Za'krug, the goblin leader in the initial attack on the grove, attacked ten times in a row! And it's not a display error - it was a different attack roll every time.
It was actually hilarious because he kept whiffing but also concerning... >.>
There was an enemy that kept trying to unlock a door like twelve times each turn in one fight.
I can only assume eldritch blast gave him brain damage.
Was it during (Act I)
the tiefling vs. druid bedlam in the Grove prison? Because it happened to me yesterday and it would have been amusing had it not bugged out the door and prevented me from saving the poor defenseless devil children. They still won the fight, though it took like 20 rounds and it looked like a clawshrimp attack when it was over.
Act 2 actually.
Stupid undead justicar kept trying to unlock the big gate that leads you to the pedestal where you have to put the book to get the spear in Shar's Gauntlet.
Finally best my first playthrough, 203 hours in. Still bothered i didn't explore a handful of rooms because i didn't want to pick a fight (bank upstairs, temple of Umberlee downstairs, the lower city jail).
Are any of the other larian crpgs turn based and worth checking out if you liked bg3?
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited October 3
I would recommend DoS2, which is the sequel to DoS but I feel the original Divinity Original Sin is a bit rough around the edges - but thankfully isn't required to play DoS 2 whatsoever.
Are any of the other larian crpgs turn based and worth checking out if you liked bg3?
Gameplaywise, the Divinity Original Sin games are good but the story, characters, writing and world are pretty forgettable. They're my least favorite games to come out of the CRPG renaissance in that regard.
BG3 was a massive MASSIVE step forward for Larian in a lot of ways. This game is kind of the total package in comparison.
Ok not that bad but there are absurd RPG chores that you cannot avoid. The game can be ludicrously difficult or easy based on your build. There are hidden mechanics that are significantly important and crafting is a core component of the game.
There are plenty of pointless combats. And padded durations. Plus the level system means that path choice can be a significant issue.
It can still be fun and isn’t a bad game. But the story is thin and basic.
5e basically fixed all of Larians flaws. Dnd provided a good story and opportunity to write good plots (the character plots in DoS 2 are good/fine but reduced by the main plot being kinda eh) while 5e removed all their worst tendencies in terms of encounter/ability/game design.
Oh no I started romancing Lae'zel cause the idea of having a casual fling was amusing to me but now I find her endearing in an extremely abrasive way.
Guess you'll have to wait for a second playthrough Karlach.
Lae'zaels actual romance is just really good, really well done, as you get to see her come out of the bluster she puts up to the world. Its just really sweet
Act II is the best act though! It’s a spooky creepy epic heartwarming/heartbreaking concise story, and I am totally here for it. Plus, in terms of power levels, somewhere around level 7 to 9 is pretty much the sweet spot for fun gameplay in BG3 IMO. You’re strong enough to do your thing, but not strong enough that doing your thing trivializes encounters unless you’re all in on optimization.
Re: Lae’zel: (light character spoilers, mostly musing on her full game arc as a whole without reference to events)
I feel like Lae’zel is one of the more complex characters, and her entire plot line is the best of all the origin characters. The plot for all of the origin characters to me comes down to them dealings with the traumas that have defined their lives to that point, and the self-destructive impulses that led to and/or stem from their trauma. In Lae’zel’s case, her plot has her discover that she has been traumatized, and to her finding things in the world that matter to her personally. She finds things beyond the ambitions that she was always told she was supposed to have.
In sadder news, my Shadowheart origin run where I’m romancing Lae’zel is going on hold at the end of Act 2 - a certain very powerful quest reward tied to Shadowheart’s quest isn’t showing up. The cutscene happens. The person says “thank you for doing that thing, here’s a reward!” In the cutscene, Shadowheart even holds the reward. But it’s not in my bags, not available to equip, and talking to the NPC further doesn’t help. I’ve reloaded a few times, no luck.
I’m hoping it gets fixed in a patch. Otherwise, I’m missing out on a very thematic reward.
