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Sorry for [Party] Rocking

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Posts

  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    "Starting to look?" Their response has been nigh-indistinguishable outside of providing free tests to households, but even then that was only after being bullied into doing so.

    Before anyone brings up the the vaccinations, I'll remind flks that Trump was all about Operation Warp Speed - had the vaccines been available while he was still in office, he would have had them being handed out with his signature on every syringe.

    DarkPrimus on
    usnTyq4.jpg
    Gamertag: PrimusD | Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
    SleepDee KaeMan in the MistsMatevHefflingMagellBrainleechKristmas KthulhuBloodsheed38thDoeSkeith
  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    Is this another we get mad at a politico opinion piece thing and then pretend our worst expectations are confirmed?

    Cause I'm getting that vibe hard here.

  • OghulkOghulk Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Is this another we get mad at a politico opinion piece thing and then pretend our worst expectations are confirmed?

    Cause I'm getting that vibe hard here.

    Nah, the Politico piece is perfectly in line with what I continue to hear in nation-wide state/local government finance round tables from advocacy organizations. The donkeys were contemplating pulling back funding from the state and local fiscal recovery funds to help pay for the federal COVID response, and frankly they fucking should, but that'd piss off too many donkeys.

    e: like, the Politico piece is something I've heard about for the last two months.

    Oghulk on
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    "Starting to look?" Their response has been nigh-indistinguishable outside of providing free tests to households, but even then that was only after being bullied into doing so.

    Before anyone brings up the the vaccinations, I'll remind flks that Trump was all about Operation Warp Speed - had the vaccines been available while he was still in office, he would have had them being handed out with his signature on every syringe.

    Remember Trump's vaccination plan? Oh right it didn't exist. Remember the big stockpiles touted before the election? Oh right those didn't exist either. Biden's admin had to get the vaccination program rolling more or less from scratch. Remember Biden stealing PPE? Oh right, didn't happen. Forcing the CDC to tout bullshit? Edit data to pretend the outbreak is over? Stall CDC reports because they don't agree with the President's ass-huffing about drugs that don't work? Nigh indistinguishable my ass.

    The administration wants more COVID funding. The GOP is blocking it. To get exactly the reaction they're getting from you.

    Why the supposed leftists here always have to downplay fascist bullshit in order to cast shade on liberals doing better things I'll never understand.

    FencingsaxzagdrobTarantioLord_AsmodeussanstodoadytumForarshryke
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    The administration has totally fucked with the CDC now that they’ve been team “return to normalcy” Phoenix, do you even read the COVID thread?

    Like we had this shit weeks ago about how the CDC has, like with trump, been manipulated to downplay the severity of the pandemic, giving room to draw down on every preventative measure but vaccines, when epidemiologists have been saying for years now that you need comprehensive and complementary measures to prevent spread instead of trying to rely on the vaccine as a single line of defense or silver bullet:
    In late February, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) unveiled a new Covid-19 monitoring system based on what they call “Community Levels.” By downplaying the importance of Sars-CoV-2 transmission, the new system instantly turned what was a pandemic map still red from Omicron transmission to green – creating the false impression that the pandemic is over.

    Released four days before the State of the Union, the new CDC measures and the narrative they created let President Biden claim victory over the virus via sleight of hand: a switch from standard reporting of community transmissions to measures of risk based largely on contentious hospital-based metrics. The previous guidelines called anything over 50 cases per 100,000 people “substantial or high.” Now, they say 200 cases per 100,000 is “low” as long as hospitalizations are also low.

    The resulting shift from a red map to a green one reflected no real reduction in transmission risk. It was a resort to rhetoric: an effort to craft a success story that would explain away hundreds of thousands of preventable deaths and the continued threat the virus poses.

    These new guidelines are at odds with evidence-based and equitable public health practice in three fundamental ways.

    First, they do not intend to prevent disease spread. By minimizing the importance of new cases, and focusing instead on hospitalizations–a lagging indicator–the revamped warning system delays action until surges are well underway and the consequences of severe disease and death are already in motion. Making matters worse, at-home tests are not recorded in the US, so the only “early indicator” in the risk level calculation grossly undercounts the true number of cases.

    The justification for the shift is that the virus is mostly harmless– a claim which not only ignores that one million have already died in the US alone, but also completely erases the reality of Long Covid. Studies indicate that 10-30% of Covid infections deteriorate into multiple debilitating syndromes lasting months to years. Minimizing Covid’s risks to the public will only increase these harms in our communities.

    Secondly, the new guidelines do more than inappropriately message safety; the guidelines shift the burden of responsibility onto vulnerable people. In place of clear, evidence-based guidance on masking for those facing greater risk, for example, the CDC simply advises individuals to consult with their local healthcare provider. This instruction assumes that providers are accessible, well informed, and willing to take on the personal liability for giving guidance around a potentially fatal virus that the CDC was once responsible for. In a country without healthcare for all, these assumptions are wrong.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/03/peoples-cdc-covid-guidelines


    No one here is downplaying Trump’s shit, as much as that straw man serves to deflect responsibility for the actions of the Biden Administration and it’s COVID advisers (run until April, I remind you, not by any actual doctor, but by businessman Jeff Zients) that have lead to dropping the ball time after time in handling this pandemic, focusing less on keeping people safe and supported during the pandemic and pushing them back into crowded, public spaces where we have now finally reached a million dead in just over two years of the virus.

    None of this is defensible and honestly it’s fucking gross when people keep trying to defend this shit as if this administration hasn’t abandoned this country for the same damn reasons as Trump and company did.

    Dee KaeMagellDarkPrimusDoodmann
  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    That as a documentary going from 1/2020 - present would be fascinating in all the facets.

