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WoW: WotLK Release Date Set at 11/13/08 [Chat and General Discussion]

1356762

Posts

  • HalfmexHalfmex I mock your value system You also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Mgcw wrote: »
    Halfmex wrote: »
    Oh, I see. Well that at least makes some sense, or more sense than it did as a Human racial. Shadowmeld has always sucked ass, but at least this way it has some reasonable PvE application.
    Yeah being able to stealth drink all the time on my Druid, I totally hated that!
    My mistake, I thought any action taken canceled the effect. My highest level Night Elf is 32 and he's never PvPed, so I honestly didn't use Shadowmeld much at all.

    Halfmex on
  • ScroffusScroffus Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    It also lets you afk more safely I guess.

    Scroffus on
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Gaaaaah. There's no "nerfing" in beta, people.

    What Blizz is doing is ramping up the numbers all the way to one extreme, then pushing them all the way back down to the other. Now they'll change things, a couple of variables at a time, in order to finetune and balance.

    At the same time, they'll try out different ideas just to see how they work - it depresses me that so many people act as if whatever the latest change in beta is what's going live. :/

    Agree 100%, but I think most people here use "nerf" as a word for knocked down or whatever, I don't really see another word to use I don't think most people are saying OMFG WTF THEY NERFED * THIS FUCKING SUCKS. Well, I mean I do see a bit of it just in general not much.

    Mgcw on
  • Beyond NormalBeyond Normal Lord Phender Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Gaaaaah. There's no "nerfing" in beta, people.

    What Blizz is doing is ramping up the numbers all the way to one extreme, then pushing them all the way back down to the other. Now they'll change things, a couple of variables at a time, in order to finetune and balance.

    At the same time, they'll try out different ideas just to see how they work - it depresses me that so many people act as if whatever the latest change in beta is what's going live. :/

    This is why I've adopted a state of complete apathy for the expansion. It's gonna come out when it comes out and it's gonna have whatever.

    However, I got completely excited for the paladin evocate. That shit was needed.

    Beyond Normal on
    Battle.net: Phender#1108 -- Steam: Phender -- PS4: Phender12 -- Origin: Phender01
  • SeptusSeptus Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Gaaaaah. There's no "nerfing" in beta, people.

    What Blizz is doing is ramping up the numbers all the way to one extreme, then pushing them all the way back down to the other. Now they'll change things, a couple of variables at a time, in order to finetune and balance.

    At the same time, they'll try out different ideas just to see how they work - it depresses me that so many people act as if whatever the latest change in beta is what's going live. :/

    Nerfing doesn't inherently mean bad, it's a reduction of power for the player, so that's what these are.

    Most of these changes don't concern me, a lot of them are general damage multipliers being reduced, and most classes are receiving them. But in some cases, they're clearly, obviously too much, like the second round of large nerfs for Death Knights, but more importantly, some talents and abilities were nerfed into near uselessness(Lock and Load).

    Septus on
    PSN: Kurahoshi1
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Septus wrote: »
    Caedere wrote: »
    Gaaaaah. There's no "nerfing" in beta, people.

    What Blizz is doing is ramping up the numbers all the way to one extreme, then pushing them all the way back down to the other. Now they'll change things, a couple of variables at a time, in order to finetune and balance.

    At the same time, they'll try out different ideas just to see how they work - it depresses me that so many people act as if whatever the latest change in beta is what's going live. :/

    Nerfing doesn't inherently mean bad, it's a reduction of power for the player, so that's what these are.

    Most of these changes don't concern me, a lot of them are general damage multipliers being reduced, and most classes are receiving them. But in some cases, they're clearly, obviously too much, like the second round of large nerfs for Death Knights, but more importantly, some talents and abilities were nerfed into near uselessness(Lock and Load).

    You're just proving my point.

    Of course they're being made useless. That's part of the testing process.

    You make it sound like it's the final state for these abilities - right now, none of these changes should concern people. They make changes, get constructive feedback, datamine the everliving shit out of the new data, and adjust accordingly.

    Caedere on
    FWnykYl.jpg
  • ScroffusScroffus Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Everytime I hear the word "datamining" I keep thinking of dwarfs in a server room with little pick axes smashing into servers looking for data.

