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Muk is the genetic apex of [Pokémon]

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  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    Well that's lame

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  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

  • CururuCururu Registered User regular
    I have no idea what I'd bring to that (poison terra, base water/dark). Seems fine tuned to make the shield phase miserable. I had been running support on the previous ones, since randos online love to run DPS, but I don't think Sylveon or Armarouge are going to work this time. Maybe I'll train up a Blissey or something.

  • KupiKupi Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    For Cinderace, I got some mileage out of being a Slowbro supporter by running Toxapex, and it may work reasonably well against Greninja too. You at least get two key resists, and the Poison Tera suggests Gunk Shot as a core attacking move, which means an Attack-based build that Chilling Water will effectively slow down.

    If it winds up being Special-based (or mixed), it might be a struggle to find a sufficiently tanky Mystical Fire user...

    EDIT: Forgot (or just didn't realize) how many other "damage and drop attack) moves are out there. For Attack, there's Lunge, Breaking Swipe, and Chilling Water, and for Special Attack there's Struggle Bug, Mystical Fire, and Snarl.

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  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    Megas will come back eventually of the 4 gimmicks they've introduced Megas and Teras are easily the most popular. Z moves just well you all saw them and D/G Max is more annoying than anything else

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  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    Megas will come back eventually of the 4 gimmicks they've introduced Megas and Teras are easily the most popular. Z moves just well you all saw them and D/G Max is more annoying than anything else

    Honestly I'd be mostly fine with Mega Evolution being gone if there were evolutions for those Pokemon that got the biggest boost from it. Mega-Mawile in particular seemed like it could have just been a normal evolution for Mawile. I'd also accept some kind of Paradox-version of Beedrill.

    Thinking on it, a weakness of Mega Evolution and Gigantamaxing was that it effectively made new versions of Pokemon that now are inaccessible without the gimmick, and Mega Evolution was reserved for specific Pokemon (whereas every Pokemon could at least Dynamax). Terastilization is a similar mechanic that doesn't come along with new forms for Pokemon, that apparently having become the domain of Paradox Pokemon. The Pokedex entry in Violet describes Roaring Moon as having "some connection to a phenomenon that occurs in a certain region", obviously referencing Mega Salamence, and Great Tusk in particular looks like it could pass as a Mega Donphan.

  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    I saw a video once speculating that Sun & Moon was originally supposed to have a Pokemon-merging mechanic and Ash-Greninja was sort of a hint towards this. At some point they must have dropped the idea, but you still have Ultra Beasts that look extremely close to main characters in the game and Lusimine merging with a Pokemon as the final boss.

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  • homogenizedhomogenized Registered User regular
    Warlock82 wrote: »
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    I saw a video once speculating that Sun & Moon was originally supposed to have a Pokemon-merging mechanic and Ash-Greninja was sort of a hint towards this. At some point they must have dropped the idea, but you still have Ultra Beasts that look extremely close to main characters in the game and Lusimine merging with a Pokemon as the final boss.

    I recall they made a manga based around something like humans merging with Pokémon, think it was called "Burst" or something like that?

  • joshgotrojoshgotro nah nahRegistered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Series three of Digimon did this as well.

    joshgotro on
  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    ReBurst, IIRC.

    In other news, apparently the Glimmet-Glimmora line is based on a combination of nightshade flowers, a kind of bright blue toxic crystal, and even an obscure kind of deep sea sponge (though this last one applies more to Glimmet than Glimmora in terms of impact on design).

    mee7ulnchdke.png

    So for starter pokemon we've got cat, crocodile, and duck, and for the late game we've got crystal sponge flowers.

    Hexmage-PA on
  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    Warlock82 wrote: »
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    I saw a video once speculating that Sun & Moon was originally supposed to have a Pokemon-merging mechanic and Ash-Greninja was sort of a hint towards this. At some point they must have dropped the idea, but you still have Ultra Beasts that look extremely close to main characters in the game and Lusimine merging with a Pokemon as the final boss.

    I recall they made a manga based around something like humans merging with Pokémon, think it was called "Burst" or something like that?

    Yeah, they mentioned that I believe

    I found the video:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfkoR9dzVeE

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  • ZythonZython Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Warlock82 wrote: »
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    I saw a video once speculating that Sun & Moon was originally supposed to have a Pokemon-merging mechanic and Ash-Greninja was sort of a hint towards this. At some point they must have dropped the idea, but you still have Ultra Beasts that look extremely close to main characters in the game and Lusimine merging with a Pokemon as the final boss.

    I know there’s a fan game that does this, but I’m still waiting for them to allow us to fuse Pokémon together. I want my Venustoise, dammit.