  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Lanz was warned for this.
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    That as a documentary going from 1/2020 - present would be fascinating in all the facets.

    Motherfucker fuck off with this shit

    I’ve barely left my house in over two years to keep from contracting this shit

    I haven’t seen most of my friends in the same length of time, because of this fucking virus

    My family and I have had to put off and push back medical appointments as we monitor the rise and fall and rise again of COVID cases in our area.

    People I care about have had to avoid going to the hospital because even during Biden’s tenure our hospitals were fucking code black from being packed with COVID patients.


    Over a million people are fucking dead because of this disease and the government abandoning us to it.

    The government is already predicting a hundred million more infections this fall and winter. The fucking capitulated to the GOP on separating out the COVID funding from the Ukraine bill because god forbid we fucking call their bluff once ever. And we’re running out of time for companies to be able to produce enough of it because they won’t make them till they get the orders in, and they can’t do that unless they’re going to get paid. And now we’re possibly going to have to ration them, while still sending most of this country, including the most vulnerable, back into this fucking meat grinder

    So fuck you, you petty little asshole, for daring to come in here and suggest any one of us are pretending to care about this disease and it’s ensuing pandemic; don’t come in here and act like people don’t fucking care about this fucking disease just because you wanna fucking Stan for a party like it’s a fucking sports team and someone saying Biden and the democrats fucked up hurts your feelings and you find that more important to actually listening to people in a community you share whose lives have been upended by this two plus year long viral nightmare

    I’m sure I’ll get infracted for this, but I’ll stand by it, because the shit you just pulled is a thousand times more ghoulish than any edict violation in this post, even if you’re still within the letter of the rules

    Edit: as expected, I accept this warning but stand by my position

    Lanz on
    KetarDee KaeDaypigeonHacksawMagellMan in the MistsMatevPolaritieDeath of RatsWiseManTobesKristmas KthulhuHachfaceTetraNitroCubanetynicFeloniousmozDarkPrimusBloodsheedDoodmannsarukunKraintSkeithZonugalFANTOMASYamiB.
  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    zagdrob was warned for this.
    Lanz wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    That as a documentary going from 1/2020 - present would be fascinating in all the facets.

    Motherfucker fuck off

    I’ve barely left my house in over two years to keep from contracting this shit

    I haven’t seen most of my friends in the same length of time, because of this fucking virus

    My family and I have had to put off and push back medical appointments as we monitor the rise and fall and rise again of COVID cases in our area.

    People I care about have had to avoid going to the hospital because even during Biden’s tenure our hospitals were fucking code black from being packed with COVID patients.


    Over a million people are fucking dead because of this disease and the government abandoning us to it.

    The government is already predicting a hundred million more infections this fall and winter. The fucking capitulated to the GOP on separating out the COVID funding from the Ukraine bill because god forbid we fucking call their bluff once ever. And we’re running out of time for companies to be able to produce enough of it because they won’t make them till they get the orders in, and they can’t do that unless they’re going to get paid. And now we’re possibly going to have to ration them, while still sending most of this country, including the most vulnerable, back into this fucking meat grinder

    So fuck you, you petty little asshole, don’t come in here and act like people don’t fucking care about this fucking disease just because you wanna fucking Stan for a party like it’s a fucking sports team and someone saying Biden and the democrats fucked up hurts your feelings and you find that more important to actually listening to people in a community you share whose lives have been upended by this two plus year long viral nightmare

    I’m sure I’ll get infracted for this, but I’ll stand by it, because the shit you just pulled is a thousand times more ghoulish than any edict violation in this post, even if you’re still within the letter of the rules

    Sure Lanz. That's what it is

    At least you wrote something yourself this time instead of linking or copy / pasting someone else's thoughts.

    And no 'my dude'? I thought that's just your introduction now. I'm disappointed.

    Fucker I spent months making COVID test kits in my kitchen and helping my regional health department interface with the CDC so dont act like I dont care about COVID. I am fucking exhausted and tired of assholes using it as their bludgeon against people doing the best they can.

    I read the dead, hospitalized, ICU numbers - adult and pediatric every fucking week now when my ops department releases them so fuck you too.

    Bogart on
    LanlaornLord_Asmodeusadytumshryke
  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    Considering how many coworkers I've buried thanks to COVID (and COVID-related devastations), yeah, it's fair to say people like me care about it.

    Are you for real with this? Do you seriously think I see COVID as just an issue over which to take the Democrats to task because I have some kind of perceived "petty grudge" against them? Because if so, that means you have a much lower opinion of me than I have of you.

    KetarMagellDee KaeMatevMan in the MistsPolaritieWiseManTobesKristmas KthulhuHachfaceTetraNitroCubaneDarkPrimusBloodsheedOghulksarukunGnizmoZonugalFANTOMASYamiB.
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    That as a documentary going from 1/2020 - present would be fascinating in all the facets.

    Motherfucker fuck off

    I’ve barely left my house in over two years to keep from contracting this shit

    I haven’t seen most of my friends in the same length of time, because of this fucking virus

    My family and I have had to put off and push back medical appointments as we monitor the rise and fall and rise again of COVID cases in our area.

    People I care about have had to avoid going to the hospital because even during Biden’s tenure our hospitals were fucking code black from being packed with COVID patients.


    Over a million people are fucking dead because of this disease and the government abandoning us to it.

