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On Guitar Heroics
AbsoluteZero
The new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered User regular
The new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered User regular
This is in response to the latest news-post made by Tycho. Yeah, I'm aware he doesn't read the forums. I figured we could discuss the topic nonetheless. Anyhoo...
The reason the "yokels" come out of the woodwork and question the value of your Guitar Heroics is because your controller is an idiotized version of an actual instrument. It is five buttons on a stick. Pushing those buttons in time with on screen cues does not make you a musician any more than Dance Dance Revolution makes you a prima fucking ballerina.
Yes, there are 5 buttons that could create a reasonable combination of sounds and given such freedom to create would classify the peripheral as an instrument. That's great. On an actual guitar there are, essentially, 126 buttons.
In my opinion the Guitar Hero and Rock Band guitars are no more legitimate instruments than those produced by Fischer Price.
Agree? Disagree?
The reason the "yokels" come out of the woodwork and question the value of your Guitar Heroics is because your controller is an idiotized version of an actual instrument. It is five buttons on a stick. Pushing those buttons in time with on screen cues does not make you a musician any more than Dance Dance Revolution makes you a prima fucking ballerina.
Yes, there are 5 buttons that could create a reasonable combination of sounds and given such freedom to create would classify the peripheral as an instrument. That's great. On an actual guitar there are, essentially, 126 buttons.
In my opinion the Guitar Hero and Rock Band guitars are no more legitimate instruments than those produced by Fischer Price.
Agree? Disagree?
AbsoluteZero on
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Music games are fun because they present the illusion that you are good at the instrument.
In the same way my mouse is an idiotized version of a gun. It's not supposed to be real, it's supposed to be a game.
Because playing Guitar Hero is quicker and much less frustrating.
Edit: Also, Guitar Hero doesn't only seek to capture the feeling of playing a guitar, but also playing before a sold out crowd in a huge-ass stadium with pyrotechnics and everything. In essence, being a rock star. Anybody could play the guitar given enough time and effort, but how many get a record deal and play at the Super Bowl or whatever?
I was unaware that the complexity of an instrument made it better or worse than any others.
I could join the Army and go to Iraq if I want to really go to war. Just about anybody can get into the Army.
It does when they are both supposed to be the same instrument.
Are you saying that the chances of becoming a rock star aren't insanely slim?
As someone who's seen firsthand the crashing and burning of several homegrown music careers, I can say that having my virtual back-up band at my beck and call is wondrous. I agree with you that being good at Guitar Hero doesn't mean you'd actually be good at being a real guitar hero, but I also have to point out that there are plenty of good reasons why one would prefer Guitar Hero to playing real guitar. Part of the immersion of being in a virtual band and playing all these different cool rock tunes is one of them.
There are compelling reasons for both. The reason I like these guitar-based rhythm games is because I like music and I like video games and rhythm games are a chocolate–and–peanut butter taste sensation that's unlike either of them together.
because a guitar isn't pick up and play.
They are not both instruments, one is a controller for a game the other is an instrument.
A person who thinks joining the Army is cool and fun probably would.
I dunno if I agree with that. I spent a year in a music class back in grade 7 and never learned how to play. Music is something that I enjoy, but the creation of it escapes me. I spent six months working on a guitar my dad game me and never got past the first couple of lessons. I couldn't tell you what it is, it's like I'm physically incapable of doing it right.
Whereas I enjoy playing Guitar Hero. So when elitists come out and say "Why don't you learn a real guitar?" All I can think is "Because all I want to do is play this game motherfucker." Why should I be expected to learn something difficult just to do something easy?
Besides, no one is claiming that you can learn how to play guitar by playing guitar hero. Tycho was saying that the guitar controller can be as valid an instrument as a real guitar, given the right software. I dunno why you guys have you noses up in the air about that. Congratulations, you can play guitar. My question is, so what?
http://www.willitblend.com/videos.aspx?type=unsafe&video=guitarhero
...sorry this was too funny to not post.
I've tried to learn the guitar and can't. For some reason strumming and doing cords at the same time is impossible for me. You know that nerd in movies that tries to play guitar? He moves his fingers, strums once, looks at the neck and moves his fingers and several seconds later he strums a second time. Yeah, thats me.
