Did the dialogue between Mark and Allen in the last issue bother anyone?
I think he was trying to emphasis the point that despite the fact Allen is basically a supporting character he and Invincible have only interacted for about 5 minutes and they spent most of that wailing on each other. Not that it was good mind you, but I think I get where he was going with it.
Though to be honest, and I hate saying this, but for the first time ever I've been kind of disappointed with the last few issues. I can't quite put my finger on it, but the whole book seems off some how. The writing is a bit stiffer and sloppier, the story seems to be stalling, and the whole flow is off. Maybe it's just me, but anything other than intensely impressed is pretty off for me on this book.
Did the dialogue between Mark and Allen in the last issue bother anyone?
I think he was trying to emphasis the point that despite the fact Allen is basically a supporting character he and Invincible have only interacted for about 5 minutes and they spent most of that wailing on each other. Not that it was good mind you, but I think I get where he was going with it.
Though to be honest, and I hate saying this, but for the first time ever I've been kind of disappointed with the last few issues. I can't quite put my finger on it, but the whole book seems off some how. The writing is a bit stiffer and sloppier, the story seems to be stalling, and the whole flow is off. Maybe it's just me, but anything other than intensely impressed is pretty off for me on this book.
It's not the fact that Allen had to be brought up to speed, but the fact that it was shown to us rather than glossed over. Maybe he needs to know what happened during the last few issues, but I didn't, especially since there was a recap issue not that long ago.
And Allen's reactions were so... generic that Mark could have been talking to literally anyone.
Reading the recap issue was a waste of time for people who've been reading it, so there is that. Otherwise, it does feel like it's between story arcs right now.
Bad as in bad. Stilted dialogue and predictable character turns!
I thought the dialogue was pretty good myself. It read like Kirkman's usual quippy style. It is still a little heavy on the exposition though, especially when Zechariah is talking, as it's still setting a lot of stuff up. But overall I thought it read well enough.
As for predictable character turns, the only thing really predictable that happened was
Wolf-Man eviscerating that Actioneer. Maybe Kirkman meant for it to be a shock, but as soon as Gary transformed I knew one of those guys were going to get it.
I think the book's biggest problem is that it's still kind of establishing itself. Hopefully it'll pick up after the initial arc. I mean, Fables and Invincible both had kind of slow starts as they worked to establish their status quo and introduce readers to the world and characters, only to pick up and turn awesome after the first arc was over. Hopefully it'll be the same thing here.
There were quips? My reading left me with the impression that the dialogue was bloated, unnatural, and oddly enough humorless.
"You are a creature of the night, like myself--and you are a being of great power. It is not easy for one such as myself to gain an ally and one as powerful as you will be very good to have."
That's not to say the word balloons are actually over-stuffed. They just feel overstuffed, mostly with exposition that could have gone without saying. Don't laundry list Wolf-Man's powers or tell me that's he's zombified a construction crew. FUCKING SHOW ME! Nobody bought this book to see two people talking on a roof.
And oh my God, Zechariah's giving meaningful pauses and side-stepping all of our hero's questions? I think he might be evil!
I actually have the feeling Kirkman's purposefully leading the reader to believe Zechariah's evil. After Gary said that becoming Wolf-Man was the best thing that's ever happened to him, all Zechariah said was, "Give it time." He obviously knows that Gary's powers have a downside when the moon is full, but I don't think he was withholding the information maliciously. If anyone's evil, it's the butler. It's always the butler.
And yeah, the dialogue's kind of rough in spots, but I can't think of a book I've read that didn't kind of stumble across an awkward sentence here of there. Some stuff just sounds good on paper but when read aloud sounds painfully awkward. I can think of several instances from Invincible, but the good outweighs the bad. I think that's the case in Wolf-Man too.
I think one of the biggest problems in the book so far is the art. Kirkman's always worked with artists that could really make their art emote (Moore, Ottley, Walker, Rathburn), but Jason Howard's art, being so stiff and plastic, really hurts the delivery of the dialogue. The problem's exacerbated by the protagonist having an inhuman face, making it even harder for the dialogue to come out of his mouth and look natural. Look at pages 2 and 3 of the book and you'll notice his expressions barely change.
