Besides, China isn't particularly likely to go to war with us anyway, our economies are too intertwined.
Aaah! Don't say that out loud - you might jinx it!
*knocks on wood*
:P
It was discovered after his death that Stalin had a filing cabinet full of strategies on how to invade the West. General MacArthur even presented a plan to the public on how to invade Soviet Land before he got the boot. I bet we've got filing systems brimming with tactics and plans on how to invade China by land like they have for us ... just in case. There's always a plan.
In the next thirty years, China's expected to hit a depression when their one child per family policy catches up to the demands on the work force. If we hit them, it'll be then. We'll be at odds with NK for at least thirty more years. Our robot troops (armed with lasers and hover tanks) will kick so much ass across that continent ...
Man, the biggest thing in those filing cabinets are this:
US's filing cabinet: "Declare an embargo on all Chinese goods, thus removing their largest customer and killing their economy."
China's filing cabinet: "Flood the money market with the trillions of U.S. Dollars we're sitting on, thus devaluing the shit out of their currency and killing their economy (especially when you take into account the fact that the recent embargo probably raised the price of every manufactured good sold in America something like 400%)
US opposition party's filing cabinet: "Make sure the next Presidential candidate makes peace with China so that we aren't all poor anymore."
and that's all she wrote. The age of worrying about a shooting war ended in '91.
Actually, KungFu, that's quite a convincing argument.
Bush could have simply contracted some crazy Saudis to crash the planes into the towers, and now only one person lives today who knows about it. And he's
Again, I can't see a way for there to have been a Presidential-level operation that has maintained total secrecy considering all the people the information would have passed through for there to have been a conspiracy on the scale you were talking about.
We don't really need a gateway into China if there's another world war because let's face it, there'll be a global exchange of nuclear weapons and cockroaches will inherit the earth. Besides, China isn't particularly likely to go to war with us anyway, our economies are too intertwined.
Don't underestimate Taiwan which is still a major source of national shame for China and the likeliest cause of war between the US and China in the future. Though not the immediate future. China's 'navy' is years away from even trying to challenge the US navy and no naval support means no way to support ground troops.
Taiwan would not result in a war, it would result in a scuffle. Admittedly one of those ones where a bunch of people die, but not a region-wide "let's go invade people" type thing, more of the type where a bunch of their planes and a bunch of our planes shoot at each other a bit while everyone rocks up in impressive looking things and stares at each other real hard.
But the operations those agencies have been able to keep secret have been minor, minor operations, and all for more definite beneficial purposes. Like the operation where they acted as a Hollywood film crew in order to save a hostage in Afghanistan, or somewhere.
You'd have to keep a significantly larger portion of people quiet about an operation which drove faux 747's into the towers. And this operation was most definitely not for beneficial purposes.
And what of the dead? The planes were real, as were the pilots. For this operation to have been government, all flight controllers would have to have been in on it, as well as pilots, and all who operated the place where those real planes landed. Then they would have had to kill all the passengers, as well as the pilots if they weren't in on it. And I suppose the just went down the line, killing everyone who wouldn't call a loved one and give a fake goodbye.
Uh, Im saying that if this was a conspiracy, the only people who would be in on it would be the government and the hijackers. Im saying if it was a coverup conspiracy tinfoilhat job, that the people on the planes were real and died and the planes were purposely crashed. Who the fuck says the planes werent crashed into the towers and they were secretly switched out? That's just retarded.
Im saying that if it was a conspiracy, the government wouldn't give a shit about the people on the planes or in the towers and the point of them doing it would be so that all died. And for what reason? To further an agenda in the Middle-East and strengthen government control and increase government control and create an authoritarian government that is after your bodily fluids.
/tinfoilhat adovcate
The "governement" side of that would have to be pretty sizeable. We're not talking Muhammad Atta talking directly on the phone with bush. You're talking creating purposeful failures in the INS, CIA, FBI and NSA to allow these guys to operate in the country uninterrupted. You'e talking docotring files. Transferring them money. Directing them where and when to strike. This would be an enormous undertaking.
