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Passage - Life and Death in 500KB.

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Posts

  • MunacraMunacra Registered User
    edited January 2008
    I feel that it is too big of a message and it is blatantly presented. For a message of that magnitude (the passage of life and death) too resonate with someone it needs to be hidden and told under the surface, so that you are able to interpret and personalize the message.

    I don't know if I said this very well, but it's the iceberg rule. 90 percent of what you are trying to say in creative works should be subtext. I feel the blocks(obstacles), the woman slowing you down(losing freedom but gaining security since you are not alone anymore), and the treasure chests (money/goals that don't bring happiness) were good analogies, but too obvious ones. Or at least, not deftly woven enough.

    Munacra on
  • LewiePLewieP Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    I think it had a big impact on me because on my first play through, I didn't even realise that you could move up or down. That spoke volumes to me.

    LewieP on
  • BigKevBigKev Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Man, i played this months ago, and absolutely loved. A tremendous work.

    BigKev on
    Steam ID : BigKev87
  • Rear Admiral ChocoRear Admiral Choco Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    I felt a huge lump in my throat when my wife finally died.

    LewieP's comment actually made me tear up a little. :(

    This game is pretty powerful for what it is.

    Rear Admiral Choco on
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  • ÆthelredÆthelred Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    This game has been way too hyped up; I might have enjoyed it otherwise.

    Æthelred on
    pokes: 1505 8032 8399
  • Lave IILave II Registered User
    edited January 2008
    If you don't like this game you are dead inside, or you've yet to face the issues it tackles.

    Lave II on
  • ben0207ben0207 Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    That has to be the most emotionally powerful five minutes of gaming ever.

    God, I'm genuinely shook up by it.

    ben0207 on
  • LeitnerLeitner Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Lave II wrote: »
    If you don't like this game you are dead inside, or you've yet to face the issues it tackles.

    or not in your teens anymore. I'm really failing to see how people are finding this at all powerful. The message is so basic it's cringe worthy. The 'wife holds you back' is a childish load of bollocks and everything else was pretty sub par. The blured future/past was the only interesting thing to come out of the whole endeavour.

    Leitner on
  • MunacraMunacra Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Why couldn't the wife help you climb blocks or perhaps find treasure? It's a bit misogynistic to say that marrying someone will only tie you down. Why can't you have the choice to be happy? This is just a nihilistic representation of life with a bunch of pixels that fails to take account that the player of a game, just as a person living his life, can make choices that bring him happiness.

    Munacra on
  • LewiePLewieP Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Leitner wrote: »
    Lave II wrote: »
    If you don't like this game you are dead inside, or you've yet to face the issues it tackles.

    or not in your teens anymore. I'm really failing to see how people are finding this at all powerful. The message is so basic it's cringe worthy. The 'wife holds you back' is a childish load of bollocks and everything else was pretty sub par. The blured future/past was the only interesting thing to come out of the whole endeavour.

    The wife does not hold you back. Sacrificing exploration to be with your wife is a worthy achievement, and it even nets you more points.

    LewieP on
  • arod_77arod_77 __BANNED USERS
    edited January 2008
    Totally empty. What are those backgrounds supposed to tell me?

    arod_77 on
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  • arod_77arod_77 __BANNED USERS
    edited January 2008
    Also, "We believe in nothing Lebowski"

    arod_77 on
    glitteratsigcopy.jpg
  • 12gauge12gauge Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Leitner wrote: »
    Lave II wrote: »
    If you don't like this game you are dead inside, or you've yet to face the issues it tackles.

    or not in your teens anymore. I'm really failing to see how people are finding this at all powerful. The message is so basic it's cringe worthy. The 'wife holds you back' is a childish load of bollocks and everything else was pretty sub par. The blured future/past was the only interesting thing to come out of the whole endeavour.

    This. The whole game did nothing for me.

    Edit: Truth to be told though, I never get emotionally involved with games or the characters.

    12gauge on
    davidoc0.jpg
  • Lave IILave II Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Leitner wrote: »
    Lave II wrote: »
    If you don't like this game you are dead inside, or you've yet to face the issues it tackles.

    or not in your teens anymore. I'm really failing to see how people are finding this at all powerful. The message is so basic it's cringe worthy. The 'wife holds you back' is a childish load of bollocks and everything else was pretty sub par. The blured future/past was the only interesting thing to come out of the whole endeavour.

