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Sarah Palin: She could have been your freaking VP

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    nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    shes also be much worse than Ted at getting free shit for Alaska

    nexuscrawler on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    For me, once I saw the interview where she refused to condemn abortion clinic bombers the election was over.

    No shit. This is like, the definition of terrorism. The use of violence to instill fear so as to influence or coerce policy towards a political or ideological end.

    When abortion clinic bombers and their supporters are a demographic that your candidate is afraid of offending or alienating, you are voting for the wrong motherfucking person.

    They can't be terrorists. They vote GOP tickets.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Not actually a mod. Roaming the streets, waving his gun around.Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    edited November 2008
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    A) There was no TV at 1929.

    B) Roosevelt was not president yet.

    The reason Biden gets a pass is because he has demonstrated that he is an extremely smart person who sometimes gets things mixed up or says something dumb. Palin is just like Biden only without the being-smart bit.

    ElJeffe on
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    DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    Um. It was a gaffe because when the stock market crashed, Hoover was president, and the television didn't exist yet.

    Daedalus on
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    necroSYSnecroSYS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2008
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    It was dumb because Roosevelt gave a radio address, not a televised one. Surprised you don't remember this brouhaha when it happened.

    necroSYS on
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    OmegasquashOmegasquash Boston, MARegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2008
    For me, once I saw the interview where she refused to condemn abortion clinic bombers the election was over.

    That's something that I hadn't heard about at all, and I kept a pretty close eye on the election. Be that as it may, just...wow.

    How can someone run for office that refuses to condone what are (in some cases) killers. It's mind boggling. But tasty enough to make me want to rub my family's face in it. Could you link that?

    I can't unfortunately. I saw it on Fox as it happened. It was on the "Obama is buddies with terrorists row" and the interviewer said "Would you similarly condemn for instance, the bombers of abortion clinics as terrorists?" and she sat and ummed and ahed and brought the subject back to obama and the question was asked again I think three times while Mccain stared at her and looked five seconds away from saying "OF COURSE YOU CONDEMN IT YOU STUPID BITCH JUST SAY IT NO ONE CARES IF YOU FUCKING BELIEVE IT JUST FUCKING SAY IT THIS IS POLITICS"

    No problem. I'll do some digging and try to find it.

    Omegasquash on
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    DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    Daedalus on
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited November 2008
    David_T wrote: »
    mcdermott wrote: »
    EDIT: This is why, for instance, I dismiss the "olol Africa's a country" thing. May be true, but seems more like petty backbiting to me. But staggering lack of understanding of civics and geography? Man, we already knew that, right from her own mouth.

    I could easily see the "Africa is a country" thing coming from the slightly more plausible "South Africa is a continent" mixup they've also talked about her making.

    Really, it's something out of a Karl Marx Brothers movie. "Well, South America is a continent, so South Africa is as well." "No, South Africa is a country." "Africa is a country?" "No, South Africa is a country, Africa is a continent, your running mate is incontinent." "Thassa right, boss." *honk*

    Although my bewilderment at someone like Palin getting close to VP is somewhat nullified by remembering that our own Minister of Culture said that his favorite opera was Phantom Of The. And then he got promoted...
    What the fuck?

    Fencingsax on
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    DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    David_T wrote: »
    mcdermott wrote: »
    EDIT: This is why, for instance, I dismiss the "olol Africa's a country" thing. May be true, but seems more like petty backbiting to me. But staggering lack of understanding of civics and geography? Man, we already knew that, right from her own mouth.

    I could easily see the "Africa is a country" thing coming from the slightly more plausible "South Africa is a continent" mixup they've also talked about her making.

    Really, it's something out of a Karl Marx Brothers movie. "Well, South America is a continent, so South Africa is as well." "No, South Africa is a country." "Africa is a country?" "No, South Africa is a country, Africa is a continent, your running mate is incontinent." "Thassa right, boss." *honk*

    Although my bewilderment at someone like Palin getting close to VP is somewhat nullified by remembering that our own Minister of Culture said that his favorite opera was Phantom Of The. And then he got promoted...
    What the fuck?