It's certainly not a perfect book, but I'm willing to let it get through its first arc before I decide to drop it or keep it.
Also, this should probably be in the Image Universe thread.
It took Omniman less than 2 minutes to kill the guardians of the globe, supposedly the most powerful and organized super group on the face of the planet. That does not bode well for our planet at all.
He did sneak up on all of them.
Think of it this way: if Superman suddenly wanted to wipe out the core members of the Justice League by inviting them to the base, and then not holding back on any of his powers while his team was in the dark, the same could probably happen. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's not so much the heroes were weaker, but that Omniman was so much stronger.
Yeah, vol. 8 was so worth the wait. I'm loving Monster Girl's interactions with Rudy Robot, but I keep wondering when something sinister is going to arise from that subplot.
I mean, we know that Robot is eventually killed or otherwise taken out of the story somehow, based on the arc where Mark meets the future Guardians of the Globe and Rex is wearing Robot's armor, unless Eve just starts calling Robot by Rex's name Rex after the actual Rex dies or something. That, plus Robot's unusual interest in Monster Girl, combined with his cryptic remarks after she first starts warming up to him hints at something being not quite right. He's also outright stated that he can predict how people will respond to his actions based on his knowledge of them, yet he keeps making geeky, yet endearing blunders when speaking to Monster Girl. I get the feeling that he's playing her for some reason.
But I'll laugh if all his cryptic remarks and shadowy maneuvers were actually just a cover to get her to date him.
It took Omniman less than 2 minutes to kill the guardians of the globe, supposedly the most powerful and organized super group on the face of the planet. That does not bode well for our planet at all.
Yes but this series is set up Dragon Ball Z style
Omniman is Saiyin in that he is Uber Powerful and is practically a space pirate that kills alot of people
Going on that idea when he mates with someone not his race he creates a mixed breed that is capable of massive power at a young age.
Difference is that Omniman is a cross between Goku and Vegeta
invicible and his mother have the same relation ship Gohan and ChiChi has in that he wants to do stuff that involves his powers and she wants him to have an education and make something more from his life.
Alos his Brother is Goten, in that they developed certain things at a younger age. Goten became SSJ at a younger age while Invincible's brother developed poewrs at a young age.
Wouldn't be suprised if Kirkman continued to borrow from Dragan Ball.
Ah, but Invincible doesn't suck shit, so your whole comparison falls apart there.
Also, Superman's totally Goku. A super powerful alien whose race was wiped out save for a few select people who make up his supporting cast, and and once trained extensively in a chamber that altered time so that he could beat up a megavillain that would have typically been outside his abilities?
And don't get me started on how similar Identity Crisis was to Super Super Rape Boy Okay Go!
Maybe in functionality, sure. (Training, power levels)
But I can't honestly say the two stories are alike in the slightest.
Viltrum and Planet Vegeta are planets of warriors so powerful that they get sent out to conquer other planets.
Omniman is like Goku and Vegeta because he was sent to Earth to conquer it, but instead fails at the mission and abandons it. Goku failed because he was good, Vegeta failed because a more powerful member of his race stopped him. Both became two of the most powerful of their race.
Omniman is like Goku because he has a halfbreed son that has the potential to be stronger than his father and has a heart of gold.
Debbie Grayson is like ChiChi in that they are both wives of the powerful warrior, and want their powerful sons to focus on schooling instead of adventuring.
I had some more to list but I forgot them, and it really was only at the early parts of the series
Ah, but Invincible doesn't suck shit, so your whole comparison falls apart there.
Also, Superman's totally Goku. A super powerful alien whose race was wiped out save for a few select people who make up his supporting cast, and and once trained extensively in a chamber that altered time so that he could beat up a megavillain that would have typically been outside his abilities?
And don't get me started on how similar Identity Crisis was to Super Super Rape Boy Okay Go!
And seeing Dragonball is based on the legend of the monkey king, yeah, one could say there are similarities.
-Otherwordly powerful being lands on earth as a baby
-Is raised by humans
-Has one weakness that almost kills him
-Decides to fight evil, and save the Earth many times
-Has powers of strenght, flight, wind
-Among enemies the is an evil general from his home...
As much as Dragonball sucked (although the manga volumes were worth it for the fights, but the cartooon? 12 pages of a chapter do not an episode make) the monkey king is to the East what king Arthur is to the West.
