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[Hiberno-Britannic Politics] - This Place Is Not A Place Of Honour

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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    I am concerned that No Drama Just Starmer isn't extremely vocal on how he intends to reverse all this shit. Stop trying to woo Tory voters Starmer, it's never going to happen.
    It's more likely he's been told that confrontationalism doesn't play well with the swing voters. Stop listening to these advisors Starmer! I want a firebrand that tells me he's passionate about X. Not a mild mannered accountant.

    Voters also generally don't respond to "I'm going to reverse all the bad things the last guy did". They tend to want to know "what you are gonna do instead".

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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    Mc zany wrote: »
    I am concerned that No Drama Just Starmer isn't extremely vocal on how he intends to reverse all this shit. Stop trying to woo Tory voters Starmer, it's never going to happen.

    Corbyn saying that he was gonna fix things is the main reason the tories have a latge majority. Starmer is playing the long game, doing anything else will allow the media the demonise him and distract from the issues the tories are facing. So far it is working.

    corbyn was merely the most visible symptom of the unbelievable weakness of the labour party for a very long time, much of which they still have and are merely benefitting from some truly pigfucking levels of incompetence on the tories part. anything trying to really dig in and singlehandedly blame him for the situation is either naive "the labour party cannot be failed" shit or playing into right-wing news "blame the figurehead" cycles.

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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    GB News are turning up on my Youtube news column and they had Nigel Farage as their thumbnail talking about Zelenskyy. That's annoying, it's an easy way to get clicks and therefore clout.

    RMS Oceanic on
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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Mc zany wrote: »
    I am concerned that No Drama Just Starmer isn't extremely vocal on how he intends to reverse all this shit. Stop trying to woo Tory voters Starmer, it's never going to happen.

    Corbyn saying that he was gonna fix things is the main reason the tories have a latge majority. Starmer is playing the long game, doing anything else will allow the media the demonise him and distract from the issues the tories are facing. So far it is working.

    corbyn was merely the most visible symptom of the unbelievable weakness of the labour party for a very long time, much of which they still have and are merely benefitting from some truly pigfucking levels of incompetence on the tories part. anything trying to really dig in and singlehandedly blame him for the situation is either naive "the labour party cannot be failed" shit or playing into right-wing news "blame the figurehead" cycles.

    I don’t know. The staggering level of idiocy that corbyn has had and continues to have with his policy discussions, proposals, and statements is pretty ridiculous. That isn’t to say the rest of labour is perfect but this man just went and talked to a journalist about how the UK shouldn’t supply Ukraine with weapons because they could potentially attack Russia.

    He keeps sabotaging things and he isn’t even in charge! He is frankly too principled for politics. There is no thing he will bend on. No position he will take that would give him power if he has to so much as keep his mouth shut about his deeply held beliefs. Which are both shitty and out of line with the greater British electorate.



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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Mc zany wrote: »
    I am concerned that No Drama Just Starmer isn't extremely vocal on how he intends to reverse all this shit. Stop trying to woo Tory voters Starmer, it's never going to happen.

    Corbyn saying that he was gonna fix things is the main reason the tories have a latge majority. Starmer is playing the long game, doing anything else will allow the media the demonise him and distract from the issues the tories are facing. So far it is working.

    corbyn was merely the most visible symptom of the unbelievable weakness of the labour party for a very long time, much of which they still have and are merely benefitting from some truly pigfucking levels of incompetence on the tories part. anything trying to really dig in and singlehandedly blame him for the situation is either naive "the labour party cannot be failed" shit or playing into right-wing news "blame the figurehead" cycles.

    I don’t know. The staggering level of idiocy that corbyn has had and continues to have with his policy discussions, proposals, and statements is pretty ridiculous. That isn’t to say the rest of labour is perfect but this man just went and talked to a journalist about how the UK shouldn’t supply Ukraine with weapons because they could potentially attack Russia.

    He keeps sabotaging things and he isn’t even in charge! He is frankly too principled for politics. There is no thing he will bend on. No position he will take that would give him power if he has to so much as keep his mouth shut about his deeply held beliefs. Which are both shitty and out of line with the greater British electorate.

