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Just out of curiosity - anyone else went through a 'Japan-only' phase?

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Posts

  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Oh, okay. I'm defensive about my Miyazaki, damn it.

    Also, good job having a terrible opinion about GitS. :P

    wwtMask on
    When he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
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  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    also incen you better not be bad talking The Breakfast Club.

    And What Dreams May Come?

    Really?

    Mask:

    I have given Ghost in the Shell so many chances, oh god, and it just drones on and on and if I'm not asleep I find myself forgetting what I just saw because I was too busy hating everything that is going on.

    Also you like Black Panther so you have terrible opinions, too.

    God.

    Soo boring.

    I mean like the first part of the original Solaris boring, here.

    The Lovely Bastard on
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  • Dex DynamoDex Dynamo Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Yes.

    And produced such things as the Breakfast Club. :P

    You're right, it did, hence the argument for expensive CGI is broken.

    Dex Dynamo on
  • ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2007
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Yes.

    And produced such things as the Breakfast Club. :P

    and the godfather

    Servo on
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  • ZeromusZeromus Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I don't really like manga, but Akira and Ghost in the Shell are pretty sweet.

    Perhaps there's someone in Japan who says, "I don't really like American comics, but Watchmen was pretty sweet."

    Zeromus on
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  • Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I never went through japan faze.

    i have always hated manga, anime, and other such things, with the occasional exception.

    The only thing i like from japan is video games and Godzilla.

    And i kinda liked ultimate muscle.

    Bloods End on
  • ZeromusZeromus Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Godzilla manga?

    Zeromus on
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  • Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Zeromus wrote: »
    Godzilla manga?

    i liked the dark horse Godzilla comics but i don't think that is manga.

    Bloods End on
  • KreutzKreutz Blackwater Park, IARegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I went through a pretty long manga phase, and I just got back into comics again about a year ago. What really drove me out of manga was the pure shit which is getting licensed and produced in the states now. It's all pandering to the stereotype of post-goths and pedophiles as anime fans. When I started reading manga, stuff like Battle Royale, GTO, Priest, etc was popular and new. They really don't have stuff like that coming out anymore. Also, they've turned the manga aisle into a mess with a bunch of wall scrolls and plush dolls and action figures and a bunch of other shit which isn't books. I really don't feel comfortable browsing next to a 3'X5' banner featuring a couple of half-naked men with flowers. Also, I don't want a fucking Naruto headband. Nobody in their right mind wants a Naruto headband.

    I still watch anime though. A lot of good series are still coming out, especially re-releases of old series on the cheaps. I'm also currently trying to collect all of the Miyazaki films that have been released in the US.

    Kreutz on
  • augustaugust where you come from is gone Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    When I was a kid, the American manga market essentially did not exist. We were talking Ghost in the Shell, and the Dark Horse edition of Akira that cost way too much.

    So, no.

    august on
  • CharmyCharmy Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I have a friend who is really big into manga, and always recommended me stuff. I never got around to reading any of it because I was always weirded out by the manga section of bookstores and libraries.

    On the other hand, I succeeded in getting them to read "Runaways", "Marvel: 1604" and "Watchmen", thus ensaring them into the world of Western comics forever.

    I can't help but feel I've upset some terrible cosmic balance.

    My experience with anime is somewhat limited, as I avoid pretty much anything on TV. The films of Miyazaki, however? Hot damn, they're excellent.

    Charmy on
    I have a twitter.
  • AlephAleph Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Ha, it's the same with me. When it comes to anime, I just watch the films (depending on the director of course) since about 99% of the ones on TV are trash.

    Aleph on
  • dangerdoomdangerdangerdoomdanger Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    nnn. No.

    The only manga i've read is Battle Royalle. Royal? Royale.

    dangerdoomdanger on
  • WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Battle Angel Alita would be about the only manga I would read (bar one American manga-ish online comic). I have a few anime titles taped from the TV, but I've never gotten around to watching those.

    Patlabor 1 was pretty awesome though.

    Wildcat on
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Honestly, if you want to get into a good conversation about manga, Ketchem_ash knows lots about that sort of thing.
    I am so sorry

    Fencingsax on
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited August 2007
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    There just aren't that many movies like Amelie or What Dreams May Come.

    there's this thing called the criterion collection

    you should make its acquaintance

    Jacobkosh on
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  • Gabriel_PittGabriel_Pitt (effective against Russian warships) Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    90% of everything is crap. Pre-boom manga was the exception because it was a lot more of that 10% that was being sent over. In a niche market, companies didn't want to take risks so they tried to get what had the greatest chance of being a success, and given that that American market is still dominated by super-hero titles where the characters have persisted for tens of years, titles where the characters could grow, change, undergo significant development without having it editorially undone five years down the line, and ultimately end was awesome. It's the same reason that stuff like Watchmen was so awesome. If it had been written as an ongoing series instead of a self-contained story, the characters would not have been able to change in the way they did. To allude to Kirsten Dunst's much derided comment about killing Spider-man, ultimately, you know that the character is never going to die, that ultimately, whatever peril he's in, he's going to overcome it. To use Watchmen again, it had a more than a few great, 'holy shit' moments because the characters didn't need to remain as is in order to ensure the popularity of an ongoing series.

