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[Terra Invicta] 30% off for Gamescom, come and shoot space in the face

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Posts

  • Last SonLast Son Registered User regular
    Why do investment points decrease when you unify countries?

    Also I'm going to make a diagram of all the hoverable tooltips in this game because it's so much easier knowing where they are.

    Because if IP scaled linearly with GDP starting with the USA and then taking China would be the only viable strategy. Thematically its harder for you to leech resources from more developed nations, its basically collective action working against you.

  • AntinumericAntinumeric Registered User regular
    Ok I hope this is useful for someone - there are so many invisible buttons, and tooltips in this game. Its so hard to find them all jesus.
    xczxl9g9ple9.jpg

    In this moment, I am euphoric. Not because of any phony god’s blessing. But because, I am enlightened by my intelligence.
  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    Last Son wrote: »
    Why do investment points decrease when you unify countries?

    Also I'm going to make a diagram of all the hoverable tooltips in this game because it's so much easier knowing where they are.

    Because if IP scaled linearly with GDP starting with the USA and then taking China would be the only viable strategy. Thematically its harder for you to leech resources from more developed nations, its basically collective action working against you.

    Also, it is a genuine economic sink for one country to absorb another. This is why nobody really wants to unify South and North Korea.

    3DS Friendcode 5413-1311-3767
    Mr RayGiantGeek2020
  • BSoBBSoB Registered User regular
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

  • Last SonLast Son Registered User regular
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    Theres very few circumstances you can't come back from in TI, if you are playing on normal. Unless the aliens have conquered a majority of Earth, nuclear war has killed off 50%+ of humanity, or global warming has gone above 4 degrees(F) you are probably fine. The global tech system means you can't really fall too far behind and the fact that a lot improvements are linked to countries means that, with enough work, you can always steal a country thats doing well if the ones you have aren't.

    Mr Ray
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    Woops, was I supposed to be doing something about global warming?

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
    Dignified PauperGiantGeek2020Elvenshae
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

    It's also very strange to look at places like say, India, which is under the control of the Servants who have it set to full spoils, boost and military. No economy or knowledge at all, and see its economy growing whereas I have my nation's with 3/2/3 in economy, welfare etc and specializing with a couple of pips in military or boost and Indias economy is growing faster than Indonesias (my main nation)

    The game desperately needs history graphs for support, gdp etc and ways to understand WHY things are happening. Like, the EU and the UK both declared war on Australia. Why did they do that. Is it my fault? How can I stop them? Is fermenting a coup really my best plan? That's not a fast strategy there! The EU is under the initiative, who are evil, but the UK is under the "meet the aliens as equals" squad who seem to like me (resistance)

    Another issue is split control of countries. If I'm the resistance, and I have 75% support and three control points in a nation but you have the executive then I should be able to create massive unrest if you use your executive control to make decisions I don't like. Sure, you are in charge, but my control and support should mean that ignoring me means civil war. I made a huge push on China, gathering 75% support and taking control points and then the servants snatched up two points and secured them, giving them executive control. And China is enormous, so taking secured points is really hard. I feel I have the support of the people and much of government, more than enough to stop you doing things I don't like, but I didn't really have any options to stop the servants here.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    tbloxham wrote: »
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

    It's also very strange to look at places like say, India, which is under the control of the Servants who have it set to full spoils, boost and military. No economy or knowledge at all, and see its economy growing whereas I have my nation's with 3/2/3 in economy, welfare etc and specializing with a couple of pips in military or boost and Indias economy is growing faster than Indonesias (my main nation)

    The game desperately needs history graphs for support, gdp etc and ways to understand WHY things are happening. Like, the EU and the UK both declared war on Australia. Why did they do that. Is it my fault? How can I stop them? Is fermenting a coup really my best plan? That's not a fast strategy there! The EU is under the initiative, who are evil, but the UK is under the "meet the aliens as equals" squad who seem to like me (resistance)

    Another issue is split control of countries. If I'm the resistance, and I have 75% support and three control points in a nation but you have the executive then I should be able to create massive unrest if you use your executive control to make decisions I don't like. Sure, you are in charge, but my control and support should mean that ignoring me means civil war. I made a huge push on China, gathering 75% support and taking control points and then the servants snatched up two points and secured them, giving them executive control. And China is enormous, so taking secured points is really hard. I feel I have the support of the people and much of government, more than enough to stop you doing things I don't like, but I didn't really have any options to stop the servants here.

