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I'm not super-opposed to having a writing forum, and if there is going to be any writing discussion, it would pretty much have to be in its own forum, for the reasons you provide. I'm just not convinced there's any demand for it at all, and I'm not sure a subforum with one thread containing five "Wow, it's dead in here" posts really serves any purpose.
I would say if anyone would really like one, it'd be a great time to speak up. It used to be a vibrant (if niche) community with some great discussions and I spent a lot of time in there, but pretty much everyone moved on.
Legos are cool, MOCs are cool, check me out on Rebrickable!
The difference between what tech was 20 years ago and how we interact with it versus today is so wild. We are a long ways off but I do think that is one where we gotta figure out what it actually means in the modern day eventually if it wins out. That is a next week discussion though.
Just to clarify, the proposal text there is directly Cheat and Morninglord's final draft as presented in the structure thread from last week. I know some bits changed from the first write-up Cheat did, so I would say to take that one as it is written in this poll, without any assumptions based on earlier versions.
And of course, if you still prefer it, but would like to see some minor changes, that is exactly what the open text field at the end is for.
There could be a stickied post at the top for general writing chat, although that is pretty dead too, but it would at least let people know writing talk should go there.
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To be honest, we just have to get things done (there's currently a LOT upcoming on our schedule, and overlapping polls is going to lead to burnout and disinterest), and for most of these polls we seem to get 50% of our responses on day one, another 40% over the next 2-3 days, and a final 10% trickle in over the last 3-4 days, so there's almost no value in running a poll for longer than a week.
The final version of the Hybrid Proposal is in the poll. We made that change based on feedback that it was originally too incremental of a transition.
Especially in option 3, there just are some subforums that I think are going to be pretty DOA(sports for one) or only have a small handful of active threads as for example leagues go to offseason.
They are positioned as listed, although nothing is 100% set in stone forever. This is for the launch of Coin Return, and we've always, under any plan, intended to do a proper community appraisal and review several months down the line to see if any aspects of the structure aren't working out as intended. If it turns out that a particular forum like the Sports one is totally dead, then I'm certain that review would probably propose merging it into another forum (Media, probably?).
So, in the end, vote for the one closest to your preference, while understanding that we can adjust and tweak to perfect it down the road.
I feel that for sports in particular, you're going to have some activity year round, and for the threads that are less active at any given moment (say NFL in the spring) they maybe won't drop off the front page so they're easier to find if someone wants to chime in about something.
Broadly speaking, I think both your really large, highly active areas and your really small, fairly niche areas are the ones that most need their own subforums. It's your middle-range stuff - movies, books - that can most easily be combined without impacting ease of conversation.
edit: And anyway, if we make a subforum and it gets no activity, it's not hard to roll it into some other fold. I imagine in the short term, with options 2 or 3, there will be a little occasional reshuffling as we start to better see the shape of this whole thing.
Legos are cool, MOCs are cool, check me out on Rebrickable!
fair enough!
I'm not really sure where they'd live otherwise, without inconveniencing people who are not trying to frequent low-poster count, high update count threads.
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Tabletop & Analog Games is just Critical Failures for the most part, with some extra allowance for board games and CCRPGs, so they'd still live there. I'd love to see them split out if there's demand enough but it just didn't make it into the proposal.
IIRC back in the day each WoW class had its own thread.
I mean youd have needed to
Vbulletin/phpbb/XF have pretty much always supported subforums. Vanilla and discourse (maybe more?) are the weird "needs to be a plugin" ones IIRC.
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They seem to be possible natively without any immediate obvious issues, although we'll have to experiment and make sure they don't cause any unexpected issues with anything else we're doing. If so (in the event that option 1 wins), it might necessitate an audible where those forums get un-nested back up to the top level.
I said at one point that I didn't want to use nested forums, but xenforo does support them, so if the Current Structure proposal wins we can retain them.
I mean it is what it is now, but I’m just imagining what a semi-split vote is going to be like in the response thread.
It's been brought up a few times. A Brolo updates/general game thread has never been shot down as something that couldn't happen next to the specific game threads.
I spent several days working on such a survey where each structure change was asked to be considered in a vacuum, but when we presented it to the survey professionals the response was pretty unanimous that it demanded too much cognition and was unlikely to produce a coherent, actionable result.
We sent them a second draft, much pared down with fewer items and improved clarity, but the feedback wasn't much different, so we decided to do away with individual line items in favor of the proposals that were on the table. And once we landed there it didn't seem as useful to take the leader, put it through another feedback round and try to ratify it, because we're not trying to engrave it in stone anyway.
There also still can be news in the off-season that might get buried in a more active subforum e.g. trades, individual player news, etc
If wrestling threads went to the sport zone, they're alive all year as well
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I guess I disagree with the assessment but happy to know it was at least considered! That may sound facetious, but genuinely I prefer knowing my (or similar to my) thoughts were considered and rejected rather than ignored.
Edit - also I really wanted to make a joke about “survey professionals” but it sounded too mean for people volunteering. We’re all nerds here!
Just to expand on this, Moe's was created because the "T" part of G&T was often pushed down very quickly, as those threads were a bit less active. so Moe's was created to have a place specifically so threads more about tech stuff didn't fall off the first couple pages of the G&T forum extremely quickly. We actually saw an uptick in tech threads once Moe's was created, and there was less duplication of threads because a thread about a topic wasn't 4 pages deep when another was created.
I do think they need to remain separate for the same reasons. Games and Technology are different, and should be treated as such. Option 2 had no place for technology specific stuff.
And I suppose my only genuine answer can be "fuck if I know?" I just hope we can move to CR without big fights and/or a bunch of people Irish Goodbyeing out of here.
My thoughts are pretty similar. I still have no idea what the future in model 3 (or even 2 to a lesser degree) actually looks like! The unification of sometimes very disparate moderating/posting styles suggested in that option is not an easy task, as much as I want it to be. Because of that I still haven't been quite able to glean what that future looks like from discussions we've had so far. There are a lot of directly conflicting opinions being raised in the discussion threads, the vibes have shifted to and fro several times, but hey gotta shoot your shot either way so we'll see where we wind up.
yeah critical failures is already this
I'll have a rethink then.
Thanks
I fully understand that it will be an awkward and difficult adjustment period and that there are tradeoffs involved; it is my opinion that these are necessary growing pains, and that without them this place is just going to continue dying off and all the effort and argument expended on CoRe is going to have been a waste.
I also understand that there are folks who vehemently disagree with this position. I'm sympathetic to some of the counterarguments, and less sympathetic to others. If keeping things the same is the result that wins then hey, I hope it'll turn out that I was wrong about that being a bad thing, and the new rules are sufficient to fix what's broke around here
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The idea of the hybrid one and I believe the full restructure is that all subforums, every single one, will have the ability to mark threads as being more or less strict about being on topic. Gnts current more on topic feel will only carry over if thread creators want it to be so, by choice.
The current brolo thread from se will fit straight into games without changes, and without any restrictions on what can be talked about at all. Just tag it. The tag names are still being worked out. Its unlikely to suddenly diverge off games because the se one almost never does, that isn't evenly remotely a worry. Even if it did temporarily nobody is going to care. Nobody does in gnt now.