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Beginning a martial art.
Robos A Go Go
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I'm a 22 year old vegan (I balance my diet well enough, and my last physical revealed nothing wrong) male who stands at 6 foot something, weighs in at 166 or so pounds, and hasn't really exercised since high school. For a while now, I've felt extremely limited, both in terms of the full extent of what I can do, both with my body and in general. It's depressing, to be frank, and so I'd like to break free of these limitations. Just now, I had the thought that a martial art might be the answer.
First off, I just want to say that I'm not looking to get into fights, stand up to bullies, or anything lame like that. Self-defense isn't really the issue either as I never get into trouble, though it's not guaranteed that I'll never be in a situation where I need to defend myself. For the most part, though, it's just a matter of me wanting to have greater control over my body and, furthermore, having the option to push that body further in terms of strength, speed, and agility whenever I so choose.
Given what I've outlined in terms of where I stand now (not morbidly unhealthy, but far from active and not remotely aggressive) and what I'd hope to gain from learning a martial art, would learning some form of self-defense be the best idea, or would I perhaps be better served elsewhere?
If the former, what exactly should I be looking for in a class? I don't want to get my ass kicked on the first day, exactly, but I also don't want to be Dwight Schrute, practicing alongside a bunch of 2nd graders. Basically, I don't want to be humiliated, but I'm also not looking to be given something that emphasizes self-esteem and keeping the customer happy over making significant progress.
P.S. I'm in the Boston area.
First off, I just want to say that I'm not looking to get into fights, stand up to bullies, or anything lame like that. Self-defense isn't really the issue either as I never get into trouble, though it's not guaranteed that I'll never be in a situation where I need to defend myself. For the most part, though, it's just a matter of me wanting to have greater control over my body and, furthermore, having the option to push that body further in terms of strength, speed, and agility whenever I so choose.
Given what I've outlined in terms of where I stand now (not morbidly unhealthy, but far from active and not remotely aggressive) and what I'd hope to gain from learning a martial art, would learning some form of self-defense be the best idea, or would I perhaps be better served elsewhere?
If the former, what exactly should I be looking for in a class? I don't want to get my ass kicked on the first day, exactly, but I also don't want to be Dwight Schrute, practicing alongside a bunch of 2nd graders. Basically, I don't want to be humiliated, but I'm also not looking to be given something that emphasizes self-esteem and keeping the customer happy over making significant progress.
P.S. I'm in the Boston area.
Robos A Go Go on
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The only way to tell how good a teacher is by watching them in action and teaching. See how they interact with all levels of students (from kids to adults, beginners to experts).
As Doc says, make sure there is some sort of sparring / actually using what you use in class against fully resisting opponents. Plus, that's where the best workout comes in.
I wound up being that schools youngest black belt, so I often went to the advanced adult classes since there wasn't another option, but don't think it's going to be like that Seinfeld episode.
First off, let me say I find your veganism sickening and disgusting. What kind of person won't eat and wear animals? You'll never be a finely-wrought 240 pound death machine if you don't start mainlining both the protein and the very souls of vanquished animals right now.
There, now that I've gotten that out of the way for anyone to follow...
it can be kind of hard for the layperson to choose a martial art because, you know, how do you tell a good teacher or school from a bad one at a surface glance?
I actually highly recommend trying it, though, because, for one thing, I can't stand "hamster wheel" style exercise, and a good martial arts class is intense. Right now, I'm recovering from a rather bad bought of respiratory illness, but I trained for in various martial arts for many years (14-27), and I should be back on the mat soon, training for MMA competition.
People will have a lot to say about styles and you should train this and you shouldn't train this.
There are very few ranks in martial arts or names of styles that really mean anything. "Kung fu" one place and "Kung fu" another place could look totally different, and TKD one place could be just like Dwight Schrute's class and it could be totally hard core at another place. What name they put on the sign doesn't matter that much.
I think there are basically things that matter, once your expectations are addressed.
1. Does the place teach a useful martial art in a realistic manner?
2. Is it affordable and are the billing practices fair?
3. Are the things being taught in keeping with my goals?
4. Are the claims being made by the instructor about what he can deliver realistic?
5. Do I find the workout challenging and worthwhile?
6. Is the general intensity level of the place in keeping with mine?
7. Is the facility convenient and a place I want to spend time?
As far as number one goes, I think a useful martial art taught in a realistic manner is a martial art that either teaches a general approach to all 3 ranges of combat (standing, clinching, and grappling) or specializes well in one range. The realism comes in as part of the training. Realistic training is alive, with lots of what's called "pressure testing," which should take the form of sparring or hard drilling. It doesn't have to be formal competition, but highly competitive martial arts seem to turn out the best fighters.
Affordibility is subject to your local conditions, and as far as fairness - martial arts are regulated basically like health clubs, so the same sort of buyer beware sense should apply.
