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Join us in the [Anime] thread to end all [Anime] threads

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Posts

  • AspectVoidAspectVoid Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    So no, you don't disagree?

    Your post is just a really weird, gibberishy way of saying, 'poorly run organizations suck. If they're poorly run, they need to be fixed.' Which is in no way contrary to 'everyone should have a union.'

    No, I said everyone having a union sucks. Everyone I know has been screwed over by unions. Forcing them into a union is garbage. And despite that I will support unions because there are people unions help. But they most certainly do not help everyone, and forcing people into a union is trash.

    Anzekay on
    PSN|AspectVoid
  • minor incidentminor incident publicly subsidized! privately profitable!Registered User, Transition Team regular
    edited April 14
    There is basically no worker who couldn’t be better off in the US with a union, and arguing that is insane because you’re basically trying to claim that US labor laws take care of people better than a union can.

    Anzekay on
    Hell, New Jersey, it said on the letter. Delivered without comment. So be it!
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Everyone* having a union has actually proven very successful in other countries

    Anzekay on
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  • AnsagoAnsago Formerly QuarterMaster Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Certainly they are not all perfect, no organization really is, but 9 times out of 10 they are much better than the alternative (no union). Rising tide lifts all boats, etc.

    Anzekay on
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Some unions dont work for labor's benefit, but no employer ever has. Have to pick a side.

    Anzekay on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • Gabriel_PittGabriel_Pitt Stepped in it Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    AspectVoid wrote: »
    So no, you don't disagree?

    Your post is just a really weird, gibberishy way of saying, 'poorly run organizations suck. If they're poorly run, they need to be fixed.' Which is in no way contrary to 'everyone should have a union.'

    No, I said everyone having a union sucks. Everyone I know has been screwed over bunions. Forcing them into a union is garbage. And despite that I will support unions because there are people unions help. But they most certainly do not help everyone, and forcing people into a union is trash.

    Everyone should have a union. If you feel otherwise, make a case for it instead of shaking your fist and shouting at clouds?

    Remember, anecdotes are worthless, and your claim 'everyone I know got screwed' is as irrelevant as saying 'the social safety net should be abolished because I heard a story one time about a woman who used food stamps and drove a nice car.'

    Anzekay on
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    The implication of "Everybody should be in a Union" is that the Union is well run.

    Anzekay on
  • HydropoloHydropolo Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    AspectVoid wrote: »
    So no, you don't disagree?

    Your post is just a really weird, gibberishy way of saying, 'poorly run organizations suck. If they're poorly run, they need to be fixed.' Which is in no way contrary to 'everyone should have a union.'

    No, I said everyone having a union sucks. Everyone I know has been screwed over by unions. Forcing them into a union is garbage. And despite that I will support unions because there are people unions help. But they most certainly do not help everyone, and forcing people into a union is trash.

    So you'd rather the company do the screwing? Seriously, even assuming what you say is true and not hyperbolic, workers have a chance of fixing their unions if they are problematic. The companies they work for, not so much.

    Anzekay on
  • Man in the MistsMan in the Mists Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    The implication of "Everybody should be in a Union" is that the Union is well run.

    Yeah, a union with shitty leaders would be better served booting and replacing said leaders.

    Anzekay on
  • GundiGundi Serious Bismuth Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Started watching Bravern. This show is dumb. I kinda love it.

    Anzekay on
  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    Anzekay on
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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    There is at least one California Union that argued that their members should be able to be paid below minimum wage as I recall. They exist, but it takes weird circumstances to cause it.

    Anzekay on
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Hazy + Flow SeaRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    Gundi wrote: »
    Started watching Bravern. This show is dumb. I kinda love it.

    it's the dumbest

    Anzekay on
    Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | Wish List
  • DiscoPirateBunnyDiscoPirateBunny CaliforniaRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    This might be the crux of the issue right there.

    "A union was bad and screwed over the workers" is a data point that reflects on the leadership of the union, but does in no way do anything to compare the results to what would've happened without a union. "Grass is greener" is a significant human mental hurdle for a reason, but it was twisted in particular to equate "bad unions" or "bad union leaders" with "unions are bad"...equated by those who had a vested interest in abolishing unions entirely.