    The government is already predicting a hundred million more infections this fall and winter. The fucking capitulated to the GOP on separating out the COVID funding from the Ukraine bill because god forbid we fucking call their bluff once ever. And we’re running out of time for companies to be able to produce enough of it because they won’t make them till they get the orders in, and they can’t do that unless they’re going to get paid. And now we’re possibly going to have to ration them, while still sending most of this country, including the most vulnerable, back into this fucking meat grinder

    So fuck you, you petty little asshole, don’t come in here and act like people don’t fucking care about this fucking disease just because you wanna fucking Stan for a party like it’s a fucking sports team and someone saying Biden and the democrats fucked up hurts your feelings and you find that more important to actually listening to people in a community you share whose lives have been upended by this two plus year long viral nightmare

    I’m sure I’ll get infracted for this, but I’ll stand by it, because the shit you just pulled is a thousand times more ghoulish than any edict violation in this post, even if you’re still within the letter of the rules

    Sure Lanz. That's what it is

    At least you wrote something yourself this time instead of linking or copy / pasting someone else's thoughts.

    And no 'my dude'? I thought that's just your introduction now. I'm disappointed.

    Fucker I spent months making COVID test kits in my kitchen and helping my regional health department interface with the CDC so dont act like I dont care about COVID. I am fucking exhausted and tired of assholes using it as their bludgeon against people doing the best they can.

    I read the dead, hospitalized, ICU numbers - adult and pediatric every fucking week now when my ops department releases them so fuck you too.

    You’re the dude who came in here and accused Folks of pretending to care, so don’t you dare play the poor innocent victim here

    KetarDee KaeMan in the MistsWiseManTobesKristmas KthulhuSpeed RacerHachfaceTetraNitroCubaneBloodsheedSkeithZonugalFANTOMASYamiB.
  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    Considering how many coworkers I've buried thanks to COVID (and COVID-related devastations), yeah, it's fair to say people like me care about it.

    Are you for real with this? Do you seriously think I see COVID as just an issue over which to take the Democrats to task because I have some kind of perceived "petty grudge" against them? Because if so, that means you have a much lower opinion of me than I have of you.

    Honestly I don't think that little of most of you. I really honestly dont.

    I have issues with many of you that have been hashed over a lot but think most of you genuinely do care and give a shit and are decent people. Even when I'm mad it's because we are mostly decent people disagreeing. Despite our differences.

    But I'm having a hard time in some cases not feeling that way for aforementioned reasons.

  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    Considering how many coworkers I've buried thanks to COVID (and COVID-related devastations), yeah, it's fair to say people like me care about it.

    Are you for real with this? Do you seriously think I see COVID as just an issue over which to take the Democrats to task because I have some kind of perceived "petty grudge" against them? Because if so, that means you have a much lower opinion of me than I have of you.

    Honestly I don't think that little of most of you. I really honestly dont.

    I have issues with many of you that have been hashed over a lot but think most of you genuinely do care and give a shit and are decent people. Even when I'm mad it's because we are mostly decent people disagreeing. Despite our differences.

    But I'm having a hard time in some cases not feeling that way for aforementioned reasons.

    Yeah dude, I know you think I’m a piece of shit; you’ve made that quite clear these past few months despite that fake ass little song and dance back in the holiday hangout


    And by the way, I didn’t say you didn’t care about COVID. I said that you repeatedly put your feelings about a party that doesn’t give two shits about you over the thoughts and feelings of your fellow community members. Big difference!

    I’m not gonna denigrate the work you did for your IRL community, but by god you sure don’t gotta problem coming in here and suggesting that I’m just playing pretend with my feelings about this shit

    Lanz on
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Moved to above

    Lanz on
  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    Considering how many coworkers I've buried thanks to COVID (and COVID-related devastations), yeah, it's fair to say people like me care about it.

    Are you for real with this? Do you seriously think I see COVID as just an issue over which to take the Democrats to task because I have some kind of perceived "petty grudge" against them? Because if so, that means you have a much lower opinion of me than I have of you.

    Honestly I don't think that little of most of you. I really honestly dont.

    I have issues with many of you that have been hashed over a lot but think most of you genuinely do care and give a shit and are decent people. Even when I'm mad it's because we are mostly decent people disagreeing. Despite our differences.

    But I'm having a hard time in some cases not feeling that way for aforementioned reasons.

    Yeah dude, I know you think I’m a piece of shit; you’ve made that quite clear these past few months despite that fake ass little song and dance back in the holiday hangout


    And by the way, I didn’t say you didn’t care about COVID. I said that you repeatedly put your feelings about a party that doesn’t give two shits about you over the thoughts and feelings of your fellow community members. Big difference!

    I’m not gonna denigrate the work you did for your IRL community, but by god you sure don’t gotta problem coming in here and suggesting that I’m just playing pretend with my feelings about this shit

    I moved a lot of this discussion to PM.

    But I do apologize for suggesting anyone is playing pretend with their feelings around COVID. I let my feelings boil over about that and I know it is hard on everyone and I should not have gone there.

    HefflingsanstodoGnizmoadytum
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Moved to the PM, was in the wrong tab

    Lanz on
  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    Considering how many coworkers I've buried thanks to COVID (and COVID-related devastations), yeah, it's fair to say people like me care about it.

    Are you for real with this? Do you seriously think I see COVID as just an issue over which to take the Democrats to task because I have some kind of perceived "petty grudge" against them? Because if so, that means you have a much lower opinion of me than I have of you.

    Honestly I don't think that little of most of you. I really honestly dont.

    I have issues with many of you that have been hashed over a lot but think most of you genuinely do care and give a shit and are decent people. Even when I'm mad it's because we are mostly decent people disagreeing. Despite our differences.

    But I'm having a hard time in some cases not feeling that way for aforementioned reasons.