Not saying it's not possible but there'd be a fuck of alot of people involve to pull it off and you're betting on not a single one having a conscience to come forward before or afterwards.
I dont understand how people are so conviced one way or another about this. You cant prove that it was a conspiracy to start a war(though I happen to believe it was, just not the whole missles and demoltion charges thing), and the people who say "oh you're fuckin crazy for believing that." should just shut up right now, because, unless you are a high level government official, or in that particular terrorist organization you cant be positive. Best to just wait for someone to fuck up and let what really happened slip, if what most people believe to be the truth isnt.
Honestly though, do you really think if the government didnt want to keep things like this secret they couldnt? Come the fuck on.
Uh, Im saying that if this was a conspiracy, the only people who would be in on it would be the government and the hijackers. Im saying if it was a coverup conspiracy tinfoilhat job, that the people on the planes were real and died and the planes were purposely crashed. Who the fuck says the planes werent crashed into the towers and they were secretly switched out? That's just retarded.
Im saying that if it was a conspiracy, the government wouldn't give a shit about the people on the planes or in the towers and the point of them doing it would be so that all died. And for what reason? To further an agenda in the Middle-East and strengthen government control and increase government control and create an authoritarian government that is after your bodily fluids.
/tinfoilhat adovcate
Most of the 9/11 "theories" start from the basic premise that planes could NOT have brought down the towers, so it had to be Something Else.
I dont understand how people are so conviced one way or another about this. You cant prove that it was a conspiracy to start a war(thoguh I happen to believe it was just not the whole missles and demoltion charges thing), and the people who say "oh you're fuckin crazy for believing that." should just shut up right now, because, unless you are a high level government official, or in that particular terrorist organization you cant be positive. Best to just wait for someone to fuck up and let what really happened slip, if what most people believe to be the truth isnt.
Honestly though, do you really think if the government didnt want to keep things like this secret they couldnt. Come the fuck on.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Government being able to keep secrets is one thing, but being able to keep secret a massive plot to perform an act of war on ones own people in our system is quite another. Even if they were able to compartmentalize it such that only an inner core knew about the whole picture, there would be a number of people on the edges of the plot who would have no motivation to cover up the plot and would have suspicious information deriving from that role. And I'm not talking about poor understanding of structural engineering here.
There are some things that could fit into that sort of category, but are much more easily explained by run of the mill incompetence, especially when you consider that fringe members of the plot would have to be kept in the dark or such a plot would be uncovered.
I think my brother has a mild conspiracy theory that there was a cover up of just how incompetent the government was about dealing with Al Qaeda.
I dont understand how people are so conviced one way or another about this. You cant prove that it was a conspiracy to start a war(thoguh I happen to believe it was just not the whole missles and demoltion charges thing), and the people who say "oh you're fuckin crazy for believing that." should just shut up right now, because, unless you are a high level government official, or in that particular terrorist organization you cant be positive. Best to just wait for someone to fuck up and let what really happened slip, if what most people believe to be the truth isnt.
Honestly though, do you really think if the government didnt want to keep things like this secret they couldnt. Come the fuck on.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Government being able to keep secrets is one thing, but being able to keep secret a massive plot to perform an act of war on ones own people in our system is quite another. Even if they were able to compartmentalize it such that only an inner core knew about the whole picture, there would be a number of people on the edges of the plot who would have no motivation to cover up the plot and would have suspicious information deriving from that role. And I'm not talking about poor understanding of structural engineering here.
There are some things that could fit into that sort of category, but are much more easily explained by run of the mill incompetence, especially when you consider that fringe members of the plot would have to be kept in the dark or such a plot would be uncovered.
I think my brother has a mild conspiracy theory that there was a cover up of just how incompetent the government was about dealing with Al Qaeda.