So, I’ve started a Tactician mode Warlock run. I’m thinking of going Warlock 5 and then other stuff, to try to be a really powerful cloth wearing melee character. Possibly Paladin 7? I dunno. So far, I’m just level 3, but I’m not having too much trouble despite the difficulty jump, and I’m just about clear in the blighted village, barring the spider zone. I do want to try to get up to level 4 before I start slaughtering the main goblin force, but I’m almost there now, so it shouldn’t be too hard.
Civics is not a consumer product that you can ignore because you don’t like the options presented.
+1
Dr. ChaosPost nuclear nuisanceRegistered Userregular
I think it would be really hard to play DOS2 after BG3. I'd imagine that game's flaws would be even more glaring by comparison.
in some ways yes,I immediately noticed how much prettier BG3 is, as well as the increased personal mobility and verticality of the battle areas. and of course the story is much better.
but unless you already like 5e, DOS2's combat is a breath of fresh air to return to. no randomness, poor play is consistently punished and good play is consistently rewarded.
+1
GoodKingJayIIIThey wanna get mygold on the ceilingRegistered Userregular
Personally I came to loathe the DOS2 combat. Maybe all those things are true, but every combat I remember played out as 1) party gets surprised by enemies dropping out of the sky, 2) claw your way through most of the enemies, battered and bruised, but with victory in sight, 3) surprise! another group of enemies randomly drops out of the sky.
Dr. ChaosPost nuclear nuisanceRegistered Userregular
edited October 3
The best way I can describe the battle system in the divinity games is sort of a puzzlelike slog with lots of enviromental gimmicks scattered about baked into the encounter design. Its very well designed but it can also wear you down over the 100 hours or so it might take you to finish one. Its a learning experience all about manipulating the battlefield.
BG3 is a much better game if you just want solid no BS structured fights like most RPGs where the encounters feel fairly straightforward for the most part.
Fights in BG3 aren't a puzzle, they're a test of might and it makes them so much easier to get into and replayable.
Its hard to describe because it sounds like I'm trashing it every time, I'm not, its the game's strong point, its just far from my preference.
Its hard, it stays consistently challenging. The system they set up doesn't fall apart at higher levels, etc. I just don't think its funner than BG3's.
Been working through the game in both a solo run and with a co-op group, and just cleared act 2 in the former; also played through DoS2 with the latter. Generally had a good time with that game and enjoying this one as well, though BG3 does feel more tightly constructed and considered with its gameplay. For my group at least, fights in DoS often devolved into chaos over who could better exploit elemental effects on the battlefield - not always a bad thing, mind. Gere those are a tactical consideration but usually not singularly game-changing (smokepowder barrels notwithstanding).
Where both kind of let me down is in the lack of a good antagonist and general forward motion of the plot. BG3's characters are overall more memorable and better-written, and they've really upped their game with VA direction, but Act 1 still gave me Fort Joy flashbacks. I spent most of it aimless and confused, stumbling around asking people for help with a problem they obviously couldn't solve. I thought it would make sense to follow Lae'zel's advice and find the other githyanki ASAP, since she at least seemed to know what was going on, but then the game itself warned me about leaving the map before I was done there. The creche itself felt kind of janky and weird, like some Kickstarter stretch goal area that didn't quite get enough development time.
Things got better in Act 2, but I had a minor moment of zen towards the end of it. Without spoiling too much,
when someone said it was time for a final confrontation with Ketheric Thorm, it struck that this would literally be my first confrontation with them. The end conversation felt tonally all over the place, starting like some remorseful fallen hero but then veering into 'bwahaha you're all doomed' villainy when Dame Aylin showed up. His obvious disagreements with his colleagues only further complicated things, and made it hard to feel anything when Aylin started crushing his skull.
This game badly needs a Sarevok or Irenicus-like figure to tie it all together; not some faceless, distant antagonist but a clear villain that shows up early, serves as an overarching objective, and makes it personal for you. As-is I just feel like I'm kind of wandering into other people's problems for lack of anywhere else to go.
This game badly needs a Sarevok or Irenicus-like figure to tie it all together; not some faceless, distant antagonist but a clear villain that shows up early, serves as an overarching objective, and makes it personal for you. As-is I just feel like I'm kind of wandering into other people's problems for lack of anywhere else to go.
It has one, IMO.
The Emperor.