    Look man, I'm gonna level with you: I'm absolutely going to stick it to the Dems on this issue as much as possible because this something they could have managed a lot better. And indeed they promised to manage it better when they were on the campaign trail in 2020. Handing over the reigns of power to them seems to have had little overall effect on the response to this pandemic. I'm not saying it's amounted to bupkiss, but it feels darn close when we've now hit one million dead in this beleaguered nation.

    The Dems don't own this pandemic, I'll grant them that, but they absolutely own the recovery, and they're botching it terribly.

    MagellHefflingMatevKetarLanzDeath of RatsDee KaeMan in the MistsWiseManTobesKristmas KthulhuBloodsheed38thDoeZonugal
  • ClipseClipse Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Clipse was warned for this.
    Lanz wrote: »
    zagdrob wrote: »
    Do people care about COVID or see it as a convenient bludgeon against an administration.

    That as a documentary going from 1/2020 - present would be fascinating in all the facets.

    Motherfucker fuck off with this shit

    I’ve barely left my house in over two years to keep from contracting this shit

    I haven’t seen most of my friends in the same length of time, because of this fucking virus

    My family and I have had to put off and push back medical appointments as we monitor the rise and fall and rise again of COVID cases in our area.

    People I care about have had to avoid going to the hospital because even during Biden’s tenure our hospitals were fucking code black from being packed with COVID patients.


    Over a million people are fucking dead because of this disease and the government abandoning us to it.

    The government is already predicting a hundred million more infections this fall and winter. The fucking capitulated to the GOP on separating out the COVID funding from the Ukraine bill because god forbid we fucking call their bluff once ever. And we’re running out of time for companies to be able to produce enough of it because they won’t make them till they get the orders in, and they can’t do that unless they’re going to get paid. And now we’re possibly going to have to ration them, while still sending most of this country, including the most vulnerable, back into this fucking meat grinder

    So fuck you, you petty little asshole, for daring to come in here and suggest any one of us are pretending to care about this disease and it’s ensuing pandemic; don’t come in here and act like people don’t fucking care about this fucking disease just because you wanna fucking Stan for a party like it’s a fucking sports team and someone saying Biden and the democrats fucked up hurts your feelings and you find that more important to actually listening to people in a community you share whose lives have been upended by this two plus year long viral nightmare

    I’m sure I’ll get infracted for this, but I’ll stand by it, because the shit you just pulled is a thousand times more ghoulish than any edict violation in this post, even if you’re still within the letter of the rules

    Edit: as expected, I accept this warning but stand by my position

    I'm just going to go ahead and, as another person furious with the Biden administration abdicating responsibility, say fuck @zagdrob and fuck whatever shitty mod decided to warn this post. I've lost family members -- plural -- to covid and I'm absolutely fucking furious at how poorly the Biden admin has handled the pandemic, and the idea that I or anyone like me is fucking pretending to care about Biden's utter failure to take covid seriously might be the most insulting thing I've seen in the entire time I've posted on these forums. As hard as it apparently is to believe, people who are unhappy with the Biden administration are also human fucking beings, you ludicrous piece of shit. To reiterate: absolutely fuck @zagdrob and absolutely fuck whatever shithead mod decided that responding in anger to this was apparently the real offense.

    Feel free to warn, infract, threadban, or ban me for this; apparently all we can expect from this forum post-Tube is a faux-"polite" dumpster fire.

    @Elki @ElJeffe @Irond Will @Jacobkosh @Bogart @Shivahn -- Just want to make sure every mod gets to have their nose rubbed in this shit.

    Bogart on
    LanzWiseManTobesDee KaetynicBloodsheedHachfaceHacksawSkeithFANTOMASYamiB.Bandable
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    The administration has totally fucked with the CDC now that they’ve been team “return to normalcy” Phoenix, do you even read the COVID thread?

    Like we had this shit weeks ago about how the CDC has, like with trump, been manipulated to downplay the severity of the pandemic, giving room to draw down on every preventative measure but vaccines, when epidemiologists have been saying for years now that you need comprehensive and complementary measures to prevent spread instead of trying to rely on the vaccine as a single line of defense or silver bullet:
    In late February, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) unveiled a new Covid-19 monitoring system based on what they call “Community Levels.” By downplaying the importance of Sars-CoV-2 transmission, the new system instantly turned what was a pandemic map still red from Omicron transmission to green – creating the false impression that the pandemic is over.

    Released four days before the State of the Union, the new CDC measures and the narrative they created let President Biden claim victory over the virus via sleight of hand: a switch from standard reporting of community transmissions to measures of risk based largely on contentious hospital-based metrics. The previous guidelines called anything over 50 cases per 100,000 people “substantial or high.” Now, they say 200 cases per 100,000 is “low” as long as hospitalizations are also low.

    The resulting shift from a red map to a green one reflected no real reduction in transmission risk. It was a resort to rhetoric: an effort to craft a success story that would explain away hundreds of thousands of preventable deaths and the continued threat the virus poses.

    These new guidelines are at odds with evidence-based and equitable public health practice in three fundamental ways.

    First, they do not intend to prevent disease spread. By minimizing the importance of new cases, and focusing instead on hospitalizations–a lagging indicator–the revamped warning system delays action until surges are well underway and the consequences of severe disease and death are already in motion. Making matters worse, at-home tests are not recorded in the US, so the only “early indicator” in the risk level calculation grossly undercounts the true number of cases.

    The justification for the shift is that the virus is mostly harmless– a claim which not only ignores that one million have already died in the US alone, but also completely erases the reality of Long Covid. Studies indicate that 10-30% of Covid infections deteriorate into multiple debilitating syndromes lasting months to years. Minimizing Covid’s risks to the public will only increase these harms in our communities.

