I my 3% crit. With the metric fuckton of mana I have with the arcane build, I'm not running out unless there's massive AoE involved.
I just try and guage my mana pool (in it's entirety) against the mobs health, and when the numbers look right, arcaneblastarcaneblast oh el oh el. Have I mention I love Murmur? My favorite no- aggro punching bag.
My usual casting rotation is fireblast-> AB->AB->AB->Frotbolt->repeat. I sometimes break it to AM on Clearcasts. If PoM is up, AP & Trinkets are usually up, so I replace a fireblast with a frostbolt o' doom.
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Basically you start with 4 mobs standing behind the curtain and each activates a few seconds after the other. That was fine the first attempt. After that, it would rotate between some of the mobs not being there with others just not working. We finally just got locked in the opera house.
I my 3% crit. With the metric fuckton of mana I have with the arcane build, I'm not running out unless there's massive AoE involved.
I just try and guage my mana pool (in it's entirety) against the mobs health, and when the numbers look right, arcaneblastarcaneblast oh el oh el. Have I mention I love Murmur? My favorite no- aggro punching bag.
My usual casting rotation is fireblast-> AB->AB->AB->Frotbolt->repeat. I sometimes break it to AM on Clearcasts. If PoM is up, AP & Trinkets are usually up, so I replace a fireblast with a frostbolt o' doom.
Molten Armor really pisses me off as a Fire spec. Impact procs are great. Ignite procs are not so great - effectively, it means that 30+% of all incoming attacks will proc a weak DoT that makes the target un-polymorphable. Not cool. I generally used it anyway but I was pretty peeved when it wiped my instance group when poly broke and I couldn't re-apply it.
The Oz event is where the frost mage truly shines, unless it's your first time and you decide that frostbolt is a better choice against Tinman than spamming ice lance to stack the debuff. Then he closes on you and is all like, IF I ONLY HAD A HEART. MAYBE I WILL TAKE YOURS. LOLCLEAVE.
Uhh yeah, I've done this fight before, I have put detect magic on Tin Man, and I have spammed over a dozen Ice Lances. There is some other mechanic at work than just one debuff per Frost Attack.
I don't know if it's damage related as well, or you need more than once Ice Lance per debuff, but I hit Tin Man with 10+ Ice Lances and it came out to 2-3 debuffs.
On a later attempt I cast detect magic on him, and watched him get kited by a warrior, and the debuffs were stacking on him anyway, with nobody touching.
I think that the Frost Damage = Rust thing is a myth, there's no officially documented text that says this is the case, and the fact that I watched him stack it on himself without being attacked would suggest that it just comes over time...
I would argue that any mage in the party would be better off keeping the strawman stunned with Scorch, and a warlock keep the Tin Man feared (usually this would be the opposite, the Tin man would be kited and the Strawman would be feared).
Scorch on Strawman is gauranteed to nuetralize him indefinately, and over the course of the fight, a mage can basically bring him below 30% until the rest of the part is free.
It seems to be clear that unless you have Slow then kiting the Tin Man is somewhat unreliable in the opening minutes of the fight if you can't spare an additional tank to hold him in the interum. Since Ice Lance doesn't work very well, if at all, and max rank Frostbolt would generate too much threat for the warrior to effectively kite him.
Are you sure you can fear Tinman? I thought what you wrote made sense until I realized that each guy supposedly has a set weakness - Roar's being fear (makes sense, cowardly lion), Tinman being rust, and Scarecrow being fire.
I my 3% crit. With the metric fuckton of mana I have with the arcane build, I'm not running out unless there's massive AoE involved.
I just try and guage my mana pool (in it's entirety) against the mobs health, and when the numbers look right, arcaneblastarcaneblast oh el oh el. Have I mention I love Murmur? My favorite no- aggro punching bag.
My usual casting rotation is fireblast-> AB->AB->AB->Frotbolt->repeat. I sometimes break it to AM on Clearcasts. If PoM is up, AP & Trinkets are usually up, so I replace a fireblast with a frostbolt o' doom.
Molten Armor really pisses me off as a Fire spec. Impact procs are great. Ignite procs are not so great - effectively, it means that 30+% of all incoming attacks will proc a weak DoT that makes the target un-polymorphable. Not cool. I generally used it anyway but I was pretty peeved when it wiped my instance group when poly broke and I couldn't re-apply it.
Yeah, you gotta be careful with it. No Molten Armor when sheeping.
I use it on boss fights where mana is no issue (which is most of them these days) and on trash where I'm not CC'ing.
I don't even have Ignite anymore, and I've still seen it break sheep. Some wierd mob- hit timing thing.
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Yeah, it sucks hardcore when it hits you at the same time your spell goes off, and the mob unsheeps itself. And then it kills you. And the rest of your party.
