Who cares I'll just play it when it shows up. Till then starcraft is still too awesome (which sucks cause I'm not reinstalling till the weeks break I get in February )
Starcraft is a total fluke though. The strategies used today are nothing like what the designers had in mind. I have no idea how this game is balanced. Fortunately starcraft 2 has the original to look at. Worst comes to worse, we get awesome UMS maps and a good campaign. Then we load SC back up.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
Who cares I'll just play it when it shows up. Till then starcraft is still too awesome (which sucks cause I'm not reinstalling till the weeks break I get in February )
Starcraft is a total fluke though. The strategies used today are nothing like what the designers had in mind. I have no idea how this game is balanced. Fortunately starcraft 2 has the original to look at. Worst comes to worse, we get awesome UMS maps and a good campaign. Then we load SC back up.
Yes, the blizzard maps that come packed with SC are...bad lol, just bad for todays style of play.
also- "haha you have zealots? firebats! go!" (if you got the battlechest and read the strat guides you'll get it)
Well in all honesty Terran > zerg> protoss, skill helps TONS though
So Terran is the best race?
This A > B > C > A stuff changes constantly with new styles of play and map. On a good map, all races should be winning approximately equally.
With the new bisu build, I'd say protoss has become a looot more difficult to deal with for zergs. Old ZvP strategy used to favour zerg. With this new defiler heavy, fast hive tech strategy ZvT has also changed. ZvT is still one of the most micro intensive and fun matchups.
Man I want to play.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
Well in all honesty Terran > zerg> protoss, skill helps TONS though
So Terran is the best race?
This A > B > C > A stuff changes constantly with new styles of play and map. On a good map, all races should be winning approximately equally.
With the new bisu build, I'd say protoss has become a looot more difficult to deal with for zergs. Old ZvP strategy used to favour zerg. With this new defiler heavy, fast hive tech strategy ZvT has also changed. ZvT is still one of the most micro intensive and fun matchups.
Man I want to play.
I've always enjoyed ZvT and ZvP, but TvP I've never figured out. Last I checked it was common for Terran to go machines, I just don't like Terran machines. Probably why I've always stuck to team games.
Well in all honesty Terran > zerg> protoss, skill helps TONS though
So Terran is the best race?
This A > B > C > A stuff changes constantly with new styles of play and map. On a good map, all races should be winning approximately equally.
With the new bisu build, I'd say protoss has become a looot more difficult to deal with for zergs. Old ZvP strategy used to favour zerg. With this new defiler heavy, fast hive tech strategy ZvT has also changed. ZvT is still one of the most micro intensive and fun matchups.
Man I want to play.
I've always enjoyed ZvT and ZvP, but TvP I've never figured out. Last I checked it was common for Terran to go machines, I just don't like Terran machines. Probably why I've always stuck to team games.
The problem with infantry in TvP is that they get owned by psi storm and reavers so hard. You really don't like siege tanks? They're like the best part of being Terran. To each his own I suppose.
Lemming: I don't know why I enjoy that picture so much, but it's great.
Marine medic has a small roll in early TvP stages as they own goons. You need stim and range upgrade though, or else range goons + micro will wreck you, which is probably why it's not used much.
TvP is all about covering your flanks with mines and proper tank pushes.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
Oh, yeah. I like tanks. Tanks are good. I don't like Vultures (too narrow a role), or Goliaths (as stupid as goons, but without the muscle to back it up). M&Ms mangle goons, and I love that about them, but Psi Storm eats Terran infantry, and until I get to nukes or BCs I'm kind of in a rut. And I know it's completely my fault, but when I played team games everyone knew how I played and we worked something out. 1v1 I'm kind of useless, and besides that I just don't like to play 1v1 because I've always found it to be too competitive.
Yeah, they're pretty trash as an attack force, but they make great pecker units. My BCs are just 500 HP casters. But I always prefer nukes when I get the chance.
Terran are the best race in the game, I have no doubt in my mind about that, just how much better than the other races is questionable though.
