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The [Labor] Thread is entitled to everything it creates

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  • MatevMatev Cero Miedo Registered User regular
    I think California does require a day off or 7th day in a week is OT. But either way that is insane. I worked 14 days straight with no days off once and I was wrecked, nothing got done at home and no real leisure time.

    I cant imagine doing 60.

    This shit is why we have labor laws and need them enforced and unions and such. Disconnected owners are always gonna keep pushing these things.

    “Well, I work 7 days a week (sitting through meetings, going on business trips, leisurely catered lunches, etc.) so those lazy drivers should be able to do it easy!”

    I just….. how many people did this get run past who were like “of course this makes sense! Throw the rabble a pittance and they’ll eat each other for it!”

    Just give your workers a raise you pricks.

    "Go down, kick ass, and set yourselves up as gods, that's our Prime Directive!"
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  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    edited February 3
    Moridin889 wrote: »
    Domino's reverts to Dave Brandon levels of villainy, creates driver "challenge" to have them work for two fucking months straight without a day off and gets called out on it:
    In a TikTok posted on Jan. 26, Denycia (@denyciadawn) calls out a Domino’s employee promotion, deemed “Survivor: Driver Edition,” that enters its workers into a raffle-like arrangement to win $10,000 if they work 60 days straight, without any tardiness, at multiple locations.

    “If there are numerous people that participated and made it to the end, they divvy that $10,000 up evenly amongst all of the employees,” the TikToker explained. “And then start another round.”

    Whoever thought this up needs to not have a job anymore.

    Outside the harm they are directly inflicting on the employees, did no one check local labor laws? I'm pretty sure there would be issues with making people do that.

    They will argue that it's optional and that the employees are volunteering to work this much.

    I've never worked pizza delivery. Is it as predatory as Uber/Lyft, where basically the company is trading the depreciation on your car for their profits?

    *edit* stop copying old jokes, draft.

    Heffling on
    TicaldfjamMatev
  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    I mean, myopic corporate crap like that Dominos bonus is the same kind of thing that causes Fed-Ex delivery drivers to just start dumping boxes in local canyons rather than go through the trouble of delivering them.

    TicaldfjamFencingsaxThawmus
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular


    labor advocacy Tweeter with a picture of another fucked up Domino's practice- waiving your breaks. Probably illegal!

    I've looked elsewhere and yep, these forms are an actual thing

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  • Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    I don't think you can waive your breaks, legally?

    Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
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  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    I don't think you can waive your breaks, legally?

    Just like EULAs, I don't think the point is that it's legally binding. It's a fear tactic.

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  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    I don't think you can waive your breaks, legally?

    Depends on the state apparently.

    webguy20
  • Moridin889Moridin889 Registered User regular
    Phoenix-D wrote: »


    labor advocacy Tweeter with a picture of another fucked up Domino's practice- waiving your breaks. Probably illegal!

    I've looked elsewhere and yep, these forms are an actual thing

    My work gave me a set of those forms during the start of the pandemic because I have a couple of employees who refuse to take breaks.

    They are still a terrible idea

  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    My work used to "bank" our afternoon break to take the week off between christmas and new years...I miss that.

    Whippy wrote: »
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  • MegaMan001MegaMan001 CRNA Rochester, MNRegistered User regular
    Stuff like that is why labor has become a race to the bottom. Agree to that request and you're a team player who helps out, refuse and you're just not invested... we are a family here you know?

    Which is why this needs to be mandated by government not up to individual employers or states.

    I am in the business of saving lives.
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  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    edited February 3
    I don't think you can waive your breaks, legally?

    It’s not, like, illegal for an employee to work through their break, but the company has to pay them for it and make a ‘good faith effort’ to give the employee an opportunity to take it. But if the employee says ‘no’ the company can’t do anything about it from a legal standpoint, only through company policy.

    Javen on
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  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    By making it opt-in, and allowing the employee the opportunity to back out at any time, this does, at a glance, appear completely legal

    Which is another way of saying that the US really needs to address many of its current labor laws.

    kimeOrcaThawmus
  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    Which is another way of saying that the US really needs to address many of its current labor laws.

    Boy do we ever!