Ill concede that. Im just saying, unless you were involved in some way, you cant be sure.
I dont understand how people are so conviced one way or another about this. You cant prove that it was a conspiracy to start a war(thoguh I happen to believe it was just not the whole missles and demoltion charges thing), and the people who say "oh you're fuckin crazy for believing that." should just shut up right now, because, unless you are a high level government official, or in that particular terrorist organization you cant be positive. Best to just wait for someone to fuck up and let what really happened slip, if what most people believe to be the truth isnt.
Honestly though, do you really think if the government didnt want to keep things like this secret they couldnt. Come the fuck on.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Government being able to keep secrets is one thing, but being able to keep secret a massive plot to perform an act of war on ones own people in our system is quite another. Even if they were able to compartmentalize it such that only an inner core knew about the whole picture, there would be a number of people on the edges of the plot who would have no motivation to cover up the plot and would have suspicious information deriving from that role. And I'm not talking about poor understanding of structural engineering here.
You could certainly keep almost everyone from knowing the ultimate goal. But when they turn on their TVs the next morning, you are going to have a lot of very angry patriots on your hands.
I dont understand how people are so conviced one way or another about this. You cant prove that it was a conspiracy to start a war(thoguh I happen to believe it was just not the whole missles and demoltion charges thing), and the people who say "oh you're fuckin crazy for believing that." should just shut up right now, because, unless you are a high level government official, or in that particular terrorist organization you cant be positive. Best to just wait for someone to fuck up and let what really happened slip, if what most people believe to be the truth isnt.
Honestly though, do you really think if the government didnt want to keep things like this secret they couldnt. Come the fuck on.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Government being able to keep secrets is one thing, but being able to keep secret a massive plot to perform an act of war on ones own people in our system is quite another. Even if they were able to compartmentalize it such that only an inner core knew about the whole picture, there would be a number of people on the edges of the plot who would have no motivation to cover up the plot and would have suspicious information deriving from that role. And I'm not talking about poor understanding of structural engineering here.
You could certainly keep almost everyone from knowing the ultimate goal. But when they turn on their TVs the next morning, you are going to have a lot of very angry patriots on your hands.
Some of these theories I really don't see a way. Like demonislhing the buildings. The people placing the charges would obviously have to know what they were doing. Even ploice, security and fire depts would think something was amiss if they were directed to ignore these people then the buildings blow up 5 minutes later.
Ill concede that. Im just saying, unless you were involved in some way, you cant be sure.
You're not in my backyard so you don't know that there's not a unicorn here :roll:
Yea, thats only very slightly the same thing. Im saying that the government has the capacity to keep such a secret from you. You're suggesting the its compoable to a fantasy creature living in your back yard, quite a fucking stretch.
Basically, any series of steps involving people will result in a cluster of fuck ups which every now and again lead to a grand fuck up. But what bends people's minds is that they can't imagine how that can be.
Or to summarize: god I hate conspiracy theorists.
I love this.
Dhalphir on
0
Options
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
Most of the 9/11 "theories" start from the basic premise that planes could NOT have brought down the towers, so it had to be Something Else.
But do they say that the planes werent crashed?
They do, unfortunately. One of the latest theories I heard was that the planes were edited into the footage real-time, and that all the eyewitness accounts were actually from news station CEOs.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Government being able to keep secrets is one thing, but being able to keep secret a massive plot to perform an act of war on ones own people in our system is quite another. Even if they were able to compartmentalize it such that only an inner core knew about the whole picture, there would be a number of people on the edges of the plot who would have no motivation to cover up the plot and would have suspicious information deriving from that role. And I'm not talking about poor understanding of structural engineering here.
There are some things that could fit into that sort of category, but are much more easily explained by run of the mill incompetence, especially when you consider that fringe members of the plot would have to be kept in the dark or such a plot would be uncovered.
I think my brother has a mild conspiracy theory that there was a cover up of just how incompetent the government was about dealing with Al Qaeda.
