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[Tech on?] Sound card advice

ViolyntViolynt regular
edited December 2007 in Games and Technology
I need a sound card that outputs Dolby Digital 5.1. I had a HTOmega Striker that worked great but I sold it (long story and I wished I hadn't). They no longer sell them on newegg and zipzoomfly doesn't carry many sound cards.

So I need a recommendation on a sound card and it needs to output DD 5.1 threw either coaxial or optical.

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Posts

  • WeretacoWeretaco Cubicle Gangster Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Weretaco on
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  • brynstarbrynstar Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Weretaco wrote: »

    Wow, that card looks pretty awesome. I might have to look into one of those myself as it would suit my current setup quite nicely!

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  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    Yea I looked into it and the card looks pretty nice. Ordered it and I will post my experience with it if anyone cares although I don't get it until Christmas as it's a gift from some one. :|

    Violynt on
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  • Homestar GunnerHomestar Gunner Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Usually I'm not one for thread hijacking, but I saw this and had to ask: what the fuck is TOSLINK/SPDIF and why does my computer have a place to connect such a device? And what can I find (presumably some speakers) that have this connection? And for that matter, would it be worth looking into?

    Homestar Gunner on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    Unless your motherboard supports DD 5.1/DTS (which it probably doesn't) than don't bother with it as you will only get stereo sound out of it.

    The new intel chipset has DD 5.1 and the old Nforce 2 chipset had it as well.

    Also on SPDIF.

    I'm using this card to connect my PC to my home theater sound system so I can play back movies and tv shows in 5.1 and maybe one day 7.1. Games should sound good as well. :P

    Violynt on
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  • Homestar GunnerHomestar Gunner Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Violynt wrote: »
    Unless your motherboard supports DD 5.1/DTS (which it probably doesn't) than don't bother with it as you will only get stereo sound out of it.

    The new intel chipset has DD 5.1 and the old Nforce 2 chipset had it as well.

    Also on SPDIF.

    I'm using this card to connect my PC to my home theater sound system so I can play back movies and tv shows in 5.1 and maybe one day 7.1. Games should sound good as well. :P

    I think my motherboard is an Intel P35. The audio sounds great (no idea what the reviewers are complaining about), I just have been wondering if it can sound even better, because for some reason I have a TOSLINK cable in my room and haven't had anything to plug it into until now.

    Homestar Gunner on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    It depends on your setup. If you have a receiver and 5.1 or more speakers hook it up and see for your self.

    There are headsets you can plug into TOSLINK as well.

    Of course none of this matters if that motherboard doesn't support DD 5.1, I did a little research and I think it does but I'm not 100% sure.

    Violynt on
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  • GrimReaperGrimReaper Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Violynt wrote: »
    Unless your motherboard supports DD 5.1/DTS (which it probably doesn't) than don't bother with it as you will only get stereo sound out of it.

    The new intel chipset has DD 5.1 and the old Nforce 2 chipset had it as well.

    Also on SPDIF.

    I'm using this card to connect my PC to my home theater sound system so I can play back movies and tv shows in 5.1 and maybe one day 7.1. Games should sound good as well. :P

    I think my motherboard is an Intel P35. The audio sounds great (no idea what the reviewers are complaining about), I just have been wondering if it can sound even better, because for some reason I have a TOSLINK cable in my room and haven't had anything to plug it into until now.

    That motherboard, as well as pretty much all motherboards in existence that use onboard sound uses AC'97. Essentially all the sound processing etc is done by your processor, all that the onboard sound chip really does is convert the processed audio into an analog signal.

    One of the reasons I went to a discrete sound card is because of an annoying sound bug in Oblivion that Realtek still haven't fixed in their latest drivers. (I know this because my laptop, a Macbook Pro uses a Realtek chip for its sound)

    GrimReaper on
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  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    If you are a gamer DO NOT USE ONBOARD SOUND

    I got a base model Sound Blaster and got a 20FPS increase, no joke.

    Meiz on
  • LogicowLogicow Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Meiz wrote: »
    If you are a gamer DO NOT USE ONBOARD SOUND

    I got a base model Sound Blaster and got a 20FPS increase, no joke.

    NForce 2 onboard sound is actually faster than any separate sound card you can have.
    Also, on dual core systems it should make no difference at all.

