Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Could Garak concoct a plan so clever and intricate that he couldn’t stop it even if he tried?
"Go down, kick ass, and set yourselves up as gods, that's our Prime Directive!"
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Could Garak concoct a plan so clever and intricate that he couldn’t stop it even if he tried?
Given Worf once stopped Garek's plans, the answer is almost certainly no.
EDIT: Or rather not all Garek plans could not be stopped by Garek. I suppose it's possible he'd find a particular plan that once underway was impossible to stop.
Undead Scottsman on
+7
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MonwynApathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime.A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered Userregular
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Yes, it is the armed forces for the United Federation of Planets. They literally fight wars for the UFP. It's just a little weird to think of because they also have a lot of non-military functions. They're like Military+
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Yes, it is the armed forces for the United Federation of Planets. They literally fight wars for the UFP. It's just a little weird to think of because they also have a lot of non-military functions. They're like Military+
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Yes, it is the armed forces for the United Federation of Planets. They literally fight wars for the UFP. It's just a little weird to think of because they also have a lot of non-military functions. They're like Military+
Next question.
Did Tuvix deserve to live?
Yes, but so did Tuvok and Neelix, and nobody will remember the transporter clone trick until Lower Decks.
Next question.
EDIT: As an aside, hybridized beings don't seem to be afforded rights over their component elements in the Federation based on other scenerios, but the question was about morality, not legality.
Undead Scottsman on
+3
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MonwynApathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime.A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered Userregular
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Yes, it is the armed forces for the United Federation of Planets. They literally fight wars for the UFP. It's just a little weird to think of because they also have a lot of non-military functions. They're like Military+
Next question.
Did Tuvix deserve to live?
Yes, but so did Tuvok and Neelix, and nobody will remember the transporter clone trick until Lower Decks.
Next question.
EDIT: As an aside, hybridized beings don't seem to be afforded rights over their component elements in the Federation based on other scenerios, but the question was about morality, not legality.
Would Voyager have been a better show if the whole thing was Year of Hell?
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Could Garak concoct a plan so clever and intricate that he couldn’t stop it even if he tried?
Just a reminder; Quark never told Garak he didn't want him to go through with the plan to assassinate him.
Garak's either a failed assassin, or he's playing the long game.
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Yes, it is the armed forces for the United Federation of Planets. They literally fight wars for the UFP. It's just a little weird to think of because they also have a lot of non-military functions. They're like Military+
Next question.
Did Tuvix deserve to live?
Yes, but so did Tuvok and Neelix, and nobody will remember the transporter clone trick until Lower Decks.
Next question.
EDIT: As an aside, hybridized beings don't seem to be afforded rights over their component elements in the Federation based on other scenerios, but the question was about morality, not legality.
Would Voyager have been a better show if the whole thing was Year of Hell?
It would have still be written by the same writers, so unless they were willing to stick to there being consequences (like scarcity of resources, unrepairable damage or injuries, deaths) it would have likely ended up with similar issues to the Voyager we got, but it may have been a more enjoyable ride in the meantime than TNG-lite.
I kinda loved how the moment he heard Q's voice, Picard immediately cranked the "fuckin' done" dial up as far as it can go.
I said much the same during our own watch party, and also commented on JDL's "devil's smile."
And in the segment before that, on the bridge,
when that booming polyphonic WE ARE came through the speakers: "there are two people on that bridge who have heard That Voice before." (And they're both going oh shit.)
Ah, so we're already christening the new thread with The Transporter (of Theseus) Discussion, bravo, wasting no time. Maybe we can talk about the Prime Directive next!
It's bad.
Next question!
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
There are seafaring organizations in Earth history that combine defense, trade and diplomacy, science and exploration, customs and immigration, and law enforcement roles into a single entity. They're called navies.
Since WWII and the end of the colonial age navies don't generally wear so many hats, but that's because things like the Coast Guard exist as distinct organizations, and the private sector increasingly has access and skills that once were primarily limited to navies. Star Trek's setting hits the reset button on that and makes Starfleet the one stop shop for the longest range, fastest speed, and best skills for almost any job.
Its nice to see STO ships on Picard, but you know what is better? Reading the first Issue of IDWs Star Trek Discovery- Adventures in 32th century starring Grudge the Queen!
Grudge for those that don't know is Booker's cat. And she looks down on you like peasant you are. The comic is told entirely from her POV and it is glorious! As befits a Queen.
The sky was full of stars, every star an exploding ship. One of ours.
Its nice to see STO ships on Picard, but you know what is better? Reading the first Issue of IDWs Star Trek Discovery- Adventures in 32th century starring Grudge the Queen!
