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[Victoria 3] Party Like It's 1836

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    We have confirmation that 1.1 is going to revise by far the biggest ahistorical bug in the game now -- the notion that trickle down economics actually works:

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    CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    That's good, because I'm tired of building things in extremely high demand only to find that no one wants to work there no matter what I fiddle with.

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    ED!ED! Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    Fiatil wrote: »
    We have confirmation that 1.1 is going to revise by far the biggest ahistorical bug in the game now -- the notion that trickle down economics actually works:

    If this change means what I think it means, then this will help keep not only SoL low, but stop the input-goods bottleneck where folks just REFUSE to leave factory jobs because they pay so much (because of course they do you're making something that is used in everything).

    . . .but I know nothing about economics so probably not.

    ED! on
    "Get the hell out of me" - [ex]girlfriend
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    chrisnlchrisnl Registered User regular
    It will definitely make stuff like minimum wage laws actually matter, which is good. It might also supercharge the investment pool with the right laws and institutions, as the capitalists should have a ton more money if they aren't paying high worker wages. That one change is going to have a pretty massive impact, and I do worry about the resulting unrest levels if they don't make adjustments elsewhere. An experienced player could probably figure out ways to handle it, but new players and the AI might struggle.

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    SLyMSLyM Registered User regular
    So I don't know if this is common knowledge or not, but your interest rate is tied to your prestige ranking. An unrecognized power has an interest rate of 40%, while a great power has one of 10% (before technology). So running a deficit to build up your nation is better if you're Britain than Brunei.

    My friend is working on a roguelike game you can play if you want to. (It has free demo)
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    chrisnlchrisnl Registered User regular
    So basically the rich get richer. Damn this game is too accurate sometimes.

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    CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    "You can get a loan if you don't need it."

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    PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Has always been true

    MiaM-55-Visualizing-Interest-Rates-by-Country-2022-Apr-20-1.jpeg

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    We've got a date -- December 5th -- and patch notes for 1.10.

    Some good stuff in there for sure -- it's neat that they gave shoutouts to the various UI mods that they're more or less incorporating into the game in 1.10 too.

    I'll admit my current #1 concern is prooobably the late game performance now -- it is not good right now. It's using 60% of my processor, 30% of my GPU, and 14+ gigs of ram in late game, but I still have overhead in all areas and it chugs very hard once the pop counts get high. There are mods that help, but they're very brute force "force pops to assimilate and remove religions" type stuff to decrease the variety of pops being tracked late game.

    Edit: It's not in the patchnotes but the dev in the patch thread claims they've made more performance improvements for 1.1, so that is good.

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    SLyMSLyM Registered User regular
    - Korean officers now wear clothes
    - The Ripper can no longer be a child or toddler
    I love paradox patch notes

    My friend is working on a roguelike game you can play if you want to. (It has free demo)
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    SLyMSLyM Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    Speaking of, here's a gem from over on the Hearts of Iron notes I enjoyed
    - AI now puts more weight on advisor competence rather than advisor cheapness, contrary to modern business practices.

    SLyM on
    My friend is working on a roguelike game you can play if you want to. (It has free demo)
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    Behold the horrible border crimes of my current Sikh (now Punjab) run:

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    Basically the East India Company seceded from Great Britain (jackpot!), and GB is the direct overlord of that mess of provinces in India. I annexed the EIC but haven't messed with GB just yet (that's the next step for the achievement), and the result is the chaos you see above.

    It's been a surprisingly fun run though. It's more dynamic than I was expecting -- you start with a strong army, terrible economy, lots of weak neighbors, and one big angry neighbor in the East India Company. It's definitely a high wire act of balancing your military budget with your economy, while still having enough troops to fend off the EIC when they come knocking.

    Fiatil on
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    New patch is live!

    Unfortunately...maybe with some gamebreaking bugs. The report right now is that all capitalists are politically inactive, which is huuuuge. Essentially no industrialist party now -- definitely needs a hotfix.

    Looks like they just forgot a line of code. Paradox QA continues to do its thing -- modders to the rescue!

    Fiatil on
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    If anyone else is still playing this, patch 1.1.2 is out!

    It's been....a very frustrating journey of patches so far.