Edit: Though I don't think they're anywhere near as compelling as either Sarevok or Irenicus, needless to say.
Burnage on
+2
Dr. ChaosPost nuclear nuisanceRegistered Userregular
This game badly needs a Sarevok or Irenicus-like figure to tie it all together; not some faceless, distant antagonist but a clear villain that shows up early, serves as an overarching objective, and makes it personal for you. As-is I just feel like I'm kind of wandering into other people's problems for lack of anywhere else to go.
It has one, IMO.
The Emperor.
Edit: Though I don't think they're anywhere near as compelling as either Sarevok or Irenicus, needless to say.
Wait, what?
0
Dr. ChaosPost nuclear nuisanceRegistered Userregular
edited October 3
I don't know if I would call Sarevok interesting. He was a giant murder man in a spiky suit of armor but there is a certain kind of appeal there in a villian thats just a giant terrifying physical wall.
Fun fight though. Had the rest of my party dead with my frightened bhaalspawn trying desperately to kite him with low health as the piss streamed down his leg.
For all of DnD's overpowered mages, it was one guy with two large melee weapons that really pushed my shit in.
Been working through the game in both a solo run and with a co-op group, and just cleared act 2 in the former; also played through DoS2 with the latter. Generally had a good time with that game and enjoying this one as well, though BG3 does feel more tightly constructed and considered with its gameplay. For my group at least, fights in DoS often devolved into chaos over who could better exploit elemental effects on the battlefield - not always a bad thing, mind. Gere those are a tactical consideration but usually not singularly game-changing (smokepowder barrels notwithstanding).
Where both kind of let me down is in the lack of a good antagonist and general forward motion of the plot. BG3's characters are overall more memorable and better-written, and they've really upped their game with VA direction, but Act 1 still gave me Fort Joy flashbacks. I spent most of it aimless and confused, stumbling around asking people for help with a problem they obviously couldn't solve. I thought it would make sense to follow Lae'zel's advice and find the other githyanki ASAP, since she at least seemed to know what was going on, but then the game itself warned me about leaving the map before I was done there. The creche itself felt kind of janky and weird, like some Kickstarter stretch goal area that didn't quite get enough development time.
Things got better in Act 2, but I had a minor moment of zen towards the end of it. Without spoiling too much,
when someone said it was time for a final confrontation with Ketheric Thorm, it struck that this would literally be my first confrontation with them. The end conversation felt tonally all over the place, starting like some remorseful fallen hero but then veering into 'bwahaha you're all doomed' villainy when Dame Aylin showed up. His obvious disagreements with his colleagues only further complicated things, and made it hard to feel anything when Aylin started crushing his skull.
This game badly needs a Sarevok or Irenicus-like figure to tie it all together; not some faceless, distant antagonist but a clear villain that shows up early, serves as an overarching objective, and makes it personal for you. As-is I just feel like I'm kind of wandering into other people's problems for lack of anywhere else to go.
Did you not go to the tower at all before going into the Shar temple?
Yeah, a villain doesn't necessarily have to be complicated to work. Sarevok works because he establishes himself as the bad guy in the first five minutes and is consistently dangerous throughout the game. Even before the Iron Throne stuff comes in, the assassins at various points make it clear this problem isn't going away quietly. Irenicus is very different character-wise but serves a similar role in the story: an obvious nemesis with an underlying mystery that sets the stakes early on. Crucially, both aren't also breathing down your neck the whole time, giving you leeway to explore and find out what's happening.
BG3's central dilemma is perfectly fine for a plot, but without a clear antagonist the only driving motivation at the start is the tadpole thing. I just think the game suffers for that, and leads to a kind of confusing opening act where the writing says this is a problem but the game says to take your time with it.
Did you not go to the tower at all before going into the Shar temple?
That's the thing, I kind of bumbled into the Shar temple - I figured the tower would advance the plot and it'd be a good idea to explore first. It's also closer to the safe zone, and there was a 'sidequest this way' nudge just outside
by Raphael. Only once I was deep inside did I learn how important the area really was, and that clearing it would start the attack on the tower.
It just feels weirdly structured, and I feel like the character would have been better served with an earlier, not-possible-to-miss appearance to introduce themselves.