You guys are serious? DON'T LET THE MOB GET TO YOU! It's simple. I never had a problem with molten armor breaking sheep in instances because shit doesn't hit me
Cause ya know, Polymorph never breaks early, and the mob never comes charging towards me, and sometimes I can't get Poly off before it gets to me/ can't nova because there's another CC'd mob in the area (or it's on cooldown).
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I've had problems with this, actually, in Kharazan. Our hunter was kiting around a spectral horse using freezing trap (Attumen's Trash). While it was running at him one time, it did its AOE vitality drain and hit me with it-- thus procin' Molten Armor. The proc crit, igniting the horse just as it hit the hunter's Freezing trap, ruining the CC and dooming the hunter to a grisly hoofed demise. When our MT learned of what happened, he just laughed and said that it had to be the most unforunate and random set of occurances ever.
I really love me molten armor, even without Impact. I've scored over 2 rogue kills offa the reflect damage alone.
Cause ya know, Polymorph never breaks early, and the mob never comes charging towards me, and sometimes I can't get Poly off before it gets to me/ can't nova because there's another CC'd mob in the area (or it's on cooldown).
Re-cast Polymorph before it breaks. Don't wait 30 seconds to cast it again, simple.
I've had problems with this, actually, in Kharazan. Our hunter was kiting around a spectral horse using freezing trap (Attumen's Trash). While it was running at him one time, it did its AOE vitality drain and hit me with it-- thus procin' Molten Armor. The proc crit, igniting the horse just as it hit the hunter's Freezing trap, ruining the CC and dooming the hunter to a grisly hoofed demise. When our MT learned of what happened, he just laughed and said that it had to be the most unforunate and random set of occurances ever.
I really love me molten armor, even without Impact. I've scored over 2 rogue kills offa the reflect damage alone.
Sometimes someone else hits the polymorphed animal, then what do you do? Do you realize instantly and get off a 1.5 second cast before the mob gets to you every time?
Yeah, didn't think so. If you play a mage, you should know that shit happens sometimes, and you do get hit. If you don't get hit ever, perhaps you are the new god of magedom.
Sometimes someone else hits the polymorphed animal, then what do you do? Do you realize instantly and get off a 1.5 second cast before the mob gets to you every time?
Yeah, didn't think so. If you play a mage, you should know that shit happens sometimes, and you do get hit. If you don't get hit ever, perhaps you are the new god of magedom.
I never played with people retarded enough to break a sheep, and if they did hit it that means the aggro is on them and not me and then it's a simple matter of casting it until it sticks.
Re-cast Polymorph before it breaks. Don't wait 30 seconds to cast it again, simple.
Sometimes it breaks after 3 seconds. Sometimes it doesn't.
The whole point is that shit happens, and when it does, it's better that a small thing doesn't turn into a big deal.
Do you absolutely, unequivically need to NOT use Molten Armor when CC'ing? Nope. Does it lower any risk involved? Yep.
Mostly, I run where our CC is Sap- Sheep- MC, so that + no ignite means that I'm realatively safe using Molten Armor. It's a different story when there are other sheep/ freezing traps involved though.
edit: And I'm glad you also have a good group. But not everyone does. Sometiems you get a multi-shot happy hunter, or a sheep gets spanked. And that doesn't mean that the spanker gets the aggro, a healer can easily pull it off of them /dipshit hunter lolfeigns and it shoots off towards the healer. Then it's my problem again.
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Sometimes someone else hits the polymorphed animal, then what do you do? Do you realize instantly and get off a 1.5 second cast before the mob gets to you every time?
Yeah, didn't think so. If you play a mage, you should know that shit happens sometimes, and you do get hit. If you don't get hit ever, perhaps you are the new god of magedom.
I never played with people retarded enough to break a sheep, and if they did hit it that means the aggro is on them and not me and then it's a simple matter of casting it until it sticks.
...where to start
Not all sheep breakers are retards, sometimes improper tabbing can cause a swing on an unintended target, my rogue has done that a few times.
Aggro also doesn't always go to the person who broke the sheep Polymorph causes some amount of threat therefor if the person who broke sheep did it with a low aggro ability the mob would go after the mage (think DOT).
I think I shall use this situation to promote slow, because I love it.
If your sheep breaks and the mob is comin' and you can't use frost nova, instant-cast slow (Which can be cast 360, so you can run away while slowing!) can give you plenty of time to deal with the mob. If you're sheepin' its probably trash and if its trash, mana isn't really a concern.
Is slow worth a 41 point? I dunno. But I do love it.
the only time i've ever had problems with molten armor in an instance is when i'm getting too many crits and I start to steal aggro. It actually happens frequently (I'm almmost full fire and have +29% crit chance with fire spells when I use molten armor)
The only time I have problem with molten armor breaking sheep is when i'm solo grinding and I have multiple pulls, and the are all upons me and Murphy's Law takes place.
