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At JFK Airport, Denying Basic Rights Is Just Another Day at the Office
Basar
IstanbulRegistered User regular
IstanbulRegistered User regular
It's kinda long but worth reading.
http://www.alternet.org/rights/95351/at_jfk_airport%2C_denying_basic_rights_is_just_another_day_at_the_office/?page=entire
I am not an American citizen, but have lived in the U.S. for more than 7 years and if that were to happen to me as a non-American, it would be nerve racking. I cannot believe Americans actualy take this sort of treatment for granted and let them continue with it.
Asking nicely to cooperate? Fine.
Questioning? Fine.
But detaining people there for hours without food / water and a restroom is frickin ridiculous. How hard is it to build a restroom there? I really love the U.S. for what it is but this sort of mistreatment and bullshit is part of the reason I left.
What do you think? Am I the only one disturbed by this stuff?
I was recently stopped by Homeland Security as I was returning from a trip to Syria. What I saw in the hours that followed shocked and disturbed me.
http://www.alternet.org/rights/95351/at_jfk_airport%2C_denying_basic_rights_is_just_another_day_at_the_office/?page=entire
I am not an American citizen, but have lived in the U.S. for more than 7 years and if that were to happen to me as a non-American, it would be nerve racking. I cannot believe Americans actualy take this sort of treatment for granted and let them continue with it.
Asking nicely to cooperate? Fine.
Questioning? Fine.
But detaining people there for hours without food / water and a restroom is frickin ridiculous. How hard is it to build a restroom there? I really love the U.S. for what it is but this sort of mistreatment and bullshit is part of the reason I left.
What do you think? Am I the only one disturbed by this stuff?
i live in a country with a batshit crazy president and no, english is not my first language
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I'm a little disturbed that standing up against a blatant abuse of civil rights is now so unconventional that it makes the news.
As a Canadian who commutes to America every day for school, I have grown to become incredibly annoyed at the border guards. I am pretty sure they dont trust anyone anymore. Its almost like you are assumed a terrorist until you are proven not.
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Yeah I don't like this. Alienating inalienable rights for the sake of stopping terrorism, or because some prissy misfit got upset, doesn't sit well with me. I'm a conservative though, so...
So! On the bright side: they do stupid things to people regardless of where they come from.
To be quick about it: Yes, it's legal.
To be more expanded: it's a blatant misuse of a terribly worded law that's been abused by the DHS since they were formed.
You can hold people indefinitely, even citizens, if you believe they may have information regarding crimes. DHS has been using this rule as a catch all for any detention of anyone since it doesn't require you to specify what crime they may have information on. So generically they go "you may know something about terrorists or terrorism" and keep you as long as they feel like.
Hi, welcome to what life is apparently like if you're not as pale white as I am. >< My interactions with DHS are pretty much 15 second affairs, depressingly.
What kind of sad time is it when you go to another country and they're nice to you almost to the point of putting a thumb up and saying "ok USA!" and then you come back here to be treated like scum?
I had a 5 minute chat with one of them over toothpaste that amused us both since there wasn't a line at 6am. We essentially went back and forth over what qualified as a liquid and if I was allowed to bring a frozen bottle of water if I wanted to. He was good natured about it, and admitted that the policy has been proven bullshit but will never go away because the agency would never admit they were wrong about something. I've had the same talks with armed NG units at the boston airport during the whole ZOMG LITE BRITE thing (what a day to fly out). Essentially bored grunts admitting that the entire thing was some serious bullshit.
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Only terrorists require more than 3 ounces of water. Are you a terrorist??
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It's been amended to only small (less than 2oz? something stupid) containers in ziplock bags on carry on luggage. A lot of the banned liquids are funny, and cause no end of headaches.
It's fallout from the OMG BINARY EXPLOSIVES thing a year or two back that has been completely discredited as scientifically impossible to pull off.
Not that I agree with the policy or that it isn't all a pain in the ass, but you're allowed to bring as much liquid as you want (as long as it fits in your stuff) after the checkpoint.
Why would anybody "trust" you on such an ignorant statement? Care to share with us examples of how americans are treated unfairly or abused by customs or airport personell "in the rest of the world"?
I wonder why that i$.
I've never gotten stopped getting on a plane. One time I accidentally took a wrong term at a London airport (blanking on which one this second) and ended up having to basically go through the international customs area again. They basically waved me through (barely made my plane... that would have sucked).
I'm also so white that Irish is my least white component. Not sure if that's related.
