I'll bother to find you some numbers when you bother to back up your statements that it is wrong for a company to look out for their bottom line.
I never said it was.
I said that "oh hey we're looking out for our bottom line over here" is not a catch-all excuse for any and all business practices a company may engage in. But that's apparently what you think and I really don't know what to say to that.
Oh, I see. The fact that they are successful is proof that all their practices are held in high-esteem by all customers? Are you really this stupid?
You're not good at business OR economics.
Assuming consumer incompitance is an awful mistake. Just because people don't mind shopping at a store you shop at doesn't mean that "they don't know what's good for them", it means that they ahave a different opinion from you.
You're not good at logic, business, economics, or ethics. Or common sense. Or reading. Because I never said "consumer incompetence" or even implied. I am suggesting that people occasionally or even often begrudgingly do business with businesses that they dislike or partially dislike or dislike a particular practice of.
You've never done business with someone you'd rather not have?
"not like" is different from "am being hurt by"
and yes, you earlier stated that consumers who don't mind buying gutted games are idiots.
Frankly, factories seals do not actually mean to everyone what they mean to you.
Plenty of products come with factory seals that are removed by the retailer, rather than the end user. Cars, in fact, often come to the dealer with a kind of petroleum seal wrapped around them, which the dealer then removes before putting them out on the lot.
I don't think that EB can be eliminated, as it is profitable at what it does(ie: selling used games). However, there are still a number of alternatives to use, like online video game stores, and perhaps at some point, another company will fill the niche of selling new games exclusively that EB does not address. It's not a perfect solution, but the free market is not a perfect thing.
Evander: Djiem makes a good point. Outsourcing to Bangalore. The company I used to work for oursourced one of its key functions to Bangalore, the one that essentially delivered data to our clients. It was...rough. Clients hated it. We lost some. Others begrudgingly stuck with us. The company certainly increased their profit as a result. Outsourcing has that effect.
In your opinion, the fact that their profits increased washes away any other effects the decision to outsource may have had, including client annoyance and employee annoyance, right? Because a company's ultimate duty is to their bottom line? Nothing else matters?
I'm just trying to get a feel for the scope of your economic and business concept here.
Actually, my opinion has to do with the overall economic ramifications of a thing, not just a company's bottom line, although it sure is fun to play with straw men.
On the topic of outsourcing, I am infavor of it, overall, because it spreads the wealth, globally. It is unfortunate that individuals lost their jobs in these instances, and I think that companies choosing to outsource should be required to make some sort of compensation to those who are being laid-off, but the global benefits, in both near-term and long-term, that come from outsourcing outweigh the immediate negatives.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
Do you go into every thread and tell people to stop talking about the thread's subject?
If the subject is stupid, yes.
Don't like EB's practices? Don't shop there. There's probably a Best Buy next door, go there instead. Problem solved.
Who are you to decide what threads are allowed to exist? The same way we shouldn't buy at EB if we hate EB, don't post here if you hate here.
uh, I'm not saying this thread isn't allowed to exist. I'm offering my opinion on the matter, which is that gutting is not a big deal and the people bitching about it should just shop somewhere else if they really care that much. Then they would get their pristine shrinkwrapped games and they could complain about something else.
On the topic of outsourcing, I am infavor of it, overall, because it spreads the wealth, globally. It is unfortunate that individuals lost their jobs in these instances, and I think that companies choosing to outsource should be required to make some sort of compensation to those who are being laid-off, but the global benefits, in both near-term and long-term, that come from outsourcing outweigh the immediate negatives.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
The problem is that the quality of the service is incredibly deteriorated, and you know that.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I gave up on EB when I went in to pick up a copy of Tomb Raider: Legend a month back. The only copy they had on XBOX was clearly pre-owned, still going for $100.
To all you people in the US whining about prices, games cost DOUBLE over here. Our exchange rate is comparable with yours, but our games come late and cost double.
So anyway, I go over to the desk and point out that the game is going for $100, is almost two years old and preowned, and TR:Anniversary is going for $60 on the other side of the store.
He says: "Dude, it's a really rare game. It's worth that much."
Me: "Rare?"
"Yeah, it's a really rare game. It was a limited release."
So I walked out. Fuck that. I don't take being lied to.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I...am flabbergasted, really.
Drez, not to be rude, but just how much experience do you have in the area of globalization and economics?
Because I am handing you fully formed and thought out personal opinions, based on some level of interest, study, and professional experience, and your response is just "wow, that is incredibly wrong." with no actual statement as to what is right.
