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[Canadian Politics Thread] Government-running Cons accused of running cons in government

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  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Anyone else catch that interview with Air Canada's CEO in which he answered a French reporter's question with, "Can you repeat that in English?" and answered why he hasn't been learning French with essentially, "Do you know how busy I am?" (I believe the exact quote was, "If you looked at my work schedule, you'd understand why")

    It was surreal.

    I've been hearing about it... let's just say his comments haven't gone unnoticed in the Québec political sphere. The CAQ couldn't have paid for better publicity for their "French is under threat and we need to save it" tour.

    Air Canada execs are the assholes who fired hundreds of employees and forced the others to take pay cuts because of covid and obtained millions in taxpayer money from the government to stay afloat, then turned around and gave themselves millions of dollars in performance bonuses based on pre-covid company performance because "taking covid into account in our job performances would be unfair". Let me put it this way: this anti-French spiel does not make me think any less of them.

    While its clearly bad PR, I'm not sure he's anti-French anymore than he is anti-Inuit. Just because you can't speak a language doesn't mean you're anti-that language.

    I disagree. If you spend 14 years living in an Inuit community and don't bother learning their language because you're "too busy", I'd say yes, you are against that language.

    Weird. I deal with the french school board here and there are folks that have lived in Alberta for 20+ years and can't speak English.... Guess they hate English?

    I lived in a predominantly Chinese area in Vancouver for a year and frequented a grocery store with only Chinese products, and most of the workers there didn't speak any English.

    So I guess....do I hate Chinese? Or do they hate English? Or both? I'm confused.

  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Anyone else catch that interview with Air Canada's CEO in which he answered a French reporter's question with, "Can you repeat that in English?" and answered why he hasn't been learning French with essentially, "Do you know how busy I am?" (I believe the exact quote was, "If you looked at my work schedule, you'd understand why")

    It was surreal.

    I've been hearing about it... let's just say his comments haven't gone unnoticed in the Québec political sphere. The CAQ couldn't have paid for better publicity for their "French is under threat and we need to save it" tour.

    Air Canada execs are the assholes who fired hundreds of employees and forced the others to take pay cuts because of covid and obtained millions in taxpayer money from the government to stay afloat, then turned around and gave themselves millions of dollars in performance bonuses based on pre-covid company performance because "taking covid into account in our job performances would be unfair". Let me put it this way: this anti-French spiel does not make me think any less of them.

    While its clearly bad PR, I'm not sure he's anti-French anymore than he is anti-Inuit. Just because you can't speak a language doesn't mean you're anti-that language.

    I disagree. If you spend 14 years living in an Inuit community and don't bother learning their language because you're "too busy", I'd say yes, you are against that language.

    He's living in Montreal, which is probably the most English language friendly part of Quebec, and most likely does a lot of his work in the rest of Canada too. Air Canada is hardly just a Quebec centric company. It's an entirely reasonable thing that he can get by just speaking English and certainly has the resources for a translator when he needs it. While, again, it is certainly bad PR, I think a demand that all people in Quebec must speak French is just as unreasonable as demanding that a unilingual Punjabi-speaker must learn English in Vancouver. Yes, that unilingual person may be disadvantaged in certain things (just like not speaking French in Quebec is a disadvantage), but if he feels he can get by without learning English, then that's his decision -- not ours.

    The difference is that the Punjabi-speaker is not forcing everyone they are dealing with to use the dominating language that is currently destroying other languages.

  • AegisAegis Fear My Dance Overshot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered User regular
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
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  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    mrondeau wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Anyone else catch that interview with Air Canada's CEO in which he answered a French reporter's question with, "Can you repeat that in English?" and answered why he hasn't been learning French with essentially, "Do you know how busy I am?" (I believe the exact quote was, "If you looked at my work schedule, you'd understand why")

    It was surreal.

    I've been hearing about it... let's just say his comments haven't gone unnoticed in the Québec political sphere. The CAQ couldn't have paid for better publicity for their "French is under threat and we need to save it" tour.

