Demoman is probably the strongest class right now. I think they need some sort of nerf to their direct combat capability, namely their primary grenades detonating on impact. It's too easy to hit people with that when they get close, which should be the Demo's weakness. Maybe there should be a 1 second period after firing where they don't detonate on impact yet or something.
Indeed. They could still defend themselfs with stickys but would have to rely more on teamwork to keep them safe.
Demoman is probably the strongest class right now. I think they need some sort of nerf to their direct combat capability, namely their primary grenades detonating on impact. It's too easy to hit people with that when they get close, which should be the Demo's weakness. Maybe there should be a 1 second period after firing where they don't detonate on impact yet or something.
Indeed. They could still defend themselfs with stickys but would have to rely more on teamwork to keep them safe.
No more 7 demomen teams.
That would work better if you could control the velocity of the pipes at all. I spent 5 minutes trying to figure out how "holding down the fire button makes your bombs go farther" like the Tip told me before realizing it only worked with stickies.
I know I'm not that good with the demo man, I've been out of FPS for too long now. However I do get quite a few direct hits in with the grenades, yet I never seem to get kills. Yet at the same time I seem to always get destroyed by other demo men. I guess I just need to play better, it just gets a bit frustrating at times.
There were some fun matches last night though, the medic is so far my favorite class.
On a side note, am I the only one who likes 2fort? It seems that whenever it comes up in rotation no one wants to play it. I personally hope they make for ctf maps.
On a side note, am I the only one who likes 2fort? It seems that whenever it comes up in rotation no one wants to play it. I personally hope they make for ctf maps.
I actually really enjoy 2fort, but that might be because I know the layout fairly well now. I dislike doing Sudden Death on it though.
I'm not sure what to make of 2fort, personally. It seems far too easy for the game to degenerate into a turtling match between the defences in each team's respective flag room- in which case it seems the offensive forces are destined to ineffectually smash against them for all time.
Or, if you're me, find yourself embroiled in a sniping match with the men on the opposing battlements...
I'm not sure what to make of 2fort, personally. It seems far too easy for the game to degenerate into a turtling match between the defences in each team's respective flag room- in which case it seems the offensive forces are destined to ineffectually smash against them for all time.
I find this is where team communication really shines. The other team has at most 1 player more than you and if the team stays updated as to the defense levels of the other side, you can adjust your offense as needed. There's been many times where I've played 2fort where the other team is holed up so heavily that I can defend our flag solo, freeing up the entire rest of the team for offense, which virtually always results in a cap.
I find this is where team communication really shines. The other team has at most 1 player more than you and if the team stays updated as to the defense levels of the other side, you can adjust your offense as needed. There's been many times where I've played 2fort where the other team is holed up so heavily that I can defend our flag solo, freeing up the entire rest of the team for offense, which virtually always results in a cap.
I've found myself disliking 2fort. There have been enough changes to the dynamics of Team Fortress that now the capture point maps are much more fun.
After playing a few rounds last night and trying some different strategies, I'd like to pose a question to everyone here: what's your personal play style like, regardless of class? Are you more conservative, trying to get your KD ratio up and staying alive, or do you charge in and go kamikaze?
I was taking a look at my KD ratio stats last night and they were pretty low, and I realized that it's because I tend to focus not on getting points/frags but helping the team as effectively as possible - making key stabs with a spy or lighting everyone on fire while playing defense, even if it doesn't score any kills. I switched it up last night and played for a while trying to get the best KD ratio I could, staying alive for a few pretty long stretches. This is much easier than it was in TFC because of the enhanced Medics and more effective dispensers, and I've noticed that it's a lot more satisfying to stay alive longer in TF2 because of the respawn times. I feel like I'm doing more good retreating for a moment, trying to get healed up and playing a little more conservatively rather than waiting 20 seconds or so to respawn.
So what do you think? How is TF2 more fun for you? How are you a more effective player?
