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Prog and other unlistenable music

13567

Posts

  • necroSYSnecroSYS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2007
    My problem with Tool is more that lyrics like "i want to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human" sound like they're deep, but when you step back and think about it as a sentence, it doesn't actually mean anything. And most of Lateralus is like that; for fuck's sake, The Grudge is a song about astrology! Astrology! "Saturn ascends the one, the ten"? What does that even mean? Astrology is retarded!

    I liked them better when they were writing songs like "Hooker with a Penis" and "Sober"

    Enh, I agree that their lyrics have gotten a bit harder to choke down with time, but when they are good, they are still really, really good. Vicarious and Jambi are probably two of my favorite songs of their entire discography, and they're on Tool's most concept-y album to date.

    necroSYS on
    There's no point in you getting both of yourselves all worked up and ready to chart the undiscovered country, then having her flush crimson red, run to the bathroom, and spend twenty minutes straining and grunting and stressing out because you're all ready to deliver your package but there's a three inch thick Sunday paper clogging up the mail slot.
  • MitsuhideMitsuhide Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Tool and Dream Theater are two of my favourite bands, but as some of you have said, I really just like the substance of it.

    I like heavy metal, and rock music as much as the next guy, but prog-metal just makes it all the more interesting.

    Mitsuhide on
  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Tools lyrics are ok at best. They 're not that deep but maynard sings with some genuine feeling and has good range. They've got a talented bunch fo musicians who have created a sound unlike anyone else. Really why so much hate?

    nexuscrawler on
  • Original RufusOriginal Rufus Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Heh, Tool is to metal lyrics as Red Hot Chili Peppers is to rock lyrics. Unfortunately, the vast majority of exposed music has shitty, pseudo-deep lyrics that, upon deeper investigation, make absolutely no sense.

    The cheesier the music is, the more I'm willing to forgive inane lyrics. Hence, part of the reason I like Dream Theater. I always find a lot to love in cheesy metal.

    But, once the music begins to appear as though it takes itself seriously, my tolerance for said lyrics degrades. Hence, part of the reason I occasionally don't like Dream Theater, and in this context, Tool.

    Original Rufus on
  • MikeManMikeMan Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    MikeMan wrote: »
    MikeMan wrote: »
    Jesus Christ, some people need a dose of Anti Stupid Cream.

    I like early Dream Theater. Unlike most of you naysayers, I've actually listened to enough of Prog rock to distinguish various styles from one another.

    A comparison that lumps Tool and DT together is laughably inane.

    I guess since I like some Prog I must be pretentious, huh. Oh, but wait, seems I like other music too! TIME PARADOX.

    Grow up, idiots.

    So can I summarize your points as "Hey! All of you people whose musical experience I'm not even remotely familiar with outside of a very narrowly focused discussion! How dare you compare two bands both known for their technical excellence, progressive tendencies and occasional masturbatory indulgence!"

    For what reason can two bands not be compared and contrasted? It's entirely possible to discern the differences between apples and oranges. They each have their potential strengths and weaknesses, and at least enough in common to get a discussion going. When we begin comparing Tool to the political landscape of 19th century London, get back to us.

    It's only pretentious to quibble and separate music behind stark, inalienable boundaries.

    What the fuck are you babbling about? I love lots of Prog, but I'm saying Tool and DT are very different.

    Please read next time.

    Well, it seems to me you're suggesting that it's stupid to compare those two bands, apparently from the platform that you know more about the topic than most people here.

    I then countered with my contention that no, you can in fact do exactly that, and see no reason why one couldn't.
    Please read next time.


    I did not say it was stupid to compare the bands, I said Poldy's lumping of them into the same category was stupid. And I don't know where you get the impression that I know more than most people. I just know more about prog rock than many people in this thread who make ignorant statements do. That's because I'm a fan. I would think that's self evident.