    Air Canada execs are the assholes who fired hundreds of employees and forced the others to take pay cuts because of covid and obtained millions in taxpayer money from the government to stay afloat, then turned around and gave themselves millions of dollars in performance bonuses based on pre-covid company performance because "taking covid into account in our job performances would be unfair". Let me put it this way: this anti-French spiel does not make me think any less of them.

    While its clearly bad PR, I'm not sure he's anti-French anymore than he is anti-Inuit. Just because you can't speak a language doesn't mean you're anti-that language.

    I disagree. If you spend 14 years living in an Inuit community and don't bother learning their language because you're "too busy", I'd say yes, you are against that language.

    He's living in Montreal, which is probably the most English language friendly part of Quebec, and most likely does a lot of his work in the rest of Canada too. Air Canada is hardly just a Quebec centric company. It's an entirely reasonable thing that he can get by just speaking English and certainly has the resources for a translator when he needs it. While, again, it is certainly bad PR, I think a demand that all people in Quebec must speak French is just as unreasonable as demanding that a unilingual Punjabi-speaker must learn English in Vancouver. Yes, that unilingual person may be disadvantaged in certain things (just like not speaking French in Quebec is a disadvantage), but if he feels he can get by without learning English, then that's his decision -- not ours.

    The difference is that the Punjabi-speaker is not forcing everyone they are dealing with to use the dominating language that is currently destroying other languages.

    No, but I bet that guy gets told to "speak white" a bunch.

    PSN: Canadian_llama
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Anyone else catch that interview with Air Canada's CEO in which he answered a French reporter's question with, "Can you repeat that in English?" and answered why he hasn't been learning French with essentially, "Do you know how busy I am?" (I believe the exact quote was, "If you looked at my work schedule, you'd understand why")

    It was surreal.

    I've been hearing about it... let's just say his comments haven't gone unnoticed in the Québec political sphere. The CAQ couldn't have paid for better publicity for their "French is under threat and we need to save it" tour.

    Air Canada execs are the assholes who fired hundreds of employees and forced the others to take pay cuts because of covid and obtained millions in taxpayer money from the government to stay afloat, then turned around and gave themselves millions of dollars in performance bonuses based on pre-covid company performance because "taking covid into account in our job performances would be unfair". Let me put it this way: this anti-French spiel does not make me think any less of them.

    While its clearly bad PR, I'm not sure he's anti-French anymore than he is anti-Inuit. Just because you can't speak a language doesn't mean you're anti-that language.

    I disagree. If you spend 14 years living in an Inuit community and don't bother learning their language because you're "too busy", I'd say yes, you are against that language.

    He's living in Montreal, which is probably the most English language friendly part of Quebec, and most likely does a lot of his work in the rest of Canada too. Air Canada is hardly just a Quebec centric company. It's an entirely reasonable thing that he can get by just speaking English and certainly has the resources for a translator when he needs it. While, again, it is certainly bad PR, I think a demand that all people in Quebec must speak French is just as unreasonable as demanding that a unilingual Punjabi-speaker must learn English in Vancouver. Yes, that unilingual person may be disadvantaged in certain things (just like not speaking French in Quebec is a disadvantage), but if he feels he can get by without learning English, then that's his decision -- not ours.

    But don't you know that unless you are fellating french culture at all times you hate QC?

    I was not aware that having a basic functional level of understanding of the language of the place you live in for the better part of two decades was "fellating frech culture at all times". Nor did I realize that being against something and hating something were synonymous. Ah, the things I learn from you Disco.

    sig.gif
  • BlarghyBlarghy Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    The company as a whole has to be able to. That does not mean that every employee has to be bilingual and he can get by via translation, if need be. I agree its a bad look. But, if, functionally, he can get by, that's his choice to make. That doesn't mean he hates French, or Quebec, or spits in the eye of every Francophone out there. It just means he doesn't speak French.

  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    The company as a whole has to be able to. That does not mean that every employee has to be bilingual and he can get by via translation, if need be. I agree its a bad look. But, if, functionally, he can get by, that's his choice to make. That doesn't mean he hates French, or Quebec, or spits in the eye of every Francophone out there. It just means he doesn't speak French.