    Yeah. Let's not pretend Corbyn isn't a very shitty politician who's incompetence as Labour leader wasn't one of the big issues with his time in power.

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    ArchangleArchangle Registered User regular
    Honestly, it would have been a lot easier if Corbyn had accepted the result of the No Confidence vote

    Yes, it's completely within the rules to put the matter to a general party vote, but when 197 out of the 237 members who have been elected to represent your party think you're not fit to lead, you should probably take the hint and not pull a Principal Skinner meme.

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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    On the other hand, while you don't interrupt an opponent making a mistake, Starmer needs to stake out something. I realize it's incredibly difficult to get through the noise of the Tories being awful, but simply being the sensible option is not enough.

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    RazielMortemRazielMortem Registered User regular
    While I understand Starmers "when the enemy is dickpunching themselves, leave them to it", the sad fact is when the GE starts, there will be some stupid bacon sandwich item the press find. There always is and they always somehow equate this to 12 years of Tory mismanagement.

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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Speaking of tories dickpunching themselves, do we have to leave them to it? Because I would gladly volunteeer to do the dickpunching for this guy:
    New deputy Tory chairman Lee Anderson clashes with radio presenter
    The Ashfield MP made headlines last year for saying people needed to learn how to cook and budget "properly", rather than use food banks.
    He argued there was "not this massive use for food banks in this country", and those who knew how to cook and budget could make meals for 30p a day.

    ---

    In 2019, Mr Anderson, while out with journalist Michael Crick, takes a phone call on the campaign trail.
    The MP returns to Crick to say the call related to a number of leaflets that had arrived at his house.
    But a microphone picks up Mr Anderson telling a voter not to tell the film crew he is a friend when they knock on his door.
    "There is a worry by some that you might be a bit dishonest," Cowley says.
    "I'm talking about that video that you did where you asked a friend to pose as an anti-Labour swing voter."
    Mr Anderson then asks Cowley if she has ever told a lie a number of times.
    "I've never asked somebody to pretend to be something they're not just to further my campaign," Cowley adds.

    ---

    Elsewhere, The Spectator has published an interview with Mr Anderson in which he expresses support for reintroducing the death penalty arguing "nobody has ever committed a crime after being executed".
    For anyone wondering, the bolded was when I felt an overpowering desire to punch this guy in the dick.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    AldoAldo Hippo Hooray Registered User regular
    Look and if you kill 'em before they commit any crimes you've solved the whole situation right out the gate.

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    daveNYCdaveNYC Why universe hate Waspinator? Registered User regular
    While I understand Starmers "when the enemy is dickpunching themselves, leave them to it", the sad fact is when the GE starts, there will be some stupid bacon sandwich item the press find. There always is and they always somehow equate this to 12 years of Tory mismanagement.

    That's because a lot of the bad stuff that the Tories did were the fault of Labour. For reasons. Yes I know how the UK parliamentary system works, why do you ask?

    Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Aldo wrote: »
    Look and if you kill 'em before they commit any crimes you've solved the whole situation right out the gate.

    Ah, the Judge Rico theory. "The innocent exist only until they inevitably become perpetrators. Guilt and innocence is a matter of timing."

    (I rewatched Stallone's Judge Dredd the other night, so that one is fresh in the memory.)

    This is one of those occasions where I wonder if these people would understand that Rico is the bad guy. Probably not, when Boris Johnson apparently thinks the mayor of Amity Island is the hero of Jaws.

    Jazz on
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    RazielMortemRazielMortem Registered User regular
    Our institutions may be collapsing, our country near to ruin, but by jove the British capacity for satire will survive until the very end.

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    NorgothNorgoth cardiffRegistered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Bogart wrote: »

    Six tweets. Six tweets before someone complained about 2000ad being political. Amazing. Satire truly is dead.

    Norgoth on
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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Stormont election deadline delayed by a year
    The government will delay the requirement for forming an executive and holding an assembly election in Northern Ireland for another year.

    The secretary of state is introducing legislation that will push the timetable back to 18 January 2024.

    Chris Heaton-Harris has already previously delayed the legal duty on him.

    He is due to inform the Stormont parties about the plan when he holds all-party talks with them later.

