In my mind 'uber' implies being practically unable to one-shot, with the ability to one shot almost anything else. Or at least come pretty close to either of those things.
That's a pretty iffy definition. I mean, look at Deoxyes. Certain forms can certainly one-shot almost anything, but just about anything will one-shot them.
In my mind 'uber' implies being practically unable to one-shot, with the ability to one shot almost anything else. Or at least come pretty close to either of those things.
That's a pretty iffy definition. I mean, look at Deoxyes. Certain forms can certainly one-shot almost anything, but just about anything will one-shot them.
defense form with recover?
But now the defense form can't OHKO other things.
Neither form fits the definition of "Can't be one-shot and can one-shot almost anything"
True enough with the 'uber' definition. I guess 'hits pretty hard but also is insanely tough to take down, even without various recovery/stat boosting moves' would be better for 'uber'?
And now I realize that I still haven't trained up a single giant dragon or godzilla of doom. Time to remedy that..
Aggril on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Tyranitar isn't a Dragon. And I agree that Metagross is way more annoying than TTar. We'll just have to wait and see what Smogon debate.
Smogon is not the Pokemon Police.
Munkus Beaver on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2007
I mean come the fuck on.
Mach punch.
Tyrantitar dies.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Uhh...
Hitmontop?
Even with Choice Band + STAB + Max Attack, it will only do about 177 damage at MOST to a -Def, 0 IV, 0 EV Hitmontop.
RedMageDarion on
Pokemon White - 3954.6369.6328
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2007
Just about any fighting attack in the game can beat the slow as all fuck tyranitar.
If they put tyranitar on the uber list, I am declaring a state of shenanigans.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
For those who don't know, i will be doing these random announcements to inform everyone
the name Shujin Katana is banned, I am Cunty, the new Shujin Katana, champion and tower tycoon
Cunty on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Toxicroak can switch in on that and use brick break
Since he's naturally faster than Tyranitar.
Or the other guy can use a STAB earthquake.
Seriously. Tyranitar is not that big of a threat. He's rarely been the deciding factor in any of my matches.
I mean but shit. Fucking weavile, guys.
Fucking weavile.
Munkus Beaver on
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Meh, tyranitar is alright but he is slow as all hell get out. I had to fight several in a tournament at metrocon and even though it was a tyranitars ability that killed my in the end. I still fought through 4 or five tyranitars in other peoples teams and it wasn't too bad.
Hey Blue, wherever you are, why does your Gabe know Quick Attack when it has the Choice Specs?
Does not compute.
Revenge KOs on guys really in the red, and to finish off Focus Sash-ers, most likely.
Choice specs is actually not a permanent part of that pokemon! Also it was that or hyper beam.
I am extremely nervous now that I know you are putting such thought into my movesets and pokemon. However, make no mistake, I have also been scheming. Our coming match will be setting a record for "things I know about the other guy's team." It ought to be very interesting and I predict a 10:1 switching to attack ratio. Lord help me if you get stealth rock up.
I wasn't scheming, just curious. And yeah, QuickAttack is better than Hyper Beam for your purposes.
Quick question guys: Choice Scarf or Specs on a Timid Mismagius? Being able to outrun stuff like Gengar, Garchomp, and Weavile is fun (although with the latter I'm dead even if I go first), but Missy doesn't seem to be dealing a lot of damage to kill stuff before falling. But if she has the Specs, she's liable to not outspeed the same things she's trying to kill.
I wasn't going to put a choice item on mine. I want it to have will-o-wisp, and that's a little awkward as my only move. On the other hand, it's also awkward to be outsped by the physical sweeper I'm trying to burn. Hm.
edit: How does Pokerus spread? Is it only between party Pokemon? What triggers the spread -- steps, time, battles?
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Uhh...
Hitmontop?
Even with Choice Band + STAB + Max Attack, it will only do about 177 damage at MOST to a -Def, 0 IV, 0 EV Hitmontop.
