So, uh, I'm kind of hitting a wall on leveling my pally from 67 to 70. Any suggestions as to where I should level, and how? I'm holy spec now. Should I cave and start prot-grinding, grind through instances constantly, or just adust my spec and gear a little and keep to questing? I only ask because I'm so close to 70, I'm hoping there has to be some kind of way for me to speed things up a bit (this is my first high-level toon, I don't know outland that well, etc.). Armory link is here http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Anvilmar&n=Kaidence
Well, caving, in terms of a different spec, would best be done with Ret I think. Other pallies have said that Outland mobs have too much health, and there are so many casters, that prot isn't as good as ret.
Would I be a bad person if I admitted that I feel like making a Ret Pally alt, even though I already have a 70 Prot Pally and just don't feel like respeccing all the time?
Give me your Protadin so I don't have to level one. :P
I keep hearing mixed things about the Protadin's ability to level solo, from it being really easy to AOE grind to it being a lot less awesome than expected for questing, etc. I want the truth!
Also, is Holy healing as boring as I've heard? Basically relying on just a few heals sounds pretty dull to me, but I've never played the class.
Whiniest Man On Earth on
0
reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
edited December 2007
Well, if you're gonna make a Ret Pally alt, you have to eventually complete the circle and make a Holy Pally alt aswell.
Are you sure that's what you want? Are you?
Or maybe that just applies to me because I'm strange like that. I had to abandon the idea of leveling a new druid to be feral so my current druid could stay resto because I realized that I would absolutely have to level a third druid to be balance and that's just too much druid leveling, so I just let it go.
Also, is Holy healing as boring as I've heard? Basically relying on just a few heals sounds pretty dull to me, but I've never played the class.
Yes, it really is that boring. Basically you'll just be spamming Flash of Light with the few exceptions when the tank takes crazy damage and you have to throw out one Holy Light.
Give me your Protadin so I don't have to level one. :P
I keep hearing mixed things about the Protadin's ability to level solo, from it being really easy to AOE grind to it being a lot less awesome than expected for questing, etc. I want the truth!
Also, is Holy healing as boring as I've heard? Basically relying on just a few heals sounds pretty dull to me, but I've never played the class.
Protadin's are retardedly easy to solo with; some things just take longer than most.
There's been several group/elite quests that I've just gone ahead and done myself. And "Kill X of Y creature" quests are a joke with AoE grinding.
But don't kid yourself about any damage you'll be doing.
Protadin's are retardedly easy to solo with; some things just take longer than most.
There's been several group/elite quests that I've just gone ahead and done myself. And "Kill X of Y creature" quests are a joke with AoE grinding.
But don't kid yourself about any damage you'll be doing.
But for this, I've been a bit unimpressed, compared to how it's portrayed. I just now got holy shield, and while it's a big increase in killing speed, it sucks up my mana terribly quickly. Maybe my gear sucks, maybe I'm not getting the right combination of judgements and seals going.
Protadin's are retardedly easy to solo with; some things just take longer than most.
There's been several group/elite quests that I've just gone ahead and done myself. And "Kill X of Y creature" quests are a joke with AoE grinding.
But don't kid yourself about any damage you'll be doing.
But for this, I've been a bit unimpressed, compared to how it's portrayed. I just now got holy shield, and while it's a big increase in killing speed, it sucks up my mana terribly quickly. Maybe my gear sucks, maybe I'm not getting the right combination of judgements and seals going.
Well it depends. Sometimes, with three mobs, I'll start by judging wisdom on one and then using righteousness, but then I'll kill it so quickly with holy shield that I won't even make back my mana cost to cast and judge that wisdom. Or I'll just judge crusader and use righteousness, but then I'm losing too much mana.
I might try judging light and using wisdom, and let my ret aura and holy shield do the killing and use my seals to regain health and mana.
I might try judging light and using wisdom, and let my ret aura and holy shield do the killing and use my seals to regain health and mana.
Ding ding ding.
You were doing it wrong. Are you also lacking a shield spike?
Gork on
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited December 2007
If anyone who prot grinds is sitting around at work not doing much, can you give an exact breakdown of exactly how to prot grind, and exactly why I should use what you suggest I use.
On my 47 paladin, I usually don't use Holy Shield for most normal grinding. It doesn't seem needed. I save it for elites and such, or when I have too many. Most of the time I judge light, and use light. And keep HP's constantly coming in. I almost never have to heal that way. If I have runners I use Hammer of Whateverthefuck, to kill them, before they can get more, but only if more would be too much of a hassle.
