Options

[AI Art] Continues to be The Torment Nexus

LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
edited September 2023 in Social Entropy++
So-called “AI” content generation engines continue to suck ass! We know the reasons why: models constantly trained on art and literary assets with no compensation ever given to the original creators, being funded by a cadre of Silicon Valley oligarchs whose wet dreams all involve removing their laboring-lessers from the equation entirely to rid themselves of that messy “paying people” cost cell in their quarterly spreadsheets, the fact many of these algorithms actually aren’t all they’re cracked up to be and require teams of exploited, underpaid workers to keep them even remotely viable for their owners.

So here’s the latest thanks to some former Vice Motherboard folks over at 404 Media:

https://www.404media.co/kaedim-ai-startup-2d-to-3d-used-cheap-human-labor/
An artificial intelligence company, whose founder Forbes included in a 30 Under 30 list recently, promises to use machine learning to convert clients’ 2D illustrations into 3D models. In reality the company, called Kaedim, uses human artists for “quality control.” According to two sources with knowledge of the process interviewed by 404 Media, at one point, Kaedim often used human artists to make the models. One of the sources said workers at one point produced the 3D design wholecloth themselves without the help of machine learning at all.

The news pulls back the curtain on a hyped startup and is an example of how AI companies can sometimes overstate the capabilities of their technology. Like other AI startups, Kaedim wants to use AI to do tedious labor that is currently being done by humans. In this case, 3D modeling, a time consuming job that video game companies are already outsourcing to studios in countries like China.

“Our software automatically models the geometry from scratch,” Kaedim founder and CEO Konstantina Psoma told Forbes last year. “Now anyone can integrate the automatic 2D to 3D conversion into their apps, games, and metaverses.” In an earlier, 2020 interview on LinkedIn, Psoma said the company is “automating the boring parts” of 3D modeling.

“Magically generate custom 3D models in minutes,” Kaedim’s website reads. Update: After the publication of this article, Kaedim rebranded its website to make it clearer that humans are involved in the company's production of 3D images. You can read an article specifically on that change here.

What Kaedim’s artificial intelligence produced was of such low quality that at one point in time “it would just be an unrecognizable blob or something instead of a tree for example,” one source familiar with its process said. 404 Media granted multiple sources in this article anonymity to avoid retaliation.

More in the article

waNkm4k.jpg?1
Lanz on
«13

Posts

  • Options
    HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    Fuck AI art. Butlerian Jihad is the only acceptable answer.

  • Options
    The Cow KingThe Cow King a island Registered User regular
    edited September 2023
    The most disappointing part of the ai art is that I could draw a UK double decker bus doing 9/11 way better then the handful of prompts I had before the discord app said we had to pay

    The Cow King on
    icGJy2C.png
  • Options
    VeldrinVeldrin Sham bam bamina Registered User regular
    eyyyy, I art

  • Options
    Indie WinterIndie Winter die Krähe Rudi Hurzlmeier (German, b. 1952)Registered User regular
    edited September 2023
    https://youtu.be/iHN5zm_Rsm8?si=qDx0ciQiHk6UYzBI

    see, I just think this is cool

    every legal and economic implication of "AI art" as it is currently utilized is damaging and harmful to real actual people whose well-being obviously have and will always take priority

    but the actual no quotation marks Art that can be done with it, things that would be impossible otherwise... some of it can be downright beautiful, as above

    and it angers me that the way this world is broken will not allow the latter condition to exist without the former

    Indie Winter on
    wY6K6Jb.gif
  • Options
    The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    I'm not trying to bait you here, Indie - but why?

    Like that's not him singing it. It's not every little choice and tweak and bit that Frank would have done with his voice singing that song.

    it's an excellent fucking mimicry of his voice, don't get me wrong, but it's not him. It's just a computer's best interpretation of him. Which is interesting in the way a fun house mirror is interesting, but not really beyond that.

