Everyone in the raid should have one, ideally, but healers especially.
Seriously, everyone should have one just because it makes Rage an even cakier cake walk, and one fear break every 2 minutes compared to 0 fear breaks or 1 every 5 is a huge difference.
Couldn't it get a bit TOO cakey? Thus making it hard to walk? Like mud, except tastey? Tastey mud, mmmmmm.
How can cake be too cakey.
Cake is never terrible, especially if you combined it with something like Ice Cream or Cheese.
I'm pretty sure they make cheesecake by mashing provolone and cake together.
Nope, it's a very mild chedder.
What about mozzarella? Do they make any out of those?
Also,
Looks like I'm going to take over main tanking duties as soon as I finish leveling my Paladin. In the basic "pre-raid" gear, will I be able to tank both Attumen and Midnight? Trying to get an idea of what I'll be capable of.
That depends, how hard can your healers heal? I was able to tank both in pretty abysmal gear(Well Blues, an epic or two, and badge gear) so I think you can handle it in blues, you just can't drop holy shield, and your healers have to heal you like crazy.
I wouldn't think it would be all that hard on the healers. Since instead of having them split between a MT and OT, you'd have them all on just the MT.
Well instead of two tanks taking some damage, you're taking a ton of damage. Actually, it's not too bad, the real issue is crushings, since if you're not crush capped you could just outright get unlucky (I was uncrushable due to loads of block rating)
Soviet Waffle on
League of Legends: Studio
0
ThomamelasOnly one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered Userregular
Ho Boy. Sitting in a guild raid now as we make archimonde attempts. Our best? 87%
*cries*
They're obsessed with tanking him against the mountain so that "if the tank gets airbursted, he can get back within melee range" Screw spreading out.
And the fears? Let's not rely on the shammy, because, and I quote "Tremor totem is unreliable at best, we can't rely on that". So we Fear ward the druid who attempts to keep the tank up by himself for 6 seconds. We've wiped at every fear so far.
*cries*
There's so much wrong with this post. 1) TANK SHOULD NEVER GET AIR BURSTED. If he is, your melee are doing it wrong. 2) Tremor totem is awesome and should be utilized but beyond that, EVERY healer should have a PVP trinket. It's not hard to get, there's no excuse not to have this for that fight. Everyone in the raid should have one, ideally, but healers especially.
So yeah. Our Raid leader is a rogue who can't seem to stay at max distance, so if the tank gets airbursted, no one seems to be able "figure out how that happened". >.> (i.e, it was him or another rogue and no one can bitch).
Yeah, we've now finally gotten two healers their trinkets. Everyone else went and got the 5 minute one and showed up with that. I cried. Now organizing all healer AV groups.
It was just demoralizing.
After that, we went to Teron Gorefiend (2 hours on Arch, 2 on him). It was a little better, just being an easier fight, but it was constant wipes between 40-50%. (i.e. when we get overwhelmed by people not killing their things). I was seeing them come into the raid at 80ish percent. That means people hit them with one/two spirit lances. Just ouch. I found the simulator after raid and posted it, but eh, I gurantee only 10 or so out of the 25 people will do it.
I like my guild, I really do, but we seem to have a much larger portion of a 25 man raid that just shows up not knowing what the hell to do than other guilds, and those of us who pay attention are dragging their asses along.
We still have people who die on Rage Winterchill because they don't have either trinket (2 min or 5 min). I honestly hope the 10 people who keep dying get it soon, but if wishes were cake...
Archimonde & the later BT bosses sound like really cool fights. However, I know the idiots will make me weep on those fights.
*sigh* I feel like people are getting overconfident ("Hey, we can stop doing T5 content!") because we breezed through the first two Hyjal bosses + first three bosses in BT. Well, I'm pretty sure we'll get Kaz'rogal - I'm a little worried about on Gorefiend, because I believe he's next after Shade.
Half our raiders are in T5 gear, the other half is still wearing partial T4, mix of new recruits & bad luck with drops. I'm in the camp who thinks we still need to do T5 content, which seems to be in the minority.
