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Why don't you like Superman?

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  • HtownHtown Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Angry wrote: »
    so i picked up for tommorow, birthright, for all seasons.

    birthright and for all seasons are awesome. for tommorow is merely alright.

    birthright is canon right?

    I think it was canon the last time anybody said anything, but the last time anybody said anything was before Infinite Crisis.

    It's was canon when it was written. It's probably canon now.

    Up, Up, and Away is canon, and it's really good and really recent.

    Htown on
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  • LibrarianThorneLibrarianThorne Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Angry wrote: »
    so i picked up for tommorow, birthright, for all seasons.

    birthright and for all seasons are awesome. for tommorow is merely alright.

    birthright is canon right?

    No, and neither is the (far superior to Birthright, IMO) Man of Steel miniseries. They did Superman's new origin in the Action Comics Annual, I think, and it's silver age with the movie costumes, basically. It was also boring as fuck as it didn't even look cool, which was something I liked about Yu's Krypton in Birthright and Byrne's Krypton in Man of Steel. I'm telling you, as probably the biggest Superman fan on these boards, wait until new writing teams get onto the character. I love Busiek and Geoff Johns but their Superman stories are terrrible.

    In the meantime, I suggest It's a Bird... and the new Death and Return of Superman hardcover. The hardcover is $75 but you're getting basically 2 years' worth of the then 4 a month Superman books (and one or two Justice League books, too). Death and Return is arguably the best Superman story of that decade, contending only with the Wedding Special which I still really need to read.

    LibrarianThorne on
  • AkatsukiAkatsuki Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    What I think has already been said by everyone arround here, but I still have room for Superman in my heart, cause, you know... he's Superman. He's a fucking icon.

    Akatsuki on
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  • MorithainMorithain Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I love Superman, but I can totally see why people hate him.

    A.) He's too powerful for his own good (yes, I'm aware of the whole post and pre-Crisis power level differences) but it's hard to write a story about someone who can just do so damn much.

    B.) Overall, he's not as bothered by emotional trauma as say, Batman to your average reader. I know Superman has gotten plenty batshit crazy over the years through various story arcs, but if you compare the character development between say, The Long Halloween and Superman For All Seasons (both by Loeb & Sale) For All Seasons is less driven by Superman, and more by the other characters. Whereas the Long Halloween really shows off how insane Bruce is.

    C.) The suit. Being a freshman in college now, having just gotten out of high school, liking comic book movies wasn't really something you could be laughed at for. Why? Because pretty much every guy I knew (from the nerds to the jocks) thought Batman Begins kicked ass. While I admire the fact that I live in a day and age where liking Lord of the Rings and comic book movies in general isn't something you'd be criticized for, when I asked other kids why Batman was cool and Superman was "gay" as they put it, they said his costume just looks fruity compared to Batmans.

    D.) He's just not a bad ass. I hate to say it, but it's almost true. Again, Superman has had plenty of bad ass moments, but most people who don't like him often are people who have only seen the movies, and only have those to compare, which is sad, but whatever.

    Again, I adore Superman, my grandfather was a member of the Supermen of America fanclub when he was a kid, and even gave me his certificate, from 1939, when he was 15. And honestly the only Superman book I read is All Star, which comes out like, twice a year -_-. But DC is just running out of ideas for him, the cow has been dry for quite some time.

    Morithain on
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  • Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited September 2007
    All-Star comes out bi-monthly

    Garlic Bread on
  • MorithainMorithain Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I know ;)

    Being a tad sarcastic

    Morithain on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • silkypeasilkypea Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    all star tries to come out bi-monthly

    the ultimates also came out bi-monthly

    silkypea on
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  • SaphSaph Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Morithain wrote: »

    B.) Overall, he's not as bothered by emotional trauma as say, Batman to your average reader. I know Superman has gotten plenty batshit crazy over the years through various story arcs, but if you compare the character development between say, The Long Halloween and Superman For All Seasons (both by Loeb & Sale) For All Seasons is less driven by Superman, and more by the other characters. Whereas the Long Halloween really shows off how insane Bruce is.
    I think you've got that the wrong way around.

