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[WoW] Shammy chat!

2456769

Posts

  • TaursaiyanTaursaiyan Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Rorus Raz wrote:
    Healing weapons tend to suck for damage because, damn it, we don't need to create brand new loot fights and nobody focuses their damage on melees with a fancy healing staff or dagger.
    I object, on the fact that The Aurastone Hammer is decent damage and with my build all the intell adds plenty of damage! /flex
    Even more so when you put the 22 Intel enchant on that bad boi

    Taursaiyan on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Int doesn't do jackshit for damage.

    reVerse on
  • TaursaiyanTaursaiyan Registered User
    edited September 2006
    reVerse wrote:
    Int doesn't do jackshit for damage.
    lol... I said, for my build, which is elemental the Aurastone Hammer is a plus healing intel weapon and that intell rocks my socks as an elemental/heal spec shaman! :wink:

    Taursaiyan on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited September 2006
    reVerse wrote:
    Int doesn't do jackshit for damage.
    It makes his shocks crit more often. He's clearly speccing Enhancement to increase his healing and spell damage.

    EDIT: Wow, he's actually serious. That depresses me.

    Sterica on
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  • TaursaiyanTaursaiyan Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Rorus Raz wrote:
    reVerse wrote:
    Int doesn't do jackshit for damage.
    It makes his shocks crit more often. He's clearly speccing Enhancement to increase his healing and spell damage.

    EDIT: Wow, he's actually serious. That depresses me.

    Don't be depressed! Yo, Intel increases the chance to crit, your mana, and damage/heal casts right? :roll:

    Taursaiyan on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Taursaiyan wrote:
    Rorus Raz wrote:
    reVerse wrote:
    Int doesn't do jackshit for damage.
    It makes his shocks crit more often. He's clearly speccing Enhancement to increase his healing and spell damage.

    EDIT: Wow, he's actually serious. That depresses me.

    Don't be depressed! Yo, Intel increases the chance to crit, your mana, and damage/heal casts right? :roll:

    Yeah, that makes perfect sense. To increase your healing and spell casting abilities, the perfect choice is to spec into the melee damage tree instead of the healing or the spell casting trees.

    reVerse on
  • TaursaiyanTaursaiyan Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Yo reverse. The only way a healing or intel weapon won't help you is if your an enhance spec. So if your a elemental or healing spec shaman the aurastone hammer is sweet as hell. If your an Enhancement I really dunno which weapon I would choose. Maybe hand of Rag? :|

    Taursaiyan on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Yo, Taursaiyan. You're not making a whole lot of sense right now.

    reVerse on
  • TaursaiyanTaursaiyan Registered User
    edited September 2006
    reVerse wrote:
    Yo, Taursaiyan. You're not making a whole lot of sense right now.

    ....How am I not making sense? I know your from Finland but it's obvious that Aurastone Hammer is good for ele/heal specs and a high damage 2 hand weapon is good for enhance specs.

    I gotta go. Go ponder!

    Taursaiyan on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    You're not making any sense because first you're talking about dualwielding Aurastone Hammers, then about how +Int enchant is going to increase the damage you do with them, and now you're rambling about something completely different entirely.

    Either that, or you just absolutely suck at quoting.

    reVerse on
  • SlabcakesSlabcakes Registered User
    edited September 2006
    reVerse wrote:
    Oh wow, they sure nerfed the fuck out of it, didn't they? Used to be 10%.
    Wasn't it only for 20 seconds (with a 2 minute cooldown), though? This one seems to be more of a constant bonus. I do wish it had a bit more flavour than Moonkin-on-a-stick.

    Slabcakes on
  • Draw On Holy MightDraw On Holy Might Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Dear Taursaiyan,

    The word is "Shaman".
    "Shammy" sounds like something a small child with a mental defect would say, and I hate everyone who has ever used it seriously. It is not an abbreviation, as the words have the same amount of letters, and it serves no purpose other than making the person who said it look stupid.

    Thank you for your time.