ZvP was and still is an uphill battle for toss despite the bisu build, leastways IMHO
Assuming you mean in terms of strength and not who you like more, I don't know what makes you think this. The large majority of the SC community considers the three races very well balanced, with maps being by far the biggest balance factor.
That, and only 2/9 of the non-korean progamers (can't find an English list atm for the koreans) who pick a race are terrans and the best of those is at third.
Terran are the best race in the game, I have no doubt in my mind about that, just how much better than the other races is questionable though.
ZvP was and still is an uphill battle for toss despite the bisu build, leastways IMHO
Assuming you mean in terms of strength and not who you like more, I don't know what makes you think this. The large majority of the SC community considers the three races very well balanced, with maps being by far the biggest balance factor.
That, and only 2/9 of the non-korean progamers (can't find an English list atm for the koreans) who pick a race are terrans and the best of those is at third.
Yeah I wanna know why you think terran's the best chopa.
Btw do you play with us under a different name?
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
Terran STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (tank push)
They can lock down, irradiate, spider mines, nuke, comsat, heal, repair, and can move their buildings
Maybe I'm just behind the times a lot and stuck back in the days when korean starcraft was TvT all the dam time
and yes the strategies have evolved a lot, but I feel the only real disadvantage to playing terran is that everyone has and theoretically can play against terran
no I actually haven't played with you guys at all, everytime I'm on no one else is and trackpads do not aid micro at all
Those sound like nice things, but I would never consider Terran to be the strongest race. And I'm a Terran player.
For me, Terran suffer from having individually weak units without the benefit of them being cheap and easy to mass produce, like Zerg. If you fuck up with Terran it's much harder to react. Protoss has the benefit of very tough staple units like the Zealot and Dragoon, and the catch-all direct damage spell, Psi Storm, which can fix almost any problem you're having. Just for me, the problem with Terran is that most of their stuff is just too specific.
Terran STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (tank push)
They can lock down, irradiate, spider mines, nuke, comsat, heal, repair, and can move their buildings
Maybe I'm just behind the times a lot and stuck back in the days when korean starcraft was TvT all the dam time
and yes the strategies have evolved a lot, but I feel the only real disadvantage to playing terran is that everyone has and theoretically can play against terran
no I actually haven't played with you guys at all, everytime I'm on no one else is and trackpads do not aid micro at all
I used to fear tanks more a few years ago (okay like 5). Every time that first push rolled out with 1 tank and marine/medic I got screwed. Now it just seems part of the game. Whatever you do, tanks are gonna bring fire down but my lurkers are still gonna rip aport those marines. I'm a lot better than I used to be though.
Siege tanks have their blind spots and are immobile. Always hit terran in transition or flank. I have a pretty nice replay of beating a Lzuruha member (top east clan) with inferior forces just because I took advantage of terrain. The only highly mobile units terran has are vultures. Air units as well, but their role is in most games a lot smaller than ground units.
I don't understand your comment on terran's only disadvantage.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
Outside of Boxer, I can't think of many pro games I've seen with lockdown. Nukes aren't really viable except as a "haha, I'm beating you, hurry up and GG before I embarass you" type strategy.
The main problem with Terran is that they require so much micro. Think of how good Boxer was, and why no one was really able to achieve the same level of success as terran then. The best players right now seem to be mostly Protoss (with Savior's fall, ).
The other races have units you can just throw at an opponent. With the current maps in rotation, most of them favor at least a quick natural right outside their main, if not two, leading to more macro early on imo.
Zerg STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (zergling rush)
They can broodling, dark swarm, lurker, plague, parasite, ensnare, and their buildings can regen
Protoss STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (storm storm lol)
They can stasis, psi storm, maelstrom, mind control, feedback, hallucinate, recall, dweb, and their buildings are glowy
Bruce Forsyth on
0
SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
Zerg STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (zergling rush)
They can broodling, dark swarm, lurker, plague, parasite, ensnare, and their buildings can regen
Protoss STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (storm storm lol)
They can stasis, psi storm, maelstrom, mind control, feedback, hallucinate, recall, dweb, and their buildings warp in without sacrificing or tying up a worker
I can't believe I didn't think of that. But glowy is amusing and wraps up my point, nicely.