    In a written update to Parliament, he said the bill would provide for a "single retrospective extension of the executive formation period for one year".

    "That would mean that, if the parties are unable to form an executive before 19 January 2024, I would again fall under a duty to hold an assembly election within 12 weeks.

    "The legislation will also enable the government to bring this new period to an early end and move to elections sooner, if necessary."
    I don't live there so someone tell me; what is it that makes having an election such a terrible prospect?

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    japanjapan Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    klemming wrote: »
    Stormont election deadline delayed by a year
    The government will delay the requirement for forming an executive and holding an assembly election in Northern Ireland for another year.

    The secretary of state is introducing legislation that will push the timetable back to 18 January 2024.

    Chris Heaton-Harris has already previously delayed the legal duty on him.

    He is due to inform the Stormont parties about the plan when he holds all-party talks with them later.

    In a written update to Parliament, he said the bill would provide for a "single retrospective extension of the executive formation period for one year".

    "That would mean that, if the parties are unable to form an executive before 19 January 2024, I would again fall under a duty to hold an assembly election within 12 weeks.

    "The legislation will also enable the government to bring this new period to an early end and move to elections sooner, if necessary."
    I don't live there so someone tell me; what is it that makes having an election such a terrible prospect?

    There's already been one and the parties can't come to an agreement on how to form a government, which is why direct rule has been imposed

    Another election wouldn't necessarily produce a different result

    Edit: That is, it's not that it's a terrible prospect, it's that it's unlikely to deliver any progress on the issue of forming a government

    japan on
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    Bad-BeatBad-Beat Registered User regular
    So if the new Department created in this week's reshuffle is the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero (DESNZ) are we meant to pronounce it Deez Nuts?

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    jmcdonaldjmcdonald I voted, did you? DC(ish)Registered User regular
    Bad-Beat wrote: »
    So if the new Department created in this week's reshuffle is the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero (DESNZ) are we meant to pronounce it Deez Nuts?

    i mean...we are now

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    RazielMortemRazielMortem Registered User regular
    What a stupid name. Why didn't they just go with Dept. of Energy? Why do they have to include other concepts? *sigh* All set dressing, no substance.

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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    But is it sillier than the Department of Levelling Up?

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    monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Bad-Beat wrote: »
    So if the new Department created in this week's reshuffle is the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero (DESNZ) are we meant to pronounce it Deez Nuts?

    British Office For Administering Department of Energy Security and Net Zero

    moniker on
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    japanjapan Registered User regular
    What a stupid name. Why didn't they just go with Dept. of Energy? Why do they have to include other concepts? *sigh* All set dressing, no substance.

    Usually because they're making substantive changes to the portfolio of the ministers involved and therefore the parts of the civil service that they direct, and it's always a pain in the arse for the people doing the work when they don't change the name and it becomes difficult to determine whether an initiative under discussion is a current programme of work, something defunct that was owned by a previous cabinet office structure, or something that used to be within your area of responsibility that now sits somewhere else

    This is notably worse under this government because of the frequency with which portfolios change

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    altidaltid Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Sunak really is the gift that keeps on giving - especially with his travel arrangements. He just won't take the train or a car like a normal person. Private jets and helicopters are his thing. Best of all, he remains completely oblivious to the optics of it all. When criticized for using an RAF jet three times in 10 days, his defence was basically "I'm too important to get the train". He then got further criticism for extensive use of a private helicopter, with the defence this time being that it was 'privately funded'. He's now been caught using a private jet from Dorset to London and back to Cornwall the following day rather than staying overnight.


    (Guardian political corresponent)

    The excuses that get rolled out really show that he simply doesn't get it. It projects an image of somebody who considers themself too good to travel like the ordinary plebs. A man living entirely in the world of the ultra-wealthy and totally detached from the general public.

    altid on
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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    What a stupid name. Why didn't they just go with Dept. of Energy? Why do they have to include other concepts? *sigh* All set dressing, no substance.
    If you say the department is doing this thing it sounds like you're taking action on that thing, and that means you don't have to put as much effort into actually doing that thing.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Bad-Beat wrote: »
    So if the new Department created in this week's reshuffle is the Department for Energy Security and Net Zero (DESNZ) are we meant to pronounce it Deez Nuts?