I'm wondering, does anyone have some l33t insights into twins? We had 2 nights on them now (I wasn't there), but i'm told we're overwhelmed with raiddamage at the moment.
There's no real gearcheck in the first half of T6 content; if you can kill Naj'entus you can get to RoS without trouble. Ditto Hyjal. Especially with the way badge loot is now, there's no reason for a progression raid to farm T5 content when you could be killing T6 bosses.
Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
hold your head high soldier, it ain't over yet
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
I'm wondering, does anyone have some l33t insights into twins? We had 2 nights on them now (I wasn't there), but i'm told we're overwhelmed with raiddamage at the moment.
Warlocks can hellfire off the shadow debuff ; )
Junpei on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited April 2008
omfg:
Hex Lord to 2% last night.
And its my fault we wiped. I was paying too much attention to what the other raiders were doing and not enough to which Soul Siphon we were on. I got icetrapped and didn't bubble/cancel bubble in time.
Well I'm a pretty happy little GM right now. My new 10man crew cleared kara in 3.5 hrs on Sunday night, and decided to have a poke around ZA on Monday for the hell of it. 1-shotted Nalorakk and got Akil'zon on the 3rd attempt, all with a few of us still sporting half blue gear. After years of dragging dead weight along in other people's guilds, it's a very pleasant change having a small group of skilled folks who can follow instructions.
With Akil'zon, our biggest problem was people having copped a static disruption, then getting another chained onto them during the collapse before we could get another heal off on them. Any tricks to it, or do we just need to get quicker with the heals? I suspect we might have some people getting it chained onto them during the normal phase, so it might just be that some need to work on their positioning as well.
Aldarez on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited April 2008
[strike]Akil'zon[/strike]All of ZA is a healing fight.
We bring four healers to Akil'zon. Our DPS is geared to the gills, so we beat the enrage easily. Infact I think we bring four healers to everything except Nalorakk.
ZA is painful to heal, which annoys me, because it looks like plenty of fun to dps or tank
grumble grumble
its not bad
certainly more fun than most of kara, which, for the tank, is just "stand there and tank that shit".
Nalorakk we get to taunt between us.
Akil'zon I get to stand and tank and maybe throw out some heals during the storm.
Halazzi I'm either standing and tanking, but calling out totems, or picking up the Lynx when it spawns. Usually that is my job, which is pretty fun, although last night I tanked Halazzi.
Jan'alai I'm obviously on dragonhawks, which is fun.
Hex Lord I tank Hex Lord the whole time. Although its a tank and spank, I have a lot to watch for. If its the paladin soul siphon, I need to call for spellsteals, and move out of Consecrate. I have to turn off my autoattack for Thorns, and move out of ice traps on the Hunter siphon (I fail at this)
We did Akil'zon with 3.5 healers, the .5 being my prot pally in his +1300 healing gear topping up the raid. I'm not really used to healing though, and there were a few times when I wasted cast time topping up the tank when I should have been leaving him for the main healers to worry about. I'm sure we'll get it cleaner next run.
I'm told after the first 2 in ZA the difficulty scales up a bit. Truth in that?
healing hexlord as a holy paladin is like pulling teeth
but you only have one tooth left, and your tooth pot is on cooldown for another 3 minutes, and everybody is about to lose 3 more teeth (which happens every 30 seconds or so)
Little Jim on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
We did Akil'zon with 3.5 healers, the .5 being my prot pally in his +1300 healing gear topping up the raid. I'm not really used to healing though, and there were a few times when I wasted cast time topping up the tank when I should have been leaving him for the main healers to worry about. I'm sure we'll get it cleaner next run.
I'm told after the first 2 in ZA the difficulty scales up a bit. Truth in that?
Try it and see. Halazzi isn't difficult, its just a heal-intensive fight and dependent on your DPS being able to get the totems down quickly.
Jan'alai will probably hurt you.
I hate Halazzi but thats only because he drops no tank loot so I'm pretty much just killing him for other people to get loot. Which I am fine iwth but I don't feel the same thrill each time I down him as I do with Akil'zon (Amani Punisher, which I thankfully have now), Nalorakk's timed chest (nice tank shoulders in there), or Jan'alai (Bulwark of the Amani Empire)
We've been trying to get some really good timed ZA runs lately, but people just...suck. How an Illidan farming guild can't get 3 chests (at least) is just embarrassing at this point.