    Scroffus on
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Scroffus wrote: »
    Everytime I hear the word "datamining" I keep thinking of dwarfs in a server room with little pick axes smashing into servers looking for data.

    Best mental image ever.

    Mgcw on
  • Wombat02Wombat02 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Septus wrote: »
    Caedere wrote: »
    Gaaaaah. There's no "nerfing" in beta, people.

    What Blizz is doing is ramping up the numbers all the way to one extreme, then pushing them all the way back down to the other. Now they'll change things, a couple of variables at a time, in order to finetune and balance.

    At the same time, they'll try out different ideas just to see how they work - it depresses me that so many people act as if whatever the latest change in beta is what's going live. :/

    Nerfing doesn't inherently mean bad, it's a reduction of power for the player, so that's what these are.

    Most of these changes don't concern me, a lot of them are general damage multipliers being reduced, and most classes are receiving them. But in some cases, they're clearly, obviously too much, like the second round of large nerfs for Death Knights, but more importantly, some talents and abilities were nerfed into near uselessness(Lock and Load).

    You're just proving my point.

    Of course they're being made useless. That's part of the testing process.

    You make it sound like it's the final state for these abilities - right now, none of these changes should concern people. They make changes, get constructive feedback, datamine the everliving shit out of the new data, and adjust accordingly.

    So we aren't allowed to talk about the game, on a forum designed for us to talk about the... game?

    Wombat02 on
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Wombat02 wrote: »
    Caedere wrote: »
    Septus wrote: »
    Caedere wrote: »
    Gaaaaah. There's no "nerfing" in beta, people.

    What Blizz is doing is ramping up the numbers all the way to one extreme, then pushing them all the way back down to the other. Now they'll change things, a couple of variables at a time, in order to finetune and balance.

    At the same time, they'll try out different ideas just to see how they work - it depresses me that so many people act as if whatever the latest change in beta is what's going live. :/

    Nerfing doesn't inherently mean bad, it's a reduction of power for the player, so that's what these are.

    Most of these changes don't concern me, a lot of them are general damage multipliers being reduced, and most classes are receiving them. But in some cases, they're clearly, obviously too much, like the second round of large nerfs for Death Knights, but more importantly, some talents and abilities were nerfed into near uselessness(Lock and Load).

    You're just proving my point.

    Of course they're being made useless. That's part of the testing process.

    You make it sound like it's the final state for these abilities - right now, none of these changes should concern people. They make changes, get constructive feedback, datamine the everliving shit out of the new data, and adjust accordingly.

    So we aren't allowed to talk about the game, on a forum designed for us to talk about the... game?

    Show me where I said that and I'll blow you. :winky:

    Caedere on
    FWnykYl.jpg
  • EndEnd Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Wombat02 wrote: »
    Caedere wrote: »
    Septus wrote: »
    Nerfing doesn't inherently mean bad, it's a reduction of power for the player, so that's what these are.

    Most of these changes don't concern me, a lot of them are general damage multipliers being reduced, and most classes are receiving them. But in some cases, they're clearly, obviously too much, like the second round of large nerfs for Death Knights, but more importantly, some talents and abilities were nerfed into near uselessness(Lock and Load).

    You're just proving my point.

    Of course they're being made useless. That's part of the testing process.

    You make it sound like it's the final state for these abilities - right now, none of these changes should concern people. They make changes, get constructive feedback, datamine the everliving shit out of the new data, and adjust accordingly.

    So we aren't allowed to talk about the game, on a forum designed for us to talk about the... game?

    I think concern and discussion is fine, but people shouldn't get their panties in a bunch.

    There will be another beta push next week, and nearly all of the changes will be forgotten by us by then. ;-)

    End on
    I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
    zaleiria-by-lexxy-sig.jpg
  • TheEmergedTheEmerged Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Septus wrote: »
    TheEmerged wrote: »
    Well, I still haven't gotten a beta key either... oh wait, that's because I refuse to do work I'm not paid for. Silly me, carry on :P

    Playing WoW is work now? The beta is still relatively stable I believe, and Death Knights will be fun, as will all the other new talents.