    Of course you can compare the two bands. Why would you think you couldn't? You can't lump them together and ignore the differences between the two, however. That's like saying Jethro Tull and Yes are the same shit. It's a statement born of ignorance.

    MikeMan on
    HOW DO YOU FUCK UP BAGELS. YOU BOIL THE WATER. PUT IN THE NOODLES
  • WorLordWorLord Registered User
    edited July 2007
    The Cheese wrote: »
    WorLord wrote: »
    No dumber than the statement it is responding to.
    Fight fire with gasoline! Woo! If the other guy does it, it means it's just fine for me too!

    Welcome to the internet, where you don't have to treat utter retardation with respect.

    The Cheese wrote: »
    WorLord wrote: »
    You clearly have little idea of what this word actually means. So stop using it.

    pre·ten·tious /prɪˈtɛnʃəs/ Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
    –adjective
    1. full of pretense or pretension.
    2. characterized by assumption of dignity or importance.
    3. making an exaggerated outward show; ostentatious.


    You were PRETENDING to be smarter than other people.

    It doesn't get much more incorrect than this.

    WorLord wrote: »
    You ASSUMED that those who do not share your love of prog dickery are SIMPLE-MINDED.

    The originating retarded statement - that complex music was "ridiculous, bloated, and pretentious" - is retarded. I made my case by stating its exact opposite.

    Next time, just for you and any other third-grade reading level peeps, I'll be sure to include my "sarcasm" tags, but I really didn't think I had to, given the flippancy of the way I wrote my response.

    The Cheese wrote: »
    And now you've assumed the PRETENSE that I don't know what "pretentious" means

    You can't assume a pretense. In fact, that sentence makes little sense.

    The Cheese wrote: »
    Time for some BROAD SWEEPING STATEMENTS:

    You should have said "time for some falsehoods," as you're only really good at those.

    As an aside, I just want to state how much I LOVE the fact that you're coming down on me, when Podly's stance painted with an equally insulting and wide brush. Why didn't you get your panties all in a dither in his direction?

    WorLord on
    ...privately black.
  • FalloutFallout GIRL'S DAY WAS PRETTY GOOD WHILE THEY LASTEDRegistered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Imagine spending a few hours with a dude who lived to constantly inundate you with dark, caustic shit, occasionally taking breaks to tell you about people he hates. How often would you hang out with this man?

    hey, i have plenty of friends

    Fallout on
    xcomsig.png
  • FalloutFallout GIRL'S DAY WAS PRETTY GOOD WHILE THEY LASTEDRegistered User regular
    edited July 2007
    necroSYS wrote: »
    My problem with Tool is more that lyrics like "i want to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human" sound like they're deep, but when you step back and think about it as a sentence, it doesn't actually mean anything. And most of Lateralus is like that; for fuck's sake, The Grudge is a song about astrology! Astrology! "Saturn ascends the one, the ten"? What does that even mean? Astrology is retarded!

    I liked them better when they were writing songs like "Hooker with a Penis" and "Sober"

    Enh, I agree that their lyrics have gotten a bit harder to choke down with time, but when they are good, they are still really, really good. Vicarious and Jambi are probably two of my favorite songs of their entire discography, and they're on Tool's most concept-y album to date.

    I honestly wasn't too big on 10,000 Days. I liked it, to be sure, but to me it was just sort of a "Lateralus 2"... Not that there's anything wrong with that. That is a special album for me.

    Fallout on
    xcomsig.png
  • necroSYSnecroSYS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2007
    Fallout wrote: »
    necroSYS wrote: »
    My problem with Tool is more that lyrics like "i want to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human" sound like they're deep, but when you step back and think about it as a sentence, it doesn't actually mean anything. And most of Lateralus is like that; for fuck's sake, The Grudge is a song about astrology! Astrology! "Saturn ascends the one, the ten"? What does that even mean? Astrology is retarded!