    Generally when i'm engaging in media it's because of the human element, it's because i'm interested in a person's take on things and how they thought about stuff, consciously or subconciously and all that fed into it.

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
    Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
    Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
    Switch: 0293 6817 9891
  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    Adam Savage recently put out his take on AI

    https://youtu.be/ESSHjm0xbig?si=6alo9j82TqiGTItV

    He's nonconfrontational and positive by nature so don't expect bashing on either side, but his point that AI lacks an essential part of human communication - a point of view - is an interesting distillation of its limits. Often when I interact with generative AI, it feels like I'm looking in a mirror. It's more of a muse or a reflective psychologist than an actual conversation partner, helping flesh out ideas but not really bringing out any novel contributions of its own.

    The second part of his answer has hidden relevance: a novel point of view is not guaranteed from humans either, and without a need to prove yourself, there's a chance innovation may be stifled. I'm wondering if all the money in generative AI right now is actually hindering its growth, as it would best be developed through easy collaboration and transparency as the data needed for development is not locked in a corporate vault somewhere but readily publicly available.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    MagellMagell Detroit Machine Guns Fort MyersRegistered User regular
    All the money in AI art right now is from tech bros who want to make art and be recognized as artits, without putting in the effort to develop those artistic skills themselves.

    That's it.

    The Chatbot shit they've been working on forever so that companies could stop paying people to do chat help on websites. And now they've adapted it to make SEO garbage articles.

  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    Magell wrote: »
    All the money in AI art right now is from tech bros who want to make art and be recognized as artits, without putting in the effort to develop those artistic skills themselves.

    That's it.

    The Chatbot shit they've been working on forever so that companies could stop paying people to do chat help on websites. And now they've adapted it to make SEO garbage articles.

    Pretty much all the market growth in the S&P 500 in the past year has been in companies heavily invested in AI, which are big players like Microsoft, Alphabet, Tesla, etc. Generative AI art is a small player in a bigger game and doesn't really drive innovation in the field - it's more like a byproduct that companies are trying to squeeze for more money, restrained by proprietary investment in secret AI models applied to other industries.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Hacksaw wrote: »
    Fuck AI art. Butlerian Jihad is the only acceptable answer.

    All seriousness, something that fucks me off is this is not AI!

    Actual artificial intelligence is a fascinating concept with a lot to discuss and learn and consider. This is just generative black boxes, and half the time the black box is just a bunch of humans in a sweatshop.

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
    Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
    Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
    Switch: 0293 6817 9891
  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    I'm not trying to bait you here, Indie - but why?

    Like that's not him singing it. It's not every little choice and tweak and bit that Frank would have done with his voice singing that song.

    it's an excellent fucking mimicry of his voice, don't get me wrong, but it's not him. It's just a computer's best interpretation of him. Which is interesting in the way a fun house mirror is interesting, but not really beyond that.

    Generally when i'm engaging in media it's because of the human element, it's because i'm interested in a person's take on things and how they thought about stuff, consciously or subconciously and all that fed into it.

    It's a similar sort of appeal as a kaleidoscope: a transformation of the things you see with some math type stuff to get something that looks like a new thing. Doesn't need a person to shake things up to imbue a sense of novelty - it's a natural mutation.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    crwthcrwth THAT'S IT Registered User regular
    you guys didn’t have enough of this topic already eh

    EzUAYcn.png
  • Options
    tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    strong words from a butt

  • Options
    Grey GhostGrey Ghost Registered User regular
    crwth wrote: »
    you guys didn’t have enough of this topic already eh

    wipny26d6b6q.jpg

    Why are we still here? Just to suffer?

  • Options
    crwthcrwth THAT'S IT Registered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    strong words from a butt

    that’s what farting is, and that’s what i do best

    EzUAYcn.png
  • Options
    LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
    A few days late but:

    https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2023/09/ai-took-my-job-literally-gizmodo-fires-spanish-staff-amid-switch-to-ai-translator/
    Last week, Gizmodo parent company G/O Media fired the staff of its Spanish-language site Gizmodo en Español and began to replace their work with AI translations of English-language articles, reports The Verge.