Ill concede that. Im just saying, unless you were involved in some way, you cant be sure.
"But you can't be sure!!!" is a stupid, stupid response on many levels. ELM was pointing out, yeah, no shit you can't be 100% sure. You can't be certain of anything, unicorn or not. Squawking "but you can't know!" to try and back up your wacko theories is dumb, dumb, dumb.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Given a proper re-investigation of the 9/11 debacle, I am quite certain that evidence of wrongdoing would come to light. The original 9/11 commission was a complete sham, the white house didn't cooperate at all, your idiot president refused to testify publicly, and they still had to censor parts from the final report. Just imagine what would happen if Bush were actually required to answer for himself in a public setting.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Given a proper re-investigation of the 9/11 debacle, I am quite certain that evidence of wrongdoing would come to light. The original 9/11 commission was a complete sham, the white house didn't cooperate at all, your idiot president refused to testify publicly, and they still had to censor parts from the final report -- just imagine what would happen if Bush were actually required to answer for himself in a public setting.
'Proper'?
Hammer long enough at a piece of metal and you'll get whatever form you want out of it.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Given a proper re-investigation of the 9/11 debacle, I am quite certain that evidence of wrongdoing would come to light. The original 9/11 commission was a complete sham, the white house didn't cooperate at all, your idiot president refused to testify publicly, and they still had to censor parts from the final report -- just imagine what would happen if Bush were actually required to answer for himself in a public setting.
'Proper'?
Hammer long enough at a piece of metal and you'll get whatever form you want out of it.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Given a proper re-investigation of the 9/11 debacle, I am quite certain that evidence of wrongdoing would come to light. The original 9/11 commission was a complete sham, the white house didn't cooperate at all, your idiot president refused to testify publicly, and they still had to censor parts from the final report. Just imagine what would happen if Bush were actually required to answer for himself in a public setting.
Wrong doing, or incompetence? The only conspiracy that's going on in regards to 9-11 is covering up just how horrible our intelligence agencies actually are, because you need to project an image of strength on the world stage.
Anyone want to argue structural mechanics and statics? I could use a refresher course on my steel manual.
See the conspiracy episodes of South Park and Bullshit!.
Conspiracy theorists have trouble with the idea that something as terrible as killing a president or blowing up a building can be done by 1 or a handful of people. Surely you can't just wake up one morning and walk to a building and aim a gun at a president and pull the trigger. It must take more than that.
It depends on who you want to kill and where.
IF you know the area, where the protection is going to be, with the fire corridors and so on.
It's hard but not impossible for a small group or individual to kill someone high up in office.
I do agree most conspiracy theorys are really out there or dumb
Brainleech on
0
Options
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Given a proper re-investigation of the 9/11 debacle, I am quite certain that evidence of wrongdoing would come to light. The original 9/11 commission was a complete sham, the white house didn't cooperate at all, your idiot president refused to testify publicly, and they still had to censor parts from the final report. Just imagine what would happen if Bush were actually required to answer for himself in a public setting.
Wrong doing, or incompetence? The only conspiracy that's going on in regards to 9-11 is covering up just how horrible our intelligence agencies actually are, because you need to project an image of strength on the world stage.
Anyone want to argue structural mechanics and statics? I could use a refresher course on my steel manual.
I would play Devil's Advocate, and argue about jet fuel burns at blah blah toolowtemperature blah blah...
But I don't have the energy to pretend to be that stupid.
I would play Devil's Advocate... But I don't have the energy to pretend to be that stupid.
I'll do it.
Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel. We all know a building wouldn't collapse until the metal frame finally turned into liquid. There's no in between phase. Matter can't be half-solid, half-liquid.
You're telling me the hijackers broke the laws of physics to bring the towers down? Well fuck, give them medals! Stop killing 'em, they're geniuses!
I would play Devil's Advocate... But I don't have the energy to pretend to be that stupid.