    Secondly, the new guidelines do more than inappropriately message safety; the guidelines shift the burden of responsibility onto vulnerable people. In place of clear, evidence-based guidance on masking for those facing greater risk, for example, the CDC simply advises individuals to consult with their local healthcare provider. This instruction assumes that providers are accessible, well informed, and willing to take on the personal liability for giving guidance around a potentially fatal virus that the CDC was once responsible for. In a country without healthcare for all, these assumptions are wrong.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/03/peoples-cdc-covid-guidelines


    No one here is downplaying Trump’s shit, as much as that straw man serves to deflect responsibility for the actions of the Biden Administration and it’s COVID advisers (run until April, I remind you, not by any actual doctor, but by businessman Jeff Zients) that have lead to dropping the ball time after time in handling this pandemic, focusing less on keeping people safe and supported during the pandemic and pushing them back into crowded, public spaces where we have now finally reached a million dead in just over two years of the virus.

    None of this is defensible and honestly it’s fucking gross when people keep trying to defend this shit as if this administration hasn’t abandoned this country for the same damn reasons as Trump and company did.

    Not once have I seen any evidence this was because of admin interference. Something we know Trump did repeatedly.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00108-4
    Researchers aren’t being obstructed at the CDC anymore, says Sam Groseclose, a former associate director of science at the CDC, who retired in December 2018. “They are encouraged to use science, so that’s a much better environment,” he says.
    A prime example of this is the CDC’s guidance last month that people who test positive for COVID-19 isolate for only 5 days — down from 10 — if they don’t have ongoing symptoms. Initially, the CDC suggested that the recommendation was based on evidence about when the virus is most transmissible. But in the following days, Walensky clarified that the choice was based on what the agency felt people would “tolerate”, and on a need to keep the country running in the face of an unprecedented surge in COVID-19 infections. “If she had said this clearly at the start, and stated that it was a trade-off of risks, people might have appreciated that,” says Angela Rasmussen, a virologist at the University of Saskatchewan in Canada. “Don’t say you’re following the science when you can’t point to the evidence.”

    Former CDC director Tom Frieden agrees, suggesting that Biden might be almost too eager to show that he is not censoring science, by allowing the CDC to act independently. The White House and other agencies should not interfere with public-health science, Frieden says, but they should help to shape policies and should communicate them in a clear and unified way to avoid a flurry of confusion.

    As mentioned in the COVID thread, approximately two thirds of the COIVD deaths since Biden took office are due to anti-vaxxers. Somewhat less, since of course there are some people who cannot be vaccinated. But still close to 2/3.

    Lord_AsmodeusFencingsaxMarathonForarshryke
  • BogartBogart Turn Around, Bright Eyes Registered User, Moderator mod
    The Glorious Edict hasn’t been rescinded, if you were wondering.

    HefflingAim
  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    Somehow I'm not surprised. People on the left are more likely to call Israel on their apartheid actions than the establishment they've already entangled.

    (I say more likely mainly due to Fetterman)

    It's not like they recently murdered a Palestinian Christian American citizen and journalist and then sent military police to cause a riot at her funeral or anything.

    There's probably a better thread here for it, but the complete lack of outrage from our government is disgusting.

    Whippy wrote: »
    nope nope nope nope abort abort talk about anime
    Help me Marie Kondo my life and buy my old stuff
    Man in the Mists
  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    The administration has totally fucked with the CDC now that they’ve been team “return to normalcy” Phoenix, do you even read the COVID thread?

    Like we had this shit weeks ago about how the CDC has, like with trump, been manipulated to downplay the severity of the pandemic, giving room to draw down on every preventative measure but vaccines, when epidemiologists have been saying for years now that you need comprehensive and complementary measures to prevent spread instead of trying to rely on the vaccine as a single line of defense or silver bullet:
    In late February, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) unveiled a new Covid-19 monitoring system based on what they call “Community Levels.” By downplaying the importance of Sars-CoV-2 transmission, the new system instantly turned what was a pandemic map still red from Omicron transmission to green – creating the false impression that the pandemic is over.

    Released four days before the State of the Union, the new CDC measures and the narrative they created let President Biden claim victory over the virus via sleight of hand: a switch from standard reporting of community transmissions to measures of risk based largely on contentious hospital-based metrics. The previous guidelines called anything over 50 cases per 100,000 people “substantial or high.” Now, they say 200 cases per 100,000 is “low” as long as hospitalizations are also low.

    The resulting shift from a red map to a green one reflected no real reduction in transmission risk. It was a resort to rhetoric: an effort to craft a success story that would explain away hundreds of thousands of preventable deaths and the continued threat the virus poses.

    These new guidelines are at odds with evidence-based and equitable public health practice in three fundamental ways.

    First, they do not intend to prevent disease spread. By minimizing the importance of new cases, and focusing instead on hospitalizations–a lagging indicator–the revamped warning system delays action until surges are well underway and the consequences of severe disease and death are already in motion. Making matters worse, at-home tests are not recorded in the US, so the only “early indicator” in the risk level calculation grossly undercounts the true number of cases.

    The justification for the shift is that the virus is mostly harmless– a claim which not only ignores that one million have already died in the US alone, but also completely erases the reality of Long Covid. Studies indicate that 10-30% of Covid infections deteriorate into multiple debilitating syndromes lasting months to years. Minimizing Covid’s risks to the public will only increase these harms in our communities.