I'm wondering, does anyone have some l33t insights into twins? We had 2 nights on them now (I wasn't there), but i'm told we're overwhelmed with raiddamage at the moment.
Warlocks can hellfire off the shadow debuff ; )
And shadowpriests can sw: death of the fire debuff.... this much we found out already. Dark runes clear fire debuff for everyone. Anyone got a universal source of firedamage to self? Some obscure item?
I'm wondering, does anyone have some l33t insights into twins? We had 2 nights on them now (I wasn't there), but i'm told we're overwhelmed with raiddamage at the moment.
Warlocks can hellfire off the shadow debuff ; )
And shadowpriests can sw: death of the fire debuff.... this much we found out already. Dark runes clear fire debuff for everyone. Anyone got a universal source of firedamage to self? Some obscure item?
I'm wondering, does anyone have some l33t insights into twins? We had 2 nights on them now (I wasn't there), but i'm told we're overwhelmed with raiddamage at the moment.
Warlocks can hellfire off the shadow debuff ; )
And shadowpriests can sw: death of the fire debuff.... this much we found out already. Dark runes clear fire debuff for everyone. Anyone got a universal source of firedamage to self? Some obscure item?
do engineering charges hurt you?
Goblin Sapper charges would. But those have a 5-minute cooldown. And require engineering to use.
SabreMau on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
I'm wondering, does anyone have some l33t insights into twins? We had 2 nights on them now (I wasn't there), but i'm told we're overwhelmed with raiddamage at the moment.
Warlocks can hellfire off the shadow debuff ; )
And shadowpriests can sw: death of the fire debuff.... this much we found out already. Dark runes clear fire debuff for everyone. Anyone got a universal source of firedamage to self? Some obscure item?
do engineering charges hurt you?
Goblin Sapper charges would. But those have a 5-minute cooldown. And require engineering to use.
*and it was as if a million Sunwell raiders cried out in terror, and were silenced, then levelled Engineering and LEatherworking*
ZA is painful to heal, which annoys me, because it looks like plenty of fun to dps or tank
grumble grumble
ZA frequently makes me want to smash things. (I'm talking to you, DPS that spread waaaaaay out on Malacrass so I can't CoH but all cuddle for the Dragonhawk guy flame breath) Well, at least it makes Bloodboil seems less stressful.
We've been trying to get some really good timed ZA runs lately, but people just...suck. How an Illidan farming guild can't get 3 chests (at least) is just embarrassing at this point.
WTB group that can 2-heal and not fail...PLEASE.
What's your group like? People gave us shit for our "unorthodox" setup when we first started getting bears, but apparently unorthodox means "we didn't just stack melee."
Maybe it depends on your two healers? Shaman and druid seemed perfect for us. Especially if they had a shadow priest. First successful run for us was prot pally, feral druid, resto shaman, resto druid, holy priest, two hunters, two warlocks, and a rogue, with the resto shaman half DPSing/half healing. The next reset we swapped the holy priest for a shadow priest and one of the warlocks for an elemental shaman. We've gotten bears with any combination of this group including a second prot pally instead of the feral one time. It's pretty forgiving once you've got the same people doing it because every patrol and pull is done as if by a well-oiled machine. One night that I missed, Vent crashed halfway through and didn't come back up for awhile, and they still got a bear out of it.
With Akil'zon, our biggest problem was people having copped a static disruption, then getting another chained onto them during the collapse before we could get another heal off on them. Any tricks to it, or do we just need to get quicker with the heals? I suspect we might have some people getting it chained onto them during the normal phase, so it might just be that some need to work on their positioning as well.
You don't have to collapse to kill akil'zon. Have your range stack in three places in an L shape around akil'zon, and then just run to whoever gets stormed. Trying to collapse as an undergeared raid is an excellent way to get overwhelmed with AE damage very quickly.