    Zython on
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  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Zython wrote: »
    Warlock82 wrote: »
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Ash-Greninja was such a weird concept. They introduce Mega Evolution, make it important in the anime, but instead of giving Ash a Pokémon to Mega Evolve they came up with something completely unrelated (though this did also mean that Battle Bond, as an ability, gets to keep existing in the new games whereas my poor Beedrill may never get to Mega Evolve again...).

    I did love the transformation sequence and the giant shuriken on the back.

    I saw a video once speculating that Sun & Moon was originally supposed to have a Pokemon-merging mechanic and Ash-Greninja was sort of a hint towards this. At some point they must have dropped the idea, but you still have Ultra Beasts that look extremely close to main characters in the game and Lusimine merging with a Pokemon as the final boss.

    I know there’s a fan game that does this, but I’m still waiting for them to allow us to fuse Pokémon together. I want my Venustoise, dammit.
    It's believed that two of the new Paradox Pokémon in the DLC will he fusions of two of the Legendary Trios; Gen 2''s Suicine, Raikou, and Entei, and Gen 5's Virizion, Cobalion, and Terrakion.

    Hexmage-PA on
  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    I've seen Gastrodon with the following moves may be the best Greninja killer
    It has stockpile and two special ground moves
    It also has clear smog and recover for that pesky battle bond

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  • a nu starta nu start Registered User regular
    For both the Charizard and the Cinderace raids, I had a few pokemon ready based on some theoretically good builds. And in both cases they were completely wrong. This time I'll just wait and see whatever the meta is before I build something.

    Number One Tricky
  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    a nu start wrote: »
    For both the Charizard and the Cinderace raids, I had a few pokemon ready based on some theoretically good builds. And in both cases they were completely wrong. This time I'll just wait and see whatever the meta is before I build something.

    Based on the move pool for Greninja it won't have anything that is super effective against Gastrodon and storm drain immunity negates it's multihit signature move which it definitely has it might also protect the inevitable random ground type someone brings in like a dummy

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  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Finally got my first shiny in this game, and from a Tera Raid no less : a Florges.

    EDIT: It's Tera Type is Dragon, which fits its color scheme when Terastilized, but if I end up using it in battles I'll need to change its Tera Type, probably to Grass for Flower Veil.

    Hexmage-PA on
  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Etwk0wBvVNA

    So apparently in the early drafts of the first Pokémon movie Mew was going to be talking shit to Mewtwo the entire time and telling him he was an abomination in a cutesy voice.

    Hexmage-PA on
  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Etwk0wBvVNA

    So apparently in the early drafts of the first Pokémon movie Mew was going to be talking shit to Mewtwo the entire time and telling him he was an abomination in a cutesy voice.

    I love that they said even though he doesn't talk in the final movie, it's still meant to be implied he's talking shit about Mewtwo. Mew kinda a dick.

    The bit about the Johto legendaries being time-related is super interesting too. Never put together that they learned Ancient Power and Future Sight when that gen's mythical is also Celebi. Totally makes sense though - the whole THEME of gen 2 was "hey we are using a clock now! Let's do time events!" I feel like there's so much they could potentially do with this in Scarlet and Violet DLC if they wanted to. (a few people have already pointed out some Johto teases in S&V so I wonder if they were thinking about this too.. Celebi feels like such a good tie-in)

    Warlock82 on
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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Ahaha. It's been a while since I had a legendary struggle itself to death. Stupid Wo-Chien being immune to Spore.

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  • LucedesLucedes Registered User regular
    what if next gen they just rerun all previous gen-exclusive mechanics

    just a big clusterfuck of mechanics all jammed together

  • KwoaruKwoaru Registered User regular
    They can do whatever they want next generation as long as the first thing they finish is being able to change clothes

    2x39jD4.jpg
  • PailryderPailryder Registered User regular
    Kwoaru wrote: »
    They can do whatever they want next generation as long as the first thing they finish is being able to change clothes

    i ran around A LONG time looking for pants/shorts shops in scarlet. my son was like, no dad, y ou are a student and you can only change the seasonal uniform /cry

  • ChallChall Registered User regular
    The DLC will reveal that we, the player are a Pokemon, and the reason we only have 4 outfits is that those are our seasonal forms.

  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    Man, at this point I've done practically everything EXCEPT the classes and other school events that aren't the Academy Ace tournament.

    Apparently there was a multi-part story with the school nurse the developers intended you to get more of each time you returned to the school, but I got to experience it all at once.

    If they wanted the school to be a place you keep revisiting they should have given you better reasons to come back often.

  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Man, at this point I've done practically everything EXCEPT the classes and other school events that aren't the Academy Ace tournament.

    Apparently there was a multi-part story with the school nurse the developers intended you to get more of each time you returned to the school, but I got to experience it all at once.

    If they wanted the school to be a place you keep revisiting they should have given you better reasons to come back often.

    They don't make it clear but you get so candy for doing the classes so it's worth going back after every few gyms

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  • Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Man, at this point I've done practically everything EXCEPT the classes and other school events that aren't the Academy Ace tournament.

