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KnobTURN THE BEAT BACKInternetModeratorMod Emeritus
edited September 2006
It is pretty sweet ass and maybe I will use this as an excuse to drum up some dudes to play in that game that has been sitting on the backburner for ages because my friends are lazy
we're talking new world of darkness, right? Either way, yeah its sweet ass. I don't like the new mage. Its not for me. I've yet to check out promethean, but out of the other three definitely Werewolf the forsaken i like the most.
Something about playing an overweight hairdresser that can turn into a huge fucking wolf and rip your face off. Also the renewed focus on spirits, thats also good.
Canada_jezus on
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KnobTURN THE BEAT BACKInternetModeratorMod Emeritus
My friends are all still pretty slightly saddened that our oWoD Mage game petered out and died a quiet death due to scheduling conflicts. I had a three-part storyline envisioned with few relevant side-adventures that figured into an overall universe of awesome. Only got through a third of it.
I never even got a chance to trick the bastard who had to be different by requesting to play a Corax in such a way that he'd be silently assassinated by a Nagah trio without warning.
At least I got to nearly kill them all with the zombified remains of molested children.
I'm not entirely sure I like the new system. Mind, I haven't played very much yet but the rearragnement concerning attributes seem a little bit... fishy...
Are they going to bring all of the old world of darkness over to the new system? I really liked Changeling, but I haven't played any other world of darkness games.
I used to play this with a few...serious gamers. They were writers for White Wolf. This was before the whole new game shit.
I thought the system was a lot of fun and the setting was hardcore. It's the first time I've ever had a GM use sounds and music to set the background and mood of the game.
But yeah, the new version? Fuck that noise. No Get of Fenris means no game.
MegaMan001 on
I am in the business of saving lives.
0
AthenorBattle Hardened OptimistThe Skies of HiigaraRegistered Userregular
edited September 2006
So can someone give a quick synopsis of the "New" WoD?
I loved the Time of Judgement, and the whole concepts behind it.. But I felt cheated when I found out they were hitting "reboot" instead of actually continuing the plotline -after- the apocalypse.
I still want to run a campaign set after the day of judgement.
Also, if I pick up the new core WoD book, does it have enough rules in it to run a WoD game without the actual core rulebook? That's the thing that always upset me about this concept of a unified rulebook that the game is a module off of -- When I buy an RPG, I want that book to have everything you need to run a game. (This was my big issue with L5R 2nd.. I only let D&D slide on tradition and the sheer volume of info that game has in its core books.)
Athenor on
He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
There were times when if I saw the White Wolf insignia again, I was going to stab someone in the groin.
Then again, there are times now where I just get this sudden urge to run another one.
Man. I have a whole microcosm worked out, too. I knew what every NPC was doing at every minute of the day, who was in cohoots with whom, all that shit.
But I just got tired of it. That and it was getting to the point where the players were basically always playing the same characters with different names and slightly different stats every time. And this was all a combination of 1st and 2nd edition stuff. None of that "Revised Edition" crap.
But six years is a bit too much for one game. I mean, I ran other games here and there, but we always returned to WoD within a couple of weeks. And if I wasn't running it, someone else was.
Also, if I pick up the new core WoD book, does it have enough rules in it to run a WoD game without the actual core rulebook? That's the thing that always upset me about this concept of a unified rulebook that the game is a module off of -- When I buy an RPG, I want that book to have everything you need to run a game. (This was my big issue with L5R 2nd.. I only let D&D slide on tradition and the sheer volume of info that game has in its core books.)
I don't quite follow your question, however, if you pick up any of the faction nWoD books, you will not be able to play a game as they do not contain base character creation information or general mechanics. So WoD rulebook + game supplement rulebook = nWoD game. A nWoD Mortal game can be fashioned out of the rules in the nWoD rulebook, however.
Casses Judger on
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AthenorBattle Hardened OptimistThe Skies of HiigaraRegistered Userregular
edited September 2006
Okay.. so the base book contains the character creation, and the supplement books contain everything else.
Whee. Is there any other merit to the core books?
I only ask because the new books are hella expensive and big.