    The game paradoxically gives too much information and not enough information, too much control and not enough control. Why is my economy going up but my GDP going down? Don't know. Here's a notification that your approval suddenly dropped a lot. Why? Not going to tell you. Do you want to assist your allies in their war? I didn't realize I was allied with anyone and it was certainly not something I did or knew about.

    And it is also bad about not telling you why something doesn't work. I spent a lot of time with councillors telling me I had enough boost to build an orbital hab without the ability or even the required UI element visible to indicate how one might do that. I'm still not sure which research finally allowed it since it's not explicitly mentioned anywhere. I had to visit a 3rd party site to even learn about the missing UI. Or how I had a councilor that couldn't do missions in various countries and the game just beeps at you that you can't do it. Until I dug into their traits and discovered they can't do missions in rival countries. Which countries are those? Who knows, well the game obviously knows, it's just not going to tell you so have fun with trial and error.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    Rival is the diplomatic state opposite to Allied so I would guess that it's whoever is rivals with that Councilor's home nation.

    PS: It feels weird to be starting a space tourism industry in the middle of an alien invasion where one space station has already gotten blown up.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
    Dignified PauperGiantGeek2020
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    Rival is the diplomatic state opposite to Allied so I would guess that it's whoever is rivals with that Councilor's home nation.

    PS: It feels weird to be starting a space tourism industry in the middle of an alien invasion where one space station has already gotten blown up.

    There's always the "four of my friends died doing it this year. It's awesome." extreme sports crowd market.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
    Dignified PauperGiantGeek2020
  • ZavianZavian universal peace sounds better than forever war Registered User regular
    Ok I hope this is useful for someone - there are so many invisible buttons, and tooltips in this game. Its so hard to find them all jesus.
    xczxl9g9ple9.jpg

    I don't know why any dev would look at a Paradox UI and go "yes, let's do this'

    AntinumericDignified PauperGiantGeek2020
  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    Their modern UIs are really good I think -- there's a lot of information in there, but I find it pretty easy to access in stuff like Stellaris and CK3.

    Most descriptions of this game I've heard describe the UI as a 2010 Paradox game, before they realized how much making good interfaces opens up their games to more customers. That's definitely bad.

    Fiatil on
    steam_sig.png
    Phoenix-DZavianMvrck
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    Ugh, I have a new problem that alien ships can just run away from me because of how much more delta v they have, so unless I want to park a full fleet at every one of my stations I can't actually force them into battle.

    Edit: The good news is that the AI seems dumb enough to allow itself to be held off indefinitely by a single point defense array.

    HamHamJ on
    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    Yes, the aliens will run circles around you for most of the game due to their better engine tech, early on the best strategy is to just accept you're going to lose stations occasionally and keep rebuilding, early stations are pretty cheap and quick to build, so its not actually the end of the world if you lose a couple. Approaching mid-game you can turn every station you really don't want to lose into a hedgehog with multiple Layered Defense Arrays (I would recommend at least three) to keep the aliens at bay. The moment you're finally able to build a ship with enough delta/v to start chasing the aliens down is definitely a "Yes... haha, YES!" moment. I now have "hunter" fleets around each planet dedicated to chasing down those annoying single destroyers they keep sending to bomb my ground bases...

    Speaking of the defensive modules, As of the latest patch, PD arrays, Layered Defense arrays and Battlestations will now all have three weapons rather than two; a laser, a kinetic and a point-defense. Previously they would have a PD and either a laser or kinetic, which lead to some jank when the AI had to pick which was the "better" weapon to use. So now there's some incentive to use all of the weapon types rather than bee-lining straight to one end of the tech tree.

  • BremenBremen Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    Ugh, I have a new problem that alien ships can just run away from me because of how much more delta v they have, so unless I want to park a full fleet at every one of my stations I can't actually force them into battle.

