I don't ever use Shred while soloing. Personally I think it's a misconception that it's the fastest way to bring a mob down solo. Here is how it works when you do Mangle:
Pounce->50 energy-> immediately tick to 70 energy
Mangle->30 energy->tick to 50
Now you have two options. You can Shred while the Pounce stun is still going, which will leave you with 8 energy. Or you can Mangle again, leaving you with 10 energy.
If you Mangle again, you'll tick back up to 30 energy. On most mobs, now's the time to use Rip; you'll have anywhere from 3-5 combo points depending on crits/OOC procs, and the mob should be around half health. Now you just clean up with 1-2 more Mangles.
If you had taken the Shred route, you would end up with 28 energy when it's time to use Rip; you'll have to wait another full energy tick, putting you one tick behind on the rotation.
Maybe not a huge deal, but seems like it's a faster kill to me.
Of course things are different in a raid situation where it's all about sustained damage. But when balancing energy costs with ticks over a short duration battle, I think Mangle is better.
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
Orem, I very rarely use rip. Most of the time I use maim and then just one more shred kills them. Probably why I don't bother. Plus a crit mangle does around 1400 damage. A crit shred does 2200.
I never really liked Maim too much. When you factor in losing your autoattack for X seconds, and the already low damage->energy conversion (it equals 1-2 ticks of Rip at best), it seems like a slower kill to me. At best it reduces the damage you take from the fight, but Ferals already have zero downtime anyway, so why bother?
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
Actually, Maim is more like Gouge, except in the form of a finishing move. It turns off auto-attack and incapacitates the target for an extra second per combo point. Also does a bit of damage.
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
So how would you choose to Shred vs. Claw or Mangle? I understand that there are different energy costs, but Rogues choose to backstab for a very different reason than energy... Or did in vanilla WoW anyhow.
Shred vs Mangle/Claw....depends a lot on if you have the talents to decrease energy costs for shred and if you have the talent to increase the stun duration of pounce. If you've got those you could use pounce and then shred 2x for an opener. I've gotten to a point where I just pounce/mangle a couple times. If the target is still around half health at that point I use rip....if it's around 30% or less health I use ferocious bite or maim. About the only time I use shred now is in raids/instances.
I suppose if you don't have Mangle yet you could continue to use Shred in your opener. Shred crits for more and will generally do more damage than Claw so ya, use it if you don't have Mangle.
I don't know why you wouldn't have the energy reduction talent for shred though. The 15% resistance to fear, etc is not worth as much as that if you are an offtank in raids. I guess if you only main tank your raids then you wouldn't want it but I feel like that's a huge waste unless you only have druid tanks.
edit: As it is now and my gear is pretty good, but no where near great, my mangles crit for around 1400-1500 and my shreds crit for around 2000-2200. That's a decent chunk of damage for 2 energy.
Right, in a raid setting where it all balances out--but in a solo setting, that extra 2 energy means Shred might as well still cost 60, because it's costing you a full energy tick.
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
Well I got this skill rotation from a guildie and it really worked well for me up until end game as feral. I used to pounce, mangle, shred. After i started doing that my damage really increased. But I really didn't start doing damage until i went boomkin.
So, my roommate and I have started running 2s warrior/druid. We're pretty terrible so far, but we're getting better. Due to a bunch of factors that have limited our ability to raid on our mains, we've decided to make this work.
My druid. Obviously her gear right now is an extremely limiting factor; until last week she had about +884 healing in pvp gear. I have 26k honor saved up for Tuesday and will be picking up the S2 mace asap. My question is, how best to spend arena points? I have about 1700 points saved, and will likely pick up another 300 or so. Our goal is to hit 1550 tonight, but I don't know if we'll have time for enough games.
My question is, assuming I did hit 1550: would I be better off replacing the offhand with the S4 offhand, or the legs with the S4 legs?
If I go legs I gain 172 armor (688 in bear), 22 stam, 22 int, 11 resilience, 50 +healing, and 8 mp5. If I go for the offhand first I gain 37 stam, 27 resilience, 42 +healing, and 10 int; I also save 725 points.
Edit: I do have a living ruby and noble topaz waiting to be cut to go into the shoulders; I haven't really bothered with considering a meta for the welfare blue helm.
Wait, I'm confused. Are you the druid, or is she the druid? o_O
Edit - oh nevermind. You are saying "her gear" as in, your druid's gear.
I'm with you now. What to gem for really depends on how well you are at kiting enemy melee. You don't need excess stamina if you can stay away from attacks masterfully. That said, you do have quite low +healing for a PvP healer, and any more you can get would be great. As a rule, I personally try to gem for survivability or spell haste, because I like to get +healing or mp5 from gear itself.