Athenor on
He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
I have significant problems with the new world of darkness. I initially approached it with great enthusiasm and curiousity, but they seem to have removed everything interesting.
I have significant problems with the new world of darkness. I initially approached it with great enthusiasm and curiousity, but they seem to have removed everything interesting.
Agreed.
They've sucked all the horror out of the horror game.
They've pulled all the intrigue of of the intrigue game.
Now it's like a bunch of LiveJournal and MySpace kids running around giving each other the finger and calling it politics.
Saint JusticeMercenaryMah-vel Baybee!!!Registered Userregular
edited September 2006
Only WoD stuff I'm familiar with is Vampire: Masquerade and Vampire: Requiem. I definitely prefer Masquerade. I don't like how they "streamlined" everything by taking away all the interesting aspects of the WoD and cutting out awesome clans left and right.
I'm actually about to start running a Vampire: Masquerade game on Wednesday night. Just me and three close friends for players. I'm really excited about it and we have all the character creation stuff out of the way. Now I just need to dream up some cool story ideas for them. . .
Saint Justice on
Some people play tennis, I erode the human soul. ~ Tycho
The newest one, Promethean the Created is incredibly good actually. It's very different from the others I find and has a really great theme, even a tangible "Can logically be achieved in a chronical" goal as well. I very much suggest having a look at it.
See, this sounds interesting to me, because it's exactly what the Old World of Darkness games were and the other New World of Darkness games aren't: It's got meaning, philosophy, a unique and interesting premise, and a goal.
Oh and the New Mage, before I forget to add some barb at WoD seeing as I can, is utterly crap.
But... but..
It has a big, shiny book, and the old Mage was the second most kickass WoD setting (after changeling)!
Athenor on
He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
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Saint JusticeMercenaryMah-vel Baybee!!!Registered Userregular
edited September 2006
Anybody have any Storyteller tips for me? I"m running a Vampire: The Masquerade game. 3 players, Camarilla Vamps. A Malkavian, Toreador, and Tremere. The Malk's derangement is megalomania, I'm really excited about that, should be interesting.
Saint Justice on
Some people play tennis, I erode the human soul. ~ Tycho
Anybody have any Storyteller tips for me? I"m running a Vampire: The Masquerade game. 3 players, Camarilla Vamps. A Malkavian, Toreador, and Tremere. The Malk's derangement is megalomania, I'm really excited about that, should be interesting.
I was bottom'd! noo!
Saint Justice on
Some people play tennis, I erode the human soul. ~ Tycho
What would be crazy is if we could get some WoD games going... and have them all tied together somehow. Yeah.
It is possible to do, but the hardest one is tying in Prometheans because even other supernaturals effectively hate them on sight and even with gifts etc will eventually become affected by disquiet. You could tie them together with story pretty easily, but having other supernaturals/mortals work with prometheans is extremely difficult.
I've mixed feelings about nWoD. Two steps forward, one step back in my mind. I like some of the streamlining and the focus on usable content, but some of their design decisions bother me, and the system still has too much MySpace energy. Still stuff I like though.
Anybody have any Storyteller tips for me? I"m running a Vampire: The Masquerade game. 3 players, Camarilla Vamps. A Malkavian, Toreador, and Tremere. The Malk's derangement is megalomania, I'm really excited about that, should be interesting.
I was bottom'd! noo!
Keep your setting, goals, and plotlines small. No plans for taking over an entire country, no nuclear bombs, small but interesting plots are easy to mange and don't get out of control. This doesn't mean they should be simple or boring, but a larger scale doesn't necessarily make anything better.
Secret ST / GM weapon: Sheet of paper with 10 male names, 10 female names, 5 business names (bars, hotels, eateries, whatever), 5 villains, and 5 one-sentence random encounters. Think of it as your lifeline, great when you need something off the top of your head and don't want to stutter for seven seconds before naming the mysterious stranger "Ted."
Oh yeah, murder mysteries are, IMO, a great way to start a campaign.