Been working through the game in both a solo run and with a co-op group, and just cleared act 2 in the former; also played through DoS2 with the latter. Generally had a good time with that game and enjoying this one as well, though BG3 does feel more tightly constructed and considered with its gameplay. For my group at least, fights in DoS often devolved into chaos over who could better exploit elemental effects on the battlefield - not always a bad thing, mind. Gere those are a tactical consideration but usually not singularly game-changing (smokepowder barrels notwithstanding).
Where both kind of let me down is in the lack of a good antagonist and general forward motion of the plot. BG3's characters are overall more memorable and better-written, and they've really upped their game with VA direction, but Act 1 still gave me Fort Joy flashbacks. I spent most of it aimless and confused, stumbling around asking people for help with a problem they obviously couldn't solve. I thought it would make sense to follow Lae'zel's advice and find the other githyanki ASAP, since she at least seemed to know what was going on, but then the game itself warned me about leaving the map before I was done there. The creche itself felt kind of janky and weird, like some Kickstarter stretch goal area that didn't quite get enough development time.
Things got better in Act 2, but I had a minor moment of zen towards the end of it. Without spoiling too much,
when someone said it was time for a final confrontation with Ketheric Thorm, it struck that this would literally be my first confrontation with them. The end conversation felt tonally all over the place, starting like some remorseful fallen hero but then veering into 'bwahaha you're all doomed' villainy when Dame Aylin showed up. His obvious disagreements with his colleagues only further complicated things, and made it hard to feel anything when Aylin started crushing his skull.
This game badly needs a Sarevok or Irenicus-like figure to tie it all together; not some faceless, distant antagonist but a clear villain that shows up early, serves as an overarching objective, and makes it personal for you. As-is I just feel like I'm kind of wandering into other people's problems for lack of anywhere else to go.
I dunno, it felt pretty personal to me when a squid man shoved his baby into my skull.
But, there are several villains who I think fit this bill. I don't think anyone rises to Irenicus-level (who let's face it is the highest bar), but I have found that:
- Raphael
- The Emperor
- Gortash (to a smaller extent)
fit this bill. And they are all compelling in their way.
The act 2 town is probably one of my favorite areas, mostly due to it literally just being Yharnam from Bloodborne. My only issue is there's not that much to actually do in the town itself.
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+1
Dr. ChaosPost nuclear nuisanceRegistered Userregular
edited October 3
Posted this elsewhere for a mod error report but figured it looked goofy enough to report here for minor amusement aswell.
AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
After playing much of BG3 and all of DoS2, even though I dislike 5th edition as a system and think it fails to make a challenging game eventually, I prefer BG3 to DoS2 even though DoS2 is far more challenging. A lot of DoS2 challenge feels very artificial, like just random bullshit stuff like constantly slipping over, enemies having truly bizarre and game breaking feeling abilities (the fucking scarecrows in DoS2), plus a good heaping of instant death. BG3 feels a lot more reasonable in this regard, primarily because they are constrained by the actual rules and haven't decided to just break everything in the game to make it challenging.
So while I'm utterly stomping the game at this point without any effort, it's still fun and engaging because the core combat is incredibly solid. It's also given me enough interesting fights and encounters that it doesn't feel boring, because there is a lot of variety that they've packed in here. I do prefer the challenge of DoS2, but I dislike the way they went about it.
BG3 also breaks the game but it does so by buffing the party.
The canon number of ways to increase spell save DC in base 5e is zero. There are very few ways to add damage dice and they all involve losing weapon bonus.
Both of these things are thrown around like candy in bg3
+1
AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
5e fails to make a challenging system regardless of this. What Larian's decisions do is end fights that are already trivial to do anyway faster, which results in less having to do long rests and thus keeps the games momentum going (which I appreciate).
SaldonasSee you space cowboy...Registered Userregular
I rather enjoyed DoS2. The armor system is a bit conflicting as it seemed like my party always had inferior armor to enemies. Without min-maxing I imagine the game on even normal would be quite difficult for some people. There was definitely a good number of combats that would just start and I'd instantly lose a character. I did my entire playthrough in co-op with a friend that wasn't very strategic though so I imagine part of the difficulty I encountered was artificial.