    Secondly, the new guidelines do more than inappropriately message safety; the guidelines shift the burden of responsibility onto vulnerable people. In place of clear, evidence-based guidance on masking for those facing greater risk, for example, the CDC simply advises individuals to consult with their local healthcare provider. This instruction assumes that providers are accessible, well informed, and willing to take on the personal liability for giving guidance around a potentially fatal virus that the CDC was once responsible for. In a country without healthcare for all, these assumptions are wrong.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/03/peoples-cdc-covid-guidelines


    No one here is downplaying Trump’s shit, as much as that straw man serves to deflect responsibility for the actions of the Biden Administration and it’s COVID advisers (run until April, I remind you, not by any actual doctor, but by businessman Jeff Zients) that have lead to dropping the ball time after time in handling this pandemic, focusing less on keeping people safe and supported during the pandemic and pushing them back into crowded, public spaces where we have now finally reached a million dead in just over two years of the virus.

    None of this is defensible and honestly it’s fucking gross when people keep trying to defend this shit as if this administration hasn’t abandoned this country for the same damn reasons as Trump and company did.

    Not once have I seen any evidence this was because of admin interference. Something we know Trump did repeatedly.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00108-4
    Researchers aren’t being obstructed at the CDC anymore, says Sam Groseclose, a former associate director of science at the CDC, who retired in December 2018. “They are encouraged to use science, so that’s a much better environment,” he says.
    A prime example of this is the CDC’s guidance last month that people who test positive for COVID-19 isolate for only 5 days — down from 10 — if they don’t have ongoing symptoms. Initially, the CDC suggested that the recommendation was based on evidence about when the virus is most transmissible. But in the following days, Walensky clarified that the choice was based on what the agency felt people would “tolerate”, and on a need to keep the country running in the face of an unprecedented surge in COVID-19 infections. “If she had said this clearly at the start, and stated that it was a trade-off of risks, people might have appreciated that,” says Angela Rasmussen, a virologist at the University of Saskatchewan in Canada. “Don’t say you’re following the science when you can’t point to the evidence.”

    Former CDC director Tom Frieden agrees, suggesting that Biden might be almost too eager to show that he is not censoring science, by allowing the CDC to act independently. The White House and other agencies should not interfere with public-health science, Frieden says, but they should help to shape policies and should communicate them in a clear and unified way to avoid a flurry of confusion.

    As mentioned in the COVID thread, approximately two thirds of the COIVD deaths since Biden took office are due to anti-vaxxers. Somewhat less, since of course there are some people who cannot be vaccinated. But still close to 2/3.

    Are you conflating "unvaccinated" with "anti-vaxxer" with "anti-vaxxer" meaning "MAGA chud who thinks it's all a hoax?"

    Because it has been said a million times before in the COVID threads but I will reiterate it here: many, many people have gone unvaccinated for reasons beyond being a conspiracy theorist or being immunocompromised.

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  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    @'ing a stranger to come to a thread they haven't participated in so you can fight them is intensely crass. Don't do it.

    rRwz9.gif
  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Lanz wrote: »
    The administration has totally fucked with the CDC now that they’ve been team “return to normalcy” Phoenix, do you even read the COVID thread?

    Like we had this shit weeks ago about how the CDC has, like with trump, been manipulated to downplay the severity of the pandemic, giving room to draw down on every preventative measure but vaccines, when epidemiologists have been saying for years now that you need comprehensive and complementary measures to prevent spread instead of trying to rely on the vaccine as a single line of defense or silver bullet:
    In late February, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) unveiled a new Covid-19 monitoring system based on what they call “Community Levels.” By downplaying the importance of Sars-CoV-2 transmission, the new system instantly turned what was a pandemic map still red from Omicron transmission to green – creating the false impression that the pandemic is over.

    Released four days before the State of the Union, the new CDC measures and the narrative they created let President Biden claim victory over the virus via sleight of hand: a switch from standard reporting of community transmissions to measures of risk based largely on contentious hospital-based metrics. The previous guidelines called anything over 50 cases per 100,000 people “substantial or high.” Now, they say 200 cases per 100,000 is “low” as long as hospitalizations are also low.

    The resulting shift from a red map to a green one reflected no real reduction in transmission risk. It was a resort to rhetoric: an effort to craft a success story that would explain away hundreds of thousands of preventable deaths and the continued threat the virus poses.

    These new guidelines are at odds with evidence-based and equitable public health practice in three fundamental ways.

    First, they do not intend to prevent disease spread. By minimizing the importance of new cases, and focusing instead on hospitalizations–a lagging indicator–the revamped warning system delays action until surges are well underway and the consequences of severe disease and death are already in motion. Making matters worse, at-home tests are not recorded in the US, so the only “early indicator” in the risk level calculation grossly undercounts the true number of cases.

    The justification for the shift is that the virus is mostly harmless– a claim which not only ignores that one million have already died in the US alone, but also completely erases the reality of Long Covid. Studies indicate that 10-30% of Covid infections deteriorate into multiple debilitating syndromes lasting months to years. Minimizing Covid’s risks to the public will only increase these harms in our communities.

    Secondly, the new guidelines do more than inappropriately message safety; the guidelines shift the burden of responsibility onto vulnerable people. In place of clear, evidence-based guidance on masking for those facing greater risk, for example, the CDC simply advises individuals to consult with their local healthcare provider. This instruction assumes that providers are accessible, well informed, and willing to take on the personal liability for giving guidance around a potentially fatal virus that the CDC was once responsible for. In a country without healthcare for all, these assumptions are wrong.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/03/peoples-cdc-covid-guidelines


    No one here is downplaying Trump’s shit, as much as that straw man serves to deflect responsibility for the actions of the Biden Administration and it’s COVID advisers (run until April, I remind you, not by any actual doctor, but by businessman Jeff Zients) that have lead to dropping the ball time after time in handling this pandemic, focusing less on keeping people safe and supported during the pandemic and pushing them back into crowded, public spaces where we have now finally reached a million dead in just over two years of the virus.