Hitmontop is not a counter to Tyranitar. Assuming you brought along Hitmontop -- and assuming Tyranitar used Crunch instead of Earthquake or Stone Edge (both of which would OHKO hitmontop), and assuming you correctly predict that Crunch and swap in Hitmontop, all you do is give the enemy a free swap out to a million different sweepers or defensive tanks as you mach punch (or use any fighting move), which can take advantage of Hitmontops low speed to either set up as you switch out or simply kill you outright, leaving Tyranitar open to CBCrunch next time you let him get in without worrying about Hitmontop.
The only flaw in Tyranitar is his difficulty switching in easy. He hits massivly hard, can escape at a moments notice without worrying about Pursuit, and has a massive 150 Base Special Defense when sandstorm is in play (i.e. always). Plus, if you mispredict choice band and get a Dragon Dancer, then your really fucked.
Whoa that special defense boost could potentially boost Ttar to uber status? Wow.
Anyway if he goes uber he won't be banned until next tournament.
With Sandstream boost and 0 EVs, Tyranitar gets 354 Sp. Def. That's the equivalent of having a base stat of 174.5. Only Regice, Probopass and Shuckle can beat that. Using 174 as his base in Sp. Def, his average base stat is 112.3. Celebi, Mew and Manaphy are at 100. Groudon and Kyogre are at 111.7. Mewtwo, Dialga and Palkia are at 113.3. It's not the best measurement of his power (it doesn't take all of his weaknesses into account) but it helps put it into perspective.
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Breloom can't OHKO with Mach Punch, but it can switch in to anything but a CH Stone Edge and deal ~80% before going down.
Leetness Incarnate on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Uhh...
Hitmontop?
Even with Choice Band + STAB + Max Attack, it will only do about 177 damage at MOST to a -Def, 0 IV, 0 EV Hitmontop.
Hitmontop is not a counter to Tyranitar. Assuming you brought along Hitmontop -- and assuming Tyranitar used Crunch instead of Earthquake or Stone Edge (both of which would OHKO hitmontop), and assuming you correctly predict that Crunch and swap in Hitmontop, all you do is give the enemy a free swap out to a million different sweepers or defensive tanks as you mach punch (or use any fighting move), which can take advantage of Hitmontops low speed to either set up as you switch out or simply kill you outright, leaving Tyranitar open to CBCrunch next time you let him get in without worrying about Hitmontop.
The only flaw in Tyranitar is his difficulty switching in easy. He hits massivly hard, can escape at a moments notice without worrying about Pursuit, and has a massive 150 Base Special Defense when sandstorm is in play (i.e. always). Plus, if you mispredict choice band and get a Dragon Dancer, then your really fucked.
The hitmontop would only die if T-tar was using earthquake (risky if the opponent is using fliers) or Stone Edge (30% chance to miss) and holding a choice band.
If the current Pokemon died and Weavile came out, then we're talking about fubar central. I can't tell you how many times I have had to sacrifice pokemon just so I could switch in my one or two pokemon that could handle a Weavile. There are very few things that can survive the first shot from a weavile then outspeed it for the second shot.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
Uhh...
Hitmontop?
Even with Choice Band + STAB + Max Attack, it will only do about 177 damage at MOST to a -Def, 0 IV, 0 EV Hitmontop.
Hitmontop is not a counter to Tyranitar. Assuming you brought along Hitmontop -- and assuming Tyranitar used Crunch instead of Earthquake or Stone Edge (both of which would OHKO hitmontop), and assuming you correctly predict that Crunch and swap in Hitmontop, all you do is give the enemy a free swap out to a million different sweepers or defensive tanks as you mach punch (or use any fighting move), which can take advantage of Hitmontops low speed to either set up as you switch out or simply kill you outright, leaving Tyranitar open to CBCrunch next time you let him get in without worrying about Hitmontop.
The only flaw in Tyranitar is his difficulty switching in easy. He hits massivly hard, can escape at a moments notice without worrying about Pursuit, and has a massive 150 Base Special Defense when sandstorm is in play (i.e. always). Plus, if you mispredict choice band and get a Dragon Dancer, then your really fucked.
Stone Edge will NOT OHKO. If it hits. Unless it's a critical. Neutral Defense, 0 IV, 0 EV Hitmontop will take 197 damage MAX.
Earthquake WILL OHKO this same Hitmontop. But with 31 IVs in Defense, it's not guaranteed. Only dealing ~190-226. Hitmontop's minimum HP is 210.