Thinking about it, I think I like 2fort more because it is CTF than for its qualities as a map. I'm very much a defensive player and try to make the best use of medic/dispensers/packs to keep going. It annoys me to no end when offensive types dont bother to duck back around the corner and hit the dispenser I schleped to the front lines. I'm not very good at the twitch, but I like to think I'm fairly decent at support, and that greatly effects my playstyle and preferences. I much prefer maps like 2fort and hydro where starts and objectives are fixed as opposed to ones like granary where not only is the objective frequently moving, but also the start locations as well (therefore frequently making all of the engineers buildings obsolete). CTF is also more fun to me because I like the way it forces you to split your troops intelligently (hopefully) as opposed to having the entirety of both teams circling a central objective in a mighty gorefest. :P
Play engineer, set up dispenser->gun->entrance->exit
Then become a spy-> disguise as enemy scout-> run backwards (tricks more people than you can ever imagine, i get many backstabs.
You realize your engineer stuff blows up when you change classes, right?
I played on one of the PA servers last night. I went engineer on Well to prep for the TF2 tourney and I had a hell of a time keeping up with the back and forth of my team. I was constantly moving my teleporter and sentry gun. I ended up with one of my worst engineer scores.
You realize your engineer stuff blows up when you change classes, right?
I played on one of the PA servers last night. I went engineer on Well to prep for the TF2 tourney and I had a hell of a time keeping up with the back and forth of my team. I was constantly moving my teleporter and sentry gun. I ended up with one of my worst engineer scores.
I've been doing really poorly every time I play as engineer recently, and that's exactly why. I get a bunch of stuff built and then the tide turns, and all my stuff ends up destroyed because it's across the front line or it's too far into our own territory to do any good.
Come to think of it, I started doing really poorly in any class once the map switched to Well. I have a hell of a time in Granary too. I think I'm still to slow to adapt to the changing situations in the "tug of war" five-cap-point maps. I also think that a lot of newer players haven't yet realized the extreme importance of capping that center point right at the beginning - Valve's devs weren't lying when they said the game rewards momentum and forward progress in an effort to avoid long, drawn out matches. Whenever I play on Granary with a group of good players, it seems like 90% of the time the round ends in under four minutes or so just because one team takes the other by storm.
I would have to describe my playstyle as causing enough collateral damage in a suicide esque run that my 25 second respawn timer makes my loss worth it.
I refuse to play defensively, but progressively, taking any opportunity present at any time. I dont "kamikaze" unless its going to completely decimate the other team for the next 25 seconds.(read I can kill 3-4 members, or a 1/4th of the team on up and get a bunch of buildings down). I will accept the sacrifice of taking out a heavy/medic combo or either if it means the sudden push for an enemy will be decimated and the remainder punished by the rest of my team....
Im not much of a team player, but a point player, but I would at least like to think that where I lack cooperation with my team, I make up with pure carnage and damage done to the enemy team.
Is it obvious yet that I love the spy? I wish the knife did a bit more damage normally, and that everyone wouldnt blow the shit out of their teamates all the time.
I am pretty much Heavy > Spy > Pyro > Eng. I am pretty much kamikaze. Sure, KD ratios are fun to keep track of, but going 40-6 isn't going to help your team cap a point if your content on staying alive. I love being the Heavy because of the power and the insane health. It is great when you got a Medic on your with a uber. I feel like I am delivering the wrath of God in chaingun form.
I was unable to manage my server while away due to a combination of talking to clients, schmoozing with clients, drinking with clients, and being individually drunk.
It is now up again. tf2.finalmeasure.com
Sorry for the delay. On the plus side it is now on Linux and should be faster and/or more stable than before.
jonxp on
Every time you write parallel fifths, Bach kills a kitten.
3DS Friend Code: 2707-1614-5576 PAX Prime 2014 Buttoneering!
I play sniper more than anything else, even though they tend to be a precision class and lack "turn the game around and win the adoration of your team mates" moments.
