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[Movies]: Violence Edition

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  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Can't believe people are talking about this while the [bad thing elsewhere] is still ongoing. This makes you trivial and me wise.
    Bed in theaters is just trying to get the humping set back.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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  • McRhynoMcRhyno Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    What should have won and what did it lose to? I have no desire to ever watch the Oscars or anything, but curious about your thoughts

    Encanto won, The Mitchells vs. The Machines should have.

    Ah.

    Hmmm.

    I really liked both of those. Mitchells vs the Machines had a better story and theme. Encanto songs are pretty addicting though :P . But yeah, overall I think I'd agree that Encanto wasn't "Best"

    Oh, the fact that they did a performance for "We Don't Talk About Bruno" (which, remember, wasn't even put up for nomination) was just a sad grasp for relevance.

    Because the song should be called
    "We're a bunch of assholes"

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    McRhyno wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    What should have won and what did it lose to? I have no desire to ever watch the Oscars or anything, but curious about your thoughts

    Encanto won, The Mitchells vs. The Machines should have.

    Ah.

    Hmmm.

    I really liked both of those. Mitchells vs the Machines had a better story and theme. Encanto songs are pretty addicting though :P . But yeah, overall I think I'd agree that Encanto wasn't "Best"

    Oh, the fact that they did a performance for "We Don't Talk About Bruno" (which, remember, wasn't even put up for nomination) was just a sad grasp for relevance.

    Because the song should be called
    "We're a bunch of assholes"

    iahqh6yhitwh.png

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  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    cj iwakura wrote: »
    Jokerman wrote: »
    We just had a decent theater (The kind with the nice seats) built in town and I'm so excited.


    I just can't hide it.

    I think I'm the only person on the planet who hates recliner seats. I miss the old ones.

    I don't hate recliner seats but I don't like them for movies. Drinking my beer and/or cocktails is very awkward when reclined. But for people who drink less than I do I can see where reclining would be pleasant.

    I saw pictures of some theater (possibly in Asia somewhere?) chain that has beds in the theater. That's just a step too far if you ask me.

    There is(was?) a local theater that would do Saturday midnight showings with beanbags. It was awesome.

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  • Atlas in ChainsAtlas in Chains Registered User regular
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

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  • MarathonMarathon Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    What should have won and what did it lose to? I have no desire to ever watch the Oscars or anything, but curious about your thoughts

    Encanto won, The Mitchells vs. The Machines should have.

    Ah.

    Hmmm.

    I really liked both of those. Mitchells vs the Machines had a better story and theme. Encanto songs are pretty addicting though :P . But yeah, overall I think I'd agree that Encanto wasn't "Best"

    Oh, the fact that they did a performance for "We Don't Talk About Bruno" (which, remember, wasn't even put up for nomination) was just a sad grasp for relevance.

    It’s one of the most popular songs in the country. It didn’t seem all that sad to me, in hindsight Disney just submitted the wrong song for consideration.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    edited March 29
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.
    What was way worse, IMO, is all the jokes about "I only saw Encanto because of my kid. I didn't see any of the other movies." by the fucking hosts. LOL adults don't watch animated films or whatever.

    Maybe the Academy would start paying attention to animated films if they were all hagiographic bullshit historical biopics or something. There are some critics out there who say that the Oscars should have a separate "Best Oscar-bait Biopic" category to corral off that nonsense, and I totally agree.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    kime wrote: »
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.
    On the other hand, Turning Red felt very true to the Asian American (well, Canadian, I guess) experience, in terms of solving multi-generational family disputes. You just... forgive and stick together, without really addressing any real issues, because you're family and that's that. It sucks, but it felt authentic to me, as an Asian American.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.
    On the other hand, Turning Red felt very true to the Asian American (well, Canadian, I guess) experience, in terms of solving multi-generational family disputes. You just... forgive and stick together, without really addressing any real issues, because you're family and that's that. It sucks, but it felt authentic to me, as an Asian American.