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  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    By making it opt-in, and allowing the employee the opportunity to back out at any time, this does, at a glance, appear completely legal

    Which is another way of saying that the US really needs to address many of its current labor laws.

    I'm sure those who don't opt in don't mysteriously get fired more often or anything

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  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    When I worked at a commercial printing press we would work 30ish days straight, 12 hour days in September to deal with the Christmas rush. 7pm-7am. It was rough! Also, there are exemptions to a lot of labor laws in regards to it being a hardship to shut the machine down for regular breaks and lunches. I ate a lot of meals at my post at that job.

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  • ShortyShorty touching the meat Registered User regular
    edited February 4
    I generally prefer to work through my lunch break since taking one means I have to stay at work an extra half hour.

    which is its own brand of horseshit. lunch should be paid.

    Shorty on
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  • MegaMan001MegaMan001 CRNA Rochester, MNRegistered User regular
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    By making it opt-in, and allowing the employee the opportunity to back out at any time, this does, at a glance, appear completely legal

    Which is another way of saying that the US really needs to address many of its current labor laws.

    I'm sure those who don't opt in don't mysteriously get fired more often or anything

    Not even fired, but given advancement opportunities or more desirable shifts.

    I am in the business of saving lives.
    Gnome-Interruptus
  • StarZapperStarZapper Vermont, Bizzaro world.Registered User regular
    edited February 4
    Of course it's due to unions that there is a lunch break, or any breaks required at all. The reason most work places have a 30 minute standard lunch is because that is the bare minimum required by law - they could pay you if they want but they fought so hard not to. Of course company culture often pressures people to not even take those meager breaks ; when I was a delivery driver I was often given shit by other workers for taking my lunch, even though it was mandated by the DOT. American work culture is toxic.

    Also, if your manager discusses work stuff with you at all during lunch legally they're obligated to pay for the break; but good luck trying to collect on that.

    StarZapper on
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  • ShortyShorty touching the meat Registered User regular
    many years ago I had a retail job that gave everyone an hour long paid lunch. it worked great. that it isn't standard is down to a combination of incompetence, greed, and vindictiveness.

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  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    By making it opt-in, and allowing the employee the opportunity to back out at any time, this does, at a glance, appear completely legal

    Which is another way of saying that the US really needs to address many of its current labor laws.

    Well.. That isn't probably true because they do not have the opportunity to back out any time.. An employee may, at any time their employer is OK with, waive their breaks. But the requirement to sign a document to get their waived breaks back is the part that makes it illegal. An employee who wants to take a break and has an available break does not need to sign and return a document. They just say "I am taking my legally entitled break" and if they're prevented from doing so its a labor violation.

    I can kind of see the point of a form like that. Some people choose to work through their breaks and this can create headaches for legal if someone claims they were denied their breaks. So you hold up the form and are like "they waived their breaks, they signed a thing doing so". But what you really want your paper to say is "I recognize that i may choose to work through breaks but am not being forced to. I don't waive my right to breaks but may waive individual breaks as i see fit". Though... i am not sure that that has any different chilling effect on break taking as the other bad one. If you sign the paper they can force you to skip breaks and when you complain they're like "good luck suing". If you don't sign the paper they fire you after a month or so.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited February 4
    MegaMan001 wrote: »
    Stuff like that is why labor has become a race to the bottom. Agree to that request and you're a team player who helps out, refuse and you're just not invested... we are a family here you know?

    Which is why this needs to be mandated by government not up to individual employers or states.

    Labour has always been a race to the bottom. This is why labour has to organize for collective benefit and why government has to set limits on what people can do.

    Like, the minimum wage is not just a law about what wages a company can pay, it's also a law about what wages a worker can accept. Because if given the chance people absolutely will work for less. (often they have little choice obviously) This kind of phenomenon is actually especially obvious in salaried work, where people will frequently lower their own wages via working longer hours if given the chance. It's how you "look like a team player" or whatever.

    shryke on
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  • crzyangocrzyango Registered User regular
    edited February 4
    I specifically remember working in a national music retail chain (initials GC) on Black Friday and showing up to help finish merching for the "rush", and just being expected to work a 16 hour shift "voluntarily" because we're commission and the best sellers get to stay after the holidays are over, but they DID supply a Jimmy John's platter in the break room!