    1.1 introduced the new legitimacy system, which was a good idea! It was comically broken from the start unfortunately. We had the "capitalists are politically inactive" bug that took 3 days to hotfix (it was 1 line of missing code in a text file), but it was hotfixed with 1.1.1

    But by the time 1.1.1 rolled around, it was apparent there were at least two major issues with patch 1.1 and 1.1.1:

    1) The game ran worse with 1.1 than 1.06. Whatever they did to slightly improve performance in 1.06 was reverted or they broke something else. So game slows to a complete crawl by 1880-1890, and is painful to play.

    2) The new legitimacy system was completely busted. It not only was nonsensical (you could achieve 100% legitimacy by just putting every interest group in government), but it was technically broken. There was a cache issue that caused your legitimacy to revert to 0 every time you load a save. This caused the AI to be completely unable to form functional governments, and players having to reform their government every time they load a save to fix the cache issue. This was left outstanding for 10 days before being fixed today.

    All that being said, I reverted to 1.06 because the patches have just made the game worse so far. There are some good changes -- AI is getting a bit better, notifications are less of an insane mess -- but the performance was so bad even on good PCs that it was not worth the price of updating. I'm going to wait for feedback on 1.1.2 before trying again, because they've managed to break a major system and/or worsen performance in every patch so far.

    My unfortunate conclusion is what I was worried about from the start -- Paradox has designed another game with a pop system their engine cannot handle. It's worse than I've ever seen it with Stellaris -- you get about 50 years into a theoretically 100 year game and it gets noticeably slow, and reaaally bad by 1900. My reason for concern is that this is with the AI being pretty bad. If Paradox gets the AI to be better at building more stuff....that's just going to make performance worse. The performance is very bad, and it's only this "good" because the AI is still overall very bad at teching up. I don't see a magic bullet fix for this one, but damn I hope I'm wrong. Even version 1.06 had very bad performance -- they need to improve it pretty drastically from that version for it to be a functional game past year 60 or so. This post and discussion further confirms that it's the pop fragmentation -- mods that reduce pop variety improve performance very noticeably.

    Fiatil on
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    chrisnlchrisnl Registered User regular
    I do want to play this game more, but I'm holding off for the moment due to reports of issues with the recent patches. It's a shame, because I really have enjoyed the game so far, but with the performance tanking even more that's a pretty big no.

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    ED!ED! Registered User regular
    I knew something wacky was going on with Legitimacy. I didn't get the "Hey everyone, get in here!" bug with government at first, but eventually I managed to get Legit to 90-something including EVERYONE in government (had to do it in a certain order).

    "Get the hell out of me" - [ex]girlfriend
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    Yeah as always I only complain about the patches because it's a super appealing game at its core and one that I've enjoyed in large part. The smart idea is definitely just to wait and play something else until they fix it -- the devs are about to go on holiday, and the pace of fixes has been relatively slow with a bit of one step forward two steps back going on. One of the devs on the forums admitted that they prooobably should have held off on the legitimacy changes to fix some more core systems -- nice to acknowledge at least.

    All of this performance talk and how it's tied to pop variety finally lead me to an unexpected place -- this AD 1648 mod:

    ?imw=5000&imh=5000&ima=fit&impolicy=Letterbox&imcolor=#000000&letterbox=false

    I'm not sure if it was intentional, but I'd heard rumors and it apparently it's true -- this mod has fixed the performance issues. It runs amazingly well -- we're talking weeks taking half as long from day one zippy fast. I knew something was dramatically different because I had an event time out for the first time before I could react to it -- it runs night and day better than the base game.

    It's a total conversion mod that moves the start date to AD 1648. It's actually incredibly impressive from that perspective -- it adds a gigantic tech tree and adds a decent amount of mechanical complexity over the base game to represent it being 1648. The "runs dramatically better" is probably just a happy coincidence -- my guess is the guy just didn't want to design 800 different subcultures for his total conversion mod -- so you have much less pop variety, and the game just runs so much better as a result.

    So umm, there sort of is a magic bullet fix for the performance issues. It's just not one that I think Paradox can do -- there area too many subcultures in the game right now. The general consensus is that the game basically has to perform calculations once for each pop group -- if your country has 1 it does the computations once, if 2 it does them twice, so on and so on.

