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Are you reading CRIMINAL? (Issue #2 on sale 4/9/2008 - Maybe?)

13

Posts

  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited March 2008
    My pull list at the LCS is shrinking to just three titles a month by the end of the summer, and Criminal is one of those three. I might not even be able to buy those three, but god damn it I will figure out some way to affor $3.50 a month for this book.

    wwtMask on
    When he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
    Twitter - @liberaltruths | Google+ - http://gplus.to/wwtMask | Occupy Tallahassee
  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited March 2008
    wwtMask wrote: »
    My pull list at the LCS is shrinking to just three titles a month by the end of the summer, and Criminal is one of those three. I might not even be able to buy those three, but god damn it I will figure out some way to affor $3.50 a month for this book.

    You could save $3.50 a month by switching to generic cereal and generic toilet paper, or unplugging all your electronics whenever they're not in use. That last one's also good for the environment!

    And if destroying the planet is more important to you than reading comics, then you're just not the man I thought you were.

    Robos A Go Go on
  • wwtMaskwwtMask Registered User regular
    edited March 2008
    Doesn't quite work that way. Any money that isn't going to bills and food and other necessities is going straight to buying things for my little girl. I think I'll actually have to decrease the amount of money I'm allowed to spend on eating out at lunch once a week (about 5 or 6 dollars) to afford the $10 a month I'd need to buy these comics. Comics or food, that is the question. :|

    wwtMask on
    When he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
    Twitter - @liberaltruths | Google+ - http://gplus.to/wwtMask | Occupy Tallahassee
  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited March 2008
    wwtMask wrote: »
    Doesn't quite work that way. Any money that isn't going to bills and food and other necessities is going straight to buying things for my little girl. I think I'll actually have to decrease the amount of money I'm allowed to spend on eating out at lunch once a week (about 5 or 6 dollars) to afford the $10 a month I'd need to buy these comics. Comics or food, that is the question. :|

    Peanut Butter and Jelly with fresh fruit and whole carrots on the side until your daughter goes to college! It'll probably be healthier than anything that costs five or six dollars a day too. You'll be leaner and well read.

    Robos A Go Go on
  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited March 2008
    Marvel.com has the release date for Criminal 2 #2 as "IN STORES: April 9, 2008".

    Plan accordingly.

    Crimsondude on
  • LuxLux Registered User regular
    edited March 2008
    They didn't have #2 today so I just bought #1.

    It's pretty cool!

    Lux on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    10 page colored/lettered preview of issue #2, on sale next week:

    http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=preview&id=42&disp=table

    jkylefulton on
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  • JRoseyJRosey SeattleRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Can't wait.

    JRosey on
    XBL: Cathadal
  • Sars_BoySars_Boy Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    okay if I pick up Criminal 2 without having read anything else will I be good?

    I plan on picking up the trades but I can't find 1 anywhere, so I'm gonna order it from Amazon soon

    Sars_Boy on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Yep, you'll be fine.

    jkylefulton on
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  • Sars_BoySars_Boy Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    awesome

    Sars_Boy on
  • mugginnsmugginns Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I picked up Criminal trade #1 and loved it. If the store still has trade #2 I'll pick it up this week when I go to get my comics and hopefully the new issue of Criminal!

    mugginns on
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  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/03/31/marvel-month-to-month-sales-february-2008/

    02/07 —
    03/07 Criminal #5 - 16,389 ( -2.6%)
    04/07 —
    05/07 Criminal #6 - 15,720 ( -4.1%)
    06/07 Criminal #7 - 15,214 ( -3.2%)
    07/07 —
    08/07 Criminal #8 - 15,169 ( -0.3%)
    09/07 Criminal #9 - 14,768 ( -2.6%)
    10/07 —
    11/07 Criminal #10 - 14,539 ( -1.6%)
    12/07 —
    01/08 —
    02/08 Criminal #1 - 18,655 (+28.3%)
    6 mnth (+23.0%)
    1 year ( — )

    02/08 Kick-Ass #1 - 47,841

    jkylefulton on
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  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Motherfucker.

    Crimsondude on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    It's not a bad little bump, but I really don't understand what Brubaker and Phillips have to do. I mean, it's probably wrong to expect similar numbers, since JRJR is a more popular artist than Phillips, and since it's a superhero book instead of a crime book, but....c'mon! A 30k gap?