    Also, I am very down on the idea of dual-wielding Shaman. It is not something I would have thought we would ever need, and now all these new Enhancement talents are going to trick all these "ololz Windfury" sons of bitches into thinking they can actually deal respectable melee damage. They still have no melee abilities other than Stormstrike, and that seems to lose a lot of its purpose with dual-wielding. This Unleashed Rage bullshit is going to see a lot of Shaman demanding to be in melee DPS groups and up there in front with them, swinging away happily while Windfury weapon has its 80% chance of doing nothing, claiming "Now we have viability and flexibility in raids!"

    No. No, you don't.

    "But what about Shamanistic Rage?!" Well, that's fantastic, although it suffers from the exact problems that people criticized Stormstrike for having for so long. Why is there a talent in the melee damage tree that restores mana? Mana is not as important if you're running around swinging a big mace (or two smaller maces, if you will) when you're out on your own, and such a concept is laughable in a raid situation where said Shaman is going to be in healing gear and in the back, away from melee because they have no business being up there in the first place.

    I don't like it, but Shaman heal better than they do anything else, because they don't have any of the utility or any of the tools that dedicated classes do. All we get are things that suck up mana or waste time, and while that's well and good running around out in the world or in PvP, it doesn't take fancy abilities or a whole lot of skill to be able to heal reasonably well. And dammit, if I have to do it, everyone else better be doing it, too.

    Fuck. At least the Elemental tree is still awesome. I'm all over that Totem of Wrath.

    Draw On Holy Might on
  • blizzard224blizzard224 Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Dear Taursaiyan,

    The word is "Shaman".
    "Shammy" sounds like something a small child with a mental defect would say, and I hate everyone who has ever used it seriously. It is not an abbreviation, as the words have the same amount of letters, and it serves no purpose other than making the person who said it look stupid.

    Thank you for your time.


    Also, I am very down on the idea of dual-wielding Shaman. It is not something I would have thought we would ever need, and now all these new Enhancement talents are going to trick all these "ololz Windfury" sons of bitches into thinking they can actually deal respectable melee damage. They still have no melee abilities other than Stormstrike, and that seems to lose a lot of its purpose with dual-wielding. This Unleashed Rage bullshit is going to see a lot of Shaman demanding to be in melee DPS groups and up there in front with them, swinging away happily while Windfury weapon has its 80% chance of doing nothing, claiming "Now we have viability and flexibility in raids!"

    No. No, you don't.

    "But what about Shamanistic Rage?!" Well, that's fantastic, although it suffers from the exact problems that people criticized Stormstrike for having for so long. Why is there a talent in the melee damage tree that restores mana? Mana is not as important if you're running around swinging a big mace (or two smaller maces, if you will) when you're out on your own, and such a concept is laughable in a raid situation where said Shaman is going to be in healing gear and in the back, away from melee because they have no business being up there in the first place.

    I don't like it, but Shaman heal better than they do anything else, because they don't have any of the utility or any of the tools that dedicated classes do. All we get are things that suck up mana or waste time, and while that's well and good running around out in the world or in PvP, it doesn't take fancy abilities or a whole lot of skill to be able to heal reasonably well. And dammit, if I have to do it, everyone else better be doing it, too.

    Fuck. At least the Elemental tree is still awesome. I'm all over that Totem of Wrath.

    Oh, you're a grumpy old basterd, aren't you.

    I like that in a poster.

    You'll fit right in at that Druid thread as well; I'm sure Reynolds has something to whine about. :wink:

    blizzard224 on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • GlalGlal Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    So there I was, playing my drood toon with a shammy friend, when a pally pops out of the bush!

    Glal on
  • Liquid GhostLiquid Ghost DO YOU HEAR THE VOICES, TOO?! Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Taursaiyan wrote:
    ....How am I not making sense? I know your from Finland...
    The fact that you honestly think this is an insult is depressing.