I still think it was a pretty good game for what it was though.
GoodKingJayIIIThey wanna get mygold on the ceilingRegistered Userregular
I've come so far around on the OST. I was kinda indifferent to it when I first started playing but by the end of the game it was living in my head rent free.
I've come so far around on the OST. I was kinda indifferent to it when I first started playing but by the end of the game it was living in my head rent free.
It's weird that they give you some insanely good items but I can only see myself using basically the same ones every time. Healing just gives bless and blade ward in BG3.
+2
AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
It's weird that they give you some insanely good items but I can only see myself using basically the same ones every time. Healing just gives bless and blade ward in BG3.
Yeah, it's pretty absurd but I also see it as addressing some of the common problems people have with 5E.
I mean, it's very obvious Larian reads forums and posts about DnD when they were thinking about many of these issues.
BG3 also breaks the game but it does so by buffing the party.
The canon number of ways to increase spell save DC in base 5e is zero. There are very few ways to add damage dice and they all involve losing weapon bonus.
Both of these things are thrown around like candy in bg3
What, no, there's items to increase spell save DC for various classes in 5E, they're just usually class locked. Rods of the Pact Keeper and Amulets of the Devout are like, standard loot table stuff. +1DC items are plain Uncommon magic items, our party Warlock has had one since level 4!
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BG3 was a massive MASSIVE step forward for Larian in a lot of ways. This game is kind of the total package in comparison.
Ok not that bad but there are absurd RPG chores that you cannot avoid. The game can be ludicrously difficult or easy based on your build. There are hidden mechanics that are significantly important and crafting is a core component of the game.
There are plenty of pointless combats. And padded durations. Plus the level system means that path choice can be a significant issue.
It can still be fun and isn’t a bad game. But the story is thin and basic.
5e basically fixed all of Larians flaws. Dnd provided a good story and opportunity to write good plots (the character plots in DoS 2 are good/fine but reduced by the main plot being kinda eh) while 5e removed all their worst tendencies in terms of encounter/ability/game design.
Lae'zaels actual romance is just really good, really well done, as you get to see her come out of the bluster she puts up to the world. Its just really sweet
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I don't mean the plot, I mean the locales.
Like I said not the biggest fan of dank and it can overstay its welcome fairly quickly for me. Like a bit more variety.
Finished the game a few days ago, killed the baddies
ending spoiler not important
Then my brain threw the game on the ground and walked away from it like Tony Hawk after he did that trick for the video.
I wanna know what the classes we didn't get to play with are like, like paladin or bard, but I cannot fucking do that act 2 again, ugh.
Re: Lae’zel: (light character spoilers, mostly musing on her full game arc as a whole without reference to events)
In sadder news, my Shadowheart origin run where I’m romancing Lae’zel is going on hold at the end of Act 2 - a certain very powerful quest reward tied to Shadowheart’s quest isn’t showing up. The cutscene happens. The person says “thank you for doing that thing, here’s a reward!” In the cutscene, Shadowheart even holds the reward. But it’s not in my bags, not available to equip, and talking to the NPC further doesn’t help. I’ve reloaded a few times, no luck.
I’m hoping it gets fixed in a patch. Otherwise, I’m missing out on a very thematic reward.
So, I’ve started a Tactician mode Warlock run. I’m thinking of going Warlock 5 and then other stuff, to try to be a really powerful cloth wearing melee character. Possibly Paladin 7? I dunno. So far, I’m just level 3, but I’m not having too much trouble despite the difficulty jump, and I’m just about clear in the blighted village, barring the spider zone. I do want to try to get up to level 4 before I start slaughtering the main goblin force, but I’m almost there now, so it shouldn’t be too hard.
Spooky scary DnD/Pathfinder is the best.
in some ways yes,I immediately noticed how much prettier BG3 is, as well as the increased personal mobility and verticality of the battle areas. and of course the story is much better.
but unless you already like 5e, DOS2's combat is a breath of fresh air to return to. no randomness, poor play is consistently punished and good play is consistently rewarded.
I much prefer BG3.
