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[Star Trek]: Strange New Worlds is out (Latest seasons of current shows in spoilers)

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  • MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    SNWE2
    "We don't change the path of developing cultures but we don't just let them die"

    Ahahahahahahaha no.

    Otherwise just a great episode that mixes high concept sci-fi with lots of personal scenes that get to just... exist? Similar to Lower Decks the fact that we get scenes that feel like the universe is lived in.

    To be fair
    This is the Kirk era, before the prime directive became a conveniant excuse for non-action.
    The whole thing struck me a bit as competing versions of the PD: Kirk (and Pike) era "just don't let anyone see you" vs TNG-et-al "WE MUST NOT INTERFERE WITH GOD'S PLAN".

    Which ironically
    their interference WAS God's (M'Hati) plan. Maybe.

    Commander Zoomoverride367
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    The Orville returns on June 2.



    Looking schmexy! Also, RIP Norm MacDonald.

    I love how much Seth MacFarlane trolled them into letting him make an actual Star Trek show.

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  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    also SNW 1x02:
    I liked that Pike sees Uhura in dress uniform and immediately understands that someone decided to prank the newbie.
    Also when he starts to ask his usual question and trips over it, because now he's literally seen himself in ten years and it's living death.

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    So the constant stream of Star Trek stuff has gotten me hooked on Paramount+ (grudgingly) and I decided to go back to Discovery. I watched season 1 as it aired and haven't really been back. I am up to season 3 and I am really loving this season. Like a ton. This is what I wanted Enterprise to be 20 years ago more or less. I still don't care for season 2, but man am I excited for more of the show I am getting at this point.

    Mancingtom
  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    The Orville returns on June 2.



    Looking schmexy! Also, RIP Norm MacDonald.

    I love how much Seth MacFarlane trolled them into letting him make an actual Star Trek show.

    Not like he trolled them, he's just has money and power so of course he gets to make himself a legally-distinct Captain of the Enterprise if he wants. Just like if Elon Musk wanted to, he has the money and power to transform the United States into a mini-Federation, free of want and poverty, but he'd rather buy Twitter.

    A comparison that does make me feel (slightly) warmer towards McFarland, since he used his much more limited resources to make something actually good.

    Commander ZoomGiantGeek2020
  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    MorganV wrote: »
    SNWE2
    "We don't change the path of developing cultures but we don't just let them die"

    Ahahahahahahaha no.

    Otherwise just a great episode that mixes high concept sci-fi with lots of personal scenes that get to just... exist? Similar to Lower Decks the fact that we get scenes that feel like the universe is lived in.

    To be fair
    This is the Kirk era, before the prime directive became a conveniant excuse for non-action.
    The whole thing struck me a bit as competing versions of the PD: Kirk (and Pike) era "just don't let anyone see you" vs TNG-et-al "WE MUST NOT INTERFERE WITH GOD'S PLAN".

    Which ironically
    their interference WAS God's (M'Hati) plan. Maybe.
    Yeah, actual precognition and predestination paradoxes ... complicate things somewhat. Though as Una points out, there's prophecy and then there's interpreting it.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Gnizmo wrote: »
    So the constant stream of Star Trek stuff has gotten me hooked on Paramount+ (grudgingly) and I decided to go back to Discovery. I watched season 1 as it aired and haven't really been back. I am up to season 3 and I am really loving this season. Like a ton. This is what I wanted Enterprise to be 20 years ago more or less. I still don't care for season 2, but man am I excited for more of the show I am getting at this point.

    I think S2 starts really strong, and just looses it's way super hard with the AI plot. Which sucks! There's a lot of great horror and ideas in there, but it just doesn't execute well on them.

    My pitch that i've mentioend before i's i'd move the sphere stuff up - possibly even make it the opener. Make the chasing the red flares connected to this explicitly. Introduce Control, but make it so that it's not Control that's the threat - it's Section 31, traumatized out of their minds by their (percived) Failures in the Klingon War, and desperate for any edge to make sure it dosent happen again. If anything, i'd actually also include the beat of Control rebelling... against section 31 (and dying in the process), which a: gives you just some good pathos, and b: makes for interesting links to the sphere data being a caring AI.