Sandstream could likely finish him off, but the point stands. Hitmontop is a pretty tough little fella.
RedMageDarion on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2007
Breloom is faster than T-tar anyway.
He can use brick break or force palm, both of which kill T-tar.
Munkus Beaver on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2007
T-tar is 4x weak to one of the most common attack types in the game, and double weak to the most common physical sweep move in the game. Any fighting move that has 60 base power should kill your basic T-tar, and any STAB earthquake will decimate him.
Munkus Beaver on
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He can use brick break or force palm, both of which kill T-tar.
Unless it was a dragon dancing T-tar that predicted the switch. Then your whole team is likely in for a world of hurt.
Vray on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2007
I can't tell you how many times my D-dancing T-tar has died after getting off a DD.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
T-tar is 4x weak to one of the most common attack types in the game, and double weak to the most common physical sweep move in the game. Any fighting move that has 60 base power should kill your basic T-tar, and any STAB earthquake will decimate him.
Only one in ten will die to STAB Earthquake? Must be tough Pokemon.
Breloom is the best Tyranitar counter in the game, and theres a million different situations people can invnet where Tyranitar gets his ass handed to him by a wide variety of pokemon with fighting moves and we all can huzzah at taking him down a peg, but the fact is, if he is used correctly -- he wont be fighting those pokemon except to cause them massive amounts of damage as they try to switch in.
I'm not saying hes Uber, I havnt had a major problem with him myself (in certain games I have though, and I can definitely see where this debate on smogon is coming from), but people are seriously underestimating the amount of carnage he can cause in both the short term (massive choice band STAB moves like crunch or stone edge) and long term (sandstorm wrecking leftovers and picking away at your team).
*edit*
I can't tell you how many times my D-dancing T-tar has died after getting off a DD.
I lol'd. He's not supposed to become invincible after getting off a DD.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2007
I would dare say that Bronzong is one of the best T-tar counters, especially if they are choice banding.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
I think it's more of a slap-on-the-wrist offense. Notice that Shujin isn't banned; effectively, his name is just changed to Cunty. If the mod wanted him really banned, well, an IP ban is something a mod can do.
I think it's more of a slap-on-the-wrist offense. Notice that Shujin isn't banned; effectively, his name is just changed to Cunty. If the mod wanted him really banned, well, an IP ban is something a mod can do.
Even still, It's kind of a dick thing to do to someone, especially over an alt.
I think it's more of a slap-on-the-wrist offense. Notice that Shujin isn't banned; effectively, his name is just changed to Cunty. If the mod wanted him really banned, well, an IP ban is something a mod can do.
Even still, It's kind of a dick thing to do to someone, especially over an alt.
I think it's more of a slap-on-the-wrist offense. Notice that Shujin isn't banned; effectively, his name is just changed to Cunty. If the mod wanted him really banned, well, an IP ban is something a mod can do.
Even still, It's kind of a dick thing to do to someone, especially over an alt.
Posts
defense form with recover?
But now the defense form can't OHKO other things.
Neither form fits the definition of "Can't be one-shot and can one-shot almost anything"
Technically it's not. But just look at that thing. I should probably have said Godzillas.
all have attacks at 150+ and all have defenses and HP near the 100s or better
And now I realize that I still haven't trained up a single giant dragon or godzilla of doom. Time to remedy that..
Smogon is not the Pokemon Police.
Mach punch.
Tyrantitar dies.
I mean seriously. Blissey could probably kill it with a physical Fighting attack.
Mach Punch may kill him (It wont if you dont have technician) but try and find a mach puncher who can swap into a choice band adamant Tyranitar's crunch.
As awesome as his cry is, Kricketune's only real use (sadly) is as a Singer/False Swiper for capturing other pokemon.
Too bad, really.
Soo.... about that Salac Berry.... ;-):whistle:
Hitmontop?
Even with Choice Band + STAB + Max Attack, it will only do about 177 damage at MOST to a -Def, 0 IV, 0 EV Hitmontop.
If they put tyranitar on the uber list, I am declaring a state of shenanigans.
the name Shujin Katana is banned, I am Cunty, the new Shujin Katana, champion and tower tycoon
Toxicroak can switch in on that and use brick break
Since he's naturally faster than Tyranitar.
