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Need help with Piano stuff
altmann
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Hi,
This is sort of a 2 parter because i don't know where to really ask this:
1. I have been interested in learning an instrument. I know this is sorta.. insane, but mainly i want to learn the piano because I love listening to Beethoven. I would say the 3rd part of Piano Sonata 14 is one of my favorite songs ever. So my question is, how hard is Beethoven in general? I know people can learn guitar and play random nirvana songs but i can't really place "piano" songs in any sort of difficulty level.
2. Where does one go to see classical piano played? I live near DC but i just moved here like a month ago. Any help is appreciated. (I also have a strong interest in seeing a symphony play).
Thanks!
This is sort of a 2 parter because i don't know where to really ask this:
1. I have been interested in learning an instrument. I know this is sorta.. insane, but mainly i want to learn the piano because I love listening to Beethoven. I would say the 3rd part of Piano Sonata 14 is one of my favorite songs ever. So my question is, how hard is Beethoven in general? I know people can learn guitar and play random nirvana songs but i can't really place "piano" songs in any sort of difficulty level.
2. Where does one go to see classical piano played? I live near DC but i just moved here like a month ago. Any help is appreciated. (I also have a strong interest in seeing a symphony play).
Thanks!
Imperator of the Gigahorse Jockeys.
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
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I don't want to discourage you from learning the piano, but be prepared to have to put a lot of work into learning anything by him. There's a reason any retard with a few months of guitar can pound out some songs by Nirvana (drunken idiot) and why it takes years of training to play anything by Beethoven (drunken genius).
Anyways, the piano is one of the easier instruments to learn, especially because the keys "line up" with the music. find a music instructor and practice, practice, practice.
also, classical music is pretty easy to play, because most songs are structured and follow basic mathematical concepts. well, once you learn how to read and understand music and play the piano, that is.
You won't be able to play it in a week if you actually start learning piano, especially if you can't already read music in Treble and Bass clef. If you're a musician who just wants to start in on piano, then you'll find it a little easier. If you're starting from scratch, though, prepare to take a few years before you're comfortable enough with the instrument to play "real" music, or scores that aren't dumbed down.
As for number 2, look for concerts in like, newspapers and whatnot. Most of the time there'll be something in the newspaper if there's a large concert.
I would say that any musician that doesn't learn to read music is going to fail miserably as a musician. They may be able to play rock/pop/blues on the piano, but in general? Almost everyone who actually does music for anything other than a party gag will need to know how to read music. I can think of pretty much 2 exceptions, and even then, we're talking about pop musicians.
Um....
Piano is also one of the only instruments that can play in polyphony with itself, which makes it harder. Trust me, as a Pianist who also plays Horn, Sax, and Guitar, piano is not one of the easier instruments to learn, beyond playing Mary had a little lamb.
That... that doesn't make it easier, and it's wrong, unless you're talking about the classical period as opposed to classical in the more broad term. The structure of the song isn't exactly what increases the difficulty. Just because I can say "Hey, Debussy used this run before, just now it's in octaves in both hands and faster!" doesn't mean I can play it.
Color me impressed. Anyways, I'll reiterate that piano is not one of the easier instruments to learn. An instructor will help immensely. My best advice is to practice your scales. Constantly.
I ended up taking music theory and piano together at a local community college. (That's usually how it is, taking music theory and then taking a class on a specific instrument.) So, what we learned in music theory tied into what we were learning in piano class and vise versa. I, personally, didn't need to take music theory as I already knew quite a bit from playing flute for a 8 years and trombone for 2 years. So, I could already read both treble and bass clef.
The most difficult part for me, though, was getting my hands to do different things at the same time.
As for an answer to your second question, I, also, recommend looking in the newspaper. Often times you'll find concerts like that at local venues, and perhaps even at a nearby college/university.
Dennis Chambers is an accomplished drummer that can't read music. Chet Baker, Wes Montgomery, need I list more? I'm not saying that you shouldn't learn to read music, I'm saying that there are people out there, accomplished musicians, that didn't. It doesn't take away from their talent, they just never learned.
As a classically trained and award winning pianist who also plays violin and guitar, I'm inclined to disagree with you. If you can learn to read music and understand that each music note corresponds to a key on the keyboard, you can pretty much play any song ever written with practice. And bringing up the fact that the piano that can play in polyphony with itself means nothing to people on a video game forum who routinely do one thing with one hand (wiggle the joystick) while doing something completely different with the right (press the buttons).
We're trying to encourage the guy to play the piano, not scare him away, remember?
Anyway, Beethoven has a nice wide range of easy to very difficult pieces - you'll find a good number of his themes in books for piano students. That said, if you're starting with a blank page with absolutely no music experience beyond listening to it, it'll take you a decent amount of time to get to the point where you can start playing Beethoven - a few months to a couple years of practice, depending on how much time per day you put into it and how quickly you take to it.
If you're serious about wanting to start up, I"d suggest finding a teacher - you can teach yourself, but your time will be much better spent with someone who knows what they're doing. Without without a teacher, (they'll have their own recommendations) I'd recommend the "Classics to Moderns" series of books - it's got a nice range of pieces that are fun to play and aren't the kiddy kinds of books.