If there's a caster, go after them first. Let all the melee proc reckoning on you take take the caster down asap. Don't be afraid to use your stuns, and if you're a BE your silence to help you fuck their shit up. I've even switched to resistance aura's when for example warlcoks SB's are hitting just too hard.
I try to keep two weapons at all times. Not 1 big two-hander like some here, but one that's not great but decent, with a Steel Weapon Chain. Cause disarm sucks. You'll notice if you go to my armory, that I have lifestealer. The healing from it, even at 47, is not very noticeable. If you have money for an enchant, Fiery will work just fine for added DPS.
The trouble I find is when you're forced to fight 1vs1 all the time, that's when efficiency starts running down, judged crusader/sealed right. helps, but your DPS still sucks.
Most often I have Ret. Aura on. I generally run with Blessing of Wisdom or Blessing of Sanctuary. If I PVP I use BoKings for the extra HP's, because most often I'm killed by casters in WSG/AB.
Also, Ardent Defender seems to me, to be HUGE. Once I 5/5'd that talent, my survivability seemed to have gone way up. You can watch as your HP's slowly go down, and bubble at the last second if you have to, to take full advantage of it etc.
I'm still not sure where I want to go with my talents right now. I'm not sure if I need that expertise shit or not, and Captain America seems cool, but I don't know if it's practical at all for a mostly solo/pug pally.
EWom on
Whether they find a life there or not, I think Jupiter should be called an enemy planet.
Hmm, but it seems if I don't use holy shield, then my damage, in sizeable groups, isn't good enough. Reckoning and ret aura alone don't seem to kill them quickly enough.
You think Ardent Defender is still that great, after being nerfed to 30% reduction? When levelling, gear and stamina from it won't be all that high.
Hmm, but it seems if I don't use holy shield, then my damage, in sizeable groups, isn't good enough. Reckoning and ret aura alone don't seem to kill them quickly enough.
Hmm, but it seems if I don't use holy shield, then my damage, in sizeable groups, isn't good enough. Reckoning and ret aura alone don't seem to kill them quickly enough.
Shield
spike
Think about how often redoubt is up.
I already have a shield spike. Redoubt is not up terribly often.
One thing that could be causing problems is the number of mobs you're pulling. If you're somewhat timid and only pull 2-4 at a time I find it's generally worse than pulling 5+ at a time. With more mobs more stuff (redoubt/reckoning) is up more often and any holy shield charges aren't wasted as often. I usually pull as large a group as I can until the first mob leashes, then I stop, consecrate and go to town with a light/light combination. I keep that up until I'm low on health, using holy shield whenever redoubt procs and then bubble, heal, and go at it again.
Super Happy: I finally got a skullflame shield for my pally, and got a thorium shield spike on it. Just 3 more levels until I can finally use it!
One thing that could be causing problems is the number of mobs you're pulling. If you're somewhat timid and only pull 2-4 at a time I find it's generally worse than pulling 5+ at a time. With more mobs more stuff (redoubt/reckoning) is up more often and any holy shield charges aren't wasted as often. I usually pull as large a group as I can until the first mob leashes, then I stop, consecrate and go to town with a light/light combination. I keep that up until I'm low on health, using holy shield whenever redoubt procs and then bubble, heal, and go at it again.
Super Happy: I finally got a skullflame shield for my pally, and got a thorium shield spike on it. Just 3 more levels until I can finally use it!
Pre-Outlands I always went a single opening consecrate once the mobs surrounded me (In front. Do NOT let mobs get behind you) to get things rolling, then just judged light, seal of lite and let ret aura, and my shield spike do all the work. You shouldn't have to bring out holy shield. In fact, pre-outlands, you should end every fight at or near full health and mana.
Once I got to Outlands, though, things changed and I went with the concentration aura/self heal method.
EDIT: Until 68, after a brief stint with ret. AoE grinding in Outlands is a different animal. Anyway, now I just spam consecrate and let my health and mitigation ride it out with judgment and seal of wisdom. It's pretty awesome in some areas just how freaking fast you take down 8 or 10 mobs.
One thing that could be causing problems is the number of mobs you're pulling. If you're somewhat timid and only pull 2-4 at a time I find it's generally worse than pulling 5+ at a time. With more mobs more stuff (redoubt/reckoning) is up more often and any holy shield charges aren't wasted as often. I usually pull as large a group as I can until the first mob leashes, then I stop, consecrate and go to town with a light/light combination. I keep that up until I'm low on health, using holy shield whenever redoubt procs and then bubble, heal, and go at it again.
Yeah, I've not really tried going against more than 3 mobs very often, and the way I remember it, I couldn't keep my health up. Certainly, with more mobs I'd get more reckoning procs for seal/judgement of light, but then I'm not gaining any mana, but then if I'm not using holy shield that wouldn't be an issue.