    Liquid Ghost on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    The point about Enhancement Shaman isn't for the Shaman himself to be topping the DPS charts, it's for him to be there, with loads of Crit Rating dualwielding two fast onehanders to provide a near constant UR buff to the rest of the party, not to mention the improved totems (Imp Windfury Totem espesially) you get by going into the Enhancement tree.

    So it doesn't matter that their only melee attack ability is the Stormstrike: all a Shaman really needs to do is turn on autoattack and keep those totems up to buff the real DPSers while providing a decent amount of DPS on his own.

    reVerse on
  • exisexis Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Taursaiyan wrote:
    ....How am I not making sense? I know your from Finland...
    The fact that you honestly think this is an insult is depressing.
    I think he was referring to the language barrier.

    Well, I hope he was.

    exis on
  • kevindenoyettekevindenoyette Registered User
    edited September 2006
    As far as the math goes, I've heard (and read) that carrying a raid-enhancement specced shaman ups the melee group DPS by an amount that makes the total group dps higher than the same group with a rogue/fury warrior instead of the shaman. Sounds viable enough to me. I think it's time to cut the raid shamans some slack. I'm looking forward to seeing how a dps-geared, enhancement specced shaman functioning as a dps class (with some heals on his group in between, or something) works out in BC. I'm not expecting miracles, but I hope it's nice for their sake.

    kevindenoyette on
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  • SlabcakesSlabcakes Registered User
    edited September 2006
    exis wrote:
    Taursaiyan wrote:
    ....How am I not making sense? I know your from Finland...
    The fact that you honestly think this is an insult is depressing.
    I think he was referring to the language barrier.

    Well, I hope he was.
    But Reverse's English is better than his!

    Slabcakes on
  • GolemGolem of Sand Saint Joseph, MORegistered User regular
    edited September 2006
    JAEF wrote:
    Sami wrote:
    If both of your weapons are able to be equipped in the main hand slot, doesn't that mean you'll be able to put shammy buffs on each of them? Windfury main + Rockbiter off? Yes please
    My bet is there will be a mechanic preventing that. I just wish the beta would come out so I didn't have to hear a bunch of speculation and could just go ask some lucky douchebag*cough...coughcoughoucoughouocuoguhough...cough* how it worked.

    My bet is that you'll be able to wield whatever weapon enchants on either weapon as you can have multiple enchants on weapons in your inventory at the moment.

    Shamans are very good utility classes, they can heal, they can buff melee or casters hella good.

    Golem on
  • ZzuluZzulu Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    What talent tree should I go with for leveling?

    Zzulu on
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  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Enhancement. Good killing power, little downtime.

    reVerse on
  • GolemGolem of Sand Saint Joseph, MORegistered User regular
    edited September 2006
    I have to say going back and trolling this topic I'm suprised that I actually agree with reVerse on the Enchancement spec.

    They are there to buff the Rogues and Warrior in the Party, not to out DPS them. Shamans are one of the best support classes in the game, imo.
    The Utility of the +AP bonus and +AP and +STR from Totems also helps accelerate the overall DPS of the group.
    Also, I am very down on the idea of dual-wielding Shaman. It is not something I would have thought we would ever need, and now all these new Enhancement talents are going to trick all these "ololz Windfury" sons of bitches into thinking they can actually deal respectable melee damage. They still have no melee abilities other than Stormstrike, and that seems to lose a lot of its purpose with dual-wielding. This Unleashed Rage bullshit is going to see a lot of Shaman demanding to be in melee DPS groups and up there in front with them, swinging away happily while Windfury weapon has its 80% chance of doing nothing, claiming "Now we have viability and flexibility in raids!"
    No. No, you don't.

    It would seem that we do. If I was a shaman and I was enhancement spec with alot of +AP and + STR buffs to give out then It would make sence to be in a Melee group.
    "But what about Shamanistic Rage?!" Well, that's fantastic, although it suffers from the exact problems that people criticized Stormstrike for having for so long. Why is there a talent in the melee damage tree that restores mana? Mana is not as important if you're running around swinging a big mace (or two smaller maces, if you will) when you're out on your own, and such a concept is laughable in a raid situation where said Shaman is going to be in healing gear and in the back, away from melee because they have no business being up there in the first place.