    At the end of the day Paradox has an expectation with their games, and I don't think they can get away with "let's just combine all of the subcultures on the British Isles and call everyone there 'British' instead of irish/scottish/english/etc. to improve performance"

    But....that is the solution. Or something similar. They have way too much pop complexity right now -- it's completely destroying the performance of their game. You can look at mods that reduce complexity and it's night and day obvious -- that 1648 mod runs so much better that it's uncanny. The devs are aware of this on some level -- the 1.06 performance improvement was about getting pop types to merge more quickly.

    It does just raise the question of -- what the hell was this development process? I like having the granular pop stuff, but at some point someone internally had to observe that it was tanking the engine performance dramatically. If they added a pop up box "Would you like to dramatically reduce population variety to double/triple your performance?" though, I'm taking it every time. It's some really extreme form over function stuff, though it obviously impacts game systems as well.

    TL;DR -- I am now using a custom version of that 1648 mod with the additional tech tree stuff and mechanics stripped out to be able to play a functional version of the game. Obviously it's historically weird as hell -- you wind up with 1800s tech in the 1600s and the political map of that time period as well -- but from a gameplay perspective it is substantially more enjoyable than the base game due to how well it runs. You can play for over 100 years and it still runs pretty well! If anyone else is interested let me know and I can upload a copy to use.

    Fiatil on
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    Kane Red RobeKane Red Robe Master of Magic ArcanusRegistered User regular
    Yeah but imagine the outrage if the Sorbians were lumped in game with the Silesians, my immersion would be ruined!

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    scherbchenscherbchen Asgard (it is dead)Registered User regular
    oh I am so over the Sorbians at this point. fuck ´em.

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    Void SlayerVoid Slayer Very Suspicious Registered User regular
    Couldnt they lump pops similar enough together on the back end then do a detailed pop by pop analysis every once in a while and redo the lump togethers.

    You could even look at traits like not drinking alchohol and say instead of processing each pop say we got 50 pops that have 75% of the wine need or whatever.

    It just seems like there are ways to keep it detailed but not check the detail every single week or day or whatever. Maybe also cut down on the truly small pops like the 1 Dixie animist and the 1 Dixie Buddhist and the 1 Dixie catholic and the 1 yankee animist and 1 yankee buddhist and so in.

    He's a shy overambitious dog-catcher on the wrong side of the law. She's an orphaned psychic mercenary with the power to bend men's minds. They fight crime!
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    PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    When I move on from my current job I have legitimately considered applying at Paradox with "I like making things fast, let me make your engines fast."

    They're not crunching an absurd amount of data, hell offload it to the GPU and run a compute shader if needed

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    HamHamJHamHamJ Registered User regular
    They posted a dev diary with like prototypes and the top entry is more stuff showing on the map and it really brings me back to asking if people actually zoom in enough to see any of that? I know I didn't for like my entire first playthrough and once I knew there was actually stuff there I did spend some time just looking around the map but it really isn't meaningfully integrated into the actual mechanics of the game most of which involve looking at various visualization maps.

    While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
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    Kane Red RobeKane Red Robe Master of Magic ArcanusRegistered User regular
    HamHamJ wrote: »
    They posted a dev diary with like prototypes and the top entry is more stuff showing on the map and it really brings me back to asking if people actually zoom in enough to see any of that? I know I didn't for like my entire first playthrough and once I knew there was actually stuff there I did spend some time just looking around the map but it really isn't meaningfully integrated into the actual mechanics of the game most of which involve looking at various visualization maps.

    I felt that way about CK3s dynamic people models as well. I can't recall "more graphical fidelity" ever being requested by the Paradox fan base but they sure seem to think it's a big deal.

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    Void SlayerVoid Slayer Very Suspicious Registered User regular
    I zoomed in once late game! Crashed the damn game while it was chugging along trying to process american kenya with 56 diffrent pops in 14 diffrent industries.

    It is neat you can actually see it developing and makes more sense in a smaller nation, but it really isnt the thing they should be focusing on.

    Most of the same catagory of buildings look the same right now anyway.