    I liked them better when they were writing songs like "Hooker with a Penis" and "Sober"

    Enh, I agree that their lyrics have gotten a bit harder to choke down with time, but when they are good, they are still really, really good. Vicarious and Jambi are probably two of my favorite songs of their entire discography, and they're on Tool's most concept-y album to date.

    I honestly wasn't too big on 10,000 Days. I liked it, to be sure, but to me it was just sort of a "Lateralus 2"... Not that there's anything wrong with that. That is a special album for me.


    I thought 10,000 days had a much stronger message, if only because of how much more connected Maynard was to the concept.

    necroSYS on
    There's no point in you getting both of yourselves all worked up and ready to chart the undiscovered country, then having her flush crimson red, run to the bathroom, and spend twenty minutes straining and grunting and stressing out because you're all ready to deliver your package but there's a three inch thick Sunday paper clogging up the mail slot.
  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Out of curiosity, what is prog rock?

    VishNub on
    Steam = VishnuOwnz
    Dota2 = Glitchmo
  • WorLordWorLord Registered User
    edited July 2007
    necroSYS wrote: »
    I thought 10,000 days had a much stronger message, if only because of how much more connected Maynard was to the concept.

    10,000 days is the only modern Tool I've heard. A friend of mine, years ago, tried to get me into them, so I started listening to the discography from the beginning. The problem with that is that apparently the first two albums... really suck, and aren't indicative of later Tool.

    So I had written them off as a crap band until I heard Jambi on the radio. I like about half of 10k days now (its hard to like the other half, as its mostly filler and minutes worth of weird sounds).
    VishNub wrote:
    Out of curiosity, what is prog rock?

    Wikipedia

    WorLord on
    ...privately black.
  • GlaealGlaeal Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    VishNub wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what is prog rock?

    Apparently it's anything with a distorted guitar that poldy doesn't like.


    Normally it's used to describe music that doesn't fall square in the middle of a particular genre of metal or rock, or uses elements of other types of music that aren't normally found in traditional metal or rock.

    Glaeal on
    Qingu wrote: »
    In fact, there was never any decree by God through the Prophet that they couldn't recieve the priesthood.
    The last nine words of this statement are unnecessary.
  • The CatThe Cat Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2007
    My problem with Tool is more that lyrics like "i want to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human" sound like they're deep, but when you step back and think about it as a sentence, it doesn't actually mean anything. And most of Lateralus is like that; for fuck's sake, The Grudge is a song about astrology! Astrology! "Saturn ascends the one, the ten"? What does that even mean? Astrology is retarded!

    I liked them better when they were writing songs like "Hooker with a Penis" and "Sober"

    *polite chuckle*

    you sound like my mother. Song lyrics aren't necessarily supposed to have a concrete meaning. If you want to hear stories in your songs, fine, go find yourself some Johnny Cash or whatever, but recognise that there are other ways to do things.

    The Cat on
    tmsig.jpg
  • necroSYSnecroSYS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2007
    WorLord wrote: »
    The problem with that is that apparently the first two albums... really suck, and aren't indicative of later Tool.

    argh.gif You shut your filthy fucking mouth!

    necroSYS on
    There's no point in you getting both of yourselves all worked up and ready to chart the undiscovered country, then having her flush crimson red, run to the bathroom, and spend twenty minutes straining and grunting and stressing out because you're all ready to deliver your package but there's a three inch thick Sunday paper clogging up the mail slot.
  • UndefinedMonkeyUndefinedMonkey Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Thread lacks discussion of The Leg of Time... quite possibly the best prog rock song of our age.

    Seriously, though... lyrics are pretty much secondary to the music for me. If they happen to not be about how much it sucks to be a white male adolescent, so much the better. Tool was great for that, in much the same way that Metallica was great for not talking about dungeons and vipers and altars and hair.

