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End of tenancy dispute
-Spitfire-
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
A bit of background is necessary to get the full picture, but I'll try to keep it brief (haha).
6 months ago, I signed a 6 month lease on a 2-bedroom suite in the lower part of a house (which I occupied by myself with my 2 cats for the entire period). I found this house through the aid of a friend, who was renting the upper part.
When I moved in, she told me that I could share her internet and cable TV and that, together with my portion of the electrical/water/other household bills, I would owe her a flat $110 per month. To my mind, this sounded reasonable. I promptly gave her cheques at the beginning of all 6 months for the agreed amount. As we both rent our parts from a separate individual who does not live on the property, I do not pay my rent to her.
We have since had a falling-out, and I have found that the house is too far away from everything I want to be close to (work, friends, places I want to go) and is too expensive for me to pay for by myself. I will not be re-negotiating the lease with the landlord, and am moving out at the end of the month.
Yesterday I got an email from her, stating that she loaned me some furniture which she wants back (whicih is of course not a problem) and the following:
"There is also a small matter with the hydro. The utilities were 60/40 and the amount asked of you was calculated over the last two years but there seems to have been a huge spike in the consumption of Hydro over the last three months, that you will have to pay your part of. Last year January the usage was 72 kWhs and this January it was 124 kWhs. The hydro has doubled in costs. Instead of the usual $115.00 it is now $240.00. So for the last three months the total for your 40% of Hydro is $150.00. You can make the cheque out to [the guy she lives with]. Thanks."
Now, I'm not trying to screw anyone here as I would just like to leave quietly and not cause any more problems, but I do get the distinct feeling that sentiment is not being returned.
First of all, I have never, ever seen a hydro bill for the house I'm staying in, so as far as I am concerned these numbers mean nothing. I have done nothing outrageous in terms of my energy consumption during any of the time I have been living in the suite. I have a computer, small TV, and I use the oven and stove on a regular basis like a normal human being. 3 months ago was approximately the time I would have turned on the heat for the winter, which I would think was reasonable. I do like to be comfortable, and the place isn't exactly a sauna. I do also turn the heat down when I go out, since that seems reasonable and responsible.
I did contact the landlord to confirm the numbers she stated for hydro usage last January to see if the comparison was fair, and he told me that the suite I am in (which is the only other one in the house) was not occupied until March last year, and thus was empty during the time she is quoting. It doesn't seem like rocket science to me that the cost for heating two suites would be more than heating only one.
What is my standing in this situation? As far as I am aware, we had a verbal contract (which can be proven by the fact that she happily cashed all the cheques I gave her and never said a peep about the amount) and I have fulfulled every aspect of what we agreed. I don't think she has any legal standing to either go to take me to small claims court (which I wouldn't put past her) or go to the landlord and try to demand part of my deposit from him to cover the "overuse" amount. If she made a mistake in her initial calculations based on occupancy in one suite instead of two, that's not my fault. If she noticed a discrepancy 3 months ago, she could have contacted me to renegotiate our agreement, which I would have done. As she sent me this email on the 21st, and I am moving out on Sunday (ie. less than a week) to my feeling it's a bit late to be trying to squeeze it out of me now as I'm walking out the door.
I've given some serious thought to this but need some confirmation on the validity of my reasoning - is it correct? Does she have any power over me in this situation at all, or any legal reason to be upset if I don't roll over and cough up the cash? As I said, I don't want to screw anyone, but I don't want to be taken advantage of either.
6 months ago, I signed a 6 month lease on a 2-bedroom suite in the lower part of a house (which I occupied by myself with my 2 cats for the entire period). I found this house through the aid of a friend, who was renting the upper part.
When I moved in, she told me that I could share her internet and cable TV and that, together with my portion of the electrical/water/other household bills, I would owe her a flat $110 per month. To my mind, this sounded reasonable. I promptly gave her cheques at the beginning of all 6 months for the agreed amount. As we both rent our parts from a separate individual who does not live on the property, I do not pay my rent to her.
We have since had a falling-out, and I have found that the house is too far away from everything I want to be close to (work, friends, places I want to go) and is too expensive for me to pay for by myself. I will not be re-negotiating the lease with the landlord, and am moving out at the end of the month.
Yesterday I got an email from her, stating that she loaned me some furniture which she wants back (whicih is of course not a problem) and the following:
"There is also a small matter with the hydro. The utilities were 60/40 and the amount asked of you was calculated over the last two years but there seems to have been a huge spike in the consumption of Hydro over the last three months, that you will have to pay your part of. Last year January the usage was 72 kWhs and this January it was 124 kWhs. The hydro has doubled in costs. Instead of the usual $115.00 it is now $240.00. So for the last three months the total for your 40% of Hydro is $150.00. You can make the cheque out to [the guy she lives with]. Thanks."
Now, I'm not trying to screw anyone here as I would just like to leave quietly and not cause any more problems, but I do get the distinct feeling that sentiment is not being returned.