    Maybe. It's not really the kind of lesson I want to be teaching my daughter, who's in a similar situation. That's not actually a very mature or healthy way to resolve conflicts. Nowadays half of how I judge media is how much I'm OK with my daughter watching it :D

    My vague memory of the last scene also feels like
    it's very much "now we are all happy and accepting of each others' separate opinions," not as much "forgive and move on without addressing issues." They just skipped all the parts that led to it?

    So either you're right and I don't want my daughter to watch it, or there's more to it and they are just bad at making movies :P

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    I think Encanto deserved its win (I still haven't seen "Flee", but it looked interesting. I saw all of the rest of them, though). But I loved all of the movies that I've seen in that category. I still think about the gag in "Mitchells vs. the Machines" of "HE BELONGS TO THE RIVER NOW" often and giggle.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    I think Encanto deserved its win (I still haven't seen "Flee", but it looked interesting. I saw all of the rest of them, though). But I loved all of the movies that I've seen in that category. I still think about the gag in "Mitchells vs. the Machines" of "HE BELONGS TO THE RIVER NOW" often and giggle.

    The loaf of bread joke was legitimately hilarious, and the movie used it beautifully.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    edited March 29
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.
    On the other hand, Turning Red felt very true to the Asian American (well, Canadian, I guess) experience, in terms of solving multi-generational family disputes. You just... forgive and stick together, without really addressing any real issues, because you're family and that's that. It sucks, but it felt authentic to me, as an Asian American.

    Maybe. It's not really the kind of lesson I want to be teaching my daughter, who's in a similar situation. That's not actually a very mature or healthy way to resolve conflicts. Nowadays half of how I judge media is how much I'm OK with my daughter watching it :D

    My vague memory of the last scene also feels like
    it's very much "now we are all happy and accepting of each others' separate opinions," not as much "forgive and move on without addressing issues." They just skipped all the parts that led to it?

    So either you're right and I don't want my daughter to watch it, or there's more to it and they are just bad at making movies :P
    I mean, it's a picture of a very specific time and place. Family dynamics in the past two decades have changed a lot among Asian Americans, for a variety of reasons. It resonated with me because it's closer (off by a little over a decade, but still) to how I experienced it, but I think it would be clear to any child that this is a fictional conflict. No one looks at Tangled and thinks "yes, this is how actual relationships between adopted daughters and mothers actually turn out" or whatever. And really, "My mom may not understand me at all, but will always have my back" is a wonderful message.

    Your daughter should watch it. Not every movie has to "send a message" or whatever, and representation is so important, especially for us minorities. I hate that the movie has become embroiled in a proxy culture war that's really a dogwhistle for coded racism.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.
    On the other hand, Turning Red felt very true to the Asian American (well, Canadian, I guess) experience, in terms of solving multi-generational family disputes. You just... forgive and stick together, without really addressing any real issues, because you're family and that's that. It sucks, but it felt authentic to me, as an Asian American.

    Maybe. It's not really the kind of lesson I want to be teaching my daughter, who's in a similar situation. That's not actually a very mature or healthy way to resolve conflicts. Nowadays half of how I judge media is how much I'm OK with my daughter watching it :D

    My vague memory of the last scene also feels like
    it's very much "now we are all happy and accepting of each others' separate opinions," not as much "forgive and move on without addressing issues." They just skipped all the parts that led to it?

    So either you're right and I don't want my daughter to watch it, or there's more to it and they are just bad at making movies :P
    I mean, it's a picture of a very specific time and place. Family dynamics in the past two decades have changed a lot among Asian Americans, for a variety of reasons. It resonated with me because it's closer (off by a little over a decade, but still) to how I experienced it, but I think it would be clear to any child that this is a fictional conflict. No one looks at Tangled and thinks "yes, this is how actual relationships between adopted daughters and mothers actually turn out" or whatever.

    Your daughter should watch it. Not every movie has to "send a message" or whatever, and representation is so important, especially for us minorities. I hate that the movie has become embroiled in a proxy culture war that's really a dogwhistle for coded racism.

    It sends a bad message is the problem. I mean she's too young for full length movies anyways so this is not a problem now.

    But the central conflict in the movie isn't some make believe thing. You yourself are complimenting how much it reflects your experiences. So for a conflict that is representative of real life situations, skipping over the resolution is kind of meh.