    Gabriel_Pitt on
  • hughtronhughtron __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2007
    90% of what any given medium produces is awful garbage, and comics are by no means an exception to this rule. There are some awful, awful japanese comics. I don't really read any new manga, but there is some quality older stuff out there, and when I say quality what I really mean is completely batty. Some of my recent favorites are:

    -Drifting Classroom is about a japanese school that gets teleported to the future and all the teachers go crazy and try to kill the students and there are giant bugs and every single speech bubble ends with an exclamation mark! It is maybe my favorite comic right now.

    -Cyborg 009 is about the horrors of the modern military-industrial complex and the dangers of unbridled capitalism and war, but it is also about a team of racial stereotype cyborg superheroes who fight rocket dragons and giant evil robot houses.

    -And finally, anything by Tezuka is amazing. Some people call him the Kirby of Japan, but that doesn't even really describe the impact he had on japanese culture. The man pretty much single handedly shaped the comics and cartoon industry of the entire country, and he did so by making the craziest most beautiful comics I've ever seen. And they all had such ridiculous concepts. To quote my thread about the man:
    Black Jack is, to quote Wikipedia, about "a talented surgeon who operates illegally using radical and supernatural techniques to combat rare afflictions." That quick popping sound you just heard was my brain exploding with delight.

    Or Mitsume ga Tooru, which is about "a junior high school student who must always wear a bandage over his forehead which conceals a third eye. When the third eye is covered Hosuke remains a normal boy. When the eye is exposed his evil side takes over and he becomes a sorcerer of enormous power with a desire to conquer the world." Oh damn son, that's hot.

    Or Fushigi na Merumo, which details the stirring story of a young orphan. "The ghost of her dead mother visits her and gives her a bottle of candy given to her by God. The blue candy turns Melmo into a 19-year-old version of herself, while the red candy turns her back into a child. Combining the two turns her first into a fetus, then into an animal of her choosing. "

    hughtron on
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  • hughtronhughtron __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2007
    The funniest/saddest part about the American Anime/Manga scene is that it is filled with deadly serious, hardcore fans that are completely obsessed with terrible children's shows. Even the older fans don't really seem interested in serious, mature work.

    It's like if a bunch of grown people in Finland were really, really interested in american comics, but only the Marvel Adventures line.

    hughtron on
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  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I dunno about that. Most of the more popular anime and manga isn't really of the Marvel Adventures variety. For the most part, the stuff you'll actually see make it over here is more or less on par with regular comics. Now the stuff on Fox Kids, that's Marvel Adventures stuff, and most of the older fans don't watch those shows.

    wwtMask on
    When he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
    Twitter - @liberaltruths | Google+ - http://gplus.to/wwtMask | Occupy Tallahassee
  • hughtronhughtron __BANNED USERS regular
    edited August 2007
    wwtMask wrote: »
    I dunno about that. Most of the more popular anime and manga isn't really of the Marvel Adventures variety. For the most part, the stuff you'll actually see make it over here is more or less on par with regular comics. Now the stuff on Fox Kids, that's Marvel Adventures stuff, and most of the older fans don't watch those shows.

    I'm not talking about content (although, in a way, I am) so much as target demographics and what people seem to be crazy about. The big shows and books, even in North America, are stuff like Naruto or Bleach or Inuyasha or even Death Note. They may have some blood and maybe even a boobie, but they're generally aimed at an adolescent market. I don't know if any of you follow 'The Blogosphere', but there was a big to-do when Dark Horse announced it was doing M.P.D. Psycho, and then again when they annouced Gantz. Nobody in North America, it seems, is reading seinen manga. It's all shonen or shojo, which is typically aimed at teenagers and younger.

    The ever-salient Chris Butcher summed it up well at the end of this post: (my emphasis)
    The future of the U.S. manga market is that either the tastes of the audience will age and the material being imported will do the same (like JAPAN), or it won’t, and we’ll be stuck with a nation of hardcore fucking nerds, lusting after MOE 12 year olds and deeply enjoying material for children (like AMERICA). Either way, you know, there’ll be an absolute avalanche of material to choose from, and so the market will remain healthy. It’d take a new Pearl Harbor for North America to turn away from Japanese culture in the fashion necessary for the market to collapse.