Okay ... I haven't played any WoD in over ten years, since Masquerade 2nd Edition. From doing a bit of thumbing through online, these are the significant changes to Vampire they've apparently made in Requiem (note how skillfully I criticise something without actually seeing it, based on scattered reports on the intarweb):
Removing Kindred generations. Is it just me, or is this tinkering with one of the fundamental game mechanics that made the whole thing interesting in the first place?
Various discipline changes to make the game less combat-centred and more story-oriented. Was this really necessary? Maybe I just always had good groups and good storytellers, but story and actual role-playing was never a problem, and general shit-kicking was always quite secondary.
Cutting down the clans."This lack of choice in clan has been instituted to force players to think of ways to make their character unique, rather than rely on playing "the last member of a dying race"; a problem which some felt had become endemic among certain players." Yet, "In Requiem also, bloodlines play a more important role, with many vampires belonging to a minor bloodline that branched away from a major clan." Makes no sense. Doesn't this pretty much encourage the very problem they're trying to solve?
Enabling intra-clan political factions and reducing the "social weight" of a player's clan. This sounds nice on the surface, but I don't really see what it serves in the end. The clans were already ideological entities by nature (unless you were Sabbat), with their own respective socio-political motivations, all under the umbrella of the Camarilla. Unless ...
Doing away with the Camarilla and Sabbat, the Inconnu, Caine, and Gehenna. Yeah, here it is. So there is no polarising struggle, no historical foundation, no dominant folklore. In fact, since every vampire ever made occasionally goes into torpor and loses their memory, no one's really sure about anything and the storyteller is free to cook up whatever horseshit they want, encouraging even more contradictory and unlikely story concepts not only in the characters, but in the world as a whole.
The whole thing now sounds like a bad PC RPG to me. Is this really how things are? Does anyone actually play Requiem? I know a fair few folks who still play Masquerade, so that would probably explain a lot. Or am I getting a completely skewed impression, and these changes are actually positive in some way, making it a better game and leaving us old farts who fear change in the dust?
Gnu on
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Saint JusticeMercenaryMah-vel Baybee!!!Registered Userregular
edited September 2006
I completely agree with you, Gnu. They basically stripped away massive amounts of content and expected you to thank them for giving you less choice. Here's an idea: if there's something in the book you don't want, don't fucking include it in your game! White Wolf shouldn't restrict ST's and players because they condescendingly don't think they can handle it.
Saint Justice on
Some people play tennis, I erode the human soul. ~ Tycho
So am I one of the only people who actually LIKES the nWoD? I'm in a Requiem game now (over on SA) and it's really quiet nice. I like the 5x5 dynamic all the new World of Darkness games have.
I view it the other way around actually, the more that's set in complete stone canon the more they are restricting me as an ST. Now I can make whatever and all decisions I want to do so regarding the origins of vampires as a whole, as individual clans and whatever else I choose to do.
With respect, that may seem intriguing to some storytellers, but it's horrible for players. For one, when you start whittling away canon and leaving the world open-ended, you have to learn an entirely new world view every time you sit down with a new storyteller, and that completely kills the roleplay aspect. Every time a player does something that elicits a "no we can't do or say or think that because this and this and this is the way things work", it shatters the immersive experience. It's being able to expect that the world works a certain way that allows players the freedom to play out their characters without concerning themselves with the storyteller's whims. It's the players who really tell the story; the storyteller's just a middleman between the players and the scenario.
And as a storyteller ... well, a for me, sandbox is only fun for so long without toys to play with. Rules have a way of encouraging creativity and suspense more often than stifling it. When anything goes, nothing is a surprise anymore.
I need to read Promethean. Wait, it's out? Shit. I haven't been into the nWoD or any WoD for far too long since I lost knowing an ST to run the games, or, well, people to play with in general.
I've not had the desire to read Werewolf too much yet, since I hated the original Garou. The Fera I loved, and as far as I know nWoD is not going to have them. Ah well.
Vampire can just. I don't even know what Vampire can do. It sounds all well and good from the end of mechanics, love the new systems, bloodline freedom and all, but.. Vampire needed metaplot. Without the Jyhad, or Gehenna, Masquerade would've fizzled. The history of vampires was the best part of the damn thing. Requiem has a lot of good ingredients but absolutely no flavor.