    Former Gizmodo writer Matías S. Zavia publicly mentioned the layoffs, which took place via video call on August 29, in a social media post. On August 31, Zavia wrote, "Hello friends. On Tuesday they shut down @GizmodoES to turn it into a translation self-publisher (an AI took my job, literally)."

    Previously, Gizmodo en Español had a small but dedicated team who wrote original content tailored specifically for Spanish-speaking readers, as well as producing translations of Gizmodo's English articles. The site represented Gizmodo's first foray into international markets when it launched in 2012 after being acquired from Guanabee.

    Newly published articles on the site now contain a link to the English version of the article and a disclaimer stating (via our translation from Google Translate), "This content has been automatically translated from the source material. Due to the nuances of machine translation, there may be slight differences. For the original version, click here."
    Este contenido ha sido traducido automáticamente del material original. Debido a los matices de la traducción automática, pueden existir ligeras diferencias. Para la versión original, haga clic aquí.

    So far, Gizmodo's pivot to AI translation hasn't gone smoothly. On social media site X, journalist and Gizmodo reader Víctor Millán noted that some of the site's new articles abruptly switch from Spanish to English midway through, possibly due to glitches in the AI translation system.

    G/O Media's decision to eschew human writers for AI is part of a recent trend of media companies experimenting with AI tools as a way to maximize content output while minimizing human labor costs. However, the practice remains controversial within the broader journalism community.

    Earlier this summer, Gizmodo began publishing AI-generated articles in English without informing or involving its editorial staff. The stories were found to contain multiple factual inaccuracies, leading the Gizmodo union to criticize the practice as unethical.


    Also:

    “ via our translation from Google Translate”

    Cannot tell if Irony intentional or Accidental

    waNkm4k.jpg?1
  • Options
    The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    ben mckenzie, shut down this thread

    7656367.jpg
  • Options
    milskimilski Poyo! Registered User regular
    edited September 2023

    That isn't even "written" by AI, it's a thesaurus-bashed plagiarizing of the TMZ article it links to. That's usually reserved for like, SEO optimized slopsites, I didn't realize MSN had fallen that far.

    E: Looks like the MSN aticle is down but here is the article it stole from: https://www.tmz.com/2023/09/12/ex-nba-player-brandon-hunter-dead-42/?adid=social-tws

    milski on
    I ate an engineer
  • Options
    PoorochondriacPoorochondriac Ah, man Ah, jeezRegistered User regular
    Finally, art has been democratized

  • Options
    LokarnLokarn Registered User regular
    But what happened to all the people being employed to fix all the AI oopsies? Surely they wouldn't just take the convenient and helpful basic framework provided by friend computer and release it verbatim and pocket the savings on labour cost?

    Oh, also Google still assures us in a featured snippet that there are no countries in Africa beginning with K. So, you know, all going great there so far.

  • Options
    GR_ZombieGR_Zombie Krillin It Registered User regular
    Finally, art has been democratized

    No longer will the pencil famine deny us

    04xkcuvaav19.png
  • Options
    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    GR_Zombie wrote: »
    Finally, art has been democratized

    No longer will the pencil famine deny us

    Oh no I already sold all my paper

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Options
    GR_ZombieGR_Zombie Krillin It Registered User regular
    GR_Zombie wrote: »
    Finally, art has been democratized

    No longer will the pencil famine deny us

    Oh no I already sold all my paper

    y4oatbo207au.jpeg

    04xkcuvaav19.png
  • Options
    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    GR_Zombie wrote: »
    Finally, art has been democratized

    No longer will the pencil famine deny us

    Oh no I already sold all my paper

    That's fine, paper currency is the past

    Convert all your cash into gold, and then give me that gold to convert into NFTs

  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    milski wrote: »

    That isn't even "written" by AI, it's a thesaurus-bashed plagiarizing of the TMZ article it links to. That's usually reserved for like, SEO optimized slopsites, I didn't realize MSN had fallen that far.