    Hmm. Let me think, If Im buffing, laying down totems, and supporting (read keeping alive) the DPS that I'm in the group with then I'm gunna be using...er..what was that called again...ummm...Mana. And since I can both Melee and get mana back while adding +AP to my party it's a double blessing.
    All we get are things that suck up mana

    Duh. Reference to Shamanistic Rage for the answer to this.

    Golem on
  • porovaaraporovaara Registered User
    edited September 2006
    So my shaman recently hit 60 and is still weilding the AV mace and the blue dragonkin stuff. All I do with him is pvp and he is 32 points into elemental with the rest in restoration. According to the shaman forums with my +62 spell damage I should be a "fucking disgrace" in battlegrounds.

    Why is it in PUGs I am always near the top in total kills, KBs while I still find time to throw out lesser healing waves on people? Does it fade away when running into a set group with good equipment? Yes. But 3 minute elemental shaman are made for AV/WSG.

    I do die a lot more than on my other 60s... a lot more. But damn is it fun running in and going bat shit crazy with totems and chain lightning. Hell I even find healing to be more fun on the shaman because LHW is so fast it feels interactive.

    porovaara on
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  • blizzard224blizzard224 Registered User
    edited September 2006
    porovaara wrote:
    So my shaman recently hit 60 and is still weilding the AV mace and the blue dragonkin stuff. All I do with him is pvp and he is 32 points into elemental with the rest in restoration. According to the shaman forums with my +62 spell damage I should be a "fucking disgrace" in battlegrounds.

    Why is it in PUGs I am always near the top in total kills, KBs while I still find time to throw out lesser healing waves on people? Does it fade away when running into a set group with good equipment? Yes. But 3 minute elemental shaman are made for AV/WSG.

    I do die a lot more than on my other 60s... a lot more. But damn is it fun running in and going bat shit crazy with totems and chain lightning. Hell I even find healing to be more fun on the shaman because LHW is so fast it feels interactive.

    I'm going to go with because half the playerbase dosn't have a rats ass of an idea how to PvP.

    blizzard224 on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    OP: The new Shaman Talents and Spells have been out for like 3 fucking weeks, you are retarded if you have not seen them by now.
    Golem wrote:
    All we get are things that suck up mana

    Duh. Reference to Shamanistic Rage for the answer to this.

    Not to mention Dual Wield + Judgement of Wisdom = No worries. Unless they nerf the proc rate on Judgement of Wisdom, it's probably something like 60 mana/5 depending on weapon speed, and that's even if they don't give a new rank of the spell.

    Mgcw on
  • GolemGolem of Sand Saint Joseph, MORegistered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Magicawe wrote:
    OP: The new Shaman Talents and Spells have been out for like 3 fucking weeks, you are retarded if you have not seen them by now.
    Golem wrote:
    All we get are things that suck up mana

    Duh. Reference to Shamanistic Rage for the answer to this.

    Not to mention Dual Wield + Judgement of Wisdom = No worries. Unless they nerf the proc rate on Judgement of Wisdom, it's probably something like 60 mana/5 depending on weapon speed, and that's even if they don't give a new rank of the spell.

    Yep.

    Saying that shamans have no business specing Enchancement is short sighted.

    Golem on
  • porovaaraporovaara Registered User
    edited September 2006
    So... spec into EM, but also get that nice melee crit talent on spell crit... and then melee crit which ups spell crit?

    Pop EM. Get melee crit within 6 seconds pop bad ass shock? Burstburst LOL?

    edit: obviously i am high and/or tired because i dont see the second talent that i was sure existed.

    porovaara on
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  • Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Magicawe wrote:
    OP: The new Shaman Talents and Spells have been out for like 3 fucking weeks, you are retarded if you have not seen them by now.
    He's on deployment in the middle of the fucking desert, browsing through a military-controlled network that evidently blocks worldofwarcraft.com. Think you might be going just a little bit hard on the guy.

