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We are canceling the apocalypse! (Final Fantasy XIV)

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Posts

  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    i definitely think hildibrand has suffered a little from feeling that it's now Obligatory

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  • SkeithSkeith Registered User regular
    I've been skipping all the dialogue and cutscenes since Stormblood and it doesn't sound like I'm missing out on much.

    aTBDrQE.jpg
  • ZythonZython Registered User regular
    Skeith wrote: »
    I've been skipping all the dialogue and cutscenes since Stormblood and it doesn't sound like I'm missing out on much.

    I like the EW stuff, but the Stormblood stuff is very missable. HW Hildebrand is still the best, though.

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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    Hildebrand is great. Y'all are a bunch of sourpusses.

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited December 2023
    I am compelled to ask this, and I am not trying to dunk on anyone, but-

    What the fuck is up with Sages?!

    Why do they never heal people?!

    I am so confused!


    Ever since I've came back to FFXIV I've done so many dungeons with a Sage that rarely to never heals people. So many needless deaths and wipes. Is it a hard class to play? Is that what's going on? I know nothing about this class, but I have grown to dread seeing them.

    My experience with Sages over dozens and dozens and dozens of dungeons can be summed up thusly:

    Sage that heals the group and there are no issues: Extremely Rare (but I have seen them!)
    Sage that barely keeps the Tank alive and heals no one else: Frightfully Common
    Sage that literally heals no one: Not Uncommon Enough

    edit- To clarify I assume the issue is with the class itself as the FFXIV playerbase I have found to be reliably delightful people.

    Axen on
    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Axen wrote: »
    I am compelled to ask this, and I am not trying to dunk on anyone, but-

    What the fuck is up with Sages?!

    Why do they never heal people?!

    I am so confused!


    Ever since I've came back to FFXIV I've done so many dungeons with a Sage that rarely to never heals people. So many needless deaths and wipes. Is it a hard class to play? Is that what's going on? I know nothing about this class, but I have grown to dread seeing them.

    My experience with Sages over dozens and dozens and dozens of dungeons can be summed up thusly:

    Sage that heals the group and there are no issues: Extremely Rare (but I have seen them!)
    Sage that barely keeps the Tank alive and heals no one else: Frightfully Common
    Sage that literally heals no one: Not Uncommon Enough

    edit- To clarify I assume the issue is with the class itself as the FFXIV playerbase I have found to be reliably delightful people.

    Sage is incredible, but you have to know how to play it or you're in for a bad time.

    The issue is that Sage doesn't have as many options for big emergency heals as the other healers do, because they are supposed to preemptively mitigate damage. If the Sage does not do that correctly they can quickly fall into a death spiral of throwing out inefficient heals over and over again to try to keep a tank alive.

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Barely keeping the tank alive and healing no one else is optimal healer play in dungeons.

  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    i do more DPS if i rez you after the pull

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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    LD50 wrote: »
    Axen wrote: »
    I am compelled to ask this, and I am not trying to dunk on anyone, but-

    What the fuck is up with Sages?!

    Why do they never heal people?!

    I am so confused!


    Ever since I've came back to FFXIV I've done so many dungeons with a Sage that rarely to never heals people. So many needless deaths and wipes. Is it a hard class to play? Is that what's going on? I know nothing about this class, but I have grown to dread seeing them.

    My experience with Sages over dozens and dozens and dozens of dungeons can be summed up thusly:

    Sage that heals the group and there are no issues: Extremely Rare (but I have seen them!)
    Sage that barely keeps the Tank alive and heals no one else: Frightfully Common
    Sage that literally heals no one: Not Uncommon Enough

    edit- To clarify I assume the issue is with the class itself as the FFXIV playerbase I have found to be reliably delightful people.

    Sage is incredible, but you have to know how to play it or you're in for a bad time.

    The issue is that Sage doesn't have as many options for big emergency heals as the other healers do, because they are supposed to preemptively mitigate damage. If the Sage does not do that correctly they can quickly fall into a death spiral of throwing out inefficient heals over and over again to try to keep a tank alive.

    Thank you for enlightening me.

    The first time I experienced this I assumed the player was just an asshole, but then I kept experiencing the same thing over and over.

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    The overwhelming majority of duty finder damage can be handled by the Sage properly mitigating and basic aoe heals. Individual players should not normally need a single targeted heal - that goes for all of the healers though, not just Sage.

    The tank should typically not need to be healed, proper Sage play in basic dungeons is similar to proper tank play - use your mitigations and the tank's health should barely move to begin with. If the tank starts needing actual heals, that's when someone in the group isn't doing something correctly.