    You know, the Marx brothers. Groucho, Chico, Zeppo, Harpo, and Karl. :P

    Daedalus on
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    GoodOmensGoodOmens Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    psychotix wrote: »

    Yes. But Palin is one of the Christians who believe we are currently living in the end of times and should be actively trying to trigger the rapture.

    Which never really made much sense to me. This is is freaking God we're talking about. If he wants to get his Rapture on, I don't really think us non-omnipotent meatbags can help or hinder much.

    GoodOmens on
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    OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    A) There was no TV at 1929.

    B) Roosevelt was not president yet.

    The reason Biden gets a pass is because he has demonstrated that he is an extremely smart person who sometimes gets things mixed up or says something dumb. Palin is just like Biden only without the being-smart bit.
    It doesn't hurt that the people who are typically trying to make a big deal out of Biden's screw ups (and there are plenty) have earned a reputation for making mountains out of molehills. Their ginned up controversies and such have led to the press ignoring or writing off the stuff that they say in regard to their opponents or anything at all, really. It certainly didn't help that the Republican had a one-woman gaff spectacular running on their side since the RNC.

    OptimusZed on
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    BamaBama Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Karl was the funny one.

    Bama on
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    LoxxLoxx Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    No, it's actually a nice party trick to ask someone, particularly someone who ought to know, to name all 50. Unless you've specifically practiced recalling all 50 from memory, at the very least it takes a long time to do it. Wisconsin is a good one... after you've got Michigan and Minnesota you tend to think you've already said Wisconsin.

    Yeah, in order to have any chance I have to mentally picture a map and start working from the Washington, then down and over in pseudo-columns. I'm usually alright until I get past the Mississippi, after which I'm bound to forget one.

    But given a map and the ability to check them off, it's easy. Like, retardedly so.

    Naming 50 of anything isn't exactly going to be easy.


    This is from a couple pages back, but you never had to memorize this in elementary school? (The list of the states starts at 0:53) ;-)


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivpUBvOeD1s

    Loxx on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    A) There was no TV at 1929.

    B) Roosevelt was not president yet.

    The reason Biden gets a pass is because he has demonstrated that he is an extremely smart person who sometimes gets things mixed up or says something dumb. Palin is just like Biden only without the being-smart bit.

    So he fucked up some memorization? Okay, I can see where in the business school he would fail the exam for that despite handling the concepts fine.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    TofystedethTofystedeth Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    No, it's actually a nice party trick to ask someone, particularly someone who ought to know, to name all 50. Unless you've specifically practiced recalling all 50 from memory, at the very least it takes a long time to do it. Wisconsin is a good one... after you've got Michigan and Minnesota you tend to think you've already said Wisconsin.
    Yeah, in order to have any chance I have to mentally picture a map and start working from the Washington, then down and over in pseudo-columns. I'm usually alright until I get past the Mississippi, after which I'm bound to forget one.

    But given a map and the ability to check them off, it's easy. Like, retardedly so.

    Naming 50 of anything isn't exactly going to be easy.


    Of course, I can also name most of the countries and capitals (as well as place them on a map) of Europe as well...I only have issues with the ones that have emerged since I took geography (which was over fifteen years ago). I can name most of the countries in Asia, most in South America, and maybe half of Africa. And I consider myself inadequate because I can't do better. Even though I would probably devastate Palin on a head-to-head test. Even if she had time to prepare.


    There's a song I learned in like, 2nd grade to help remember the states. It does them in alphabetic order. Unfortunately I can't get much past kansas because the notes and rhythm become really repetitive making it less effective a mnemonic.

    In 5th grade we spent about 2 months learning states/countries capitals doing a continent at a time. That was the first test I ever cheated on :(. I was doing great but couldn't remember the capital of Lesotho or some obscure country like that.