    UndefinedMonkey on
    This space intentionally left blank.
  • real_pochaccoreal_pochacco Registered User
    edited July 2007
    The Cat wrote: »
    My problem with Tool is more that lyrics like "i want to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human" sound like they're deep, but when you step back and think about it as a sentence, it doesn't actually mean anything. And most of Lateralus is like that; for fuck's sake, The Grudge is a song about astrology! Astrology! "Saturn ascends the one, the ten"? What does that even mean? Astrology is retarded!

    I liked them better when they were writing songs like "Hooker with a Penis" and "Sober"

    *polite chuckle*

    you sound like my mother. Song lyrics aren't necessarily supposed to have a concrete meaning. If you want to hear stories in your songs, fine, go find yourself some Johnny Cash or whatever, but recognise that there are other ways to do things.

    This is how I feel about it. There are some songs that are more poetic than others, and I think Tool is more on the poetic end with albums like Lateralus. That sentence, by the way, means a lot to me -- I could go into my personal relation to that line, but I don't think you want to hear it.

    And The Grude is definitely not about astrology, good god.

    real_pochacco on
  • ShoggothShoggoth Registered User
    edited July 2007
    "i want to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human" That is horrendous.
    Thread lacks discussion of The Leg of Time... quite possibly the best prog rock song of our age.

    That is great.

    Shoggoth on
    11tu0w1.jpg
  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Glaeal wrote: »
    VishNub wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, what is prog rock?

    Apparently it's anything with a distorted guitar that poldy doesn't like.


    Normally it's used to describe music that doesn't fall square in the middle of a particular genre of metal or rock, or uses elements of other types of music that aren't normally found in traditional metal or rock.

    So, almost everything? Got it.

    VishNub on
    Steam = VishnuOwnz
    Dota2 = Glitchmo
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Tool was great for that, in much the same way that Metallica was great for not talking about dungeons and vipers and altars and hair.

    Are we listening to the same Metallica? Whiplash, Metal Militia, Escape, The Thing That Should Not Be, etc.?

    I enjoy Metallica but to say they don't write lyrics about cliché things is fuckin silly.

    Mgcw on
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Heh, Tool is to metal lyrics as Red Hot Chili Peppers is to rock lyrics. Unfortunately, the vast majority of exposed music has shitty, pseudo-deep lyrics that, upon deeper investigation, make absolutely no sense.

    you take that back about the chili peppers.

    he is my favorite lyricist.

    unless it was your way of saying Tool is awesome.

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • WorLordWorLord Registered User
    edited July 2007
    necroSYS wrote: »
    WorLord wrote: »
    The problem with that is that apparently the first two albums... really suck, and aren't indicative of later Tool.

    argh.gif You shut your filthy fucking mouth!

    Ha!

    Well, to be fair, it wasn't claw-your-ears-out-with-an-icepick bad. I just found most of the songs to have been overlong and terribly repetitive, and not at all the stuff that near-religious-experiences are made of (which is how a few people I know treated Tool).

    I think I'm going to go back and listen to the previous two CD's, I'm told that's where the action is at.

    WorLord on
    ...privately black.
  • Wonder_HippieWonder_Hippie __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Variable wrote: »
    Heh, Tool is to metal lyrics as Red Hot Chili Peppers is to rock lyrics. Unfortunately, the vast majority of exposed music has shitty, pseudo-deep lyrics that, upon deeper investigation, make absolutely no sense.

    you take that back about the chili peppers.

    he is my favorite lyricist.

    unless it was your way of saying Tool is awesome.

    I... uhhh...

    The fucker runs out of words in Around the World. He runs out of words for an entire verse. He spouts gibberish for an entire verse. Your favorite lyricist has the writing skill of a 1-year-old.

    Wonder_Hippie on
    Your sig was too tall. -Thanatos
    Feral wrote: »
    MikeMan wrote: »
    i'm just a loveologist
    love me some lovin'
    gonna study up on lovin'

    Ain't no problem you can't solve in loveology with a larger sample size.
  • CptKemzikCptKemzik Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Variable wrote: »
    Heh, Tool is to metal lyrics as Red Hot Chili Peppers is to rock lyrics. Unfortunately, the vast majority of exposed music has shitty, pseudo-deep lyrics that, upon deeper investigation, make absolutely no sense.

    you take that back about the chili peppers.

    he is my favorite lyricist.

    unless it was your way of saying Tool is awesome.

