The new forums will be named Coin Return (based on the most recent vote)! You can check on the status and timeline of the transition to the new forums here.
The Guiding Principles and New Rules document is now in effect.
Apathy, hypocrisy, and you. Especially you.
Daedalus
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Recently, somewhere from a few hundred to a few thousand people, mostly from the notoriously apathetic 16-26 age bracket, started actively protesting in the streets about some cult or something. Whatever, there's another thread on that. That's not what we're here for.
Simultaneously, on this very forum, a bunch of people from what I'm largely assuming is the 16-26 age bracket came together to discuss this, and, of course, many other topics. Comments from many posters, some of them well-respected hereabouts, included the idea that the protesters were "fucking retarded", that the protest was a waste of time because it wouldn't accomplish some goal all by itself, that the protest was a waste of time because there were more important things to protest, that the acts being protested against weren't really any different than things other groups do all the time (so, clearly, why bother protesting any of them!), etc. etc.
This is a forum that regularly (and rightly!) curses the apathy of the 16-26 demographic in every single thread dealing with any sort of election.
Wait, what? Do I have this right? Sitting on your ass in the comfort of your apartment or dorm room "phone banking," calling people who already support your views and reminding them to vote, is commendable. Donating (online, natch) an amount of money that wouldn't even pay for a new video game to the forum's political candidate of choice is amazing. Getting off your ass and actually protesting about an issue that you actually care about is a retarded waste of time.
This isn't even remotely limited to this forum, of course; I just used it as an example. Every day, there's a protest for something on some college campus, and every day, the rest of the student body will at best turn their backs and at worst complain about the protesters. Why is this?
We've got a serious apathy problem, all right. It looks like it's self-perpetuating, too. Voting is great, guys, really, but getting off your ass to vote is the bare fucking minimum. But when anyone who decides to throw away apathy and actually speak up for something is ridiculed, it's not hard to see where this problem comes from. Fuck, if going on the streets with fucking signs is a worthless waste of time that couldn't possibly effect any change, how are you going to convince people that their one vote among hundreds of millions has any fucking effect?
Simultaneously, on this very forum, a bunch of people from what I'm largely assuming is the 16-26 age bracket came together to discuss this, and, of course, many other topics. Comments from many posters, some of them well-respected hereabouts, included the idea that the protesters were "fucking retarded", that the protest was a waste of time because it wouldn't accomplish some goal all by itself, that the protest was a waste of time because there were more important things to protest, that the acts being protested against weren't really any different than things other groups do all the time (so, clearly, why bother protesting any of them!), etc. etc.
This is a forum that regularly (and rightly!) curses the apathy of the 16-26 demographic in every single thread dealing with any sort of election.
Wait, what? Do I have this right? Sitting on your ass in the comfort of your apartment or dorm room "phone banking," calling people who already support your views and reminding them to vote, is commendable. Donating (online, natch) an amount of money that wouldn't even pay for a new video game to the forum's political candidate of choice is amazing. Getting off your ass and actually protesting about an issue that you actually care about is a retarded waste of time.
This isn't even remotely limited to this forum, of course; I just used it as an example. Every day, there's a protest for something on some college campus, and every day, the rest of the student body will at best turn their backs and at worst complain about the protesters. Why is this?
We've got a serious apathy problem, all right. It looks like it's self-perpetuating, too. Voting is great, guys, really, but getting off your ass to vote is the bare fucking minimum. But when anyone who decides to throw away apathy and actually speak up for something is ridiculed, it's not hard to see where this problem comes from. Fuck, if going on the streets with fucking signs is a worthless waste of time that couldn't possibly effect any change, how are you going to convince people that their one vote among hundreds of millions has any fucking effect?
Daedalus on
0
Posts
I'm pissed off that people here can't see why this generation is extremely apathetic about anything political while simultaneously making the problem worse. You can't actively discourage people from political protest on the one hand and then get pissed off when the AARP controls our country for the nth year in a row because the 18-26 year old demographic can't be bothered to vote.
Whenever anyone in this generation comes forward and cares about an issue, they get cannabalized by their peers for daring to give a shit about something, even by people here who can't stand the Baby Boomers controlling our country for six presidential terms in a row.
I absolutely refuse to believe that internet groups and phoning people on a list of "people who already believe our message in the first place" are more effective than a public protest. The public is certainly more desensitized to them than they were in the sixties, sure, but it's still the best we've got.
It doesn't help that the individuals who are comfortable in ignoring status quo tend to be especially emberassing in their other behavior.
The more valid concern, however, is the concentration of effort on less important things. While it's true that it's easier to win the smaller battle, people desensitize easily, and if you have a thousand protests over trifling matters, the really nasty things may get ignored.
I didn't exactly have the easiest time getting my associates to join me when I was staging my weekly "piss off the preacher" show, even though I was praised away from the view of the crowd.
It doesn't help that, right now, Western culture is remarkably conservative in behavior, outside of culturally-sanctioned places and times.
---
Fuzzy: "Waiting for the world to change?"
What constitutes an effective protest?
More power to people who want to bother, but after seeing protesters Every Day while living and working in DC, I fail to see how they're not just annoying people trying to use the street for normal daily activities.
I'm also completely torn in this instance. Sure, I dislike Scientology, but I'm none too fond of 4chan culture either. So I consider it a net wash that they dislike each other.
This is why the most effective historical protests were essentially treated as crime waves.
Hell, we can even include drum circles and whatever other retarded hippie shit protestors typically do these days. I mean, really, we have probably one of the most protested presidents in U.S. history right now. He was up against one of the largest protests the world has ever seen before the Iraq war, has had constant, incessant protests since, and they haven't even stopped him from getting re-elected (though it's worth noting that a lot of those same protestors voted for Nader, because "lol Republicrat"). You show me a bunch of protestors, and I'll show you a bunch of jobless hippies, reeking of patchouli, pot, and unwashed bodies, who really are only in it because hippies don't go to church, and they need a social gathering of some sort.
WGA?
...
No no the change must be immediate or large or else there was no point in protesting!
Well, they are a form of protest.
But they cause money loss.
And so they often work.
Ah, and here's the other side of the coin. "These people don't really care. They're just out there for the lulz. I donated Obama's campaign twenty-five bucks through Paypal! I really care!"
Indeed, but part of it involves people carrying signs outside to garner visibility for their cause.
Does that mean they shouldn't happen or are stupid in the first place?
edit: this was in 2000.
The thing about telling other people that what they think doesn't matter, is that nobody really gives a fuck what you think either. The only difference being that they at the least have the gumption to go out and make a stand for something.
Uh why does it matter? Than asked for an example of an effective protest in the last 20 years.
The WGA strike isn't a protest, it's a walkout, which is doing something other than standing around holding signs and beating on drums.
Uh, the Scientology protests happened world wide, one of the biggest ones was in London I believe.