    EDIT: Loxx's song is not the one I'm thinking of.

    Tofystedeth on
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    GoodOmensGoodOmens Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    GoodOmens on
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    nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    TV wasn't invented at the time

    of course it was a slip amongst dozen of interviews

    she fucked up the single ones she did

    nexuscrawler on
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Yar wrote: »
    "When the stock market crashed, Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed," Biden told Couric. "He said, 'Look, here's what happened.'"

    Be honest. If Palin had said that stream of nonsense you guys would have been raging about it.

    I'm failing to see how that's a dumb thing to say unless Roosevelt really did only talk about princes of greed at that point. Either way why wouldn't talking about what happened be a good thing? And how is it comparable to refusing to condemn people who vote on healthcare issues with pipe-bombs?

    TV wasn't invented at the time

    of course it was a slip amongst dozen of interviews

    she fucked up the single ones she did
    TV had been invented; it just wasn't available to consumers yet.

    Couscous on
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    psychotixpsychotix __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    psychotix wrote: »

    Yes. But Palin is one of the Christians who believe we are currently living in the end of times and should be actively trying to trigger the rapture.

    Which never really made much sense to me. This is is freaking God we're talking about. If he wants to get his Rapture on, I don't really think us non-omnipotent meatbags can help or hinder much.

    I'd tend to agree. But the logic thrown out by the crazies points to all sorts of world events that are associated with the end of times as the proof that we are in it.

    It's been bad enough having leaders who pander to these idiots for votes, it's another to elect a leader who actively believes in it and has made some pretty insane comments about it.

    psychotix on
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    mcdermottmcdermott Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    mcdermott on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    So I'm not the only one who credits Palin with a substantial share of the Obama victory. That's reassuring.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Not actually a mod. Roaming the streets, waving his gun around.Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    I can't recall any interview-type situation where McCain didn't clearly want to throttle the woman. The only joint appearance I can think of where he seems pleased with his choice is the one where he kept staring at her ass while she was addressed the throngs.

    ElJeffe on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Not actually a mod. Roaming the streets, waving his gun around.Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    So I'm not the only one who credits Palin with a substantial share of the Obama victory. That's reassuring.

    I think of it as McCain making many mistakes, each of which gave Obama about 20 EVs.

    ElJeffe on
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    TheBlackWindTheBlackWind Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    mcdermott wrote: »
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    I can't recall any interview-type situation where McCain didn't clearly want to throttle the woman. The only joint appearance I can think of where he seems pleased with his choice is the one where he kept staring at her ass while she was addressed the throngs.

    I loved his most reason SNL appearance for the same reason. It looked like he really enjoyed the Palin jokes. Every time Fey would get going, he started to choke back a laugh.

    TheBlackWind on
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    piLpiL Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    I think Sarah Palin's nomination for VP is a telling symptom of the political process. I think it is rare that we actually do choose amongst the smartest, or those with the best leadership. We really vote almost primarily on ideaology, and so this sort of thing crops up.

    We do not choose our leaders from business owners and CEOs who have brought start-ups to multi-billion dollar corporations. The rare few times we've had full fledged "General of the Army", we've had decent presidents (Eisenhower, Washington, and Grant), but once every 75 years is few and far between. Only one president has achieved a doctorate (Woodrow Wilson, Johns-Hopkins).

    People who are these things exist in America, but I guess they're probably too smart to run for office. I don't approve, but it just seems that's the way it goes. Bill Gates/Dr. Roger Tsien 2012.

    piL on
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    DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    So I'm not the only one who credits Palin with a substantial share of the Obama victory. That's reassuring.

    I think that McCain would have had a substantially better chance to win if Hilary had won the primary solely because he would have picked a different running mate.

    Daedalus on
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    mcdermottmcdermott Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    So I'm not the only one who credits Palin with a substantial share of the Obama victory. That's reassuring.

    I think of it as McCain making many mistakes, each of which gave Obama about 20 EVs.