No problems in instances though.
What do you guys think of the viability of a PoM/Pyroblast/Iceblock(Frostbite+Shatter) talent build? Obviously the usual cookie cutter builds will be "better" (moreDPSlololo11), but this seems like you can get a nice PoM+Pyroblast on a frozen target every 3 minutes + a nice Ice Lance. The oh-the-shit-has-hit-the-fan skill (Ice Block) is available as well.
I'm thinking it has some viability as nice solo build, and not so much when it comes to raiding/group PvP. But come on! +~53% crit to Pyroblast? Yes, please!
What do you guys think of the viability of a PoM/Pyroblast/Iceblock(Frostbite+Shatter) talent build? Obviously the usual cookie cutter builds will be "better" (moreDPSlololo11), but this seems like you can get a nice PoM+Pyroblast on a frozen target every 3 minutes + a nice Ice Lance. The oh-the-shit-has-hit-the-fan skill (Ice Block) is available as well.
I'm thinking it has some viability as nice solo build, and not so much when it comes to raiding/group PvP. But come on! +~53% crit to Pyroblast? Yes, please!
You gain 20% spell coefficient over Frostbolt and about 400 damage. Assuming you were 40 Arc you end up losing Mind Mastery, Spell Power, and AP. The mind mastery most likley counters the 20% spell coefficient, and the AP will overwhelm the 400 damage and your then losing 50% more damage on a crit. In my opinion definitely not worth it.
Have you tried 21/40 fire/frost, though? A lot of people really like shatter/blastwave with various impact and ignite procs. Plus you get all the nifty frost tree things, minus the frost elemental (which I, personally, find lackluster).
I think I shall use this situation to promote slow, because I love it.
If your sheep breaks and the mob is comin' and you can't use frost nova, instant-cast slow (Which can be cast 360, so you can run away while slowing!) can give you plenty of time to deal with the mob. If you're sheepin' its probably trash and if its trash, mana isn't really a concern.
Is slow worth a 41 point? I dunno. But I do love it.
Slow is god of heroic dungeons, that is all.
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I think I shall use this situation to promote slow, because I love it.
If your sheep breaks and the mob is comin' and you can't use frost nova, instant-cast slow (Which can be cast 360, so you can run away while slowing!) can give you plenty of time to deal with the mob. If you're sheepin' its probably trash and if its trash, mana isn't really a concern.
Is slow worth a 41 point? I dunno. But I do love it.
Spellsteal is god of heroic dungeons, that is all.
Slow has easily become my favorite spell in my arsenal, "Oh shit, Counterspell is on cooldown, SLOW!". I also love casting it on enemy healers in PvP so they can watch theor tank die while they slow heal.
I really enjoyed it when I had it, but I was doing alot of PvP at the time. I'd like to hear how useful it is in 5 mans and whatnot.
In the battle of Slow vs Iceblock, Iceblock has won out for the time being. I might consider switching though, as using Arcane Blast as my primary nuke = very little aggro.
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Slow sounds like a lot of fun, but 2/0/59 is my baby, and always will be. Too many fun talents in Frost - I'm probably going to take the resist points out of arcane and put them into the melee / spell damage avoidance.
Yeah, I've yet to find a good use for frost warding. I mean if I had the points to, I would take it, but there are too many other good talents in the tree to lose
Frost is one of the very few talent trees in the game that works quite well super-specialized. The main reason being that almost all of its talents are good for something, and the early Arcane talents are not so hot. 61 points is overkill though, you should at least take the 2 points to reduce your Polymorph resists.
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I just try and guage my mana pool (in it's entirety) against the mobs health, and when the numbers look right, arcaneblastarcaneblast oh el oh el. Have I mention I love Murmur? My favorite no- aggro punching bag.
My usual casting rotation is fireblast-> AB->AB->AB->Frotbolt->repeat. I sometimes break it to AM on Clearcasts. If PoM is up, AP & Trinkets are usually up, so I replace a fireblast with a frostbolt o' doom.
We did get to AOE pull the Gallery.
Edit: LOL FIRE MAGES
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Echo the mod bastard says: 1.1 megabytes of GIF inline? Get outta here.
Molten Armor really pisses me off as a Fire spec. Impact procs are great. Ignite procs are not so great - effectively, it means that 30+% of all incoming attacks will proc a weak DoT that makes the target un-polymorphable. Not cool. I generally used it anyway but I was pretty peeved when it wiped my instance group when poly broke and I couldn't re-apply it.
Uhh yeah, I've done this fight before, I have put detect magic on Tin Man, and I have spammed over a dozen Ice Lances. There is some other mechanic at work than just one debuff per Frost Attack.