Also, in regards to Smasher in another thread, I totally thought team melee had max cap of 200 for each race. It was pretty cool to see 600 stat cap for my toss when I tried it.
Bruce Forsyth on
0
SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
Siege tanks have their blind spots and are immobile. Always hit terran in transition or flank. I have a pretty nice replay of beating a Lzuruha member (top east clan) with inferior forces just because I took advantage of terrain. The only highly mobile units terran has are vultures. Air units as well, but their role is in most games a lot smaller than ground units.
I'd be interested in seeing this game.
Also, I've come up with an idea for PvT. I don't know how well it would work, but I'm eager to try it out.
Siege tanks have their blind spots and are immobile. Always hit terran in transition or flank. I have a pretty nice replay of beating a Lzuruha member (top east clan) with inferior forces just because I took advantage of terrain. The only highly mobile units terran has are vultures. Air units as well, but their role is in most games a lot smaller than ground units.
I'd be interested in seeing this game.
Also, I've come up with an idea for PvT. I don't know how well it would work, but I'm eager to try it out.
Nony has already done it sorry.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
0
SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
Siege tanks have their blind spots and are immobile. Always hit terran in transition or flank. I have a pretty nice replay of beating a Lzuruha member (top east clan) with inferior forces just because I took advantage of terrain. The only highly mobile units terran has are vultures. Air units as well, but their role is in most games a lot smaller than ground units.
I'd be interested in seeing this game.
Also, I've come up with an idea for PvT. I don't know how well it would work, but I'm eager to try it out.
I actually searched youtube for nony and found a game of him recorded and then with his own commentary added. It's kind of amusing to watch him go crazy with all the mouse clicks and APM, but to speak so slowly.
Also, I haven't seen anyone on in a few days, so what are the chances of getting something going tonight? I'm not on yet, but perhaps soon...
I actually searched youtube for nony and found a game of him recorded and then with his own commentary added. It's kind of amusing to watch him go crazy with all the mouse clicks and APM, but to speak so slowly.
Also, I haven't seen anyone on in a few days, so what are the chances of getting something going tonight? I'm not on yet, but perhaps soon...
The poor guy hasn't seen arbitersssss.avi
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
0
SmasherStarting to get dizzyRegistered Userregular
I actually searched youtube for nony and found a game of him recorded and then with his own commentary added. It's kind of amusing to watch him go crazy with all the mouse clicks and APM, but to speak so slowly.
Also, I haven't seen anyone on in a few days, so what are the chances of getting something going tonight? I'm not on yet, but perhaps soon...
Zerg STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (zergling rush)
They can broodling, dark swarm, lurker, plague, parasite, ensnare, and their buildings can regen
Protoss STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (storm storm lol)
They can stasis, psi storm, maelstrom, mind control, feedback, hallucinate, recall, dweb, and their buildings are glowy
If a ling rush fails you typically cannot keep massing lings, while you can keep pushing with tanks.
I've never seen a pro protoss default to psi storm to win a match, to help beat M&Ms or Dark Swarm yes, but defaulting to it no.
Every time that first push rolled out with 1 tank and marine/medic I got screwed. Now it just seems part of the game. Whatever you do, tanks are gonna bring fire down but my lurkers are still gonna rip aport those marines. I'm a lot better than I used to be though.
Siege tanks have their blind spots and are immobile. Always hit terran in transition or flank. I have a pretty nice replay of beating a Lzuruha member (top east clan) with inferior forces just because I took advantage of terrain. The only highly mobile units terran has are vultures. Air units as well, but their role is in most games a lot smaller than ground units.
I don't understand your comment on terran's only disadvantage.
Like I said skill helps a lot. What I meant by their disadvantage is that terran playstyle hasn't changed all that much, its still very much either M&M or tank push and people have at this point gotten experience playing against these builds.
