PS3 Owners - A Quick Moment of Your Time, Please

h8b1llg8ts

I know this thread is going to be short and hopefully sweet, so can a mod keep an eye on it and close her up when we're done.

So can you guys and gals explain the old 60GB PS3 to me. From what I understand is that the 40GB and 60GB PS3's will play old PS1 and PS2 games. But the new 80GB will not?

So if that's true and 1up's new article showing that the 60GB, has gone the way of the dodo like the 40GB, that I cannot play my old Playstation games on a new PS3?

1up.com wrote:

The constant SKU swapping by hardware manufacturers is easily the most confusing part of this generation. Around E3 time, Sony Computer Entertainment America confirmed they were introducing an 80GB-equipped PlayStation 3 bundled with MotorStorm at $599, the price the 60GB SKU previously occupied. The 60GB SKU became $499 -- which was once the 20GB SKU before it was discontinued -- and now Sony's announced that SKU has completely left their warehouses.
Confused? You should be. But, SCEA confirmed to 1UP (stemming from a PC World story) the 60GB SKU has left the building and into the hands of retailers. They wouldn't speculate on how long it would take for machines to run out, only that there was "ample supply," suggesting there's more than enough to give breathing room for the next move.

That move is likely phasing out the 60GB SKU and dropping the 80GB SKU to $499, but SCEA wouldn't comment and tossed us the same quote you've seen elsewhere. "We won't" be making any further announcements regarding our PS3 model hardware strategy in North America until the 60GB model is exhausted and market conditions are evaluated," said SCEA Senior Director of Corp. Comm. Dave Karraker.

I really didn't want to go running out to buy another Playstation until the price goes down A LOT more. But the idea of having a PS2 and a PS3 next to each other really chaps my hide. I already have my Wii and 360 sitting on top of my Xbox brick due to the lack of backwards compatibility ...

SpikedFreak

20 and 60gb PS3 have the EE chip making playing ps1 and ps2 games a nearly flawless experience. Since the new 80gb does not, it has to do it through software. So many games are unsupported, and some that do run, do not run correctly.

Scosglen

The deal with the old AMERICAN PS3's (40GB and 60GB models) is that they have an Emotion Engine chip in them; for all intents and purposes they basically have miniaturized PS2 hardware inside of the PS3. Because of this they are able to do hardware-based emulation for PS2 games, which is to say it almost isn't even emulation at all. The EE based PS3's have nearly perfect backwards compatability.

All of the EU PS3s, and the new 80GB NA PS3's do not have the EE chip in them to save on manufacturing costs. Instead these consoles rely entirely on software-based emulation to muscle PS2 games into running. This does NOT mean that these EE-less PS3's don't have BC, but the BC is decidedly less comprehensive, and among the games that do work, more of them will have minor to major problems when you actually play them. You can expect most high-profile games to work fine with software emulation, and it sounds like Sony is periodically adding more support to fix games which don't work properly, but if you have a collection of games which include more obscure titles things become more of a crapshoot.

DarkWarrior

They already released a new backwards compatability update. So while buying a non EE chip PS3 means you won't be able to play 100% of games straight away, they ARE working on it which is more than can be said for the 360.

From the lists it also looks like a large amount of games, in particular the most popular ones, will work with the latest updates installed.

Transporter

You CAN play PS1/PS2 games on any of the new PS3's.

However, they may or may not be buggy as shit.

The old 60g PS3 has the actual Emotion Chip thing that the PS2 had.

The New PS3's do not. They emulate it.

akajaybay

I picked up the 60Gb mainly for this reason.
I figured I had the cash at the time, I knew I'd want one eventually, the price had just dropped and who knew for sure if it'd stick, and the backwards compatability would be nice. BUT I did kind of regret it for a while. I quickly realized, oh yeah the old controller isn't going to work. Which means no rumble. And I kind of like my rumble. Also, no guitar hero controller. Which is mainly what I was playing on the PS2.
So for a while it was my paperweight of shame until I picked up Warhawk; which is fun for all the boys and girls. Again I know at some point I would want the PS3 but the backwards compatability was my main reason for grabbing it right then, but just realize its not a complete replacement for the ps2 depending on what you use it for.

h8b1llg8ts

akajaybay wrote: »

I picked up the 60Gb mainly for this reason.
I figured I had the cash at the time, I knew I'd want one eventually, the price had just dropped and who knew for sure if it'd stick, and the backwards compatability would be nice. BUT I did kind of regret it for a while. I quickly realized, oh yeah the old controller isn't going to work. Which means no rumble. And I kind of like my rumble. Also, no guitar hero controller. Which is mainly what I was playing on the PS2.
So for a while it was my paperweight of shame until I picked up Warhawk; which is fun for all the boys and girls. Again I know at some point I would want the PS3 but the backwards compatability was my main reason for grabbing it right then, but just realize its not a complete replacement for the ps2 depending on what you use it for.

