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"If you really loved me, you'd stay with me even without the sex"

DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
edited October 2007 in Debate and/or Discourse
This is a line that one of my friends recently said to her boyfriend.

They've been together for about a year, give or take a month, and in the last few months he's been bitching to me about the almost total lack of sex...he said it was happening less than once a month. I suspect he may have been exaggerating a bit, but probably not much.

I asked my friend about it...because I'm tactless and blunt like that, and she said that she just didn't think sex was very important, and that if he really loved her, he'd stay with her even without sex.

I think she's dreaming, personally. In my opinion, relationships have to have both the physical and the emotional side to them, or they're just halves of a relationship. Quite apart from the fact that its common knowledge that sex is one of the few driving goals a man has, and its silly to think that he can repress it healthily.

What do you guys think? And also aside from this specific situation, what do you think about the idea in general? There's a phrase I heard recently..."A man may have many problems with his wife, but if he's getting plenty of sex, they don't matter."

Dhalphir on
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Posts

  • ShintoShinto __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Seems like a sign something else is wrong. Or something about the sex is wrong.

    Shinto on
  • slowrollslowroll __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    She's either being naive or manipulative.

    Edit: Or it's the outgrowth of another issue, like lack of trust, someone else, etc.

    Personally, I'd either solve the underlying problem or move on.

    slowroll on
  • redxredx I(x)=2(x)+1 whole numbersRegistered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Quite apart from the fact that its common knowledge that sex is one of the few driving goals a man has, and its silly to think that he can repress it healthily.
    irony?

    redx on
    They moistly come out at night, moistly.
  • ShintoShinto __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Hey now, we don't know her reasons. Maybe she was raped once, physical intimacy is very difficult for her and she's looking for the emotional assurance that the guys friend just isn't some shmuck who wants to dick her.

    Shinto on
  • slowrollslowroll __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Shinto wrote: »
    Hey now, we don't know her reasons. Maybe she was raped once, physical intimacy is very difficult for her and she's looking for the emotional assurance that the guys friend just isn't some shmuck who wants to dick her.

    Well, there is some ambiguity here. I interpreted what he said as meaning the sex tailored off and she's complacent w/ having it infrequently, not that it was always infrequent.

    slowroll on
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited September 2007
    People also have naturally different sex drives - it needn't be the case that he's a rutting horndog or she's messed-up and frigid. But yeah, I agree that it's a genuine problem that either needs to be worked on by the couple, or they should find people more compatible. I've never understood the prevailing notion that sex issues between couples are somehow shallow, minor, or less worthy of attention than emotional issues.

    Jacobkosh on
    rRwz9.gif
  • NarketNarket __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    It just depends on how the strong the relationship is(in my opinion). My girlfriend decided that she didn't want to have sex anymore until we were married. At this time, we'd been together a year and a half, and sexualy intimate for more than a year. She was serious about it and i love her very deeply. So, i went along with it and would've still been okay with it, but as it turns out she didn't last more than a couple of days.

    Narket on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ShintoShinto __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Narket wrote: »
    It just depends on how the strong the relationship is(in my opinion). My girlfriend decided that she didn't want to have sex anymore until we were married. At this time, we'd been together a year and a half, and sexualy intimate for more than a year. She was serious about it and i love her very deeply. So, i went along with it and would've still been okay with it, but as it turns out she didn't last more than a couple of days.

    Ah, the forbidden fruit effect.

    Shinto on
  • CorlisCorlis Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Shinto wrote: »
    Hey now, we don't know her reasons. Maybe she was raped once, physical intimacy is very difficult for her and she's looking for the emotional assurance that the guys friend just isn't some shmuck who wants to dick her.
    Sounds like he's only been complaining for a few months though, which might imply that the sex has been more frequent in the past.

    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.