Throw me a violin and I can play fucking Vivaldi, but fuck If I'm going to be able to play the opening to Smoke on the Water.
Shit, I forgot about Will it blend. Thanks!
You are being that guy. Stop. Stop now.
Games are (for the most part) simulations; if you don't have a problem with any other semi-realistic games, then why pick on Guitar Hero just b/c you happen to actually play the guitar? Just b/c I play the piano, I don't go up to kids playing on their Playskool 12-key plastic keyboards and go "why are you wasting your time with that? Try the real thing!" It's fun. Learning an instrument is a completely different beast. The rewards are greater, but it's a much more long-term investment than ~$100 for a game.
People with this complaint (probably coupled with the great interview Gabe's grandfather gave) make me think of a veteran going to some kid playing CoD and going "That's not what it's like at all. If you really want to experience it, join the army." I know that being in actual combat is not similar to sitting in a comfy chair and clicking a mouse, just like I know playing a real guitar is different than a videogame version. I'd rather not join the army b/c of the downsides (time commitment, discomfort, possible death, etc.). The downsides to learning the guitar over playing Guitar Hero are on a much smaller scale, but the reasoning is the same.
Would it ever be as complex as a real guitar? Hell no. Would you (unlike in the game) still have to have musical skill to play it? Hell yes.
As to the ludricrous quirk about the buttons: my trumpet only has 3 buttons. But I can still make some damn good music on it.
I've never understood the people that say "Well why don't you just get a real guitar?" Because that's not the point of the game, idiots. Playing the guitar is DAMN HARD (*Playing good, anyway) and requires years of practice to perfect.
Besides, who's to say you can't do both?
3DS Friend Code: 0404-6826-4588 PM if you add.
I actually did learn to play the guitar, because of Guitar Hero. It would never have happened if it wasn't for that game.
"Go up, thou bald head." -2 Kings 2:23
Guitar hero can be picked up and played instantly which is why it's so popular among music lovers.
Learning to play real guitar at the level of the songs in Guitar Hero can take years.
The comparison between the two is so stupid that I'm surprised it's even brought up.
I also play Donkey Konga but I've never had anyone say to me 'why don't you just learn to play the real bongos?'.
PSN = Wicker86 ________ Gamertag = Wicker86
You're not a real guitar player if you started out on GH! True guitar players start playing guitar for the love of music and calluses!
Number of groupies?
I've tried. I am fairly certain I will never be any good but I can have a lot of fun belting out my three chords of pain stylings at parties and around campfires. Jamming with friends is way more fun than Guitar Hero (I haven't played Rock Band) but it is really hard to find friends these days who aren't either too good or too bad. That said, I kinda stopped playing Guitar Hero around "You've Got Another Thing Comming" on the first verions/hard because I hit a wall and couldn't get around the fact that I could be wasting my time trying to play Stairway to Heaven on my real guitar. With people around though, unless you've got a drummer (with drums) you're better off with the game.
― Marcus Aurelius
Path of Exile: themightypuck
Why spend so much time perfecting the art of playing Guitar Hero, getting insanely good at it, when you could spend that time practicing playing an actual guitar.
This argument assumes the following:
Being exceptionally skilled at playing Guitar Hero is far less valuable than being exceptionally skilled at playing an actual guitar.
It also assumes:
A person trying to become insanely good at playing Guitar Hero is doing so because he or she wants to be able to play complicated music.
They argument then falls back on the obvious:
The Guitar Hero controller is not as complicated as a real guitar, so it does not translate into being able to play complicated music
Now, I know the above is speculation on my part about what someone is actually thinking when they are arguing, but I'm trying to come up with some sort of breakdown as to why this view is constantly voiced.
Do not fall back on the assumption that playing a real guitar as opposed to the game is more accessible than going to war as opposed to play Call of Duty 4. Yes, you are right there.
But these analogy can be applied to any game on the market. Why play Fifa when you can go outside and kick a ball around, thus getting better and better at soccer?
Why play Gran Turismo when you can go drive around in a car at a track and get better and better at vehicle handling?
Why play Wii Sports when you can play the actual sport and get better and better at it?