    He's a shy overambitious dog-catcher on the wrong side of the law. She's an orphaned psychic mercenary with the power to bend men's minds. They fight crime!
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited December 2022
    Yeah I honestly love that eventually you have zeppelins and trains on the map but uhh...in 130 hours I've probably spent roughly 1 minute actually looking at that. The game needs several major patches to fix what's there already before we worry about touching that stuff at all.

    Ironically most of my time looking at the zeppelins has been late game because they're an obvious visual indicator that "oh hey it's 1910 so the game is running at 7 fps now as demonstrated by the zeppelins moving incredibly slowly"

    Fiatil on
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    Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    Couldnt they lump pops similar enough together on the back end then do a detailed pop by pop analysis every once in a while and redo the lump togethers.

    You could even look at traits like not drinking alchohol and say instead of processing each pop say we got 50 pops that have 75% of the wine need or whatever.

    It just seems like there are ways to keep it detailed but not check the detail every single week or day or whatever. Maybe also cut down on the truly small pops like the 1 Dixie animist and the 1 Dixie Buddhist and the 1 Dixie catholic and the 1 yankee animist and 1 yankee buddhist and so in.

    But if you don’t have dixie animists and yankee buddhists how do you model the 5 unemployed hippie post-undergrads that live in a trailer in my neighbor’s backyard?

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    The only notable update is that it appears we have another hilariously simple mod that gives tremendous performance boosts: a new mod that fixes the massive FPS drops and interface lag you get late game with lots of construction. It did it by....removing the tiny little pictures of buildings in your queue that show up in the top right:

    49vslvq9kv9z.png

    I managed to break the spell and stop playing this a couple of weeks ago -- it is fun for 50-60 years then I get to watch it painfully slow to a crawl and become unplayable once I get to the fun high tech stuff. A unique and good game with fatal flaws -- my biggest weakness. But yeah, it's biggest crime is performance and I honestly can't remember the last time I've seen a game released in such a technically poor state as far as just framerate is concerned. My VR rig built in 2019 is helpless after the first half of the game, and it appears to apply to people with the fanciest new setups as well.

    I wanted to say it's just the pop diversity -- nope. That plays a key, but it's several factors. If you eliminate pop diversity, it gets better but still is bad by the end game. It's pop diversity, number of buildings built, and whatever weirdness is going on with the construction queue. It's just a total mess. I'm curious to see how this mod feeds into the late game "too many buildings" lag, as it was at least partially related but not entirely.

    I've seen people in other places talk about it being because the players are just min/maxing too hard....but like, this is grand strategy/4X stuff 101. It's a game about building a fancy economy and teching up -- if you're not at war, you invest in construction knowing it will boom you into the mid and late game as long as you're not conquered by a militarily more powerful nation. That's every 4X or grand strategy game I've ever played. I've long since stopped getting absurd numbers of construction -- I cap myself knowing performance will tank and it's just unnecessary -- but it still breaks the game even having a modestly strong economy.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Paradox put out the first dev diary about a week ago for 1.2. As always, it sounds like a neat feature but hopefully they can fix the existing game too. The follow-up post with responses to fan questions does at least mention they consider performance to be a high priority issue for 1.2, and they say they have several people working on it full time. Prooobably won't be seeing a patch until mid February though, so I guess we'll find out.

    I was poking around the forums to see the current state of the game and if any interesting performance mods have come out, and it sounds like the community has reached something of a conclusion on a major reason why the AI is bad. It appears the AI builds lots of ports when times are good, and when the economy gets a bit of a crunch they just start deleting all of their ports, sometimes rebuilding them then deleting them again. This of course causes their entire economy to spiral out of control as deleting ports to save maintenance is a terrible terrible idea, because it will lower market access and that is worth more than the maintenance cost. It's one of the reasons Austria does so well (not very many port slots) and Great Britain does not.

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    WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    Fiatil wrote: »
    I was poking around the forums to see the current state of the game and if any interesting performance mods have come out, and it sounds like the community has reached something of a conclusion on a major reason why the AI is bad. It appears the AI builds lots of ports when times are good, and when the economy gets a bit of a crunch they just start deleting all of their ports, sometimes rebuilding them then deleting them again. This of course causes their entire economy to spiral out of control as deleting ports to save maintenance is a terrible terrible idea, because it will lower market access and that is worth more than the maintenance cost. It's one of the reasons Austria does so well (not very many port slots) and Great Britain does not.