It is the response that would only either come from some one who knows nothing on the subject, or some one who knows everything (provided that I am absolutely wrong), and I'm pretty damn sure I'm not absolutely wrong.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I...am flabbergasted, really.
Drez, not to be rude, but just how much experience do you have in the area of globalization and economics?
Because I am handing you fully formed and thought out personal opinions, based on some level of interest, study, and professional experience, and your response is just "wow, that is incredibly wrong." with no actual statement as to what is right.
It is the response that would only either come from some one who knows nothing on the subject, or some one who knows everything (provided that I am absolutely wrong), and I'm pretty damn sure I'm not absolutely wrong.
A lot. I almost went to Bangalore to train people. I get the impression that you've read a lot of textbook-style opinion on this. I don't mean any offense, but I know exactly what I'm talking about in this regard. I've seen the ramifications of outsourcing. And to call outsourcing "globalization" is laughable. If outsourcing is apples, then globalization is oranges.
Anyway, I've been in the thick of it. Economics, globalization of an entity, outsourcing. All of it, for years. And I also worked at EB and have been shopping there ever since we had an Amiga 500, so I know a lot about them too. Anyway, I'm really done talking about any of this with you. Sorry. I just don't have the strength anymore.
Drez on
Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
0
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
edited November 2007
This thread is about EB gutting games, not outsourcing. The fuck is wrong with you guys?
I have no problem with a thread bitching about policies you don't like, I have never really run into being sold a gutted game but I can definitely understand the frustration. I find it funny how many people seem to be on a personal crusade to see EB burned and piss on its ashes. You seem to act as if Gamestop killed your mother and is a sin upon corporate America whose sole purpose is raping your churches and burning your women.
I have no problem with a thread bitching about policies you don't like, I have never really run into being sold a gutted game but I can definitely understand the frustration. I find it funny how many people seem to be on a personal crusade to see EB burned and piss on its ashes. You seem to act as if Gamestop killed your mother and is a sin upon corporate America whose sole purpose is raping your churches and burning your women.
To be fair, I'd rather see the Japan system implemented here than the EB system. Seeing EB prosper is like seeing the bad guy win. You don't want people to think: "Man, that technique is successful, I should emulate it", you want stores being run in a customer-friendly fashion.
Just to be clear, Evander, a lot of people say "olol outsourcing makes people in the US lose jobs." I mean, that's the popular soundbyte you hear from people against it. I'm not exaggerating when I say that that is the tip of the iceberg. That IS a gigantic problem, sure, but there are so many other problems with outsourcing usually stemming from how it's implimented and which functions are outsourced (because it's not merely "tech support" anymore; many major corporations are outsourcing just about every core function and division outside of sales to India). There are very, very big problems with outsourcing in a general and also on a case-by-case basis and unemployment is only one of them.
I have no problem with a thread bitching about policies you don't like, I have never really run into being sold a gutted game but I can definitely understand the frustration. I find it funny how many people seem to be on a personal crusade to see EB burned and piss on its ashes. You seem to act as if Gamestop killed your mother and is a sin upon corporate America whose sole purpose is raping your churches and burning your women.
Yes, that's a good way of putting it. I actually do hate the company to that degree.
Drez on
Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
0
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
This thread is about EB gutting games, not outsourcing. The fuck is wrong with you guys?
EB likes to outsource the guts from their boxes.
You and your words.
Quick note: Evander said something back there about consumers not caring about gutted games. If that was true, this thread wouldn't exist. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in that he meant 'most consumers' don't care about gutted games. This may be true, but I promise you that when people start to see a frequency in scratched discs or manuals / other documentation that's severely fucked with, they'll slowly build it up.
I would like to know what the exact policy is on why games are gutted.
This thread is about EB gutting games, not outsourcing. The fuck is wrong with you guys?
EB likes to outsource the guts from their boxes.
You and your words.
Quick note: Evander said something back there about consumers not caring about gutted games. If that was true, this thread wouldn't exist. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in that he meant 'most consumers' don't care about gutted games. This may be true, but I promise you that when people start to see a frequency in scratched discs or manuals / other documentation that's severely fucked with, they'll slowly build it up.
I would like to know what the exact policy is on why games are gutted.
Only a "fraction of a percent" care, apparently. All 12 of us are in this thread, I guess.
I mean, I don't know if there's an official policy, but I was working at EB right when we stopped getting display cases and the reason given was "it's cheaper to gut the games." That's the "unofficial" reason, but I'm sure that's also the real reason.
This thread is about EB gutting games, not outsourcing. The fuck is wrong with you guys?
EB likes to outsource the guts from their boxes.
You and your words.