Capping medics moments before they Ubercharge a heavy or taking out an engineer before he can remove a sapper makes it all worthwhile, though!
Best instance was on granary, where I realised there were two identical demomen jumping around on the freight crates. As one stood on the edge to lob pipe bombs towards the advancing Reds, the other stood directly behind him, suddenly shifted into a spy, and just as they raised their knife... blam. Fully charged headshot smacks 'im against the nearest wall, and the demoman I saved jumped down to the floor, never realising he owed me his life. Lousy Brit wanker!
I had some guy run through a crowd of prime targets to kill me moments before I reached or unleashed an uber like five times in a row. He really took that "kill the medic" advice to heart.
Best instance was on granary, where I realised there were two identical demomen jumping around on the freight crates. As one stood on the edge to lob pipe bombs towards the advancing Reds, the other stood directly behind him, suddenly shifted into a spy, and just as they raised their knife... blam. Fully charged headshot smacks 'im against the nearest wall, and the demoman I saved jumped down to the floor, never realising he owed me his life. Lousy Brit wanker!
I'm an aggressive offensive person. This comes over from how I play AvP2 as an alien (Alpha Evac btw for those that still play). I've gotten used to playing without a medic with me (and for some reason whenever I have a medic I always get ubercharged in the middle of reloading, which blows), but I always want to keep the pressure on. The way I see it, if the other team doesn't have a constant threat then that just lets them build up defenses or setup a new strategy that will make it harder later on for my team. In most cases I go straight for the cap points as well since every second on it gets us that much closer to securing it and most teams tend to quickly forget whatever strategy they had going once they see their point being captured. I might die within less than 1 second on the CP from a sentry, but then I also know where the sentry is and can tell my team.
Demoman is probably the strongest class right now. I think they need some sort of nerf to their direct combat capability, namely their primary grenades detonating on impact. It's too easy to hit people with that when they get close, which should be the Demo's weakness. Maybe there should be a 1 second period after firing where they don't detonate on impact yet or something.
I'm not sure what you're getting at here. Direct combat is different from close combat.
Close combat sucks. I have a terrible time hitting anything close.
Primary grenades do basically no splash damage, so the only viable way of using them is to hit something directly.
And, even if they did do splash damage, it would be ridiculously difficult to kill anything with them. I have a hard enough time hitting people directly, but if they don't detonate then, and bounce off, grenades would be going everywhere but next to the enemies.
I'm an aggressive offensive person. I've gotten used to playing without a medic with me (and for some reason whenever I have a medic I always get ubercharged in the middle of reloading, which blows), but I always want to keep the pressure on. The way I see it, if the other team doesn't have a constant threat then that just lets them build up defenses or setup a new strategy that will make it harder later on for my team. In most cases I go straight for the cap points as well since every second on it gets us that much closer to securing it and most teams tend to quickly forget whatever strategy they had going once they see their point being captured. I might die within less than 1 second on the CP from a sentry, but then I also know where the sentry is and can tell my team.
Limed because that's generally my strategy, too.
Also: As a heavy, I certainly appreciate having a medic healing me, but I'm not the only person who needs healing. If I'm at full and we're not on the front lines and someone else is in the red, take a moment to heal them. And if I'm running around with my shotgun and someone more useful is nearby, ubercharge them instead of me.
I'm an aggressive offensive person. I've gotten used to playing without a medic with me (and for some reason whenever I have a medic I always get ubercharged in the middle of reloading, which blows), but I always want to keep the pressure on. The way I see it, if the other team doesn't have a constant threat then that just lets them build up defenses or setup a new strategy that will make it harder later on for my team. In most cases I go straight for the cap points as well since every second on it gets us that much closer to securing it and most teams tend to quickly forget whatever strategy they had going once they see their point being captured. I might die within less than 1 second on the CP from a sentry, but then I also know where the sentry is and can tell my team.