    ETA: Of course if there's some physical or mental/emotional thing here, it's a whole 'nother ball of wax

    Corlis on
    But I don't mind, as long as there's a bed beneath the stars that shine,
    I'll be fine, just give me a minute, a man's got a limit, I can't get a life if my heart's not in it.
  • DjiemDjiem Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    If you're forgetting the present example and just saying "If you really loved me, you'd stay with me even without the sex" as some rule for relationships, I'd have to disagree. Sex is an integral part of a relationship, as it becomes part of your commitment to your loved one.

    If a girl told me that "even without the sex" thing, I'd reply "If you really loved me, you'd stay with me even with me having sex with other girls".

    Djiem on
  • ZalbinionZalbinion Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    What do you guys think? And also aside from this specific situation, what do you think about the idea in general? There's a phrase I heard recently..."A man may have many problems with his wife, but if he's getting plenty of sex, they don't matter."

    I think this phrase is pretty callous towards men. Sure, for plenty of guys it's true, but for those to whom the phrase applies, solving the sex issue solves other issues. What about the guys for whom it's not true though, the guys who are just fine with their sex lives but are genuinely unable to reconcile other problems in their relationships? They're ignored despite the fact that by definition they're the guys who need help.

    Zalbinion on
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Yeah, I agree, it is pretty callous towards men, but it is largely true.

    Sure, a good sex life isn't going to solve major problems, such as abuse and the like, but for all the niggling things that are a part of any relationship, like bad habits and the like, if the man is getting plenty of sex he isn't going to give two shits about them.

    Dhalphir on
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    How old are they both?

    Johannen on
  • Mom2KatMom2Kat Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Well this is kinda interesting to me since my HUsband and I are in this situation.

    When we got together as teenagers we had normal all the time sex. After a few years and a daughter my libido dropped to nearly nothing, even him pawing at me annoys me. He however would love to have sex at least every day. I don't even notice if month has gone by. We get along and actually only recently got married, we have been together for 9 years. So yeah it is a challenge for him and I want to want more sex for him but I don't I try but I just don't care. But after all that Sex is not the most important thing. It is great and wonderfull, and we are not going the way of seperate beds or anything, (I can't sleep well without him there) But since we love each other we get through it.

    Mom2Kat on
  • AdrienAdrien Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Yeah, I agree, it is pretty callous towards men, but it is largely true.

    Sure, a good sex life isn't going to solve major problems, such as abuse and the like, but for all the niggling things that are a part of any relationship, like bad habits and the like, if the man is getting plenty of sex he isn't going to give two shits about them.

    Is there any actual support for that, or is it just a catchy axiom?

    Seems like it doesn't matter how great the sex is, if you can't stand to spend the rest of your time with the person you spend all of your time with, it's going to be Bad for the Relationship.

    Adrien on
    tmkm.jpg
  • sdrawkcaB emaNsdrawkcaB emaN regular
    edited September 2007
    Corlis wrote: »
    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.

    The people who say "if you really loved me" (male or female, in any context) never seem to realize that it's a two-way street, do they?

    sdrawkcaB emaN on
  • Mom2KatMom2Kat Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Adrien wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Yeah, I agree, it is pretty callous towards men, but it is largely true.

    Sure, a good sex life isn't going to solve major problems, such as abuse and the like, but for all the niggling things that are a part of any relationship, like bad habits and the like, if the man is getting plenty of sex he isn't going to give two shits about them.

    Is there any actual support for that, or is it just a catchy axiom?

    Seems like it doesn't matter how great the sex is, if you can't stand to spend the rest of your time with the person you spend all of your time with, it's going to be Bad for the Relationship.


    Exactly, because we love each other and want to spend time together the mis match in libido is more of the little problem than the other way around.

    Mom2Kat on
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Mom2Kat wrote: »
    Well this is kinda interesting to me since my HUsband and I are in this situation.