Quick note: Evander said something back there about consumers not caring about gutted games. If that was true, this thread wouldn't exist. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in that he meant 'most consumers' don't care about gutted games. This may be true, but I promise you that when people start to see a frequency in scratched discs or manuals / other documentation that's severely fucked with, they'll slowly build it up.
I would like to know what the exact policy is on why games are gutted.
I'll guarantee that even "non-hardcore-gamers" will be pissed when they see the guy stop playing the game he's playing and put it in the disc as described earlier in the thread.
Djiem on
0
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
This thread is about EB gutting games, not outsourcing. The fuck is wrong with you guys?
EB likes to outsource the guts from their boxes.
You and your words.
Quick note: Evander said something back there about consumers not caring about gutted games. If that was true, this thread wouldn't exist. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in that he meant 'most consumers' don't care about gutted games. This may be true, but I promise you that when people start to see a frequency in scratched discs or manuals / other documentation that's severely fucked with, they'll slowly build it up.
I would like to know what the exact policy is on why games are gutted.
I'll guarantee that even "non-hardcore-gamers" will be pissed when they see the guy stop playing the game he's playing and put it in the disc as described earlier in the thread.
Can you pull that up? I'm juggling tasks at the moment.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I...am flabbergasted, really.
Drez, not to be rude, but just how much experience do you have in the area of globalization and economics?
Because I am handing you fully formed and thought out personal opinions, based on some level of interest, study, and professional experience, and your response is just "wow, that is incredibly wrong." with no actual statement as to what is right.
It is the response that would only either come from some one who knows nothing on the subject, or some one who knows everything (provided that I am absolutely wrong), and I'm pretty damn sure I'm not absolutely wrong.
A lot. I almost went to Bangalore to train people. I get the impression that you've read a lot of textbook-style opinion on this. I don't mean any offense, but I know exactly what I'm talking about in this regard. I've seen the ramifications of outsourcing. And to call outsourcing "globalization" is laughable. If outsourcing is apples, then globalization is oranges.
Anyway, I've been in the thick of it. Economics, globalization of an entity, outsourcing. All of it, for years. And I also worked at EB and have been shopping there ever since we had an Amiga 500, so I know a lot about them too. Anyway, I'm really done talking about any of this with you. Sorry. I just don't have the strength anymore.
The strength to do what? You've just been declaring me wrong and making me jump through hoops to get any sort of explanation out of you.
And "outsourcing" is, honestly, nothing but subcontracting a function that you've previously done internally. When you outsource to India, that IS globalization. That is not all that there is to it, but that
The outsourcing behaviors of your particular firm may not have been proper, I don't know. The concept, in and of itself, is one with more bad than good, as long as there are checks in place to prevent people from getting hurt.
And, finally, you may have worked at EB in the past, but there IS NO EB anymore, so even if you saw some secret memo back then, it's gone. New management. New company.
Your attitude, Drez, seems to be that the interests of people ALWAYS come before the interests of a company, even on the individual level. I'm not saying that you are wrong for thinking this, but A) it is not how our society works (meaning that your issue isn't with GameStop, it's with Society as a whole) and it does tend to ignore that companies themselves are made up of people.
This thread is about EB gutting games, not outsourcing. The fuck is wrong with you guys?
EB likes to outsource the guts from their boxes.
You and your words.
Quick note: Evander said something back there about consumers not caring about gutted games. If that was true, this thread wouldn't exist. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in that he meant 'most consumers' don't care about gutted games. This may be true, but I promise you that when people start to see a frequency in scratched discs or manuals / other documentation that's severely fucked with, they'll slowly build it up.
I would like to know what the exact policy is on why games are gutted.
I did mean most. I said in other posts that some people are bothered, and that's perfectly fine. Personally, I rarely buy gutted games.
As for gutted games being damaged, that is a SEPERATE issue. It is within EB protocal that a damaged game should not be sold as new, and anyone who makes the decision to do that is breaking company rules. They are suposed to either defect it out, transfer it to used, or sell it at a shop-worn discount
Blow the whistle if you see this being done, for the good of yourself and other consumers. Stores shouldn't get away with knowingly selling damaged product.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I...am flabbergasted, really.
Drez, not to be rude, but just how much experience do you have in the area of globalization and economics?
Because I am handing you fully formed and thought out personal opinions, based on some level of interest, study, and professional experience, and your response is just "wow, that is incredibly wrong." with no actual statement as to what is right.
It is the response that would only either come from some one who knows nothing on the subject, or some one who knows everything (provided that I am absolutely wrong), and I'm pretty damn sure I'm not absolutely wrong.