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Its a little bit of an exaggeration, but it has also become standard operating practice for experienced US travelers in Europe to pretend to be Canadian for this very reason (not with passports and the like but throwing a maple leaf on your backpack or in casual conversation). The current Administration has built up a lot of ill will and squandered a great great deal of good will internationally.
I hear the Japanese still welcome us though.
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I don't know, I'm pretty sure you can make explosives out of non-liquid material. You can fit enough on your body to blow a plane up. My fucking water or toothpaste should be the least of their concerns.
Hey, let's just make everyone get naked and get their body openings locked shut with some sort of medical procedure because that's the only way someone's not getting on the plane with an amount not able to blow it up. This is a stupid policy and the law that allows this or group that came up with this has no fucking common sense.
I've heard this rumour. Honestly, it just doesn't fly with me. Like GungHo said, as long as you don't suddenly start spouting crap about how things are better in my country and why the natives should do things "The American Way" you're pretty much fine. There might be one or two idiots that'll seek to say something purely on grounds of nationality, but those kinds of idiots can be found in pretty much any country and to do with any nationality.
It is true that the current administration is also seen as largely incompetent and stupid abroad. However, most people can tell the difference between a citizen and their government.
I have yet to meet an American outside his/her country I didn't get along with. I treat Americans well and as far as I know so do our boarder control guards.
My theory is that the bible thumpers, red necks and crazies all stay in their home states where they can tote their weaponry, sleep with their cousins and vote for their long lost uncles. I seriously don't understand how such a great people end up with such shitty leaders. I hope Obama gets elected and whips your government into shape.
In the past year Japanese customs started fingerprinting and photographing pretty much all foreigners, including permanent residents, on entry into Japan. Apparently this is to prevent terrorism, despite the fact that Japan's only notable incidents of terrorism were carried out by citizens.
But hey, at least it's not just Americans being singled out.
The best thing about the binary explosive bollocks was the guards at Heathrow deciding the best way to deal with this would be to confiscate all liquids...
...and then empty them into a large drum right next to the people queueing up to board!
As I'm emigrating to the US I've been active on immigration forums for a while and there are horror stories from all over the world. Visiting your girlfriend/boyfriend in the US is not illegal but if you lack sufficient proof of your ties to your home country (i.e. you usually need a letter from your employer and a letter from your landlord/mortgage payment evidence) then you can be viewed as intending to immigrate no matter what you or your partner says.
British man - white, ordinary-looking, etc. - went to visit his girlfriend, didn't lie upon inspection, just wanted a holiday - had no intent to stay there. Had a return ticket booked and everything. After interrogating him - and ringing her up and interrogating her - for several hours he was handcuffed, led away to jail, offered only beef jerky to eat and then sent straight home.
Another example - British man again, a guy my dad knows. He originally wanted to tour the States for 4 months or so, and as the Visa Waiver Program only allows you to travel without a visa for 3 months he applied for a tourist (6 month) visa. He was denied at the US embassy, but this does not affect the use of the VWP so instead he just decided to scale back his trip to 6 weeks. However, once he was in the air and filling out the forms, he came across the question 'have you ever been denied a US visa before?' He ticked yes, thinking he was being honest. (He actually needed to tick no, as they are only concerned with immigration visas). At point of entry, he wasn't given a real chance to explain. Just slung in jail again and sent back on the next available flight.
Fortunately I've had few problems entering the US. I was asked more questions than when I've flown to any other country, but that was about it.
Yeah, it can be hard for the border guards to determine when someone is lying, and I understand the need to prove ties to your home country, but I don't see how that excuses the kind of treatment people are subjected to.
Oh, and the US has taken the fingerprints of my forefingers, um, 6 times now, and the fingerprints of my whole hand twice. That's also pretty crazy. :P
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That was my fault - I was packing his carry-on bag full of edible goodies completely forgetting about the restriction on liquids, although I'm not sure I would've counted salad cream as a liquid. 4 packets of Jaffa Cakes, 6 mince pies, 1 Christmas cake, several chocolate bars and a couple of packs of biscuits were a-okay, though. :^:
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Host: And now it's time for the bonus round: What's in my barrel?
Audience: Chug! Chug! Chug! Chug!
I think my primary concern would be what if someone had smuggled a caustic chemical and was mixed with something that could react with it?
Now, I cant go 30 km to my school across the supposed "longest undefended border" in the world without being given the third degree every time. And of course I get no grief coming back into Canada at all.
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Oh I know. That was still one of the first thing that came to mind though.
But seriously, it is pretty retarded if they were actually mixing it together in one big pot.
At least we know where weekend kids TV variety shows get their "gunk" from.
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