    Apparently there was a multi-part story with the school nurse the developers intended you to get more of each time you returned to the school, but I got to experience it all at once.

    If they wanted the school to be a place you keep revisiting they should have given you better reasons to come back often.

    They don't make it clear but you get so candy for doing the classes so it's worth going back after every few gyms

    The school is emblematic of one of my big design complaints about the game: there's a certain story/fantasy they were trying to sell but the designers seem to have been too afraid of putting restrains on the open world aspects to really sell it. Even if they don't require it, I think some reminders to check in at the school would have gone a long way towards making it flow better. There's nothing wrong with giving the players a lot of freedom but still snapping their eyeballs back to a critical path every now and then.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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  • Cameron_TalleyCameron_Talley Registered User regular
    It didn't help that the "school" was basically just a series of menus, with nothing really to explore.

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  • TayaTaya Registered User regular
    I think there were ways to make the school aspect fun but they didn't really accomplish it. I enjoyed getting to know the teachers, but the school lessons were rarely anything interesting. It would have been cool to decorate your dorm or have a mystery to solve in the school or something I don't know. I'm not a fan of minigames, but maybe some home ec or art class or Phys Ed games would have made it more rewarding.

  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    There's an entire post game bit where you follow Penny around checking on the team star people but I feel like they could have added that into story progression

    The school is actually a terrible idea for an open world game when past pokemon games just sent you out on the thinnest of concepts and your character just kind of fell into plots.

    If the games main story was trying to get the cover legendary home that may have been better

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  • akjakakjak Thera Spooky GymRegistered User regular
    It didn't help that the "school" was basically just a series of menus, with nothing really to explore.

    I blame covid. It’s not like pokemon to NOT make you walk around a lot, and using a menu to zorp you to class seems like a “oh no we ran out of time” kludge.

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  • Halos Nach TariffHalos Nach Tariff Can you blame me? I'm too famous.Registered User regular
    I actually quite enjoyed the little school stuff that's in there, I went back every couple of gym badges and that seemed to work out fine, all the little interactions with the teachers were pretty cute. I'd agree it feels like a time crunch thing though, I'd guess some of the school element stuff wound up getting cut.

    It's kinda funny that they decided that the open world game should have a schooling backdrop, when a school year timetable with various field trips would've been the perfect excuse to keep things more on rails like the older games.

  • Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    I actually quite enjoyed the little school stuff that's in there, I went back every couple of gym badges and that seemed to work out fine, all the little interactions with the teachers were pretty cute. I'd agree it feels like a time crunch thing though, I'd guess some of the school element stuff wound up getting cut.

    It's kinda funny that they decided that the open world game should have a schooling backdrop, when a school year timetable with various field trips would've been the perfect excuse to keep things more on rails like the older games.

    I like some aspects of the school, but a lot was done in a clunky way obviously. Still, the idea of having school classes that teach some of the game mechanics that aren't as obvious is a sound choice. There are a lot of mechanics veteran players take for granted that a newer player who is a child does not know of and having it taught via in-game school does make sense and feels intuitive. The classes just could really have been done better.

    Still, I do enjoy a number of the teachers and wish they could have done more instead of being relegated to a few lectures and dialogue scenes.

    Steel Angel on
    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    I'm playing online ranked singles with the current team: Annihilape, Armarouge, Baxcalibur, Clodsire, Lokix, and Scovillain. I need to make some changes to advance in rank, but I'm not certain what.

    Out of my entire team Scovillain is the only one I've not seen anyone have on their own teams, but the one I'm running has been surprisingly useful. It's unexpectedly fast, and I've trained it to have Attack just a bit higher than Special Attack so that it can run Seed Bomb/Zen Headbutt/Overheat/Leaf Storm and hit pretty hard with all of them. I could change to a defensive Tera type perhaps, but Tera-boosted Seed Bomb is pretty nice.

    Clodsire is such a good boy; I've trained it in an atypical way to sacrifice Special Attack and Speed so it can take hits and hit back with more force than someone might expect. Yawn/Toxic Spikes/Earthquake/Megahorn is what I have going on him.

    Baxcalibur is Choice Scarf'd and there to spam Glaive Rush. Simple.

    I really need to think more about Tera Type. Just today I've run into a Tera Ghost Garganacl with Curse and Recover, as well as a Tera Fairy Volcarona with Tera Blast and Leech Life.

    Maybe I can find a weird niche for my Tera Dragon Florges...

    Hexmage-PA on
  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Taya wrote: »
    I think there were ways to make the school aspect fun but they didn't really accomplish it. I enjoyed getting to know the teachers, but the school lessons were rarely anything interesting. It would have been cool to decorate your dorm or have a mystery to solve in the school or something I don't know. I'm not a fan of minigames, but maybe some home ec or art class or Phys Ed games would have made it more rewarding.