    Edit: The good news is that the AI seems dumb enough to allow itself to be held off indefinitely by a single point defense array.

    Just as a tip, you can deal with aliens running by surrounding them. Or rather, if a fleet evades another fleet it's put on cooldown for a few hours to represent firing its engines, and if you intercept it while it's on cooldown it can't evade. So divide your forces into two fleets, set them both to intercept the alien at roughly the same time, have one fleet pursue with a couple kps, and the second one should get the fight.

    The downside to this, of course, is that you need at least twice the firepower you're comfortable fighting the aliens with to do it, because if the first fleet isn't powerful enough they'll just kill it.

    Bremen on
  • MonwynMonwyn Apathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime. A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    So I've played about 30 hours of this across two campaigns, both as Resistance, both going for the EU strat, and in both cases none of the AI grabbed the US. In my first campaign this went to Weird Shit where the US underwent cyclical revolutions throwing random factions into and out of CP until I got an event where Paris was nuked by terrorists after getting their hands on a nuke from "a country that had recently seen a change in government."

    In my restart (going much better, on the whole) the US still has no one muscling in on its CP and it's become an authoritarian state with like 8 unrest. I'm going to put EU expansion on hold (France, Germany, Benelux, and Denmark already unified, Poland and a couple other minors getting integrated in a few months) to try and snag the US or at least as much as I can and pull it out of the death spiral, but is a US-first strat effectively required to keep it from going batshit?

    Both of these games have been on Normal, and it's very bizarre to me that the AI has completely ignored prime real estate like the US to fight me over, like, Slovakia.

    Monwyn on
    uH3IcEi.png
  • SeGaTaiSeGaTai Registered User regular
    Having done a similar start of going for EU; then giving up after awhile and picking up USA after no one else did; it can take a lot of actions to get that first USA CP without much to show for it; and I'm guessing the AI (at least on normal) isn't configured to keep pushing for it; and is setup to just always be doing something wherever it can.

    PSN SeGaTai
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    So in the struggle to figure out how federations are supposed to work, and in particular the frustration around sending someone to "set national policy" and finding I couldn't do anything, I found a useful tooltip. Select a country, and in the overview section, there is an icon to the right of the "Overview" title, that if you hover over that, it tells you what policy options you would have if you did that mission including the wait times.

    Unification also requires research into specific techs for that country (Except EU and Russia), so it's predefined on what you can do, which is an odd design choice frankly.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • AntinumericAntinumeric Registered User regular
    So in the struggle to figure out how federations are supposed to work, and in particular the frustration around sending someone to "set national policy" and finding I couldn't do anything, I found a useful tooltip. Select a country, and in the overview section, there is an icon to the right of the "Overview" title, that if you hover over that, it tells you what policy options you would have if you did that mission including the wait times.

    Unification also requires research into specific techs for that country (Except EU and Russia), so it's predefined on what you can do, which is an odd design choice frankly.

    https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/45066600#Comment_45066600

    There are loads of hidden tooltips.

    In this moment, I am euphoric. Not because of any phony god’s blessing. But because, I am enlightened by my intelligence.
    Mr Ray
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    Bremen wrote: »
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    Ugh, I have a new problem that alien ships can just run away from me because of how much more delta v they have, so unless I want to park a full fleet at every one of my stations I can't actually force them into battle.

    Edit: The good news is that the AI seems dumb enough to allow itself to be held off indefinitely by a single point defense array.

    Just as a tip, you can deal with aliens running by surrounding them. Or rather, if a fleet evades another fleet it's put on cooldown for a few hours to represent firing its engines, and if you intercept it while it's on cooldown it can't evade. So divide your forces into two fleets, set them both to intercept the alien at roughly the same time, have one fleet pursue with a couple kps, and the second one should get the fight.

    The downside to this, of course, is that you need at least twice the firepower you're comfortable fighting the aliens with to do it, because if the first fleet isn't powerful enough they'll just kill it.

    Thanks! This has actually worked really well. I do usually take about 50% losses and I did have a bit of scare when it looked like an alien dreadnought might actually tank my entire load of missiles, but I have once again cleared orbit of any alien scum.