    Anzekay on
    "Let's take a look at the scores! The girls are at the square root of Pi, while the boys are still at a crudely drawn picture of a duck. Clearly, it's anybody's game!"
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    A union that acts like a cop union basically. You reported one of your co workers violating lock out tag out? Fuck you, we won't represent you and we will defend anyone who retaliates. That sort of thing.

    This to be clear basically never happens.

    What's more common is "fuck you got mine" where the senior employees negotiate good shit for themselves and the juniors all get fucked. So from the juniors perspective they might well be better off without.

    Fortunately most unions are coming around on that being a bad idea.

    Anzekay on
  • HacksawHacksaw J. Duggan Esq. Wrestler at LawRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    No two-tier systems in my union. And thank goodness.

    Anzekay on
  • HevachHevach Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    I know of unions that screwed over members. The UAW has a number of times that they sold out some members for the immediate enrichment of others*. My own job would have been UAW a generation ago but we got dumped like the janitors before us for overtime benefits that have since evaporated, and now I'm SPFPA and the janitors haven't been unionized since the 80's.

    Thing is, you want to see what happens with no UAW you look at Tesla, where everybody is worse off than the most serially screwed UAW workers. SPFPA isn't great but I know people with my same job outside of the union making half what I do and he's gotten in several fights with armed assailants in the last year while the greatest danger I suffered was when I dropped my favorite pen off the catwalk and never found it.

    Getting screwed by a union almost always still manges to be better than getting screwed directly by your employer.


    *-very important to emphasize that they just won a huge victory for those same workers last year.

    Anzekay on
  • SonelanSonelan Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    I know its not related to union news but I figure this thread would be able to answer this question for me about my union. If I keep getting ghosted by my local stewards when I ask them about my work situation is going above the local something I can do?

    Anzekay on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    I don't think they are worse for their members on average. They can be bad for some of their members. Or worse for some members then others. But still better for their members on average then the alternatives.

    Basically "I got screwed by a union" can be 100% true, even for a member, and your statement that they are better on average is still true.


    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    A union that acts like a cop union basically. You reported one of your co workers violating lock out tag out? Fuck you, we won't represent you and we will defend anyone who retaliates. That sort of thing.

    This to be clear basically never happens.

    Cop unions are also generally good for cops. Good benefits, good pay, etc, etc. Not so great for a lot of other people though. Obviously. But even shitty cop unions get their members (or most of them) better stuff then they would get without one.

    Anzekay on
  • RatherDashingRatherDashing Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    My personal experience with unions is not being able to be part of them, and knowing people who were in unions who felt pretty screwed by them. But I still instinctively feel that the problem of bad unions would get better if there were more of them, not worse. Unions being more widespread, available, accepted and understood would probably lead to better behaved unions in general.

    Anzekay on
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Bears The Name FreedomRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    PLA wrote: »
    cj iwakura wrote: »
    JJK manga stuff:
    I'm really not feeling where this is going. Not only is Sukuna a less interesting villain than Geto or not-Geto(he was more fun as an anti-hero ridealong), but all the resolutions are just unsatisfying. Gojo should've been the one to take out Kenjaku, not Yuta after some random comedian got him to... let his guard down because he's silly, I guess?

    And now we have endless chapters of people fighting Sukuna over and over, only for his underling to go 'oh he's not even taking this seriously lol'.

    Well guess what, Gege, maybe no one should take the writing seriously, either.
    Gotta get in a guy who kind of stands there bored while every character in the cast take turns to individually fail over the course of months of publication. At least they try a fun jumpjutsu every now and then.
    If you mean who I think you mean, I think he always avoids getting involved because he thinks it's the best way to stay alive... And he's probably right.

    Anzekay on
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  • NaphtaliNaphtali Hazy + Flow SeaRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    mashle is alright

    but uh

    who does a clipshow after 6 episodes?
    yes, yes, I know it's they're trying to save budget and couldn't make 13 episodes to fill their slot so they did this instead

    Anzekay on
    Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | Wish List
  • enc0reenc0re Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    I don’t like that we are taking “everyone I have ever known has been screwed by the union” at face value. The vast majority of the time, I cannot think of a single counterexample I have personally encountered, where someone squealed about being screwed by the union they either:

    1. Had no idea how far out of line they were and how much worse off the would have been without representation.
    -OR-
    2. Had positively insane ideas of what they were entitled to, often at the expense of other union members, and were Pikachu-face shocked when people with actual experience didn’t see it their way.