OOoooo. Great point.

God of War, Grand T, ect without rumble I cannot imagine that feeling taken away from me.

Thanx akajaybay, I owe you lunch ...

DarkSymphony

it works fantastically as a backwards compatibility machine if you get the 60GB or 20GB system (if you can even find the 20). The thing is I *think* there's an adapter you can use for the GH controller. Like I know you can use any given USB->ps2 converter but I think there's one that fixes you up real good with the GH games. And I'd imagine you could an adapter for ps2 controllers as well which would then give you rumble for the rumble supported ps2 games. In fact I have a converter, I'll give it a shot and see.

akajaybay

DarkSymphony wrote: »

it works fantastically as a backwards compatibility machine if you get the 60GB or 20GB system (if you can even find the 20). The thing is I *think* there's an adapter you can use for the GH controller. Like I know you can use any given USB->ps2 converter but I think there's one that fixes you up real good with the GH games. And I'd imagine you could an adapter for ps2 controllers as well which would then give you rumble for the rumble supported ps2 games. In fact I have a converter, I'll give it a shot and see.

Yeah that's kind of what I had hoped at first. There are some 3rd party adapters to connect old controllers.
But apparantly the rumble still doesnt actually work through them. The controller will work but the system doesnt pass along the rumble prompting for whatever reason. Then the guitar hero controllers dont work real well either. It sounded like you could "sort" of get it working on one brands but it involved alot of swapping of controllers to get past prompts of hitting the new contollers ps button and there were issues with the whammy bar not working quite right.

Also you'll need to get an addon to swap your memory card info onto the harddrive of the PS3, it's like $10 or so. Easier if you know someone who's had to do it already since it's mainly a one use tool.

I was a bit disappointed that they didnt bother to leave even a hidden away port for the older controller style or a memory card slot. But really it just came down to keeping the ole Ps2 for now sitting right next to the PS3.

cloudeagle

akajaybay wrote: »

Also you'll need to get an addon to swap your memory card info onto the harddrive of the PS3, it's like $10 or so. Easier if you know someone who's had to do it already since it's mainly a one use tool.

The memory transfer device is $15, actually. Definitely hit up some friends if you go this route, or check ebay or craigslist.

h8b1llg8ts

DarkSymphony wrote: »

it works fantastically as a backwards compatibility machine if you get the 60GB or 20GB system (if you can even find the 20). The thing is I *think* there's an adapter you can use for the GH controller. Like I know you can use any given USB->ps2 converter but I think there's one that fixes you up real good with the GH games. And I'd imagine you could an adapter for ps2 controllers as well which would then give you rumble for the rumble supported ps2 games. In fact I have a converter, I'll give it a shot and see.

But even with an adaptor, for me, I don't want to play with a wired controller on a wireless system. So I'll hold off for a while even though I found out my secretary just went out, on her lunch, and bought one for her kids ... damn consumer whore curse. ... stop eurge to buy ....


And I thank everyone for there help ...

Evangir

DarkWarrior wrote: »

They already released a new backwards compatability update. So while buying a non EE chip PS3 means you won't be able to play 100% of games straight away, they ARE working on it which is more than can be said for the 360.

From the lists it also looks like a large amount of games, in particular the most popular ones, will work with the latest updates installed.

Microsoft never said they've cancelled their BC work. Hell, they released an update... a month and a half ago?

Software emulation sucks. Also note that many games on these BC lists only "work" to varying degrees. Some will be perfect. Some won't get you past the title screen. I can't imagine it being anything but hell on the PS3. Also consider that most of the charm of the PS2 was how massive a software library it had. Since they'll be focusing on the big sellers, the niche titles that many people love will probably be ignored (similar to what happened with the 360's BC, although they've recently added PDO, Psychonauts, and Shenmue II).

akajaybay

Here's the rundown on adaptor issues:
Adaptor Review

No rumble because sony either cant or doesnt want to mess with it for legal reasons.
GH1 controller works with it, GH2 mostly works.

Lanz

Evangir wrote: »

DarkWarrior wrote: »

They already released a new backwards compatability update. So while buying a non EE chip PS3 means you won't be able to play 100% of games straight away, they ARE working on it which is more than can be said for the 360.