    Or here, where Jason Thompson, who used to work for Viz (maybe still does?) explains some of the realities of the current North American manga market:
    ...The fact of the U.S. manga market isn’t that shojo dominates the charts, it’s that stuff for younger readers dominates the charts. It’s simply hard to get the more adult manga into the big chain outlets...
    ...

    hughtron on
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  • Octopus MelodyOctopus Melody Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Some more "adult" kinda stuff still manages to get through, which is most of what I read. I enjoyed the two books by Toshihiro Tatsumi, The Push Man and other stories, and I forget the second one's title. Kazuichi Hanawa's Doing Time was pretty good too.

    Octopus Melody on
  • AlephAleph Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I can't believe I forgot to mention The Push Man, Yoshihiro Tatsumi's mangas are absolutely for adult. There's a word to classify his type of comics in Japan but it's definitely not one of the so-called seinen ones. Honestly after browsing them for some time at my local Borders, most of the seinen mangas read almost as juvenile as its shojo and shonen siblings.

    Aleph on
  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Obviously most anime and manga will be shoujo and shounen, simply because it appeals to a wider demographic. It's more or less the same situation with American animation, wherein the vast majority is aimed at adolescents and early teens. Whether the market outgrows its current tastes remains to be seen, but I wouldn't count on it. I imagine the rate of attrition is offset by newer and younger readers.

    Anyway, on a bit of a tangent, I'm glad I had my Japanophile phase, since it really gave me lots of ammo to skewer anime and manga with in the GV tournament.

    wwtMask on
    When he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
    Twitter - @liberaltruths | Google+ - http://gplus.to/wwtMask | Occupy Tallahassee
  • NogsNogs Crap, crap, mega crap. Crap, crap, mega crap.Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I tried to read a manga once. but i read the ending first before i realized it and i was like "fuck this"

    Nogs on
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  • LibrarianThorneLibrarianThorne Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Right as I was hitting that Japanophile phase, I read Kingdom Come. Put an end to that "Manga is better than comics" pretty quick.

    I still do enjoy manga, but I find the action scenes in shounen really hard to follow. It's like, this is a great storyboard, so I've decided that for stuff like Naruto and Bleach the anime is just flat out more enjoyable. Berserk, on the other hand, is fucking awesome and the anime wasn't a real improvement on the storytelling, so I'm comfortable buying the manga for it. As far as anime, I really enjoy giant robots and shounen. I'll also pop in for fantasy series like Slayers (because Slayers is a game of D&D gone horribly, horribly right), but really cerebral stuff like Neon Genesis Evangelion bores me to tears.

    <3 for Osamu Tezuka. So much <3. Astro Boy remains one of the best goddamn series I've ever read. Hayao Miyazaki also can't really do much wrong.

    As I said in another thread, I'd kill to see Akira Toriyama do a Superman manga. Astro Boy was Tezuka's take on Superboy, and Goku in Dragonball Z is Toriyama's take on Superman. If only DC could wise up and get something like a Toriyama-made Superman comic made they'd find their market share rocketing upwards.

    LibrarianThorne on
  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    On the subject of Japanese creators doing their takes on American comic icons: I really enjoy the Power Pack comics drawn by GuriHiru. I'd love to see more of that sort of crossover. Alex Ross or Stuart Immonen on on Ghost in the Shell would make me pretty happy.

    wwtMask on
    When he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
    Twitter - @liberaltruths | Google+ - http://gplus.to/wwtMask | Occupy Tallahassee
  • TransporterTransporter Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I went through a phase of enjoying most things Japanese.

    Then I started browsing Anime forums and decided never to think that way again.

    I blissfully enjoy everything.

    Except country.

    Fuck country.

    Transporter on
  • Mai-KeroMai-Kero Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Right as I was hitting that Japanophile phase, I read Kingdom Come. Put an end to that "Manga is better than comics" pretty quick.

    I still do enjoy manga, but I find the action scenes in shounen really hard to follow. It's like, this is a great storyboard, so I've decided that for stuff like Naruto and Bleach the anime is just flat out more enjoyable. Berserk, on the other hand, is fucking awesome and the anime wasn't a real improvement on the storytelling, so I'm comfortable buying the manga for it. As far as anime, I really enjoy giant robots and shounen. I'll also pop in for fantasy series like Slayers (because Slayers is a game of D&D gone horribly, horribly right), but really cerebral stuff like Neon Genesis Evangelion bores me to tears.

    <3 for Osamu Tezuka. So much <3. Astro Boy remains one of the best goddamn series I've ever read. Hayao Miyazaki also can't really do much wrong.