Grudge for those that don't know is Booker's cat. And she looks down on you like peasant you are. The comic is told entirely from her POV and it is glorious! As befits a Queen.
One of my favorite scenes from this season of Discovery:
Its nice to see STO ships on Picard, but you know what is better? Reading the first Issue of IDWs Star Trek Discovery- Adventures in 32th century starring Grudge the Queen!
Grudge for those that don't know is Booker's cat. And she looks down on you like peasant you are. The comic is told entirely from her POV and it is glorious! As befits a Queen.
One of my favorite scenes from this season of Discovery:
I mean, they already have ships manned entirely by holograms...
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HardtargetThere Are Four LightsVancouverRegistered Userregular
edited March 2022
alright i watched the first ep of picard season 2
Various thoughts
- I don't get why he's playing Picard as such a fucking old man, like irl pat stew is more spry. This also sucked in season 1
- he's a fucking roboto and that isn't mentioned
- it's an entire story about his love life and Beverly is still not mentioned again, this is fucking INSANE at this point
- really, the borg again?
- the first half of the episodes is so rambly and it takes forever to get going
- Guinan felt totally wasted, he didn't even say to her what he wanted to say to her, why was she there at all?
- Picard doesn't need a deep dark secret about his mom being beaten up by his dad (or whatever) to show why he can't love, It's fucking stupid and doesn't fit the character
- once he gets onto the stargazer suff starts to finally happen
- at least the federation seems back on track
- the last 2 mins with Q was interesting and didn't just feel like fan service
- oh also i'm glad they mentioned why Alison Pill's character isn't in jail instead of just ignoring it
- I don't get why he's playing Picard as such a fucking old man, like irl pat stew is more spry. This also sucked in season 1
- Picard doesn't need a deep dark secret about his mom being beaten up by his dad (or whatever) to show why he can't love, It's fucking stupid and doesn't fit the character
Given that the latter point is (I believe) autobiographical, it would seem that Jean-Luc Picard is both not enough and too much like Patrick Stewart. (Also, Picard is about a decade older than Stewart.)
Is the direction of Picard’s character something you expected to be completely reworked after season one? I mean, if you’re disappointed you’re disappointed—I get it—but given that Stewart clearly has a (if not the) guiding hand in the direction of the character and he’s still involved… why would it have changed?
Sneaks on
+4
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cptruggedI think it has something to do with free will.Registered Userregular
After Jessie Gender's recent video I've decided to Trek some more. Started Lower Decks and it is amazing. I'm strongly considering giving Voyager another try. I gave it a hard pass when it aired cause, well, it seemed really bad. But I did the same with DS9 until a member of this forum told me DS9 was their favorite trek and lo and behold they were right it was amazing.
After Jessie Gender's recent video I've decided to Trek some more. Started Lower Decks and it is amazing. I'm strongly considering giving Voyager another try. I gave it a hard pass when it aired cause, well, it seemed really bad. But I did the same with DS9 until a member of this forum told me DS9 was their favorite trek and lo and behold they were right it was amazing.
I hope you enjoy them both!
Voyager isn’t perfect, but it was appointment TV for my mom and I growing up, so I’ve got a lot of fond memories.
+1
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Element BrianPeanut Butter ShillRegistered Userregular
edited March 2022
Watching S2E1 of Picard and waiting for Q to show up gave me this vibe
After Jessie Gender's recent video I've decided to Trek some more. Started Lower Decks and it is amazing. I'm strongly considering giving Voyager another try. I gave it a hard pass when it aired cause, well, it seemed really bad. But I did the same with DS9 until a member of this forum told me DS9 was their favorite trek and lo and behold they were right it was amazing.
Someone in my STO fleet recently watched VOY for the first time. They struggled with the first season, and then someone else provided a curated list of the better episodes. Want me to acquire that for you?
0
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cptruggedI think it has something to do with free will.Registered Userregular
After Jessie Gender's recent video I've decided to Trek some more. Started Lower Decks and it is amazing. I'm strongly considering giving Voyager another try. I gave it a hard pass when it aired cause, well, it seemed really bad. But I did the same with DS9 until a member of this forum told me DS9 was their favorite trek and lo and behold they were right it was amazing.
Someone in my STO fleet recently watched VOY for the first time. They struggled with the first season, and then someone else provided a curated list of the better episodes. Want me to acquire that for you?
Sure! That'd be really cool. I'm old school so I don't particularly mind slogging through the early rough stuff. But I'm also not invested enough to think it wouldn't burn me out if I hit too many stinkers in a row.