    But that's just my own reasoning for my own opinion of not super liking it. That doesn't take away from you liking it :)

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  • KasynKasyn Registered User regular
    I liked Mitchells but wasn't blown away to the point where I think it's outrageous that it didn't win. Encanto is fine and a safe pick. I've heard Bruno on the fucking radio several times in the past few weeks, so I don't think a performance of it at the Oscars is sad and desperate or anything, it's really just that much of an insane smash hit for a track from a film.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.
    On the other hand, Turning Red felt very true to the Asian American (well, Canadian, I guess) experience, in terms of solving multi-generational family disputes. You just... forgive and stick together, without really addressing any real issues, because you're family and that's that. It sucks, but it felt authentic to me, as an Asian American.

    Maybe. It's not really the kind of lesson I want to be teaching my daughter, who's in a similar situation. That's not actually a very mature or healthy way to resolve conflicts. Nowadays half of how I judge media is how much I'm OK with my daughter watching it :D

    My vague memory of the last scene also feels like
    it's very much "now we are all happy and accepting of each others' separate opinions," not as much "forgive and move on without addressing issues." They just skipped all the parts that led to it?

    So either you're right and I don't want my daughter to watch it, or there's more to it and they are just bad at making movies :P
    I mean, it's a picture of a very specific time and place. Family dynamics in the past two decades have changed a lot among Asian Americans, for a variety of reasons. It resonated with me because it's closer (off by a little over a decade, but still) to how I experienced it, but I think it would be clear to any child that this is a fictional conflict. No one looks at Tangled and thinks "yes, this is how actual relationships between adopted daughters and mothers actually turn out" or whatever.

    Your daughter should watch it. Not every movie has to "send a message" or whatever, and representation is so important, especially for us minorities. I hate that the movie has become embroiled in a proxy culture war that's really a dogwhistle for coded racism.

    It sends a bad message is the problem. I mean she's too young for full length movies anyways so this is not a problem now.

    But the central conflict in the movie isn't some make believe thing. You yourself are complimenting how much it reflects your experiences. So for a conflict that is representative of real life situations, skipping over the resolution is kind of meh.

    But that's just my own reasoning for my own opinion of not super liking it. That doesn't take away from you liking it :)
    I mean, Disney movies (specifically the princess ones) are often criticized for the fact that they rush through the denouement to get to "and they live happily ever after" or whatever. I don't think animated movies aimed at a younger audience are where you're going to find such resolutions. We're supposed to just overlook the fact that Ariel did a dumbass thing for a boy and suffered essentially no repercussions for it, for example.

    I'm struggling to think of examples among animated Disney/Pixar/Dreamworks type flicks that don't have an expedited process of forgiveness and whatnot, to be honest, at least in the manner that would be satisfying to adult me.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    edited March 29
    I mean. Encanto and The Mitchells both did the conflict resolution better, it's what started this :smile:

    Not perfect, sure. But I was never judging any of them for not being perfect

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    The Mitchells Vs. The Machines and Encanto are an interesting comparison. Similar theme of disconnected expectations from one generation to the next. Encanto has the better music. The dad from Mitchells is trying so hard to understand his daughter, while Abuela is trying so hard to micromanage her family. It makes the Mitchells more likeable, but does that make it a better movie? I don't think I could pick between them. I've popped on Mitchells on Netflix a bunch of times just to watch the Mom scene at the end, but I've also Youtube'd Surface Pressure a dozen times. Good problem to have, some competition in the animation category.

    Mitchells has a better conflict and resolution. Encanto has an all right resolution in that they tried. And, well,
    Turning Red
    they did kind of the same conflict again, but just decided to skip the "trying" part of the resolution.
    On the other hand, Turning Red felt very true to the Asian American (well, Canadian, I guess) experience, in terms of solving multi-generational family disputes. You just... forgive and stick together, without really addressing any real issues, because you're family and that's that. It sucks, but it felt authentic to me, as an Asian American.

