Blizz has outright said that they intend to have 2H tanking superior to DW. DW is only a consideration after you touch down all three trees in a tri-spec. Yet I still see people trying to DW tank. Frustrating. No, you can not reach the hitcap and the defense cap at the same time hargle bargle.
Seriously though. I have not seen one frost DK who was using a 2Hander.
Frost doesn't seem to be getting as much love as Unholy, seeing as Unholy is kind of "the best" at tanking and DPS at the moment.
But any serious frost tanking or DPS build requires a 2her for the same reason that MS warriors use twohanders--strikes bases on weapon damage.
Also, it's starting to look like the preferred Frost DPS rotation is (blood tap for death rune) IT>BS>OB>OB>FS dump/IT>OB>BS>OB>FS dump.
Plague strike does shit dmg and the extra OB every rotation does more damage than the extra BS, PS, and resulting Blood Plague. This scales better and takes off at epic gear levels because it gives you two OBs and FSs every rotation as opposed to every other rotation.
Still in testing though.
Why got IT then BS instead of throwing in a PS? You are missing a dot as well as the extra damage granted from having another disease on them.
You clearly did not read anything that he just said.
He read it and he's right. Not using PS is dumb. His rotation is fucked since he doesnt account for any rune strikes eating his RP and just says spam FS. Oblit and BS both gain more dmg with the number of diseases, too. The extra disease can be spread to adds as well. If he's frost, as he says, he doesnt have a single HC listed either.
While not as important for raiding, PS also has a chance to remove HOTs everytime it does dmg and does a significant amount of damage for the dot part. Just because the upfront dmg is low doesnt mean its useless.
The guy should go back to his 'still testing' and work some more since he doesn't use several key spells.
But what else are you going to spend that unholy rune on?
You're only using one Blood Strike, so you only have one Death Rune. This gets combined with the unholy rune into the extra OB.
Because you only BS once per rotation, you'll always have one Death Rune for your next rotation. There reason you need to alternate your BS and OB in the second rotation is to avoid a 2 second gap where all you have is a Death Rune that you might accidently use on a BS instead of combining with an Unholy Rune for the an OB.
zenpotato on
0
Options
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
edited December 2008
Yeah, after much gnashing of teeth, I've given up on DW on my DK as anywhere close to feasible. Which is disappointing because I already have a plate wearer that uses a two hander. So I get to pursue the exact same gear. Fun.
EDIT: I just hit 67 last night. I had thought DK dps was crazy. Apparently I was wrong because RS is a game changer. Christ.
But what else are you going to spend that unholy rune on?
You're only using one Blood Strike, so you only have one Death Rune. This gets combined with the unholy rune into the extra OB.
Because you only BS once per rotation, you'll always have one Death Rune for your next rotation. There reason you need to alternate your BS and OB in the second rotation is to avoid a 2 second gap where all you have is a Death Rune that you might accidently use on a BS instead of combining with an Unholy Rune for the an OB.
Ok, I see what you're going for there now, interesting.
Yeah, after much gnashing of teeth, I've given up on DW on my DK as anywhere close to feasible. Which is disappointing because I already have a plate wearer that uses a two hander. So I get to pursue the exact same gear. Fun.
EDIT: I just hit 67 last night. I had thought DK dps was crazy. Apparently I was wrong because RS is a game changer. Christ.
Wait until you get some of the initial quest rewards in Northrend. My RS was hitting for near 3k crit and death strike crit heals were 3.5k with some green 2H sword I got for doing the very first quest. I'm only 70.
Enjoy your RS damage now, who knows how hard it'll hit after the nerf bat gets taken to it.
You clearly did not read anything that he just said.
He read it and he's right. Not using PS is dumb. His rotation is fucked since he doesnt account for any rune strikes eating his RP and just says spam FS. Oblit and BS both gain more dmg with the number of diseases, too. The extra disease can be spread to adds as well. If he's frost, as he says, he doesnt have a single HC listed either.
While not as important for raiding, PS also has a chance to remove HOTs everytime it does dmg and does a significant amount of damage for the dot part. Just because the upfront dmg is low doesnt mean its useless.