    As I said in another thread, I'd kill to see Akira Toriyama do a Superman manga. Astro Boy was Tezuka's take on Superboy, and Goku in Dragonball Z is Toriyama's take on Superman. If only DC could wise up and get something like a Toriyama-made Superman comic made they'd find their market share rocketing upwards.

    I don't think Evangelion is supposed to be really cerebral. Really dumb would be more accurate.

    Mai-Kero on
  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    edited August 2007
    I've read some manga. Blade of the Immortal was my first, I think. I really like Blame! and Biomega a ton.

    DouglasDanger on
  • LibrarianThorneLibrarianThorne Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Mai-Kero wrote: »
    Right as I was hitting that Japanophile phase, I read Kingdom Come. Put an end to that "Manga is better than comics" pretty quick.

    I still do enjoy manga, but I find the action scenes in shounen really hard to follow. It's like, this is a great storyboard, so I've decided that for stuff like Naruto and Bleach the anime is just flat out more enjoyable. Berserk, on the other hand, is fucking awesome and the anime wasn't a real improvement on the storytelling, so I'm comfortable buying the manga for it. As far as anime, I really enjoy giant robots and shounen. I'll also pop in for fantasy series like Slayers (because Slayers is a game of D&D gone horribly, horribly right), but really cerebral stuff like Neon Genesis Evangelion bores me to tears.

    <3 for Osamu Tezuka. So much <3. Astro Boy remains one of the best goddamn series I've ever read. Hayao Miyazaki also can't really do much wrong.

    As I said in another thread, I'd kill to see Akira Toriyama do a Superman manga. Astro Boy was Tezuka's take on Superboy, and Goku in Dragonball Z is Toriyama's take on Superman. If only DC could wise up and get something like a Toriyama-made Superman comic made they'd find their market share rocketing upwards.

    I don't think Evangelion is supposed to be really cerebral. Really dumb would be more accurate.


    That's what I got from it. It's like Watchmen except with giant robots and shitty teenagers, so....

    I mean, I get what it was doing. It was deconstructing giant robot anime. However, it did it in such a way that I as a fan of giant robot anime couldn't really follow it. There were no endearing characters, and it just came off to me as a huge pile of bleh. All my friends still say it's the best giant robot series ever and I've given up contradicting them. It's a giant robot series for people who don't like giant robot series, which is fine, but in my opinion Mobile Suit Gundam will always be a better show.

    LibrarianThorne on
  • NAND NORNAND NOR Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    That's what I got from it. It's like Watchmen except with giant robots and shitty teenagers, so....

    No .... no it's not. Watchmen was an unintentional, intellectual deconstruction of the state of comic books at the time (and to this day) that in ways also made statements on things outside of comics. Evangelion was a cartoon filled with fan service and forced Christian symbolism in an attempt to feel "deep" and "meaningful."

    NAND NOR on
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  • ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2007
    unintentional?

    Servo on
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  • IrohIroh Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    hughtron wrote: »
    The future of the U.S. manga market is that either the tastes of the audience will age and the material being imported will do the same (like JAPAN), or it won’t, and we’ll be stuck with a nation of hardcore fucking nerds, lusting after MOE 12 year olds and deeply enjoying material for children (like AMERICA). Either way, you know, there’ll be an absolute avalanche of material to choose from, and so the market will remain healthy. It’d take a new Pearl Harbor for North America to turn away from Japanese culture in the fashion necessary for the market to collapse.

    If he's saying what I think he is, this is a crock of shit. We've already covered the fact that more than a simple majority of American comics are no longer for children. They may have started that way, but things have come a long way since then.

    However, if he's only talking about the quality of manga that we get here, he's probably correct. A whole lot of people buying manga in the US are content with stuff that's absolute trash, just because it seems exotic.

    Iroh on
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  • ZeromusZeromus Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    NAND NOR wrote: »
    That's what I got from it. It's like Watchmen except with giant robots and shitty teenagers, so....

    No .... no it's not. Watchmen was an unintentional, intellectual deconstruction of the state of comic books at the time (and to this day) that in ways also made statements on things outside of comics. Evangelion was a cartoon filled with fan service and forced Christian symbolism in an attempt to feel "deep" and "meaningful."

    I think you probably don't have any fucking idea what you're talking about.

    Zeromus on
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  • IrohIroh Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    No, I'm pretty sure Eva is shit.

    Iroh on
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  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    the only thing wrong about that is that Watchmen wasn't unintentional.

    The Lovely Bastard on
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  • ZeromusZeromus Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    He's pretty much right about Eva, but I think that is a gross oversimplification of Watchmen.

    Zeromus on
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  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    Watchmen also had Pirates.

    The Lovely Bastard on
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  • ZeromusZeromus Registered User regular
    edited August 2007
    And post-modernism.

    Zeromus on
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