We could easilt find hundreds of heroes with an arthurian-like story, the same way with the story of the monkey king.
Yeah, vol. 8 was so worth the wait. I'm loving Monster Girl's interactions with Rudy Robot, but I keep wondering when something sinister is going to arise from that subplot.
I mean, we know that Robot is eventually killed or otherwise taken out of the story somehow, based on the arc where Mark meets the future Guardians of the Globe and Rex is wearing Robot's armor, unless Eve just starts calling Robot by Rex's name Rex after the actual Rex dies or something. That, plus Robot's unusual interest in Monster Girl, combined with his cryptic remarks after she first starts warming up to him hints at something being not quite right. He's also outright stated that he can predict how people will respond to his actions based on his knowledge of them, yet he keeps making geeky, yet endearing blunders when speaking to Monster Girl. I get the feeling that he's playing her for some reason.
But I'll laugh if all his cryptic remarks and shadowy maneuvers were actually just a cover to get her to date him.
Robot clones a body from Rex, thus why he looks like Rex in the future. It's not actually Rex. I think.
Yeah, vol. 8 was so worth the wait. I'm loving Monster Girl's interactions with Rudy Robot, but I keep wondering when something sinister is going to arise from that subplot.
I mean, we know that Robot is eventually killed or otherwise taken out of the story somehow, based on the arc where Mark meets the future Guardians of the Globe and Rex is wearing Robot's armor, unless Eve just starts calling Robot by Rex's name Rex after the actual Rex dies or something. That, plus Robot's unusual interest in Monster Girl, combined with his cryptic remarks after she first starts warming up to him hints at something being not quite right. He's also outright stated that he can predict how people will respond to his actions based on his knowledge of them, yet he keeps making geeky, yet endearing blunders when speaking to Monster Girl. I get the feeling that he's playing her for some reason.
But I'll laugh if all his cryptic remarks and shadowy maneuvers were actually just a cover to get her to date him.
Robot clones a body from Rex, thus why he looks like Rex in the future. It's not actually Rex. I think.
You can tell who he is just by looking for signs of aging.
Robot clones a body from Rex, thus why he looks like Rex in the future. It's not actually Rex. I think.
Yes but
at one point, right after future-Eve confesses her love and Invincible leaves, Robot says something about how Eve wasn't paying attention to the whole, "Not disrupting the timestream," thing. Eve replies, "Shut up Rex," and Robot, upon removing his helmet makes a very flippant, Rex-like comment, saying something like, "Whatever, let's just go."
I don't see any reason for Robot (Rudy) to take Rex's name when he's already shown that he'd like to be called by his own given name. Unless future-Eve's just mentally unstable and likes to call Robot by her ex-boyfriend's name due to their identical appearances.
Maybe I'm reading into it a bit too much, but it seems like that exchange was there to set something up in the future.
Robot clones a body from Rex, thus why he looks like Rex in the future. It's not actually Rex. I think.
Yes but
at one point, right after future-Eve confesses her love and Invincible leaves, Robot says something about how Eve wasn't paying attention to the whole, "Not disrupting the timestream," thing. Eve replies, "Shut up Rex," and Robot, upon removing his helmet makes a very flippant, Rex-like comment, saying something like, "Whatever, let's just go."
I don't see any reason for Robot (Rudy) to take Rex's name when he's already shown that he'd like to be called by his own given name. Unless future-Eve's just mentally unstable and likes to call Robot by her ex-boyfriend's name due to their identical appearances.
Maybe I'm reading into it a bit too much, but it seems like that exchange was there to set something up in the future.
well given the situation
the fact they went back in time and to another dimension to find him specifically in order to change their future...I would hazard to guess that it isn't an accurate picture of what will happen in the future. Basically the Bishop syndrome. Its just a possible future, not a necessary future.
Robot clones a body from Rex, thus why he looks like Rex in the future. It's not actually Rex. I think.
Yes but
at one point, right after future-Eve confesses her love and Invincible leaves, Robot says something about how Eve wasn't paying attention to the whole, "Not disrupting the timestream," thing. Eve replies, "Shut up Rex," and Robot, upon removing his helmet makes a very flippant, Rex-like comment, saying something like, "Whatever, let's just go."