    Logicow on
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    GrimReaper wrote: »
    Violynt wrote: »
    Unless your motherboard supports DD 5.1/DTS (which it probably doesn't) than don't bother with it as you will only get stereo sound out of it.

    The new intel chipset has DD 5.1 and the old Nforce 2 chipset had it as well.

    Also on SPDIF.

    I'm using this card to connect my PC to my home theater sound system so I can play back movies and tv shows in 5.1 and maybe one day 7.1. Games should sound good as well. :P

    I think my motherboard is an Intel P35. The audio sounds great (no idea what the reviewers are complaining about), I just have been wondering if it can sound even better, because for some reason I have a TOSLINK cable in my room and haven't had anything to plug it into until now.

    That motherboard, as well as pretty much all motherboards in existence that use onboard sound uses AC'97. Essentially all the sound processing etc is done by your processor, all that the onboard sound chip really does is convert the processed audio into an analog signal.

    One of the reasons I went to a discrete sound card is because of an annoying sound bug in Oblivion that Realtek still haven't fixed in their latest drivers. (I know this because my laptop, a Macbook Pro uses a Realtek chip for its sound)

    Err, point of order, I thought all motherboards use intel HD Audio now.

    Rook on
  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Logicow wrote: »
    Meiz wrote: »
    If you are a gamer DO NOT USE ONBOARD SOUND

    I got a base model Sound Blaster and got a 20FPS increase, no joke.

    NForce 2 onboard sound is actually faster than any separate sound card you can have.
    Also, on dual core systems it should make no difference at all.

    Well I have a core2 duo with an asus board. Trust me, I didn't think it would be a problem and came upon this by accident.

    Meiz on
  • StormwatcherStormwatcher Blegh BlughRegistered User regular
    edited December 2007
    AC'97 is shit
    shitty shit mcshitty o'shitterson shit-chan.
    seriously. Play a game on AC'97, then play it on an X-Fi and then go back to the on-board shit, I mean, sound.

    You'll wann rip your ears off. Oh, and even regular mp3 playing is quite shitty too.

    AC'97 may sound good compared to crappy ipod earphones, but it's shit.

    Stormwatcher on
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  • MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Meiz wrote: »
    Logicow wrote: »
    Meiz wrote: »
    If you are a gamer DO NOT USE ONBOARD SOUND

    I got a base model Sound Blaster and got a 20FPS increase, no joke.

    NForce 2 onboard sound is actually faster than any separate sound card you can have.
    Also, on dual core systems it should make no difference at all.

    Well I have a core2 duo with an asus board. Trust me, I didn't think it would be a problem and came upon this by accident.

    20 FPS increase huh.

    Malkor on
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  • PolagoPolago Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    While it's a VERY highly debated card due to both age and support, the m-audio revolution 7.1 is pretty good if you can find it at a solid price. There's also the Revolution 5.1 for a lesser price too. 24bit/192khz output, Dolby 5.1, DTS, etc. To speak on it's age though, it comes with Tony Hawk Pro Skater 3. RESEARCH this card line before you try it because while i've really love everything m-audio I own, other people have had some small issues due to slightly older driver support with macs and the such (mostly due to the consistant OS X updates).

    For what you need, weretaco's solution looks slick regardless.

    Polago on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    I doubt you got a 20 fps increase.

    All the benchmarks show about a MAX 7 fps difference between the Creative cards and on board/non hardware accelerated sound cards. Also you don't get that increase from the Creative card in Vista and one more thing, the sound card I am buying here isn't prone to causing blue screen of deaths.

    Stop speaking out of your ass Meiz.

    EDIT: Benchmark. I'm not buying this card for a speed increase, I want to be able to use my surround sound threw optical and I can't do that with the any of the Creative cards. Well you can but it's not as convenient.

    Violynt on
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  • WeretacoWeretaco Cubicle Gangster Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    I've usually seen reports of 1-2% at max as far as framerate increase with a dedicated soundcard. The benefit of the soundcard is for audio quality.

    Weretaco on
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  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Violynt wrote: »
    I doubt you got a 20 fps increase.