    And honestly, make it more episodic - part of why S2 starts so strong is that other than the red flares plot, the initial episodes ARE episodic, and as a result we get some really good stuff - a rescue mission, the very cool "how the hell are there humans here?" episode, etc.

    But this is all hypotheticals and done is is done. We got Ansoun Mount, Eththan Peck & Rebecca Romijin for SNW (And SNW itself!) out of Season 2, and i can forgive a lot for that.

    Def tell us what you think when you hit S4 Gnizmo! Most people would agree it's real fucking good.

    @TOGSolid So i wanna push back a little here:
    My read of the scene is that Uhura is embarssed and uncomfortable in this scene - her captain just laughed at her! Good naturedly, but she's obviously not handling the being hazed very well... and you know, fair enough. So she's immediately looking for stuff that feels familiar and safe to her, and embarrassing herself in the process. Plus, Hemmer himself seems pretty unphased, even impressed that she stands up to him and Spock and bites back (In what i assume was Andorian?)

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
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  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    The Orville returns on June 2.



    Looking schmexy! Also, RIP Norm MacDonald.

    I love how much Seth MacFarlane trolled them into letting him make an actual Star Trek show.

    Not like he trolled them, he's just has money and power so of course he gets to make himself a legally-distinct Captain of the Enterprise if he wants. Just like if Elon Musk wanted to, he has the money and power to transform the United States into a mini-Federation, free of want and poverty, but he'd rather buy Twitter.

    A comparison that does make me feel (slightly) warmer towards McFarland, since he used his much more limited resources to make something actually good.

    Originally McFarland pitched The Orville as a Star Trek spinoff to CBS. They wanted nothing to do with him so we went to Fox who was more than willing to give him a show as long as he starred in it.

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    edited May 13
    Gnizmo wrote: »
    So the constant stream of Star Trek stuff has gotten me hooked on Paramount+ (grudgingly) and I decided to go back to Discovery. I watched season 1 as it aired and haven't really been back. I am up to season 3 and I am really loving this season. Like a ton. This is what I wanted Enterprise to be 20 years ago more or less. I still don't care for season 2, but man am I excited for more of the show I am getting at this point.

    I think S2 starts really strong, and just looses it's way super hard with the AI plot. Which sucks! There's a lot of great horror and ideas in there, but it just doesn't execute well on them.

    My pitch that i've mentioend before i's i'd move the sphere stuff up - possibly even make it the opener. Make the chasing the red flares connected to this explicitly. Introduce Control, but make it so that it's not Control that's the threat - it's Section 31, traumatized out of their minds by their (percived) Failures in the Klingon War, and desperate for any edge to make sure it dosent happen again. If anything, i'd actually also include the beat of Control rebelling... against section 31 (and dying in the process), which a: gives you just some good pathos, and b: makes for interesting links to the sphere data being a caring AI.

    And honestly, make it more episodic - part of why S2 starts so strong is that other than the red flares plot, the initial episodes ARE episodic, and as a result we get some really good stuff - a rescue mission, the very cool "how the hell are there humans here?" episode, etc.

    But this is all hypotheticals and done is is done. We got Ansoun Mount, Eththan Peck & Rebecca Romijin for SNW (And SNW itself!) out of Season 2, and i can forgive a lot for that.

    Def tell us what you think when you hit S4 Gnizmo! Most people would agree it's real fucking good.

    @TOGSolid So i wanna push back a little here:
    My read of the scene is that Uhura is embarssed and uncomfortable in this scene - her captain just laughed at her! Good naturedly, but she's obviously not handling the being hazed very well... and you know, fair enough. So she's immediately looking for stuff that feels familiar and safe to her, and embarrassing herself in the process. Plus, Hemmer himself seems pretty unphased, even impressed that she stands up to him and Spock and bites back (In what i assume was Andorian?)

    See my take on season 2 is very different. I didn't really care for it start to finish. I bounced off of it after my first time trying to watch the first episode of season 2. Of course, I can enjoy episodic stuff but much prefer some level of serialization. Like The Burn mystery is what is really helping tie together season 3 so far as it is a nice under current throughout. The Federation plot is also really wonderful for that. I am not expecting a satisfying resolution to it but we will see!