I don't see any reason for Robot (Rudy) to take Rex's name when he's already shown that he'd like to be called by his own given name. Unless future-Eve's just mentally unstable and likes to call Robot by her ex-boyfriend's name due to their identical appearances.
Maybe I'm reading into it a bit too much, but it seems like that exchange was there to set something up in the future.
well given the situation
the fact they went back in time and to another dimension to find him specifically in order to change their future...I would hazard to guess that it isn't an accurate picture of what will happen in the future. Basically the Bishop syndrome. Its just a possible future, not a necessary future.
If I remember right it was actually
"Shut up, Rex." I thought the point was that it was her telling him to piss off for calling her on a morality issue when he'd cloned someone without their knowledge or permission (since no one seemed to notice when he joined the Guardians maybe it becomes more obvious or an issue as he ages and looks more like Rex).
Kirkman's not one to waste plot hooks on throw away bits, so I assume it's almost a given that not only will we be getting into whatever that signified at some point, but that we're going to meet the version of Invincible that spent 15 years alone in that dimension and went crazy (or whatever happened).
werehippy on
0
Dr. ChaosPost nuclear nuisanceRegistered Userregular
edited July 2007
I've already had a couple of things spoiled for me unfortunately but I look forward to picking up the trades.
The series sounds alot more interesting and less generic than it seems it is at first glance.
I'm just going to come in here and say, I hate anyone who got the new Invincible because my shop only got 2 in and there are 3 people with it on their pull.
Guess who was number 3.
Vann Diras on
0
Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
edited July 2007
Perhaps you should try telling your shop to stop sucking?
Posts
I think he was trying to emphasis the point that despite the fact Allen is basically a supporting character he and Invincible have only interacted for about 5 minutes and they spent most of that wailing on each other. Not that it was good mind you, but I think I get where he was going with it.
Though to be honest, and I hate saying this, but for the first time ever I've been kind of disappointed with the last few issues. I can't quite put my finger on it, but the whole book seems off some how. The writing is a bit stiffer and sloppier, the story seems to be stalling, and the whole flow is off. Maybe it's just me, but anything other than intensely impressed is pretty off for me on this book.
It's not the fact that Allen had to be brought up to speed, but the fact that it was shown to us rather than glossed over. Maybe he needs to know what happened during the last few issues, but I didn't, especially since there was a recap issue not that long ago.
And Allen's reactions were so... generic that Mark could have been talking to literally anyone.
William's feeling kind of weak lately too.
Bad as in bad. Stilted dialogue and predictable character turns!
I thought the dialogue was pretty good myself. It read like Kirkman's usual quippy style. It is still a little heavy on the exposition though, especially when Zechariah is talking, as it's still setting a lot of stuff up. But overall I thought it read well enough.
As for predictable character turns, the only thing really predictable that happened was
I think the book's biggest problem is that it's still kind of establishing itself. Hopefully it'll pick up after the initial arc. I mean, Fables and Invincible both had kind of slow starts as they worked to establish their status quo and introduce readers to the world and characters, only to pick up and turn awesome after the first arc was over. Hopefully it'll be the same thing here.
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"You are a creature of the night, like myself--and you are a being of great power. It is not easy for one such as myself to gain an ally and one as powerful as you will be very good to have."
That's not to say the word balloons are actually over-stuffed. They just feel overstuffed, mostly with exposition that could have gone without saying. Don't laundry list Wolf-Man's powers or tell me that's he's zombified a construction crew. FUCKING SHOW ME! Nobody bought this book to see two people talking on a roof.
And oh my God, Zechariah's giving meaningful pauses and side-stepping all of our hero's questions? I think he might be evil!
And yeah, the dialogue's kind of rough in spots, but I can't think of a book I've read that didn't kind of stumble across an awkward sentence here of there. Some stuff just sounds good on paper but when read aloud sounds painfully awkward. I can think of several instances from Invincible, but the good outweighs the bad. I think that's the case in Wolf-Man too.
I think one of the biggest problems in the book so far is the art. Kirkman's always worked with artists that could really make their art emote (Moore, Ottley, Walker, Rathburn), but Jason Howard's art, being so stiff and plastic, really hurts the delivery of the dialogue. The problem's exacerbated by the protagonist having an inhuman face, making it even harder for the dialogue to come out of his mouth and look natural. Look at pages 2 and 3 of the book and you'll notice his expressions barely change.