Your goals are kind of important. You say surviving fights is not a huge deal for you, so I would recommend you avoid some of the "survival" oriented stuff like Krav Maga, Kali or kajukembo. That's things like knife fighting, dirty fighting, street awareness. You seem like you want a good workout with a sport element, and a little practicality as a side effect, from what I can tell. Your post didn't indicate to me that you were interested in a particular culture or region or anything. To me, that flags arts like Judo, Brazilian jiu-jitsu, boxing, kickboxing, muay thai - things with a hard workout and a fun sport element.
You instructor shouldn't promise you crazy self defense abilities in a short time. He should promise you sensible advancement in skill and condition.
You obviously want a good workout that won't destroy you - and one great thing about martial arts is as an activity, it scales well. You will probably be sore the first few times you go, just because you're using alien muscle groups that you don't normally use, but as long as you don't wander into the bad dojo from karate kid, they should be able to work with you at your level.
Intensity is a matter of knowing what you want out of the martial arts. For example, where I train, it's pretty intense. It's a dingy, basement gym, and the basic purpose of the place is to groom fighters for the cage. People that want a workout are welcome, but if their goal isn't competition, they are going to be used to train the fighters. You will either spar standing, grappling, or mixed every day, at a level hard enough to leave bruises. Obviously, that's not for everyone. Dwight Schrute's school would be the opposite end of the spectrum - and yes, I've seen real schools every bit that bad.
Most schools have tiered classes for beginners, intermediate, advanced, and then competitive students, so this isn't always an issue with picking a school so much as being placed in the right class in the school.
The convince of the location is obviously something you have to figure out, but as far as wanting to spend time there, I favor places with showers over places without, places with extra equipment - like a weight room or cardio stuff over those without, and I'm not afraid to ask, politely, how often stuff, particularly grappling mats, gets cleaned.
On a personal note, I have had the most fun training Brazilian jiu-jitsu and judo.
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I host a podcast about movies.
A karate or taekwando or judo studio would be a good fit if you wanted that whole mind and body spiritualism. Lots of discipline respect etc. I did that for a while, but got bored because the sparring was so unrealistic.
What I would suggest (if youre the type thats interested) is a boxing/kickboxing gym. There are two types of these gyms. The first type panders to housewives who want to do aerobic kickboxing. This is good if you want to meet girls. The second, is more about training for amateur and professional bouts. I was a member of a gym that had a former kickboxing world champ. Sadly, I got less attention because of that..
In fact, I ended up quitting because of that. You said you worried about getting beaten up on the first day? Well, they wouldnt even let me spar for about the first 8 months.
Most gyms give you some free classes. Check out a bunch of places until you find on that suits you.
I host a podcast about movies.
Everyone here is giving you good advice. Any reputable school will give you a free class and allow you to sit in on a few classes. If they don't, you should take your business elsewhere. Also, as other people have noted, there are a lot of really terrible egomaniacs teaching martial arts. If someone claims to have done a whole lot of awesome shit, but can't offer any proof, well...you see where I'm headed with this. Lots of fevered egos.
Do you feel any natural affinity towards any type of martial arts? Would you rather study an art that is predominately striking or grappling? Someone earlier suggested Muay Thai, and it will definitely offer you a workout. You're also assured a good workout as, eventually, you will be sparring a lot.
Also, Kung Fu is just a catch-all term for Chinese Martial Art. Basically, if the art originated in China, it's considered kung fu. Finding a reputable teacher of any style of kung fu in the states is challenging, but if you find a good one it's totally worth it.
There is a Wah Lum Pai Kwoon in Boston, which is Praying Mantis style kung fu. They tend to have a good name and be reputable. I'm not endorsing them or anything, just saying that they exist and tend to have a good reputation. Feel free to send me a PM if you have any questions.
I agree with the majority here that sparring is a must, and a good class will have an atmosphere that lets you give what you can while pushing you to do more, and not a "OOH-RAH MOTHERFUCKERS, IT'S TIME TO BANG!" mentality. If people are focused on how mean or badass they are, find somewhere else.
I started with Kung Fu in February and found it to be very well rounded. My particular school focuses on katas (formulated attack sets) as the primary thing-to-learn, augmented with self defense moves for all the basic scenarios. We also spar every class. Sparring is important to help you see how those formal katas can actually be used in real situations. Starting at yellow belt, we work on weapons. Tell you what, twirling a bo staff for 30 minutes gives your arms a great full-muscle work out.
Given what you want, you may also want to check out Tai Chi. This is actually a combative art that is very powerful. However, it is taught slowly so that you gain superior control over your body, balance, breathing, and movements. The workout is more than one would expect because it is primarily body-weight stuff (such as take 20 seconds to lift one leg high and slowly take a step) that will give you great tone and definition. When coupled with a traditional weight workout, it does amazing things for the body. The only thing it lacks is the aerobic angle - though this is solved by a run before/after class.