The guy should go back to his 'still testing' and work some more since he doesn't use several key spells.
Or, you could stop and think about it for a minute. Also, to be clear, this is a Frost DPS rotation.
When DPSing, you don't get rune strikes.
OB does gain from an extra disease, but that amount is reduced when using the Glyph of OB, which is assumed for Frost DPS raiding. You're only using one Blood Strike, which also reduces the usefulness there.
The spam FS section is the runic power dump which means spam FS twice and use HB if you get a Rime proc. Because you cut out a BS and the PS, you have extra time before you frost runes reset to get in the extra Frost Strike. You're not losing GCDs with this rotation like you might if you tried to do a full RP dump with the standard rotation.
Quite frankly, the damage gained from the extra OB and FS every other rotation is greater (about 75-100 DPS in early Naxx gear) than the damage lost by a missing Blood Strike, Plague Strike, Blood Plague, and damage bonus to IT from Glacial Rot. As weapon dmg goes up, that gap widens. OB and FS scale much, much better with gear than BS or PS do. The OB glyph is important for this to happen--it causes OB to scale much better with gear and worse with diseaes.
Don't get your panties in a bunch just because this isn't a standard rotation. For a deep frost DPS build, plague strike and the resulting Blood Plague just isn't a big chunk of damage.
Blizz has outright said that they intend to have 2H tanking superior to DW. DW is only a consideration after you touch down all three trees in a tri-spec. Yet I still see people trying to DW tank. Frustrating. No, you can not reach the hitcap and the defense cap at the same time hargle bargle.
Seriously though. I have not seen one frost DK who was using a 2Hander.
If it counts for anything, I'm a frost DK using a 2hander.
2H frost is ridiculously fun.
Group: "Uh where's that mob we were fighting? It was here a second ago but now I can't find it."
DK: "Sorry guys, I gibbed it when I hit it with my giagantic axe. That red mist hanging in the air? All that's left."
xzzy on
0
Options
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
Yeah, after much gnashing of teeth, I've given up on DW on my DK as anywhere close to feasible. Which is disappointing because I already have a plate wearer that uses a two hander. So I get to pursue the exact same gear. Fun.
EDIT: I just hit 67 last night. I had thought DK dps was crazy. Apparently I was wrong because RS is a game changer. Christ.
Wait until you get some of the initial quest rewards in Northrend. My RS was hitting for near 3k crit and death strike crit heals were 3.5k with some green 2H sword I got for doing the very first quest. I'm only 70.
Enjoy your RS damage now, who knows how hard it'll hit after the nerf bat gets taken to it.
I'm already hitting for 3K with RS. :P
Nova_C on
0
Options
HalfmexI mock your value systemYou also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered Userregular
Wait until you get some of the initial quest rewards in Northrend. My RS was hitting for near 3k crit and death strike crit heals were 3.5k with some green 2H sword I got for doing the very first quest. I'm only 70.
Enjoy your RS damage now, who knows how hard it'll hit after the nerf bat gets taken to it.
Blizz has outright said that they intend to have 2H tanking superior to DW. DW is only a consideration after you touch down all three trees in a tri-spec. Yet I still see people trying to DW tank. Frustrating. No, you can not reach the hitcap and the defense cap at the same time hargle bargle.
Seriously though. I have not seen one frost DK who was using a 2Hander.
If it counts for anything, I'm a frost DK using a 2hander.
2H frost is ridiculously fun.
Group: "Uh where's that mob we were fighting? It was here a second ago but now I can't find it."
DK: "Sorry guys, I gibbed it when I hit it with my giagantic axe. That red mist hanging in the air? All that's left."
Anyone else doing DK tanking having a hell of a time reaching the defense cap? I am doing everything I can and STILL am not capped (using heroic / badge) gear. Not having denfense on the 2hrs seems way too constraining, I have to use sub-par avoidance gear for pure +defense.
Maybe I should look into dual wield tanking with the +defense items...
I kind of get the idea that that was what was originally intended. For most DK tanks to go frost and DW, but it doesn't really work as well as it should.