A lot. I almost went to Bangalore to train people. I get the impression that you've read a lot of textbook-style opinion on this. I don't mean any offense, but I know exactly what I'm talking about in this regard. I've seen the ramifications of outsourcing. And to call outsourcing "globalization" is laughable. If outsourcing is apples, then globalization is oranges.
Anyway, I've been in the thick of it. Economics, globalization of an entity, outsourcing. All of it, for years. And I also worked at EB and have been shopping there ever since we had an Amiga 500, so I know a lot about them too. Anyway, I'm really done talking about any of this with you. Sorry. I just don't have the strength anymore.
The strength to do what? You've just been declaring me wrong and making me jump through hoops to get any sort of explanation out of you.
And "outsourcing" is, honestly, nothing but subcontracting a function that you've previously done internally. When you outsource to India, that IS globalization. That is not all that there is to it, but that
The outsourcing behaviors of your particular firm may not have been proper, I don't know. The concept, in and of itself, is one with more bad than good, as long as there are checks in place to prevent people from getting hurt.
And, finally, you may have worked at EB in the past, but there IS NO EB anymore, so even if you saw some secret memo back then, it's gone. New management. New company.
Your attitude, Drez, seems to be that the interests of people ALWAYS come before the interests of a company, even on the individual level. I'm not saying that you are wrong for thinking this, but A) it is not how our society works (meaning that your issue isn't with GameStop, it's with Society as a whole) and it does tend to ignore that companies themselves are made up of people.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I...am flabbergasted, really.
Drez, not to be rude, but just how much experience do you have in the area of globalization and economics?
Because I am handing you fully formed and thought out personal opinions, based on some level of interest, study, and professional experience, and your response is just "wow, that is incredibly wrong." with no actual statement as to what is right.
It is the response that would only either come from some one who knows nothing on the subject, or some one who knows everything (provided that I am absolutely wrong), and I'm pretty damn sure I'm not absolutely wrong.
A lot. I almost went to Bangalore to train people. I get the impression that you've read a lot of textbook-style opinion on this. I don't mean any offense, but I know exactly what I'm talking about in this regard. I've seen the ramifications of outsourcing. And to call outsourcing "globalization" is laughable. If outsourcing is apples, then globalization is oranges.
Anyway, I've been in the thick of it. Economics, globalization of an entity, outsourcing. All of it, for years. And I also worked at EB and have been shopping there ever since we had an Amiga 500, so I know a lot about them too. Anyway, I'm really done talking about any of this with you. Sorry. I just don't have the strength anymore.
The strength to do what? You've just been declaring me wrong and making me jump through hoops to get any sort of explanation out of you.
And "outsourcing" is, honestly, nothing but subcontracting a function that you've previously done internally. When you outsource to India, that IS globalization. That is not all that there is to it, but that
The outsourcing behaviors of your particular firm may not have been proper, I don't know. The concept, in and of itself, is one with more bad than good, as long as there are checks in place to prevent people from getting hurt.
And, finally, you may have worked at EB in the past, but there IS NO EB anymore, so even if you saw some secret memo back then, it's gone. New management. New company.
Your attitude, Drez, seems to be that the interests of people ALWAYS come before the interests of a company, even on the individual level. I'm not saying that you are wrong for thinking this, but A) it is not how our society works (meaning that your issue isn't with GameStop, it's with Society as a whole) and it does tend to ignore that companies themselves are made up of people.
There's a fine line between raping the customer and not making money. To me, EB/GS crosses that line and goes way way into the "raping the customer" territory. Not all of them, mind you, since, as I've said, mine is doing pretty good. I just don't approve of their business model. At all.
Gutting also leads to other foul play. I know a guy who works at Gamestop who would get the serial numbers from games (like the Orange Box.). Not just one either, but multiples of the same games then he would just illegally download it on a torrent. The worse part would be that they would sell all the games he stole the serial numbers from to customers.
Did they fire him? Oh no, they never caught him, and he's the fucking manager now.
It's complete and utter bullshit. You know what buying a new game means to me? Breaking the seal. If you don't have a sealed game, fuck you, put it back, I don;t want it. And put back the other 5 sealed games you DO have, because I'm going to a store where I can get all 6 games sealed. And guess what? I'm going to go straight home after that, eat a taco, scratch my left elbow, and then post on my favorite internet forum about your bullshit. I'm going to wade through trash posts by idiot internet know it alls pretending to know stuff about economics, and I'm going to express my opinion. I'm going to ignore the morons telling me "So what just don't shop there and shut up, speak with your wallet, blah blah blah," and I'm going to post here and tell everyone about how a retailer tried to fuck a consumer. And other people, who may have been unaware or nonchalant about said fucking, will quite possibly be turned off from said retailer.