I'll mess around with all these methods later. Though, I am ever so tempted to try out Ret, considering how often I have to really work at getting several mobs, of the kind that I want, together.
Not to be the whiny bitch nay sayer or anything, but Protection (at least in my experience) sucks ass in Outland. Pre-outland, it is fucking rad, but once you get to 58, every mob you encounter has some sort of castbar, and if you do find a group of non-casting mobs, you can bet your ass Blizzard snuck casters in there as well, just to ruin your day.
I specced out of Protection in frustration, went to Ret for like 2 days, now I'm back to Protection. I enjoy Protatin tanking too much to stay away, so i'm just going to do that till 70.
As for me though, I use BoSanc, Judge Light and have Wisdom up. I use Holy shield if 3 or more mobs are on me, but only when redoubt procs so i'm not wasting charges.
And what level of mobs are you pulling? Stuff over you, same level, or a couple levels below? It'd probably be most efficient to gather up plenty of a-couple-levels-below.
Not to be the whiny bitch nay sayer or anything, but Protection (at least in my experience) sucks ass in Outland. Pre-outland, it is fucking rad, but once you get to 58, every mob you encounter has some sort of castbar, and if you do find a group of non-casting mobs, you can bet your ass Blizzard snuck casters in there as well, just to ruin your day.
I specced out of Protection in frustration, went to Ret for like 2 days, now I'm back to Protection. I enjoy Protatin tanking too much to stay away, so i'm just going to do that till 70.
As for me though, I use BoSanc, Judge Light and have Wisdom up. I use Holy shield if 3 or more mobs are on me, but only when redoubt procs so i'm not wasting charges.
While leveling my Paladin I had a holy/prot build that gave me strong healing capabilities in addition to some of the prot staples, like reckoning, bosanc and redoubt. It allowed me to duke it out with some of the mobs that weren't as conducive to prot tanking. I think the spec was something like this, but I was more of a healer and less of a tank. Maybe getting some ret talents would allow you to kick their shit in with reckoning and a 2Her? Something like this perhaps.
Seal of Command could help a lot, I may try that out, I've grown so in love with my current build for tanking, but I guess I could get rid of OHW-Spec and it shouldn't affect me *too* much.
Leveling my second paladin, I quickly grew irritated with Outlands Prot leveling about the time I hit Naga in western Zangarmarsh. So, I went Ret with a fantastic 2hander from Ramparts. It sucked even more (or I sucked at that playstyle).
So, I modified my Prot spec to include only up to Ardent Defender dmg reduction and Ret talents for a melee boost and quicker judgements when I needed a bit more burst. I did not take SoC from ret. I have zero talents in Holy; but questing is much better.
Now, this paladin is Blood Elf and I use SoB, but Righteousness is fine. The trick is to use Light/Wis during normal melee mobs but swap SoB/Judge for the quicker kill on casters. The best is when you can pull 2-3 melee mobs with that one caster. The caster bites it fast.
There is still nothing worse than accidentally gathering three Arakkoa Windcallers or three of those tree people in Bone Wastes and spending 10 minutes trying to melee them/interrupt that constant Regrowth. But it's much easier with more crits and using SoB for extra dmg. I still run away from a situation like that.
Also, when the situation is mostly melee, I'll use Sanctuary and feel like I come out ahead on mana (rather than using Wisdom). The mobs die faster so I take less dmg. And the dmg over time is probably much more mana efficient than say . . using an extra consecrate during a group kill.
When I was leveling Mage, SPriest, Rogue, I could grind and see really quick exp gains by just killing stuff. Leveling paladin quickly in Outland is very reliant on quest exp to me, even though Prot is set up for large grind groups of melee.
Oscreth on
Old man, family, works too hard, locked into a routine, but still plays with army men and video games.
If you want to play League of Legends, here is my refer a friend: So I get points
Off tanking is frustrating. I ended up OTing VR and could barely muster up a decent amount of aggro. It felt so painful and useless. Finally got aggro at 30% and tanked him till he was dead. Now THAT was fun!
Thomase1984 on
0
ThomamelasOnly one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered Userregular
Off tanking is frustrating. I ended up OTing VR and could barely muster up a decent amount of aggro. It felt so painful and useless. Finally got aggro at 30% and tanked him till he was dead. Now THAT was fun!
Dark runes. It's the extra mana you need, plus some threat from the mana gain, plus some extra from the healing you'll get with SA which is a little more threat.
If you don't have aggro then pop AS when ever the cooldown is up. Do you know the SoV tricks with SoC/AW?