    I've gone back to using the starting rockets for my defense fleet though because they just have so much more thrust than any of the advanced fission drives I am developing. And like 6 dv is enough if all you need to do is shuttle around low Earth orbit. So after messing around with larger destroyers with advanced drives and laser cannons and as much armor as I could fit, I have gone back to making a swarm of the smallest cheapest possible escort class that is just a mass of missle racks strapped to a giant rocket with no armor to speak of. At least these ones can actually turn and maneuver in combat.

    HamHamJ on
    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
  • Last SonLast Son Registered User regular
    So in my most recent run I decided to try a new strategy. I started out grabbing France and as many of the EU states as I could but instead of unifying them I instead set up developing the crap out of them, by which I mean developing stuff for me. I set everyone to about 10% funding, 10% boost, and 80% mission control, with a little welfare where needed to make sure unrest didn't go above 2.0 and didn't unify anyone until they had completed all of the MC points they could build. It took me until mid 2031 to finish unifying everyone but when I did the EU was an absolute monster.

    I forgot to grab screenshots but the EU produced 1300 science, $400, and about 22 boost per month but the real jackpot was the 210 mission control. Funfact, each unused mission control point gives $10.5 and 3 science per month. I had about 20 MC in use so all that extra MC was giving me an extra 570 science and $2,000 per month beyond the EU's base numbers. About the same time I was finishing up unifying I unlocked mission to the inner planets and tier 2 habs and so set about turning all that sweet cash into science stations around Mercury. By 2033 I was producing 13,000 science per month and I am now flying through the research tree.

    I believe the aliens are going to be in for a rude surprise near the end of the 2030s.

    Mvrcktanni0GiantGeek2020Elvenshae
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    tbloxham wrote: »
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

    It's also very strange to look at places like say, India, which is under the control of the Servants who have it set to full spoils, boost and military. No economy or knowledge at all, and see its economy growing whereas I have my nation's with 3/2/3 in economy, welfare etc and specializing with a couple of pips in military or boost and Indias economy is growing faster than Indonesias (my main nation)

    The game desperately needs history graphs for support, gdp etc and ways to understand WHY things are happening. Like, the EU and the UK both declared war on Australia. Why did they do that. Is it my fault? How can I stop them? Is fermenting a coup really my best plan? That's not a fast strategy there! The EU is under the initiative, who are evil, but the UK is under the "meet the aliens as equals" squad who seem to like me (resistance)

    Another issue is split control of countries. If I'm the resistance, and I have 75% support and three control points in a nation but you have the executive then I should be able to create massive unrest if you use your executive control to make decisions I don't like. Sure, you are in charge, but my control and support should mean that ignoring me means civil war. I made a huge push on China, gathering 75% support and taking control points and then the servants snatched up two points and secured them, giving them executive control. And China is enormous, so taking secured points is really hard. I feel I have the support of the people and much of government, more than enough to stop you doing things I don't like, but I didn't really have any options to stop the servants here.

    Just found out two fun new features. First, you can’t declare a defensive war to help an ally, unless your country has naval access to the country they are at war with. Second, the securing interests mission happens faster than the crackdown mission, so, there’s pretty much now way back vs a large nation with a lost control point other than sabotaging it to the point where natural unrest allows a coup.

    Two massive whiffs on game mechanics.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    I would not want to be basically guaranteed to lose each of my control points every time the secure ran out, so that's actually good. Control points in big nations are still doable it just requires a lot of effort building public support first and spending the influence to boost your chances.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
    Mr RaySeGaTai
  • MonwynMonwyn Apathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime. A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered User regular
    tbloxham wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

    It's also very strange to look at places like say, India, which is under the control of the Servants who have it set to full spoils, boost and military. No economy or knowledge at all, and see its economy growing whereas I have my nation's with 3/2/3 in economy, welfare etc and specializing with a couple of pips in military or boost and Indias economy is growing faster than Indonesias (my main nation)

    The game desperately needs history graphs for support, gdp etc and ways to understand WHY things are happening. Like, the EU and the UK both declared war on Australia. Why did they do that. Is it my fault? How can I stop them? Is fermenting a coup really my best plan? That's not a fast strategy there! The EU is under the initiative, who are evil, but the UK is under the "meet the aliens as equals" squad who seem to like me (resistance)