Try more games. If you find yourself the focus 90% of the time (which is likely), and you can't get away, then gem for survivability. If not, go for +healing.
So I like my druid again after picking up a few of the first tier Resto talents. He's 59 now. If I've got 42 points in Feral and have started putting a few in Resto (mostly to help out Feral), would I be able to pick up a healing set and not be laughed out of the instance? I want to say yes, but that mana pool of mine is atrocious.
My feral druid alt is currently 58, and he's been cheerfully mainhealing instances since his late twenties with nothing more than a healing set composed mostly of random out-of-date quest greens and no points in resto.
Frankly, with the HoTs available to a druid, even with my iffy mana pool I spend most of my time when I'm healing standing around with 90% mana twiddling my thumbs until it's time to refresh Rejuv. Even on the rare occasions I DO find myself getting low, an Innervate on myself clears that up pretty quick.
I've been known to drop the occasional starfire on things just for something to do.
Edit: Really the only thing I like about healing with my druid is that between his healing weapon (shovel), his robe, and his wide-brimmed hat, whenever he wears his healing set he looks like some kind of magic gardener
Edit 2: And in case you're curious for the sake of comparison, his healing gear only boosts his mana pool up to about 4.5k, with only 93 +healing.
Well, that's good to hear. I haven't really done much healing besides solo-stuff with this guy, so looking at only three heals while my main is a shadow priest, the difference in options is obvious. I mean, look at cat form, you get just about all of a rogue's great attacks. Still, if it'll get in instances, I'm for it.
drhazard on
0
BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
edited June 2008
So S4 rolled around and I finally realised a long-held dream... going Restokin in PvP :P
Dreamstate, Lunar Guidance and the extra padding from Boomkin make a LOT of difference in PvP, I have 205 mp/5 and 700 spelldmg making sustained pewpew and healing possible in the same spec. I LOVE it, never had so much fun in WoW before. Also when I get the epic trinket I'll have 505 resilience lawl, it's awesome running into the middle in AV and kiting as many melee as you can, my best run was all the way to FW GY where they got ganked piecemeal
Dreamstate, Lunar Guidance and the extra padding from Boomkin make a LOT of difference in PvP, I have 205 mp/5 and 700 spelldmg making sustained pewpew and healing possible in the same spec. I LOVE it, never had so much fun in WoW before. Also when I get the epic trinket I'll have 505 resilience lawl, it's awesome running into the middle in AV and kiting as many melee as you can, my best run was all the way to FW GY where they got ganked piecemeal
Well, in your gear, you could do it I wish I was geared enough to go Restokin, but sadly, my bonus healing/HP/resilience still isn't quite there.
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
#1: OOC Proc- Another Shred goes down, followed up by Maim. Mob will probably be dead at this point(Crits), or close to it. Final Shred or Mangle will finish the job.
#2: Wait on the energy tick for Maim. Maim goes down. Wait on the energy to Shred. Mob probably dies at this point(Crits).
42% crit, 3kish AP.
Can probably debate this for a little while, but it boils down to playstyle, and overall gear setup. Remember that you are first and foremost a "Backstab" Rogue in a kitty suit.
well I have a mage/boomkin team with my boyfriend and what we usually do, and lately we've been winning about 8/10 games is. I'll cyclone/moonfire people and have my treants out at the start of the fight. Then throw off a heal every so often. If he ice blocks or something. You being a healer I would suggest keeping cyclone up and letting your team mate take care of the other with you helping out a bit with moonfire.
You're good, I'd say. In the future focus on getting more armor and agi if you want to tank tougher stuff, your health is plenty right now but your armor and dodge are on the low side (mostly your armor).
My main spec is Resto, but my realm has a severe tank shortage so I decided to go Feral for a week for kicks and badges. Just trying to be geared well enough to comfortably tank things
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
So if I socket for more agility, does the armor I get from that get multiplied by Dire Bear? Should I maybe drop some stamina gems for straight agility or agility/stamina?
OremLK on
My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
I don't think the armor bonus from agi gets multiplied by bear form, and it's pretty negligible anyways. I don't know that I'd drop some stam gems, but as you gear up I'd strongly suggest using agi gems instead.
Posts
'Sup.
Pounce->50 energy-> immediately tick to 70 energy
Mangle->30 energy->tick to 50
Now you have two options. You can Shred while the Pounce stun is still going, which will leave you with 8 energy. Or you can Mangle again, leaving you with 10 energy.
If you Mangle again, you'll tick back up to 30 energy. On most mobs, now's the time to use Rip; you'll have anywhere from 3-5 combo points depending on crits/OOC procs, and the mob should be around half health. Now you just clean up with 1-2 more Mangles.
If you had taken the Shred route, you would end up with 28 energy when it's time to use Rip; you'll have to wait another full energy tick, putting you one tick behind on the rotation.