I don't know if it's damage related as well, or you need more than once Ice Lance per debuff, but I hit Tin Man with 10+ Ice Lances and it came out to 2-3 debuffs.
On a later attempt I cast detect magic on him, and watched him get kited by a warrior, and the debuffs were stacking on him anyway, with nobody touching.
I think that the Frost Damage = Rust thing is a myth, there's no officially documented text that says this is the case, and the fact that I watched him stack it on himself without being attacked would suggest that it just comes over time...
Scorch on Strawman is gauranteed to nuetralize him indefinately, and over the course of the fight, a mage can basically bring him below 30% until the rest of the part is free.
It seems to be clear that unless you have Slow then kiting the Tin Man is somewhat unreliable in the opening minutes of the fight if you can't spare an additional tank to hold him in the interum. Since Ice Lance doesn't work very well, if at all, and max rank Frostbolt would generate too much threat for the warrior to effectively kite him.
Yeah, you gotta be careful with it. No Molten Armor when sheeping.
I use it on boss fights where mana is no issue (which is most of them these days) and on trash where I'm not CC'ing.
I don't even have Ignite anymore, and I've still seen it break sheep. Some wierd mob- hit timing thing.
Cause ya know, Polymorph never breaks early, and the mob never comes charging towards me, and sometimes I can't get Poly off before it gets to me/ can't nova because there's another CC'd mob in the area (or it's on cooldown).
I really love me molten armor, even without Impact. I've scored over 2 rogue kills offa the reflect damage alone.
Re-cast Polymorph before it breaks. Don't wait 30 seconds to cast it again, simple.
Now THAT'S unlucky.
Yeah, didn't think so. If you play a mage, you should know that shit happens sometimes, and you do get hit. If you don't get hit ever, perhaps you are the new god of magedom.
I never played with people retarded enough to break a sheep, and if they did hit it that means the aggro is on them and not me and then it's a simple matter of casting it until it sticks.
Sometimes it breaks after 3 seconds. Sometimes it doesn't.
The whole point is that shit happens, and when it does, it's better that a small thing doesn't turn into a big deal.
Do you absolutely, unequivically need to NOT use Molten Armor when CC'ing? Nope. Does it lower any risk involved? Yep.
Mostly, I run where our CC is Sap- Sheep- MC, so that + no ignite means that I'm realatively safe using Molten Armor. It's a different story when there are other sheep/ freezing traps involved though.
edit: And I'm glad you also have a good group. But not everyone does. Sometiems you get a multi-shot happy hunter, or a sheep gets spanked. And that doesn't mean that the spanker gets the aggro, a healer can easily pull it off of them /dipshit hunter lolfeigns and it shoots off towards the healer. Then it's my problem again.
...where to start
Not all sheep breakers are retards, sometimes improper tabbing can cause a swing on an unintended target, my rogue has done that a few times.
Aggro also doesn't always go to the person who broke the sheep Polymorph causes some amount of threat therefor if the person who broke sheep did it with a low aggro ability the mob would go after the mage (think DOT).
Bing 60 Warrior
Wymond 40 Rogue
If your sheep breaks and the mob is comin' and you can't use frost nova, instant-cast slow (Which can be cast 360, so you can run away while slowing!) can give you plenty of time to deal with the mob. If you're sheepin' its probably trash and if its trash, mana isn't really a concern.
Is slow worth a 41 point? I dunno. But I do love it.
The only time I have problem with molten armor breaking sheep is when i'm solo grinding and I have multiple pulls, and the are all upons me and Murphy's Law takes place.
No problems in instances though.
I'm thinking it has some viability as nice solo build, and not so much when it comes to raiding/group PvP. But come on! +~53% crit to Pyroblast? Yes, please!
You gain 20% spell coefficient over Frostbolt and about 400 damage. Assuming you were 40 Arc you end up losing Mind Mastery, Spell Power, and AP. The mind mastery most likley counters the 20% spell coefficient, and the AP will overwhelm the 400 damage and your then losing 50% more damage on a crit. In my opinion definitely not worth it.
Have you tried 21/40 fire/frost, though? A lot of people really like shatter/blastwave with various impact and ignite procs. Plus you get all the nifty frost tree things, minus the frost elemental (which I, personally, find lackluster).
Slow is god of heroic dungeons, that is all.
I really enjoyed it when I had it, but I was doing alot of PvP at the time. I'd like to hear how useful it is in 5 mans and whatnot.
In the battle of Slow vs Iceblock, Iceblock has won out for the time being. I might consider switching though, as using Arcane Blast as my primary nuke = very little aggro.
I still think Ice Block is better if you are spec'd frost, but I could see arguments for slow being better in a Arcane/Fire build.
Frost is a funky tree - there's really nothing bad in it - well, Frost Warding is rarely used, but that doesn't make it bad.
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