    Saph on
  • panthersampanthersam Registered User new member
    Ok the reason I don't like superman is simply he's not realistic. As powerful as they make him he shouldn't even be anywhere near a human they've made him a virtual god hell marvel doesn't even make their god characters that powerful ( even though in my personal opinion Thor could totally kick supes ass) which brings me to another point marvel needs to power up Thor way more

  • Burden of ProofBurden of Proof You three boys picked a beautiful hill to die on. Registered User regular
    I pretty much rolled my eyes at Superman for years until I actually read some of his comics. After all, people don't traditionally go through the trouble of purchasing a comic book about a character that they aren't interested in. When I finally started reading a few of his books, I realized that none of my preconceived notions were wrong, but actually worked in context of the stories.

    So yeah, I wasn't wrong, but I was.

    Superman is absolutely necessary to the DC setting, even if I'm not dying to pick up his books.

  • KyouguKyougu Registered User regular
    Looking for realism in super hero comics seems a bit silly.

    In the grand scheme of things Supes fits perfectly well into the DC world and that's what should matter

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    If you don't like Superman then I am very sorry to hear that and I hope you get better soon

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  • Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    I demand realism in my imaginary stories!

  • UnbrokenEvaUnbrokenEva HIGH ON THE WIRE BUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered User regular
    also, don't dig up threads from 5 years ago guy

    we have rules

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  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Well, since it's here now, I guess I'll pull out my thoughts since I was just talking about this with a co-worker.

    I think the unusually high level of outspoken dislike for superman you get in the comics world comes from a collection of things.

    1. The character is old: As far as superheroes go, you don't get anyone really older than Superman. He's guy who started tights and flights. This in and of itself is not the problem, though. The problem is that a lot of writers who seek to write him grew up with Superman as their childhood hero. This means that with the exception of a few seminal works, quite a lot of writers create a hyper-idealised version of the character who becomes the norm and then the children that grew up on him grow up and write a hyper idealised of their Superman. So on and so forth. This is cut back by reductivist movements to Superman's mythos like Man of Steel or Morrison's current Action Comics. These don't matter though because...

    2. Respected people in the industry during the years when comics became a "legitamite artform" threw Superman under the bus: This happened quite a bit in the early to mid 80's. Dark, bleak comic books were (and in a lot of ways still are) the in thing. The Dark Knight Returns alone did untold levels of damage to the character in pop culture. I don't hear the complaints of Superman as establisment stooge being the reason he is unloved as much as I used to, but most of those arguments trace back to DKR. Lots of respected folks have made the "too powerful" argument. It was pleanty true when it was first brought up in interviews and such. Silver Age Superman of the 50's-early 70's could blow out a star like a birthday candle, break the "time barrier" and had so many Super Powers, he almost had a power for every dumb gadget in Batman's utility belt around the same time. Almost. Lots of people noted this. Lots of people since who have little to no interest in superman when asked about him cribbed these comments even though they no longer apply. Even Bruce Timm has complained about Superman's powers in commentary for the JLA cartoon. It exists independently of what Superman actually is now. Anyway, all this lead to...

    3. The pop culture understanding of Superman is thirty to fourty years old: Although there have been outstanding superman runs and stories (and also terrible ones, like any character) none of those works have pierced the veil of Super-fandom into the greater knowledge of pop culture. Maybe All-Star could qualify, but only in the world of comics at large. The image of Batman in pop culture at large used to be Adam West until Batman '89. Superman has had no impact on the cultural zeitgeist since the early Donner films. As previously noted by someone else, people don't read characters they don't think they're going to like. I guess what I'm trying to say here is that the layman's image of batman is much closer to his true personality, appearance, adventures, ect. than Superman's. Same is true of Spider-Man, Avengers, whatever else you want to put in there for the comparison.

    There are of course people that just straight up cannot get into Superman even having read his modern adventures. But seriously, the dude has crazy science adventures every week, beats up giant monsters, out of control robots, and mad scientists and has a sweet man-cave full of alien WMD's and a monster zoo. The dude's a blast to hang out with on a monthly basis. If y'all want to hangout with that killjoy Batman, that's your perrogative.