Limed because that's generally my strategy, too.
Also: As a heavy, I certainly appreciate having a medic healing me, but I'm not the only person who needs healing. If I'm at full and we're not on the front lines and someone else is in the red, take a moment to heal them. And if I'm running around with my shotgun and someone more useful is nearby, ubercharge them instead of me.
The problem I have is that the heavy can't really dodge or move around, especially if he's actively firing the chaingun. This means that I get hit much more than other classes who can fire while moving.
How I play depends a lot on my mood. I usually die a lot, but I always take 1-3 people with me. If I play Heavy (pretty much anytime a team doesn't have more then one) every once in awhile I take out 5-8 people and a bunch of buildings. Those are the lives that make dieing in a horrible way worth it.
Also if a Medic is kind enough to ubercharge me I take that as a sign they are ready to go balls deep into enemy territory and probably die. I don't play around when ubercharged I head straight for the CP and clear it out and stand on it shooting everyone until the charge runs out so we can cap or go past the CP and kill anyone coming to reinforce hopefully buying my team enough time to cap behind me.
I almost never get ubercharged and live after it runs out becuase I'm surrounded, but I always get my licks in. Unless the medic is a retard and charges me way in friendly territory and yells, "hurry up." I'm a goddamn Heavy, I can do a lot of things, but "hurry" isn't one of them.
I really love playing on the PA servers (steam id is nolifeking)because you guys are so much better than most. I usually do pretty well for myself on a PA server, sometimes in the top 3, sometimes not, but I just played on a pub server where to enemy was so bad that I got 50 (fifty) points in one life. As a demoman (read: Godking vs noob engineers) with 2 intel captures. 30 kills. I had a medic on me most of the time (its was like 8v8) but the sheer destruction we caused was amazing. I don't think they ever got to kill my medic either.
Also, could I get an invite to the PA group? I posted in the last thread but I think it was missed.
It drives me nuts when Medics use the ubercharge itself as a sign for the Heavy to move out. That's hugely wasteful, it'll be half gone by the time it's really needed. Use your words to communicate with your partner, tell them you have uber and to move out. Then activate the uber as late as possible, the closer to death the better. Every second counts.
It drives me nuts when Medics use the ubercharge itself as a sign for the Heavy to move out. That's hugely wasteful, it'll be half gone by the time it's really needed. Use your words to communicate with your partner, tell them you have uber and to move out. Then activate the uber as late as possible, the closer to death the better. Every second counts.
THANK YOU, someone who understands. Same thing goes for you Heavies - you've gotta trust your Medic. No, I'm not going to invuln you when you have 450 health and are standing in perfect safety. Get your ass out there and start blasting and I'll invuln you before we both die. And for god's sake, unless you've pretty much dropped a nuke on the whole battlefield, once there's only 2 or 3 seconds left of invuln, get to safety, or at least to a place where your medic can hide around a corner while he heals you. I think it's stupid that most of my invulns end in death immediately after because the Heavy I was charging wandered into the middle of the pool and we both got put in front of a firing squad once it wore off.
I can't wait to get my microphone, it will make all of this much easier.
It drives me nuts when Medics use the ubercharge itself as a sign for the Heavy to move out. That's hugely wasteful, it'll be half gone by the time it's really needed. Use your words to communicate with your partner, tell them you have uber and to move out. Then activate the uber as late as possible, the closer to death the better. Every second counts.
let's see you try to tell the heavy to move out when you're actively healing with your right hand, and dodging around in order to not die with your left.
sometimes the only course of action is to use the ubercharge/wait until a mass of guys comes and then use it, signaling a push.
now, if i had my mic setup, that's a diff. story.
Xenocide Geek on
i wanted love, i needed love
most of all, most of all
someone said true love was dead
but i'm bound to fall
bound to fall for you
oh what can i do
I have come to a bone chilling conclusion: I don't like the Demo man.