So you see, going to a different store is not the only way a customer exercises their power. Because if you really are such fucking business professors with PhD's in arrogance, you would know how much business can be lost due to the negative word of mouth generated by an unsatisfied customer.
So really, does gutting bother you? If it does, and you heard EB does it from me, you might say "fuck EB." If you are unsure, you might see how pissed I am and go, "fuck EB." And if it doesn't, you may not care. OR, you may come into a thread like this pretending to be some kind of genius telling people that they should shut up about it and just shop elsewhere. But seriously, screw that. I'm going to shop elsewhere AND bitch like a motherfucker.
MaverikV on
I'm a firm believer in the philosophy of a ruling class. Especially since I rule.
I miss Japan. The games were inexpensive, you could find a store just by visually scanning the area (no matter where you were), they had new releases in stock, they had Wiis, and the pre-order system there isn't pushed down your throat*, and since I don't speak Japanese I had no clue what the guys were saying. I guess it's impossible for that kind of store to exist, since they're obviously not making any money whatsoever, right? Tssk.
There's an irony here in that the U.S's used market has nothing on Japan's :P
Just to be clear, Evander, a lot of people say "olol outsourcing makes people in the US lose jobs." I mean, that's the popular soundbyte you hear from people against it. I'm not exaggerating when I say that that is the tip of the iceberg. That IS a gigantic problem, sure, but there are so many other problems with outsourcing usually stemming from how it's implimented and which functions are outsourced (because it's not merely "tech support" anymore; many major corporations are outsourcing just about every core function and division outside of sales to India). There are very, very big problems with outsourcing in a general and also on a case-by-case basis and unemployment is only one of them.
Wait, are you saying that we should step in with preventative measures against problems that only "might" occur, rather than ltting them work themselves out (which the market always does. Already you see companies who adverttise as not outsourcing, and seeing a return from it)?
I bet you were in favor of the war in Iraq too, no?
(seriously, Iraq is just about as relevant to outsourcing as outsourcing is to gutting.)
All I can say is, I'm happy I don't work at EB any more. It's given me a distaste for working in retail . Whenever I bought something I'd just get a fresh copy from the back anyway, haha. I would always do the same for customers if we had a non gutted copy.
The ironic thing is, gutting games is usually done because of the excuse of security, but we had half a drawer of discs stolen once because we didn't lock them... Then we did start locking them, and it was always a pain when there weren't enough keys to go around, or when one of the drawers fell off its rollers, or the endless shuffling of discs when more room was needed, or retarded coworkers who put pre-owned guts in new, or Xbox in the PS2 drawer.
Overall, I can't say I... appreciated the system. New releases were so much easier. Big cabineted stack behind the counter, all you had to do was grab a new copy, and bam, sell it.
So you see, going to a different store is not the only way a customer exercises their power. Because if you really are such fucking business professors with PhD's in arrogance, you would know how much business can be lost due to the negative word of mouth generated by an unsatisfied customer.
Fucking bingo. My agenda is to let as many people as I can know about this company's terrible practices.
I miss Japan. The games were inexpensive, you could find a store just by visually scanning the area (no matter where you were), they had new releases in stock, they had Wiis, and the pre-order system there isn't pushed down your throat*, and since I don't speak Japanese I had no clue what the guys were saying. I guess it's impossible for that kind of store to exist, since they're obviously not making any money whatsoever, right? Tssk.
There's an irony here in that the U.S's used market has nothing on Japan's :P
Man, tell me about it. There was this store called "RetroGames" or something, where I bought a bunch of Famicom/Super Famicom games for peanuts. It was insane. But their prices on used "new" games weren't as high as in the US. The difference between new and used was really big, sometimes almost half the cost even though the game was still in near perfect condition. I don't know how much they offer for trade-ins, though.
And as for gutting leading to bad things, from my time working in a retail store, I can tell you that, if I wanted to, I had access to being able to open up the sealed games, copy down codes, and then reseal them. I NEVER did this, nor did I ever even have the urge to, but I had plenty of access and oportunity.
Gutting games doesn' lead to shady practices. Hiring shady people does.
So you see, going to a different store is not the only way a customer exercises their power. Because if you really are such fucking business professors with PhD's in arrogance, you would know how much business can be lost due to the negative word of mouth generated by an unsatisfied customer.
Fucking bingo. My agenda is to let as many people as I can know about this company's terrible practices.
How is gutting raping the customer? Hiring shady people does.