There's my DK. Defense rating 545, and I believe the DRating cap is 540 in WotLK. Most of my items are either quest blues or rep gear.
It's really easy to hit the defense cap, you just have to know where to look. Try checking out MMOChamp's armor list for tanking upgrades that you might be able to get your hands on.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited December 2008
Funny story: I was just testing out my DK a bit. I ran up to a target dummy and I wanted to see what would happen when I had a blood rune on CD with blood tap (to see if it immediately activated).
Well, I used blood strike. I am talented such that the rune turns into a death rune, so it changed to that and started recharging. I hit blood tap and suddenly I had two death runes fully charged. And now I have one permanent death rune. Weird.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
hmmm if you could turn the other blood into a perma-death then i think we might have something here.
Algorefiend on
0
Options
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited December 2008
Can't get the perma-death thing going, but I have confirmed this:
Use blood strike. It turns into a death rune on CD.
Use blood tap. You now have two death runes off CD.
So my opening rotation would be IT (to pull) > PS > SS > BS/BT > SS > SS
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
nice i guess i should consider putting BT on my bar somewhere then lol
Algorefiend on
0
Options
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited December 2008
Blood tap turns one blood rune into a death rune for 20 seconds regardless. It should be on your bar anyway.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Wait until you get some of the initial quest rewards in Northrend. My RS was hitting for near 3k crit and death strike crit heals were 3.5k with some green 2H sword I got for doing the very first quest. I'm only 70.
Enjoy your RS damage now, who knows how hard it'll hit after the nerf bat gets taken to it.
I'm already hitting for 3K with RS. :P
Why must you turn my office into a den of lies?
My 2H is a green sword I picked up with a top end of just over 800. So 200% weapon damage is 1600, + around 300 damage and I'm just shy of 2K. A crit is +50%, so I'm usually around 2800 or so for crits, which is close enough to 3K for me to say 3K.
It's useful in a lot of situations, lI mostly use it for tanking. You DnD->PS->IT->Pest, and then you have no runes. But, you can Blood-Tap->Bloodboil for a buch for AOE threat quick.
Wait until you get some of the initial quest rewards in Northrend. My RS was hitting for near 3k crit and death strike crit heals were 3.5k with some green 2H sword I got for doing the very first quest. I'm only 70.
Enjoy your RS damage now, who knows how hard it'll hit after the nerf bat gets taken to it.
I'm already hitting for 3K with RS. :P
Why must you turn my office into a den of lies?
My 2H is a green sword I picked up with a top end of just over 800. So 200% weapon damage is 1600, + around 300 damage and I'm just shy of 2K. A crit is +50%, so I'm usually around 2800 or so for crits, which is close enough to 3K for me to say 3K.
A melee crit is +100%. But armor damage reduction would reduce that to 2800 from something higher.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
ok gotcha. normally in my heroics we just aoe pull everything so i'm always using pest/BB till the last guy but for bosses that could push me a litlle further up the DPS range. i'll check it out
Algorefiend on
0
Options
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited December 2008
Oh yeah. This is definitely a solo/boss thing. Trash pulls are usually absurdly chaotic, as is PvP. But this will be a bitchin boost for Raid Bosses, especially with the SS glyph. You'll have a really high chance of reapping your diseases, allowing you to just continue with the SS's, while the converted blood-rune can be used to drop a PS for desecrated ground when the rotation comes back up.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Looking at this for a tanking build for my DK....I really don't know about master of ghouls though...I mean I'm not looking at DPS here, im looking for threat/mitigation/utility....
I mean I don't know why I WOULD get rid of it, or what I would spend the point on...but it just seems kinda pointless for a tank....
But am I wrong???
Also- any news on fixing that annoying blade barrier bug????
Oh yeah. This is definitely a solo/boss thing. Trash pulls are usually absurdly chaotic, as is PvP. But this will be a bitchin boost for Raid Bosses, especially with the SS glyph. You'll have a really high chance of reapping your diseases, allowing you to just continue with the SS's, while the converted blood-rune can be used to drop a PS for desecrated ground when the rotation comes back up.