The main problem with Terran is that they require so much micro. Think of how good Boxer was, and why no one was really able to achieve the same level of success as terran then. The best players right now seem to be mostly Protoss (with Savior's fall, ).
The other races have units you can just throw at an opponent. With the current maps in rotation, most of them favor at least a quick natural right outside their main, if not two, leading to more macro early on imo.
You cannot throw toss at an opponent, and Jaedong (zerg) is just about the top of the heap as far as players go these days.
I'm interested in seeing how good chopa is. Someone play him. I can't I've given up SC for awhile.
No offence chopa but it's just nice to see if someone actually has skills or is theory crafting. Granted even if you haven't played in awhile if you were a good player in the past you should be able to be on par or better than most PA players right now.
Dangerisk on
If what you say is true, the Shaolin and the Wu-Tang could be DANGERISK.
I get that way sometimes. I think I'm gaming too much and it's getting in the way of other things. The problem is when I cut back, I don't actually get more things done. I just get extremely bored trying to fill the time with something else. I procrastinate so bad, but I can't really say my playing games is the cause.
That kinda goes along with something Blizzard said when SC was first released. Terran, since they played most similar to previous RTS's, were supposed to be easy to learn and difficult to master. I think zerg were the ones that were supposed to be difficult to learn and easy to master.
Here's a list of the top 30 Korean Players at this current moment, according to the ELO rating system, though it's not really that accurate. (same thing used for chess)
Jaedong - Zerg, Best Player at the moment in the world.
Stork - Protoss
Sea - Terran
Anytime - Protoss
Much - Protoss
Flash - Terran
Luxury - Zerg (Aka ZergTwin #1)
Kal - Protoss
Bisu - Protoss
Hwasin - Terran
Mind - Terran
815 - Zerg
Rock - Protoss
Gorush - Zerg
Best - Protoss
Forgg - Zerg
Yellow[Arnc] - Zerg (aka. Fake Yellow aka. Zergtwin #2)
FirebatHero - Terran (aka FirebatQueero)
Light - Terran
Savior - Zerg
Iris - Terran
Rumble - Zerg
GGPlay - Zerg
Hyun - Zerg
Firefist - Zerg
July - Zerg (Aka Fatzerg)
Darkelf - Terran
Xellos - Terran (Aka DDR Terran)
Kwanro - Zerg
Midas - Terran
A few players are on this list just for astounding records over a very short period of time against mostly mediocre players. (Hyun, 815) Bisu definitely belongs a bit higher, though I think he may be at the beginning of the end of his reign of dominance, and I'm not sure Rock belongs so high on the list either.
The list consists of 12 Zergs, 11 Terrans, and 7 Protosses - which goes to show that Starcraft is still fairly balanced at the super-high levels of play. However, if you expand to the top 100, you get a whole lot more more Terrans than anything else.
From what I've seen, there are two sorts of players in the Korean professional circuit. The Machines and the Innovators.
The Machines are those who take existing strategy and drill it into themselves to try and win by playing flawlessly against their opponents - Jaedong is basically one of these players - he took the basic ZvT framework laid by Savior, and then took it to its limits by playing flawlessly in clutch games, though his ZvP is still kind of rocky, which is only offset by Stork's mediocre PvZ and Bisu's tendancy to get eliminated in tournaments before playing Jaedong.
Then there are the Innovators, who take concepts for strategies and realize them. A current example is Bisu, who basically created his own trademark style of dominating PvZ play with the 'Bisu Build' - Forge-first Fast Expand into Corsairs, then Dark Templars, and finally winning through the economic advantage created by the harass. However, I'm sure that within the next few months, some young Korean Protoss Machine who can do the Bisu Build better than Bisu will upstage him.
The best thing in this game is too hide massive numbers of zerglings near the enemy base, (and I mean 100+) and then pretend attack with a small force of hydras. The enemy thinks you are an idiot, and counter attacks. You undig the lings and have an awesome time as your friend nearly dies of laughter over vent.