After Jessie Gender's recent video I've decided to Trek some more. Started Lower Decks and it is amazing. I'm strongly considering giving Voyager another try. I gave it a hard pass when it aired cause, well, it seemed really bad. But I did the same with DS9 until a member of this forum told me DS9 was their favorite trek and lo and behold they were right it was amazing.
Someone in my STO fleet recently watched VOY for the first time. They struggled with the first season, and then someone else provided a curated list of the better episodes. Want me to acquire that for you?
Sure! That'd be really cool. I'm old school so I don't particularly mind slogging through the early rough stuff. But I'm also not invested enough to think it wouldn't burn me out if I hit too many stinkers in a row.
(has a few that are a little iffy, 'cause it was tailored to this fleetie's interests, but it should serve)
Commander Zoom on
+4
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MonwynApathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime.A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered Userregular
edited March 2022
Picard S2E1 thoughts
Kinda weird that the Borg referred to Picard as Picard, and not Locutus. I get it when they're sending the original signal but once he shows you'd think we'd get both that title and "Seven of Nine, tertiary adjunct of unimatrix 01"
The domestic violence subplot is very much Stewart working some of his advocacy into the script, as is the pit bull padding alongside him in the vineyard.
I was outright angry at bringing back Q when it was previewed; All Good Things capped that storyline off pretty perfectly, and it seemed like a cheap callback. I'm a lot more interested now that the context is that Picard knowingly killed himself out of fear rather than helping those who asked for it.
Caught up on Discovery and I have to say I really am enjoying this season.
Yes the DMA and the big crisis is scary. But at the same time it being a mining drone for a super advanced civilization that may or may not be alive is a wonderful reveal. It is very old school sci-fi in feeling. Also a bit of Stellaris I would say. Then going to a place outside the galactic barrier which is an old TOS thing. Then you get Dyson Rings and a possible gas giant living species that communicates not through sound but hydrocarbons?
I am 100% on board with this. I do think the Book/Tarka side plot is silly but it I also like both characters so whatever.
Also Vulcan flirting is great.
Mazzyx on
+2
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Element BrianPeanut Butter ShillRegistered Userregular
Kinda weird that the Borg referred to Picard as Picard, and not Locutus. I get it when they're sending the original signal but once he shows you'd think we'd get both that title and "Seven of Nine, tertiary adjunct of unimatrix 01"
The domestic violence subplot is very much Stewart working some of his advocacy into the script, as is the pit bull padding alongside him in the vineyard.
I was outright angry at bringing back Q when it was previewed; All Good Things capped that storyline off pretty perfectly, and it seemed like a cheap callback. I'm a lot more interested now that the context is that Picard knowingly killed himself out of fear rather than helping those who asked for it.
Picard vs Locutus
I thought others had mentioned that, since Picard became cyber-Picard, he was essentially removed from what the Borg had done to him, physically at least. We don't know this for sure, but it might have been hinted at by him looking to 7 when the ship arrives and her confirming that it's Borg. I wonder if them referring to him as Picard instead of Locutus is also a sign of his further removal from the collective?
Kinda weird that the Borg referred to Picard as Picard, and not Locutus. I get it when they're sending the original signal but once he shows you'd think we'd get both that title and "Seven of Nine, tertiary adjunct of unimatrix 01"
The domestic violence subplot is very much Stewart working some of his advocacy into the script, as is the pit bull padding alongside him in the vineyard.
I was outright angry at bringing back Q when it was previewed; All Good Things capped that storyline off pretty perfectly, and it seemed like a cheap callback. I'm a lot more interested now that the context is that Picard knowingly killed himself out of fear rather than helping those who asked for it.
Re: the Borg: I kind of like the plot that this is a broken Borg. In TNG we also saw that the Borg were vulnerable to internal discord, provided you could introduce it. In Voyager we see races that have learned to live on the fringe of the Collective and pull at the loose strings, we see one and possibly several races that can straight up beat them in a fair fight, and others that didn't fight fair. We see internal instability giving drones a potential exit door, and we see freed drones able to leverage the hive mind for constructive purposes.
The last time we saw the Borg, Voyager was ripping and subsequently prolapsing them a new asshole with future tech, and even though the Borg were adapting to that tech by the end, they lost a fleet, a massive space station, and a large portion of their transwarp network. And even the temporary sundering of the Collective could have had profound effects of even some of their enemies like those free drones or Species 8472 were able to capitalize.
It's not clear what they wanted in that scene, but I suspect their goals were different than in any previous encounter. We know the Borg Queen appears again, maybe we'll learn then, or maybe after Picard passed Q's new trial he'll be put back in that moment to proceed in a different way.