So SoV's damage is calculated at the time the first stack is applied, and as long as it doesn't drop off, it keeps the bonuses. So you stack the following:
AW + Destruction pot + JoCr = +30% damage and 260 extra spell damage for each tick. Even if you switch over to JoW....you still get the benefit of JoCr on SoV. Start with a +spell damage shield and flask of blinding light....and you can put out some insane threat on this fight.
I think SoV's damage calculation adds all the spelldamage bonus to the first tick. So 1 application is 30 + (spelldamage), 2 applications is 30 + (spelldamage) + 30, 3 is 30 + (spelldamage) + 30 + 30, etc. At least for the DoT effect. Judgement is separate, I think.
Protadin's are retardedly easy to solo with; some things just take longer than most.
There's been several group/elite quests that I've just gone ahead and done myself. And "Kill X of Y creature" quests are a joke with AoE grinding.
But don't kid yourself about any damage you'll be doing.
But for this, I've been a bit unimpressed, compared to how it's portrayed. I just now got holy shield, and while it's a big increase in killing speed, it sucks up my mana terribly quickly. Maybe my gear sucks, maybe I'm not getting the right combination of judgements and seals going.
I think SoV's damage calculation adds all the spelldamage bonus to the first tick. So 1 application is 30 + (spelldamage), 2 applications is 30 + (spelldamage) + 30, 3 is 30 + (spelldamage) + 30 + 30, etc. At least for the DoT effect. Judgement is separate, I think.
You are correct about the judgement but the dot portion should be 17% per tick.
Posts
Ayliana Moonwhisper Ecksus Cerazal
I'm not entirely sure that's a good enough reason to stop me.
Ayliana Moonwhisper Ecksus Cerazal
I keep hearing mixed things about the Protadin's ability to level solo, from it being really easy to AOE grind to it being a lot less awesome than expected for questing, etc. I want the truth!
Also, is Holy healing as boring as I've heard? Basically relying on just a few heals sounds pretty dull to me, but I've never played the class.
Are you sure that's what you want? Are you?
Or maybe that just applies to me because I'm strange like that. I had to abandon the idea of leveling a new druid to be feral so my current druid could stay resto because I realized that I would absolutely have to level a third druid to be balance and that's just too much druid leveling, so I just let it go.
Yes, it really is that boring. Basically you'll just be spamming Flash of Light with the few exceptions when the tank takes crazy damage and you have to throw out one Holy Light.
Protadin's are retardedly easy to solo with; some things just take longer than most.
There's been several group/elite quests that I've just gone ahead and done myself. And "Kill X of Y creature" quests are a joke with AoE grinding.
But don't kid yourself about any damage you'll be doing.
Ayliana Moonwhisper Ecksus Cerazal
Hey hey hey, my protadin does crazy damage.
Against dual-wielding melee mobs.
Against anything else, not so much.
But for this, I've been a bit unimpressed, compared to how it's portrayed. I just now got holy shield, and while it's a big increase in killing speed, it sucks up my mana terribly quickly. Maybe my gear sucks, maybe I'm not getting the right combination of judgements and seals going.
Figurine of the Colossus dropped, but I d/c'd right when the boss died and I couldn't roll on it once I get back in the game.
What is the combination you're using?
I might try judging light and using wisdom, and let my ret aura and holy shield do the killing and use my seals to regain health and mana.
Ding ding ding.
You were doing it wrong. Are you also lacking a shield spike?
If there's a caster, go after them first. Let all the melee proc reckoning on you take take the caster down asap. Don't be afraid to use your stuns, and if you're a BE your silence to help you fuck their shit up. I've even switched to resistance aura's when for example warlcoks SB's are hitting just too hard.
I try to keep two weapons at all times. Not 1 big two-hander like some here, but one that's not great but decent, with a Steel Weapon Chain. Cause disarm sucks. You'll notice if you go to my armory, that I have lifestealer. The healing from it, even at 47, is not very noticeable. If you have money for an enchant, Fiery will work just fine for added DPS.
The trouble I find is when you're forced to fight 1vs1 all the time, that's when efficiency starts running down, judged crusader/sealed right. helps, but your DPS still sucks.
Most often I have Ret. Aura on. I generally run with Blessing of Wisdom or Blessing of Sanctuary. If I PVP I use BoKings for the extra HP's, because most often I'm killed by casters in WSG/AB.
Also, Ardent Defender seems to me, to be HUGE. Once I 5/5'd that talent, my survivability seemed to have gone way up. You can watch as your HP's slowly go down, and bubble at the last second if you have to, to take full advantage of it etc.
