Now, if we can just get Adam West to reprise his roll as Batman, it will be like the 70's, 80's, 90's and 2000's never happened!
Ingenious!
Sentry on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wrote:
When I was a little kid, I always pretended I was the hero,' Skip said.
'Fuck yeah, me too. What little kid ever pretended to be part of the lynch-mob?'
God damnit. You know, I get that Didio and Geoff Johns want the DCU to be as similar as possible to when they were kids but at one point, you'd really think that they'd realise "hey, aren't teenagers and young adults our target market, they weren't even alive when we were kids".
Whatever, I'll probably drop a lot of DCU books pretty soon. I'll stick around for Blackest Night and whatever Grant Morrison does but otherwise, I'll probably just stick to Vertigo and old DC trades.
God damnit. You know, I get that Didio and Geoff Johns want the DCU to be as similar as possible to when they were kids but at one point, you'd really think that they'd realise "hey, aren't teenagers and young adults our target market, they weren't even alive when we were kids".
Whatever, I'll probably drop a lot of DCU books pretty soon. I'll stick around for Blackest Night and whatever Grant Morrison does but otherwise, I'll probably just stick to Vertigo and old DC trades.
at least Quesada only cares about spider-man being like when he was a kid
You know, I don't even mind undoing Barbara's paralysis and making her an active superhero again, even if it flies in the face of her characterization throughout a 100+ issue run of Birds of Prey. But I just know that it'll be done at the expense of Cass; either she'll be shuffled aside for a while to eventually be killed in the next big Bat-Event, or she'll be made to look ineffectual and useless next to the real Batgirl.
Reconfiguring Babs as cheesecake--especially with the cleavage--just seems wrong. As Oracle, she was sexy in a smart way, which is far more appealing than yet another big boobed bouncing heroine.
It would be like watching Tina Fey give a lap dance to a farting drunk. That kind of wrong.
Reconfiguring Babs as cheesecake--especially with the cleavage--just seems wrong. As Oracle, she was sexy in a smart way, which is far more appealing than yet another big boobed bouncing heroine.
It would be like watching Tina Fey give a lap dance to a farting drunk. That kind of wrong.
To be honest, though, Cass has already been ruined as a character, and even if the impetus for the reboot is pretty stupid, I would be perfectly content if, when all is said and done, we have a Babs Batgirl that kicks ass as a character.
Kind of like Brand New Day? But not mediocre-bad?
Knowing DC, though, it'll be fucked up either way.
I'm pretty sure the new Batman will be Dick. I know it was only a possible future, but in 666 Damian says "I knew I would never be as good as my father or Dick Grayson but blah blah blah" something like that.
yeah.
okay, i know i keep harping on this, but rereading the whole series really puts certain things into a different light.
i just reread 666 today and a few things stood out.
when damian walks into his batcave area, there is a sort of trophy case. in this case are two batman outfits and damian's robin outfit. the batman outfit on the right is clearly bruce's costume. the one in the middle is very similar, but the bat symbol is quite a bit larger and more stylized. this costume is the one that is being worn by the dead batman we see in the beginning of the issue.
given that there are only two batsuits in the cave, coupled with, as mister bucker noted, damian specifically citing his father and dick as the two batmen he would never be as good as seems to pretty definitively point to grant's intention being that dick will become batman (assuming this is meant to be any sort of "real" future) and that damian will be his robin and somehow lead to dick's death.
this would also clarify babs' line about damian being responsible for the death of a "good friend". dick and babs were fuck buddies from way back, after all.
i can't seem to find a direct reference to damian's age in the "current" timeline, but given the art and his general attitude, i would estimate he's somewhere between nine and eleven. given that he claims to have sold his soul at the age of fourteen (presumably when he became batman and took on the full burden of being gotham's protector), it would appear he now has a window of something on the order of four years from "now" until dick's death.
if there's one thing I've learned though, you can never trust comics that take place in the future.
If you did, Tim would have to be Batman ala Titan's Tomorrow.
Sentry on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wrote:
When I was a little kid, I always pretended I was the hero,' Skip said.
'Fuck yeah, me too. What little kid ever pretended to be part of the lynch-mob?'
true. I also agree about the hints... Morrison seems to have a pretty damn clear picture for how things should go.
Sentry on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wrote:
When I was a little kid, I always pretended I was the hero,' Skip said.
'Fuck yeah, me too. What little kid ever pretended to be part of the lynch-mob?'
To be honest, though, Cass has already been ruined as a character, and even if the impetus for the reboot is pretty stupid, I would be perfectly content if, when all is said and done, we have a Babs Batgirl that kicks ass as a character.
Kind of like Brand New Day? But not mediocre-bad?
Knowing DC, though, it'll be fucked up either way.
I think you only have to look at who's writing the Oracle mini to get an idea of how things will go.
"Hey, we need someone to undo a critical element of one of the most famous, best-selling Batman stories ever written. Someone who can stack up to Alan Moore. Someone who possesses that same literary spark, with a gift for the written word."
"Alright, well Johns, Morrison, Rucka, Waid, Robinson, and Busiek are all booked up."
"Oh. Really?