"But the ST can fill in badass shit there!" This is not a new development. The Golden Rule has been in the books. Now they just made an entire book out of the golden rule. It's best when there's something there for you to have as at least a default, and the Storyteller could use his/her imagination to change it, or completely bulldoze it and do a load of new shit.
Plus Anatole was the fucking bee's knees.
New mage has its ups and downs. Atlantis is good. The new magic system is brilliant. The Paths & Orders? Um. It's hard to say. You can make every kind of Mage you used to, but now it doesn't seem like there's too much society behind it. Well there is bu--Ah hell. You can easily make an Acanthus version of a Euthanatos, but then there is no Euthanatos. You're a point of view in a very large pool of point of views instead of a smaller, more specific one more guarenteed to sympathise with your morals and practices. Did that make any sense? I'm bad at that.
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Something about playing an overweight hairdresser that can turn into a huge fucking wolf and rip your face off. Also the renewed focus on spirits, thats also good.
I don't know about anyone else
but i'm not
Huh, well, in that case.
How about those thirteen clans? Or like, what, 9 traditions? Man its been too long.
I never even got a chance to trick the bastard who had to be different by requesting to play a Corax in such a way that he'd be silently assassinated by a Nagah trio without warning.
At least I got to nearly kill them all with the zombified remains of molested children.
"Olol I am a vampyre and I hate life and I dress all in black, and I'm Malkavian so I'm going to use my powers to have sex with the waitress."
"Uhm. Right. You guys have fun."
I thought the system was a lot of fun and the setting was hardcore. It's the first time I've ever had a GM use sounds and music to set the background and mood of the game.
But yeah, the new version? Fuck that noise. No Get of Fenris means no game.
I loved the Time of Judgement, and the whole concepts behind it.. But I felt cheated when I found out they were hitting "reboot" instead of actually continuing the plotline -after- the apocalypse.
I still want to run a campaign set after the day of judgement.
Also, if I pick up the new core WoD book, does it have enough rules in it to run a WoD game without the actual core rulebook? That's the thing that always upset me about this concept of a unified rulebook that the game is a module off of -- When I buy an RPG, I want that book to have everything you need to run a game. (This was my big issue with L5R 2nd.. I only let D&D slide on tradition and the sheer volume of info that game has in its core books.)
There were times when if I saw the White Wolf insignia again, I was going to stab someone in the groin.
Then again, there are times now where I just get this sudden urge to run another one.
Man. I have a whole microcosm worked out, too. I knew what every NPC was doing at every minute of the day, who was in cohoots with whom, all that shit.
But I just got tired of it. That and it was getting to the point where the players were basically always playing the same characters with different names and slightly different stats every time. And this was all a combination of 1st and 2nd edition stuff. None of that "Revised Edition" crap.
But six years is a bit too much for one game. I mean, I ran other games here and there, but we always returned to WoD within a couple of weeks. And if I wasn't running it, someone else was.
I don't quite follow your question, however, if you pick up any of the faction nWoD books, you will not be able to play a game as they do not contain base character creation information or general mechanics. So WoD rulebook + game supplement rulebook = nWoD game. A nWoD Mortal game can be fashioned out of the rules in the nWoD rulebook, however.
Whee. Is there any other merit to the core books?
I only ask because the new books are hella expensive and big.
Agreed.
They've sucked all the horror out of the horror game.
They've pulled all the intrigue of of the intrigue game.
Now it's like a bunch of LiveJournal and MySpace kids running around giving each other the finger and calling it politics.
I'm actually about to start running a Vampire: Masquerade game on Wednesday night. Just me and three close friends for players. I'm really excited about it and we have all the character creation stuff out of the way. Now I just need to dream up some cool story ideas for them. . .
But... but..
It has a big, shiny book, and the old Mage was the second most kickass WoD setting (after changeling)!
I was bottom'd! noo!
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
They could probably get along with Mages...
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Keep your setting, goals, and plotlines small. No plans for taking over an entire country, no nuclear bombs, small but interesting plots are easy to mange and don't get out of control. This doesn't mean they should be simple or boring, but a larger scale doesn't necessarily make anything better.