    Looking at numbers like that, or fuck, looking at the numbers that shit like COUNTDOWN does - I really don't know how creators handle it. I'd go crazy if my financial well-being rested in the hands of people that order 280,000 copies of COUNTDOWN in a month (or40-50k copies of each COUNTDOWN spinoff).

    jkylefulton on
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  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    It's the genre. And people just sucking.

    Crimsondude on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Oh, my WOWIO guy asked me if you were able to forward his contact information to Bru.

    jkylefulton on
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  • MunchMunch Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You know, 18k really isn't bad. At all. It's basically an indie book that just happens to be published by Marvel, so for it to be doing numbers comparable to Hellboy and Invincible (which are considered smashing successes for their publishers), and outselling virtually the entire Vertigo line (excluding Fables) is quite a feat. It'd probably have to fall to around 6k to get axed, if Vertigo's cancellations are anything to go by.

    Sure it sucks that KICK ASS is outselling it, but Millar's a one man hype machine working within a known genre, so it's to be expected.

    Munch on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Vertigo's cancellations are not anything to go by, since ICON and Vertigo have radically different deals - ICON pays for everything entirely out of the creator's pockets, whereas Vertigo is still under the financial umbrella of DC for marketing, printing, and everything else.

    jkylefulton on
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  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Oh, crap. I totally spaced on that. It was about the time I was earning the ring, so it just slipped through the cracks.

    Anyway, the book wouldn't be cancelled by Marvel as far as I can tell. It'd be cancelled by Brubaker, et al. because they can't personally afford to publish it.

    And God bless that volume 2 bump, but when I got that e-mail from Ed I nearly shit. "Oh, great. We get the last one-shot and then *poof*." Now, Criminal 2 #4 is solicited for June as part 1 of a 4-part arc. So things may have changed since that e-mail. I haven't contacted him since then to ask. A bump like that may, may, have been enough to keep Phillips paid. Close as I can tell, it'd take at least 20k a month just for Brubaker to make money.

    Crimsondude on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Ah, I'll let my WOWIO guy know that you'll be forwarding the info shortly - he seemed very keen on CRIMINAL, and I know it's proving to be a viable distribution model for lots of creators (plus, you can find lots of stuff there, like the complete Alan Moore SUPREME run, all free, all legal).

    jkylefulton on
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  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Damn.

    Crimsondude on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    http://www.wowio.com

    He's looking into getting a lot of out-of-print creator owned stuff from the 70s-now up on there as well - I mean, even if the downloads only translate into additional revenue equivalent to 1000 copies / month, it's basically free money for the creators (ie a way for creators to reap the benefits of back issues by cutting out the middle man).

    jkylefulton on
    tOkYVT2.jpg
  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Sent.

    Crimsondude on
  • MunchMunch Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Vertigo's cancellations are not anything to go by, since ICON and Vertigo have radically different deals - ICON pays for everything entirely out of the creator's pockets, whereas Vertigo is still under the financial umbrella of DC for marketing, printing, and everything else.

    I would say Vertigo is even less lenient on books than Image, Icon, etc. Because like you said, DC has a lot more overhead to cover with promotion and such. As long as Criminal generates enough revenue for them to publish and distribute it, they won't cancel it. Books published by Marvel/DC under their main banners aren't afforded that luxury, as they're expected to not only generate enough money to cover printing, distribution, and the retailers, but they also have to make enough money to pay the creators and generate enough revenue to make the book profitable for the company.

    Once again, look at books like Invincible, Astounding Wolf-Man, Atomic Robo, Powers, Dynamo 5, Noble Causes, Walking Dead, and others that operate under a similar publishing scheme as Icon. These books are selling 5-20k and are looked at as massive successes by both their creators and the companies that publish them. Unless Brubaker and Phillips have a serious addiction to gold-plated whores, the book should be generating enough revenue to pay them a decent wage. Even if it wasn't, Brubaker is writing a few high tier books that guarantee him regular pay and allow him to afford a pay cut on Criminal. Maybe Phillips demands more money than other indie comics guys like Mike Oeming or Ryan Ottley. I don't know. But going purely off the numbers, Criminal would appear to be a mild success, and certainly not the doomed, flaming ship sinking into the ocean that some people would seem to think it is.