    I guess I should add that Emperor Georgiou is the absolute best and makes the show infinitely better when she is nominally helping Star Fleet. She better be in the rest of this series or I will be pissed!

    Gnizmo on
  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    ...I have bad news.

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
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  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Gnizmo wrote: »
    Gnizmo wrote: »
    So the constant stream of Star Trek stuff has gotten me hooked on Paramount+ (grudgingly) and I decided to go back to Discovery. I watched season 1 as it aired and haven't really been back. I am up to season 3 and I am really loving this season. Like a ton. This is what I wanted Enterprise to be 20 years ago more or less. I still don't care for season 2, but man am I excited for more of the show I am getting at this point.

    I think S2 starts really strong, and just looses it's way super hard with the AI plot. Which sucks! There's a lot of great horror and ideas in there, but it just doesn't execute well on them.

    My pitch that i've mentioend before i's i'd move the sphere stuff up - possibly even make it the opener. Make the chasing the red flares connected to this explicitly. Introduce Control, but make it so that it's not Control that's the threat - it's Section 31, traumatized out of their minds by their (percived) Failures in the Klingon War, and desperate for any edge to make sure it dosent happen again. If anything, i'd actually also include the beat of Control rebelling... against section 31 (and dying in the process), which a: gives you just some good pathos, and b: makes for interesting links to the sphere data being a caring AI.

    And honestly, make it more episodic - part of why S2 starts so strong is that other than the red flares plot, the initial episodes ARE episodic, and as a result we get some really good stuff - a rescue mission, the very cool "how the hell are there humans here?" episode, etc.

    But this is all hypotheticals and done is is done. We got Ansoun Mount, Eththan Peck & Rebecca Romijin for SNW (And SNW itself!) out of Season 2, and i can forgive a lot for that.

    Def tell us what you think when you hit S4 Gnizmo! Most people would agree it's real fucking good.

    @TOGSolid So i wanna push back a little here:
    My read of the scene is that Uhura is embarssed and uncomfortable in this scene - her captain just laughed at her! Good naturedly, but she's obviously not handling the being hazed very well... and you know, fair enough. So she's immediately looking for stuff that feels familiar and safe to her, and embarrassing herself in the process. Plus, Hemmer himself seems pretty unphased, even impressed that she stands up to him and Spock and bites back (In what i assume was Andorian?)

    See my take on season 2 is very different. I didn't really care for it start to finish. I bounced off of it after my first time trying to watch the first episode of season 2. Of course, I can enjoy episodic stuff but much prefer some level of serialization. Like The Burn mystery is what is really helping tie together season 3 so far as it is a nice under current throughout. The Federation plot is also really wonderful for that. I am not expecting a satisfying resolution to it but we will see!

    I guess I should add that Emperor Georgiou is the absolute best and makes the show infinitely better when she is nominally helping Star Fleet. She better be in the rest of this series or I will be pissed!

    I thought the plot of season 2 was an ok sci-fi story, but poor Star Trek. It was also a bit amusing that someone finally realized the tech and events in Discovery would have jacked with the existing series lore so badly they were canonically purged from history. Season 3 is much more what Trek should be: wrangling with what the ideals of the Federation mean.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    ...I have bad news.

    Whelp. Time to erase some episodes, burn the studio to the ground, and start fresh with some better ideas. I assume this has already started so I will just join in when I catch up to it happening.

  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Despite the actor being great, Georgio is a really fucking stupid idea. Let's just have this cannabilistic, genocidal, human-supremecist tyrant running around, free and unsupervised.

    That's how progressive the Federation is! We accept anyone, even people-eating mega-Hitlers!

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  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Is she still getting her own show, or did that get cancelled?

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    Gnizmo wrote: »
    ...I have bad news.

    Whelp. Time to erase some episodes, burn the studio to the ground, and start fresh with some better ideas. I assume this has already started so I will just join in when I catch up to it happening.
    Instead of the studio, the burned the whole galaxy to the ground.

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  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited May 13
    SNWE2
    "We don't change the path of developing cultures but we don't just let them die"

    Ahahahahahahaha no.

    Otherwise just a great episode that mixes high concept sci-fi with lots of personal scenes that get to just... exist? Similar to Lower Decks the fact that we get scenes that feel like the universe is lived in.