    I... uhhh...

    The fucker runs out of words in Around the World. He runs out of words for an entire verse. He spouts gibberish for an entire verse. Your favorite lyricist has the writing skill of a 1-year-old.

    In terms of actual vocal delivery Kiedes is pretty good, but I'd have to agree about his actual lyrics. They would be the weak link of an otherwise awesome band.

    CptKemzik on
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Variable wrote: »
    Heh, Tool is to metal lyrics as Red Hot Chili Peppers is to rock lyrics. Unfortunately, the vast majority of exposed music has shitty, pseudo-deep lyrics that, upon deeper investigation, make absolutely no sense.

    you take that back about the chili peppers.

    he is my favorite lyricist.

    unless it was your way of saying Tool is awesome.

    I... uhhh...

    The fucker runs out of words in Around the World. He runs out of words for an entire verse. He spouts gibberish for an entire verse. Your favorite lyricist has the writing skill of a 1-year-old.

    man he doesn't run out of words. you can't understand it. that's the point.

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • Original RufusOriginal Rufus Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Variable wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Heh, Tool is to metal lyrics as Red Hot Chili Peppers is to rock lyrics. Unfortunately, the vast majority of exposed music has shitty, pseudo-deep lyrics that, upon deeper investigation, make absolutely no sense.

    you take that back about the chili peppers.

    he is my favorite lyricist.

    unless it was your way of saying Tool is awesome.

    I... uhhh...

    The fucker runs out of words in Around the World. He runs out of words for an entire verse. He spouts gibberish for an entire verse. Your favorite lyricist has the writing skill of a 1-year-old.

    man he doesn't run out of words. you can't understand it. that's the point.

    Was this a serious post?

    I'm actually curious.

    Original Rufus on
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited July 2007
    not really.

    edit - but he doesn't run out of words. people don't actually ever do that in songs... so saying that's the reason is obviously ridiculous. if he sings gibberish, as with any other singer, it's because that's what he wanted to sing right there.

    so that in and of itself isn't a great reason to say he's bad. if you don't like him, I totally get that, but I very much do.

    Variable on
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  • YodaTunaYodaTuna Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    I HATE YOU AND I HATE THE BANDS YOU LIKE!

    This is a terrible thread.

    YodaTuna on
  • Alchemist449Alchemist449 Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Meh, I'm not a fan of either band but the OP is just overreacting. Hey, if you don't like it turn it off.

    Alchemist449 on
  • necroSYSnecroSYS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited July 2007
    Magicawe wrote: »
    Tool was great for that, in much the same way that Metallica was great for not talking about dungeons and vipers and altars and hair.

    Are we listening to the same Metallica? Whiplash, Metal Militia, Escape, The Thing That Should Not Be, etc.?

    I enjoy Metallica but to say they don't write lyrics about cliché things is fuckin silly.

    Not to mention Creeping Death, Wherever I May Roam, Call of Kutulu, etc.

    necroSYS on
    There's no point in you getting both of yourselves all worked up and ready to chart the undiscovered country, then having her flush crimson red, run to the bathroom, and spend twenty minutes straining and grunting and stressing out because you're all ready to deliver your package but there's a three inch thick Sunday paper clogging up the mail slot.
  • VothVoth Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Well, so far the only band I like that's been mentioned is Styx. Though, I'm assuming that is referring to the first three albums pre-Tommy Shaw. Or maybe there's another band named Styx nowadays?

    Voth on
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  • SuperunknownSuperunknown Registered User
    edited July 2007
    Opinions opinions opinions. Respect each others, no ones right. I personally enjoy Prog Rock but can understand how it's unappealing to others, in the same way pop music or electro is unappealing to certain groups of people.