Are you talking to yourself? :P
Evander has one point, though, guys. I am part of the problem in a way, because I didn't call EB's headquarters to rip them a new one when they raped me with their lies and shitty, useless extended warranty. The problem is that I didn't want to get the employees in troubles. I want these corporate motherfuckers to burn in hell, but not the poor bastards they torture in their pawn shop outlets.
Djiem on
0
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
All I can say is, I'm happy I don't work at EB any more. It's given me a distaste for working in retail . Whenever I bought something I'd just get a fresh copy from the back anyway, haha. I would always do the same for customers if we had a non gutted copy.
The ironic thing is, gutting games is usually done because of the excuse of security, but we had half a drawer of discs stolen once because we didn't lock them... Then we did start locking them, and it was always a pain when there weren't enough keys to go around, or when one of the drawers fell off its rollers, or the endless shuffling of discs when more room was needed, or retarded coworkers who put pre-owned guts in new, or Xbox in the PS2 drawer.
Overall, I can't say I... appreciated the system. New releases were so much easier. Big cabineted stack behind the counter, all you had to do was grab a new copy, and bam, sell it.
See, security being their reason is noble and all, but there's practical methods of it out there already. Locked cases where games are displayed. Have empty cases out in the store for people to pick up and read.
And as for gutting leading to bad things, from my time working in a retail store, I can tell you that, if I wanted to, I had access to being able to open up the sealed games, copy down codes, and then reseal them. I NEVER did this, nor did I ever even have the urge to, but I had plenty of access and oportunity.
Gutting games doesn' lead to shady practices. Hiring shady people does.
Offering employees that you have no way of morally assessing at time of hire easy methods of doing shady things leads to shady practices.
So you see, going to a different store is not the only way a customer exercises their power. Because if you really are such fucking business professors with PhD's in arrogance, you would know how much business can be lost due to the negative word of mouth generated by an unsatisfied customer.
Fucking bingo. My agenda is to let as many people as I can know about this company's terrible practices.
Have you ever bothered to call them and complain?
What's that going to do?
"Hey, you guys suck!"
That's going to do nothing. Decreasing their revenue by convincing other customers that they are a bad place to shop at is within our power, though...somewhat anyway.
Drez on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
So you see, going to a different store is not the only way a customer exercises their power. Because if you really are such fucking business professors with PhD's in arrogance, you would know how much business can be lost due to the negative word of mouth generated by an unsatisfied customer.
Fucking bingo. My agenda is to let as many people as I can know about this company's terrible practices.
Have you ever bothered to call them and complain?
"You guys need to stop removing games from the boxes and just store them in the back or behind the counter."
"You guys need to stop informing me of a release date that will always turn into a 'it's the shipping date' explaination and your competition has those games in stock already."
"You guys need to stop suggesting games in place of others, and at least suggest the game along with others."
I've complained to a store before. It ain't going to do much on my own. Telling other people about these problems is the best way.
And as for gutting leading to bad things, from my time working in a retail store, I can tell you that, if I wanted to, I had access to being able to open up the sealed games, copy down codes, and then reseal them. I NEVER did this, nor did I ever even have the urge to, but I had plenty of access and oportunity.
Gutting games doesn' lead to shady practices. Hiring shady people does.
Offering employees that you have no way of morally assessing at time of hire easy methods of doing shady things leads to shady practices.
New hires shouldn't be working without some one else on the job to keep a strict eye on their behavior.
And you should at least make an attempt at a moral assessment during the hiring process.
Seriously, you don't just pull a dude of the street, and give him access to thousands worth of dollars of merchandise.
Posts
"not like" is different from "am being hurt by"
and yes, you earlier stated that consumers who don't mind buying gutted games are idiots.
Frankly, factories seals do not actually mean to everyone what they mean to you.
Plenty of products come with factory seals that are removed by the retailer, rather than the end user. Cars, in fact, often come to the dealer with a kind of petroleum seal wrapped around them, which the dealer then removes before putting them out on the lot.
Actually, my opinion has to do with the overall economic ramifications of a thing, not just a company's bottom line, although it sure is fun to play with straw men.
On the topic of outsourcing, I am infavor of it, overall, because it spreads the wealth, globally. It is unfortunate that individuals lost their jobs in these instances, and I think that companies choosing to outsource should be required to make some sort of compensation to those who are being laid-off, but the global benefits, in both near-term and long-term, that come from outsourcing outweigh the immediate negatives.
Or do you think that people in third world countries should be penalized for not being born in the united states? If they are willing to do a job for less money (provided it is a living wage) but just happen to have been born in the wrong geographical spot, do you think they should be punished?
The problem is that the quality of the service is incredibly deteriorated, and you know that.