    E: Looks like the MSN aticle is down but here is the article it stole from: https://www.tmz.com/2023/09/12/ex-nba-player-brandon-hunter-dead-42/?adid=social-tws

    Never having bothered to change my edge homepage from msn.com for the past 8 years it's less a fall and more a gentle mudslide at the bottom of a sinkhole

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    PoorochondriacPoorochondriac Ah, man Ah, jeezRegistered User regular
    o4wwcefbv76h.png
    https://www.404media.co/first-google-search-result-for-tiananmen-square-tank-man-is-ai-generated-selfie/

    Luckily we can all get free D&D portraits whenever we want and the tits can be just ASTRONOMICALLY huge, so it's probably all fine on balance

  • Options
    HobnailHobnail Registered User regular
    I think all this stuff is going to wrap itself up fairly shortly

    Broke as fuck and the bills past due, all amounts assist and are kindly received.

    https://www.paypal.me/hobnailtaylor
  • Options
    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    There's an article up on New Republic about how the anti-trafficking movement gave cover to opportunistic men, both as pre-existing and newly-manufactured celebrities, and how their supposed anti-trafficking programs built using "machine learning" does little to help prevent human trafficking, but is a huge boon to cops looking to harass sex workers.
    We know few details about how Spotlight works, but it appears to involve data scraping, “machine learning,” and facial recognition, collecting adult sex workers’ data and identities from online sex work ads, then using that as a source to search for children suspected of having been trafficked. By creating a database of sex workers for cops, many sex workers rights’ advocates say, Spotlight sounds like nothing more than a tool for passively generating a collection of sexual content meant only for sex workers’ intentionally ephemeral online ads, which can also be used to identify them outside sex work, all without their knowledge or consent. In a Spotlight training video for police reviewed by Forbes, Spotlight is described as “the Google for human trafficking or online escort activities.” Clearly this has value to police beyond locating kids.

    Law enforcement officers who have used Spotlight also acknowledge that Thorn has created a tool for obtaining confessions—from suspected victims who don’t want help from police, who may themselves be participants in criminalized conduct by being involved in the sex trade, even if nonconsensually. “We use it in victim interviews, which can be the turning point where they realize we know too much and full denials just won’t work anymore,” two detectives from the Bernalillo County Sheriff’s Office wrote on Thorn’s blog in 2018. For them, though Spotlight may be a tool to locate missing kids, it’s also a tool for turning victims facing possible prosecution into state witnesses.

    Spotlight didn’t just enable Kutcher to become an asset to cops—it also helped him become an A.I. guy. On the tech conference circuit over the past decade, he talked up how Spotlight uses A.I. for facial recognition, including in a partnership with Amazon Rekognition—a tool that Amazon has banned law enforcement from using, except by Thorn and similar, purported anti-trafficking efforts, after activists raised civil liberties and gender and racial justice concerns over its use. Kutcher also became an investor in A.I., for instance with his investment, alongside Elon Musk, Peter Thiel, and Mark Zuckerberg, in an A.I. company called Vicarious, a vague but richly cash-infused venture, described by its founder as a technology that would “let us make labor much more affordable, which would then let us all rise in society.” Kutcher followed this with his own $240 million A.I. investment fund. Kutcher once portrayed Steve Jobs, but now he has fully assumed the tech thought leader role himself. Thorn helped.

  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Paladin wrote: »
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    But the working that it is doing is disconnected from human trafficking, it's just being used to do other stuff (which it is effective at, but which are separate or even contrary to its stated goals).