    Another issue is split control of countries. If I'm the resistance, and I have 75% support and three control points in a nation but you have the executive then I should be able to create massive unrest if you use your executive control to make decisions I don't like. Sure, you are in charge, but my control and support should mean that ignoring me means civil war. I made a huge push on China, gathering 75% support and taking control points and then the servants snatched up two points and secured them, giving them executive control. And China is enormous, so taking secured points is really hard. I feel I have the support of the people and much of government, more than enough to stop you doing things I don't like, but I didn't really have any options to stop the servants here.

    Just found out two fun new features. First, you can’t declare a defensive war to help an ally, unless your country has naval access to the country they are at war with. Second, the securing interests mission happens faster than the crackdown mission, so, there’s pretty much now way back vs a large nation with a lost control point other than sabotaging it to the point where natural unrest allows a coup.

    Two massive whiffs on game mechanics.

    You can crackdown/purge a secured point. Check your counselors' stats; those missions use Espionage and Investigate, and it's labeled which stat is responsible for which mission if you hover over the mission. There are a *ton* of orgs available which boost those so just stack on the relevant counselor, dump some influence into the rolls, and kick them out.

    Both missions are also effected by public approval so keep running campaigns while you try to crackdown.

    uH3IcEi.png
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    Monwyn wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

    It's also very strange to look at places like say, India, which is under the control of the Servants who have it set to full spoils, boost and military. No economy or knowledge at all, and see its economy growing whereas I have my nation's with 3/2/3 in economy, welfare etc and specializing with a couple of pips in military or boost and Indias economy is growing faster than Indonesias (my main nation)

    The game desperately needs history graphs for support, gdp etc and ways to understand WHY things are happening. Like, the EU and the UK both declared war on Australia. Why did they do that. Is it my fault? How can I stop them? Is fermenting a coup really my best plan? That's not a fast strategy there! The EU is under the initiative, who are evil, but the UK is under the "meet the aliens as equals" squad who seem to like me (resistance)

    Another issue is split control of countries. If I'm the resistance, and I have 75% support and three control points in a nation but you have the executive then I should be able to create massive unrest if you use your executive control to make decisions I don't like. Sure, you are in charge, but my control and support should mean that ignoring me means civil war. I made a huge push on China, gathering 75% support and taking control points and then the servants snatched up two points and secured them, giving them executive control. And China is enormous, so taking secured points is really hard. I feel I have the support of the people and much of government, more than enough to stop you doing things I don't like, but I didn't really have any options to stop the servants here.

    Just found out two fun new features. First, you can’t declare a defensive war to help an ally, unless your country has naval access to the country they are at war with. Second, the securing interests mission happens faster than the crackdown mission, so, there’s pretty much now way back vs a large nation with a lost control point other than sabotaging it to the point where natural unrest allows a coup.

    Two massive whiffs on game mechanics.

    You can crackdown/purge a secured point. Check your counselors' stats; those missions use Espionage and Investigate, and it's labeled which stat is responsible for which mission if you hover over the mission. There are a *ton* of orgs available which boost those so just stack on the relevant counselor, dump some influence into the rolls, and kick them out.

    Both missions are also effected by public approval so keep running campaigns while you try to crackdown.

    85% public support, investigate 22. Control of multiple control points in neighboring nations and 3 domestic points. China and India is just too big for the calculations to work. With the population as high as they are, with a protection active you have like an 8% chance to breach it. Everywhere else it just about works, but China and India are pretty broken in the calculations. They should make the public approval boost a function of population, since increasing public opinion is harder in larger nations.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • MonwynMonwyn Apathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime. A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered User regular
    Ah gotcha, my biggest struggle on that front so far has been Germany so I didn't think about the population factor. About to be fighting that fight with the US though so that'll be fun.