    So I took my 30 minute lunch break to eat whatever dregs of the veggie subs that were left and had the store manager ask why I was taking a lunch break.

    "So I can't take a lunch break?"

    "I mean, don't you want the commission?"

    "I want to sit down, are you telling me I can't have a lunch break?"

    Response was "Do whatever the fuck you want" so I took 45, and that was my big rebellion at the age of 25, which was apparently 11 years ago.

    Outlasted that prick, though.

    crzyango on
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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    ITTT, a shitty and frankly racist argument against remote work gets ripped apart:



    The author is a media relations consultant.

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  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    ITTT, a shitty and frankly racist argument against remote work gets ripped apart:

    htt ps://twitter.com/edzitron/status/1489025195079712772

    The author is a media relations consultant.

    Note that what the principal did is what you are supposed to do the second you find out that what you are doing is not allowed due to being considered an ethics violation, which is to inmediatly stop, resolve the ethical conflict and move on. Rest is just "if you don't give your life and soul to your job you won't go to heaven" word salad, which is a complete waste of time to even read.

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  • Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    ITTT, a shitty and frankly racist argument against remote work gets ripped apart:



    The author is a media relations consultant.

    That opinion piece really is something else. It is difficult to express in words my contempt for that professor and the awful, asinine, asskissing opinion piece he wrote. What a, what a piece of shit. Really. I'm so fucking tired of arguments that employees should have some sort of intrinsic, unearned loyalty for the company that hires them, spoken out of the other side of the same mouthpieces who regurgitate bullshit defenses of why corporations are totally justified underpaying and firing employees to meet arbitrary growth metrics or to boost executive raises.

    Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
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  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    So, this LinkedIn post went viral because it describes conditions for devs in Amazon:
    Hi LinkedIn connections! I am ready for my next journey with your company!

    After I received an offer from Alexa AI, I expressed my intention for an internal transfer to my manager at my current AWS team. Since it is performance review season at Amazon, he quickly sent me into a dev plan (PIP) and blackmailed to my future manager and their supervisor.

    He has PIP quotas to fill and luckily, dead people can't talk! Yay!

    So now I am open to work! Recruiters, if you have a job opening that needs a software engineer with solid programming skills, send me a DM!

    Setting delivery deadline for Monday morning on Friday afternoon? Easy!
    Paging at 2AM on Saturday? No problem!
    Being oncall every 4 weeks for a team that lost 50% developers over one year? Piece of cake!
    I only have one humble request, if I submited 51k lines of code in January and my whole team submitted 68k, do not call me a "Least Effective".

    Recruiters from Amazon are not welcome, your understanding is much appreciated.

    You know how New World is a buggy mess filled with exploits? This is why. People with choices will put up with that for a year to have "Amazon" on their CV, then bail. Or bail sooner.

    MatevTicaldfjamElvenshaeMan in the MistsMoridin889FencingsaxMartini_PhilosopherVegemyteHacksawShadowfireSmrtnikIncenjucarnever dieOghulkGnome-InterruptusMayabirdHefflingMrVyngaard
  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    I don't know that I've written all that much more than 51k lines of code in my 9 years where I am now. I'd have to be copy-pasting like mad to hit that in one month

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  • MadpoetMadpoet Registered User regular
    My boss told me that they don't care about lines of code, so I just stopped using newlines. I only wrote one line of code last year, but it was a doozy.

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  • asurasur Registered User regular
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    So, this LinkedIn post went viral because it describes conditions for devs in Amazon:
    Hi LinkedIn connections! I am ready for my next journey with your company!

    After I received an offer from Alexa AI, I expressed my intention for an internal transfer to my manager at my current AWS team. Since it is performance review season at Amazon, he quickly sent me into a dev plan (PIP) and blackmailed to my future manager and their supervisor.

    He has PIP quotas to fill and luckily, dead people can't talk! Yay!

    So now I am open to work! Recruiters, if you have a job opening that needs a software engineer with solid programming skills, send me a DM!

    Setting delivery deadline for Monday morning on Friday afternoon? Easy!
    Paging at 2AM on Saturday? No problem!
    Being oncall every 4 weeks for a team that lost 50% developers over one year? Piece of cake!
    I only have one humble request, if I submited 51k lines of code in January and my whole team submitted 68k, do not call me a "Least Effective".