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    Guek
  • azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Its not that i dont like him, I just find him the prototype superhero..the basic guy that can fly, super everything, nicest guy on the planet and.....well thats the starting point. meanwhile everyone else has been starting with that then removing pieces, adding pieces, adding flaws to make him more human and thats why I find say Thor to be a much more awesome character then Superman. Guys a God, hes thousands of years old, hes got a mythology behind and in front of him and while hes honorable and worthy, hes not always that. hes not the guy that never kills, never makes a mistake.

    Even the Sentry, an obvious superman ripoff was more interesting to read simply because he was batshit crazy.

    When you take just one piece of superman, say super speed, and focus on it, you get the flash, and something more interesting then the whole. Superman dispite being the fastest, the strongest, the mostest everything, comes across as a jack-of-all-trades to me. Hes impossible to focus on one part of him because hes got everything and its him having everything that make him superman. Superman is the hero for kids who arent sophisticated enough to want deeper characterization. If i read superman nowadays, its because im interested in something clark kent is doing, not what superman is doing.

    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    azith28 wrote: »
    Its not that i dont like him, I just find him the prototype superhero..the basic guy that can fly, super everything, nicest guy on the planet and.....well thats the starting point. meanwhile everyone else has been starting with that then removing pieces, adding pieces, adding flaws to make him more human and thats why I find say Thor to be a much more awesome character then Superman. Guys a God, hes thousands of years old, hes got a mythology behind and in front of him and while hes honorable and worthy, hes not always that. hes not the guy that never kills, never makes a mistake.

    Even the Sentry, an obvious superman ripoff was more interesting to read simply because he was batshit crazy.

    When you take just one piece of superman, say super speed, and focus on it, you get the flash, and something more interesting then the whole. Superman dispite being the fastest, the strongest, the mostest everything, comes across as a jack-of-all-trades to me. Hes impossible to focus on one part of him because hes got everything and its him having everything that make him superman. Superman is the hero for kids who arent sophisticated enough to want deeper characterization. If i read superman nowadays, its because im interested in something clark kent is doing, not what superman is doing.

    Superman never makes a mistake now?

    SUperman ain't close to the "mostest".

    That bold line is insanely insulting.

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  • Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    I believe that if Grant Morrison were here he'd offer to fight you over that line.

    SightTDWOniros25
  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    Which would be quite the honor, mind, but would the fight be fought with fists or memetic psychic energy from the sixth dimension? :D

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  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Seriously guys

    you need help

    but it's okay

    there are people who can bring you beyond your terrible affliction

    AntimatterCentipede DamascusGR_Zombie
  • LibrarianThorneLibrarianThorne Registered User regular
    Wow, this thread is back? My notifications exploded, man this is old.

    I think everyone has to go through a phase where Superman is "dumb" and "overpowered" and characters like Spider-Man and Batman are better "because they're not for little kids." There's a tendency to reduce Superman to Nice Guy With Powers and assume that's all his stories are.

    It totally ignores, of course, stories that take time to discover. For The Man Who Has Everything, Red Son, For All Seasons, Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow, What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, & The American Way.... All of these stories hit a lot harder and with a lot more complexity once you understand just how hard they are to write. Superman is, I think, one of the hardest characters to write for (especially in the post-Flashpoint DCnU). He doesn't have easy gimmes like Batman or Spider-Man. He doesn't do a lot of work for you. To write a good Superman story, you have to start with "When you're the most powerful thing in the world, why would you spend all your time helping other people?"

    Superman asks us to be selfless, to see the world as an inclusive whole (a la All-Star Superman) and less as pure black and white. Are there simple Superman stories? Of course, in fact most superhero stories are fairly simple It takes rare talents to make them anything more than that, and an even rarer talent to do the same for Superman.

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  • GuekGuek Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Oniros25 wrote: »
    3. The pop culture understanding of Superman is thirty to fourty years old: Although there have been outstanding superman runs and stories (and also terrible ones, like any character) none of those works have pierced the veil of Super-fandom into the greater knowledge of pop culture. Maybe All-Star could qualify, but only in the world of comics at large. The image of Batman in pop culture at large used to be Adam West until Batman '89. Superman has had no impact on the cultural zeitgeist since the early Donner films. As previously noted by someone else, people don't read characters they don't think they're going to like. I guess what I'm trying to say here is that the layman's image of batman is much closer to his true personality, appearance, adventures, ect. than Superman's. Same is true of Spider-Man, Avengers, whatever else you want to put in there for the comparison.