From the lists it also looks like a large amount of games, in particular the most popular ones, will work with the latest updates installed.

Microsoft never said they've cancelled their BC work. Hell, they released an update... a month and a half ago?

Software emulation sucks. Also note that many games on these BC lists only "work" to varying degrees. Some will be perfect. Some won't get you past the title screen. I can't imagine it being anything but hell on the PS3. Also consider that most of the charm of the PS2 was how massive a software library it had. Since they'll be focusing on the big sellers, the niche titles that many people love will probably be ignored (similar to what happened with the 360's BC, although they've recently added PDO, Psychonauts, and Shenmue II).

not to mention Sony right out said that adding more titles to BC would not be top priority.

The Burnin8or

You can check the backwards compatibility of games for your specific model of PS3 (60 vs. 80) on the Playstation site:

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

h8b1llg8ts

Lanz wrote: »

Evangir wrote: »

DarkWarrior wrote: »

They already released a new backwards compatability update. So while buying a non EE chip PS3 means you won't be able to play 100% of games straight away, they ARE working on it which is more than can be said for the 360.

From the lists it also looks like a large amount of games, in particular the most popular ones, will work with the latest updates installed.

Microsoft never said they've cancelled their BC work. Hell, they released an update... a month and a half ago?

Software emulation sucks. Also note that many games on these BC lists only "work" to varying degrees. Some will be perfect. Some won't get you past the title screen. I can't imagine it being anything but hell on the PS3. Also consider that most of the charm of the PS2 was how massive a software library it had. Since they'll be focusing on the big sellers, the niche titles that many people love will probably be ignored (similar to what happened with the 360's BC, although they've recently added PDO, Psychonauts, and Shenmue II).

not to mention Sony right out said that adding more titles to BC would not be top priority.

And I can understand that since the PS2 is still out selling the PS3 ...

h8b1llg8ts

I know this won't help me with my decision but this info may help others so I wanted to pass it along.

1up.com wrote:

The PlayStation 3 v1.92 firmware update earlier this week apparently fixed issues related to the backwards compatibility of certain PlayStation 2 titles, but what's the point of updating games if we don't know what's wrong in the first place? Sony Computer Entertainment America has now launched a search engine that produces the known issues with (from what we can tell) most older releases for PS2 and PS One.
Also, at the bottom of the page, SCEA says they're working with publishers to come up with solutions for peripheral-based games to be fully compatible -- hello, Guitar Hero. "Ultimately, however, it will be up to those companies to decide if they want to produce these peripherals to support this gameplay option."

Well, that's not an encouraging sign. What company is going to produce a new peripheral for backwards compatibility?

Said PS3 Search Engine

Unco-ordinated

The Burnin8or wrote: »

You can check the backwards compatibility of games for your specific model of PS3 (60 vs. 80) on the Playstation site:

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

I'm so annoyed at that. SCEA have a great list up, with all the games and problems there, meanwhile SCEE have a piece of shit list up with very vague parameters.

Marty81

So *every* 60 GB US PS3 has an EE chip? Or just the older ones?

cloudeagle

Marty81 wrote: »

So *every* 60 GB US PS3 has an EE chip? Or just the older ones?

Every. And they're not being made anymore.

bongi

didn't they only take out the EE chip? i thought they left in the other bit of ps2 hardware?

taliosfalcon

Unco-ordinated wrote: »

The Burnin8or wrote: »

You can check the backwards compatibility of games for your specific model of PS3 (60 vs. 80) on the Playstation site:

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

I'm so annoyed at that. SCEA have a great list up, with all the games and problems there, meanwhile SCEE have a piece of shit list up with very vague parameters.

the first two games i searched for weren't in the list at all...D:

Couscous

taliosfalcon wrote: »

Unco-ordinated wrote: »

The Burnin8or wrote: »

You can check the backwards compatibility of games for your specific model of PS3 (60 vs. 80) on the Playstation site:

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

I'm so annoyed at that. SCEA have a great list up, with all the games and problems there, meanwhile SCEE have a piece of shit list up with very vague parameters.

the first two games i searched for weren't in the list at all...D:

What did you search for?

Mmmm... Cocks...