Or the other guy can use a STAB earthquake.
Seriously. Tyranitar is not that big of a threat. He's rarely been the deciding factor in any of my matches.
I mean but shit. Fucking weavile, guys.
Fucking weavile.
When I first caught him I was hopeful that his stats would be Pretty good, I never checked them till today...and they're quite average.
I wasn't going to put a choice item on mine. I want it to have will-o-wisp, and that's a little awkward as my only move. On the other hand, it's also awkward to be outsped by the physical sweeper I'm trying to burn. Hm.
edit: How does Pokerus spread? Is it only between party Pokemon? What triggers the spread -- steps, time, battles?
Hitmontop is not a counter to Tyranitar.
Assuming you brought along Hitmontop -- and assuming Tyranitar used Crunch instead of Earthquake or Stone Edge (both of which would OHKO hitmontop), and assuming you correctly predict that Crunch and swap in Hitmontop, all you do is give the enemy a free swap out to a million different sweepers or defensive tanks as you mach punch (or use any fighting move), which can take advantage of Hitmontops low speed to either set up as you switch out or simply kill you outright, leaving Tyranitar open to CBCrunch next time you let him get in without worrying about Hitmontop.
The only flaw in Tyranitar is his difficulty switching in easy. He hits massivly hard, can escape at a moments notice without worrying about Pursuit, and has a massive 150 Base Special Defense when sandstorm is in play (i.e. always). Plus, if you mispredict choice band and get a Dragon Dancer, then your really fucked.
Thanks. You guys are all great at answering my many cruddy little questions.
With Sandstream boost and 0 EVs, Tyranitar gets 354 Sp. Def. That's the equivalent of having a base stat of 174.5. Only Regice, Probopass and Shuckle can beat that. Using 174 as his base in Sp. Def, his average base stat is 112.3. Celebi, Mew and Manaphy are at 100. Groudon and Kyogre are at 111.7. Mewtwo, Dialga and Palkia are at 113.3. It's not the best measurement of his power (it doesn't take all of his weaknesses into account) but it helps put it into perspective.
Breloom can't OHKO with Mach Punch, but it can switch in to anything but a CH Stone Edge and deal ~80% before going down.
The hitmontop would only die if T-tar was using earthquake (risky if the opponent is using fliers) or Stone Edge (30% chance to miss) and holding a choice band.
If the current Pokemon died and Weavile came out, then we're talking about fubar central. I can't tell you how many times I have had to sacrifice pokemon just so I could switch in my one or two pokemon that could handle a Weavile. There are very few things that can survive the first shot from a weavile then outspeed it for the second shot.
Earthquake WILL OHKO this same Hitmontop. But with 31 IVs in Defense, it's not guaranteed. Only dealing ~190-226. Hitmontop's minimum HP is 210.
Sandstream could likely finish him off, but the point stands. Hitmontop is a pretty tough little fella.
He can use brick break or force palm, both of which kill T-tar.
Unless it was a dragon dancing T-tar that predicted the switch. Then your whole team is likely in for a world of hurt.
Only one in ten will die to STAB Earthquake? Must be tough Pokemon.
So is there a story behind this or what?
I'm not saying hes Uber, I havnt had a major problem with him myself (in certain games I have though, and I can definitely see where this debate on smogon is coming from), but people are seriously underestimating the amount of carnage he can cause in both the short term (massive choice band STAB moves like crunch or stone edge) and long term (sandstorm wrecking leftovers and picking away at your team).
*edit*
I lol'd. He's not supposed to become invincible after getting off a DD.
I made this alt, a mod found out, liked the name Cunty better than Shujin Katana, so he banned Shujin Katana
for a history of Cunty, The Sardine go to www.achewood.com
Since when is an alt a bannable offense.
I think it's more of a slap-on-the-wrist offense. Notice that Shujin isn't banned; effectively, his name is just changed to Cunty. If the mod wanted him really banned, well, an IP ban is something a mod can do.
Even still, It's kind of a dick thing to do to someone, especially over an alt.
EDIT: New Thread time lol
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