    He's not the one who has to deal with the problem. He suffers 0 negative consequences. What he does is force everyone else he interacts with to use English.

  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    mrondeau wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    The company as a whole has to be able to. That does not mean that every employee has to be bilingual and he can get by via translation, if need be. I agree its a bad look. But, if, functionally, he can get by, that's his choice to make. That doesn't mean he hates French, or Quebec, or spits in the eye of every Francophone out there. It just means he doesn't speak French.

    He's not the one who has to deal with the problem. He suffers 0 negative consequences. What he does is force everyone else he interacts with to use English.

    I mean, fundamentally, that's true of everyone insofar as everyone 'forces' others to interact with them in a language they know. It's weird to me to use that as a criticism of someone's character because it's literally true of every human being on earth.

  • BlarghyBlarghy Registered User regular
    mrondeau wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    The company as a whole has to be able to. That does not mean that every employee has to be bilingual and he can get by via translation, if need be. I agree its a bad look. But, if, functionally, he can get by, that's his choice to make. That doesn't mean he hates French, or Quebec, or spits in the eye of every Francophone out there. It just means he doesn't speak French.

    He's not the one who has to deal with the problem. He suffers 0 negative consequences. What he does is force everyone else he interacts with to use English.

    I think he's suffering some consequences right about now with all this bad PR.

  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Anyone else catch that interview with Air Canada's CEO in which he answered a French reporter's question with, "Can you repeat that in English?" and answered why he hasn't been learning French with essentially, "Do you know how busy I am?" (I believe the exact quote was, "If you looked at my work schedule, you'd understand why")

    It was surreal.

    I've been hearing about it... let's just say his comments haven't gone unnoticed in the Québec political sphere. The CAQ couldn't have paid for better publicity for their "French is under threat and we need to save it" tour.

    Air Canada execs are the assholes who fired hundreds of employees and forced the others to take pay cuts because of covid and obtained millions in taxpayer money from the government to stay afloat, then turned around and gave themselves millions of dollars in performance bonuses based on pre-covid company performance because "taking covid into account in our job performances would be unfair". Let me put it this way: this anti-French spiel does not make me think any less of them.

    While its clearly bad PR, I'm not sure he's anti-French anymore than he is anti-Inuit. Just because you can't speak a language doesn't mean you're anti-that language.

    I disagree. If you spend 14 years living in an Inuit community and don't bother learning their language because you're "too busy", I'd say yes, you are against that language.

    He's living in Montreal, which is probably the most English language friendly part of Quebec, and most likely does a lot of his work in the rest of Canada too. Air Canada is hardly just a Quebec centric company. It's an entirely reasonable thing that he can get by just speaking English and certainly has the resources for a translator when he needs it. While, again, it is certainly bad PR, I think a demand that all people in Quebec must speak French is just as unreasonable as demanding that a unilingual Punjabi-speaker must learn English in Vancouver. Yes, that unilingual person may be disadvantaged in certain things (just like not speaking French in Quebec is a disadvantage), but if he feels he can get by without learning English, then that's his decision -- not ours.

    But don't you know that unless you are fellating french culture at all times you hate QC?

    I was not aware that having a basic functional level of understanding of the language of the place you live in for the better part of two decades was "fellating frech culture at all times". Nor did I realize that being against something and hating something were synonymous. Ah, the things I learn from you Disco.

    Yeah because not wanting to respond to a french reported using what can be pretty technical terms at a press event is totoally the same thing as not knowing french.

    I speak a bit of spanish.... I won't do an interview with it.

    I guess that means I hate Latin countries?

    Or maybe QC can take a chill pill and realize that not everyone is going to bend over for them at all times.

    PSN: Canadian_llama
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    I think we need to put the AC CEO's comments in context here.

    This isn't a random Punjabi immigrant plucked off the streets or an entry-level minimum-wage Air Canada employee. He's the CEO and responsible for setting an example for the company. And his example is "English only".

    Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, the problem isn't so much that he can't speak French but the disdain he shows at the idea. If he'd answered the journalist's questions with something along the lines of "This sounds like an important question and I want to make sure I understand all its nuances to give a correct answer, unfortunately my French isn't strong enough, would you mind repeating it in English", I doubt anyone but die-hard sovereignists would have batted an eye. He didn't say that. He said "Speak English, I'm too busy to bother learning French." And that's what angered people.

    sig.gif
  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Nova_C wrote: »
    mrondeau wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    The company as a whole has to be able to. That does not mean that every employee has to be bilingual and he can get by via translation, if need be. I agree its a bad look. But, if, functionally, he can get by, that's his choice to make. That doesn't mean he hates French, or Quebec, or spits in the eye of every Francophone out there. It just means he doesn't speak French.

    He's not the one who has to deal with the problem. He suffers 0 negative consequences. What he does is force everyone else he interacts with to use English.

    I mean, fundamentally, that's true of everyone insofar as everyone 'forces' others to interact with them in a language they know. It's weird to me to use that as a criticism of someone's character because it's literally true of every human being on earth.

    It's a problem when one group is always accommodated and another group always has to accommodate them.
    What actually happens is that you have 10 people working together, 9 of which are francophones, and 1 is anglophone, so everything is done in English. Always.

  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Anyone else catch that interview with Air Canada's CEO in which he answered a French reporter's question with, "Can you repeat that in English?" and answered why he hasn't been learning French with essentially, "Do you know how busy I am?" (I believe the exact quote was, "If you looked at my work schedule, you'd understand why")

    It was surreal.

    I've been hearing about it... let's just say his comments haven't gone unnoticed in the Québec political sphere. The CAQ couldn't have paid for better publicity for their "French is under threat and we need to save it" tour.

    Air Canada execs are the assholes who fired hundreds of employees and forced the others to take pay cuts because of covid and obtained millions in taxpayer money from the government to stay afloat, then turned around and gave themselves millions of dollars in performance bonuses based on pre-covid company performance because "taking covid into account in our job performances would be unfair". Let me put it this way: this anti-French spiel does not make me think any less of them.

    While its clearly bad PR, I'm not sure he's anti-French anymore than he is anti-Inuit. Just because you can't speak a language doesn't mean you're anti-that language.

    I disagree. If you spend 14 years living in an Inuit community and don't bother learning their language because you're "too busy", I'd say yes, you are against that language.

    He's living in Montreal, which is probably the most English language friendly part of Quebec, and most likely does a lot of his work in the rest of Canada too. Air Canada is hardly just a Quebec centric company. It's an entirely reasonable thing that he can get by just speaking English and certainly has the resources for a translator when he needs it. While, again, it is certainly bad PR, I think a demand that all people in Quebec must speak French is just as unreasonable as demanding that a unilingual Punjabi-speaker must learn English in Vancouver. Yes, that unilingual person may be disadvantaged in certain things (just like not speaking French in Quebec is a disadvantage), but if he feels he can get by without learning English, then that's his decision -- not ours.

    But don't you know that unless you are fellating french culture at all times you hate QC?

    I was not aware that having a basic functional level of understanding of the language of the place you live in for the better part of two decades was "fellating frech culture at all times". Nor did I realize that being against something and hating something were synonymous. Ah, the things I learn from you Disco.

    Yeah because not wanting to respond to a french reported using what can be pretty technical terms at a press event is totoally the same thing as not knowing french.

    I speak a bit of spanish.... I won't do an interview with it.

    I guess that means I hate Latin countries?

    Or maybe QC can take a chill pill and realize that not everyone is going to bend over for them at all times.

    What you hate and do not hate is up to you. I never used the word and I'm tired of you trying to put it in my mouth. (That's what she said.)

    sig.gif
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2021
    mrondeau wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    mrondeau wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    The problem is that Air Canada is subject to the Official Languages Act and must be able to conduct its business in both official languages.

    While the extent to which this applies to its upper management may be open to interpretation, it's also a very bad PR look to have the lead of your company not only unable to speak it but also directly indicate that he has no intention to learn, in an interview with French journalists, in Quebec.