I'll do it.
Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel. We all know a building wouldn't collapse until the metal frame finally turned into liquid. There's no in between phase. Matter can't be half-solid, half-liquid.
You're telling me the hijackers broke the laws of physics to bring the towers down? Well fuck, give them medals! Stop killing 'em, they're geniuses!
Absolutely. I know I see plenty of melted steel when burning buildings collapse. It's practically a forge.
I would play Devil's Advocate... But I don't have the energy to pretend to be that stupid.
I'll do it.
Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel. We all know a building wouldn't collapse until the metal frame finally turned into liquid. There's no in between phase. Matter can't be half-solid, half-liquid.
You're telling me the hijackers broke the laws of physics to bring the towers down? Well fuck, give them medals! Stop killing 'em, they're geniuses!
Absolutely. I know I see plenty of melted steel when burning buildings collapse. It's practically a forge.
And let's not forget, sans incredible flaming heat, a perfectly good airplane wing moving at high speeds couldn't possibly make a dent in a buildings supports.
Actually, barring the heat and being limited to impact damage the towers would likely have stood due to the tube and core design. It was the sagging beams resulting from the breached fire proofing on the steel trusses that caused the top to collapse. Without the heat they would have had excessive load placed on them but not likely enough to cause catastrophic failures on the remainder of the structural skin.
But what aspect of whatever combination of heat and impact the planes had caused the actual collapse of the whole tower? I'm not familiar with the actual architectural design of the towers, but as I'm thinking of it, I can't help but be just a little confused as to how the entire tower came down.
As it's playing through my head now, the structure around the impact site weakens and collapses. That part is clear, but was the mass of the portion of tower that collapsed really of sufficient weight to pound the remaining tower into the ground? Did the fire spread? Or did the heat result from the fire spread that efficiently that the whole building's structure was weakened? I know heat travels efficiently through metal, but I might imagine the insulation might absorb some heating traveling down the frame of the building.
Also, wasn't there a debate about the shoddy insulation of the floors and frame when the towers were built, possibly contributing to the eventual collapse?
But what aspect of whatever combination of heat and impact the planes had caused the actual collapse of the whole tower? I'm not familiar with the actual architectural design of the towers, but as I'm thinking of it, I can't help but be just a little confused as to how the entire tower came down.
As it's playing through my head now, the structure around the impact site weakens and collapses. That part is clear, but was the mass of the portion of tower that collapsed really of sufficient weight to pound the remaining tower into the ground? Did the fire spread? Or did the heat result from the fire spread that efficiently that the whole building's structure was weakened? I know heat travels efficiently through metal, but I might imagine the insulation might absorb some heating traveling down the frame of the building.
Also, wasn't there a debate about the shoddy insulation of the floors and frame when the towers were built, possibly contributing to the eventual collapse?
The diagram of it I saw was that the planes hit and knocked off a bunch of the fireproofing. Then the fire and flaming jet fuel didn't melt the steel, but heated it sufficiently to significantly weaken it. So then the structure fails somewhere in the middle, and the building can no longer hold up the upper floors then they start pancaking down and causes a cascading failure.
That's just off the top of my head though, there may have been a more in depth explanation of it.
The impact shook most/all of the fireproofing off of the trusses that it was sprayed onto. (it also just took some out, but with redundancy that wasn't a big issue) The now exposed steel was weakened by the extreme temperatures from everything inside of an office + jet fuel + airplane passengers bursting into flames that burned for a prolonged period due to the sprinkler system's pipes being destroyed/ruptured when the core was pierced and partially destroyed. This intense heat, and drawn out lowered heat after the jet fuel and corpses ran out, caused the steel trusses to become plastic at their weakest points, the middles, putting more strains on their strongest points, the connections. Eventually the sagging became too much and the connections snapped the structural skin envelope that was supporting much of the above load due to the core's penetration. The top 15 (?) whatever stories were no longer given enough force to sustain their load and so they fell. It wasn't a perfect pancake, but given the sheer size of the building something swaying and tilting by some 50 odd feet or so wouldn't really be perceptible so you might as well say it all went straight down.