Wow. This officially ends me ever discussing economics with you, right after I respond to the following:
This paragraph hints at an astounding level of ignorance, all the way from "living wage" down to the notion that people are "punished" if they are born in India and/or because they can't work for United States companies while still living in India.
I...am flabbergasted, really.
To all you people in the US whining about prices, games cost DOUBLE over here. Our exchange rate is comparable with yours, but our games come late and cost double.
So anyway, I go over to the desk and point out that the game is going for $100, is almost two years old and preowned, and TR:Anniversary is going for $60 on the other side of the store.
He says: "Dude, it's a really rare game. It's worth that much."
Me: "Rare?"
"Yeah, it's a really rare game. It was a limited release."
So I walked out. Fuck that. I don't take being lied to.
Drez, not to be rude, but just how much experience do you have in the area of globalization and economics?
Because I am handing you fully formed and thought out personal opinions, based on some level of interest, study, and professional experience, and your response is just "wow, that is incredibly wrong." with no actual statement as to what is right.
It is the response that would only either come from some one who knows nothing on the subject, or some one who knows everything (provided that I am absolutely wrong), and I'm pretty damn sure I'm not absolutely wrong.
A lot. I almost went to Bangalore to train people. I get the impression that you've read a lot of textbook-style opinion on this. I don't mean any offense, but I know exactly what I'm talking about in this regard. I've seen the ramifications of outsourcing. And to call outsourcing "globalization" is laughable. If outsourcing is apples, then globalization is oranges.
Anyway, I've been in the thick of it. Economics, globalization of an entity, outsourcing. All of it, for years. And I also worked at EB and have been shopping there ever since we had an Amiga 500, so I know a lot about them too. Anyway, I'm really done talking about any of this with you. Sorry. I just don't have the strength anymore.
EB likes to outsource the guts from their boxes.
To be fair, I'd rather see the Japan system implemented here than the EB system. Seeing EB prosper is like seeing the bad guy win. You don't want people to think: "Man, that technique is successful, I should emulate it", you want stores being run in a customer-friendly fashion.
Yes, that's a good way of putting it. I actually do hate the company to that degree.
You and your words.
Quick note: Evander said something back there about consumers not caring about gutted games. If that was true, this thread wouldn't exist. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in that he meant 'most consumers' don't care about gutted games. This may be true, but I promise you that when people start to see a frequency in scratched discs or manuals / other documentation that's severely fucked with, they'll slowly build it up.
I would like to know what the exact policy is on why games are gutted.
Only a "fraction of a percent" care, apparently. All 12 of us are in this thread, I guess.
I mean, I don't know if there's an official policy, but I was working at EB right when we stopped getting display cases and the reason given was "it's cheaper to gut the games." That's the "unofficial" reason, but I'm sure that's also the real reason.
I'll guarantee that even "non-hardcore-gamers" will be pissed when they see the guy stop playing the game he's playing and put it in the disc as described earlier in the thread.
Can you pull that up? I'm juggling tasks at the moment.
The strength to do what? You've just been declaring me wrong and making me jump through hoops to get any sort of explanation out of you.
And "outsourcing" is, honestly, nothing but subcontracting a function that you've previously done internally. When you outsource to India, that IS globalization. That is not all that there is to it, but that
The outsourcing behaviors of your particular firm may not have been proper, I don't know. The concept, in and of itself, is one with more bad than good, as long as there are checks in place to prevent people from getting hurt.
And, finally, you may have worked at EB in the past, but there IS NO EB anymore, so even if you saw some secret memo back then, it's gone. New management. New company.
Your attitude, Drez, seems to be that the interests of people ALWAYS come before the interests of a company, even on the individual level. I'm not saying that you are wrong for thinking this, but A) it is not how our society works (meaning that your issue isn't with GameStop, it's with Society as a whole) and
I did mean most. I said in other posts that some people are bothered, and that's perfectly fine. Personally, I rarely buy gutted games.
As for gutted games being damaged, that is a SEPERATE issue. It is within EB protocal that a damaged game should not be sold as new, and anyone who makes the decision to do that is breaking company rules. They are suposed to either defect it out, transfer it to used, or sell it at a shop-worn discount
Blow the whistle if you see this being done, for the good of yourself and other consumers. Stores shouldn't get away with knowingly selling damaged product.
You
Need
To
Stop
Doing
This.
There's a fine line between raping the customer and not making money. To me, EB/GS crosses that line and goes way way into the "raping the customer" territory. Not all of them, mind you, since, as I've said, mine is doing pretty good. I just don't approve of their business model. At all.