    Anzekay on
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    shryke wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    I don't think they are worse for their members on average. They can be bad for some of their members. Or worse for some members then others. But still better for their members on average then the alternatives.

    Basically "I got screwed by a union" can be 100% true, even for a member, and your statement that they are better on average is still true.


    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    A union that acts like a cop union basically. You reported one of your co workers violating lock out tag out? Fuck you, we won't represent you and we will defend anyone who retaliates. That sort of thing.

    This to be clear basically never happens.

    Cop unions are also generally good for cops. Good benefits, good pay, etc, etc. Not so great for a lot of other people though. Obviously. But even shitty cop unions get their members (or most of them) better stuff then they would get without one.

    Cop unions have gotten lots of cops killed, so...not really. I used lock out/tag out an example for a reason. You mess with that, people end up dead.

    Anzekay on
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    I don't think they are worse for their members on average. They can be bad for some of their members. Or worse for some members then others. But still better for their members on average then the alternatives.

    Basically "I got screwed by a union" can be 100% true, even for a member, and your statement that they are better on average is still true.


    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    A union that acts like a cop union basically. You reported one of your co workers violating lock out tag out? Fuck you, we won't represent you and we will defend anyone who retaliates. That sort of thing.

    This to be clear basically never happens.

    Cop unions are also generally good for cops. Good benefits, good pay, etc, etc. Not so great for a lot of other people though. Obviously. But even shitty cop unions get their members (or most of them) better stuff then they would get without one.

    Cop unions have gotten lots of cops killed, so...not really. I used lock out/tag out an example for a reason. You mess with that, people end up dead.

    Sure that happens. But you've got much better odds of just serving out your time without anything like that happening.

    Anzekay on
  • AbacusAbacus Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    On two-tier systems, I have never seen an union that has sold out for one without losing a significant amount of power, or just be turned into an employer mouthpiece.

    In other words, their defacto dissolution.

    So, "Everybody should have an union" comes with the obvious "and that union should be funcional".

    Anzekay on
  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    I don't think they are worse for their members on average. They can be bad for some of their members. Or worse for some members then others. But still better for their members on average then the alternatives.

    Basically "I got screwed by a union" can be 100% true, even for a member, and your statement that they are better on average is still true.


    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    I am not sure how “a bad Union” is worse than no Union. It would be shockingly difficult for a union to be so bad workers are less well off

    A union that acts like a cop union basically. You reported one of your co workers violating lock out tag out? Fuck you, we won't represent you and we will defend anyone who retaliates. That sort of thing.

    This to be clear basically never happens.

    Cop unions are also generally good for cops. Good benefits, good pay, etc, etc. Not so great for a lot of other people though. Obviously. But even shitty cop unions get their members (or most of them) better stuff then they would get without one.

    Cop unions have gotten lots of cops killed, so...not really. I used lock out/tag out an example for a reason. You mess with that, people end up dead.

    Cop unions get complicated by cops just being a legalized gang. It is almost impossible to suss out what is because they will terrorize politicians and each other into compliance, and what is because they can drum up a lot of support from the public to force politicians hands.

    Anzekay on
  • LasbrookLasbrook It takes a lot to make a stew When it comes to me and youRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    Alan
    Naphtali wrote: »
    mashle is alright

    but uh

    who does a clipshow after 6 episodes?
    yes, yes, I know it's they're trying to save budget and couldn't make 13 episodes to fill their slot so they did this instead

    Bucchigiri.

    Anzekay on
  • TNTrooperTNTrooper Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Naphtali wrote: »
    mashle is alright

    but uh

    who does a clipshow after 6 episodes?
    yes, yes, I know it's they're trying to save budget and couldn't make 13 episodes to fill their slot so they did this instead

    Girls und Panzer and Arifureta had a 5.5 recap episode due to their productions being trainwrecks.

    Anzekay on
    steam_sig.png
  • ArcTangentArcTangent Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    TNTrooper wrote: »
    Naphtali wrote: »
    mashle is alright

    but uh

    who does a clipshow after 6 episodes?
    yes, yes, I know it's they're trying to save budget and couldn't make 13 episodes to fill their slot so they did this instead

    Girls und Panzer and Arifureta had a 5.5 recap episode due to their productions being trainwrecks.

    Regalia was such a train wreck that it canceled its broadcast for quality control reasons after four episodes and came back the next season.