    British Office For Administering Department of Energy Security and Net Zero

    The best part is that based on what I know* about how the UK likes to create and name bureaucratic layers this isn’t all that unlikely

    *mostly based on the works of Monty Python guys and maybe this isn’t good

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    MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    altid wrote: »
    The excuses that get rolled out really show that he simply doesn't get it. It projects an image of somebody who considers themself too good to travel like the ordinary plebs. A man living entirely in the world of the ultra-wealthy and totally detached from the general public.

    I mean, at least it's not a false projection?

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    RazielMortemRazielMortem Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Sunak is indeed living up to my expectations that he is simply keeping the seat warm for Johnson. I still expect him gone by summer and Johnson back by autumn even though still under investigation for numerous breaches. Good times...

    RazielMortem on
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    CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    altid wrote: »
    Sunak really is the gift that keeps on giving - especially with his travel arrangements. He just won't take the train or a car like a normal person. Private jets and helicopters are his thing. Best of all, he remains completely oblivious to the optics of it all. When criticized for using an RAF jet three times in 10 days, his defence was basically "I'm too important to get the train". He then got further criticism for extensive use of a private helicopter, with the defence this time being that it was 'privately funded'. He's now been caught using a private jet from Dorset to London and back to Cornwall the following day rather than staying overnight.


    (Guardian political corresponent)

    The excuses that get rolled out really show that he simply doesn't get it. It projects an image of somebody who considers themself too good to travel like the ordinary plebs. A man living entirely in the world of the ultra-wealthy and totally detached from the general public.

    Is a chauffeured ministerial Jag with police motor convoy not fancy enough for him? And where has this helicopter come from? Did he bring it from home or did he steal that from the RAF too?

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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Starmer's whole deal about not interrupting your opponent when they're saying something thats hurting them seems a lot less convincing when he's also unwilling to go after them when things are working in their favor.

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    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    altid wrote: »
    Sunak really is the gift that keeps on giving - especially with his travel arrangements. He just won't take the train or a car like a normal person. Private jets and helicopters are his thing. Best of all, he remains completely oblivious to the optics of it all. When criticized for using an RAF jet three times in 10 days, his defence was basically "I'm too important to get the train". He then got further criticism for extensive use of a private helicopter, with the defence this time being that it was 'privately funded'. He's now been caught using a private jet from Dorset to London and back to Cornwall the following day rather than staying overnight. (Guardian political corresponent)

    The excuses that get rolled out really show that he simply doesn't get it. It projects an image of somebody who considers themself too good to travel like the ordinary plebs. A man living entirely in the world of the ultra-wealthy and totally detached from the general public.

    Remember, this is a man who literally didn't know how to pay for petrol - or, by extension, anything - using a contactless card.

    Jazz on
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    tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    Jazz wrote: »
    altid wrote: »
    Sunak really is the gift that keeps on giving - especially with his travel arrangements. He just won't take the train or a car like a normal person. Private jets and helicopters are his thing. Best of all, he remains completely oblivious to the optics of it all. When criticized for using an RAF jet three times in 10 days, his defence was basically "I'm too important to get the train". He then got further criticism for extensive use of a private helicopter, with the defence this time being that it was 'privately funded'. He's now been caught using a private jet from Dorset to London and back to Cornwall the following day rather than staying overnight. (Guardian political corresponent)

    The excuses that get rolled out really show that he simply doesn't get it. It projects an image of somebody who considers themself too good to travel like the ordinary plebs. A man living entirely in the world of the ultra-wealthy and totally detached from the general public.

    Remember, this is a man who literally didn't know how to pay for petrol - or, by extension, anything - using a contactless card.

    I'm sorry, but, I've been around people who had hundreds of millions of dollars, and I've been with them to starbucks and seen them buy a coffee. The weirdness of the Ultra Rich (the nicer ones at least) is like, they won't understand how you can get home from the dentist without a driver. Or, they'll apologize to you that the hotels in the group price range won't come with a butler for the room. They don't understand how normal budgets work. Not that they don't know how to use a credit card!

    Is Sunak so weird that he doesn't know that?