Posts
Who cares I'll just play it when it shows up. Till then starcraft is still too awesome (which sucks cause I'm not reinstalling till the weeks break I get in February
Starcraft is a total fluke though. The strategies used today are nothing like what the designers had in mind. I have no idea how this game is balanced. Fortunately starcraft 2 has the original to look at. Worst comes to worse, we get awesome UMS maps and a good campaign. Then we load SC back up.
also- "haha you have zealots? firebats! go!" (if you got the battlechest and read the strat guides you'll get it)
Handmade Jewelry by me on EtsyGames for sale
Me on Twitch!
Uhhhh
no.
So Terran is the best race?
This A > B > C > A stuff changes constantly with new styles of play and map. On a good map, all races should be winning approximately equally.
With the new bisu build, I'd say protoss has become a looot more difficult to deal with for zergs. Old ZvP strategy used to favour zerg. With this new defiler heavy, fast hive tech strategy ZvT has also changed. ZvT is still one of the most micro intensive and fun matchups.
Man I want to play.
I've always enjoyed ZvT and ZvP, but TvP I've never figured out. Last I checked it was common for Terran to go machines, I just don't like Terran machines. Probably why I've always stuck to team games.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
The problem with infantry in TvP is that they get owned by psi storm and reavers so hard. You really don't like siege tanks? They're like the best part of being Terran. To each his own I suppose.
Lemming: I don't know why I enjoy that picture so much, but it's great.
TvP is all about covering your flanks with mines and proper tank pushes.
But a good tank push gets me all kinds of wet.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
Yeah, they're pretty trash as an attack force, but they make great pecker units. My BCs are just 500 HP casters. But I always prefer nukes when I get the chance.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
ZvP was and still is an uphill battle for toss despite the bisu build, leastways IMHO
Assuming you mean in terms of strength and not who you like more, I don't know what makes you think this. The large majority of the SC community considers the three races very well balanced, with maps being by far the biggest balance factor.
That, and only 2/9 of the non-korean progamers (can't find an English list atm for the koreans) who pick a race are terrans and the best of those is at third.
Yeah I wanna know why you think terran's the best chopa.
Btw do you play with us under a different name?
They can lock down, irradiate, spider mines, nuke, comsat, heal, repair, and can move their buildings
Maybe I'm just behind the times a lot and stuck back in the days when korean starcraft was TvT all the dam time
and yes the strategies have evolved a lot, but I feel the only real disadvantage to playing terran is that everyone has and theoretically can play against terran
no I actually haven't played with you guys at all, everytime I'm on no one else is and trackpads do not aid micro at all
For me, Terran suffer from having individually weak units without the benefit of them being cheap and easy to mass produce, like Zerg. If you fuck up with Terran it's much harder to react. Protoss has the benefit of very tough staple units like the Zealot and Dragoon, and the catch-all direct damage spell, Psi Storm, which can fix almost any problem you're having. Just for me, the problem with Terran is that most of their stuff is just too specific.
Anyone want to beta read a paranormal mystery novella? Here's your chance.
stream
I used to fear tanks more a few years ago (okay like 5). Every time that first push rolled out with 1 tank and marine/medic I got screwed. Now it just seems part of the game. Whatever you do, tanks are gonna bring fire down but my lurkers are still gonna rip aport those marines. I'm a lot better than I used to be though.
Siege tanks have their blind spots and are immobile. Always hit terran in transition or flank. I have a pretty nice replay of beating a Lzuruha member (top east clan) with inferior forces just because I took advantage of terrain. The only highly mobile units terran has are vultures. Air units as well, but their role is in most games a lot smaller than ground units.
I don't understand your comment on terran's only disadvantage.
The main problem with Terran is that they require so much micro. Think of how good Boxer was, and why no one was really able to achieve the same level of success as terran then. The best players right now seem to be mostly Protoss (with Savior's fall,
The other races have units you can just throw at an opponent. With the current maps in rotation, most of them favor at least a quick natural right outside their main, if not two, leading to more macro early on imo.