    No, doing proper beta testing is work IMO. Playing WoW happens to be a lot of fun, but I don't like spending what time I have to play the game "not count". And don't tell me I'm learning stuff in advance, because most of it will be on WoWHead the day after it hits, or changed again.

    If someone else doesn't care about that (and from reading this and other boards, I know I'm in the minority there) more power to them.

    TheEmerged on
    Sometimes, the knights are the monsters
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I'm still torn between leveling up my moobear, or going for a deathmoo instead. So many choices... D:

    Caedere on
    FWnykYl.jpg
  • AddaAdda LondonRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Scroffus wrote: »
    Everytime I hear the word "datamining" I keep thinking of dwarfs in a server room with little pick axes smashing into servers looking for data.


    "Ohhhh the files are IN the computer"

    Adda on
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    I want to know more PA people on Twitter.
  • Little JimLittle Jim __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2008
    haha i guess the wow community at large broke another CM huh

    Little Jim on
    th_crabz.png
  • ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Little Jim wrote: »
    haha i guess the wow community at large broke another CM huh

    Who? Ghostcrawler?

    He's a Developer, not a CM, and if that's the usual slant of his posts, he sounds anything but broken. What he does sound is "fucking awesome".

    He pretty much nailed the forums/community to a T. And I don't mean in the accuracy of his mockery, he figuratively nailed them to a fucking cross.

    Forar on
    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
  • HalfmexHalfmex I mock your value system You also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    The great thing about him is that he's always direct without being a douche about things (like Tseric could be, or Drysc to a lesser extent ). Even Zarhym or whatever the floating red skull's name is) is pretty decent.

    Halfmex on
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Forar wrote: »
    Little Jim wrote: »
    haha i guess the wow community at large broke another CM huh

    Who? Ghostcrawler?

    He's a Developer, not a CM, and if that's the usual slant of his posts, he sounds anything but broken. What he does sound is "fucking awesome".

    He pretty much nailed the forums/community to a T. And I don't mean in the accuracy of his mockery, he figuratively nailed them to a fucking cross.
    Ghostcrawler is fucking awesome. I... I think GC might be a girl, I don't know, however. I'm uncertain of what gender pronoun to use.

    But yeah - the DK forums contain the highest amount of GC-goodness that you'll find. It's full of pure gold.

    Caedere on
    FWnykYl.jpg
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Little Jim wrote: »
    haha i guess the wow community at large broke another CM huh

    Who? Ghostcrawler?

    He's a Developer, not a CM, and if that's the usual slant of his posts, he sounds anything but broken. What he does sound is "fucking awesome".

    He pretty much nailed the forums/community to a T. And I don't mean in the accuracy of his mockery, he figuratively nailed them to a fucking cross.
    Ghostcrawler is fucking awesome. I... I think GC might be a girl, I don't know, however. I'm uncertain of what gender pronoun to use.

    But yeah - the DK forums contain the highest amount of GC-goodness that you'll find. It's full of pure gold.

    Yes, have seen her referred to as She by other CMs I believe.

    EDIT: They must have sent out a huge wave of beta invites, like 5-6 people I know got one yesterday.

    Mgcw on
  • Kevin CristKevin Crist I make the devil hit his knees and say the 'our father'Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Mgcw wrote: »
    EDIT: They must have sent out a huge wave of beta invites, like 5-6 people I know got one yesterday.


    And I'm not one of them.. :x

    Kevin Crist on
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    Steam: YOU FACE JARAXXUS| Twitch.tv: CainLoveless
  • Wombat02Wombat02 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Mgcw wrote: »
    EDIT: They must have sent out a huge wave of beta invites, like 5-6 people I know got one yesterday.


    And I'm not one of them.. :x

    I second your :x

    Wombat02 on
  • PierceNeckPierceNeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Several people on here, plus about 8 people in my guild, got invites yesterday.


    So, people who got in to the beta....
    Is it supposed to be taking 20 hours to download the client? I started it around 11pm last night and it was at 381mb out of 1.88gb before I left for work this morning.

    PierceNeck on
    steam_sig.png
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    PierceNeck wrote: »
    Several people on here, plus about 8 people in my guild, got invites yesterday.