ZA is painful to heal, which annoys me, because it looks like plenty of fun to dps or tank
grumble grumble
ZA frequently makes me want to smash things. (I'm talking to you, DPS that spread waaaaaay out on Malacrass so I can't CoH but all cuddle for the Dragonhawk guy flame breath) Well, at least it makes Bloodboil seems less stressful.
Offtanks that are to slow to follow the MT on the Lynx. God, I want to kill them with rusty spoons. Also Mages (or anyone, really) who fail at dodging the bombs at dragonhwak. If I can do it in my 80% runspeed treeform, you have exactly zero excuse.
The first time we took Waffle to a bear run he dropped a frost trap in the middle of the platform so half of us couldn't see the bombs on the ground, true story!
Though the best was the first time we did it without our second hunter and forgot that he's usually the one to kill the second hatcher, so suddenly we had both sides of eggs hatched at once. We still didn't wipe but oh god dragonhawk rape everywhere.
Posts
Cheese? Seriously?
Nope, it's a very mild chedder.
Also,
Looks like I'm going to take over main tanking duties as soon as I finish leveling my Paladin. In the basic "pre-raid" gear, will I be able to tank both Attumen and Midnight? Trying to get an idea of what I'll be capable of.
which is a tall order for the beginning of karazan
Well instead of two tanks taking some damage, you're taking a ton of damage. Actually, it's not too bad, the real issue is crushings, since if you're not crush capped you could just outright get unlucky (I was uncrushable due to loads of block rating)
It's the spike damage that would suck. It depends on how much stamina and badge gear you're wearing.
So yeah. Our Raid leader is a rogue who can't seem to stay at max distance, so if the tank gets airbursted, no one seems to be able "figure out how that happened". >.> (i.e, it was him or another rogue and no one can bitch).
Yeah, we've now finally gotten two healers their trinkets. Everyone else went and got the 5 minute one and showed up with that. I cried. Now organizing all healer AV groups.
It was just demoralizing.
After that, we went to Teron Gorefiend (2 hours on Arch, 2 on him). It was a little better, just being an easier fight, but it was constant wipes between 40-50%. (i.e. when we get overwhelmed by people not killing their things). I was seeing them come into the raid at 80ish percent. That means people hit them with one/two spirit lances. Just ouch. I found the simulator after raid and posted it, but eh, I gurantee only 10 or so out of the 25 people will do it.
I like my guild, I really do, but we seem to have a much larger portion of a 25 man raid that just shows up not knowing what the hell to do than other guilds, and those of us who pay attention are dragging their asses along.
Archimonde & the later BT bosses sound like really cool fights. However, I know the idiots will make me weep on those fights.
*sigh* I feel like people are getting overconfident ("Hey, we can stop doing T5 content!") because we breezed through the first two Hyjal bosses + first three bosses in BT. Well, I'm pretty sure we'll get Kaz'rogal - I'm a little worried about on Gorefiend, because I believe he's next after Shade.
Half our raiders are in T5 gear, the other half is still wearing partial T4, mix of new recruits & bad luck with drops. I'm in the camp who thinks we still need to do T5 content, which seems to be in the minority.
There's no real gearcheck in the first half of T6 content; if you can kill Naj'entus you can get to RoS without trouble. Ditto Hyjal. Especially with the way badge loot is now, there's no reason for a progression raid to farm T5 content when you could be killing T6 bosses.
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
Warlocks can hellfire off the shadow debuff ; )
Hex Lord to 2% last night.
And its my fault we wiped. I was paying too much attention to what the other raiders were doing and not enough to which Soul Siphon we were on. I got icetrapped and didn't bubble/cancel bubble in time.
With Akil'zon, our biggest problem was people having copped a static disruption, then getting another chained onto them during the collapse before we could get another heal off on them. Any tricks to it, or do we just need to get quicker with the heals? I suspect we might have some people getting it chained onto them during the normal phase, so it might just be that some need to work on their positioning as well.
We bring four healers to Akil'zon. Our DPS is geared to the gills, so we beat the enrage easily. Infact I think we bring four healers to everything except Nalorakk.