They can broodling, dark swarm, lurker, plague, parasite, ensnare, and their buildings can regen
Protoss STILL have the single best default strategy in the game (storm storm lol)
They can stasis, psi storm, maelstrom, mind control, feedback, hallucinate, recall, dweb, and their buildings are glowy
I'll take that over floating buildings any day.
Also, in regards to Smasher in another thread, I totally thought team melee had max cap of 200 for each race. It was pretty cool to see 600 stat cap for my toss when I tried it.
I'd be interested in seeing this game.
Also, I've come up with an idea for PvT. I don't know how well it would work, but I'm eager to try it out.
Nony has already done it sorry.
Also, I haven't seen anyone on in a few days, so what are the chances of getting something going tonight? I'm not on yet, but perhaps soon...
The poor guy hasn't seen arbitersssss.avi
NEOOOWWWW
If a ling rush fails you typically cannot keep massing lings, while you can keep pushing with tanks.
I've never seen a pro protoss default to psi storm to win a match, to help beat M&Ms or Dark Swarm yes, but defaulting to it no.
I think this is part of my problem, though I am trying to catch up with the times.
Like I said skill helps a lot. What I meant by their disadvantage is that terran playstyle hasn't changed all that much, its still very much either M&M or tank push and people have at this point gotten experience playing against these builds.
You cannot throw toss at an opponent, and Jaedong (zerg) is just about the top of the heap as far as players go these days.
No offence chopa but it's just nice to see if someone actually has skills or is theory crafting. Granted even if you haven't played in awhile if you were a good player in the past you should be able to be on par or better than most PA players right now.
13 protoss, 11 zerg, 5 terran
http://sc.gosugamers.net/features/2349
Stork - Protoss
Sea - Terran
Anytime - Protoss
Much - Protoss
Flash - Terran
Luxury - Zerg (Aka ZergTwin #1)
Kal - Protoss
Bisu - Protoss
Hwasin - Terran
Mind - Terran
815 - Zerg
Rock - Protoss
Gorush - Zerg
Best - Protoss
Forgg - Zerg
Yellow[Arnc] - Zerg (aka. Fake Yellow aka. Zergtwin #2)
FirebatHero - Terran (aka FirebatQueero)
Light - Terran
Savior - Zerg
Iris - Terran
Rumble - Zerg
GGPlay - Zerg
Hyun - Zerg
Firefist - Zerg
July - Zerg (Aka Fatzerg)
Darkelf - Terran
Xellos - Terran (Aka DDR Terran)
Kwanro - Zerg
Midas - Terran
A few players are on this list just for astounding records over a very short period of time against mostly mediocre players. (Hyun, 815) Bisu definitely belongs a bit higher, though I think he may be at the beginning of the end of his reign of dominance, and I'm not sure Rock belongs so high on the list either.
The list consists of 12 Zergs, 11 Terrans, and 7 Protosses - which goes to show that Starcraft is still fairly balanced at the super-high levels of play. However, if you expand to the top 100, you get a whole lot more more Terrans than anything else.
From what I've seen, there are two sorts of players in the Korean professional circuit. The Machines and the Innovators.
The Machines are those who take existing strategy and drill it into themselves to try and win by playing flawlessly against their opponents - Jaedong is basically one of these players - he took the basic ZvT framework laid by Savior, and then took it to its limits by playing flawlessly in clutch games, though his ZvP is still kind of rocky, which is only offset by Stork's mediocre PvZ and Bisu's tendancy to get eliminated in tournaments before playing Jaedong.
Then there are the Innovators, who take concepts for strategies and realize them. A current example is Bisu, who basically created his own trademark style of dominating PvZ play with the 'Bisu Build' - Forge-first Fast Expand into Corsairs, then Dark Templars, and finally winning through the economic advantage created by the harass. However, I'm sure that within the next few months, some young Korean Protoss Machine who can do the Bisu Build better than Bisu will upstage him.
/story