    Maybe. It's not really the kind of lesson I want to be teaching my daughter, who's in a similar situation. That's not actually a very mature or healthy way to resolve conflicts. Nowadays half of how I judge media is how much I'm OK with my daughter watching it :D

    My vague memory of the last scene also feels like
    it's very much "now we are all happy and accepting of each others' separate opinions," not as much "forgive and move on without addressing issues." They just skipped all the parts that led to it?

    So either you're right and I don't want my daughter to watch it, or there's more to it and they are just bad at making movies :P
    I mean, it's a picture of a very specific time and place. Family dynamics in the past two decades have changed a lot among Asian Americans, for a variety of reasons. It resonated with me because it's closer (off by a little over a decade, but still) to how I experienced it, but I think it would be clear to any child that this is a fictional conflict. No one looks at Tangled and thinks "yes, this is how actual relationships between adopted daughters and mothers actually turn out" or whatever. And really, "My mom may not understand me at all, but will always have my back" is a wonderful message.

    Your daughter should watch it. Not every movie has to "send a message" or whatever, and representation is so important, especially for us minorities. I hate that the movie has become embroiled in a proxy culture war that's really a dogwhistle for coded racism.

    I watched it with my daughter, I thought it was good and sent good messages, generally.

    The thing about the ending that bugged me wasn't anything about the daughter,
    but the assumption that the mother/aunts/grandmother had to give up their pandas, as a given. I'm not sure what message was trying to be sent there? That their time had passed? That they made their choice and now having seen a different option through the lens of a younger generation, they don't get a moment to decide for themselves if they want to take a different path? I'm genuinely not sure what was supposed to be communicated by that. It just sure felt like "break the rules to protect family, but then you're expected to go back to repressing part of your identity without thought or question."

    As far as messages about the daughter
    I liked that there were mistakes and consequences. I liked that there was forgiveness and and some bits of the reality of how different people can react, and how cruel sometimes kids can be, and that it isn't typically that anyone is explicitly bad or mean, but everyone is hiding parts of themselves out of fear, and sometimes lash out in ways that hurt them, but again, consequences (within the reasonable context of an hour and a half long movie). I liked that it was saying clearly that even if you're embarrassed by the things you're thinking and feeling during adolescence, you're not alone, and it's not as weird as every authority figure in your life tries to make you feel like it is, and that honestly it's pretty god damned silly that our culture tries so hard to act like there's a "right" way that you should behave, that is good and proper, which just leads to the vast majority of kids growing up feeling like they've got a part of them they have to hide and pretend doesn't exist. I liked that the movie gave the finger to that idea, at least for the daughter. I liked that the movie tried to normalize the feelings of arousal and sexuality that you naturally feel at that age, and again, showed girls that they, too, feel those things, even if our fucked up culture that expects certain behaviors of young women, that is still based almost entirely on times when daughters were property and currency.

    Just generally, I liked that the movie had a specific target, and did a good job of treating its audience as if they're the intelligent and curious individuals they are.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    kime wrote: »
    I mean. Encanto and The Mitchells both did the conflict resolution better, it's what started this :smile:

    Not perfect, sure. But I was never judging any of them for not being perfect
    And they both felt like convenient fantasies for me. But I guess that's why we watch movies, right? It's not like we watch them to mirror real life or anything.

    Speaking of hagiographic bullshit, I watched "King Richard" last night on HBOMax. The joke about "Finally, a biopic about two of the strongest Black women in the world... which focuses on their father" really hit home on this one. Although I was really impressed that I did not recognize Jon Bernthal at ALL until the credits started rolling. And I'm like "Oh SHIT, that was him?"

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Also best animated picture should have been Coco.

    I don't care that it came out in 2017.

    Until they make an animated picture that is better, it should win.

    Though, Into the Spider-verse is up there, maybe tied.

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  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    I'm to the point where I ignore any biopic that has been approved by the subjects in it.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    Doodmann wrote: »
    I'm to the point where I ignore any biopic that has been approved by the subjects in it.
    I mean, the Elton John one was pretty good, actually. They leaned hard into the psychedelia and the music, though.

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    Doodmann wrote: »
    I'm to the point where I ignore any biopic that has been approved by the subjects in it.
    I mean, the Elton John one was pretty good, actually. They leaned hard into the psychedelia and the music, though.