Eh, fuck it. Get the guy who did Batman & Superman v.s. Vampires & Werewolves."
To be honest, though, Cass has already been ruined as a character, and even if the impetus for the reboot is pretty stupid, I would be perfectly content if, when all is said and done, we have a Babs Batgirl that kicks ass as a character.
Kind of like Brand New Day? But not mediocre-bad?
Knowing DC, though, it'll be fucked up either way.
ugh there is so much wrong with everything typed here
To be honest, though, Cass has already been ruined as a character, and even if the impetus for the reboot is pretty stupid, I would be perfectly content if, when all is said and done, we have a Babs Batgirl that kicks ass as a character.
Cass just needs someone who's name is not Adam Beechen to write her for a change.
This really does make me feel like her mini was specifically engineered in preparation for this turn of events, though. "Oh, you like Cass Batgirl? Well why didn't you buy her mini?"
Who was interviewed? I don't intend on going to IGN because it's a pretty big hassle to get videos or images to work properly on their site. I'd find it weird that Dick would suddenly not want to become Batman because of what it does to you, when he's already been acting very Batman-ish in his solo series. It wouldn't be the first time in the last few months that DC's left hand didn't know what its right hand was doing (despite them both being Batman books and having the same editor).
Didio, Daniels and Mart something?
In any case, I'm with Servo and Zeromus.
Dick's going to be Batman, but there will probably be a conflict with Tim before he picks up the cowl, and he's unlikely to do it super willingly. The interview implied that there were two reasons why he wouldn't want to be Batman, and I think they could both be overridden by his desire to maintain Bruce's legacy in a 'pure' form, untainted by Raging Tim or Psycho Jason.
It's too bad DC has permanently alienated Alan Moore. I'd love to see what he could do with Batman today, especially since he's come to view Killing Joke with some disdain.
It's too bad DC has permanently alienated Alan Moore. I'd love to see what he could do with Batman today, especially since he's come to view Killing Joke with some disdain.
It's too bad DC has permanently alienated Alan Moore. I'd love to see what he could do with Batman today, especially since he's come to view Killing Joke with some disdain.
Why?
Despite its popularity, Moore himself would later find much fault with his story, calling it "clumsy, misjudged, and [devoid of] real human importance." Moore, trying to present far more relatable, human characters, found that Batman and the Joker were just presented as characters[13] and said, "I don't think [The Killing Joke]'s a very good book. It's not saying anything very interesting."[14]
Or was that "why" directed at some other part of my statement?
I don't understand, is he just being a perfectionist? The ending says something interesting about them both and no superhero has ever been as vulnerable as Barbara.
I don't understand, is he just being a perfectionist? The ending says something interesting about them both and no superhero has ever been as vulnerable as Barbara.
From "The Extraordinary Works of Alan Moore", p122-123:
AM: There's lots of nastiness in Watchmen. But with Watchmen you're talking about kind of the universal issues, there's a payoff. There's some nasty stuff in Swamp Thing but with Swamp Thing, again, it's fine to talk about something that's important in a lot of those stories. If you're going to play the nasty card then you have to make sure that you've got a good reason for playing it, that it's not just gratuitous.
...
And I think that's probably, at the end of the day, what happened with The Killing Joke because there's some very nasty things in The Killing Joke and ultimately at the end of the day The Killing Joke is a story about Batman and the Joker: it isn't about anything that you're ever going to encounter in real life, because Batman and the Joker are not like any human beings that have ever lived. So there's no important human information being imparted.
...
So, like I said, you're not going to encounter those people on your next trip to the 7-11 or whatever, and knowing that their psychoses are a mirror image of each other is not really going to improve your life any. So that was what was wrong with The Killing Joke from my point of view.
Jacobkosh on
0
JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
in his defense none of those other writers really stack up to alan moore either
I think Busiek and Morrison can write superheroes just as well as Moore (partly because they're not laden with ten tons of arch, snide irony) and I feel like Morrison's nonsuperhero stuff is just as good as Moore's - I would put The Invisibles up against From Hell, for instance.
To be honest, though, Cass has already been ruined as a character, and even if the impetus for the reboot is pretty stupid, I would be perfectly content if, when all is said and done, we have a Babs Batgirl that kicks ass as a character.
Kind of like Brand New Day? But not mediocre-bad?
Knowing DC, though, it'll be fucked up either way.
ugh there is so much wrong with everything typed here
Part of me wants to see Babs as Batgirl again, but another part of me knows that she has grown way beyond the suit. I want her to have her spine healed no matter what, but it doesn't make sense for her to go from being a woman back to a girl. Perhaps we could put this gorgeous redhead back into costume as a "Bat-Woman," as it were. Oh wait...
I think Oracle is an awesome character and it would be a waste to put her back in a bat-suit. As Oracle, she fills a role of being a networking master. She can get almost any info for anyone. She's a valuable resource to Batman, the Justice League, the Outsiders, and the Birds of Prey. She can do so much more good in this capacity than she can as a costumed crime fighter.