    The company as a whole has to be able to. That does not mean that every employee has to be bilingual and he can get by via translation, if need be. I agree its a bad look. But, if, functionally, he can get by, that's his choice to make. That doesn't mean he hates French, or Quebec, or spits in the eye of every Francophone out there. It just means he doesn't speak French.

    He's not the one who has to deal with the problem. He suffers 0 negative consequences. What he does is force everyone else he interacts with to use English.

    I mean, fundamentally, that's true of everyone insofar as everyone 'forces' others to interact with them in a language they know. It's weird to me to use that as a criticism of someone's character because it's literally true of every human being on earth.

    It's a problem when one group is always accommodated and another group always has to accommodate them.
    What actually happens is that you have 10 people working together, 9 of which are francophones, and 1 is anglophone, so everything is done in English. Always.

    I mean, sort of. Punjabi isn't an official language, nor is it a language my company operates in, but there are several people from India in my office and they communicate with each other in Punjabi.

    Well, mostly.

    There's a bunch of languages in India, too, but most of my Indian co-workers speak Punjabi.

    Ultimately, though, in your example, I imagine the 9 francophones do speak English, at least a little, and the lone anglophone doesn't speak French, and the path of least resistance is to operate in the language everyone understands. If none of the francophones speak English, and the anglophone does not speak French, I don't imagine that lone anglophone being able to function.

    I get that English is dominant to the point of slowly eroding the presence of French in Canada, but the only way to stop that is to force people to operate in French.

    How do you do that in a bilingual nation? The solution is to remove English as an official language.

    Good luck, I suppose.

    Nova_C on
  • TubularLuggageTubularLuggage Registered User regular
    edited November 2021
    Heck, I've had French-Canadian relatives not from Quebec, who speak French as their first language, who have had multiple experiences while visiting Quebec, where they spoke French to francophone Quebeckers, and those Quebeckers refused to speak to them in French because they 'spoke French wrong'. To me, that's far ruder than switching languages due to lack of proficiency, and it's a weirdly common occurrence for other French Canadians visiting Quebec. Like, enough that it's a thing.

    I love French and certainly want to see it flourish in this country. Perhaps though, Quebeckers who are worried about preserving the language need to learn a tactic other than abrasiveness?

    TubularLuggage on
  • SatanIsMyMotorSatanIsMyMotor Fuck Warren Ellis Registered User regular
    Heck, I've had French-Canadian relatives not from Quebec, who speak French as their first language, who have had multiple experiences while visiting Quebec, where they spoke French to francophone Quebeckers, and those Quebeckers refused to speak to them in French because they 'spoke French wrong'. To me, that's far ruder than switching languages due to lack of proficiency, and it's a weirdly common occurrence for other French Canadians visiting Quebec. Like, enough that it's a thing.

    I love French and certainly want to see it flourish in this country. Perhaps though, Quebeckers who are worried about preserving the language need to learn a tactic other than abrasiveness?

    Having worked in NB Tourism for about 6 years this was also the experience when speaking french to Quebecers visiting the province too.
    I think bi/multi-lingualism is absolutely an asset but imposition of it on everyone is not smart for a number of reasons. It's also essentially put my province into an infinite deficit that we'll never get out of because we have to approach it in the dumbest way possible where everything needs to be in both languages, translated, and interpreted if it has anything to do with the government. And I mean everything.

  • MuzzmuzzMuzzmuzz Registered User regular
    I'm loving the Doug Ford government pulling a Harper and running attack ads on potential political threats, despite there being no election. You're really ruining my podcast listening mood, dude.

  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    I think we need to put the AC CEO's comments in context here.

    This isn't a random Punjabi immigrant plucked off the streets or an entry-level minimum-wage Air Canada employee. He's the CEO and responsible for setting an example for the company. And his example is "English only".

    Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, the problem isn't so much that he can't speak French but the disdain he shows at the idea. If he'd answered the journalist's questions with something along the lines of "This sounds like an important question and I want to make sure I understand all its nuances to give a correct answer, unfortunately my French isn't strong enough, would you mind repeating it in English", I doubt anyone but die-hard sovereignists would have batted an eye. He didn't say that. He said "Speak English, I'm too busy to bother learning French." And that's what angered people.

    I just watched the video, and there's no disdain visible. He's a business executive trying to send the message that he's focused on rebuilding the business and that's his priority rather than his own personal failings at language education. He asked the reporter to repeat the question in English because he knows his French comprehension isn't good enough to answer the question. I don't see how this isn't being respectful given his current inability to understand the question. He then says that he'd love to be able to speak French, which is admittedly empty words.

    I'd note too that the reporter, instead of asking the question in English, then repeats it in French to someone beside Rosseau. Should we be giving the reporter shit for not using a language the person he's speaking to can understand?

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/air-canada-ceo-french-1.6236356

    I don't know, maybe this video is edited down and there's something more egregious in another video somewhere? Like are people actually watching what he said or just pissed off because they read some clickbait saying he crapped on the french language or something?

    :so_raven:
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    Heck, I've had French-Canadian relatives not from Quebec, who speak French as their first language, who have had multiple experiences while visiting Quebec, where they spoke French to francophone Quebeckers, and those Quebeckers refused to speak to them in French because they 'spoke French wrong'. To me, that's far ruder than switching languages due to lack of proficiency, and it's a weirdly common occurrence for other French Canadians visiting Quebec. Like, enough that it's a thing.

    I love French and certainly want to see it flourish in this country. Perhaps though, Quebeckers who are worried about preserving the language need to learn a tactic other than abrasiveness?

    I'm a native french speaker and was refused service in lac st jean because I was speaking to someone in English over the phone.

    QC is awash in xenophobia of many sorts

    PSN: Canadian_llama
  • AegisAegis Fear My Dance Overshot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered User regular
    Corvus wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    I think we need to put the AC CEO's comments in context here.

    This isn't a random Punjabi immigrant plucked off the streets or an entry-level minimum-wage Air Canada employee. He's the CEO and responsible for setting an example for the company. And his example is "English only".

    Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, the problem isn't so much that he can't speak French but the disdain he shows at the idea. If he'd answered the journalist's questions with something along the lines of "This sounds like an important question and I want to make sure I understand all its nuances to give a correct answer, unfortunately my French isn't strong enough, would you mind repeating it in English", I doubt anyone but die-hard sovereignists would have batted an eye. He didn't say that. He said "Speak English, I'm too busy to bother learning French." And that's what angered people.

    I just watched the video, and there's no disdain visible. He's a business executive trying to send the message that he's focused on rebuilding the business and that's his priority rather than his own personal failings at language education. He asked the reporter to repeat the question in English because he knows his French comprehension isn't good enough to answer the question. I don't see how this isn't being respectful given his current inability to understand the question. He then says that he'd love to be able to speak French, which is admittedly empty words.

    I'd note too that the reporter, instead of asking the question in English, then repeats it in French to someone beside Rosseau. Should we be giving the reporter shit for not using a language the person he's speaking to can understand?

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/air-canada-ceo-french-1.6236356

    I don't know, maybe this video is edited down and there's something more egregious in another video somewhere? Like are people actually watching what he said or just pissed off because they read some clickbait saying he crapped on the french language or something?

    I'm coming at this from the perspective of a federal government employee who has had to interact with the public (and thus had to be made aware of official languages policies). This situation isn't an exact parallel since the reporter's not a client seeking government (or in this case Air Canada) services, but given this is the CEO it's being drawn out as emblematic of Air Canada's approach to its duties under the Official Languages Act.

    Asking the reporter to repeat their question in the other official language is, in and of itself, incredibly disrespectful. His on the spot reasoning is irrelevant and shows a lack of consideration for being respectful in terms of language rights. It's a bit of an odd situation since you can't necessarily hand off to another person as a CEO, but in general, encountering these situations should be handled by offering the client the option to speak with someone able to answer their query in the language of their choice. It's at that point that the person either accepts your offer or chooses themselves to switch to another language. You're not forcing the choice on them.