    Recruiters from Amazon are not welcome, your understanding is much appreciated.

    You know how New World is a buggy mess filled with exploits? This is why. People with choices will put up with that for a year to have "Amazon" on their CV, then bail. Or bail sooner.

    There's absolutely no reason to put up with Amazon for a minute, nevermind a year. If you can get into Amazon then you can get in to the other 20+ tech companies that are just as recognized and don't treat their workers like complete garbage.

    mrondeauKayne Red Robe
  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    asur wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    So, this LinkedIn post went viral because it describes conditions for devs in Amazon:
    Hi LinkedIn connections! I am ready for my next journey with your company!

    After I received an offer from Alexa AI, I expressed my intention for an internal transfer to my manager at my current AWS team. Since it is performance review season at Amazon, he quickly sent me into a dev plan (PIP) and blackmailed to my future manager and their supervisor.

    He has PIP quotas to fill and luckily, dead people can't talk! Yay!

    So now I am open to work! Recruiters, if you have a job opening that needs a software engineer with solid programming skills, send me a DM!

    Setting delivery deadline for Monday morning on Friday afternoon? Easy!
    Paging at 2AM on Saturday? No problem!
    Being oncall every 4 weeks for a team that lost 50% developers over one year? Piece of cake!
    I only have one humble request, if I submited 51k lines of code in January and my whole team submitted 68k, do not call me a "Least Effective".

    Recruiters from Amazon are not welcome, your understanding is much appreciated.

    You know how New World is a buggy mess filled with exploits? This is why. People with choices will put up with that for a year to have "Amazon" on their CV, then bail. Or bail sooner.

    There's absolutely no reason to put up with Amazon for a minute, nevermind a year. If you can get into Amazon then you can get in to the other 20+ tech companies that are just as recognized and don't treat their workers like complete garbage.

    Eh. There's a non-trivial amount of randomness that goes into these tech interviews at the big tech companies. There's also a wide variety of orgs within Amazon which are given a lot of freedom to screw over their devs.... or not. So if it happens to be the only offer you get, it's not guaranteed to be a horrible experience.

    That said you should try not to go there if you have options because of how they treat their warehouse employees if nothing else.

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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    They’ve been contacting me for SDE2 positions several times a week now and just

    Does your file show that I turned down that position because I was offered a better position? At the place you’re trying to snipe me from?

    And you want me to start with some online assessment?

    Gee, I can’t imagine why you’re having trouble hiring.

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  • GilgaronGilgaron Registered User regular
    Heffling wrote: »
    Moridin889 wrote: »
    Domino's reverts to Dave Brandon levels of villainy, creates driver "challenge" to have them work for two fucking months straight without a day off and gets called out on it:
    In a TikTok posted on Jan. 26, Denycia (@denyciadawn) calls out a Domino’s employee promotion, deemed “Survivor: Driver Edition,” that enters its workers into a raffle-like arrangement to win $10,000 if they work 60 days straight, without any tardiness, at multiple locations.

    “If there are numerous people that participated and made it to the end, they divvy that $10,000 up evenly amongst all of the employees,” the TikToker explained. “And then start another round.”

    Whoever thought this up needs to not have a job anymore.

    Outside the harm they are directly inflicting on the employees, did no one check local labor laws? I'm pretty sure there would be issues with making people do that.

    They will argue that it's optional and that the employees are volunteering to work this much.

    I've never worked pizza delivery. Is it as predatory as Uber/Lyft, where basically the company is trading the depreciation on your car for their profits?

    *edit* stop copying old jokes, draft.

    I can tell you that if you get hit by a delivery driver that neither their 'normal' car insurance policy nor the store will cover anything, and eventually the damage gets sent to collections in the name of the driver.

    Mayabird
  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    Some good news for a change: workers at the Staten Island Amazon warehouse are going to get a union election, and the Alabama Amazon workers are getting a do-over. Amazon is, of course, pissed as fuck about this, and will no doubt once again try to sabotage not only the good working people of Alabama, but also try their best to fuck with the folks in Staten Island, as well. It is my sincere hope that both elections succeed and that Amazon gets to eat an entire bag of shit for being the evil fucks that they are.