Lucascraft on
0
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
I think Oracle is an awesome character and it would be a waste to put her back in a bat-suit. As Oracle, she fills a role of being a networking master. She can get almost any info for anyone. She's a valuable resource to Batman, the Justice League, the Outsiders, and the Birds of Prey. She can do so much more good in this capacity than she can as a costumed crime fighter.
She can do all that while she walks though. Because of the way the DC universe operates, she is choosing to be crippled. Which is the biggest flaw of her still being in the chair. It doesn't so anything but show that she hasn't moved on from TKJ yet.
actually it shows that she is unwilling to be given special treatment just because the gods that play around on our world happen to like her. if they can cure her, they can cure everyone, and unless they do, she won't take the cure.
I currently have zero batman trades (besides Death And The City). If I can only afford one at the moment, what is the one I absolutely should pick up first?
Kris on
0
JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
I currently have zero batman trades (besides Death And The City). If I can only afford one at the moment, what is the one I absolutely should pick up first?
Year One's a great book but I probably wouldn't get it if I could only buy one book, since Batman's origins are fairly well known at this point and it could feel a little redundant.
I'd probably go with The Long Halloween or Detective (which is the first part of Dini's Detective Comics run, before Death and the City).
Posts
reading that, it's not hard to make the leap to
Ingenious!
Whatever, I'll probably drop a lot of DCU books pretty soon. I'll stick around for Blackest Night and whatever Grant Morrison does but otherwise, I'll probably just stick to Vertigo and old DC trades.
Silver Age Comics are so great you guys!
Tumblr Twitter
Then the book changes its name at issue 2 to Oracle: With Working Legs.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
how the the fuck is being batgirl more effective than that?
It would be like watching Tina Fey give a lap dance to a farting drunk. That kind of wrong.
Even then, she would still probably be hilarious.
Kind of like Brand New Day? But not mediocre-bad?
Knowing DC, though, it'll be fucked up either way.
yeah.
okay, i know i keep harping on this, but rereading the whole series really puts certain things into a different light.
i just reread 666 today and a few things stood out.
when damian walks into his batcave area, there is a sort of trophy case. in this case are two batman outfits and damian's robin outfit. the batman outfit on the right is clearly bruce's costume. the one in the middle is very similar, but the bat symbol is quite a bit larger and more stylized. this costume is the one that is being worn by the dead batman we see in the beginning of the issue.
given that there are only two batsuits in the cave, coupled with, as mister bucker noted, damian specifically citing his father and dick as the two batmen he would never be as good as seems to pretty definitively point to grant's intention being that dick will become batman (assuming this is meant to be any sort of "real" future) and that damian will be his robin and somehow lead to dick's death.
this would also clarify babs' line about damian being responsible for the death of a "good friend". dick and babs were fuck buddies from way back, after all.
i can't seem to find a direct reference to damian's age in the "current" timeline, but given the art and his general attitude, i would estimate he's somewhere between nine and eleven. given that he claims to have sold his soul at the age of fourteen (presumably when he became batman and took on the full burden of being gotham's protector), it would appear he now has a window of something on the order of four years from "now" until dick's death.
If you did, Tim would have to be Batman ala Titan's Tomorrow.
either way, i doubt morrison didn't intend those hiints
I think you only have to look at who's writing the Oracle mini to get an idea of how things will go.
"Hey, we need someone to undo a critical element of one of the most famous, best-selling Batman stories ever written. Someone who can stack up to Alan Moore. Someone who possesses that same literary spark, with a gift for the written word."
"Alright, well Johns, Morrison, Rucka, Waid, Robinson, and Busiek are all booked up."
"Oh. Really?
Eh, fuck it. Get the guy who did Batman & Superman v.s. Vampires & Werewolves."
Tumblr Twitter
ugh there is so much wrong with everything typed here
Cass just needs someone who's name is not Adam Beechen to write her for a change.
This really does make me feel like her mini was specifically engineered in preparation for this turn of events, though. "Oh, you like Cass Batgirl? Well why didn't you buy her mini?"
Didio, Daniels and Mart something?
In any case, I'm with Servo and Zeromus.
Dick's going to be Batman, but there will probably be a conflict with Tim before he picks up the cowl, and he's unlikely to do it super willingly. The interview implied that there were two reasons why he wouldn't want to be Batman, and I think they could both be overridden by his desire to maintain Bruce's legacy in a 'pure' form, untainted by Raging Tim or Psycho Jason.
And I really like the 666 future.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
Why?
Or was that "why" directed at some other part of my statement?
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
From "The Extraordinary Works of Alan Moore", p122-123:
I think Busiek and Morrison can write superheroes just as well as Moore (partly because they're not laden with ten tons of arch, snide irony) and I feel like Morrison's nonsuperhero stuff is just as good as Moore's - I would put The Invisibles up against From Hell, for instance.
Howso?
That said, doesn't it seem excessive to already be lining up the death of the next Batman before he's even officially stepped into the role?
at least, presumably up until now.
I currently have zero batman trades (besides Death And The City). If I can only afford one at the moment, what is the one I absolutely should pick up first?
Year One.
I'd probably go with The Long Halloween or Detective (which is the first part of Dini's Detective Comics run, before Death and the City).