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    tbloxham wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    altid wrote: »
    Sunak really is the gift that keeps on giving - especially with his travel arrangements. He just won't take the train or a car like a normal person. Private jets and helicopters are his thing. Best of all, he remains completely oblivious to the optics of it all. When criticized for using an RAF jet three times in 10 days, his defence was basically "I'm too important to get the train". He then got further criticism for extensive use of a private helicopter, with the defence this time being that it was 'privately funded'. He's now been caught using a private jet from Dorset to London and back to Cornwall the following day rather than staying overnight. (Guardian political corresponent)

    The excuses that get rolled out really show that he simply doesn't get it. It projects an image of somebody who considers themself too good to travel like the ordinary plebs. A man living entirely in the world of the ultra-wealthy and totally detached from the general public.

    Remember, this is a man who literally didn't know how to pay for petrol - or, by extension, anything - using a contactless card.

    I'm sorry, but, I've been around people who had hundreds of millions of dollars, and I've been with them to starbucks and seen them buy a coffee. The weirdness of the Ultra Rich (the nicer ones at least) is like, they won't understand how you can get home from the dentist without a driver. Or, they'll apologize to you that the hotels in the group price range won't come with a butler for the room. They don't understand how normal budgets work. Not that they don't know how to use a credit card!

    Is Sunak so weird that he doesn't know that?

    Yes. Yes he is.

    Embarrassing moment Rishi Sunak struggles to use bank card while buying petrol

    He had to borrow the car from a Sainsbury's employee as well. Like Sunak drives a Kia.

    Jazz on
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    TastyfishTastyfish Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    He just puts the card in and puts his pin in.
    Bit weird to not have someone tell you that this now exists but not insane. Just implies that he doesn't buy a lot of sub-£99 things in person.

    You order in a lot rather than going to the shop to buy things (or you have your wife's staff to do that), you live at work in a catered apartment and don't generally travel without it being a bit of a deal (more than most people who did this job, definitely some 'Presidential' mindset sneaking in with the private jets and helicopters). It's not often you do need to do this.

    Tastyfish on
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    JazzJazz Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Most people don't try to pay using the barcode scanner through the plastic screen not realising it isn't a card machine.

    One thing I will give Sunak is that he very rarely tries any sort of "man of the people" shtick like that. At least he's not Farage or Johnson in that regard. But then his wealth is entirely in another league to them and it's not exactly a secret. The dude could buy Rees-Mogg and Zahawi with what he'd find down the back of his sofa.

    Jazz on
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    japanjapan Registered User regular
    Dorries is standing down

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/09/i-have-to-remove-myself-nadine-dorries-to-step-down-as-an-mp

    Apparently the removal of Johnson as PM led to her decision which I don't think is a surprise to anyone

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    TastyfishTastyfish Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    The position of mistress is apparently open, so why not ride off into the sunset together...

    [edit] HAHAHAHAHA..sorry, his nickname for her is 'Nads'! Definitely a relationship of mutual respect there, Nads.
    [edit edit] In the context of whether she should "go" no less! The reassuring words being pretty much "Don't go, Nads".

    Tastyfish on
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    RazielMortemRazielMortem Registered User regular
    japan wrote: »
    Dorries is standing down

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/09/i-have-to-remove-myself-nadine-dorries-to-step-down-as-an-mp

    Apparently the removal of Johnson as PM led to her decision which I don't think is a surprise to anyone

    And nothing of value was lost...

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    CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    japan wrote: »
    Dorries is standing down

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/09/i-have-to-remove-myself-nadine-dorries-to-step-down-as-an-mp

    Apparently the removal of Johnson as PM led to her decision which I don't think is a surprise to anyone

    I thought she was in the house of Lords now? Can she be in both houses at the same time?

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    ElldrenElldren Is a woman dammit ceterum censeoRegistered User regular
    japan wrote: »
    Dorries is standing down

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/09/i-have-to-remove-myself-nadine-dorries-to-step-down-as-an-mp

    Apparently the removal of Johnson as PM led to her decision which I don't think is a surprise to anyone

    Are we sure it wasn’t due to the coal miner’s strike? Maybe the Suez crisis? Perhaps the abdication of Edward VIII?

    Just trying to think of other, contemporary events

    fuck gendered marketing
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