    Anecdotally it seems like there's a hidden penalty to CP-related missions if you're over cap or if taking that point would put you over, so if you're devestating a couple small nations for spoils you might want to consider abandoning then until you get the stuff you really want. The AI seems to try to stay pretty close to their own cap so there's a good chance they don't even take them from you.

    uH3IcEi.png
  • Last SonLast Son Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    tbloxham wrote: »
    Monwyn wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    BSoB wrote: »
    My current problem is I have no idea how well I'm doing. Like, I'm not even sure what my current pace is, let alone if it is good enough to win.

    I can look and see some stats compared to the AIs and they seem good. I suppose. I'm not sure I want to spend the next however-many hours figuring out if I have lost or not.

    It really reeeeaaallly doesn't help that the AI will take countries and then abandon them, which leaves their icon on the nation but they aren't getting benefits from it. This leaves the world map a hideously messy splatter of nations the AI groups have and don't have, so it becomes all but impossible to know at a glance where an organization might have focus.

    It's also very strange to look at places like say, India, which is under the control of the Servants who have it set to full spoils, boost and military. No economy or knowledge at all, and see its economy growing whereas I have my nation's with 3/2/3 in economy, welfare etc and specializing with a couple of pips in military or boost and Indias economy is growing faster than Indonesias (my main nation)

    The game desperately needs history graphs for support, gdp etc and ways to understand WHY things are happening. Like, the EU and the UK both declared war on Australia. Why did they do that. Is it my fault? How can I stop them? Is fermenting a coup really my best plan? That's not a fast strategy there! The EU is under the initiative, who are evil, but the UK is under the "meet the aliens as equals" squad who seem to like me (resistance)

    Another issue is split control of countries. If I'm the resistance, and I have 75% support and three control points in a nation but you have the executive then I should be able to create massive unrest if you use your executive control to make decisions I don't like. Sure, you are in charge, but my control and support should mean that ignoring me means civil war. I made a huge push on China, gathering 75% support and taking control points and then the servants snatched up two points and secured them, giving them executive control. And China is enormous, so taking secured points is really hard. I feel I have the support of the people and much of government, more than enough to stop you doing things I don't like, but I didn't really have any options to stop the servants here.

    Just found out two fun new features. First, you can’t declare a defensive war to help an ally, unless your country has naval access to the country they are at war with. Second, the securing interests mission happens faster than the crackdown mission, so, there’s pretty much now way back vs a large nation with a lost control point other than sabotaging it to the point where natural unrest allows a coup.

    Two massive whiffs on game mechanics.

    You can crackdown/purge a secured point. Check your counselors' stats; those missions use Espionage and Investigate, and it's labeled which stat is responsible for which mission if you hover over the mission. There are a *ton* of orgs available which boost those so just stack on the relevant counselor, dump some influence into the rolls, and kick them out.

    Both missions are also effected by public approval so keep running campaigns while you try to crackdown.

    85% public support, investigate 22. Control of multiple control points in neighboring nations and 3 domestic points. China and India is just too big for the calculations to work. With the population as high as they are, with a protection active you have like an 8% chance to breach it. Everywhere else it just about works, but China and India are pretty broken in the calculations. They should make the public approval boost a function of population, since increasing public opinion is harder in larger nations.

    So 3 more investigation and another 5% public support would bring your chance up to ~20% which is certainly doable. Otherwise you can murder/detain the servant's councilors who are capable of doing the 'defend interests' mission when the defense is about to expire, likewise murder/detain councilors who have high administration to lower their defense, or steal their +admin orgs to lower their administration that way. There are also techs that improve your chances of succeeding a crackdown directly as well as techs that increase the amount of influence you can spend to increase your success chances in general.

    edit: Oh, or depending on what their CP usage is like murder their councilors to make them go over their cap which would give you massive bonuses to crackdowns. Murdering your enemies is pretty effective in general really.

    Last Son on
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Protect happens before crackdown, but crackdown also happens before purge. So you can run both a crackdown and purge mission on the same point on the same turn and while the purge will show a very low success chance, it will in practice be much higher if your crackdown succeeds. It may not get you around that population problem, but it's useful in general. Plus, being a dice roll you could always just keep retrying until it succeeds even on low chances if you can afford to have 2 councilors dedicated to it for some time.