    Salvation122 on
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Magicawe wrote:
    OP: The new Shaman Talents and Spells have been out for like 3 fucking weeks, you are retarded if you have not seen them by now.
    He's on deployment in the middle of the fucking desert, browsing through a military-controlled network that evidently blocks worldofwarcraft.com. Think you might be going just a little bit hard on the guy.

    Ouch, woops. I didn't read past like his third post :oops:

    *shoots self in foot*

    Mgcw on
  • khainkhain Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    As far as the math goes, I've heard (and read) that carrying a raid-enhancement specced shaman ups the melee group DPS by an amount that makes the total group dps higher than the same group with a rogue/fury warrior instead of the shaman. Sounds viable enough to me. I think it's time to cut the raid shamans some slack. I'm looking forward to seeing how a dps-geared, enhancement specced shaman functioning as a dps class (with some heals on his group in between, or something) works out in BC. I'm not expecting miracles, but I hope it's nice for their sake.

    I predict that pretty much the exact same thign that happens now will happen in the expansion. You'll put 1 shaman in the MT group and 1 shaman in the healer group and if you happen to take 3 then you'll put 1 more into your second dps group. Whether or not they heal I think will be based on the fight and I hope blizzard designs the instances so on say the first boss you need all your shamans healing and then the next you they can dps as priests can cover the healing and then say o nteh next on your shamans are back to healing becuase pallies need to tank or something. Of course druids get the shaft as always and are stuck healing. :wink:

    khain on
  • Draw On Holy MightDraw On Holy Might Registered User
    edited September 2006
    I think what a lot of you dual-wield proponents seem to think that the encounters in Burning Crusade will actuall allow for hybrid classes to do something other than heal and still contribute to the raid just as much. I'm not saying that it will necessarily be like that, but you have to keep in mind that this is the game where, up until this point, everyone who can heal does (with the exception of maybe a feral Druid and a shadow Priest, but those classes are actually good at what they do). There is a lot of talk of "ololz versatility in raids," but I don't see it ever happening.

    People will do what they can to maintain the status quo, which means that, if there's a chance an encounter can be beaten without chaning too much how things work and what the classes are doing now, then that's what will happen. Maybe the better guilds will allow for a few classes to try something new, but who knows how that will actually turn out, and I expect the community at large to keep with the same "if you can heal, fucking do it" mentality that has brought about the completion of all raid content thus far. I want nothing more than for hybrid classes to actually have the option to do something other than heal, because of some fantasy that they can become just as good as the other classes at fulfilling these different roles, but it isn't going to fucking happen.

    Also, my "suck up mana" comment was made towards Shaman ranged DPS. Things like Lightning Bolt and Chain Lightning. Notice that I said "dedicated classes" and not dedicated melee classes, as my point was about Shaman specialization in general. I was trying to point out that Shaman have no tools available that other classes get: things like mana regeneration or threat reduction. Things that matter in those given roles. They baiscally have one thing they can do, and that's cast spells until out of mana or sit there and auto-attack. Ranged DPS is out of the picture for this reason, and I suppose we'll see how well dual-wielding holds up.

    However, saying that Shamanistic Rage is good because dropping totems and healing wastes mana is bullshit- Totems are dirt cheap, and you only drop two at a time, maybe three if there's resistance needed. And healing the group? Give me a fucking break. If this supposed dual-wield Shaman is as loaded up on +crit and AP gear as everyone is assuming, they are going to have a small mana pool and are going to heal for shit. Feral Druids can get away with this, because all they have to do is heal themselves. But don't expect a decked out Enhancement Shaman in a melee DPS group to actually be able to keep them all alive. Shamanistic Rage is on a cooldown, Mana Spring doesn't do shit, though Blessing of Wisdom might help.