    To be fair
    This is the Kirk era, before the prime directive became a conveniant excuse for non-action.
    The whole thing struck me a bit as competing versions of the PD: Kirk (and Pike) era "just don't let anyone see you" vs TNG-et-al "WE MUST NOT INTERFERE WITH GOD'S PLAN".

    Retconning the PD to be this much less dogmatic take is something I am okay with. The PD should first and foremost be about avoiding the moral hazards of colonialization and empire building

    It also lets us avoid crap like Dear Doctor (which was dumb to begin with because the aliens in Dear Doctor were an already contacted species who were asking for help point blank)

    override367 on
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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    Is she still getting her own show, or did that get cancelled?

    Supposedly, the Section 31 show is still in the works with Terran Emperor Georgiou in it.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    Is she still getting her own show, or did that get cancelled?

    Dunno! a quick google says that as of the start of this year it's still in active production with their writers room, but Yeoh is an actor in big demand. So i suspect they're looking to thread the needle on where she'll be able to fit in her schedule (apparently the show was her idea too!)

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    Despite the actor being great, Georgio is a really fucking stupid idea. Let's just have this cannabilistic, genocidal, human-supremecist tyrant running around, free and unsupervised.

    That's how progressive the Federation is! We accept anyone, even people-eating mega-Hitlers!

    You are 100% right on this of course, but it is a Garak situation. You just have to really focus on not remembering the characters back story for even a single second. Just ride the wave of denial to really jam on the awesome moments that character brings.

    SiliconStewMazzyx
  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    SNWE2
    "We don't change the path of developing cultures but we don't just let them die"

    Ahahahahahahaha no.

    Otherwise just a great episode that mixes high concept sci-fi with lots of personal scenes that get to just... exist? Similar to Lower Decks the fact that we get scenes that feel like the universe is lived in.

    To be fair
    This is the Kirk era, before the prime directive became a conveniant excuse for non-action.
    The whole thing struck me a bit as competing versions of the PD: Kirk (and Pike) era "just don't let anyone see you" vs TNG-et-al "WE MUST NOT INTERFERE WITH GOD'S PLAN".

    Retconning the PD to be this much less dogmatic take is something I am okay with. The PD should first and foremost be about avoiding the moral hazards of colonialization and empire building

    It also lets us avoid crap like Dear Doctor (which was dumb to begin with because the aliens in Dear Doctor were an already contacted species who were asking for help point blank)

    It's not even a retcon, that's literally what the PD was in TOS before the later shows extended it and made it into dogma (while claiming to have done away with "old superstitions").

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    Gnizmo wrote: »
    Despite the actor being great, Georgio is a really fucking stupid idea. Let's just have this cannabilistic, genocidal, human-supremecist tyrant running around, free and unsupervised.

    That's how progressive the Federation is! We accept anyone, even people-eating mega-Hitlers!

    You are 100% right on this of course, but it is a Garak situation. You just have to really focus on not remembering the characters back story for even a single second. Just ride the wave of denial to really jam on the awesome moments that character brings.



    My favorite Georgiou moment: "I thought there were no bad ideas." and all of the responses afterwards.

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  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Garek at least kept his past hidden long enough to establish personal relationships with the crew so when things did start coming out they at least had some frame of reference for his character.

    Georgio got maximum slack because Burnham had unresolved issues with HER Georgio. It wasn't even anything Terran Georgio did to get everyone to ignore her crimes! Burnham just wanted her surrogate surrogate parental figure so all is forgiven.

    Commander ZoomPailryderhonovere
  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Discovery S3:
    They do make it clear that she has been changed by her exposure to the Federation. When she finds herself back in her universe she tries to fit in, but her heart isn't in it. She tries all these perverse concepts like 'mercy' and 'co-operation'.

    I find Georgiou, Garak and Quark to be some of the best examples on how the Federation can change your outlook, even if you're not a member and even if you deny it. All the Starfleet people already bought into this, that's the reason they're out here. But these bystanders thought of themselves as the quintessential examples of Terran/Cardassian/Ferengi ideals, they pick up on the Federation ideas and even if they dismiss them out of hand, when push comes to shove they find that their old viewpoints just don't have the unquestioning appeal that they used to.