    When we got together as teenagers we had normal all the time sex. After a few years and a daughter my libido dropped to nearly nothing, even him pawing at me annoys me. He however would love to have sex at least every day. I don't even notice if month has gone by. We get along and actually only recently got married, we have been together for 9 years. So yeah it is a challenge for him and I want to want more sex for him but I don't I try but I just don't care. But after all that Sex is not the most important thing. It is great and wonderfull, and we are not going the way of seperate beds or anything, (I can't sleep well without him there) But since we love each other we get through it.

    I think that could just be a case of spicing up your sex life though, even though it is slightly a cliche.

    Why don't you try to find out what turns you on and then use whatever is neccessary? You said you want to want sex so do what you need to do.

    Johannen on
  • DjiemDjiem Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    I hate how sex is always portrayed as something a woman gives a man. It's a multiplayer game. It's a co-op mission. It's a "everybody wins" scenario. Nobody is giving someone else sex. You are having sex TOGETHER.

    That crap only exists because, GENERALLY, men's libido is higher than women's.

    Djiem on
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    suilimeA wrote: »
    Corlis wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.

    The people who say "if you really loved me" (male or female, in any context) never seem to realize that it's a two-way street, do they?

    Just lie down and take it?

    Johannen on
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Adrien wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Yeah, I agree, it is pretty callous towards men, but it is largely true.

    Sure, a good sex life isn't going to solve major problems, such as abuse and the like, but for all the niggling things that are a part of any relationship, like bad habits and the like, if the man is getting plenty of sex he isn't going to give two shits about them.

    Is there any actual support for that, or is it just a catchy axiom?

    Seems like it doesn't matter how great the sex is, if you can't stand to spend the rest of your time with the person you spend all of your time with, it's going to be Bad for the Relationship.

    I think its true. I know it would apply to me.

    But if the problems are so bad that you can't stand to spend "the rest of your time" with them, then I think that would qualify as a major problem, not a minor annoyance.

    To clarify, when I say "minor annoyance", I mean things like eating too loudly, leaving dishes unwashed, long-ass showers using all the hot water (although for me personally thats a major annoyance), things like that.

    Dhalphir on
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    By the way, i'll ask again, how old are they both?

    Johannen on
  • slowrollslowroll __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Diminishing returns to sex w/ the same person. Couples sex is either great or the most boring, depressing thing ever (in my experience, at least).

    slowroll on
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Johannen wrote: »
    By the way, i'll ask again, how old are they both?

    She is 20, he is 18.

    Dhalphir on
  • AdrienAdrien Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Adrien wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Yeah, I agree, it is pretty callous towards men, but it is largely true.

    Sure, a good sex life isn't going to solve major problems, such as abuse and the like, but for all the niggling things that are a part of any relationship, like bad habits and the like, if the man is getting plenty of sex he isn't going to give two shits about them.

    Is there any actual support for that, or is it just a catchy axiom?

    Seems like it doesn't matter how great the sex is, if you can't stand to spend the rest of your time with the person you spend all of your time with, it's going to be Bad for the Relationship.

    I think its true. I know it would apply to me.

    But if the problems are so bad that you can't stand to spend "the rest of your time" with them, then I think that would qualify as a major problem, not a minor annoyance.

    To clarify, when I say "minor annoyance", I mean things like eating too loudly, leaving dishes unwashed, long-ass showers using all the hot water (although for me personally thats a major annoyance), things like that.

    Well that's sort of the point. If you're compatible, with or without sex, then you're compatible. Sex isn't some magic guy-relationship-bullet.

    Adrien on
    tmkm.jpg
  • Mom2KatMom2Kat Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Johannen wrote: »
    suilimeA wrote: »
    Corlis wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.

    The people who say "if you really loved me" (male or female, in any context) never seem to realize that it's a two-way street, do they?

    Just lie down and take it?


    As horrible as this is going to sound, sometimes you just have to. There are nights when I would rather scour pots and pans by hand, than have sex, (I own a diswasher and only dishwaser safe pots for a reason)but because I love my husband i will offer a blow job or something. I usually end up enjoying myself, mostly because I love seeing him well happy ;-) but I am too damn tired or not interested to have intercourse.