    So, people who got in to the beta....
    Is it supposed to be taking 20 hours to download the client? I started it around 11pm last night and it was at 381mb out of 1.88gb before I left for work this morning.

    Firewall, blocked ports, etc? Mine was going at like 800kb/s.

    Mgcw on
  • PierceNeckPierceNeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I'm terrible with all that firewall junk. I turned off what I could find easily, but otherwise I have no idea.

    PierceNeck on
    steam_sig.png
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Holy shit, pure ownage:

    http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=9679743852&pageNo=3&sid=2000#42

    That warms the cockles of my heart right there.

    Caedere on
    FWnykYl.jpg
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Holy shit, pure ownage:

    http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=9679743852&pageNo=3&sid=2000#42

    That warms the cockles of my heart right there.

    Oh my god, yes.

    Mgcw on
  • EndEnd Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    Holy shit, pure ownage:

    http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=9679743852&pageNo=3&sid=2000#42

    That warms the cockles of my heart right there.

    That's pure awesome.

    I guess people didn't notice the sticky that said: 1. If you were invited, you can be uninvited. ...which, I mean, that's kinda obvious even without the sticky.

    End on
    I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
    zaleiria-by-lexxy-sig.jpg
  • PierceNeckPierceNeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Can someone copy and paste the awesome? I'm a websense victim.

    PierceNeck on
    steam_sig.png
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    PierceNeck wrote: »
    Can someone copy and paste the awesome? I'm a websense victim.
    Tigole wrote:
    Q u o t e:
    WOTLK Balance - Is a Colossal Failure

    I log on today for the patch and what do I see: Warrior, Shadowpriest and Shaman NERFS.

    Meanwhile Rogues, DeathKnights and Mages are completely broken. (I play Rouge and Mage so no I'm not personally upset, but this is just dumb).

    Even without poisons, on my Rogue I can kill a Shadowpriest within ONE cloak and stunlock. Meanwhile Blizzard is nerfing the mitigation on the Shadowpriest Dispersion. What a good way to balance the game - trying to re-tool the classes that aren't broken, without touching the ones that obviously are.

    Since the community has been so gracious in providing it's feedback. I would really love to hear some feedback from the Blizzard Developers making decisions.

    Have you ever leveled a character to 70 in World of Warcraft?
    Have you ever logged on to the WOTLK BETA Test Realms?


    Blizzard wanted player input for the development process? I would love to see the player input that advocated for Shadowpriest, Warrior and Shaman Nerfs. Because any player that logs on the Beta Realm for just about minutes, that is not completely blind, would have easily told you, that you're doing it wrong.

    WOTLK Balance is a Colossal Failure. The beta has been plagued by moronic development decisions,
    that have completely unbalanced this game, over-complicated this game while reducing the skill level of this game.

    I could write pages, about what is broken, what isn't, what is good and what needs to be fixed. But honestly I'm sick of this. What a waste of time, all the individual player input has been. And one knows it when they see patch notes like these.


    Actually, comparing our accounts, I have multiple 70's more than you do. I also notice that all of my characters are higher level than yours in the Beta.

    Thanks for helping us test out the Beta while you lasted. Beta testing isn't cut out for everyone. It was nice having you.

    Mgcw on
  • PierceNeckPierceNeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    That's awesome.

    PierceNeck on
    steam_sig.png
  • JustinSane07JustinSane07 Really, stupid? Brockton__BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2008
    Wow. That's actually pretty fucking fail.

    The guy offers detailed criticism and they remove his beta invite. What a bunch of cocks.

    JustinSane07 on
  • Wombat02Wombat02 Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Wow. That's actually pretty fucking fail.

    The guy offers detailed criticism (AND ALL KINDS OF BULLSHIT) and they remove his beta invite. What a bunch of cocks.

    Wombat02 on
  • EndEnd Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Wow. That's actually pretty fucking fail.

    The guy offers detailed criticism and they remove his beta invite. What a bunch of cocks.

    Detailed? If he had turned that huge post of whine into the one paragraph of anything useful that he had, it wouldn't have been a problem. Most of his post was whining on how Blizzard doesn't do any testing and clearly has never played a max level character. Clearly.