The problem with every statement above is that it assumes the player is playing the game in order to get better at the activity the game tries to replicate.
People are playing the games to entertain themselves. The act of playing the game is what is enjoyable.
However, I think he makes an interesting point. Computers have already changed the way people compose and play music. I think the idea of an instrument designed to allow virtuosity and complex melodies and rhythms, without the need to comform to any physical demands, is pretty compelling. Music could really use a revolutionary new instrument, something as revolutionary as the electric guitar was in the 50s and 60s, that allows you to play in novel new ways.
I don't know if Rock Band and its ilk will herald the arrival of this new instrument, but it's possible.
I agree with him in that there are videogames that emulate certain real life things, and that games are fun, and it's retarded for someone to always come in and shit on everyone's party because "why when you could learn to play a real guitar?"
But that youtube he linked to was .. no. Sorry. If I am going to learn a tool by which to create music, it's certainly not going to be my Wireless Wii SG Les Paul. Yes, yes, anything that allows a person to use their creativity to put together notes can be considered an instrument, right, I get that.
That said, I don't have the time or the energy to learn 'real guitar.' I am never, not ever, going to be good enough to play the thing so well that I can play a Stevie Ray Vaughan song, or even half the solos in the GH games.
Guitar Hero is a fun way to interact with music. Even if I did learn the guitar I'd still enjoy interacting with really cool songs as they are in Guitar Hero. But just because I don't have the time, dedication, or energy to learn the actual guitar doesn't negate that.
Furthermore, I have no knowledge of music. "Play a D chord." I have no idea what the fuck that means or even sounds like. Even if I learned all of the hand positions of a guitar, I'm still completely clueless towards playing music in general. At best, I would be able to learn how to read guitar tabs, and memorize them. Lastly, I have no natural rhythm. With guitar hero, I can get to that rhythm visually. But even if I had the amazing dexterity of half the original guitarists of these songs in GH, I'd still never be able to nail the rhythm of the songs just right.
For someone like me, it really is a stretch to go from Guitar Hero to real guitar. But even if it weren't, Guitar Hero is still a fun and intuitive and approachable game, and a great way to get connected to great music, even when you don't have the time or the skill to learn the real-life instrument.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I don't lime, but if I did lime, I would lime this.
― Marcus Aurelius
Path of Exile: themightypuck
Are you kidding me? ...
Do you actually think the only reason people play Madden is because they can't be in the NFL? By that logic, no guitarist would ever play Guitar Hero, and no football player would ever play Madden. Video games aren't reality, sir, and it is imperative that you understand the difference between playing Madden and being in the NFL before continuing with your argument.
Each button can be "on" or "off", ie 1 or 0, and four buttons can represent everything from 0000, or 0, to 1111, or F. Strum down to enter a value or strum up to back up to a previous value for editing. (Edit: heck this could even be used as an accessible tool to teach kids how to program computers.)
Also, with just five buttons and strumming up versus down gives you 64 possibilities, which is more keys than an electronic synthesizer. Still don't believe it's feasible to play real music with a GH controller? Then maybe you should read the internets more.
Finally, what exactly gives you the authority to tell me I shouldn't play Guitar Hero?
"Go up, thou bald head." -2 Kings 2:23
Because even if I learn to play the guitar, drums, or whatever, I will never have a fucking crowd singing along with me, cheering me on.
Also, some people like things that others don't! Holy shit, news at fucking 11 get out!
https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970666737/
I play the drums in real life. I have 8 buttons essentially on a drumset
This does not apply for rock band drums.
Allow me.
Tycho/Slash have it mostly spot on. I had a Rock Band party this past weekend, and there was someone who came who was A Musician. Had been playing guitar, drums, etc since he was 7. When the Musician failed out of songs on guitar and drums, he started to reiterate the same argument. "Well, I can play this on real instruments, so this is kinda lame." Dude pissed in all our coffee.
I dunno. It's a bias. Doesn't negate the fact that we had other people who were playing who were also musicians, in a band, whatnot, all enjoying the game immensely and pestering me as to when we were doing it again.
I couldn't
touche, if absolutezero included chords in his 126 buttons. I was thinking he was just counting frets x strings