculous), you can bankroll most of the team cards yourself. If the team faceplants during the early maps due to you running +economy instead of +damage, then they probably would have wiped eventually and you're just saving yourself some time by wiping early.
    • Consider swapping out Reckless Strategy for Hyper-focused. You are already running -ADS debuffs with Steady Aim, so you might as well commit to that since you're not going to be outrunning anything while ADS anyway. It seems like an obvious change to me, so I assume that you simply do not have the card.
    • Consider running Shredder as an earlier offensive skill. Anecdotally I've felt that this one has provided my biggest boost in the early game, especially against ogre/breakers when everyone has grey weapons since a 15% boost of damage to the whole team should be stronger than any individual DPS card. I still don't know if it stacks though, so it might be a dead card if someone else runs it.
    • Consider running Utility Scavenger instead of ammo scavenger. This card provides ammo via the ammo cans, and additionally provides the team with toolkits, defibs, and stunguns. Late game purple ammo cans provide hefty chunks of ammo. Try it. If it's sufficient for helping fulfill your ammo sustain, then it is fulfilling the role of ammo scavenger while additionally providing extra for your team. If not, then go back to ammo scavenger.
    • Consider swapping Fleet of Foot and Run Like Hell. My opinion is that if you want to run a +movespeed card then you're best off grabbing the bigger payoff early
    • Consider trying to make room for Admin reload? The synergy between it and Two is One is pretty strong and allows for very high uptime on your ability to send lead down range.
    • Assuming that it's a build for pugs, consider making room for one of the more potent medical cards. Experienced EMT seems to be the most popular since it provides an instaneous +20% HP boost the first time that you heal someone, and as a bonus it removes trauma damage between maps due to the way that the game simply truncates that +20% HP between maps and the fact that trauma damage is always at the end of your healthbar that gets truncated. Poultice is kind of nice too since it provides an extra +20 HP heal (over time) to any healing item, which goes a long way towards making early game healing more substantial and makes late game pills/bandages pretty nice. (I don't have experienced EMT unlocked yet)
    • Consider swapping out screwdriver for multitool. IMO if you're running a use speed card, run a bigger effect to make the investment of the card worth it.
    • Consider moving Steady Aim lower down into your list. I love the card but a lot of the time, especially in the early levels, I feel like I can play-around having sluggish ADS speed and that other cards would have a more immediate impact.
    • I'm in favor of keeping silver bullets. I'm a bit unsure of the following, but I think that the damage modifiers stack better if you stack lots of different types of +damage instead of doubling down on something like going all in on weakspot damage. There was some contention with how the damage math works and a bug with "Knowledge is power", so I'm unsure on this point.


    g0uoeq62uhzr.jpg
    This is the build that I've been running. I've been running Hoffman for more ammo sustain and have the intent of ultimately running LMG+SMG.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
    drunkenpandarenSummaryJudgment
  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    edited November 2021
    https://kotaku.com/more-people-are-playing-left-4-dead-2-than-back-4-blood-1847975649

    Here's hoping they can do some work on the game to recapture that audience

    I like many others don't really care about the deck aspect and just want to fun zombie co-op shooter

    Local H Jay on
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    https://kotaku.com/more-people-are-playing-left-4-dead-2-than-back-4-blood-1847975649

    Here's hoping they can do some work on the game to recapture that audience

    I like many others don't really care about the deck aspect and just want to fun zombie co-op shooter

    How many PC players are actually playing it on Steam though? Every person I group with is playing on Xbox Game Pass.

    The game is a fun co-op zombie shooter lol

    SeGaTaidrunkenpandaren
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    I feel the deck aspect makes the game? Like building a deck, doing a run seeing how it works that's awesome.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
    urahonky
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    I'm hopping online right now if anyone's interested in playing. B4B id is Samson4715#4202

    Preacher
  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    I feel the deck aspect makes the game? Like building a deck, doing a run seeing how it works that's awesome.

    Well I'm happy for you but for me I just wanted a spiritual successor to the Left 4 Dead games. And I can appreciate their ambition, but the deck building honestly just turns me off. I just want a free play mode where I can hop in and not have to worry about the deck. And that includes online co-op and versus. I mean almost all the complaints in this thread have been about how pubbies don't seem to understand the game and I'm sure the deck system has a lot to do with that

  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    I feel the deck aspect makes the game? Like building a deck, doing a run seeing how it works that's awesome.

    Well I'm happy for you but for me I just wanted a spiritual successor to the Left 4 Dead games. And I can appreciate their ambition, but the deck building honestly just turns me off. I just want a free play mode where I can hop in and not have to worry about the deck. And that includes online co-op and versus. I mean almost all the complaints in this thread have been about how pubbies don't seem to understand the game and I'm sure the deck system has a lot to do with that

    I don't think the deck building has anything to do with that honestly. Like my issue with pubbies is them not helping when you get stuck, or not avoiding obstacles. Those aren't deck related. Like that's just gameplay they can't adjust to.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
    urahonkyadytumMoridin889drunkenpandaren
  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    I feel the deck aspect makes the game? Like building a deck, doing a run seeing how it works that's awesome.

    Well I'm happy for you but for me I just wanted a spiritual successor to the Left 4 Dead games. And I can appreciate their ambition, but the deck building honestly just turns me off. I just want a free play mode where I can hop in and not have to worry about the deck. And that includes online co-op and versus. I mean almost all the complaints in this thread have been about how pubbies don't seem to understand the game and I'm sure the deck system has a lot to do with that

    I don't think the deck building has anything to do with that honestly. Like my issue with pubbies is them not helping when you get stuck, or not avoiding obstacles. Those aren't deck related. Like that's just gameplay they can't adjust to.

    Yea, my issue with PUGs is the exact same reason I avoided PUGs in L4D. People with zero awareness, people who wouldn't heal, people not helping out teammates, etc. All stuff that has nothing to do with the deck system itself.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
    PreacherurahonkyMoridin889drunkenpandaren
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    I mean if anything the Deck system lets people crutch out like picking all melee cards basically can make you an invincible truck of zombie slaying on recruit.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    Idk I played with pubbies a lot in L4D2 recently and most of them seemed to know it pretty well. But again, ten year old game. I'm still not hearing a reason we can't have a Freeplay mode.

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