    Yeah, that +30 mana/5 seconds will go well with all of that other mana regen that the Shaman has on all of his +crit and AP gear. Please.

    So, the Shaman will be spending all of his time on auto-attack, supposedly healing his group, and trying to regain what little mana he can. In a dire situation, there's no way you can gain back enough mana to make a difference. That's what mana potions are for, I know, but if you're just going to pop poitions when you need it, then what's the point?

    I'm not saying Shaman have no business speccing Enhancement. That's stupid, and I never said that at all. I'm just saying that, in a raid situation, unless Blizzard somehow magically doesn't fuck up and is able to make every single encounter in the expansion wonderful and special that Shaman are able to not heal for a change, then we will be healing.

    Draw On Holy Might on
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Yeah, that +30 mana/5 seconds will go well with all of that other mana regen that the Shaman has on all of his +crit and AP gear. Please.

    Actually it's 39-40 mana/5 with the current rank and Improved talent. Also, I wasn't talking about BLESSING of wisdom I was talking about JUDGEMENT of Wisdom, which is a chance to return 59 mana on melee/ranged hit. While dual wielding, this equates to AT LEAST 60 mana/5 at the current rank. Understand now? On my Paladin I can regen 5% of my mana every melee swing. Granted I have Seal of Wisdom as well which gives me a chance for 90 mana per swing, but I don't dual wield either and the seal is proc per minute not proc per swing like the judgement.

    Mgcw on
  • simsim Registered User
    edited September 2006
    I think what a lot of you dual-wield proponents seem to think that the encounters in Burning Crusade will actuall allow for hybrid classes to do something other than heal and still contribute to the raid just as much.

    CM's did say that this was development's goal for BC encounters...

    sim on
  • SaerisSaeris Borb Enthusiast flapflapflapflapRegistered User regular
    edited September 2006
    Quite consistently for Blizzard, goal and product are two entirely different things.

    Saeris on
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  • JohnHamJohnHam Registered User regular
    edited September 2006
    I think it would be interesting if some damage meter could sort out people's additional damage as a result of the Shaman's presence, and lump in in as additional Shaman damage.

    That would be a huge pain in the ass

    JohnHam on
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  • SaerisSaeris Borb Enthusiast flapflapflapflapRegistered User regular
    edited September 2006
    JohnHam wrote:
    I think it would be interesting if some damage meter could sort out people's additional damage as a result of the Shaman's presence, and lump in in as additional Shaman damage.

    That would be a huge pain in the ass

    That's possible to code, and I think some of them already support it with Power Infusion. Not terribly hard, really.

    Saeris on
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  • simsim Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Saeris wrote:
    Quite consistently for Blizzard, goal and product are two entirely different things.

    Oh, I don't disagree there.

    In some bizaro universe there's an MMO where hybrids complain that they do too much DPS and not enough healing, and healing classes are notoriously turned down for groups because they need a to fill a dps slot.

    sim on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited September 2006
    The purpose of the 41 pointer in Enhancement is so the shaman can regenerate mana.

    Now, why would he want to do that?

    Oh yeah, to heal and cast totems.

    Imagine, a talent that always the shaman to do two things at once. It's like they are HYBRIDS or something.

    Sterica on
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  • Draw On Holy MightDraw On Holy Might Registered User
    edited September 2006
    Rorus Raz wrote:
    The purpose of the 41 pointer in Enhancement is so the shaman can regenerate mana.

    A chance to regenerate mana. For 20 seconds. Every 2 minutes.

    It's like its USELESS or something.


    Also, re: Judgement of Wisdom.
    Forgot about the judgement, honestly. That might make up for it. The point still stands, however, that a Shaman in Enhancement gear is still going to be a shitty healer. They could always just wear their healing gear and dual wield to regain mana, but if that's the case, they should have a large enough mana pool and perhaps enough mana/5 to not even need to worry about the judgement at all. It's kind of a vicious circle.

    And by vicious, I mean pointless.

    Draw On Holy Might on
This discussion has been closed.