    In reply to earlier:
    I know what turns me on, and we switch things up often, I just have no intrest most of the time, and find his what I see as constant demands as annoying. He has tried letting me take the lead but it was a misrable 7 weeks for him.

    Mom2Kat on
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    By the way, i'll ask again, how old are they both?

    She is 20, he is 18.

    Huh, could be a case of he's not sexually mature enough for her.

    Johannen on
  • JohannenJohannen Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Mom2Kat wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    suilimeA wrote: »
    Corlis wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.

    The people who say "if you really loved me" (male or female, in any context) never seem to realize that it's a two-way street, do they?

    Just lie down and take it?


    As horrible as this is going to sound, sometimes you just have to. There are nights when I would rather scour pots and pans by hand, than have sex, (I own a diswasher and only dishwaser safe pots for a reason)but because I love my husband i will offer a blow job or something. I usually end up enjoying myself, mostly because I love seeing him well happy ;-) but I am too damn tired or not interested to have intercourse.

    In reply to earlier:
    I know what turns me on, and we switch things up often, I just have no intrest most of the time, and find his what I see as constant demands as annoying. He has tried letting me take the lead but it was a misrable 7 weeks for him.
    Fair enough, shows that you are willing to make sacrifices though. I guess men just don't understand women a lot of the time. (read as ever :P )

    Edit: by that I mean I think we have a sexual drive that basically goes:

    Erection = Want Sex

    Whereas women aren't anywhere near that simple.

    Johannen on
  • armageddonboundarmageddonbound Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    There is word for a sexless relationship. Friendship.

    armageddonbound on
  • _J__J_ Pedant Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    What do you guys think? And also aside from this specific situation, what do you think about the idea in general? There's a phrase I heard recently..."A man may have many problems with his wife, but if he's getting plenty of sex, they don't matter."

    I still haven't had sex. I don't think it's that important in a relationship.

    If you think relationships are 50% physical and 50% emotional then, yeah, sex will be important to you.

    If you think relationships are 90% emotional and 10% physical then you'll probably be in a far better position when sex stops being interesting or when your cock stops working.

    Just my opinion.

    _J_ on
  • slowrollslowroll __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Mom2Kat wrote: »
    Johannen wrote: »
    suilimeA wrote: »
    Corlis wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.

    The people who say "if you really loved me" (male or female, in any context) never seem to realize that it's a two-way street, do they?

    Just lie down and take it?


    As horrible as this is going to sound, sometimes you just have to. There are nights when I would rather scour pots and pans by hand, than have sex, (I own a diswasher and only dishwaser safe pots for a reason)but because I love my husband i will offer a blow job or something. I usually end up enjoying myself, mostly because I love seeing him well happy ;-) but I am too damn tired or not interested to have intercourse.

    In reply to earlier:
    I know what turns me on, and we switch things up often, I just have no intrest most of the time, and find his what I see as constant demands as annoying. He has tried letting me take the lead but it was a misrable 7 weeks for him.

    What's your impetus then? I'm not being facetious, I want to know. Is it romantic trigger or is it every once in a while you get the urge to have sex or something else?

    slowroll on
  • ShintoShinto __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Sex stops being interesting?

    What is this jibber-jabber?

    Shinto on
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited September 2007
    _J_ wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    What do you guys think? And also aside from this specific situation, what do you think about the idea in general? There's a phrase I heard recently..."A man may have many problems with his wife, but if he's getting plenty of sex, they don't matter."

    I still haven't had sex. I don't think it's that important in a relationship.

    If you think relationships are 50% physical and 50% emotional then, yeah, sex will be important to you.

    If you think relationships are 90% emotional and 10% physical then you'll probably be in a far better position when sex stops being interesting or when your cock stops working.

    Just my opinion.

    Yeah, I thought this when I was a virgin too.