First of all, I have never, ever seen a hydro bill for the house I'm staying in, so as far as I am concerned these numbers mean nothing. I have done nothing outrageous in terms of my energy consumption during any of the time I have been living in the suite. I have a computer, small TV, and I use the oven and stove on a regular basis like a normal human being. 3 months ago was approximately the time I would have turned on the heat for the winter, which I would think was reasonable. I do like to be comfortable, and the place isn't exactly a sauna. I do also turn the heat down when I go out, since that seems reasonable and responsible.
I did contact the landlord to confirm the numbers she stated for hydro usage last January to see if the comparison was fair, and he told me that the suite I am in (which is the only other one in the house) was not occupied until March last year, and thus was empty during the time she is quoting. It doesn't seem like rocket science to me that the cost for heating two suites would be more than heating only one.
What is my standing in this situation? As far as I am aware, we had a verbal contract (which can be proven by the fact that she happily cashed all the cheques I gave her and never said a peep about the amount) and I have fulfulled every aspect of what we agreed. I don't think she has any legal standing to either go to take me to small claims court (which I wouldn't put past her) or go to the landlord and try to demand part of my deposit from him to cover the "overuse" amount. If she made a mistake in her initial calculations based on occupancy in one suite instead of two, that's not my fault. If she noticed a discrepancy 3 months ago, she could have contacted me to renegotiate our agreement, which I would have done. As she sent me this email on the 21st, and I am moving out on Sunday (ie. less than a week) to my feeling it's a bit late to be trying to squeeze it out of me now as I'm walking out the door.
I've given some serious thought to this but need some confirmation on the validity of my reasoning - is it correct? Does she have any power over me in this situation at all, or any legal reason to be upset if I don't roll over and cough up the cash? As I said, I don't want to screw anyone, but I don't want to be taken advantage of either.
-Spitfire- on
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edit: just saw where you have the evidence of $110 a month. Nevermind my previous statement, tell her no thank you, politely. I doubt she'll take you to court for $150.
Remind her that you had agreed to $110 per month, and as you've been living there for half a year, there's been plenty of time for her to renegotiate before now. If she made a mistake, well, it's on her onus to cover it, and any reimbursement you give her is up to your discretion.
Sorry for the confusion, when I said "hydro" I should have included water in that as well. We agreed on $110 per month for "my part of the household bills which are shared" - which I would assume to be electricity, water, internet, Cable TV, garbage pickup, and anything else that would fall under that category. I pay for a separate phone line (which is my cel) and that is the only un-shared bill I have.
I wouldn't mind just giving her the money because at one time she had been a good friend to me and I really detest fighting over stupid stuff - but the fact is that I'm broke and don't have it, and she knows that, too. I'm having a hard time coming up with the money to move in the first place, but I have to because the place is too expensive.
However, given her behaviour towards me over the past few months and now this, it seems that she is trying to take advantage of my already vulnerable situation, and trying to pull one over on me because she views me as being in the weaker position. She can be a very domineering and threatening person (and also very wealthy, meaning she could happily take me to court for the fun of it) and I am not looking forward to this dispute. This is why I want to make sure I'm in the clear before I go forward.
I live in the Vancouver, BC area, and waited on the phone last night for about 40 minutes for a tenancy dispute agent for advice as well, before I gave up on waiting.
I know she had a dispute with a person who was renting the same suite from March onwards last year. Though from my understanding he may have brought most of it on himself, it still seems she has a track record of being difficult and unreasonable to live with, which is another reason why I am trying to excuse myself quietly from the situation and not intentionally cause any problems.
Also, notice in her email that she admits "The amount asked of you was this." The other party is ALREADY admitting that you have a previous agreement.
If not, and none of the bills are in your name and there isn't a contract regarding what you owe for utilities, then she's pretty much done. You made a verbal agreement on a flat rate and she cashed the cheques, which carries the implication of agreement. I can't even imagine her taking you to court over this anyway.
EDIT: Were you subletting? Or did you have a direct agreement with the landlord?
We are both renting from the same landlord, with whom we both have our own separate direct agreements. The landlord is not involved in any part of the utility agreement though, and my upstairs neighbour is not involved in my rental agreement (beyond helping me find it).
I really don't know why she would feel the need to do this, but I guess maybe she feels the need to "get her last digs in" at me before I'm gone.
This is it.
If you have an agreement with your landlord, and have paid a deposit to him, she cannot go and demand part of your deposit to cover anything. Pretty sure it would be illegal for the landlord to hand over your money to cover something he has no involvement in, or knowledge of.
If you had an agreement, and you kept up your end of it, my advice would just be to ignore the childish attempt to get the last laugh. Don't even give this person the satisfaction of a response. You are out of there in a few days, and wont have to deal with it after that.
This here. You and her agreed to this amount to pay the bills, that is all you need.
Don't be afraid of small claims court. Lawyers are not allowed. All it is are two people explaining their side of the story to magistrate and him making a ruling.
Her argument is moot even if you left the heating on all summer and trippled the bill you agreed to a set amount each month which was a mistake on her part.
Satans..... hints.....