    Superunknown on
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  • SavantSavant Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    YodaTuna wrote: »
    I HATE YOU AND I HATE THE BANDS YOU LIKE!

    This is a terrible thread.

    Your music is bad and you should feel bad!

    pic00239.jpg

    is the correct response.

    I am surprised at the hate here for progressive rock in general though, as there is a lot of it which is in the mainstream and isn't pure wankery. Looking through the bands on the wikipedia page classified as prog rock the ones I recognized and have listened to are some of my favorites of rock, even if they have have some songs which are rather obtuse.

    Savant on
  • The CheeseThe Cheese Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    WorLord wrote: »
    snip

    1) No, you were definitely acting like Mr. Fucking Smarty Pants
    2) Yes you can assume a pretense. A pretense is (if I may quote the dictionary again) a "a false show of something" or "a piece of make-believe". The make-believe in this case is that you are smarter than other people because you listen to music written in 14/8 or whatever.
    3) I've come down on Poldy before, no need to get back into that. You're doing that thing where you act like because somebody else is being an idiot, it's OK for you to do it too.

    The Cheese on
  • SnorkSnork Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    The Cheese wrote: »
    you basically said that if you don't like prog-rock you're stupid

    which is a dumb thing to say

    and pretentious

    And the OP basically said if you do like prog you're stupid.

    This thread is retarded.

    I hate Tool, but I don't hate them because they're overblown and ridiculous. I listen to Dream Theatre every once and a while. There is no inherent goodness in music just because it is in weird time signatures with weird chords, but no inherent badness either.

    But let's be serious, anyway. Dream Theatre has not been worthy of the name 'progressive' for a long time. All of their albums sound the same, they aren't progressing anywhere.

    Snork on
  • MikeManMikeMan Registered User regular
    edited July 2007
    Snork wrote: »
    The Cheese wrote: »
    you basically said that if you don't like prog-rock you're stupid

    which is a dumb thing to say

    and pretentious

    And the OP basically said if you do like prog you're stupid.

    This thread is retarded.

    I hate Tool, but I don't hate them because they're overblown and ridiculous. I listen to Dream Theatre every once and a while. There is no inherent goodness in music just because it is in weird time signatures with weird chords, but no inherent badness either.

    But let's be serious, anyway. Dream Theatre has not been worthy of the name 'progressive' for a long time. All of their albums sound the same, they aren't progressing anywhere.

    Yeah everything after SFAM has been pretty bad, IMO. But whatevs.

    MikeMan on
    HOW DO YOU FUCK UP BAGELS. YOU BOIL THE WATER. PUT IN THE NOODLES
  • XenosX_XenosX_ Registered User
    edited July 2007
    The Cheese wrote: »
    WorLord wrote: »
    snip
    2) Yes you can assume a pretense. A pretense is (if I may quote the dictionary again) a "a false show of something" or "a piece of make-believe". The make-believe in this case is that you are smarter than other people because you listen to music written in 14/8 or whatever.

    I feel that there is an extremely fine line here... I am a huge progressive rock fan, and one of the reasons I listen to so much of it is because of the complex syncopated rhythms and varying time signatures. However, even though I think most would agree that playing in 29/8 is more mentally taxing, and ergo, intellectual (as far as keeping time goes) than playing in 4/4, I think that very few people would listen to something in 29/8 just to feel superior to those who would not be able to follow the rhythm.

    Whether or not you think that being good with unconventional meter makes you smarter, I listen to it because it interests me, the same way that I read stuff like 'House of Leaves' as opposed to reading stuff like 'The Catcher in the Rye'. I would not consider the latter especially complex with respect to language or structure, but it is nonetheless good, and certainly visceral. I still find the former more rewarding. To think that I enjoy progressive rock and Danielewski because I have some bizarre inferiority complex is itself a pretense.