    To be honest, I think what the school is *supposed* to do is a good idea. It's basically an advanced tutorial on some of the more complicated topics that new players might not know about (shiny rates, type effectiveness actual numbers, how to get premier balls, etc). But it's literally never advertised as such. You have to explore it yourself and find this out. I feel like a little signposting would have gone a long way here. And then it's also sort of this middle ground where players who know this stuff are missing out on some rewards if they don't participate (i.e. Galarian Meowth most significantly, but also fast travel points to the four shrines and some other stuff) and it's sort of boring for those players to have to do that just to get those rewards which are exclusive to the classes. (TBH I still haven't done like 3 of the classes)

    Also fuck that math teacher and her trick questions. There's always one teacher like that. "Here, let me give you a math problem that teaches wrong math!"

    Warlock82 on
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  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Okay, I'll admit that the Biology class just got a laugh out of me. The instructor is talking about different ways Pokémon can evolve, and begins specifically mentioning how Primeape evolves in Annihilape before being cut-off by the school bell.

    For those unaware, someone wrote in one of Primeape's Pokédex entries that it can get so angry it dies. Scarlet and Violet introduce Rage Fist, a move that causes Primeape to evolve if it is used 20 times without taking the Primeape to a Pokémon Center for healing. As Rage Fist has less than twenty uses, the player has to use an item to restore usage of Rage Fist so Primeape can keep using it. Then it "evolves" from a Fighting type to a Fighting/Ghost type called Annihilape.

    So basically the people who make these games added lore about how Primeape can die if it gets too angry, then later made an evolution of Primeape that depends on the player enabling the Primeape to use Rage Fist until it "evolves", then included a character who is set to tell a classroom of kids how to kill their Primeapes before being interrupted.

    The Pokémon games, unlike the tie-in show, love to just tease us with how the entire premise of the game is deeply morally questionable to the point of introducing a Pokémon you canonically can only get from enabling its own death.

    Hexmage-PA on
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Okay, I'll admit that the Biology class just got a laugh out of me. The instructor is talking about different ways Pokémon can evolve, and begins specifically mentioning how Primeape evolves in Annihilape before being cut-off by the school bell.

    For those unaware, someone wrote in one of Primeape's Pokédex entries that it can get so angry it dies. Scarlet and Violet introduce Rage Fist, a move that causes Primeape to evolve if it is used 20 times without taking the Primeape to a Pokémon Center for healing. As Rage Fist has less than twenty uses, the player has to use an item to restore usage of Rage Fist so Primeape can keep using it. Then it "evolves" from a Fighting type to a Fighting/Ghost type called Annihilape.

    So basically the people who make these games added lore about how Primeape can die if it gets too angry, then later made an evolution of Primeape that depends on the player enabling the Primeape to use Rage Fist until it "evolves", then included a character who is set to tell a classroom of kids how to kill their Primeapes before being interrupted.

    No, there's no requirement about not visiting a pokemon center. It just has to use it 20 times. A fun trick I was told for that? Go fight some level 2 lechonks at the start of the game, because it still counts even if it whiffs because of typing. And then you can burn through the PP much faster because not leaving battle, less animations, etc.

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  • Up JobUp Job Registered User regular
    I only need two more entries to complete my dex, Flutter Mane and Koraidon. Would anyone be able to help me with them?

  • Hexmage-PAHexmage-PA Registered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Hexmage-PA wrote: »
    Okay, I'll admit that the Biology class just got a laugh out of me. The instructor is talking about different ways Pokémon can evolve, and begins specifically mentioning how Primeape evolves in Annihilape before being cut-off by the school bell.

    For those unaware, someone wrote in one of Primeape's Pokédex entries that it can get so angry it dies. Scarlet and Violet introduce Rage Fist, a move that causes Primeape to evolve if it is used 20 times without taking the Primeape to a Pokémon Center for healing. As Rage Fist has less than twenty uses, the player has to use an item to restore usage of Rage Fist so Primeape can keep using it. Then it "evolves" from a Fighting type to a Fighting/Ghost type called Annihilape.

    So basically the people who make these games added lore about how Primeape can die if it gets too angry, then later made an evolution of Primeape that depends on the player enabling the Primeape to use Rage Fist until it "evolves", then included a character who is set to tell a classroom of kids how to kill their Primeapes before being interrupted.

    No, there's no requirement about not visiting a pokemon center. It just has to use it 20 times. A fun trick I was told for that? Go fight some level 2 lechonks at the start of the game, because it still counts even if it whiffs because of typing. And then you can burn through the PP much faster because not leaving battle, less animations, etc.

    Oh, I guess I read some misinfo on the "No Pokémon Center" thing.

    Still dies, though.

  • CururuCururu Registered User regular
    Are all Ghost types actually dead/undead, though?

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