Hevach on
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HardtargetThere Are Four LightsVancouverRegistered Userregular
- I don't get why he's playing Picard as such a fucking old man, like irl pat stew is more spry. This also sucked in season 1
- Picard doesn't need a deep dark secret about his mom being beaten up by his dad (or whatever) to show why he can't love, It's fucking stupid and doesn't fit the character
Given that the latter point is (I believe) autobiographical, it would seem that Jean-Luc Picard is both not enough and too much like Patrick Stewart. (Also, Picard is about a decade older than Stewart.)
Is the direction of Picard’s character something you expected to be completely reworked after season one? I mean, if you’re disappointed you’re disappointed—I get it—but given that Stewart clearly has a (if not the) guiding hand in the direction of the character and he’s still involved… why would it have changed?
ya I more just meant i find it a annoying choice to watch, i wasn't expecting it to change. the other stuff was more real complaints but i did like the ending and i'm very curious to see where they go this season
- I don't get why he's playing Picard as such a fucking old man, like irl pat stew is more spry. This also sucked in season 1
- Picard doesn't need a deep dark secret about his mom being beaten up by his dad (or whatever) to show why he can't love, It's fucking stupid and doesn't fit the character
Given that the latter point is (I believe) autobiographical, it would seem that Jean-Luc Picard is both not enough and too much like Patrick Stewart. (Also, Picard is about a decade older than Stewart.)
Is the direction of Picard’s character something you expected to be completely reworked after season one? I mean, if you’re disappointed you’re disappointed—I get it—but given that Stewart clearly has a (if not the) guiding hand in the direction of the character and he’s still involved… why would it have changed?
ya I more just meant i find it a annoying choice to watch, i wasn't expecting it to change. the other stuff was more real complaints but i did like the ending and i'm very curious to see where they go this season
My only real big issue is
no beverly mention, it's brutal
I, too, don't talk about my crushes that I had 30 years ago.
+5
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AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
- I don't get why he's playing Picard as such a fucking old man, like irl pat stew is more spry. This also sucked in season 1
- Picard doesn't need a deep dark secret about his mom being beaten up by his dad (or whatever) to show why he can't love, It's fucking stupid and doesn't fit the character
Given that the latter point is (I believe) autobiographical, it would seem that Jean-Luc Picard is both not enough and too much like Patrick Stewart. (Also, Picard is about a decade older than Stewart.)
Is the direction of Picard’s character something you expected to be completely reworked after season one? I mean, if you’re disappointed you’re disappointed—I get it—but given that Stewart clearly has a (if not the) guiding hand in the direction of the character and he’s still involved… why would it have changed?
ya I more just meant i find it a annoying choice to watch, i wasn't expecting it to change. the other stuff was more real complaints but i did like the ending and i'm very curious to see where they go this season
My only real big issue is
no beverly mention, it's brutal
Picard not getting with Beverly is practically a character trait. I'll allow it.
After Picard shared everyone's future with them in All Good Things, I expect he and Crusher never got together, knowing how it would end. Nobody else followed the same future Picard spoiled for them, either.
I goddamn know I missed something in Discovery. I suspect I left it on and went to work at some point and it played a couple episodes I missed. Because it just up and stopped making sense a few episodes back and judging from this thread it's not just the season taking that late downturn I've been dreading.
So restarting the season and trying to go in with a clean slate.
After the STO stuff in Picard and hearing how Kurtzman has pushed for tighter integration around the franchise, I'm noticing stuff like the reference to the Iconian War that I glossed over the first time... If I even saw this episode? I'm not sure I did.
Posts
It's bad.
Next question!
Could Garak concoct a plan so clever and intricate that he couldn’t stop it even if he tried?
Given Worf once stopped Garek's plans, the answer is almost certainly no.
EDIT: Or rather not all Garek plans could not be stopped by Garek. I suppose it's possible he'd find a particular plan that once underway was impossible to stop.
Is Starfleet a military, proclimations otherwise to the side?
Yes, it is the armed forces for the United Federation of Planets. They literally fight wars for the UFP. It's just a little weird to think of because they also have a lot of non-military functions. They're like Military+
Next question.
Did Tuvix deserve to live?
Yes, but so did Tuvok and Neelix, and nobody will remember the transporter clone trick until Lower Decks.
Next question.
EDIT: As an aside, hybridized beings don't seem to be afforded rights over their component elements in the Federation based on other scenerios, but the question was about morality, not legality.
Would Voyager have been a better show if the whole thing was Year of Hell?
Just a reminder; Quark never told Garak he didn't want him to go through with the plan to assassinate him.
Garak's either a failed assassin, or he's playing the long game.