Uh... wait, can the PS3s that use the EE chip still do what is done in the emulation?
Example - I remember when Sony released the update that allows the PS3 to upscale PS2 games, and it was a pretty big deal. All the PS3s can use this update right? Or can the ones with the EE not, since they essentially aren't using the emulation and running on the PS2s hardware.

xta

the 60gb ps3 is supposed to be the most complete ps3 there ever will be due to having the hardware ps2 emulation, after the 60gb is gone, it's all going to be software

Mmmm... Cocks...

xta wrote: »

the 60gb ps3 is supposed to be the most complete ps3 there ever will be due to having the hardware ps2 emulation, after the 60gb is gone, it's all going to be software

Uh, so are you saying yes, it can do both?

Unco-ordinated

taliosfalcon wrote: »

Unco-ordinated wrote: »

The Burnin8or wrote: »

You can check the backwards compatibility of games for your specific model of PS3 (60 vs. 80) on the Playstation site:

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

I'm so annoyed at that. SCEA have a great list up, with all the games and problems there, meanwhile SCEE have a piece of shit list up with very vague parameters.

the first two games i searched for weren't in the list at all...D:

Really? Wow, only 3 of my games weren't on the list (DMC1, DQVIII and LOTR:ROTK). The other 50 or so PS2 games showed up, as well as the 20 or so PS1 games. There was no point in doing it (since they're all PAL games) but I just wanted to compare how horrible the SCEE list is compared to the SCEA list.

Cocks: Yeah, the 60GB can upscale PS2 games as well.

bongi: Yeah, the 80GB PS3 still has the Graphics Synthesizer chip in it. Eventually they'll probably take that out too and have the backwards compatibility done completely through software.

thunderclump

Wait, so Sony are revising hardware and actually making it worse?

This is clearly a bold new strategy.

Marty81

thunderclump wrote: »

Wait, so Sony are revising hardware and actually making it worse?

This is clearly a bold new strategy.

Well, it almost makes me want to get a 60 GB PS3 now.

Almost.

Sanders

thunderclump wrote: »

Wait, so Sony are revising hardware and actually making it worse?

This is clearly a bold new strategy.

Much like advertisements in games, it is a bold new way to save money and pass the savings to us.....tralian bank accounts.

taliosfalcon

titmouse wrote: »

taliosfalcon wrote: »

Unco-ordinated wrote: »

The Burnin8or wrote: »

You can check the backwards compatibility of games for your specific model of PS3 (60 vs. 80) on the Playstation site:

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

I'm so annoyed at that. SCEA have a great list up, with all the games and problems there, meanwhile SCEE have a piece of shit list up with very vague parameters.

the first two games i searched for weren't in the list at all...D:

What did you search for?

Gitaroo Man and Persona 3. Although with Persona 3 they probably just haven't updated the list since it came out. Man..i've been planning on buying a ps3 eventually for awhile..but after fooling around with that checker quite a few of my games have serious problems on the 80 like "game hangs at a specific point during gameplay" ..i may need to buy a 60 before the stock dries up..damn you sony

Wienke

Kinda curious as to how good this upscaling business goes for PS2 games. I mean, does it add AA and all kinds of fancy stuff to make PS2 games look a heck of a lot better? Or does it just upscale it to 480p etc.?

Right now there's not really any one game on the PS3 that seems like a must own for the price but I do love me some PS2 games (replaying through some older ones like Jak and Daxter...or its unofficial name "Mario 64 2").

MichaelLC

I got the 60GB for this reason. Or rather, it was the tipping point of my desire to get one.

So far I've bought more PS2/1 games than PS3:

- GoW 1
- FFXII
- SoTC
- Castlevania
- Rampage (what?!)

- Ninja Gaiden Sigma
- Resisteanace: FoM

Reznik

Wienke wrote: »

Kinda curious as to how good this upscaling business goes for PS2 games. I mean, does it add AA and all kinds of fancy stuff to make PS2 games look a heck of a lot better? Or does it just upscale it to 480p etc.?

I'm not really sure how all this upscaling stuff works but when I play Shadow of the Colossus on my PS3 with smoothing and fullscreen upscaling, it looks gorgeous. The smoothing is very noticeable, at least on SotC. I found it didn't do much for FFX, so I guess it depends on the game.

bsjezz

man, the ps3's software emulation really isn't that bad. i've played pretty much all the way through MGS3 on it, and when i went to check the compatibility page out of interest, i was surprised to see it was given the lowest level of compatibility - which I always thought meant it was unplayable. the only errors i've noticed are a few corrupted save files and the rare spot of slow-down. nothing that stops you from playing it, and it still looks bloody great with upscaling etc.

if you have the opportunity, get a 60gb because you can easily and cheaply upgrade the HD - but if you're super-stressing about backwards compatibility, don't. it's not that awful.