    She'd need more straight-edged characters to play off of, but it does support the message that no-one is incapable of change.

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  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    Discovery S3:
    They do make it clear that she has been changed by her exposure to the Federation. When she finds herself back in her universe she tries to fit in, but her heart isn't in it. She tries all these perverse concepts like 'mercy' and 'co-operation'.

    I find Georgiou, Garak and Quark to be some of the best examples on how the Federation can change your outlook, even if you're not a member and even if you deny it. All the Starfleet people already bought into this, that's the reason they're out here. But these bystanders thought of themselves as the quintessential examples of Terran/Cardassian/Ferengi ideals, they pick up on the Federation ideas and even if they dismiss them out of hand, when push comes to shove they find that their old viewpoints just don't have the unquestioning appeal that they used to.

    She'd need more straight-edged characters to play off of, but it does support the message that no-one is incapable of change.
    or immune to being corrupted by our insidious root beer.

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  • DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    The Orville returns on June 2.



    Looking schmexy! Also, RIP Norm MacDonald.

    man i hope they give Norm a proper send off, none of that giant sunglasses case bullshit.

  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    DanHibiki wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    The Orville returns on June 2.



    Looking schmexy! Also, RIP Norm MacDonald.

    man i hope they give Norm a proper send off, none of that giant sunglasses case bullshit.

    "Of my friend, I can only say this: of all the souls I have encountered in my travels, his was the most... gooey."

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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Georgiou is absolutely in my top three Disco characters. She's very much just an absurd foil to spark conversations about federation ethics but she's so fun while she does it.
    The fact she slowly loses her Terran Edge is a great little character arc. She's still not like, federation standard but I think she finishes a better, almost good woman by the end.

  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    The Orville returns on June 2.



    Looking schmexy! Also, RIP Norm MacDonald.

    I love how much Seth MacFarlane trolled them into letting him make an actual Star Trek show.

    Not like he trolled them, he's just has money and power so of course he gets to make himself a legally-distinct Captain of the Enterprise if he wants. Just like if Elon Musk wanted to, he has the money and power to transform the United States into a mini-Federation, free of want and poverty, but he'd rather buy Twitter.

    A comparison that does make me feel (slightly) warmer towards McFarland, since he used his much more limited resources to make something actually good.

    Good new on that front Tesla stock bombing means he cant buy Twitter he had to cancel the deal and loses a billion dollars

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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Also it's close enough to Star Trek's nonsense so I'm gonna bitch about it here: In the UK the current method of streaming Stargate is to pay an extra five pounds a month on your amazon prime sub to sub to MGM.

    This is super reasonable, until you get to the later seasons.

    You can watch 8 seasons of SG-1 and the last two each ask you to pay £20 per season.

    You can watch 4 seasons of Atlantis and the last one asks you to fork out £20.

    I swear if I start watching Universe and the second season costs £20 bucks I'm gonna scream.

  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    Also it's close enough to Star Trek's nonsense so I'm gonna bitch about it here: In the UK the current method of streaming Stargate is to pay an extra five pounds a month on your amazon prime sub to sub to MGM.

    This is super reasonable, until you get to the later seasons.

    You can watch 8 seasons of SG-1 and the last two each ask you to pay £20 per season.

    You can watch 4 seasons of Atlantis and the last one asks you to fork out £20.

    I swear if I start watching Universe and the second season costs £20 bucks I'm gonna scream.
    Eh. Seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 are when it turns into Farscape: The Reunion, so you aren't missing out too much other than the 200th episode special.

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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Jackie Registered User regular
    Look I cared enough about bad but connected sci-fi to watch Enterprise S1+2.

    You can't stop me from further self harm etc etc

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  • chrono_travellerchrono_traveller Registered User regular
    You make it sound like Farscape: The Reunion is a bad thing! :tongue:

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  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    You make it sound like Farscape: The Reunion is a bad thing! :tongue:

    Yeah, what the hell.

    (the comic sequel was actually kinda bad)

  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    Also it's close enough to Star Trek's nonsense so I'm gonna bitch about it here: In the UK the current method of streaming Stargate is to pay an extra five pounds a month on your amazon prime sub to sub to MGM.

    This is super reasonable, until you get to the later seasons.

    You can watch 8 seasons of SG-1 and the last two each ask you to pay £20 per season.