    This hits the nail square on the head for me. I like Superman. I've enjoyed a fair amount of Superman stories. But I don't think I'll ever really love the character because...well...I just find him to be generally dated and boring. But that's only the character as a whole. There are fantastic Superman stories out there for sure. I can see why the diehard fans are so into the character. But for me? There's not much for me to relate to. And far too often, it feels like writers cross the line from a Superman who stands for the best in us to a worn out, tired cliche that's trying to push naive optimism. When he works, he works, but I find that I have trouble relating to the character whatsoever in your average superman book.

    You big time fans of Superman, would you say the character has evolved significantly in the past 25years? How has he changed since the start of the 90s?

    Guek on
  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Guek wrote: »
    Oniros25 wrote: »
    3. The pop culture understanding of Superman is thirty to fourty years old: Although there have been outstanding superman runs and stories (and also terrible ones, like any character) none of those works have pierced the veil of Super-fandom into the greater knowledge of pop culture. Maybe All-Star could qualify, but only in the world of comics at large. The image of Batman in pop culture at large used to be Adam West until Batman '89. Superman has had no impact on the cultural zeitgeist since the early Donner films. As previously noted by someone else, people don't read characters they don't think they're going to like. I guess what I'm trying to say here is that the layman's image of batman is much closer to his true personality, appearance, adventures, ect. than Superman's. Same is true of Spider-Man, Avengers, whatever else you want to put in there for the comparison.

    This hits the nail square on the head for me. I like Superman. I've enjoyed a fair amount of Superman stories. But I don't think I'll ever really love the character because...well...I just find him to be generally dated and boring. But that's only the character as a whole. There are fantastic Superman stories out there for sure. I can see why the diehard fans are so into the character. But for me? There's not much for me to relate to. And far too often, it feels like writers cross the line from a Superman who stands for the best in us to a worn out, tired cliche that's trying to push naive optimism. When he works, he works, but I find that I have trouble relating to the character whatsoever in your average superman book.

    You big time fans of Superman, would you say the character has evolved significantly in the past 25years? How has he changed since the start of the 90s?

    Well, he's been all over the place in recent times. Pre-flashpoint (the event that started the current era of DC Comics continuity last yearish in case you aren't up on that kind of thing) Superman went through a complex maze of subtle shifts to continuity and personality that were really just shades of who he was in the 90's. Birthright briefly made him a vegetarian and did a pretty good job of "modernizing" the post-crisis Superman. Secret Origin seemingly tried to move the character closer to what is in pop culture's mind's eye when they think of big blue (this was a mistake in my mind. See number 3.)

    That all changed in the mid 2000's when Grant Morrison started getting his hooks into the character. He wrote his out of continuity All-Star which was like a "good parts version" of the character that took the best bits from every era that came before it. But the real revolution (for me at least) is the New 52 Action Comics Superman written by Morrison (this time in continuity) who, as I kind of hinted at, is reductivist in the level of rose colored glasses Superman is seen through.

    He returns to being a social activist with a cape: a man of the people who stands up to the bullies regular folk can't. He exposes rotten buisnessmen, taunts corrupt cops and builds decent housing for the poor. He also punches robots, fights aliens and travels through time, but that's just gravy. Especially in volume one, Superman VS the Men of Steel, his story is presented like an american tall tale, like John Henry or Paul Bunyan but written for the 21st centry. Even Clark Kent is not the easy going befuddled reporter so much as a driven old-school reporter looking to expose the "Sekelletons buried in the foundation of the City of Tomorrow" as he once described it. He's still got a certain ammount of leveity to him and seems to generally enjoy both his mundane life and being Superman, so it's not like you're reading about Batman in a red cape, but if any of that sounds appealing to whoever reads this, please, please do me a solid and at least flip through the first volume trade for the new Action Comics. It's a blast and a half and my current favorite comic.