Any option you choose will provide you physical work and improve your coordination, balance, muscle tone, mental clarity, reaction time, and general feeling of healthiness.
Murphy's Paradox: The more you plan, the more that can go wrong. The less you plan, the less likely your plan will succeed.
Martial arts class without regular full contact sparring is a waste of time. I know it sounds heavy handed, but it really makes a difference.
Edit: Also, Sanda/San Shou is the shit. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanshou
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
That's a ridiculous argument. It may be a waste of time for you, but it's asinine to assert that it'd be a waste of someone elses'. The guy just wants to get in shape and do something interesting while doing it.
I've always found working out for the sake of working out dull. Competition, on the other hand...
Don't expect to become teh hardcorez overnight, and beware of any martial art that claims you don't need to be physically fit to be able to kick someone's ass. It's a lie. You don't need to be built like Charles Atlas but you do need to have a certain minimum level of stamina and muscular endurance. In fact, although doing martial arts will make you fitter in and of itself, you'll probably get more out of it faster if you spend a couple of hours a week in a gym as well, in particular focusing on your legs and core muscles (abs/back), which are a lot more important to most martial arts than your biceps and suchlike.
"And this is his sofa, is it?" said Arthur.
Do gi grappling for both.
Okay, fair enough. That sentince can be amended to "Martial arts class without regular full contact sparring is a waste of time, if you care even a little bit about learning to fight while you are there."
Better?
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
Where do you live?
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
Just outside Boston, Brighton specifically.
This is a good point as well.
I expected this thread to be full of people reccomending Wing Chun and RSBD classes, I'm pretty impressed with this forum.
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
This is the closest Judo place I could find, $40-$60 a month, plus $50 annual fee:
http://sites.google.com/a/tohokujudo.org/tohoku-judo-club/Class-Schedule
This is gonna be more than fifty a month, but you also have one of the best muay thai gyms in the U.S. right next to you:
http://www.sityodtong.com/
Muay Thai invloves kicking people in the face, wich is always fun, but not nessisaraly less effective than dropping someone's head on the floor with Judo.
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
Not necessarily. Some of the kung fu styles and tai chi often do a lot of static training/slow motion kata (someone mentioned the tai chi movements above). Those can get you into some seriously good shape. If you don't believe me, try holding a low horse stance for a couple minutes.
If you're looking for useful self defense skills, then sparring is really useful. If you're looking for a workout, it's not the only way to do it.
Where I do san shou there is a tai chi forms class. Few people who take it are in any kind of shape. Katas have thier uses in martial arts training, but they don't give a cardio workout or develop explosive strength.
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
As for price, I pay $100 a month, which gives me up to 4 classes a week if I was crazy. However, it is a high quality school and I am in Northern VA where everything is expensive.
Murphy's Paradox: The more you plan, the more that can go wrong. The less you plan, the less likely your plan will succeed.
A good Krav maga school will make you hurt. It will also make you fit. From what I've heard though pure Krav is a little light on the ground technique. This is all hearsay though, as I've not participated in these things.
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If it's a legit school, which it probably isn't, any Krav Maga school will teach purely self defense. If you're looking for the art in Martial Arts, you won't find it there.
Some schools will also be heavier on the discipline aspects than others. If saying "yes, sir" (or "hai, sensei") a lot is not your thing, then there are definitely schools where you can avoid it, although it might limit your choice of style.
I wouldn't consider either of these things to be indicative of the quality of the school, as I'm sure there will be good and bad schools of all varieties.
SCAM SCAM SCAM SCAM SCAM
Sorry, that's just the warning bell going off. $140 is a shit-ton, and I've noticed that the shittier the school, the more they charge.
That seems like a whole heck of a lot too.
If the president had any real power, he'd be able to live wherever the fuck he wanted.
The instructor and class is important. You want someone thats knowledgable and doesnt have anything to prove. Anyone that spends the whole first lesson telling you why their style is superior and that if you train under them you will be able to do X to person Y... not worth your time. Also be on the look out for rooms full of macho dicks that are just trying to prove something. Unfortunately - there are lots of these guys in MA.
By all means, pick up a realistic fighting system if thats your thing - but dont get put off by how seriously some people take it on forums. Martial arts are the most fun way to get fit that I've found... Well, aside from the obvious.
Also:
Good classes should have a pretty good sylabus. Nobody will expect you to be fit/flexible/coordinated when you first turn up - so thats not a worry. Similarly - most places set the kids classes aside from the adults. I honestly wouldn't worry about this. Their job is to teach you... Knowing nothing is actuially a lot better than knowing something from another style that you have to unlearn. Nobody will do this:
"OK man - hit this pad"
*paf*
"OH MY GO, JOE COME LOOK AT THIS GUY- HE HITS THE PAD LIKE A GIRL! Go on man do it again" *giggle*
They will expect you to be just as inexperienced as you are. Their job is to teach you.