    End on
    I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
    zaleiria-by-lexxy-sig.jpg
  • RoanthRoanth Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I agree that there is no reason for "end of the world" reactions to beta changes, but priests seriously got sodomized with a broomstick on this last patch. It's not the numbers I am concerned with. It's the fact that many of our new talents are so lackluster in terms of "fun" and "newness" compared to what other classes are getting, especially the Shadowtree. I dare anyone to look me in the eyes and tell me that the 51-point talent, Dispersion, is not a complete piece of shit. It's like the new lolwell.

    What also concerns me is the time pressure that Blizz is under to launch the expansion. Some of the reactions in the beta priest thread were along the lines of "we can always go back and fix things, even after the expansion is released". That is hardly comforting given how long it takes Blizz to fix anything on live.

    Roanth on
  • dojangodojango Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    actually it seemed pretty general criticism, and not particularly useful. As so many posters have said, they're just tweaking stuff, seeing what works and what doesn't. Today's huge nerf to class X and broken class Y is going to be fixed... as long as people say "hey, skill Z is underpowered" as opposed to "OMG SKILL Z IS SO USELESS U ALL SUCK AND I HATE YOU" or whatever. They should really have an etiquette guide to proper feedback.

    dojango on
  • EndEnd Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Roanth wrote: »
    I agree that there is no reason for "end of the world" reactions to beta changes, but priests seriously got sodomized with a broomstick on this last patch. It's not the numbers I am concerned with. It's the fact that many of our new talents are so lackluster in terms of "fun" and "newness" compared to what other classes are getting, especially the Shadowtree. I dare anyone to look me in the eyes and tell me that the 51-point talent, Dispersion, is not a complete piece of shit. It's like the new lolwell.

    There was a lot of sodomy in the last patch. If I had to guess, only some of it will stick, and the bits that do, won't stick as hard as they stick now.
    What also concerns me is the time pressure that Blizz is under to launch the expansion. Some of the reactions in the beta priest thread were along the lines of "we can always go back and fix things, even after the expansion is released". That is hardly comforting given how long it takes Blizz to fix anything on live.

    This is Blizzard we're talking about.

    If they decided it was all shitty, it wouldn't be out of character for them to cancel the game. That's unlikely of course, but they'll delay it if they have to.

    If I have to, I'll go play a different game.

    *shrug*

    End on
    I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
    zaleiria-by-lexxy-sig.jpg
  • SeptusSeptus Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    TheEmerged wrote: »
    No, doing proper beta testing is work IMO. Playing WoW happens to be a lot of fun, but I don't like spending what time I have to play the game "not count". And don't tell me I'm learning stuff in advance, because most of it will be on WoWHead the day after it hits, or changed again.

    If someone else doesn't care about that (and from reading this and other boards, I know I'm in the minority there) more power to them.

    Sure, but "proper" beta testing can vary a lot. At this point in the beta, if I were to get an invite, I wouldn't feel bad at all about just tooling around with a Death Knight for a few levels, getting one level each on my three lvl 70s, and then not playing again except for testing out new talents in each beta push for about 30 minutes. I think that's fun, to test out how new specs will be, and it still provides a fair amount of good input for Blizzard, without going all out and leveling to 77 or 80.
    Caedere wrote: »
    You're just proving my point.

    Of course they're being made useless. That's part of the testing process.

    You make it sound like it's the final state for these abilities - right now, none of these changes should concern people. They make changes, get constructive feedback, datamine the everliving shit out of the new data, and adjust accordingly.

    I see no value whatsoever in changing a talent that is easily seen, without even playing the game, to be completely terrible(at least for pve, and it's reeeeally stretching it for pvp). It wouldn't be a good beta change for Blizzard to suddenly make Titan's Grip give you a -50% damage penalty, for instance.

    Septus on
    PSN: Kurahoshi1
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Septus wrote: »
    TheEmerged wrote: »
    No, doing proper beta testing is work IMO. Playing WoW happens to be a lot of fun, but I don't like spending what time I have to play the game "not count". And don't tell me I'm learning stuff in advance, because most of it will be on WoWHead the day after it hits, or changed again.