    But doesn't compare to the absolute clusterfuck of God Eater. It managed three episodes, took a week off, two more episodes, another week off, repeat that one more time, then said fuck it, see you in six months for the last four episodes. This was in 2015 too, so no covid excuse.

    Anzekay on
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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Cops aren't labor, and they don't have solidarity with anyone but themselves.

    Anzekay on
  • AnzekayAnzekay Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 14
    PLA wrote: »
    The rest of Himmel's party all had more normal perspectives on their interactions with Frieren, and gaining comparable experience to apply gives her new insight to what they saw, and discernment for what she saw but didn't take active interest in.

    this is particularly apt for Frieren observing the interactions and growing closeness of Fern and Stark, even more so with Sein's observations that he remarkes on to her.

    Anzekay on
  • HydropoloHydropolo Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Cops aren't labor, and they don't have solidarity with anyone but themselves.

    Cops are labor, but cops are labor who are complicit with capital. Unlike capital, cops in theory, could rejoin labor. They just have to want to. Capital never can.

    Anzekay on
  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Anzekay wrote: »
    PLA wrote: »
    The rest of Himmel's party all had more normal perspectives on their interactions with Frieren, and gaining comparable experience to apply gives her new insight to what they saw, and discernment for what she saw but didn't take active interest in.

    this is particularly apt for Frieren observing the interactions and growing closeness of Fern and Stark, even more so with Sein's observations that he remarkes on to her.
    Sein's "Just start dating already!" scene was him stating what the audience was screaming. And I still think one of the high points of the anime is Fern and Stark's dance - the roles they played might be false, but it's quite clear that the emotions they share while dancing are definitely not.

    It's also hilarious in the chapter where they finally go on a date (good boy, Stark, for using your words, even if you did start off asking her out as a bit of revenge) that both of them go to Frieren for advice.

    Anzekay on
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  • enc0reenc0re Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    This is a massive tangent, but as pro labor as I am, I do think there are some jobs that should not be permitted to unionize. I haven’t fully thought it through, but basically I draw the line if you are authorized to enact state violence.

    Military, police, prison guards; I want them to be treated well and have good jobs. I am not comfortable with those positions being unionized.

    Anzekay on
  • AnzekayAnzekay Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 14
    Anzekay wrote: »
    PLA wrote: »
    The rest of Himmel's party all had more normal perspectives on their interactions with Frieren, and gaining comparable experience to apply gives her new insight to what they saw, and discernment for what she saw but didn't take active interest in.

    this is particularly apt for Frieren observing the interactions and growing closeness of Fern and Stark, even more so with Sein's observations that he remarkes on to her.
    Sein's "Just start dating already!" scene was him stating what the audience was screaming. And I still think one of the high points of the anime is Fern and Stark's dance - the roles they played might be false, but it's quite clear that the emotions they share while dancing are definitely not.

    It's also hilarious in the chapter where they finally go on a date (good boy, Stark, for using your words, even if you did start off asking her out as a bit of revenge) that both of them go to Frieren for advice.

    more Frieren spoilery stuff
    I feel very confident in my belief that if Sein was around they both would've asked him instead haha

    Anzekay on
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Hazy + Flow SeaRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    post anime, frieren manga spoilers
    I miss Sein, wonder when he's going pop back up again, if ever

    Anzekay on
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  • MatevMatev Cero Miedo Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Martial jobs come built in with incentives to be treated well since you tend to not want to piss off the people you’re giving weapons and combat training to

    Anzekay on
    "Go down, kick ass, and set yourselves up as gods, that's our Prime Directive!"
    Hail Hydra
  • AnzekayAnzekay Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 14
    Naphtali wrote: »
    post anime, frieren manga spoilers
    I miss Sein, wonder when he's going pop back up again, if ever
    I feel pretty sure that he will eventually, likely with his friend in tow. They'll probably run into each other further north

    Anzekay on
  • ZibblsnrtZibblsnrt Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited April 14
    Hydropolo wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Cops aren't labor, and they don't have solidarity with anyone but themselves.

    Cops are labor, but cops are labor who are complicit with capital. Unlike capital, cops in theory, could rejoin labor. They just have to want to. Capital never can.

    Cops, as they currently exist, are management. Rejoining labour would require a comprehensive enough change that the result might as well be an entirely different profession afterwards.

    Anzekay on
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