The insulation wasn't shoddy nor was it applied improperly. It easily went beyond code requirements and is still in use today. The primary issue was that insulation and the core only took into account fire rating and not impact damage which has been somewhat improved. However, you need to keep in mind that we really shouldn't be designing all of our buildings for the worst case scenario otherwise you'll never be able to rent them out. It's the same reason why you only have wind speed or earthquake rating control the level of lateral force your structural equations take into account. Technically it's possible to have an earthquake strike at the same time as a hurricane and a tornado, but it doesn't make sense to design a building for that contingency.
Posts
Man, the biggest thing in those filing cabinets are this:
US's filing cabinet: "Declare an embargo on all Chinese goods, thus removing their largest customer and killing their economy."
China's filing cabinet: "Flood the money market with the trillions of U.S. Dollars we're sitting on, thus devaluing the shit out of their currency and killing their economy (especially when you take into account the fact that the recent embargo probably raised the price of every manufactured good sold in America something like 400%)
US opposition party's filing cabinet: "Make sure the next Presidential candidate makes peace with China so that we aren't all poor anymore."
and that's all she wrote. The age of worrying about a shooting war ended in '91.
Bush could have simply contracted some crazy Saudis to crash the planes into the towers, and now only one person lives today who knows about it. And he's
Also: Rabble rabble- grassy knoll, lettered moon props, tinfoil hats - rabble rabble...
I saw an internet documentary proving it!
Our first game is now available for free on Google Play: Frontier: Isle of the Seven Gods
Taiwan would not result in a war, it would result in a scuffle. Admittedly one of those ones where a bunch of people die, but not a region-wide "let's go invade people" type thing, more of the type where a bunch of their planes and a bunch of our planes shoot at each other a bit while everyone rocks up in impressive looking things and stares at each other real hard.
The "governement" side of that would have to be pretty sizeable. We're not talking Muhammad Atta talking directly on the phone with bush. You're talking creating purposeful failures in the INS, CIA, FBI and NSA to allow these guys to operate in the country uninterrupted. You'e talking docotring files. Transferring them money. Directing them where and when to strike. This would be an enormous undertaking.
Not saying it's not possible but there'd be a fuck of alot of people involve to pull it off and you're betting on not a single one having a conscience to come forward before or afterwards.
Honestly though, do you really think if the government didnt want to keep things like this secret they couldnt? Come the fuck on.
Most of the 9/11 "theories" start from the basic premise that planes could NOT have brought down the towers, so it had to be Something Else.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Or at least some solid evidence.
Government being able to keep secrets is one thing, but being able to keep secret a massive plot to perform an act of war on ones own people in our system is quite another. Even if they were able to compartmentalize it such that only an inner core knew about the whole picture, there would be a number of people on the edges of the plot who would have no motivation to cover up the plot and would have suspicious information deriving from that role. And I'm not talking about poor understanding of structural engineering here.
There are some things that could fit into that sort of category, but are much more easily explained by run of the mill incompetence, especially when you consider that fringe members of the plot would have to be kept in the dark or such a plot would be uncovered.
I think my brother has a mild conspiracy theory that there was a cover up of just how incompetent the government was about dealing with Al Qaeda.
Ill concede that. Im just saying, unless you were involved in some way, you cant be sure.
You could certainly keep almost everyone from knowing the ultimate goal. But when they turn on their TVs the next morning, you are going to have a lot of very angry patriots on your hands.
But do they say that the planes werent crashed?
Some of these theories I really don't see a way. Like demonislhing the buildings. The people placing the charges would obviously have to know what they were doing. Even ploice, security and fire depts would think something was amiss if they were directed to ignore these people then the buildings blow up 5 minutes later.