    There are plenty of Sages that don't "get" this though, and those you're going to have a problem with. They will treat it like a reactive healer and everyone will have a bad time.

  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Well, a tank pulling wall to wall can end up needing active healing even when everything is going right (in particular in leveling content, it's easier to get away with only using oGCDs at level cap when everyone's gear is up to date and all).

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  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    The other issue with Sage is that it starts at level 70, so there's A LOT of people who don't otherwise heal who pick it up for the ShB / EW role quests because they don't have to level it as far as the other healing classes. So you get people who straight up aren't healers.

    (it is amusing to me the number of people who just... don't seem to get mitigate healing, because wayyy back in Guild Wars 1 I was a Protection Monk, which is all about the mitigates to the point that regular healing feels weird to me)

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  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Well, a tank pulling wall to wall can end up needing active healing even when everything is going right (in particular in leveling content, it's easier to get away with only using oGCDs at level cap when everyone's gear is up to date and all).

    In particular if you get into a 30-50 dungeon and your tank pulls big, you're probably going to have to spam.

  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    admanb wrote: »
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Well, a tank pulling wall to wall can end up needing active healing even when everything is going right (in particular in leveling content, it's easier to get away with only using oGCDs at level cap when everyone's gear is up to date and all).

    In particular if you get into a 30-50 dungeon and your tank pulls big, you're probably going to have to spam.

    People sometimes forget that classes don't have access to a whole lot of abilities in that level range.

    Hell, I've done it and realized all too late that, "Oh shit, I don't have any of my stuff!"

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited December 2023
    one thing nobody has mentioned is that you will never actually see a properly played sage casting any heals because none of the heals they should be using have cast times

    and if you do see one casting some heals, then that's probably why people are dying because their casted heals are useless

    sage is by far the strongest dungeon healer, especially at max level. it's my choice for expert roulette if im not queueing with a tank friend because if the pug tank isn't doing wall to wall pulls and tries to pull "you pull you tank" idiocy, sage can do the wall pulls in expert dungeons without a tank, so wipes don't happen.

    Dhalphir on
  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    one thing nobody has mentioned is that you will never actually see a properly played sage casting any heals because none of the heals they should be using have cast times

    and if you do see one casting some heals, then that's probably why people are dying because their casted heals are useless

    sage is by far the strongest dungeon healer, especially at max level. it's my choice for expert roulette if im not queueing with a tank friend because if the pug tank isn't doing wall to wall pulls and tries to pull "you pull you tank" idiocy, sage can do the wall pulls in expert dungeons without a tank, so wipes don't happen.

    Sage in dungeons is excellent, but it does make me wish I had more dps abilities because casting the same 3 spells gets boring. The sand bug boss in the most recent dungeon is my favorite because I can solo soak the stack mechanic and then icarus out of the quicksand.

  • JarsJars Registered User regular
    I mean expert is a snoozefest for healers, especially if the tank is pld/war. The only thing I like about sage in the harder hitting leveling dungeons is taurochole. whm still has the advantage in most dungeons thanks to holy.

  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    sage is fine but they do not have Expedient and they can't eat their fairy so what's even the point (besides knife guns) (knife guns are a pretty strong argument, HOWEVER...)

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  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited December 2023
    Jars wrote: »
    I mean expert is a snoozefest for healers, especially if the tank is pld/war. The only thing I like about sage in the harder hitting leveling dungeons is taurochole. whm still has the advantage in most dungeons thanks to holy.

    White mage is stronger if you have a good tank, does significantly more damage, but they can't be the tank for a wall to wall pull like a sage can, if your tank sucks. Sages can freely self spam their single target shields on themselves which, with good use of mitigation is enough to keep yourself alive as the sage through tanking the wall pull, but white mage can't do that - once you're out of lilies and off-gcds, you're reduced to cure 2 and spell pushback from being meleed prevents that from working very well.

    Dhalphir on
  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    edited December 2023
    Sage isn't THAT burst healing starved... I think you were just running into a string of people playing poorly

    and yeah if you are concerned about not seeing heal spell cast bars with a sage it's because they don't cast their basic cast-time-having heals almost ever, it's much more efficient for them to press the mode switch button and then the instant cast version that makes a shield. And everything that's not the basic GCD heals is also instant. Except like, the heal/damage laser they get at 90. The only situation you'd want to cast your non-shield version of your basic heals is if everyone is already shielded and not taking damage to break it while you cast the next one, but still low on actual HP and so you need to top them off for an incoming big hit, and ALL your other cooldowns are used up.