    But it's also even slightly more perplexing since the other person that the reporter asked the question to was bilingual (or a full interpreter, which the reporter seemed to understand that's why they were there), which means the CEO had the option to have the question translated for him so he could answer and his answer be provided in French, and his first instinct was to not take that.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
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  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    "More than 30 new posts? Wonder what happened in Quebec today ..."
    *catches up on thread*
    Mhmm, yep.


    :P

  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

  • AegisAegis Fear My Dance Overshot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered User regular
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
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  • breton-brawlerbreton-brawler Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    mainly because it won't mean anything in the current labor market? all the minimum wage jobs are so empty that employers are generally paying more than the 15$ *new* minimum wage. it also gives future cover if the labor shortage isn't filled: cue the "people are lazy, they won't even work the jobs when we increase the wage". it's like the right to disconnect legislation, alot of political cover that sounds good but in effect won't change anything in reality, and can make for some easy wins on the next electoral campaign.

  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    I mean, he's the CEO and the questions were about him. He's always going to try and answer those questions himself.

    :so_raven:
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    Election coming. And Ford isn't Republican levels of stupid.

  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    Election coming. And Ford isn't Republican levels of stupid.

    I mean, Republicans keep winning, so I don't think it's stupidity. Avarice, sure. Greed, absolutely. Hate and fear, most definitely. But I think stupidity underestimates what is happening on the right.

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Nova_C wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    Election coming. And Ford isn't Republican levels of stupid.

    I mean, Republicans keep winning, so I don't think it's stupidity. Avarice, sure. Greed, absolutely. Hate and fear, most definitely. But I think stupidity underestimates what is happening on the right.

    Republicans could win even more if they actually threw some populist bones to the public. The kind of shit Ford is doing. You can see the same shit in his handling of the pandemic. Cowardly and stupid? Absolutely. But it at least showed a vague understanding that people getting infected was bad and that getting someone else to take the blame for that was good.

  • ShadowhopeShadowhope Baa. Registered User regular

    The difference is that Ford is a conservative of opportunity, rather than an ideological conservative. That is to say, he’ll happily do the right thing if it’s easy and convenient and makes him look good, rather than working hard to fuck everything up for everyone due to a deeply held belief.

    Civics is not a consumer product that you can ignore because you don’t like the options presented.
  • HerrCronHerrCron It that wickedly supports taxation Registered User regular
    I mean, what kind of person would live in Montreal for years and not know French

    *looks around nervously*

    Right...

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  • EtiowsaEtiowsa Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    Maybe he was hoping to distract from the fact that he's privatizing low income assistance, and the company he's gonna give the contract to are some republican assholes.

  • ZibblsnrtZibblsnrt Registered User regular
    Muzzmuzz wrote: »
    I'm loving the Doug Ford government pulling a Harper and running attack ads on potential political threats, despite there being no election. You're really ruining my podcast listening mood, dude.

    Well, it's not like he can campaign on much of anything popular he's done, and conservatives are allergic to having actual platforms these days because the reflexive opacity is extending to elections as much as governance.

  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    I think we need to put the AC CEO's comments in context here.

    This isn't a random Punjabi immigrant plucked off the streets or an entry-level minimum-wage Air Canada employee. He's the CEO and responsible for setting an example for the company. And his example is "English only".

    Secondly, and perhaps more importantly, the problem isn't so much that he can't speak French but the disdain he shows at the idea. If he'd answered the journalist's questions with something along the lines of "This sounds like an important question and I want to make sure I understand all its nuances to give a correct answer, unfortunately my French isn't strong enough, would you mind repeating it in English", I doubt anyone but die-hard sovereignists would have batted an eye. He didn't say that. He said "Speak English, I'm too busy to bother learning French." And that's what angered people.

    he also doens't give a shit if this gives him bad PR, you're flying air canada regardless unless west jet is cheaper or happens to go somewhere air canada doesn't

    This "controversy" simply does not matter to their bottom line

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  • ImperfectImperfect Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Nova_C wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    Election coming. And Ford isn't Republican levels of stupid.