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  • valhalla130valhalla130 13 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered User regular
    Golden God wrote: »
    I hate Superman because hes a dick to everyone he meets. He attempts to force everyone to live to a higher standered as a person. Normally its no problem to want people to strive twords a less self centered lifestyle. But Superman wants you to live up to a im pretty sure that 9 times out of 10 im stronger, faster, and smarter than what ever im challenged with. For the most part it boils down to the old saying its easy being nice when your God.

    Wait a minute... a guy being extremely nice and showing himself to be an example for the way humanity could be, in regards to being nicer, and caring for others... is being a dick?

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  • valhalla130valhalla130 13 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered User regular
    Here's my take on it... I love Superman because of what others have said. He embodies hope. He is the guy everyone should strive to be like, and yes, he has awesome powers, but they aren't everything and great writers can either pit him against someone who is as strong as he is, negating the need for kryptonite, or deal with him in ways that challenge him even without the powers. For the Man Who Has Everything is an excellent example of that.

    On a base level though... I think a lot of people just react negatively to anything that is a "good guy." Like my brother always wanted to be the decepticons, or Cobra, or the Empire, instead of the autobots, GI Joe or the Rebels, because bad guys were "cooler."

    I really think a lot of people approach Superman this way, then try to fit their argument around that without realizing what they're doing, and they never really give the character a chance.

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    Oniros25LibrarianThorne
  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    Here's my take on it... I love Superman because of what others have said. He embodies hope. He is the guy everyone should strive to be like, and yes, he has awesome powers, but they aren't everything and great writers can either pit him against someone who is as strong as he is, negating the need for kryptonite, or deal with him in ways that challenge him even without the powers. For the Man Who Has Everything is an excellent example of that.

    On a base level though... I think a lot of people just react negatively to anything that is a "good guy." Like my brother always wanted to be the decepticons, or Cobra, or the Empire, instead of the autobots, GI Joe or the Rebels, because bad guys were "cooler."

    I really think a lot of people approach Superman this way, then try to fit their argument around that without realizing what they're doing, and they never really give the character a chance.

    My all-time favorite guy, Grant Morrison, in his history of superheroes/autobiography Supergods on this very subject has said that it's gone so far towards the reverance for the anti-hero, the badass, the tortured protagonist, that it is now punk or counter culture to just admit that being the good guy is pretty cool. A kind of, "Oh, come on! What are we trying to prove with this, anyway?" sort of argument.

    The sad truth is, since he is a becon of idealism and optimism, the more cynical and dismissive of "good guys" the world becomes, the more it needs Superman. Good thing he's down for a neverending battle because it's probably going to get worse before it gets any better...unless of course Man of Steel turns out to be the game changer for Superman that Batman '89 was for Batman. Then maybe I'll put my soapbox away and just read my comics in peace.

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  • WiseManTobesWiseManTobes Registered User regular
    Curious question, how many reboots and retcons has Superman received since this thread originally began in 07 ? rofl

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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Oniros25 wrote: »
    3. The pop culture understanding of Superman is thirty to fourty years old: Although there have been outstanding superman runs and stories (and also terrible ones, like any character) none of those works have pierced the veil of Super-fandom into the greater knowledge of pop culture. Maybe All-Star could qualify, but only in the world of comics at large. The image of Batman in pop culture at large used to be Adam West until Batman '89. Superman has had no impact on the cultural zeitgeist since the early Donner films. As previously noted by someone else, people don't read characters they don't think they're going to like. I guess what I'm trying to say here is that the layman's image of batman is much closer to his true personality, appearance, adventures, ect. than Superman's. Same is true of Spider-Man, Avengers, whatever else you want to put in there for the comparison.

    That's not entirely true. Superman had had the Smallville tv show, Superman: TAS and Justice League/Justice League Unlimited (and Young Justice: TAS when he guest stars). It might not impact society's perspective as much as a big budget films do, but it has a noticeable impact anyway. Superman is also getting a new big budget movie soon. That said, Superman Return didn't do the character or franchise any favors.
    There are of course people that just straight up cannot get into Superman even having read his modern adventures. But seriously, the dude has crazy science adventures every week, beats up giant monsters, out of control robots, and mad scientists and has a sweet man-cave full of alien WMD's and a monster zoo. The dude's a blast to hang out with on a monthly basis. If y'all want to hangout with that killjoy Batman, that's your perrogative.