    I'm not surprised the AI screws up its own economy. The economy is tricky enough for a player to wrap their mind around, the AI doesn't stand a chance.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited January 2023
    Fiatil wrote: »
    I was poking around the forums to see the current state of the game and if any interesting performance mods have come out, and it sounds like the community has reached something of a conclusion on a major reason why the AI is bad. It appears the AI builds lots of ports when times are good, and when the economy gets a bit of a crunch they just start deleting all of their ports, sometimes rebuilding them then deleting them again. This of course causes their entire economy to spiral out of control as deleting ports to save maintenance is a terrible terrible idea, because it will lower market access and that is worth more than the maintenance cost. It's one of the reasons Austria does so well (not very many port slots) and Great Britain does not.

    I'm not surprised the AI screws up its own economy. The economy is tricky enough for a player to wrap their mind around, the AI doesn't stand a chance.

    Heh well it is worth mentioning that Anbeeld's AI mod totally understands the economy, isn't particularly performance intensive as far as the scripts go, and doesn't do any sort of cheating stuff to accomplish it unless you opt in to increase the difficulty. It's been out for 3 months and fully functional the entire time.

    The reason it's not a solution is that.....the current game engine can't handle the AI understanding the economy and playing anything like a player. It causes performance issues due to the AI actually building buildings like it's theoretically supposed to. More buildings in Victoria 3 causes more simulation lag in very drastic ways.

    The port thing is just something the AI flat out should not be doing -- it's not a misunderstanding of their particular economic situation, it's a completely misunderstanding of "ports give value vastly in excess of their maintenance cost if market access is not 100%". They're doing the opposite of what they should be doing, and then getting trapped in a loop.

    Really, the basics of the economy in this game are incredibly simple. There's absolutely no reason the AI should struggle with it to the degree it does.

    All you have to do to have a really good economy is open your market tab, and sort by the most overpriced good. Get more of that good. Produce it if you can, trade for it if you can't (the trade part is only difficult because the AI is bad at making buildings and are thus unreliable trade partners for exotic goods in particular). If that building needs other goods to make said good....well you make more of the building that makes the input good. That step is even baked into step 1, because lack of a supply of good shows up as an overpriced good in the market tab.

    Beyond that, you make sure your provinces have 100% market access with ports and rails. That's it. I'm not a programmer, but I've modded the game enough to see that it's not very hard to use their scripting language to have the AI prioritize those two buildings if market access <100 (and a mod exists that does exactly this). You can be incredibly effective at the entire game by doing that over and over again -- open market tab, look for overpriced goods, make more of that good. Yeah there are ways to kick it up even more, but you can get a ridiculously overtuned economy that easily surpasses the AI every single time by doing that (unless you're playing as a super super small nation), and with a dash of building more construction buildings when you have positive income. It's the strategy I used in my first game ever as Japan, and it works every time. There are political laws you can pass to unlock even more money to be even better at doing that, but it's an incredibly simple supply/demand system.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    I am happy Paradox is learning from their mistakes in small ways at least -- they announced that 1.2 will launch as an open beta first, which is a very good idea given the issues with the prior patches:

    s1irajpjaimu.png

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    Open beta for patch 1.2 on February 8th, wooh.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    Beta patch out!

    Incredibly early reports on performance are very positive. Won't know for sure until someone gets later game, but a very encouraging video showing early game being quite a bit speedier on the Sim time.

    Of course I went and got addicted to an MMO I hadn't played in 18 years, so not sure if I'll have time to mess with it after work. Soon though!

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited March 2023
    1.2 is out on Monday!

    The change long is mega huge; if you're curious it's in the linked dev post.

    I haven't taken a game all the way to the end in the open beta yet, but the most recent open beta definitely brings a lot of really good changes and additions to the game.

    I tentatively will say that this is probably what version 1.0 should have been. I think performance could still be better late game, but it's no longer a complete travesty like it was in the last version. Most of the big ticket wacky issues have been addressed -- trade routes aren't free arbitrage money anymore (the price computation has been fixed), the battle system is much less insane, fronts don't split into 100 tiny unmanned sub fronts, the New World has been given significantly more arable land with Asia's reduced (California previously had substantially less arable land than Ireland), and mass migrations are now tied to ethnic group + country of origin, so you don't wind up with bizarre situations (such as your German state is a paradise, but the neighboring German state lives in squalor causing both your very wealthy free healthcare Germans and their very poor Germans to migrate to Kenya.)