    In my teens this wouldn't have effected me much, and now I'm in my mid 20's and facing a massive choice between GF and Career, the game couldn't be more appropriate.

    Lave II on
  • Lave IILave II Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Munacra wrote: »
    Why couldn't the wife help you climb blocks or perhaps find treasure? It's a bit misogynistic to say that marrying someone will only tie you down. Why can't you have the choice to be happy? This is just a nihilistic representation of life with a bunch of pixels that fails to take account that the player of a game, just as a person living his life, can make choices that bring him happiness.

    Thats not the point. Your taking it far to literally. This game would work just the same if you swapped the two characters genders.

    Whenever you walk through your life with some else your options diminish, but the worth of the options remaining can dramatically increase. Because no couple with ever have identical aims in life.

    This is represented by treasure chests being harder to get too with a partner to represent how achieving your aims in life is HARDER with a partner than alone, but the rewards/points scored for each treasure cheast is HIGHER because you've someone to share it with.

    For instance, As an astronomer (and British astronomy being fucked) I could go get a job in Hawaii and leave all my friends and partner behind, but my GF wouldn't be able to work there. So I would be alone again.

    It's an difficult aspect of life, and it's amazing that a 500kb game can make me reflect on that so much.

    Lave II on
  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2008
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    Khavall on
  • 12gauge12gauge Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Khavall wrote: »
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    IMHO, there is not much subcontext - honestly, most messages the game tries to convey are pushed on me, there is just not a lot to interpret in the game.

    12gauge on
    davidoc0.jpg
  • Lave IILave II Registered User
    edited January 2008
    12gauge wrote: »
    Khavall wrote: »
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    IMHO, there is not much subcontext - honestly, most messages the game tries to convey are pushed on me, there is just not a lot to interpret in the game.

    Seriously? Try finding something which makes such a wonderfully poignant exploration of human life in 5 fucking minutes.

    Two quotes from another forum I frequent about this game:
    First time I played, I missed the maze too. I just plodded on from left to right, married the first girl I saw and died without ever having sought or earned any rewards. It was a safe but ultimately unsatisfying life, devoid of all rewards and disappointments. Nothing ventured, nothing gained, but nothing lost either, apart from opportunities. A sad commentary on the way some people live their real lives.

    On my second play, I found the maze and went all-out for the chests, exploring every passage, leaving no stone unturned. I did pretty well for myself, but in my eagerness to clock up the riches, I left the girl behind and died alone. Perhaps there's a lesson here too. I think I'll buy my partner a bunch of flowers on the way home.
    Definitely something you have to play without knowing what's going to happen.

    I got the wife and found her irritating because I couldn't navigate the maze properly with two people. And then when the wife died (I was expecting them to both die at the same time, so I was a little shocked when she died first) I felt sad because all along I'd been wishing she wasn't there, and then suddenly she was dead and I never really appreciated that she was there. Then I walked on for a few seconds and then returned to stand by her grave because I didn't see the point of going on without her.

    Um... yeah. 9.5/10

    Oddly, this game is the perfect metaphor for a dilemma I'm facing in real life.

    People have brought real emotions and thought from the game. That makes it "better" than most games to begin with.

    How you live your life is A Big Issue and video games are one of the best forms to explore that, because you can try them again and again. Explore past mistakes, and guess your future life.

    This game treats that more than any "Proper" game I can think off. I

    Lave II on
  • MunacraMunacra Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Lave II wrote:
    Seriously? Try finding something which makes such a wonderfully poignant exploration of human life in 5 fucking minutes.

    For Sale: Baby shoes. Never used.

    Munacra on
  • MunacraMunacra Registered User
    edited January 2008
    12gauge wrote: »
    Khavall wrote: »
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    IMHO, there is not much subcontext - honestly, most messages the game tries to convey are pushed on me, there is just not a lot to interpret in the game.

    What is the subtext Khavall?

    Munacra on
  • Lave IILave II Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Munacra wrote: »
    Lave II wrote:
    Seriously? Try finding something which makes such a wonderfully poignant exploration of human life in 5 fucking minutes.

    For Sale: Baby shoes. Never used.

    ....................................................................

    .....................well played.


    :^:

    Lave II on
  • DusdaDusda is ashamed of this post Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    You know, this game would fit perfectly on some random computer in Lost.

    Dusda on
  • -SPI--SPI- Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Not much of a game really. I liked the effect with what is essentially the past and the future being made the focus and condensing on either side with it shifting as the life goes on. That was a really clever effect, and one I didn't even notice until near the end.