My guild could not (and at present still cannot, though we haven't been at it long) down Halazzi with 3 healers. Just wasn't gonna happen.
grumble grumble
its not bad
certainly more fun than most of kara, which, for the tank, is just "stand there and tank that shit".
Nalorakk we get to taunt between us.
Akil'zon I get to stand and tank and maybe throw out some heals during the storm.
Halazzi I'm either standing and tanking, but calling out totems, or picking up the Lynx when it spawns. Usually that is my job, which is pretty fun, although last night I tanked Halazzi.
Jan'alai I'm obviously on dragonhawks, which is fun.
Hex Lord I tank Hex Lord the whole time. Although its a tank and spank, I have a lot to watch for. If its the paladin soul siphon, I need to call for spellsteals, and move out of Consecrate. I have to turn off my autoattack for Thorns, and move out of ice traps on the Hunter siphon (I fail at this)
I'm told after the first 2 in ZA the difficulty scales up a bit. Truth in that?
but you only have one tooth left, and your tooth pot is on cooldown for another 3 minutes, and everybody is about to lose 3 more teeth (which happens every 30 seconds or so)
Try it and see. Halazzi isn't difficult, its just a heal-intensive fight and dependent on your DPS being able to get the totems down quickly.
Jan'alai will probably hurt you.
I hate Halazzi but thats only because he drops no tank loot so I'm pretty much just killing him for other people to get loot. Which I am fine iwth but I don't feel the same thrill each time I down him as I do with Akil'zon (Amani Punisher, which I thankfully have now), Nalorakk's timed chest (nice tank shoulders in there), or Jan'alai (Bulwark of the Amani Empire)
WTB group that can 2-heal and not fail...PLEASE.
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
And shadowpriests can sw: death of the fire debuff.... this much we found out already. Dark runes clear fire debuff for everyone. Anyone got a universal source of firedamage to self? Some obscure item?
prot pally, prot warrior
2 fire mages
1 hunter
1 enhance shaman
1 rogue
1 CoH priest
1 resto shammy
1 warlock
Usually at least 7 minutes to spare, 7 times in a row. Still haven't killed illidan yet.
Its all about the trash, and not stopping for loot.
do engineering charges hurt you?
Goblin Sapper charges would. But those have a 5-minute cooldown. And require engineering to use.
*and it was as if a million Sunwell raiders cried out in terror, and were silenced, then levelled Engineering and LEatherworking*
ZA frequently makes me want to smash things. (I'm talking to you, DPS that spread waaaaaay out on Malacrass so I can't CoH but all cuddle for the Dragonhawk guy flame breath) Well, at least it makes Bloodboil seems less stressful.
What's your group like? People gave us shit for our "unorthodox" setup when we first started getting bears, but apparently unorthodox means "we didn't just stack melee."
Maybe it depends on your two healers? Shaman and druid seemed perfect for us. Especially if they had a shadow priest. First successful run for us was prot pally, feral druid, resto shaman, resto druid, holy priest, two hunters, two warlocks, and a rogue, with the resto shaman half DPSing/half healing. The next reset we swapped the holy priest for a shadow priest and one of the warlocks for an elemental shaman. We've gotten bears with any combination of this group including a second prot pally instead of the feral one time. It's pretty forgiving once you've got the same people doing it because every patrol and pull is done as if by a well-oiled machine. One night that I missed, Vent crashed halfway through and didn't come back up for awhile, and they still got a bear out of it.
You don't have to collapse to kill akil'zon. Have your range stack in three places in an L shape around akil'zon, and then just run to whoever gets stormed. Trying to collapse as an undergeared raid is an excellent way to get overwhelmed with AE damage very quickly.
Offtanks that are to slow to follow the MT on the Lynx. God, I want to kill them with rusty spoons. Also Mages (or anyone, really) who fail at dodging the bombs at dragonhwak. If I can do it in my 80% runspeed treeform, you have exactly zero excuse.
Though the best was the first time we did it without our second hunter and forgot that he's usually the one to kill the second hatcher, so suddenly we had both sides of eggs hatched at once. We still didn't wipe but oh god dragonhawk rape everywhere.