    All the benchmarks show about a MAX 7 fps difference between the Creative cards and on board/non hardware accelerated sound cards. Also you don't get that increase from the Creative card in Vista and one more thing, the sound card I am buying here isn't prone to causing blue screen of deaths.

    Stop speaking out of your ass Meiz.

    EDIT: Benchmark. I'm not buying this card for a speed increase, I want to be able to use my surround sound threw optical and I can't do that with the any of the Creative cards. Well you can but it's not as convenient.

    That's right, I'm talking out of my ass yet when I loaded DoD after I installed my Sound blaster, I went from a jittery 40-50fps to 70-80 fps without tweaks or anything. Just disabled my onboard card and set the sound blaster as primary. I know this because netgraph is consistently on in every source game I play.

    Look, I know because I have practical experience in this matter so before you dismiss the idea, try not doing the very thing you're accusing me of.

    Meiz on
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    I think the point is, it's a lot more likely that your PC was fucked up. Rather than the fact that sound cards magically increse your FPS by 80%

    Rook on
  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Rook wrote: »
    I think the point is, it's a lot more likely that your PC was fucked up. Rather than the fact that sound cards magically increse your FPS by 80%

    What kind of kooky math professor taught you percentages and their application I wonder?

    My pc wasn't fucked up hose brain, it was just build. All I did was:
    -Dissable my onboard card
    -Enable my Sound Blaster.

    That's it.

    I didn't re-install Direct X

    I didn't kick it

    I didn't hurt its feelings.

    Meiz on
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    The one that says 80% of 40 is roughly 30 and that 70 is 30+40.

    Why, which one did you learn from?

    Rook on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    I have an Audigy 2 in my system that I never use and thought I'd try it out just for this.

    I'm getting a 3 fps increase in GTA:SA using the creative card. That's the only game I got an FPS increase.
    Half-life 2 stayed consistent (by consistent I mean no change) and so did Call of Duty 4.

    Specs: Core2Duo 6550, 8800GT, 2 gigs of DDR2 800 and an Asus P5K-E motherboard.

    Maybe I should turn off all AA and AF and then lower my resolution so I'm not bound by my graphics card? But then what's the point?

    Violynt on
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  • MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Well you could do an exotic speaker setup...

    Malkor on
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  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    Right now I'm just using headphones until I get my card.

    Violynt on
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  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Rook wrote: »
    The one that says 80% of 40 is roughly 30 and that 70 is 30+40.

    Why, which one did you learn from?

    Right and would this be more likely because of:
    A)Magic
    B)Recent and only hardware change.

    Meiz on
  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Violynt wrote: »
    I have an Audigy 2 in my system that I never use and thought I'd try it out just for this.

    I'm getting a 3 fps increase in GTA:SA using the creative card. That's the only game I got an FPS increase.
    Half-life 2 stayed consistent (by consistent I mean no change) and so did Call of Duty 4.

    Specs: Core2Duo 6550, 8800GT, 2 gigs of DDR2 800 and an Asus P5K-E motherboard.

    Maybe I should turn off all AA and AF and then lower my resolution so I'm not bound by my graphics card? But then what's the point?

    See, that's fucking weird because I have practically the same setup except my video card is ATI.

    Look I'm willing to post SS's of in game footage for tf2 and Dod once I get home.

    Meiz on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    I have screen shots using different hardware but it says the same FPS up in the corner (using fraps) so it's pointless in posting mine as you wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

    I'd like to test battlefield 2 but I'm not sure of the console command to uncap the fps.

    Violynt on
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  • GrimReaperGrimReaper Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Rook wrote: »
    GrimReaper wrote: »
    Violynt wrote: »
    Unless your motherboard supports DD 5.1/DTS (which it probably doesn't) than don't bother with it as you will only get stereo sound out of it.

    The new intel chipset has DD 5.1 and the old Nforce 2 chipset had it as well.

    Also on SPDIF.

    I'm using this card to connect my PC to my home theater sound system so I can play back movies and tv shows in 5.1 and maybe one day 7.1. Games should sound good as well. :P

    I think my motherboard is an Intel P35. The audio sounds great (no idea what the reviewers are complaining about), I just have been wondering if it can sound even better, because for some reason I have a TOSLINK cable in my room and haven't had anything to plug it into until now.