    You can watch 4 seasons of Atlantis and the last one asks you to fork out £20.

    I swear if I start watching Universe and the second season costs £20 bucks I'm gonna scream.
    Eh. Seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 are when it turns into Farscape: The Reunion, so you aren't missing out too much other than the 200th episode special.

    The 200th episode is pretty much worth both seasons.

    Also the Farscape seasons weren't that bad.

    I mean its hard to hold a candle to Richard Dean Anderson hamming it up as Jack. But they do pretty well.

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  • durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    This is a good show! I'm really enjoying finally watching a thing that does fun episodic stories again.

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Season 3 of Discovery ultimately did not disappoint me! It was a really fun ride start to end. I am not at all happy to have seen the last of Emperor Georgiou (for now), but I did at least see it coming. I loved the call back to TOS in the 2 parter and ultimately I am hopeful we will see her again.

    The Burn mystery sure did get resolved. It was in pretty much the exact fashion I thought it would. It had all the hallmarks of a mystery that was set-up with no solution in mind which always ends poorly. It could have been worse I guess? At least they left it as kind of a background thing tied into why the Federation was split up. My joy at watching it beginning to come back together overshadowed the sad.

    Speaking of the Federation that was a really fun way to have that plot resolve. All season they have had the amoral characters see hyper competent in everything. I was waiting for someone to burst in and save the Admiral from Osira's villainous schemes. Having it come down the the Federation not be complete fucking idiots despite all evidence to the contrary when it comes to trying to redeem their former enemies. I am looking at you hard Georgiou, Garek, Seven, Hugh, Locutus, half the Voyager crew really I guess, Archer, every single Admiral, Shinzon, Khan, Cardassians like 3 times... Wow, you know when you start listing them it you just keep finding new examples. I'd say they need to seriously rethink some of their standard operating procedures but the majority of those have worked out really well.

    Onto season 4!

    Edit: Oh, and I loved everything about Adira Tal. I know people complained about the clunky pronoun conversation, but it felt incredibly well done to me. That is just how those conversations tend to go. I am super thrilled to have more representation in a way that is really nice. Especially when it is handled well in a franchise that has not historically done super great in this arena due to the flawed human writers of the time aspiring for something a bit out of their reach.

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  • HevachHevach Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Even if you eliminate the fact from our world that a lot of people will immediately be assholes just for the sake of ruining your day, the best hypothetical scenario in that conversation is like being in a room full of people saying your name wrong, it's going to be awkward no matter when you correct them.



    Even if Star Trek eliminates bigotry it doesn't follow that they have eliminated not-getting-it, and those reactions can be just as hurtful and it can be easier to just go through life as Dahta instead of Dayta rather than keep having the same conversation about something which is way more important to yourself than most of the people you're talking to.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    @Gnizmo I love Adira and Grey so much because not only are they played by actors who match their identities, but their dialogue is bang on for how young Queer people tend to interact with each other. I've literally had those conversations with my queer friends, and it's great

    Also because Hugh and Stamets basically adopting them is adorable

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Gnizmo I love Adira and Grey so much because not only are they played by actors who match their identities, but their dialogue is bang on for how young Queer people tend to interact with each other. I've literally had those conversations with my queer friends, and it's great

    Also because Hugh and Stamets basically adopting them is adorable

    It is so authentic I have to assume the actors (is there a gender neutral term for this?) have had some say in it. I know I am an old in the queer community now but it definitely feels like an update version of the way we would talk once upon a time. It definitely matches the experiences that have been shared with me from the youth I work with as well as my son and his friends.

    Oh man the beauty of doing it with Trill just hit me too! Wow do I miss stuff sometimes. Jadzia is definitely the best Trek had done exploring trans like experiences well ahead of the time. Almost certainly by accident, but still. What a touching way to honor that legacy in a very subtle manner. It definitely makes sense why they would want to make Adira a human as well to keep it from just being "aliens be weird" as tends to happen in sci-fi.

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  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    Latest SNW also takes, in passing, a good (IMO) poke at one of the standard Trek bits:

    Bridge Officer: "We can have that ready in an hour."
    Guy who(se department) will be doing most of the actual work: "Oh, 'we' can, huh?"

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