    BahamutZERO on
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  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    The first section of Holminster Switch is a terrible thing to inflict on new Sage players.

  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    wall pulling the first section of hominster is rough on every healer, so especially so on brand new fresh out of the unlock quest sages yeah

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  • MugsleyMugsley DelawareRegistered User regular
    When I tank roulette dungeons and see we have a Sage, I know I'm going to have a good time.

    My interpretation from play is that Kardia does most of the heavy lifting (healing from DPS) rather than burst. I'd like to think I'm decent at using my mitigation cooldowns to help.

  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    Kardia is basically a targeted scholar fairy. But their kit overall flows really well at 90 for dungeons at least.

  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    Kardia is worth approximately as much healing as scholar fairy auto heals or regen ticks from the other two yeah

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Kardia is worth approximately as much healing as scholar fairy auto heals or regen ticks from the other two yeah

    The real star is Kerachole imo (and Sacred Soil, SCH's equivalent) - 30s cooldown for 10% mitigation and regen to the whole party.

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  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    The difference is that if the sage is frantically casting heals on the tank, the Kardia healing disappears.

  • TamerBillTamerBill Registered User regular
    jothki wrote: »
    The difference is that if the sage is frantically casting heals on the tank, the Kardia healing disappears.

    Well if the scholar is frantically casting heals he's probably used Dissipate for more aetherflow pips, so the faerie healing disappears too.

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  • JarsJars Registered User regular
    I don't even have dissipation on my bars. fucking trash skill

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    I actually really hate scholar, which makes me sad because it used to be my favorite class. I know astro is getting eyed by the devs for a rework but it should really be scholar.

  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    I have some things I find annoying on scholar (I'd love to have a button that turns my next heal into pure shields, because there's no good way to throw them up ahead of a mechanic without wasting healing if everyone's topped up), but it's in a perfectly functional spot, even if it has some significant mechanical overlap with Sage.

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  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    the fuck do you mean fanfest is this weekend

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  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    I have some things I find annoying on scholar (I'd love to have a button that turns my next heal into pure shields, because there's no good way to throw them up ahead of a mechanic without wasting healing if everyone's topped up), but it's in a perfectly functional spot, even if it has some significant mechanical overlap with Sage.

    Scholar rant under the spoiler.
    Fucking dissipation man. You need emergency healing so you use dissipation to get you more aetherflow stacks and a self buff to healing, but with your fairy gone you don't generate fairy gauge when you spend that aetherflow so you're really just robbing your future self of those resources, and the self buff doesn't actually do anything because it only affects healing spells IE nothing that you do with the fucking aetherflow stacks you got from using dissipation in the first place. What fucking idiot designed that?

    Summon seraph also kinda sucks. Most of the abilities are the same as eos, but the regular heal turns into a shield that ends up feeling kinda worthless because it's really not very strong and she just heals random people so the shield portion commonly just goes to waste.

    Emergency tactics is just... yeah, let's give scholar emergency healing that works by taking the interesting part of the job (mitigation) and just gets rid of it. What a cool button!

    The crit part of adlo is now 'catalyze' instead of galvanize, so it isn't copied with deployment tactics.

    At the end of the day it feels like scholar's toolkit is a bunch of different pieces that don't fit together. To add insult to injury, they took what was the most interesting healer dps rotation and turned it into the most boring.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited January 4
    jothki wrote: »
    The difference is that if the sage is frantically casting heals on the tank, the Kardia healing disappears.

    that's true, though spamming Eukrasian Diagnosis back to back on a tank is absolutely insane throughput and even an unmitigated tank doing the first Mt Gulg wall pull (i think the largest pull in the game?) will stay alive through that. you're really not going to miss the Kardia in that scenario.

    Dhalphir on
  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    Tokyo Fanfest keynote starting in 15 minutes
    https://youtu.be/9A2ljmmUT_I

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  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited January 7
    Krile is a pictomancer.

    Femroth sighted.

    reVerse on
  • DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Krile as a picto/painter is already maximum adorable

  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    edited January 7
    6e4f6whicy1a.png

    pictomancer artifact gear is Relm's outfit, of course

    BahamutZERO on
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  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Bears The Name FreedomRegistered User regular
    Relm lives again!
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  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    nice real life pictomancer AF gear cosplay lol
    I guess Yoshida got to cosplay reaper and viper before lol

    BahamutZERO.gif
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