It would have still be written by the same writers, so unless they were willing to stick to there being consequences (like scarcity of resources, unrepairable damage or injuries, deaths) it would have likely ended up with similar issues to the Voyager we got, but it may have been a more enjoyable ride in the meantime than TNG-lite.
Next question.
And in the segment before that, on the bridge,
There are seafaring organizations in Earth history that combine defense, trade and diplomacy, science and exploration, customs and immigration, and law enforcement roles into a single entity. They're called navies.
Since WWII and the end of the colonial age navies don't generally wear so many hats, but that's because things like the Coast Guard exist as distinct organizations, and the private sector increasingly has access and skills that once were primarily limited to navies. Star Trek's setting hits the reset button on that and makes Starfleet the one stop shop for the longest range, fastest speed, and best skills for almost any job.
Grudge for those that don't know is Booker's cat. And she looks down on you like peasant you are. The comic is told entirely from her POV and it is glorious! As befits a Queen.
One of my favorite scenes from this season of Discovery:
She's a queen.
Oh, a cat would fuck that planet up.
Timeline adds up about right for him to be a commander at this point.
Well, Barclay's got his holo-deck reservation at 0230 hours, so I imagine he'll be able to shine then.
"Okey-dokey!"
He's holding out for President Barclay.
Various thoughts
- he's a fucking roboto and that isn't mentioned
- it's an entire story about his love life and Beverly is still not mentioned again, this is fucking INSANE at this point
- really, the borg again?
- the first half of the episodes is so rambly and it takes forever to get going
- Guinan felt totally wasted, he didn't even say to her what he wanted to say to her, why was she there at all?
- Picard doesn't need a deep dark secret about his mom being beaten up by his dad (or whatever) to show why he can't love, It's fucking stupid and doesn't fit the character
- once he gets onto the stargazer suff starts to finally happen
- at least the federation seems back on track
- the last 2 mins with Q was interesting and didn't just feel like fan service
- oh also i'm glad they mentioned why Alison Pill's character isn't in jail instead of just ignoring it
we'll see how episode 2 is but so far ehhh
Given that the latter point is (I believe) autobiographical, it would seem that Jean-Luc Picard is both not enough and too much like Patrick Stewart. (Also, Picard is about a decade older than Stewart.)
Is the direction of Picard’s character something you expected to be completely reworked after season one? I mean, if you’re disappointed you’re disappointed—I get it—but given that Stewart clearly has a (if not the) guiding hand in the direction of the character and he’s still involved… why would it have changed?
I hope you enjoy them both!
Voyager isn’t perfect, but it was appointment TV for my mom and I growing up, so I’ve got a lot of fond memories.
Arch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_goGR39m2k
Someone in my STO fleet recently watched VOY for the first time. They struggled with the first season, and then someone else provided a curated list of the better episodes. Want me to acquire that for you?
Sure! That'd be really cool. I'm old school so I don't particularly mind slogging through the early rough stuff. But I'm also not invested enough to think it wouldn't burn me out if I hit too many stinkers in a row.
Voyager Recommended Watchlist
(has a few that are a little iffy, 'cause it was tailored to this fleetie's interests, but it should serve)
The domestic violence subplot is very much Stewart working some of his advocacy into the script, as is the pit bull padding alongside him in the vineyard.
I was outright angry at bringing back Q when it was previewed; All Good Things capped that storyline off pretty perfectly, and it seemed like a cheap callback. I'm a lot more interested now that the context is that Picard knowingly killed himself out of fear rather than helping those who asked for it.
I am 100% on board with this. I do think the Book/Tarka side plot is silly but it I also like both characters so whatever.
Also Vulcan flirting is great.
Picard vs Locutus
Arch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_goGR39m2k
The last time we saw the Borg, Voyager was ripping and subsequently prolapsing them a new asshole with future tech, and even though the Borg were adapting to that tech by the end, they lost a fleet, a massive space station, and a large portion of their transwarp network. And even the temporary sundering of the Collective could have had profound effects of even some of their enemies like those free drones or Species 8472 were able to capitalize.
It's not clear what they wanted in that scene, but I suspect their goals were different than in any previous encounter. We know the Borg Queen appears again, maybe we'll learn then, or maybe after Picard passed Q's new trial he'll be put back in that moment to proceed in a different way.
ya I more just meant i find it a annoying choice to watch, i wasn't expecting it to change. the other stuff was more real complaints but i did like the ending and i'm very curious to see where they go this season
My only real big issue is
Picard not getting with Beverly is practically a character trait. I'll allow it.
So restarting the season and trying to go in with a clean slate.