Secret ST / GM weapon: Sheet of paper with 10 male names, 10 female names, 5 business names (bars, hotels, eateries, whatever), 5 villains, and 5 one-sentence random encounters. Think of it as your lifeline, great when you need something off the top of your head and don't want to stutter for seven seconds before naming the mysterious stranger "Ted."
Oh yeah, murder mysteries are, IMO, a great way to start a campaign.
Okay ... I haven't played any WoD in over ten years, since Masquerade 2nd Edition. From doing a bit of thumbing through online, these are the significant changes to Vampire they've apparently made in Requiem (note how skillfully I criticise something without actually seeing it, based on scattered reports on the intarweb):
Removing Kindred generations. Is it just me, or is this tinkering with one of the fundamental game mechanics that made the whole thing interesting in the first place?
Various discipline changes to make the game less combat-centred and more story-oriented. Was this really necessary? Maybe I just always had good groups and good storytellers, but story and actual role-playing was never a problem, and general shit-kicking was always quite secondary.
Cutting down the clans. "This lack of choice in clan has been instituted to force players to think of ways to make their character unique, rather than rely on playing "the last member of a dying race"; a problem which some felt had become endemic among certain players." Yet, "In Requiem also, bloodlines play a more important role, with many vampires belonging to a minor bloodline that branched away from a major clan." Makes no sense. Doesn't this pretty much encourage the very problem they're trying to solve?
Enabling intra-clan political factions and reducing the "social weight" of a player's clan. This sounds nice on the surface, but I don't really see what it serves in the end. The clans were already ideological entities by nature (unless you were Sabbat), with their own respective socio-political motivations, all under the umbrella of the Camarilla. Unless ...
Doing away with the Camarilla and Sabbat, the Inconnu, Caine, and Gehenna. Yeah, here it is. So there is no polarising struggle, no historical foundation, no dominant folklore. In fact, since every vampire ever made occasionally goes into torpor and loses their memory, no one's really sure about anything and the storyteller is free to cook up whatever horseshit they want, encouraging even more contradictory and unlikely story concepts not only in the characters, but in the world as a whole.
The whole thing now sounds like a bad PC RPG to me. Is this really how things are? Does anyone actually play Requiem? I know a fair few folks who still play Masquerade, so that would probably explain a lot. Or am I getting a completely skewed impression, and these changes are actually positive in some way, making it a better game and leaving us old farts who fear change in the dust?
And as a storyteller ... well, a for me, sandbox is only fun for so long without toys to play with. Rules have a way of encouraging creativity and suspense more often than stifling it. When anything goes, nothing is a surprise anymore.
I've not had the desire to read Werewolf too much yet, since I hated the original Garou. The Fera I loved, and as far as I know nWoD is not going to have them. Ah well.
Vampire can just. I don't even know what Vampire can do. It sounds all well and good from the end of mechanics, love the new systems, bloodline freedom and all, but.. Vampire needed metaplot. Without the Jyhad, or Gehenna, Masquerade would've fizzled. The history of vampires was the best part of the damn thing. Requiem has a lot of good ingredients but absolutely no flavor.
"But the ST can fill in badass shit there!" This is not a new development. The Golden Rule has been in the books. Now they just made an entire book out of the golden rule. It's best when there's something there for you to have as at least a default, and the Storyteller could use his/her imagination to change it, or completely bulldoze it and do a load of new shit.
Plus Anatole was the fucking bee's knees.
New mage has its ups and downs. Atlantis is good. The new magic system is brilliant. The Paths & Orders? Um. It's hard to say. You can make every kind of Mage you used to, but now it doesn't seem like there's too much society behind it. Well there is bu--Ah hell. You can easily make an Acanthus version of a Euthanatos, but then there is no Euthanatos. You're a point of view in a very large pool of point of views instead of a smaller, more specific one more guarenteed to sympathise with your morals and practices. Did that make any sense? I'm bad at that.
I actually like the paring down of the clans, and I am a big fan of the Covenants.