    None of this is defensible and honestly it’s fucking gross when people keep trying to defend this shit as if this administration hasn’t abandoned this country for the same damn reasons as Trump and company did.

    Not once have I seen any evidence this was because of admin interference. Something we know Trump did repeatedly.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-00108-4
    Researchers aren’t being obstructed at the CDC anymore, says Sam Groseclose, a former associate director of science at the CDC, who retired in December 2018. “They are encouraged to use science, so that’s a much better environment,” he says.
    A prime example of this is the CDC’s guidance last month that people who test positive for COVID-19 isolate for only 5 days — down from 10 — if they don’t have ongoing symptoms. Initially, the CDC suggested that the recommendation was based on evidence about when the virus is most transmissible. But in the following days, Walensky clarified that the choice was based on what the agency felt people would “tolerate”, and on a need to keep the country running in the face of an unprecedented surge in COVID-19 infections. “If she had said this clearly at the start, and stated that it was a trade-off of risks, people might have appreciated that,” says Angela Rasmussen, a virologist at the University of Saskatchewan in Canada. “Don’t say you’re following the science when you can’t point to the evidence.”

    Former CDC director Tom Frieden agrees, suggesting that Biden might be almost too eager to show that he is not censoring science, by allowing the CDC to act independently. The White House and other agencies should not interfere with public-health science, Frieden says, but they should help to shape policies and should communicate them in a clear and unified way to avoid a flurry of confusion.

    As mentioned in the COVID thread, approximately two thirds of the COIVD deaths since Biden took office are due to anti-vaxxers. Somewhat less, since of course there are some people who cannot be vaccinated. But still close to 2/3.

    Are you conflating "unvaccinated" with "anti-vaxxer" with "anti-vaxxer" meaning "MAGA chud who thinks it's all a hoax?"

    Because it has been said a million times before in the COVID threads but I will reiterate it here: many, many people have gone unvaccinated for reasons beyond being a conspiracy theorist or being immunocompromised.

    Soon to be added to the list this fall: there’s not enough fucking vaccine

    Speed RacerMagellRingoMan in the Mists
  • jungleroomxjungleroomx It's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovels Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    I think people deciding to forego vaccines far outnumber those who have it decided for them, whether it be medical or social.

    I’m comfortable lumping in people who decide to forego vaccines because of politics as chudlings.

    There are people who have a complete earned distrust I also exempt, since you know Tuskeegee. But I dunno, it’s different when its NOT a government facility using not government vaccines.

    jungleroomx on
  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

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  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    Continuing this: and we know that basically your response to it’s going to be a gamble. Some folks get on fine with little more than soreness in their arm. Others get laid out for the next day, day and a half because of immune response variation while the body’s gearing up its defenses once the vaccine does its job

    We have a vaccine that can help against the virus, but we don’t have an economic system that permits workers to do what they need to get it (i.e., stay the fuck home and rest while it primes your immune system)

    Lanz on
  • PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    It's hard to keep even basic decorum and respect for persons when the gentle parts of your psyche have been worn away by the isolation and natural cruelty of the pandemic. I account for this and give slips of behavior a wide berth.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
    FeloniousmozFencingsaxDoodmannRingoThawmus
  • Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    edited May 14
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    I would include "unable due to economic factors outside their control" to be an example of decided for them, rather than a conscious and intentional decision without strong extenuating circumstances.

    Lord_Asmodeus on
    Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
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  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    My brother and sister and law were going to get vaccinated because everyone was going to cut them off in terms of contact, and then they got covid, both of them nearly died, and now they "don't need the vaccine because you can't get it twice"
    they got covid in november and my brother is only now getting his voice back

    We lost my aunt to covid, my great grandma to covid, ffs

    Right wing media has brain poisoned people

    override367 on
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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited May 14
    Doodmann wrote: »
    Somehow I'm not surprised. People on the left are more likely to call Israel on their apartheid actions than the establishment they've already entangled.

    (I say more likely mainly due to Fetterman)

    It's not like they recently murdered a Palestinian Christian American citizen and journalist and then sent military police to cause a riot at her funeral or anything.

    There's probably a better thread here for it, but the complete lack of outrage from our government is disgusting.

    The Middle East thread is where people were talking about it.

    Fencingsax on
    Doodmann
  • Knuckle DraggerKnuckle Dragger Explosive Ovine Disposal Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    As someone who was working 55-60 hour weeks, I'm going to call bullshit on this. It would have been understandable early on, when everyone was trying to get an appointment, and you might not have been able to schedule one the afternoon before your day off (assuming you worked a six day week). It rings completely hollow over a year later.

    I'd rather be led by a comedian than ruled by a joke.
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    As someone who was working 55-60 hour weeks, I'm going to call bullshit on this. It would have been understandable early on, when everyone was trying to get an appointment, and you might not have been able to schedule one the afternoon before your day off (assuming you worked a six day week). It rings completely hollow over a year later.
    The point isn't the time for the shot, but the side effects. There are people who literally work paycheck to paycheck, and cannot afford a day off.

    DarkPrimusLanzBloodsheedStyrofoam SammichFeloniousmozMatevLord_AsmodeusWiseManTobesMan in the MistsDee Kae
  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Doodmann wrote: »
    Somehow I'm not surprised. People on the left are more likely to call Israel on their apartheid actions than the establishment they've already entangled.

    (I say more likely mainly due to Fetterman)

    It's not like they recently murdered a Palestinian Christian American citizen and journalist and then sent military police to cause a riot at her funeral or anything.

    There's probably a better thread here for it, but the complete lack of outrage from our government is disgusting.

    The Middle East thread is where people were talking about it.