BG3 is a much better game if you just want solid no BS structured fights like most RPGs where the encounters feel fairly straightforward for the most part.
Fights in BG3 aren't a puzzle, they're a test of might and it makes them so much easier to get into and replayable.
Its hard to describe because it sounds like I'm trashing it every time, I'm not, its the game's strong point, its just far from my preference.
Its hard, it stays consistently challenging. The system they set up doesn't fall apart at higher levels, etc. I just don't think its funner than BG3's.
BG3 is far and away the better game mind
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Where both kind of let me down is in the lack of a good antagonist and general forward motion of the plot. BG3's characters are overall more memorable and better-written, and they've really upped their game with VA direction, but Act 1 still gave me Fort Joy flashbacks. I spent most of it aimless and confused, stumbling around asking people for help with a problem they obviously couldn't solve. I thought it would make sense to follow Lae'zel's advice and find the other githyanki ASAP, since she at least seemed to know what was going on, but then the game itself warned me about leaving the map before I was done there. The creche itself felt kind of janky and weird, like some Kickstarter stretch goal area that didn't quite get enough development time.
Things got better in Act 2, but I had a minor moment of zen towards the end of it. Without spoiling too much,
This game badly needs a Sarevok or Irenicus-like figure to tie it all together; not some faceless, distant antagonist but a clear villain that shows up early, serves as an overarching objective, and makes it personal for you. As-is I just feel like I'm kind of wandering into other people's problems for lack of anywhere else to go.
Now playing: Teardown and Baldur's Gate 3 (co-op)
Sunday Spotlight: Horror Tales: The Wine
It has one, IMO.
Edit: Though I don't think they're anywhere near as compelling as either Sarevok or Irenicus, needless to say.
Already got more of their damn bags and pouches than I know what to do with.
Fun fight though. Had the rest of my party dead with my frightened bhaalspawn trying desperately to kite him with low health as the piss streamed down his leg.
For all of DnD's overpowered mages, it was one guy with two large melee weapons that really pushed my shit in.
Did you not go to the tower at all before going into the Shar temple?
Warning, contains some spoilers
BG3's central dilemma is perfectly fine for a plot, but without a clear antagonist the only driving motivation at the start is the tadpole thing. I just think the game suffers for that, and leads to a kind of confusing opening act where the writing says this is a problem but the game says to take your time with it.
That's the thing, I kind of bumbled into the Shar temple - I figured the tower would advance the plot and it'd be a good idea to explore first. It's also closer to the safe zone, and there was a 'sidequest this way' nudge just outside
Now playing: Teardown and Baldur's Gate 3 (co-op)
Sunday Spotlight: Horror Tales: The Wine
I dunno, it felt pretty personal to me when a squid man shoved his baby into my skull.
But, there are several villains who I think fit this bill. I don't think anyone rises to Irenicus-level (who let's face it is the highest bar), but I have found that:
- The Emperor
- Gortash (to a smaller extent)
fit this bill. And they are all compelling in their way.
Bard clown armor/Faerun's lamest superhero:
https://imgur.com/a/M3lilpg
So while I'm utterly stomping the game at this point without any effort, it's still fun and engaging because the core combat is incredibly solid. It's also given me enough interesting fights and encounters that it doesn't feel boring, because there is a lot of variety that they've packed in here. I do prefer the challenge of DoS2, but I dislike the way they went about it.
The canon number of ways to increase spell save DC in base 5e is zero. There are very few ways to add damage dice and they all involve losing weapon bonus.
Both of these things are thrown around like candy in bg3
I still think it was a pretty good game for what it was though.
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Boss Music:
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Yeah, it's pretty absurd but I also see it as addressing some of the common problems people have with 5E.
I mean, it's very obvious Larian reads forums and posts about DnD when they were thinking about many of these issues.
Until you run into Githyanki or Mind Flayers anyway. Then you just kind of shit your pants.
What, no, there's items to increase spell save DC for various classes in 5E, they're just usually class locked. Rods of the Pact Keeper and Amulets of the Devout are like, standard loot table stuff. +1DC items are plain Uncommon magic items, our party Warlock has had one since level 4!