    The big ticket item is that they've given an option to pretty significantly overhaul how you construct your economy -- a private investment pool with private construction that is not directly controlled by the player. It's a toggle when you start, so the old option is still available. But it does add a lot of flavor to the various economy laws that was lacking -- Command Economy now abolishes the private investment pool entirely and gives you 100% control over construction, whereas Laissez Faire has tons of private construction and private investment. It actually feels like a more hands off system, which makes sense!

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    WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    edited March 2023
    Ah, the patch is out.

    I should get back to this game. Once I've looked up some tutorials to refresh my memory of how it actually works.

    WotanAnubis on
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    PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Prior to the 1960s Ireland had 57000 sq km of agricultural land, presumably that would have been pretty steady more or less for centuries
    California in 1859 had 32000 sq km

    It wasn't until the mid 1850s that it was even a net exporter

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited March 2023
    Phyphor wrote: »
    Prior to the 1960s Ireland had 57000 sq km of agricultural land, presumably that would have been pretty steady more or less for centuries
    California in 1859 had 32000 sq km

    It wasn't until the mid 1850s that it was even a net exporter

    Right, and this game stretches until 1936. Before the patch, California was hard capped at ~1840 levels of agriculture for the entire game.

    Their previous system tied "arable land" 100% to "population in the area in 1836". It created a bunch of wacky situations that were completely ahistorical, particularly as you got later in the game.

    Good news though, they fixed it! They realized that capping agricultural capacity in 1936 based on the population of an area in 1836 is a really bad system. Arable land in this game is the potential capacity for agricultural growth, not the current amount of agricultural development in a given time period. California should start out undeveloped but with massive potential, and now it does. It was a huge change too! Most of South/East Asia was cut in half, and lots of the new world doubled or more. Brazil is probably crazy good now -- they were fun to play before, and now have about twice as much arable land.

    That aside, I think the patch is really good so far! I spent more time with the latest open beta over the weekend -- there are some tweaks in the final version but mostly just bugfixes.

    I'm really digging the private investment system. I was a bit worried about it giving you less stuff to do, buuut late game becomes constantly spamming buildings to use your construction capacity, and it's great to have some help on that end. Still plenty to do, but the economic systems feel much more alive. The investment pool previously was sort of a weird system as well -- sort of just a separate piggy bank behind your government budget -- and now it feels like its own thing that you need to poke and prod in various ways to get the full benefit from. It really does feel like a much better game now; the private investment system alone is such a big feature that I'm sure they wanted it in for release, and the performance improvements are huge as well.

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    WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    It's seriously breaking my brain that it seems like I can actually make money by importing the goods I need to support my industry. This goes against every instinct I've developed playing city builders.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited March 2023
    Yeah, the trade system is like, super useful now.

    It's great! It felt like the only option before was full on vertical integration or die, which made teching up to fancier technology and rare resources a pain. But you can actually be a small specialist country fairly reliably now, and the rarer resources are more accessible without having to go conquer Vietnam and develop them yourself in every run. They also made the intermediate military "healing" production method only require alcohol and cloth instead of opium, which is great.

    The AI is also substantially more competitive now. It felt like by 1880 the game was over and I would leave everyone's GDP in the dust before, but the majors can get scary in 1.2! I've seen Russia with pretty much all of Asia in their market with 800+ divisions of troops, and the UK and France get really nasty too. The U.S. routinely expands and actually succeeds in manifest destiny...it's a night and day difference.

    Fiatil on
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    chrisnlchrisnl Registered User regular
    I need to put some more time into this game now that it's had a couple patches. I've done a Sweden into Scandinavia run and a Prussia into Germany run. I may give Russia a try, or maybe the USA or France. I don't really have the desire to try an unrecognized country right now, it doesn't sound like the system to claw your way out of that status is really satisfactory yet. I'll probably try the USA though, even if it is probably still too easy to avoid the US Civil War.

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