It's certainly not a perfect book, but I'm willing to let it get through its first arc before I decide to drop it or keep it.
Also, this should probably be in the Image Universe thread.
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Yep.
They never saw what was coming.
My digital art! http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?t=8168
My pen and paper art! http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?t=7462
I'm really glad the whole Reanimen thing got resolved and the parts with William pretending to be a bum were priceless.
But I'll laugh if all his cryptic remarks and shadowy maneuvers were actually just a cover to get her to date him.
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Yes but this series is set up Dragon Ball Z style
Omniman is Saiyin in that he is Uber Powerful and is practically a space pirate that kills alot of people
Going on that idea when he mates with someone not his race he creates a mixed breed that is capable of massive power at a young age.
Difference is that Omniman is a cross between Goku and Vegeta
invicible and his mother have the same relation ship Gohan and ChiChi has in that he wants to do stuff that involves his powers and she wants him to have an education and make something more from his life.
Alos his Brother is Goten, in that they developed certain things at a younger age. Goten became SSJ at a younger age while Invincible's brother developed poewrs at a young age.
Wouldn't be suprised if Kirkman continued to borrow from Dragan Ball.
You know that, right?
While that's okay in the Powerful Moments thread, it's not so much here.
Actually, I compared the two in my head when I first read Invincible.
There are lots of similarities between them
Also, Superman's totally Goku. A super powerful alien whose race was wiped out save for a few select people who make up his supporting cast, and and once trained extensively in a chamber that altered time so that he could beat up a megavillain that would have typically been outside his abilities?
And don't get me started on how similar Identity Crisis was to Super Super Rape Boy Okay Go!
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But the
Also, it is a dismissive analogy, no way around that.
But I can't honestly say the two stories are alike in the slightest.
Omniman is like Goku and Vegeta because he was sent to Earth to conquer it, but instead fails at the mission and abandons it. Goku failed because he was good, Vegeta failed because a more powerful member of his race stopped him. Both became two of the most powerful of their race.
Omniman is like Goku because he has a halfbreed son that has the potential to be stronger than his father and has a heart of gold.
Debbie Grayson is like ChiChi in that they are both wives of the powerful warrior, and want their powerful sons to focus on schooling instead of adventuring.
I had some more to list but I forgot them, and it really was only at the early parts of the series
And seeing Dragonball is based on the legend of the monkey king, yeah, one could say there are similarities.
-Otherwordly powerful being lands on earth as a baby
-Is raised by humans
-Has one weakness that almost kills him
-Decides to fight evil, and save the Earth many times
-Has powers of strenght, flight, wind
-Among enemies the is an evil general from his home...
As much as Dragonball sucked (although the manga volumes were worth it for the fights, but the cartooon? 12 pages of a chapter do not an episode make) the monkey king is to the East what king Arthur is to the West.
We could easilt find hundreds of heroes with an arthurian-like story, the same way with the story of the monkey king.
My digital art! http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?t=8168
My pen and paper art! http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showthread.php?t=7462
You can tell who he is just by looking for signs of aging.
Yes but
I don't see any reason for Robot (Rudy) to take Rex's name when he's already shown that he'd like to be called by his own given name. Unless future-Eve's just mentally unstable and likes to call Robot by her ex-boyfriend's name due to their identical appearances.
Maybe I'm reading into it a bit too much, but it seems like that exchange was there to set something up in the future.
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well given the situation
PARKER, YOU'RE FIRED! <-- My comic book podcast! Satan look here!
If I remember right it was actually
Kirkman's not one to waste plot hooks on throw away bits, so I assume it's almost a given that not only will we be getting into whatever that signified at some point, but that we're going to meet the version of Invincible that spent 15 years alone in that dimension and went crazy (or whatever happened).
The series sounds alot more interesting and less generic than it seems it is at first glance.
Anally.
Guess who was number 3.
is this why there aren't many comic stores? horribly retarded management?
Allen the Alien.
Daaaaaaaaamn.
Anally.
it seems like nothing is really getting resolved in these issues.