Maybe not a huge deal, but seems like it's a faster kill to me.
Of course things are different in a raid situation where it's all about sustained damage. But when balancing energy costs with ticks over a short duration battle, I think Mangle is better.
marry me
Maim = Sinister Strike?
Rip = Rupture?
O.o
rip: rupture
claw/mangle: Sinister Strike
shred: Backstab
Ravage: ambush
Pounce: CS with bleed effect
I suppose if you don't have Mangle yet you could continue to use Shred in your opener. Shred crits for more and will generally do more damage than Claw so ya, use it if you don't have Mangle.
So, bye bye druid twinks in WSG at lvl 39.
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
edit: As it is now and my gear is pretty good, but no where near great, my mangles crit for around 1400-1500 and my shreds crit for around 2000-2200. That's a decent chunk of damage for 2 energy.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dragonmaw&n=Tiandihui
My druid. Obviously her gear right now is an extremely limiting factor; until last week she had about +884 healing in pvp gear. I have 26k honor saved up for Tuesday and will be picking up the S2 mace asap. My question is, how best to spend arena points? I have about 1700 points saved, and will likely pick up another 300 or so. Our goal is to hit 1550 tonight, but I don't know if we'll have time for enough games.
My question is, assuming I did hit 1550: would I be better off replacing the offhand with the S4 offhand, or the legs with the S4 legs?
If I go legs I gain 172 armor (688 in bear), 22 stam, 22 int, 11 resilience, 50 +healing, and 8 mp5. If I go for the offhand first I gain 37 stam, 27 resilience, 42 +healing, and 10 int; I also save 725 points.
Edit: I do have a living ruby and noble topaz waiting to be cut to go into the shoulders; I haven't really bothered with considering a meta for the welfare blue helm.
Thoughts?
Edit - oh nevermind. You are saying "her gear" as in, your druid's gear.
I'm with you now. What to gem for really depends on how well you are at kiting enemy melee. You don't need excess stamina if you can stay away from attacks masterfully. That said, you do have quite low +healing for a PvP healer, and any more you can get would be great. As a rule, I personally try to gem for survivability or spell haste, because I like to get +healing or mp5 from gear itself.
Try more games. If you find yourself the focus 90% of the time (which is likely), and you can't get away, then gem for survivability. If not, go for +healing.
Frankly, with the HoTs available to a druid, even with my iffy mana pool I spend most of my time when I'm healing standing around with 90% mana twiddling my thumbs until it's time to refresh Rejuv. Even on the rare occasions I DO find myself getting low, an Innervate on myself clears that up pretty quick.
I've been known to drop the occasional starfire on things just for something to do.
Edit: Really the only thing I like about healing with my druid is that between his healing weapon (shovel), his robe, and his wide-brimmed hat, whenever he wears his healing set he looks like some kind of magic gardener
Edit 2: And in case you're curious for the sake of comparison, his healing gear only boosts his mana pool up to about 4.5k, with only 93 +healing.
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Eonar&n=Beaststrike
Dreamstate, Lunar Guidance and the extra padding from Boomkin make a LOT of difference in PvP, I have 205 mp/5 and 700 spelldmg making sustained pewpew and healing possible in the same spec. I LOVE it, never had so much fun in WoW before. Also when I get the epic trinket I'll have 505 resilience lawl, it's awesome running into the middle in AV and kiting as many melee as you can, my best run was all the way to FW GY where they got ganked piecemeal
Well, in your gear, you could do it
1 of 2 things then happens:
#1: OOC Proc- Another Shred goes down, followed up by Maim. Mob will probably be dead at this point(Crits), or close to it. Final Shred or Mangle will finish the job.
#2: Wait on the energy tick for Maim. Maim goes down. Wait on the energy to Shred. Mob probably dies at this point(Crits).
42% crit, 3kish AP.
Can probably debate this for a little while, but it boils down to playstyle, and overall gear setup. Remember that you are first and foremost a "Backstab" Rogue in a kitty suit.
First Blood 85 Priest 80 Mage 85 Paladin 83 Druid 80 DK 85 Huntard 85 Shaman
"Tardo Wan" sounds like a Jedi that required 436 years to train and then killed himself by looking into his lightsaber while turning it on."
FUCK YOU!
We're cute and cuddly, and we hump pillars. I refer you to my Avatar.
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First Blood 85 Priest 80 Mage 85 Paladin 83 Druid 80 DK 85 Huntard 85 Shaman
"Tardo Wan" sounds like a Jedi that required 436 years to train and then killed himself by looking into his lightsaber while turning it on."
Sorry, just a little class envy going on there.
you are good to bore your healer to death.
And holy shit. Dire Cat form in the expansion!!!