    Agreed. Too many buy the myth that Superman is too powerful yet Marvel and DC have loads of characters, including super-heroes, that operate in his ballpark or surpass it power wise. And too many people ignore that his powers can and have been toned down.
    Golden God wrote: »
    I hate Superman because hes a dick to everyone he meets. He attempts to force everyone to live to a higher standered as a person. Normally its no problem to want people to strive twords a less self centered lifestyle. But Superman wants you to live up to a im pretty sure that 9 times out of 10 im stronger, faster, and smarter than what ever im challenged with. For the most part it boils down to the old saying its easy being nice when your God.


    :?

  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    Most of them had already happened by '07. They've added one as of the New 52...maybe secret origin happened after I can't remember now...either way, no more than Spider-Man really :-)

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  • WiseManTobesWiseManTobes Registered User regular
    Ya, it was more because I'm Marvel Centric I was curious, only 1 reboot in 5 years is actually pretty good in comics, Go Go Supes!

    Also, I'm sure I said this in earlier pages the first time this thread came around, but these forums taught me that Superman can be awesome, he's just hard to write, but when you get a good writer on him.. /swoon

    Steam! Battlenet:Wisemantobes#1508
  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Ya, it was more because I'm Marvel Centric I was curious, only 1 reboot in 5 years is actually pretty good in comics, Go Go Supes!

    Also, I'm sure I said this in earlier pages the first time this thread came around, but these forums taught me that Superman can be awesome, he's just hard to write, but when you get a good writer on him.. /swoon

    So he's like any other physically powerful character.

    Oniros25
  • Crimson KingCrimson King Registered User regular
    all good characters have a weakness

    superman's weakness is his genuine belief that there is good in all people

    it is also his greatest strength

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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    all good characters have a weakness

    superman's weakness is his genuine belief that there is good in all people

    it is also his greatest strength

    And magic and highly advanced technology and being beaten to death by enemies stronger than he is and telepathy etc.

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    really powerful characters aren't even harder to write than anyone else

    just create adversaries of equal power

    I never get why people always say "but Superman is so powerful it's boring"

    Power is relative. He's unimaginably strong compared to a normal human but that's why he never has straight up fights with normal humans

    Solar on
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  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    Except Luthor...though you'd have to be kind of an idiot to think that there is anything normal about that human.

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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Oniros25 wrote: »
    Except Luthor...though you'd have to be kind of an idiot to think that there is anything normal about that human.

    Superman avoids physically harming Luthor unless he's wearing that fancy armor or beating his super-powered proxies.

  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    I was attempting humor. Clearly, it did not go off without a hitch...

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  • GuekGuek Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    I think the only thing that annoys me about Superman's power set is when he's painted as invincibly strong in one panel and then seems to be winded by what I'd think would be much weaker enemies. I recall a random issue I read a month or so ago where he was fighting some kind of kryptonian dragon that was giving him a bit of trouble when earlier in the issue he was bench pressing a planet (or something like that). Like, really? Unless that dragon was made out of kryptonite, it didn't really seem to make sense. I think I prefer the Timm version that's still relatively strong but not capable of juggling continents and thus more understandably struggles with medium to hard hitting foes.

    Guek on
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    well if the Dragon was Kryptonian it would have Kryptonian powers surely

    thus allowing it to pose a very potent threat to Superman

  • Oniros25Oniros25 Registered User regular
    That was in the Superman ongoing, wasn't it? Man, that's written by Scott Lobdell. Inconsistancy is practically his middle name. I enter into evidence for this his entire run on Superboy when the New 52 began. There was no sense of what Superboy's power levels were at, how his powers even worked...characters would talk about stuff that has that "remember this for later because it's going to be important" sort of way and then the plot point just evaporates. Part of the reason I'm still not reading Superman, just Action.

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