    Rocket Man was pretty decent!

    And it was nice that they made it clear out of the gate that it wasn't supposed to be true to life.

    Though, that didn't stop the endless "fact checking" articles when it came out.

    Also I enjoyed how much Elton John seemed to like Taron Egerton.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    I have no take, unlike the rest of you stupid peasants, you disordered rabble, you celebrity-obsessed rubes.
    I don't really think Encanto did the conflict resolution that well.

    It also definitely does the whole "we're family, so let's all agree to forgive each other" thing where there's no real redress of wrongs or anything, it's more that people just agree that family connections are important and we should move forward. Which is kinda more true to life even if it's perhaps less satisfying from certain perspectives.

    But Encanto also feels rushed as all hell in the last half.

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  • ElJeffeElJeffe Moderator, ClubPA mod
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    Add me to the "I loved Mitchells but don't see an Encanto win as a travesty" pile. I thought they were both great, but Mitchells probably kneecapped its Oscar chances by being too funny. I never really thought it had a chance, unfortunately.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    I mean. Encanto and The Mitchells both did the conflict resolution better, it's what started this :smile:

    Not perfect, sure. But I was never judging any of them for not being perfect

    And they both felt like convenient fantasies for me. But I guess that's why we watch movies, right? It's not like we watch them to mirror real life or anything.

    But you just said you liked Turning Red because it mirrored your real life more? I'm not sure I understand your opinion, but that's OK :) .

    There is value in things that mirror real life. ie, sexism and racism are real, and honestly are supported by a LOT of people (maybe a majority of people) in the world. It is not appropriate if all media avoids unpleasant things. But I also expect that movies should be handling them appropriately. Turning Red essentially just skipped the conflict resolution part of the story to jump to a happy ending, and that's not great for me for a children's movie to show my daughter (my standard, like I said :D ).
    shryke wrote: »
    I don't really think Encanto did the conflict resolution that well.

    It also definitely does the whole "we're family, so let's all agree to forgive each other" thing where there's no real redress of wrongs or anything, it's more that people just agree that family connections are important and we should move forward. Which is kinda more true to life even if it's perhaps less satisfying from certain perspectives.

    But Encanto also feels rushed as all hell in the last half.

    I agree with rushed, yeah. Basically, I think Encanto had the right beats there, just didn't really give them time to mature, but oh well. As in, it had:
    A recognition that Abuela was a problem. Abuela is able to deny that, then the problem becomes undeniable (ie the house is destroyed). She sees the results of her actions. She has a moment of quiet reflection. She takes action to seek out the person she wronged. She apologizes and explains why she did the wrong things she did. She moves forward to reconcile with the rest of her family by hugging Bruno, etc. She and the rest of the family and the entire town spend time together to try and rebuild a healthier future together without the same toxicity they had before.

    And then, only then do they actually get the happy ending with Mirabel restoring the magic and everything being Happily Ever After.

    Now yeah, all of that was in like... 7 minutes of screentime lol. But it was there, at least. And that's a big deal for me.

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  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    edited March 29
    This whole thing just goes to show something I said earlier, and I will now make the convoluted and unconvincing case why.
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    I mean. Encanto and The Mitchells both did the conflict resolution better, it's what started this :smile:

    Not perfect, sure. But I was never judging any of them for not being perfect

    And they both felt like convenient fantasies for me. But I guess that's why we watch movies, right? It's not like we watch them to mirror real life or anything.

    But you just said you liked Turning Red because it mirrored your real life more? I'm not sure I understand your opinion, but that's OK :) .
    Last I checked, I didn't turn into a Red Panda during my adolescence. :)

    (That would be SO fucking cool, though)

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    edited March 29
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    I mean. Encanto and The Mitchells both did the conflict resolution better, it's what started this :smile:

    Not perfect, sure. But I was never judging any of them for not being perfect

    And they both felt like convenient fantasies for me. But I guess that's why we watch movies, right? It's not like we watch them to mirror real life or anything.