Then the thing to focus on, is why someone would have desecration
Why take desicration for PvE? cause you get 5% damage bonus while standing in it. that goes for disease ticks as well as DnD ticks. i couldn't post the numbers i do without it.
Why take desicration for PvE? cause you get 5% damage bonus while standing in it. that goes for disease ticks as well as DnD ticks. i couldn't post the numbers i do without it.
You would post numbers less than 5% reduced without it. It sucks when dpsing, because it doesn't mesh well with glyph of SS, which every dpsing Unholy spec should have. It sucks when tanking because of the huge number of tanking fights where movement is required(not to mention you don't really need 5% more dps, for 5 points, as a tank).
Looking at this for a tanking build for my DK....I really don't know about master of ghouls though...I mean I'm not looking at DPS here, im looking for threat/mitigation/utility....
I mean I don't know why I WOULD get rid of it, or what I would spend the point on...but it just seems kinda pointless for a tank....
But am I wrong???
Also- any news on fixing that annoying blade barrier bug????
Take all the points out of desecration and put them in Rage of Rivendare. Take out master of ghouls and a point in blade armor for dirge. Virulence is a better damage (and ergo, threat) talent than ravenous dead.
Why take desicration for PvE? cause you get 5% damage bonus while standing in it. that goes for disease ticks as well as DnD ticks. i couldn't post the numbers i do without it.
You would post numbers less than 5% reduced without it. It sucks when dpsing, because it doesn't mesh well with glyph of SS, which every dpsing Unholy spec should have. It sucks when tanking because of the huge number of tanking fights where movement is required(not to mention you don't really need 5% more dps, for 5 points, as a tank).
Thats a good point. I'm not tanking at the moment so movement of the tank isn't really an issue for me, i can try putting those 5 points somewhere else and see if i can post the same numbers. if not then i don't really see a reason to move them because if it takes long enough to move the mob somewhere i'd just be starting the cycle fresh in the new spot, with a new patch of unholy ground.
edit: the rotation i posted above is my boss DPS rotationnot a tanking rotation.
Why take desicration for PvE? cause you get 5% damage bonus while standing in it. that goes for disease ticks as well as DnD ticks. i couldn't post the numbers i do without it.
You would post numbers less than 5% reduced without it. It sucks when dpsing, because it doesn't mesh well with glyph of SS, which every dpsing Unholy spec should have. It sucks when tanking because of the huge number of tanking fights where movement is required(not to mention you don't really need 5% more dps, for 5 points, as a tank).
Shit it sucks even without the gkyph. You're still only going to be dropping a plaguestrike every other rotation.
I pvped a bit last night, and only sorta knew what I was doing. I think I may have found one of the worst enemies for a Death Knights in PVP are though: resto shamans. With earth shield, multiple disease cleansing, fast heals, and mail armor those things are a gigantic pain to kill. I chased one down the tunnel in WSG and I just couldn't kill the guy by myself.
Savant on
0
Options
FairchildRabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?"Registered Userregular
edited December 2008
If you are still leveling your Death Knight in Outland and you are tired of spamming the General channel in Nagrand while trying to get a Ring of Blood group together, don't bother. The Halaani Claymore is better. Seriously.
If you are still leveling your Death Knight in Outland and you are tired of spamming the General channel in Nagrand while trying to get a Ring of Blood group together, don't bother. The Halaani Claymore is better. Seriously.
EXP, Potions, Gold - All worthwhile!
GPIA7R on
0
Options
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
If you are still leveling your Death Knight in Outland and you are tired of spamming the General channel in Nagrand while trying to get a Ring of Blood group together, don't bother. The Halaani Claymore is better. Seriously.
EXP, Potions, Gold - All worthwhile!
Taking the time to find a PuG willing to do it? Not worthwhile! :P
Nova_C on
0
Options
FairchildRabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?"Registered Userregular
edited December 2008
True enough. The only awesome item left to obtain (I think) is the Blades Edge neckpiece, Natasha's Pack Collar, and then I'm ready to head over the water.
If you are still leveling your Death Knight in Outland and you are tired of spamming the General channel in Nagrand while trying to get a Ring of Blood group together, don't bother. The Halaani Claymore is better. Seriously.