    Apart from that though there really isn't anything there to get excited about or hold my interest. The pointless wandering in a random dull environment might have been a thematic choice to convey some message, but the end result is that I spend 4 and a half of the 5 minutes bored and wondering what the fuss is all about. The ending was nice but I really think this is being overhyped in the extreme.

    -SPI- on
  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Munacra wrote: »
    12gauge wrote: »
    Khavall wrote: »
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    IMHO, there is not much subcontext - honestly, most messages the game tries to convey are pushed on me, there is just not a lot to interpret in the game.

    What is the subtext Khavall?

    Really?


    Figure it out yourself. The text is simple: You have 5 minutes. You can see ahead and behind, but as it stretches farther ahead and behind it gets compressed and distorted. You can get a wife, but she impedes your ability to move in tight spaces for a higher score count from some things. There are treasure chests, but only some of them contain anything.

    Now anything else you gleam from the game is subtext. Can you honestly tell me that that was all you took away?

    Khavall on
  • Lave IILave II Registered User
    edited January 2008
    I once read this great book about a farm. But the pigs were mean. :(
    Yes I know that's allegory and not subtext.

    Lave II on
  • Kid PresentableKid Presentable Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    I can't tell if I'm missing something artsy or if my computer just can't handle these hot graphics, but is it supposed to be really distorted and blurry looking on the right side of the screen?

    EDIT: OH I GET IT NOW BECAUSE I PLAYED THE GAME!

    Kid Presentable on
  • MightyMighty Omeganaut '15 '16 '17 NebraskaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Just think of all the gold i could have if i had never met you.

    Mighty on
    steam_sig.png Twitch: twitch.tv\dreadmighty
  • BallmanBallman Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Ok, I didn't get to play this until this morning, but I read through the rest of the thread to get other people's impressions. I can understand if people don't get anything out of playing it, but after reading the thread, I feel that there are some things that people missed.

    First of all, I'm almost positive you don't get ANY points for treasure chests. I tested it out, and wandering around getting treasure didn't get me any points at all. What does give you points is your forward progress. So, to the programmer, it's forward progress that "counts."

    I played twice, and there's a subtlety to playing with/without the girl that hasn't been mentioned. When you play through with her, you see all these paths with treasure you can't take. If you play through again without her, you can take these paths, but most of them are simply dead ends. Since the limiting factor in the game is time instead of distance, you get a much higher score if you ignore the treasure and keep pressing on. So, since there's an easy path forward that lets you take your spouse, why not take her along and get double the points.

    Also on a side-note, the progression of both the music and the thickness of the obstacles were nice touches. At the very beginning and the end, there's not much to the music at all, but it's much richer in the middle. Also, near the middle, there are many obstacles, and it's much easier to take a dead-end path even with your spouse. Near the beginning, there are a lot of obstacles that are easily avoidable, but at the end, there are hardly any at all.

    I thought it was pretty great.

    Edit: Ok, I hadn't read the creator's statement. I guess when I was checking chests, I didn't realize that there was a difference, and some of them can have treasure and a lot don't. That changes the way I interpret that part.

    Ballman on
    JC of DI wrote:
    Mr. G wrote: »
    So, there's a video of Kurt Cobain in [Guitar Hero 5] out. I feel dirty watching this, he just looks wrong.

    Well Cobain's mo-cap session was completely useless, so you can't blame them.
  • RichardTauberRichardTauber Kvlt Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Beautiful. A work of art. That's all I can say. Not nihilistic as much as an honest and very personal view of life from a young man.

    RichardTauber on
  • MunacraMunacra Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Khavall wrote: »
    Munacra wrote: »
    12gauge wrote: »
    Khavall wrote: »
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    IMHO, there is not much subcontext - honestly, most messages the game tries to convey are pushed on me, there is just not a lot to interpret in the game.

    What is the subtext Khavall?

    Really?


    Figure it out yourself. The text is simple: You have 5 minutes. You can see ahead and behind, but as it stretches farther ahead and behind it gets compressed and distorted. You can get a wife, but she impedes your ability to move in tight spaces for a higher score count from some things. There are treasure chests, but only some of them contain anything.

    Now anything else you gleam from the game is subtext. Can you honestly tell me that that was all you took away?

    So you can't argue for any subtext then? No themes, motifs or symbolism? Also, subtext does not mean what you interpret out of a work.