    Jacobkosh on
    rRwz9.gif
  • _J__J_ Pedant Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Shinto wrote: »
    Sex stops being interesting?

    What is this jibber-jabber?

    My assumption is that if you continually have sex with the same person for 30 years it will be less interesting after 30 years than it was the first time.

    That's not a universal rule, though.

    _J_ on
  • _J__J_ Pedant Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    _J_ wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    What do you guys think? And also aside from this specific situation, what do you think about the idea in general? There's a phrase I heard recently..."A man may have many problems with his wife, but if he's getting plenty of sex, they don't matter."

    I still haven't had sex. I don't think it's that important in a relationship.

    If you think relationships are 50% physical and 50% emotional then, yeah, sex will be important to you.

    If you think relationships are 90% emotional and 10% physical then you'll probably be in a far better position when sex stops being interesting or when your cock stops working.

    Just my opinion.

    Yeah, I thought this when I was a virgin too.

    Fair enough.

    _J_ on
  • EriosErios Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Shinto wrote: »
    Sex stops being interesting?

    What is this jibber-jabber?

    Evil new-speak.

    Erios on
    Steam: erios23, Live: Coconut Flavor, Origin: erios2386.
  • slowrollslowroll __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    jacobkosh wrote: »
    _J_ wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    What do you guys think? And also aside from this specific situation, what do you think about the idea in general? There's a phrase I heard recently..."A man may have many problems with his wife, but if he's getting plenty of sex, they don't matter."

    I still haven't had sex. I don't think it's that important in a relationship.

    If you think relationships are 50% physical and 50% emotional then, yeah, sex will be important to you.

    If you think relationships are 90% emotional and 10% physical then you'll probably be in a far better position when sex stops being interesting or when your cock stops working.

    Just my opinion.

    Yeah, I thought this when I was a virgin too.

    slowroll on
  • CorlisCorlis Registered User regular
    edited September 2007
    Johannen wrote: »
    suilimeA wrote: »
    Corlis wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    As for a relationship without sex, well, if the woman says the man should logically be willing to endure something for the sake of love, doesn't that mean that she also should logically be willing to endure something else (i.e. sex) for the sake of love as well? As such, it might be nice of her to have sex with him the same way it would be nice of him to give her a back rub or fix her breakfast in bed. If meeting somewhere in the middle isn't something either is willing to agree to, then I guess it would be best to break up.
    The people who say "if you really loved me" (male or female, in any context) never seem to realize that it's a two-way street, do they?
    Just lie down and take it?
    "Close your eyes and think of the Empire..." :P

    Well it's like a lot of things couples might do for each other to make their partners happy, even if it's something they don't enjoy themselves. He makes her risotto for dinner every Saturday even though he dislikes risotto. She plays his favourite jazz music in the house even though it bores her a little. He gets her some scotch even though he'd prefer plain beer. She helps cleans the cat's litterbox even though she's indifferent to the cat. Likewise they both have sex at frequencies that are not optimal for them for the sake of the other.

    Corlis on
    But I don't mind, as long as there's a bed beneath the stars that shine,
    I'll be fine, just give me a minute, a man's got a limit, I can't get a life if my heart's not in it.
  • ShintoShinto __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    _J_ wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    Sex stops being interesting?

    What is this jibber-jabber?

    My assumption is that if you continually have sex with the same person for 30 years it will be less interesting after 30 years than it was the first time.

    That's not a universal rule, though.

    Actually for a lot of people the first time sucks and things just keep getting better from there.

    Shinto on
  • _J__J_ Pedant Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2007
    Shinto wrote: »
    _J_ wrote: »
    Shinto wrote: »
    Sex stops being interesting?

    What is this jibber-jabber?

    My assumption is that if you continually have sex with the same person for 30 years it will be less interesting after 30 years than it was the first time.

    That's not a universal rule, though.

    Actually for a lot of people the first time sucks and things just keep getting better from there.

    Interesting.

    _J_ on
This discussion has been closed.