Yea, thats only very slightly the same thing. Im saying that the government has the capacity to keep such a secret from you. You're suggesting the its compoable to a fantasy creature living in your back yard, quite a fucking stretch.
Comparing conspiracies to unicorns is incredibly stupid on many levels.
I love this.
Maybe man...but ...
unicorns!
You seem to have missed the post to which he was replying. Here it is again:
"But you can't be sure!!!" is a stupid, stupid response on many levels. ELM was pointing out, yeah, no shit you can't be 100% sure. You can't be certain of anything, unicorn or not. Squawking "but you can't know!" to try and back up your wacko theories is dumb, dumb, dumb.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
'Proper'?
Hammer long enough at a piece of metal and you'll get whatever form you want out of it.
It clearly wasn't chaired by a true Scotsman.
I made a game, it has penguins in it. It's pay what you like on Gumroad.
Currently Ebaying Nothing at all but I might do in the future.
Wrong doing, or incompetence? The only conspiracy that's going on in regards to 9-11 is covering up just how horrible our intelligence agencies actually are, because you need to project an image of strength on the world stage.
Anyone want to argue structural mechanics and statics? I could use a refresher course on my steel manual.
Canada built the CN tower solely so that we could also "wave our dicks in the air" so to speak.
India is now also following suit.
MWO: Adamski
It depends on who you want to kill and where.
IF you know the area, where the protection is going to be, with the fire corridors and so on.
It's hard but not impossible for a small group or individual to kill someone high up in office.
I do agree most conspiracy theorys are really out there or dumb
I would play Devil's Advocate, and argue about jet fuel burns at blah blah toolowtemperature blah blah...
But I don't have the energy to pretend to be that stupid.
I'll do it.
Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel. We all know a building wouldn't collapse until the metal frame finally turned into liquid. There's no in between phase. Matter can't be half-solid, half-liquid.
You're telling me the hijackers broke the laws of physics to bring the towers down? Well fuck, give them medals! Stop killing 'em, they're geniuses!
Kind of sort of related, and probably frowned upon but it's funny so whatever.
That's beautiful.
And i didn't even have sound.
Absolutely. I know I see plenty of melted steel when burning buildings collapse. It's practically a forge.
Our first game is now available for free on Google Play: Frontier: Isle of the Seven Gods
And let's not forget, sans incredible flaming heat, a perfectly good airplane wing moving at high speeds couldn't possibly make a dent in a buildings supports.
Seriously guys this just reeks of a cover up.
As it's playing through my head now, the structure around the impact site weakens and collapses. That part is clear, but was the mass of the portion of tower that collapsed really of sufficient weight to pound the remaining tower into the ground? Did the fire spread? Or did the heat result from the fire spread that efficiently that the whole building's structure was weakened? I know heat travels efficiently through metal, but I might imagine the insulation might absorb some heating traveling down the frame of the building.
Also, wasn't there a debate about the shoddy insulation of the floors and frame when the towers were built, possibly contributing to the eventual collapse?
The diagram of it I saw was that the planes hit and knocked off a bunch of the fireproofing. Then the fire and flaming jet fuel didn't melt the steel, but heated it sufficiently to significantly weaken it. So then the structure fails somewhere in the middle, and the building can no longer hold up the upper floors then they start pancaking down and causes a cascading failure.
That's just off the top of my head though, there may have been a more in depth explanation of it.
The insulation wasn't shoddy nor was it applied improperly. It easily went beyond code requirements and is still in use today. The primary issue was that insulation and the core only took into account fire rating and not impact damage which has been somewhat improved. However, you need to keep in mind that we really shouldn't be designing all of our buildings for the worst case scenario otherwise you'll never be able to rent them out. It's the same reason why you only have wind speed or earthquake rating control the level of lateral force your structural equations take into account. Technically it's possible to have an earthquake strike at the same time as a hurricane and a tornado, but it doesn't make sense to design a building for that contingency.