I did end up finding some nice concerts I'm going to go to. I found that the National Symphony Orchestra plays at the Kennedy center so I've got reminders on my schedule now for some upcoming shows (well, august).
It's interesting, i have this idea that it's really hard to get your hands to do 2 things differently at once and then i realize I'm typing this post and they're doing just that. Also, playing games is very similar (in my mind) to a repetition-like movement.
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
Probably should. Since 3 out of a field doesn't really make a point against "A few exceptions". Also, exclusively Jazz, man? It's a scalar language which has its roots in improv, I'd hardly say that three jazz players constitute a plethora of skilled musicians who can't read music. Without trying to disrespect a field within which I have very little proficiency, Jazz is a hell of a lot closer to the pop side of things than the classical side of things. Not that jazz isn't difficult and full of its own quircks and stylistics, there is a huge difference between a skilled musician and someone who can play jazz really well by ear.
And to fend off your response, no, I don't think that classical is the only route, I think that anyone who only plays or writes in one style is a bad musician. They may be a good performer on their instrument, in fact, they could be the best performer on their instrument in the world, but they're a bad musician. Musicians can read music. End of story.
As a classically trained and award winning pianist who also plays violin and guitar, I'm inclined to disagree with you. If you can learn to read music and understand that each music note corresponds to a key on the keyboard, you can pretty much play any song ever written with practice. And bringing up the fact that the piano that can play in polyphony with itself means nothing to people on a video game forum who routinely do one thing with one hand (wiggle the joystick) while doing something completely different with the right (press the buttons).
We're trying to encourage the guy to play the piano, not scare him away, remember?[/QUOTE]
No, no you can't. That's dumb. I want you to find someone, teach them to read music, then slap one of the more hardcore Chopin or Ligeti etudes in front of them, and see if they can play it. They can't. You know why? They don't have the technique. Hell, they wouldn't even have the technique to play the notes, let alone play them correctly. Hell, find someone who off the bat can play even 8 different dynamics on the piano. Hell, find someone who can fucking play with any sense of tone right off the bat.
As for the ability to play video games being equal to piano... that's also dumb. No one has to push a joystick with 2-5 different accentuation with one hand playing a game. Nor do they, most of the time, have their hands working in opposition. Most games also don't have the sophistication to change the response in multiple ways simply based on the strength with which the command is generated, beyond a simple soft-hard way, on analog sticks. Saying that there's a connection between a single control scheme split between two hands and having multiple ideas, dynamics, tones, articulations, durations is absurd. It's like connecting the ability to drive in Cruisin' USA with the ability to fly an F-16. Sure, there are similarities but that doesn't mean that an expert Cruisin' player will be able to jump in a cockpit and land on Carriers.
And yeah, we're trying to encourage him, but lying to him about it being a really easy instrument is going to make him dissapointed and discouraged when he starts playing and realizes how misled he was.
A lot of people I know that learned another instrument that only plays a single line of music (like violin) before the piano had a hard time keeping track of both hands at the same time, while people who learned piano first had a much easier time dealing with two hands. It's kindof a tradeoff - learning another instrument first will give you a grounding in music that will help, but keeping track of more than one line of music can be a hard thing to learn if you've only had to deal with one in past experience.
Anyway, I just wanted to reiterate what another poster said: you can find many arrangements of many 'levels'. There are some versions of 'Canon in D' that can be learned in 8 hours even if you've never played the piano... and others that even a skilled musician would struggle with.
Are you looking to play an orchestral-rendition with virtually all of the notes and no abbreviation?
If so, you're looking at quite a bit of time (way more than a few days or 'a week or two') to flawlessly play anything by Beethoven.
I thought the same thing when I started playing piano. I couldn't figure out why it was so hard seeing as how I can type pretty well. I guess the thing is, is that when you are typing you are only really pushing down one or two keys at once, where as there is a set rhythm and note length in piano music that seems to make it a bit difficult. I don't know though, that's just me. It may be different for you.
By all means, piano isn't hard to understand, I mean. I was playing scales and triads long before I took the piano class, but the class did help greatly to play songs.
I'd like to say though that I don't in any way think that piano is something I'll just "pick up in a week or two" I'm simply asking questions. I know that if I did it, it would be a longer term thing with the goal in mind of being able to play those kinds of pieces.
Bramble - your point on the multiple keys at the same time does have merit. In fact, I'd say in looking at it, the keyboard is so much more simple than a piano in those terms as we have an analog stream of keystrokes not a multiple stroke thing.
i imagine piano is like typing this whole sentence out at once..
ae;lnisf'avincla;ksdjfwe[nic;wlkndl;afkjsaf;jkldsf;ja;afeiow;nvc'woeif
I can so do this lol.
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
Also,
I recommend a teacher.
best of luck!
It's also motivation; in the example above, I was, admittedly, much less mature then I am now; if I tried again, I'd probably do much better with sticking with the early stuff.
Summary: Keep your eye on your final goal of playing well, and don't get frustrated.