    I mean, Republicans keep winning, so I don't think it's stupidity. Avarice, sure. Greed, absolutely. Hate and fear, most definitely. But I think stupidity underestimates what is happening on the right.

    They lost the House, Senate, and Presidency in the last two elections.

    Not sure what you mean by "keep winning."

    Their current strategy is to gerrymander to unprecedented levels to try to start winning again.

    (And I mean, it looks like it's going to work, but still, characterizing them as "keep winning" just ain't so.)

  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Imperfect wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Nova_C wrote: »
    It's either Quebec or Alberta, yeah.

    Imagine the day when Saskatchewan causes a ruckus.

    Or Manitoba.

    I am personally still a little confused as to why Ford decided to raise the minimum wage to $15. I certainly wasn't expecting that out of this government, especially after the previous cancellation.

    Election coming. And Ford isn't Republican levels of stupid.

    I mean, Republicans keep winning, so I don't think it's stupidity. Avarice, sure. Greed, absolutely. Hate and fear, most definitely. But I think stupidity underestimates what is happening on the right.

    They lost the House, Senate, and Presidency in the last two elections.

    Not sure what you mean by "keep winning."

    Their current strategy is to gerrymander to unprecedented levels to try to start winning again.

    (And I mean, it looks like it's going to work, but still, characterizing them as "keep winning" just ain't so.)

    And this administration is completely hamstrung despite having control of the executive and legislative branches.

  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    There's already multiple threads about US politics infighting. Could we at least keep this one for Canadian politics infighting, or even better, invade the current"why does your party suck" thread with Canadian perspectives?

    Seriously, we could fill pages with whatever the Greens are doing. Also Québec Solidaire.

  • ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    I mean, it couldn’t go any worse than some random asshole picking a fight with an entire wing of the us political spectrum…

    >.>

    <.<

    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    edited November 2021
    mrondeau wrote: »
    There's already multiple threads about US politics infighting. Could we at least keep this one for Canadian politics infighting, or even better, invade the current"why does your party suck" thread with Canadian perspectives?

    Seriously, we could fill pages with whatever the Greens are doing. Also Québec Solidaire.

    Please. If the Canadian Politics thread is going to invade any other threads, it should be the cooking thread.

    Also the threads for any sci-fi show filmed in BC are fair game.

    Richy on
    sig.gif
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    edited November 2021
    If you want some good Canadian drama, Nova Scotia premiere Tim Houston said the quiet part out loud yesterday when his response to $15 minimum wage implied that minimum wage jobs aren't real jobs.
    He has "apologized" today insofar as saying that wasn't what he meant.
    ...
    But apparently what that meant was that nobody should want to do them, and increasing minimum wage would disincentivize people from wanting to switch careers.

    A fun bit of math and digging will reveal that $15/hour is ~$30,000, and that more than half of the province's workforce (52%) makes less than $30k annually.
    Shockingly, little c cons are still cons.

    ArcticLancer on
  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    If you want some good Canadian drama, Nova Scotia premiere Tim Houston said the quiet part out loud yesterday when his response to $15 minimum wage implied that minimum wage jobs aren't real jobs.
    He has "apologized" today insofar as saying that wasn't what he meant.
    ...
    But apparently what that meant was that nobody should want to do them, and increasing minimum wage would disincentivize people from wanting to switch careers.

    A fun bit of math and digging will reveal that $15/hour is ~$30,000, and that more than half of the province's workforce (52%) makes less than $30k annually.
    Shockingly, little c cons are still cons.

    No one ever needed to be incentivized away from minimum wage jobs: the kind of employers who would like to pay you even less tend to be very, very shitty bosses, no matter what the actual minimum wage is.
    The usual excuse is that minimum wage jobs are low-qualification, low-stress and low-importance, but, for some reasons, more and more jobs are minimum wage, including some rather essential ones.

    It's almost as if the free market was not working properly when it comes to working conditions. But I'm certain that things would improve now that small employers have no people to lord over.

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