Why? Because playing anything but him makes me feel really gimped so I hardly get to enjoy the other classes. To me the other classes seem like toys and when things get rough I always bust out the demo.
I still don't really like waiting to uber. A rocket to the medic or a sniper anywhere can put an end to the built up charge. I think I hate that far more than losing a few seconds by not gambling. Just sayin'!
Do you still heal the guy when you uber(assuming he was hurt)? If you do not there's almost no reason to wait--you'll still have all that health afterwards. Note: I generally don't play medic unless I think we need one.
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Indeed. They could still defend themselfs with stickys but would have to rely more on teamwork to keep them safe.
No more 7 demomen teams.
I'd rather not have that problem.
That would work better if you could control the velocity of the pipes at all. I spent 5 minutes trying to figure out how "holding down the fire button makes your bombs go farther" like the Tip told me before realizing it only worked with stickies.
There were some fun matches last night though, the medic is so far my favorite class.
On a side note, am I the only one who likes 2fort? It seems that whenever it comes up in rotation no one wants to play it. I personally hope they make for ctf maps.
I actually really enjoy 2fort, but that might be because I know the layout fairly well now. I dislike doing Sudden Death on it though.
Or, if you're me, find yourself embroiled in a sniping match with the men on the opposing battlements...
I find this is where team communication really shines. The other team has at most 1 player more than you and if the team stays updated as to the defense levels of the other side, you can adjust your offense as needed. There's been many times where I've played 2fort where the other team is holed up so heavily that I can defend our flag solo, freeing up the entire rest of the team for offense, which virtually always results in a cap.
After playing a few rounds last night and trying some different strategies, I'd like to pose a question to everyone here: what's your personal play style like, regardless of class? Are you more conservative, trying to get your KD ratio up and staying alive, or do you charge in and go kamikaze?
I was taking a look at my KD ratio stats last night and they were pretty low, and I realized that it's because I tend to focus not on getting points/frags but helping the team as effectively as possible - making key stabs with a spy or lighting everyone on fire while playing defense, even if it doesn't score any kills. I switched it up last night and played for a while trying to get the best KD ratio I could, staying alive for a few pretty long stretches. This is much easier than it was in TFC because of the enhanced Medics and more effective dispensers, and I've noticed that it's a lot more satisfying to stay alive longer in TF2 because of the respawn times. I feel like I'm doing more good retreating for a moment, trying to get healed up and playing a little more conservatively rather than waiting 20 seconds or so to respawn.
So what do you think? How is TF2 more fun for you? How are you a more effective player?
Play engineer, set up dispenser->gun->entrance->exit
Then become a spy-> disguise as enemy scout-> run backwards (tricks more people than you can ever imagine, i get many backstabs.
Problem is my stats don't reflect how much ive played, cause i never play long enough to finish a 30 minute round.
QUICK FIX FOR SOUND STUTTER CRASH/HANGING TF2:
(Dxlevel 8.1) + turn off AA and AF
You realize your engineer stuff blows up when you change classes, right?
I played on one of the PA servers last night. I went engineer on Well to prep for the TF2 tourney and I had a hell of a time keeping up with the back and forth of my team. I was constantly moving my teleporter and sentry gun. I ended up with one of my worst engineer scores.
Come to think of it, I started doing really poorly in any class once the map switched to Well. I have a hell of a time in Granary too. I think I'm still to slow to adapt to the changing situations in the "tug of war" five-cap-point maps. I also think that a lot of newer players haven't yet realized the extreme importance of capping that center point right at the beginning - Valve's devs weren't lying when they said the game rewards momentum and forward progress in an effort to avoid long, drawn out matches. Whenever I play on Granary with a group of good players, it seems like 90% of the time the round ends in under four minutes or so just because one team takes the other by storm.