Did they fire him? Oh no, they never caught him, and he's the fucking manager now.
It's complete and utter bullshit. You know what buying a new game means to me? Breaking the seal. If you don't have a sealed game, fuck you, put it back, I don;t want it. And put back the other 5 sealed games you DO have, because I'm going to a store where I can get all 6 games sealed. And guess what? I'm going to go straight home after that, eat a taco, scratch my left elbow, and then post on my favorite internet forum about your bullshit. I'm going to wade through trash posts by idiot internet know it alls pretending to know stuff about economics, and I'm going to express my opinion. I'm going to ignore the morons telling me "So what just don't shop there and shut up, speak with your wallet, blah blah blah," and I'm going to post here and tell everyone about how a retailer tried to fuck a consumer. And other people, who may have been unaware or nonchalant about said fucking, will quite possibly be turned off from said retailer.
So you see, going to a different store is not the only way a customer exercises their power. Because if you really are such fucking business professors with PhD's in arrogance, you would know how much business can be lost due to the negative word of mouth generated by an unsatisfied customer.
So really, does gutting bother you? If it does, and you heard EB does it from me, you might say "fuck EB." If you are unsure, you might see how pissed I am and go, "fuck EB." And if it doesn't, you may not care. OR, you may come into a thread like this pretending to be some kind of genius telling people that they should shut up about it and just shop elsewhere. But seriously, screw that. I'm going to shop elsewhere AND bitch like a motherfucker.
There's an irony here in that the U.S's used market has nothing on Japan's :P
Wait, are you saying that we should step in with preventative measures against problems that only "might" occur, rather than ltting them work themselves out (which the market always does. Already you see companies who adverttise as not outsourcing, and seeing a return from it)?
I bet you were in favor of the war in Iraq too, no?
(seriously, Iraq is just about as relevant to outsourcing as outsourcing is to gutting.)
The ironic thing is, gutting games is usually done because of the excuse of security, but we had half a drawer of discs stolen once because we didn't lock them... Then we did start locking them, and it was always a pain when there weren't enough keys to go around, or when one of the drawers fell off its rollers, or the endless shuffling of discs when more room was needed, or retarded coworkers who put pre-owned guts in new, or Xbox in the PS2 drawer.
Overall, I can't say I... appreciated the system. New releases were so much easier. Big cabineted stack behind the counter, all you had to do was grab a new copy, and bam, sell it.
And this, my friends, is the true meaning of freedom.
Steam | Twitter
Fucking bingo. My agenda is to let as many people as I can know about this company's terrible practices.
Man, tell me about it. There was this store called "RetroGames" or something, where I bought a bunch of Famicom/Super Famicom games for peanuts. It was insane. But their prices on used "new" games weren't as high as in the US. The difference between new and used was really big, sometimes almost half the cost even though the game was still in near perfect condition. I don't know how much they offer for trade-ins, though.
And as for gutting leading to bad things, from my time working in a retail store, I can tell you that, if I wanted to, I had access to being able to open up the sealed games, copy down codes, and then reseal them. I NEVER did this, nor did I ever even have the urge to, but I had plenty of access and oportunity.
Gutting games doesn' lead to shady practices. Hiring shady people does.
Have you ever bothered to call them and complain?
Are you talking to yourself? :P
Evander has one point, though, guys. I am part of the problem in a way, because I didn't call EB's headquarters to rip them a new one when they raped me with their lies and shitty, useless extended warranty. The problem is that I didn't want to get the employees in troubles. I want these corporate motherfuckers to burn in hell, but not the poor bastards they torture in their pawn shop outlets.
See, security being their reason is noble and all, but there's practical methods of it out there already. Locked cases where games are displayed. Have empty cases out in the store for people to pick up and read.
Offering employees that you have no way of morally assessing at time of hire easy methods of doing shady things leads to shady practices.
What's that going to do?
"Hey, you guys suck!"
That's going to do nothing. Decreasing their revenue by convincing other customers that they are a bad place to shop at is within our power, though...somewhat anyway.
"You guys need to stop removing games from the boxes and just store them in the back or behind the counter."
"You guys need to stop informing me of a release date that will always turn into a 'it's the shipping date' explaination and your competition has those games in stock already."
"You guys need to stop suggesting games in place of others, and at least suggest the game along with others."
I've complained to a store before. It ain't going to do much on my own. Telling other people about these problems is the best way.
New hires shouldn't be working without some one else on the job to keep a strict eye on their behavior.
And you should at least make an attempt at a moral assessment during the hiring process.
Seriously, you don't just pull a dude of the street, and give him access to thousands worth of dollars of merchandise.