    But you just said you liked Turning Red because it mirrored your real life more? I'm not sure I understand your opinion, but that's OK :) .
    Last I checked, I didn't turn into a Red Panda during my adolescence. :)

    (That would be SO fucking cool, though)

    Your first few posts on the movie were complimenting how authentic it felt compared to the Encanto and Mitchells?

    If you wanna explain more I'm curious, as I don't really get what you're saying so far, but if not that's fine! Just for fun and curiosity :smile:

    Edit: Unless this was just a silly joke and you still like Turning Red for it being true-to-life. Obviously without actually turning into a red panda :tongue:

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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    edited March 29
    Mocking people with disabilities or conditions is good.
    My main complaint with Encanto is just that I felt like it needed one more song towards the end.

    Cuz I liked the songs and I wanted another one.

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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    Mocking people with disabilities or conditions is good.
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Doodmann wrote: »
    George Lucas has only made 6 movies in his entire career.

    He has only directed six movies in his entire career, but his career is so much more than being a director.

    It's pretty crazy what a talent Lucas had for finding talent early in his career.

    Like say what you want about Lucas's ability to make movies, at least when he's the dude at the top. But his taste in films and his taste in people who make films aged pretty incredibly well.

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Doodmann wrote: »
    George Lucas has only made 6 movies in his entire career.

    He has only directed six movies in his entire career, but his career is so much more than being a director.

    It's pretty crazy what a talent Lucas had for finding talent early in his career.

    Like say what you want about Lucas's ability to make movies, at least when he's the dude at the top. But his taste in films and his taste in people who make films aged pretty incredibly well.

    He also revolutionized FX, SFX, and sound mixing by actually treating them as something to actually be invested in. ILM and Skywalker Sound still remain industry leaders.

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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    Mocking people with disabilities or conditions is good.
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    Yeah there's this weird contempt for animation that Hollywood still seems to have, even as so many directors of modern CGI-fiestas are simultaneously taking inspiration from animation.

    I was thinking about it a lot lately after reading about Satoshi Kon's bitterness against Darren Aronofsky for what Aronofsky called paying tribute, and what Kon called stealing. Kon was like, I'm a not-very-successful small name director who can barely afford to fund his movies, and you're a famous Hollywood director making big budget movies, what kind of tribute is it for you to take my shots and the credit for them and I can't do anything about it?

    There is a certain sense in the film industry of treating animation as like a sort of minor league farm team, no matter how good it is it'll never be treated seriously, but they're happy having it there to raid ideas and talent from whenever they want.

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  • TychoCelchuuuTychoCelchuuu PIGEON Registered User regular
    I have no take, unlike the rest of you stupid peasants, you disordered rabble, you celebrity-obsessed rubes.
    Kana wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Doodmann wrote: »
    George Lucas has only made 6 movies in his entire career.

    He has only directed six movies in his entire career, but his career is so much more than being a director.

    It's pretty crazy what a talent Lucas had for finding talent early in his career.

    Like say what you want about Lucas's ability to make movies, at least when he's the dude at the top. But his taste in films and his taste in people who make films aged pretty incredibly well.

    He also revolutionized FX, SFX, and sound mixing by actually treating them as something to actually be invested in. ILM and Skywalker Sound still remain industry leaders.
    And he created Indiana Jones!

  • KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    edited March 30
    TexiKen wrote: »
    The real answer is Words Bubble Up Like Soda Pop.
    I haven't seen Encanto or Mitchell vs. the Machines, but you are probably right. Does the best animation category include non-American or non-English language works?

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    I have no take, unlike the rest of you stupid peasants, you disordered rabble, you celebrity-obsessed rubes.
    Kana wrote: »
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    Yeah there's this weird contempt for animation that Hollywood still seems to have, even as so many directors of modern CGI-fiestas are simultaneously taking inspiration from animation.

    I was thinking about it a lot lately after reading about Satoshi Kon's bitterness against Darren Aronofsky for what Aronofsky called paying tribute, and what Kon called stealing. Kon was like, I'm a not-very-successful small name director who can barely afford to fund his movies, and you're a famous Hollywood director making big budget movies, what kind of tribute is it for you to take my shots and the credit for them and I can't do anything about it?