  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    Straightzi wrote: »
    Paladin wrote: »
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    But the working that it is doing is disconnected from human trafficking, it's just being used to do other stuff (which it is effective at, but which are separate or even contrary to its stated goals).

    I think a more pointed question is if facial recognition is a tool that can be used to help combat human trafficking. If not, then it doesn't really need ML optimization.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Paladin wrote: »
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    These "anti-human trafficking" organizations do very little to prevent actual human trafficking, Paladin, because they exist to combat a mythologized idea that bears little resemblance to how human trafficking actually occurs.

    Sex worker is not a synonym for trafficking victim.

  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Paladin wrote: »
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    These "anti-human trafficking" organizations do very little to prevent actual human trafficking, Paladin, because they exist to combat a mythologized idea that bears little resemblance to how human trafficking actually occurs.

    Sex worker is not a synonym for trafficking victim.

    It seems like there are at least 3 concepts under scrutiny then: the concept of facial recognition, the people that go in the database, and the technological execution. So if facial recognition isn't the problem, it's the fact that people who aren't being trafficked are included in the database. Got it.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited September 2023
    Paladin wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Paladin wrote: »
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    These "anti-human trafficking" organizations do very little to prevent actual human trafficking, Paladin, because they exist to combat a mythologized idea that bears little resemblance to how human trafficking actually occurs.

    Sex worker is not a synonym for trafficking victim.

    It seems like there are at least 3 concepts under scrutiny then: the concept of facial recognition, the people that go in the database, and the technological execution. So if facial recognition isn't the problem, it's the fact that people who aren't being trafficked are included in the database. Got it.

    No. You are utterly wrong.

    Facial recognition software is a problem, too. The technology has a long and documented history of being flawed and having inherent racial biases baked into it, never mind the unethical and biased ways that law enforcement agencies utilize them.

    Creating databases of people for police to freely peruse is bad, too. Police have to (ostensibly) follow strict procedures in order to gather evidence against someone suspected of a crime. These organizations don't have to follow those rules. In a very real sense, they allow law enforcement agencies to circumvent laws that exist in order to protect people's privacy and right to a fair trial.

    I can't believe I have to spell this all out for you.

    DarkPrimus on
  • Options
    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Paladin wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Paladin wrote: »
    Does it do little to prevent human trafficking? That excerpt you posted makes it sound like it does work, but works too well

    These "anti-human trafficking" organizations do very little to prevent actual human trafficking, Paladin, because they exist to combat a mythologized idea that bears little resemblance to how human trafficking actually occurs.

    Sex worker is not a synonym for trafficking victim.

    It seems like there are at least 3 concepts under scrutiny then: the concept of facial recognition, the people that go in the database, and the technological execution. So if facial recognition isn't the problem, it's the fact that people who aren't being trafficked are included in the database. Got it.

    No. You are utterly wrong.

    Facial recognition software is a problem, too. The technology has a long and documented history of being flawed and having inherent racial biases baked into it, never mind the unethical and biased ways that law enforcement agencies utilize them.

    Creating databases of people for police to freely peruse is bad, too. Police have to (ostensibly) follow strict procedures in order to gather evidence against someone suspected of a crime. These organizations don't have to follow those rules. In a very real sense, they allow law enforcement agencies to circumvent laws that exist in order to protect people's privacy and right to a fair trial.

    I can't believe I have to spell this all out for you.

    You don't have to assume people don't know what they don't know. So if facial recognition as a concept is bad, then the solution is to advocate against it and all its forms. The database and the algorithm are then redundant.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
  • Options
    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited September 2023
    Oh. My god.

    The database would still be bad even if it wasn't created using facial recognition technology.

    That's why I just posted about it being a bad thing, independent of facial recognition technology.

    DarkPrimus on
  • Options
    Houk the NamebringerHouk the Namebringer Nipples The EchidnaRegistered User regular
    sigh

  • Options
    The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    pencils

    7656367.jpg
Sign In or Register to comment.