    Munacra on
  • RavenlockRavenlock Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Leitner wrote: »
    The 'wife holds you back' is a childish load of bollocks and everything else was pretty sub par.
    Except the wife doesn't "hold you back", you actually get a higher score for exploring with the wife than without her. You have to sacrifice for the partnership (represented in the game by not being able to move as easily), but if you think that real marriage doesn't involve sacrifice, you're either not married or amazingly selfish. :P

    I thought the risk/reward aspect of pairing up was remarkably well handled for a five-minute Atari style project. How would you have done it?

    Ravenlock on
    Steam ID: Ravenlock
    XBL / GFWL Gamertag: Ravenlock80
    Wii System Code: 3019 1654 2730 1955
    <Whore> Listen to me rant on the Immortal Machines PC Gaming Podcast! </Whore>
  • The_ScarabThe_Scarab Registered User regular
    edited January 2008
    I opened it up in a window, held the right arrow key and browsed something awful at the same time as playing this game.

    what does that say about my life, or the lives of everyone?


    I dont have time for spirituality. Ive got game on threads to manage goddamit.

    The_Scarab on
    scarab you have mental problems
  • Houk the NamebringerHouk the Namebringer Nipples The EchidnaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2008
    So this managed to have an emotional impact on only some people here? Already better than 95% of games then.

    But seriously, even if it didn't impact you, surely you can recognize the value of a game that can have such a strong impact on others in such a short period of time. It's a real artistic expression, even if it's not for you.

    Houk the Namebringer on
  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2008
    Munacra wrote: »
    Khavall wrote: »
    Munacra wrote: »
    12gauge wrote: »
    Khavall wrote: »
    I don't understand how people can complain about the game not being deep enough and then only take it at the surface literal level.

    IMHO, there is not much subcontext - honestly, most messages the game tries to convey are pushed on me, there is just not a lot to interpret in the game.

    What is the subtext Khavall?

    Really?


    Figure it out yourself. The text is simple: You have 5 minutes. You can see ahead and behind, but as it stretches farther ahead and behind it gets compressed and distorted. You can get a wife, but she impedes your ability to move in tight spaces for a higher score count from some things. There are treasure chests, but only some of them contain anything.

    Now anything else you gleam from the game is subtext. Can you honestly tell me that that was all you took away?

    So you can't argue for any subtext then? No themes, motifs or symbolism? Also, subtext does not mean what you interpret out of a work.

    Wait what do you see as subtext? Because American Heritage defines it as "The implicit meaning or theme of a literary text."

    So that would be, say, the meaning that is interpreted from the work that is not part of the text? Oh hey.

    And yeah, I can. Look at the wife. What is she there for? She boosts the experience, but some things you can't do with her. And then she dies first. So that's not necessarily a good or bad view on relationships, but it's implying simply what relationships are. You can have a relationship, but doing so closes off certain paths of life. Some of these paths are rewarding, and you're missing out on them by being in a relationship, similar to life, but you're also missing out on some dead end paths. When taken as a metaphor to life, which it's pretty obvious the game is supposed to be taken as, then you can see that the paths aren't really literal paths, but instead certain life choices. So in life do you search for love, which will increase your enjoyment of what you do experience, or do you forget about love and try to experience life fully? It might work out and it might not. In case you didn't know, it's implying a choice, and that life is fully of choices, and each one changes the experience somewhat, but you can't tell which way it'll go until you actually do it.

    Most of the game comes down to that, the whole choice thing. Now maybe you're defining subtext wrongly, but that's an implicit meaning that's not part of the main text of the game.

    It's like you're just trying to be obtuse for the hell of it.

    Oh by the way, maybe it was that I couldn't argue the point, or maybe it was that I thought anyone not an idiot could see from playing the game at least some point of subtext and I'm working didn't want to type out giant pages of shit because people can't interpret shit for anything other than face value. But I'm on break now.

    Khavall on
  • MunacraMunacra Registered User
    edited January 2008
    Well, you took a giant leap of logic with that definition of subtext. Look at the word implicit.

    Subtext is part of the text that is not announced explicitly. It is very much a part of the text. only under the surface. Every single one of the examples you gave is blatantly obvious in the game, and so it is not subtext.

    I feel this game has too big of a message and it is not being treated with enough finesse. It lacks the subtext neccesary so that it doesn't feel like its hitting me over the head with its meaning.

    Munacra on
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