    Munch on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You should probably read one of the Brubaker interviews posted in this thread, Munch. For example, the one on the first page, where Bru mentions that he doesn't get paid at all, and that they barely make enough to pay Phillips and the colorist for their time.

    jkylefulton on
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  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Brubaker wrote:
    People think that because we're coming out of Marvel, that somehow that makes it successful. But it doesn't work that way. It really is based on sales. If the book doesn't sell, Sean and [colorist] Val [Staples] don't get paid. I mean, I still have not taken a dime on Criminal. I've either given it all to those guys or set it aside in, like, a rainy day fund for anytime the book doesn't make enough money to pay them. I just want the book to exist. I'm happy to write it for free.

    jkylefulton on
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  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Wow, Brubaker sounds like a stand-up guy.

    Robos A Go Go on
  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    He was a cartoonist. In theory he could do the art himself. But it pays to have a real art team onboard.

    I'm not being pessimistic just because I am. It's mainly because this is the e-mail he sent me when I asked him about sales:
    Me
    Some friends and online acquaintances wanted me to ask you if there were any numbers on how well Criminal vol.2 no. 1 has sold since its release.


    I hope it's been selling well.


    Ed Brubaker to me


    We've been getting decent reorders, but it's still an uphill battle, sadly. Have to see what the orders are for the next few issues to really know how it's doing.

    Crimsondude on
  • WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Wowio wrote:
    Do I have to be a United States resident to sign up to WOWIO?
    For now, WOWIO is only available to people living in the United States. Copyright laws vary by country and currently our licensing restrictions limit distribution to U.S. residents.

    Dammnit!

    Wildcat on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    http://freakangels.com/whitechapel/comments.php?DiscussionID=1719

    Week-long Q&A with Brubaker at Ellis' WHITECHAPEL site. Check it out and participate!

    jkylefulton on
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  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I bought the first Criminal trade. Is the story found within meant to be self-contained, or are the loose ends revisited in subsequent issues?

    Robos A Go Go on
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I'd say both - you get a full story during an arc, but Brubaker revisits the characters later. For example, characters from COWARD show up in LAWLESS, and Bru has said that he has plans on following up on COWARD soon (one more self contained issue (#3), an arc with the cripple from LAWLESS, and then the COWARD follow-up).

    tl:dr - It's very similar to the way Miller weaves characters in and out of various SIN CITY arcs. I hope that answers the question.

    jkylefulton on
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  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    And an answer from Brubaker himself:
    Bru wrote:
    You can read them in any order. All the Criminal books stand on their own. That said, if you read Coward before Lawless, you get a few Easter Eggs in Lawless, basically. The main plan for Criminal was that each book would be completely new-reader friendly. If you're going to do crime comics, we figured, you need to keep them uncluttered for new eyes.

    jkylefulton on
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  • mugginnsmugginns Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I actually won $30 from the comic store for guessing the right team in the NCAA tourney, so I picked up the 2nd trade of this. Look forward to reading it this weekend. Coward was really good, and I also have the 2nd monthly issue to read, but I don't want to mix up the two so I'll read the trade first.

    mugginns on
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  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You can read the new series before you read the trade, it won't mess anything up for you.

    Personally, I think the latest issue is the strongest CRIMINAL story he's told yet.

    jkylefulton on
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  • mugginnsmugginns Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You can read the new series before you read the trade, it won't mess anything up for you.

    Personally, I think the latest issue is the strongest CRIMINAL story he's told yet.

    Yeah what I meant is I don't want to get the two stories confused. I might actually go back and read Criminal #1 issue beforehand, because I read so much sometimes I confuse stories

    mugginns on
    E26cO.jpg
  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Ah, right on. I understand completely.

    jkylefulton on
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  • CrimsondudeCrimsondude Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Remember when I mentioned REAL ownership and control a minute ago? If I had done Sleeper creator-owned, I'd be a multimillionaire by now.

    !!


    I love the title in this Q:
    Ed,
    I really enjoyed "A Complete Lowlife" (with thanks to ye olde artbomb for pointing me towards it). Will there ever be a continuation of your pseudo-autobiography? Perhaps "A Comic Highlife" (lame, I know), which would chronicle your outstanding success?

    Crimsondude on
  • Success is kind of boring, so I bet he won't!

    The Geebs That Knows Everything About Animorphs on
This discussion has been closed.