    Since it does tie into this thread somewhat, and I haven't posted it in the MENA thread, here is an Al Jazeera article collecting US Congressperson responses to the killing of Shireen Abu Akleh. TL;DR, the progressives you would expect have made actual statements with intent, Pelosi and Schiff made lip service tweets devoid of actual content.

    DarkPrimus on
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  • LanzLanz Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    As someone who was working 55-60 hour weeks, I'm going to call bullshit on this. It would have been understandable early on, when everyone was trying to get an appointment, and you might not have been able to schedule one the afternoon before your day off (assuming you worked a six day week). It rings completely hollow over a year later.
    The point isn't the time for the shot, but the side effects. There are people who literally work paycheck to paycheck, and cannot afford a day off.

    This; if I went trawling through the COVID thread here in D&D, how many posters in this specific sub forum would I find who got flat laid out as their immune response kicked in?

    Cause like, that’s the point of a vaccine! You trigger an immune response to a lower-grade viral threat so your body can learn to identify the virus in question (in the mRNA vaccines’ case, by having your cells produce the spike-protein so your system can learn to identify it as a threat and neutralize it if memory serves on the general mechanics behind it), and the nature of such a method means some folks are gonna have a stronger response than others given the variability between individual immune systems, which at the more severe end means you might be bedridden for a day

    Lanz on
    MagellMan in the Mists
  • Knuckle DraggerKnuckle Dragger Explosive Ovine Disposal Registered User regular
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    As someone who was working 55-60 hour weeks, I'm going to call bullshit on this. It would have been understandable early on, when everyone was trying to get an appointment, and you might not have been able to schedule one the afternoon before your day off (assuming you worked a six day week). It rings completely hollow over a year later.
    The point isn't the time for the shot, but the side effects. There are people who literally work paycheck to paycheck, and cannot afford a day off.

    I don't think the number in the US working seven days a week would quality as, "many, many people," let alone the subset of them who can't afford a single day off.

    I'd rather be led by a comedian than ruled by a joke.
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    A single missed shift means missed bills or food scarcity for literally millions of americans

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    As someone who was working 55-60 hour weeks, I'm going to call bullshit on this. It would have been understandable early on, when everyone was trying to get an appointment, and you might not have been able to schedule one the afternoon before your day off (assuming you worked a six day week). It rings completely hollow over a year later.
    The point isn't the time for the shot, but the side effects. There are people who literally work paycheck to paycheck, and cannot afford a day off.

    I don't think the number in the US working seven days a week would quality as, "many, many people," let alone the subset of them who can't afford a single day off.

    Someone having one day a week where they can absolutely guarantee they do not have to work does not mean they have the time or means to go to a pharmacy during the hours that pharmacy is open, spend the time waiting to recieve the vaccine and the time after to see if there's an immediate side-effect, and then go home and have ??? days of time further where they can take off work and all other obligations in case the vaccine knocks them on their ass.

    We are telling you the working poor of America are a real and not-insignificant part of our population who are simultaneously at among the highest risk of infection, the most without means to mitigate exposure, and the least able to weather the financial hardships that come with a COVID infection - all through no fault of their own - and you keep going "Eh, but are they really though?"

    DarkPrimus on
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  • Knuckle DraggerKnuckle Dragger Explosive Ovine Disposal Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    When a person cannot afford to take a sick day, that means they cannot afford to take a sick day for the after-effects of a vaccine shot.

    As someone who was working 55-60 hour weeks, I'm going to call bullshit on this. It would have been understandable early on, when everyone was trying to get an appointment, and you might not have been able to schedule one the afternoon before your day off (assuming you worked a six day week). It rings completely hollow over a year later.
    The point isn't the time for the shot, but the side effects. There are people who literally work paycheck to paycheck, and cannot afford a day off.

    I don't think the number in the US working seven days a week would quality as, "many, many people," let alone the subset of them who can't afford a single day off.

    Someone having one day a week where they can absolutely guarantee they do not have to work does not mean they have the time or means to go to a pharmacy during the hours that pharmacy is open, spend the time waiting to recieve the vaccine and the time after to see if there's an immediate side-effect, and then go home and have ??? days of time further where they can take off work and all other obligations in case the vaccine knocks them on their ass.

    We are telling you the working poor of America are a real and not-insignificant part of our population who are simultaneously at among the highest risk of infection, the most without means to mitigate exposure, and the least able to weather the financial hardships that come with a COVID infection - all through no fault of their own - and you keep going "Eh, but are they really though?"

    You're changing your argument. When I originally responded, you were bemoaning someone not being able to take a sick day to recover; now it's ??? days of time further where they can take off work and all other obligations in case the vaccine knocks them on their ass. You also ignore the fact that there have been programs passed specifically to encourage employers to provide paid leave for employees to get vaccinated and recover. I don't question that there are still people in situations that prevent them from getting vaccinated; I question the numbers of them that you are trying to argue.

    I'd rather be led by a comedian than ruled by a joke.
  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited May 14
    Oh, well if there were programs passed to encourage employers to provide paid leave to their employees

    Weird who you grant assumptions of agency as good faith to, and who you cast doubt upon with assumptions of agency

    I have not changed my argument. I expanded upon it when you took "cannot take a day off" to mean "literally working seven days a week," the better for you to double-down on the skepticism about workers being unable to make time to recieve the vaccine.

    DarkPrimus on
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  • ZavianZavian universal peace sounds better than forever war Registered User regular
    As an immuno-compromised person currently on chemo drugs, I am terrified of COVID. I feel as though both parties consider my life as 'expendable'. Personally, I don't feel there's any honor in 'dying for the economy'. It certainly doesn't fill me with a sense of party loyalty when it's made clear that my life has no value to said party

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