EXP, Potions, Gold - All worthwhile!
Taking the time to find a PuG willing to do it? Not worthwhile! :P
Especially when the PuG consists of 4 DKs and an Enhancement Shammy two levels too low for the zone.
Still, I suppose it mostly depends on the server, because the entire time I was in Nagrand leveling my DK, we (Horde) had Halaa once. And that was for maybe ten minutes or so.
Luckily that crappy PuG I got lucky when a 80 Priest wandered by and healed from outside the group, so I got my Honed Voidaxe (after much smashing my head against the keyboard because the people in the group were retarded and kept accepting the quest individually, so we had to re-do several fights multiple times).
Halfmex on
0
Options
FairchildRabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?"Registered Userregular
edited December 2008
We had so much trouble with the last RoB boss that we finally switched the Paladin tank to healing while we three Death Knights combo-tanked him, which barely worked the second time we tried it.
Ironically, I had done Ampitheatre of Awesomeness the week earlier and had much better luck with two Shamans healing a Death Knight tank. Once this wave of Death Knights reaches AoA I expect similar 5 Death Knights/No Healer PUG's continually wiping on the last boss.
If you are still leveling your Death Knight in Outland and you are tired of spamming the General channel in Nagrand while trying to get a Ring of Blood group together, don't bother. The Halaani Claymore is better. Seriously.
Which is of course only an option if your faction actually has Halaa.
Posts
He read it and he's right. Not using PS is dumb. His rotation is fucked since he doesnt account for any rune strikes eating his RP and just says spam FS. Oblit and BS both gain more dmg with the number of diseases, too. The extra disease can be spread to adds as well. If he's frost, as he says, he doesnt have a single HC listed either.
While not as important for raiding, PS also has a chance to remove HOTs everytime it does dmg and does a significant amount of damage for the dot part. Just because the upfront dmg is low doesnt mean its useless.
The guy should go back to his 'still testing' and work some more since he doesn't use several key spells.
You're only using one Blood Strike, so you only have one Death Rune. This gets combined with the unholy rune into the extra OB.
Because you only BS once per rotation, you'll always have one Death Rune for your next rotation. There reason you need to alternate your BS and OB in the second rotation is to avoid a 2 second gap where all you have is a Death Rune that you might accidently use on a BS instead of combining with an Unholy Rune for the an OB.
EDIT: I just hit 67 last night. I had thought DK dps was crazy. Apparently I was wrong because RS is a game changer. Christ.
Ok, I see what you're going for there now, interesting.
Enjoy your RS damage now, who knows how hard it'll hit after the nerf bat gets taken to it.
Or, you could stop and think about it for a minute. Also, to be clear, this is a Frost DPS rotation.
When DPSing, you don't get rune strikes.
OB does gain from an extra disease, but that amount is reduced when using the Glyph of OB, which is assumed for Frost DPS raiding. You're only using one Blood Strike, which also reduces the usefulness there.
The spam FS section is the runic power dump which means spam FS twice and use HB if you get a Rime proc. Because you cut out a BS and the PS, you have extra time before you frost runes reset to get in the extra Frost Strike. You're not losing GCDs with this rotation like you might if you tried to do a full RP dump with the standard rotation.
Quite frankly, the damage gained from the extra OB and FS every other rotation is greater (about 75-100 DPS in early Naxx gear) than the damage lost by a missing Blood Strike, Plague Strike, Blood Plague, and damage bonus to IT from Glacial Rot. As weapon dmg goes up, that gap widens. OB and FS scale much, much better with gear than BS or PS do. The OB glyph is important for this to happen--it causes OB to scale much better with gear and worse with diseaes.
Don't get your panties in a bunch just because this isn't a standard rotation. For a deep frost DPS build, plague strike and the resulting Blood Plague just isn't a big chunk of damage.
2H frost is ridiculously fun.
Group: "Uh where's that mob we were fighting? It was here a second ago but now I can't find it."
DK: "Sorry guys, I gibbed it when I hit it with my giagantic axe. That red mist hanging in the air? All that's left."