    There is a certain sense in the film industry of treating animation as like a sort of minor league farm team, no matter how good it is it'll never be treated seriously, but they're happy having it there to raid ideas and talent from whenever they want.

    Your example seems more just like Aronofsky is a big fan.

  • PailryderPailryder Registered User regular
    Mocking people with disabilities or conditions is good.
    The twitter post last thread about Mitchells vs the Machines was super neat. I loved that glimpse into how the scenes changed to be more dynamic and land better. The father and daughter singing was /chefs kiss. I need more good laughs in my life. Encanto was fine/good but in my book Mitchells is the film that was more amazing.

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited March 30
    shryke wrote: »
    Kana wrote: »
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    Yeah there's this weird contempt for animation that Hollywood still seems to have, even as so many directors of modern CGI-fiestas are simultaneously taking inspiration from animation.

    I was thinking about it a lot lately after reading about Satoshi Kon's bitterness against Darren Aronofsky for what Aronofsky called paying tribute, and what Kon called stealing. Kon was like, I'm a not-very-successful small name director who can barely afford to fund his movies, and you're a famous Hollywood director making big budget movies, what kind of tribute is it for you to take my shots and the credit for them and I can't do anything about it?

    There is a certain sense in the film industry of treating animation as like a sort of minor league farm team, no matter how good it is it'll never be treated seriously, but they're happy having it there to raid ideas and talent from whenever they want.

    Your example seems more just like Aronofsky is a big fan.

    That's how Aronofsky viewed himself. Are you trying to suggest that Kon's feelings about scenes from his film that was not commercial successful showing up, uncredited, in a film that becomes a huge hit and boosts that director into stardom aren't valid?

    To quote Kon's (translated) words, after meeting Aronofsky:
    I’m feeling pathetic. It’s a pitiful tale when the person being paid homage to has less name recognition, less social credibility and less budget to spend.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    I have no take, unlike the rest of you stupid peasants, you disordered rabble, you celebrity-obsessed rubes.
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Kana wrote: »
    Also, Best Animated Feature continues to be a joke as the film that should have won (and won the awards where the people voting actually respect the medium) lost to This Year's Disney/Pixar/DreamWorks Film for the same stupid reason that the Academy continues to allow the full Academy to vote on the award, even when a good portion holds animation in contempt.

    Yeah there's this weird contempt for animation that Hollywood still seems to have, even as so many directors of modern CGI-fiestas are simultaneously taking inspiration from animation.

    I was thinking about it a lot lately after reading about Satoshi Kon's bitterness against Darren Aronofsky for what Aronofsky called paying tribute, and what Kon called stealing. Kon was like, I'm a not-very-successful small name director who can barely afford to fund his movies, and you're a famous Hollywood director making big budget movies, what kind of tribute is it for you to take my shots and the credit for them and I can't do anything about it?

    There is a certain sense in the film industry of treating animation as like a sort of minor league farm team, no matter how good it is it'll never be treated seriously, but they're happy having it there to raid ideas and talent from whenever they want.

    Your example seems more just like Aronofsky is a big fan.

    That's how Aronofsky viewed himself. Are you trying to suggest that Kon's feelings about scenes from his film that was not commercial successful showing up, uncredited, in a film that becomes a huge hit and boosts that director into stardom aren't valid?

    To quote Kon's (translated) words, after meeting Aronofsky:
    I’m feeling pathetic. It’s a pitiful tale when the person being paid homage to has less name recognition, less social credibility and less budget to spend.

    I'm sure he felt that way. But so what? Sometimes the references become larger then the original. And afaik Aronofsky wasn't out there, like, deliberately sabotaging Kon's career or something. He's a big fan of his apparently so it's not like he's displaying any contempt for animation as a medium there.

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Plagiarism is fine as long as it's done with love, got it.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited March 30
    I have no take, unlike the rest of you stupid peasants, you disordered rabble, you celebrity-obsessed rubes.
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Plagiarism is fine as long as it's done with love, got it.

    Tributes and references are plagiarism now?

    And what's that got to do with Kon's complaint anyway? Cause what he seems to be upset about is that Aronofsky got more famous then him.

    shryke on
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