    That motherboard, as well as pretty much all motherboards in existence that use onboard sound uses AC'97. Essentially all the sound processing etc is done by your processor, all that the onboard sound chip really does is convert the processed audio into an analog signal.

    One of the reasons I went to a discrete sound card is because of an annoying sound bug in Oblivion that Realtek still haven't fixed in their latest drivers. (I know this because my laptop, a Macbook Pro uses a Realtek chip for its sound)

    Err, point of order, I thought all motherboards use intel HD Audio now.

    All manufactured ones now, yes. But most of current machines people actually own still have AC'97 chips in them, case in point whenever somebody at work brings in their home laptop/pc in it's usually an AC'97 chip in that sucker.

    It'll probably be a year or two before we see the "hd" audio chips take the majority. (I hate that hd audio marketing term)

    Also, if you have a single core processor then yes.. with a discrete audio card you'll see a bit of a performance increase, probably somewhere in the region of 1-5%. If you've got multi/dual/quad core processor then you likely won't see any difference. (since most games aren't multithreaded and the fact that in terms on processing power the audio processing stuff takes a tiny, tiny amount of processing time out of those more modern processors)

    GrimReaper on
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  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    I have an HD Audio chip maybe that's why I don't see a FPS increase over the Audigy 2?

    I thought all Creative cards processed the sound though...

    Violynt on
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  • MeizMeiz Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    I have a Realtek HD audio on mine and replaced it with an SB X-Fi Xtreme Audio board.

    My mobo's an Asus P5LD2 with a Core 2 Duo 6300 and 3 gigs of ram.

    I'll try both for tf2.

    Edit: 6fps difference.

    I guess DoD's just bad with audio. Mind you, there's a lot more ambiance.

    Moral of the story is don't play DoD with onboard Audio.

    Meiz on
  • StormwatcherStormwatcher Blegh BlughRegistered User regular
    edited December 2007
    this is not about FPS.
    This is about not sounding like shit in a tiny can.

    Stormwatcher on
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  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    Actually this is about FPS at the moment. Look on the first page where Meiz is claiming a 20 FPS increase by not using on board.

    Violynt on
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  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    I think we can all just settle this by going to our game de jour and seeing if it has a -nosound command line parameter and seeing how much of an increase you can get.

    As for actual cards to buy, this may not help out the OP but there's a new audio standard coming with Dx10.1 (XAudio 2?) so I'm waiting for that to hit before I end up with a soundcard in my machine.

    Rook on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    I need a card now, I don't really have a money issue so I can just upgrade if I need to later on.

    Violynt on
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  • FirebrandFirebrand Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Why is it that enabling "Hardware Acceleration" for sound in games actually gives worse performance? Is it doing fancy stuff that the software mixing doesn't do?

    Firebrand on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    That should improve performance if you are using a Audigy or X-fi card, as it off loads the sound onto the card.

    Violynt on
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  • FirebrandFirebrand Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    No, I got an Audigy 2 actually. Gained somewhere around 5 FPS in WoW by disabling HW acceleration there, and tooltips for the option in games generally says it affects performance negatively.

    Firebrand on
  • ViolyntViolynt regular
    edited December 2007
    Really... I guess I am misinformed on the subject.

    Going to look into this later.

    Violynt on
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  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    It's probably because enabling hardware acceleration means you're actually doing more work on the audio to make it sound better, stuff like individual per-voice processing (yes I looked that up on the internets), better audio spatialization etc.

    Also, I hear WoW is a bit odd when it comes to sound.

    Rook on
  • MarlorMarlor Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Firebrand wrote: »
    No, I got an Audigy 2 actually. Gained somewhere around 5 FPS in WoW by disabling HW acceleration there, and tooltips for the option in games generally says it affects performance negatively.

    Is it an Audigy 2 Value?

    The Audigy Value cards are cheaper, because they use an inexpensive chipset. Unfortunately, this means that they have to do much of their processing in the driver, rather than in hardware. The result is a performance hit on CPU-dependent games.

    I was really unimpressed by my Audigy 2 Value, so I rarely used it. My X-Fi is a different story. I've noticed a bit of a performance gain from my X-Fi card, and EAX is certainly an improvement on games that use it well.

    Marlor on
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