    (Warehouse) workers of the world, unite!

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  • GvzbgulGvzbgul Registered User regular
    Dark_Side wrote: »
    Grace save us if this movement ever gets caught up with and in the reactionary, populist fascist movement we're seeing politics right now.

    At least right now, that seems unlikely, as the fascist movement going in the US is inextricably linked to the uber rich, who have been funding their own soft revolution for decades.
    There is a rise in anti-vax/mandate worker protests. Canada's shituation is a direct result. I think it's already caught up in it, at least among the populists.

  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    Dark_Side wrote: »
    Grace save us if this movement ever gets caught up with and in the reactionary, populist fascist movement we're seeing politics right now.

    At least right now, that seems unlikely, as the fascist movement going in the US is inextricably linked to the uber rich, who have been funding their own soft revolution for decades.
    There is a rise in anti-vax/mandate worker protests. Canada's shituation is a direct result. I think it's already caught up in it, at least among the populists.

    I wonder how much of that changes per proffession. A trucker is relatively isolated most of the time, so of course they don't care. Meanwhile, the entire service sector has been taking abuse from anti-maskers (and, in some cases, getting shot at) for over 2 years.

    On data, here's Howard Altman, editor for Military Times, on the vaccination rates of the US Army:


    Overall, those are very high rates. Also lol at 0 religious exceptions. Good, they are only useful as toilet paper.

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  • never dienever die Registered User regular
    And with it being 6 medical exemptions, it makes me fairly confident that most of those, if not all, are legit exemptions.

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  • mcdermottmcdermott Registered User regular
    edited February 7
    never die wrote: »
    And with it being 6 medical exemptions, it makes me fairly confident that most of those, if not all, are legit exemptions.

    0 would actually concern me, because over an organization that large there should absolutely be a couple no-shit medical reasons not to get it. Even in a theoretically fit and healthy population like the military.

    6 (out of 700 processed) seems about right.

    mcdermott on
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  • DedwrekkaDedwrekka Metal Hell adjacentRegistered User regular
    Scooter wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Kamar wrote: »
    I'd expect to see a mainstream labor movement in the US be rife with racism and misogyny and nativism and religious bigotry, because that's implicit in the 'mainstream X in the US' part, but it probably wouldn't be those things in such a way as to help to permanently entrench those values the way conservative/reactionary movements driven from the top do.

    edit: Though I guess that flavor of labor movement might end up self-destructing and turning in on itself in such a way as to allow a reactionary counterstroke.

    Dunno. From /r/antiwork falling thanks to a (now former) mod commiting the sheer stupidity of going to an interview on Fox News to rising up again after 3 days thanks to cleaning house, people are very aware that the only way to keep a movement ongoing is to do a constant effort to keep right-wing infiltrators out. Meanwhile, the alternative sub, /r/workreform, was quickly abandoned after the head mod was discovered to be a libertarian crypto nerd and not cleaning the "race/left-right divisions are keeping the workers from uniting" right-wing co-opting memes.

    Yeah, antiwork has its issues but any such movement kind of necessarily needs to be leftist. I saw a bunch of 'bipartisan' "Republicans are as welcome here as socialists!" posts on workreform that first day or two and was just like...no. People actively voting for Republicans are the people stopping 'work reform'.

    While generally true that reform will necessarily come from the left (and historically, usually avowed socialist reformers), it's important to remember that labor in the US has largely been co-opted by conservatives, largely by naming a target for workers to focus ire upon. While labor reform usually comes from the Left, the terminology of labor reform has been entirely coopted by the Right. To the point that unionizers are constantly fighting decades of misinformation.

    What I'm getting at is that it's not as clear cut as saying all unions are leftist. Remember, police unions are the most powerful and politically active unions in the US, and likely the least left-leaning. It's dangerous to expect a reactionary worker revolt will always be left-leaning.

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    As ever, police and their unions are utterly divorced from labor and trades and their corresponding unions, so you can't really compare them except to contrast them.

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  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    As someone who works with the Teamsters, I would like to dispute the claim that police guilds are the most powerful and active unions in the US. :P

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