    XenosX_ on
  • AJRAJR You took too long Now your candy's goneRegistered User regular
    edited July 2007
    MikeMan wrote: »
    Snork wrote: »
    The Cheese wrote: »
    you basically said that if you don't like prog-rock you're stupid

    which is a dumb thing to say

    and pretentious

    And the OP basically said if you do like prog you're stupid.

    This thread is retarded.

    I hate Tool, but I don't hate them because they're overblown and ridiculous. I listen to Dream Theatre every once and a while. There is no inherent goodness in music just because it is in weird time signatures with weird chords, but no inherent badness either.

    But let's be serious, anyway. Dream Theatre has not been worthy of the name 'progressive' for a long time. All of their albums sound the same, they aren't progressing anywhere.

    Yeah everything after SFAM has been pretty bad, IMO. But whatevs.

    I honestly think Train of Thought was their best album. But that's just me. I haven't enjoyed much of their work since then.

    AJR on
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  • ShoggothShoggoth Registered User
    edited July 2007
    XenosX_ wrote: »
    The Cheese wrote: »
    WorLord wrote: »
    snip
    2) Yes you can assume a pretense. A pretense is (if I may quote the dictionary again) a "a false show of something" or "a piece of make-believe". The make-believe in this case is that you are smarter than other people because you listen to music written in 14/8 or whatever.

    I feel that there is an extremely fine line here... I am a huge progressive rock fan, and one of the reasons I listen to so much of it is because of the complex syncopated rhythms and varying time signatures. However, even though I think most would agree that playing in 29/8 is more mentally taxing, and ergo, intellectual (as far as keeping time goes) than playing in 4/4, I think that very few people would listen to something in 29/8 just to feel superior to those who would not be able to follow the rhythm.

    Whether or not you think that being good with unconventional meter makes you smarter, I listen to it because it interests me, the same way that I read stuff like 'House of Leaves' as opposed to reading stuff like 'The Catcher in the Rye'. I would not consider the latter especially complex with respect to language or structure, but it is nonetheless good, and certainly visceral. I still find the former more rewarding. To think that I enjoy progressive rock and Danielewski because I have some bizarre inferiority complex is itself a pretense.

    I know lots of people (hey, most of them even play instruments) who listen to music like Dream Theater entirely because it is difficult to play, and they will often scoff at playing a simple piece. In short, their full of shit.

    Now I know you probably don't listen to Dream Theater to feel superior, but a lot of people do. Some people feel that listening to this kind of music is literally above listening something like the Beatles. These people usually make a huge impression on others. I think that's why bands like Dream Theater incite such venomous outcry , because some of their fans are fucking annoying.

    Shoggoth on
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  • SuperunknownSuperunknown Registered User
    edited July 2007
    So basically you're generalising.

    If a band has a few douchey fans, therefore all their fans are and so is the band.

    Superunknown on
    [size=+7]GIANT FUCKING SIGNATURE[/size]
  • Wonder_HippieWonder_Hippie __BANNED USERS
    edited July 2007
    Variable wrote: »
    not really.

    edit - but he doesn't run out of words. people don't actually ever do that in songs... so saying that's the reason is obviously ridiculous. if he sings gibberish, as with any other singer, it's because that's what he wanted to sing right there.

    so that in and of itself isn't a great reason to say he's bad. if you don't like him, I totally get that, but I very much do.

    I even like RHCP, Blood Sugar Sex Magik days at least, but this poppy shit they're pumping out hurts my amygdala. It's just nonsensical crap for the most part; I will respect the fact that he can deliver decent combinations of words, but it's like a schizophrenic patient with word salad, in that it makes sense grammatically but has absolutely no substance.

    Wonder_Hippie on
    Your sig was too tall. -Thanatos
    Feral wrote: »
    MikeMan wrote: »
    i'm just a loveologist
    love me some lovin'
    gonna study up on lovin'

    Ain't no problem you can't solve in loveology with a larger sample size.
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