    I agree that if they are riding the CP line, detaining or killing their councilors to push them over is a good way to get them to have significant penalties to maintaining control.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • LykouraghLykouragh Registered User regular
    I'm 40 hours into this game and having just a grand time, though the first few hours were really slow.

    What strikes me is how good the writing is; I'm excited to replay as other factions just to see their stories. (Playing as Resistance first).

  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    Edit - Eh, deleted my complaining, its the sort of thing which will be fixed. Its just really counter immersive for me.

    tbloxham on
    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    Important to note that odds are not linear. If you start at 0%, paying the max may only get you to like 3%. But if you start at 3%, paying the max may get you to 30% or more. If you are having trouble with a mission it may help to look at the actual difficulty numbers, not just the odds, to see how much you would need to raise yours or lower theirs to get decent odds.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
    Mr Ray
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    Yeah, that was the part which frustrated me about the protection being faster than crackdown. I dilligently waited, biding my time and building massive support. I defended my own points, and got my best woman as ready as she could be to attack with the right orgs buffing her. The clock was ticking, as the Chinese army was already loaded onto the boat heading to Australia. I even made sure to protect her, and try to arrest a few enemy agents in the week leading up to the move. Then their protection fell, and I moved in and invested 64 influence into the attack, increasing her chances from 30% to 75%. A tough roll, but, I was confident. And then the protection just went back up before I could do anything. She rolled a 29, which wasn't enough vs the enemy protected point.

    I guess what I'd say is that maybe they need a 'disrupt' action, where you can deploy your own person using like Operations or something as a resource to disrupt enemy actions like protect or set government policy.

    tbloxham on
    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • SeGaTaiSeGaTai Registered User regular
    It's worth keeping in mind how unfun it might be - or ppl think it would be having to defend from the AI using whatever disrupt action you'd consider adding to the game. There is a reason the no control space asset mod is so popular

    PSN SeGaTai
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    SeGaTai wrote: »
    It's worth keeping in mind how unfun it might be - or ppl think it would be having to defend from the AI using whatever disrupt action you'd consider adding to the game. There is a reason the no control space asset mod is so popular

    Disrupt would be a waste of a team member turn, and a function of command and support. And all ot does is prevent you using a resource. I think it would be inherently balanced. It also plays nicely into the other agents. If you think your opponent will disrupt, then don't use the protect, have your person surveil instead and then assassinate the disrupting agent.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • Last SonLast Son Registered User regular
    Detain already does that though, detain the enemy agent the turn before the defense ends and they'll be in jail(and unable to assign a mission) on the turn the point is vulnerable and you can crackdown.

  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    edited October 2022
    You might also try detaining / assassinating the owning faction's high Administration councillors; they don't apply their stats to the faction's CP limit while imprisoned (or dead), and pushing them over the CP limit might give you the boost you need.

    China is always rough no matter what though; I was only able to take it by maxing out PR and then taking 8% shots over and over until they succeeded. Note also that you don't necessarily have to take a nation's CPs in order; you can click the CP in the nation pane to go for a different one instead. I.e, you might want to take the "Mass Media" point of a nation first, as it usually gives you a bonus to taking other points.

    Mr Ray on
  • tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    Last Son wrote: »
    Detain already does that though, detain the enemy agent the turn before the defense ends and they'll be in jail(and unable to assign a mission) on the turn the point is vulnerable and you can crackdown.

    Protect is an incredibly common action, I have 4 councilors with it. I've seen at least three Servants councilors with it, and despite two team members running an investigate/assassinate squad the last 5 months I've only killed 2 and imprisoned 1 of their team.

    Detain is specific, track down an elite agent with strong skills and remove them. The protect action doesn't even require a roll. It just happens, often without their agent even being visible.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
  • GarthorGarthor Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    The game seriously suffers from trying to cram everything into the bi-monthly "everybody does One Thing and it either succeeds or fails". If instead of a 10% chance in half a month, it was guaranteed but the difficulty makes it take six months, everything would be much more palatable. Especially the stupid task of trying to use surveil to find enemy counselors.

    Garthor on
    Dignified Pauper
  • HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    Well now, I just took a moment to scan the solar system and saw that there is a mothership on it's way to Earth.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
    Elvenshae
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