I'm still not sure where I want to go with my talents right now. I'm not sure if I need that expertise shit or not, and Captain America seems cool, but I don't know if it's practical at all for a mostly solo/pug pally.
You think Ardent Defender is still that great, after being nerfed to 30% reduction? When levelling, gear and stamina from it won't be all that high.
Shield
spike
Think about how often redoubt is up.
I already have a shield spike. Redoubt is not up terribly often.
Super Happy: I finally got a skullflame shield for my pally, and got a thorium shield spike on it. Just 3 more levels until I can finally use it!
Pre-Outlands I always went a single opening consecrate once the mobs surrounded me (In front. Do NOT let mobs get behind you) to get things rolling, then just judged light, seal of lite and let ret aura, and my shield spike do all the work. You shouldn't have to bring out holy shield. In fact, pre-outlands, you should end every fight at or near full health and mana.
Once I got to Outlands, though, things changed and I went with the concentration aura/self heal method.
EDIT: Until 68, after a brief stint with ret. AoE grinding in Outlands is a different animal. Anyway, now I just spam consecrate and let my health and mitigation ride it out with judgment and seal of wisdom. It's pretty awesome in some areas just how freaking fast you take down 8 or 10 mobs.
I don't use it because without wisdom, I have serious mana issues.
Yeah, I've not really tried going against more than 3 mobs very often, and the way I remember it, I couldn't keep my health up. Certainly, with more mobs I'd get more reckoning procs for seal/judgement of light, but then I'm not gaining any mana, but then if I'm not using holy shield that wouldn't be an issue.
I'll mess around with all these methods later. Though, I am ever so tempted to try out Ret, considering how often I have to really work at getting several mobs, of the kind that I want, together.
I specced out of Protection in frustration, went to Ret for like 2 days, now I'm back to Protection. I enjoy Protatin tanking too much to stay away, so i'm just going to do that till 70.
As for me though, I use BoSanc, Judge Light and have Wisdom up. I use Holy shield if 3 or more mobs are on me, but only when redoubt procs so i'm not wasting charges.
While leveling my Paladin I had a holy/prot build that gave me strong healing capabilities in addition to some of the prot staples, like reckoning, bosanc and redoubt. It allowed me to duke it out with some of the mobs that weren't as conducive to prot tanking. I think the spec was something like this, but I was more of a healer and less of a tank. Maybe getting some ret talents would allow you to kick their shit in with reckoning and a 2Her? Something like this perhaps.
Ghalan - Tauren Druid
So, I modified my Prot spec to include only up to Ardent Defender dmg reduction and Ret talents for a melee boost and quicker judgements when I needed a bit more burst. I did not take SoC from ret. I have zero talents in Holy; but questing is much better.
Now, this paladin is Blood Elf and I use SoB, but Righteousness is fine. The trick is to use Light/Wis during normal melee mobs but swap SoB/Judge for the quicker kill on casters. The best is when you can pull 2-3 melee mobs with that one caster. The caster bites it fast.
There is still nothing worse than accidentally gathering three Arakkoa Windcallers or three of those tree people in Bone Wastes and spending 10 minutes trying to melee them/interrupt that constant Regrowth. But it's much easier with more crits and using SoB for extra dmg. I still run away from a situation like that.
Also, when the situation is mostly melee, I'll use Sanctuary and feel like I come out ahead on mana (rather than using Wisdom). The mobs die faster so I take less dmg. And the dmg over time is probably much more mana efficient than say . . using an extra consecrate during a group kill.
When I was leveling Mage, SPriest, Rogue, I could grind and see really quick exp gains by just killing stuff. Leveling paladin quickly in Outland is very reliant on quest exp to me, even though Prot is set up for large grind groups of melee.
If you want to play League of Legends, here is my refer a friend: So I get points
Dark runes. It's the extra mana you need, plus some threat from the mana gain, plus some extra from the healing you'll get with SA which is a little more threat.
If you don't have aggro then pop AS when ever the cooldown is up. Do you know the SoV tricks with SoC/AW?
So SoV's damage is calculated at the time the first stack is applied, and as long as it doesn't drop off, it keeps the bonuses. So you stack the following:
AW + Destruction pot + JoCr = +30% damage and 260 extra spell damage for each tick. Even if you switch over to JoW....you still get the benefit of JoCr on SoV. Start with a +spell damage shield and flask of blinding light....and you can put out some insane threat on this fight.
The first time you see the debuff on the boss.
Awesome tip TY!
Whats your level/talents?
Or even just your name and server.
Ayliana Moonwhisper Ecksus Cerazal
You are correct about the judgement but the dot portion should be 17% per tick.