I refuse to play defensively, but progressively, taking any opportunity present at any time. I dont "kamikaze" unless its going to completely decimate the other team for the next 25 seconds.(read I can kill 3-4 members, or a 1/4th of the team on up and get a bunch of buildings down). I will accept the sacrifice of taking out a heavy/medic combo or either if it means the sudden push for an enemy will be decimated and the remainder punished by the rest of my team....
Im not much of a team player, but a point player, but I would at least like to think that where I lack cooperation with my team, I make up with pure carnage and damage done to the enemy team.
Is it obvious yet that I love the spy? I wish the knife did a bit more damage normally, and that everyone wouldnt blow the shit out of their teamates all the time.
Of course, whenever I do this we instantly push the enemies to their second to last CP, where they've done the same.
If I don't build it, they push instead.
I was unable to manage my server while away due to a combination of talking to clients, schmoozing with clients, drinking with clients, and being individually drunk.
It is now up again. tf2.finalmeasure.com
Sorry for the delay. On the plus side it is now on Linux and should be faster and/or more stable than before.
3DS Friend Code: 2707-1614-5576
PAX Prime 2014 Buttoneering!
Capping medics moments before they Ubercharge a heavy or taking out an engineer before he can remove a sapper makes it all worthwhile, though!
Best instance was on granary, where I realised there were two identical demomen jumping around on the freight crates. As one stood on the edge to lob pipe bombs towards the advancing Reds, the other stood directly behind him, suddenly shifted into a spy, and just as they raised their knife... blam. Fully charged headshot smacks 'im against the nearest wall, and the demoman I saved jumped down to the floor, never realising he owed me his life. Lousy Brit wanker!
Beautiful.
I'm not sure what you're getting at here. Direct combat is different from close combat.
Close combat sucks. I have a terrible time hitting anything close.
Primary grenades do basically no splash damage, so the only viable way of using them is to hit something directly.
And, even if they did do splash damage, it would be ridiculously difficult to kill anything with them. I have a hard enough time hitting people directly, but if they don't detonate then, and bounce off, grenades would be going everywhere but next to the enemies.
Limed because that's generally my strategy, too.
Also: As a heavy, I certainly appreciate having a medic healing me, but I'm not the only person who needs healing. If I'm at full and we're not on the front lines and someone else is in the red, take a moment to heal them. And if I'm running around with my shotgun and someone more useful is nearby, ubercharge them instead of me.
edit - In Response to Arsenic
Also if a Medic is kind enough to ubercharge me I take that as a sign they are ready to go balls deep into enemy territory and probably die. I don't play around when ubercharged I head straight for the CP and clear it out and stand on it shooting everyone until the charge runs out so we can cap or go past the CP and kill anyone coming to reinforce hopefully buying my team enough time to cap behind me.
I almost never get ubercharged and live after it runs out becuase I'm surrounded, but I always get my licks in. Unless the medic is a retard and charges me way in friendly territory and yells, "hurry up." I'm a goddamn Heavy, I can do a lot of things, but "hurry" isn't one of them.
Also, could I get an invite to the PA group? I posted in the last thread but I think it was missed.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/nolifeking42
Grr. That's annoying. Thanks for taking the time to answer!
I can't wait to get my microphone, it will make all of this much easier.
let's see you try to tell the heavy to move out when you're actively healing with your right hand, and dodging around in order to not die with your left.
sometimes the only course of action is to use the ubercharge/wait until a mass of guys comes and then use it, signaling a push.
now, if i had my mic setup, that's a diff. story.
most of all, most of all
someone said true love was dead
but i'm bound to fall
bound to fall for you
oh what can i do
If it's 100% and we're outside a heavily fortified area, ffs move in and start firing!
Also X -> 8 = 'I am fully charged!'
Why? Because playing anything but him makes me feel really gimped so I hardly get to enjoy the other classes. To me the other classes seem like toys and when things get rough I always bust out the demo.
Do you still heal the guy when you uber(assuming he was hurt)? If you do not there's almost no reason to wait--you'll still have all that health afterwards. Note: I generally don't play medic unless I think we need one.