    If someone else doesn't care about that (and from reading this and other boards, I know I'm in the minority there) more power to them.

    Sure, but "proper" beta testing can vary a lot. At this point in the beta, if I were to get an invite, I wouldn't feel bad at all about just tooling around with a Death Knight for a few levels, getting one level each on my three lvl 70s, and then not playing again except for testing out new talents in each beta push for about 30 minutes. I think that's fun, to test out how new specs will be, and it still provides a fair amount of good input for Blizzard, without going all out and leveling to 77 or 80.
    Caedere wrote: »
    You're just proving my point.

    Of course they're being made useless. That's part of the testing process.

    You make it sound like it's the final state for these abilities - right now, none of these changes should concern people. They make changes, get constructive feedback, datamine the everliving shit out of the new data, and adjust accordingly.

    I see no value whatsoever in changing a talent that is easily seen, without even playing the game, to be completely terrible(at least for pve, and it's reeeeally stretching it for pvp). It wouldn't be a good beta change for Blizzard to suddenly make Titan's Grip give you a -50% damage penalty, for instance.
    You don't see a value no, but then, there you go - you're not Blizzard. :)

    And it changing Titan's Grip to give -50% damage penalty allowed them to help itemize weapons better or plan other changes, then it would absolutely be a good beta change.

    Remember: The beta is for Blizzard, not for the players. Beta is basically a big sandbox where the devs can toss out ideas and see what happens. It's the best opportunity for them to try out different things. They'll tweak and change and revert and buff and nerf and do whatever in the name of finding what works, even if it doesn't make sense to you.

    Caedere on
    FWnykYl.jpg
  • SeptusSeptus Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Caedere wrote: »
    You don't see a value no, but then, there you go - you're not Blizzard. :)

    And it changing Titan's Grip to give -50% damage penalty allowed them to help itemize weapons better or plan other changes, then it would absolutely be a good beta change.

    Remember: The beta is for Blizzard, not for the players. Beta is basically a big sandbox where the devs can toss out ideas and see what happens. It's the best opportunity for them to try out different things. They'll tweak and change and revert and buff and nerf and do whatever in the name of finding what works, even if it doesn't make sense to you.

    OK, Blizzard could make it a 50% damage penalty, and then increase the dps of all 2handers, and then decrease the damage of all skills that players using two handers would use, and then increase the damage of those abilities when used by one handers. It would be a mess.

    My point is, talents and abilities can be changed in such a way that they would terrible in any, or would require vast amounts of effort elsewhere to make them not terrible. Blizzard devs are also fallible and that's fine, but sometimes they way overtweak something, and those are mistakes.

    Septus on
    PSN: Kurahoshi1
  • CaedereCaedere S'no regrets BIRDIESRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Septus wrote: »
    Caedere wrote: »
    You don't see a value no, but then, there you go - you're not Blizzard. :)

    And it changing Titan's Grip to give -50% damage penalty allowed them to help itemize weapons better or plan other changes, then it would absolutely be a good beta change.

    Remember: The beta is for Blizzard, not for the players. Beta is basically a big sandbox where the devs can toss out ideas and see what happens. It's the best opportunity for them to try out different things. They'll tweak and change and revert and buff and nerf and do whatever in the name of finding what works, even if it doesn't make sense to you.

    OK, Blizzard could make it a 50% damage penalty, and then increase the dps of all 2handers, and then decrease the damage of all skills that players using two handers would use, and then increase the damage of those abilities when used by one handers. It would be a mess.

    My point is, talents and abilities can be changed in such a way that they would terrible in any, or would require vast amounts of effort elsewhere to make them not terrible. Blizzard devs are also fallible and that's fine, but sometimes they way overtweak something, and those are mistakes.


    They are not mistakes when it's still in beta.


    You seem to not understand the core point - NONE OF THIS IS FINAL. By definition, they're "overtweaking" - that's how you get good data. You go to one extreme, and then the other, and then you finetune it a couple variables at a time.

    What I'm saying is very, very simple: Beta is a messy process and if you panic or freak out over any changes then it's stupid, because the dev team will deliberately make ridiculous changes in order to gather data and feedback to help make balanced changes.

    Caedere on
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