I'm already hitting for 3K with RS. :P
Yeah I'm 2H frost myself. Fun times are had.
My Portfolio Site
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Twisting+Nether&n=Blossom
There's my DK. Defense rating 545, and I believe the DRating cap is 540 in WotLK. Most of my items are either quest blues or rep gear.
It's really easy to hit the defense cap, you just have to know where to look. Try checking out MMOChamp's armor list for tanking upgrades that you might be able to get your hands on.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Well, I used blood strike. I am talented such that the rune turns into a death rune, so it changed to that and started recharging. I hit blood tap and suddenly I had two death runes fully charged. And now I have one permanent death rune. Weird.
Use blood strike. It turns into a death rune on CD.
Use blood tap. You now have two death runes off CD.
So my opening rotation would be IT (to pull) > PS > SS > BS/BT > SS > SS
My 2H is a green sword I picked up with a top end of just over 800. So 200% weapon damage is 1600, + around 300 damage and I'm just shy of 2K. A crit is +50%, so I'm usually around 2800 or so for crits, which is close enough to 3K for me to say 3K.
A melee crit is +100%. But armor damage reduction would reduce that to 2800 from something higher.
It does not. The main thing I'm bringing up here is this:
You use blood strike. It turns into a death rune and starts to recharge. As soon as this happens, you hit blood tap, which is off the GCD.
You now have two death runes available when the GCD comes back up where previously you had one blood rune up.
PS>IT>DnD>BS > gnomish lightning/hand rocket combo>PS>IT>SS>SS
with gargy i do ~3100dps if the boss doesn't stun or become immune in the middle of gargoyle.
I think a could work SS>SS>SS>BT>PS as the second set of runes for a bit of a boost.
*off to the dummy when i get home*
Looking at this for a tanking build for my DK....I really don't know about master of ghouls though...I mean I'm not looking at DPS here, im looking for threat/mitigation/utility....
I mean I don't know why I WOULD get rid of it, or what I would spend the point on...but it just seems kinda pointless for a tank....
But am I wrong???
Also- any news on fixing that annoying blade barrier bug????
Then the thing to focus on, is why someone would have desecration
For pve.
You would post numbers less than 5% reduced without it. It sucks when dpsing, because it doesn't mesh well with glyph of SS, which every dpsing Unholy spec should have. It sucks when tanking because of the huge number of tanking fights where movement is required(not to mention you don't really need 5% more dps, for 5 points, as a tank).
Take all the points out of desecration and put them in Rage of Rivendare. Take out master of ghouls and a point in blade armor for dirge. Virulence is a better damage (and ergo, threat) talent than ravenous dead.
LoL: failboattootoot
Thats a good point. I'm not tanking at the moment so movement of the tank isn't really an issue for me, i can try putting those 5 points somewhere else and see if i can post the same numbers. if not then i don't really see a reason to move them because if it takes long enough to move the mob somewhere i'd just be starting the cycle fresh in the new spot, with a new patch of unholy ground.
edit: the rotation i posted above is my boss DPS rotationnot a tanking rotation.
Shit it sucks even without the gkyph. You're still only going to be dropping a plaguestrike every other rotation.
LoL: failboattootoot
i've ended many a fight as a resto shaman emoting "/yawn" while the would-be gankers get bored and go away.
Edit: Rogues, obviously, can go to hell.
EXP, Potions, Gold - All worthwhile!
Taking the time to find a PuG willing to do it? Not worthwhile! :P
Still, I suppose it mostly depends on the server, because the entire time I was in Nagrand leveling my DK, we (Horde) had Halaa once. And that was for maybe ten minutes or so.
Luckily that crappy PuG I got lucky when a 80 Priest wandered by and healed from outside the group, so I got my Honed Voidaxe (after much smashing my head against the keyboard because the people in the group were retarded and kept accepting the quest individually, so we had to re-do several fights multiple times).
Ironically, I had done Ampitheatre of Awesomeness the week earlier and had much better luck with two Shamans healing a Death Knight tank. Once this wave of Death Knights reaches AoA I expect similar 5 Death Knights/No Healer PUG's continually wiping on the last boss.