    After talking to a long string of people all of whom name either the selection of Palin or her first/second interviews as the moment they abandoned McCain I'm convinced that she is what sealed Obama's victory.

    Like I said before, I think Palin put Obama in office by solidifying the states he needed, like CO, NM, NV, etc. The ones he was leading pre-bump, and would likely have then gone on to win had the economy not imploded.

    The economy (and McCain's reaction) I think provided the margin. I think the economy delivered Ohio, and probably Indiana and Florida as well.

    But absent economic issues I think Palin would still have led Obama to a narrow (or perhaps not-so-narrow, considering how she shot her mouth off in Virginia) victory.

    The threads! They're mixing!
    I think that McCain would have had a substantially better chance to win if Hilary had won the primary solely because he would have picked a different running mate.

    True. I'd actually have given McCain even odds or better against Hillary. For a variety of other reasons as well, not relevant to this thread. But Palin being a significant one as well.

    mcdermott on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    Daedalus wrote: »
    mcdermott wrote: »
    GoodOmens wrote: »
    Daedalus wrote: »
    Oh, man, McCain's facial expression in that video is hilarious.

    That's the look of a man whose brain is strangling itself.

    It's like you can hear him silently screaming, "SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP SHUT THE FUCK UP OH GOD I HATE YOU NOW I DON'T GET TO BE PRESIDENT SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

    I don't think it took long for McCain to realize he had fucked up hard. But it's not like there was anything he could do at that point. Can't replace her, have to support her, basically damage control and going down with the ship.

    So I'm not the only one who credits Palin with a substantial share of the Obama victory. That's reassuring.

    I think that McCain would have had a substantially better chance to win if Hilary had won the primary solely because he would have picked a different running mate.

    I think there's some truth to this. I also think that trying to win over feminists by picking a woman who supports abortion clinic bombers might have been really dumb in its own right.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited November 2008
    piL wrote: »
    I think Sarah Palin's nomination for VP is a telling symptom of the political process. I think it is rare that we actually do choose amongst the smartest, or those with the best leadership. We really vote almost primarily on ideaology, and so this sort of thing crops up.

    We do not choose our leaders from business owners and CEOs who have brought start-ups to multi-billion dollar corporations. The rare few times we've had full fledged "General of the Army", we've had decent presidents (Eisenhower, Washington, and Grant), but once every 75 years is few and far between. Only one president has achieved a doctorate (Woodrow Wilson, Johns-Hopkins).

    People who are these things exist in America, but I guess they're probably too smart to run for office. I don't approve, but it just seems that's the way it goes. Bill Gates/Dr. Roger Tsien 2012.
    Doctorates are not the only measure of great thinkers. Clinton is a Rhodes Scholar, Obama was president of Harvard Law Review, and so on. Yes, we have had presidents whose emphasis lay elsewhere, but we have had many smart presidents.

    Fencingsax on
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    mcdermottmcdermott Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    I think there's some truth to this. I also think that trying to win over feminists by picking a woman who supports abortion clinic bombers might have been really dumb in its own right.

    Roll for feminist vote...need a 16 or better....

    ROLLED A 1! CRITICAL FAIL!

    Did I do that right? I haven't played D&D since Clinton was in office.

    mcdermott on
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    PantsBPantsB Fake Thomas Jefferson Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    piL wrote: »
    I think Sarah Palin's nomination for VP is a telling symptom of the political process. I think it is rare that we actually do choose amongst the smartest, or those with the best leadership. We really vote almost primarily on ideaology, and so this sort of thing crops up.

    We do not choose our leaders from business owners and CEOs who have brought start-ups to multi-billion dollar corporations. The rare few times we've had full fledged "General of the Army", we've had decent presidents (Eisenhower, Washington, and Grant), but once every 75 years is few and far between. Only one president has achieved a doctorate (Woodrow Wilson, Johns-Hopkins).

    People who are these things exist in America, but I guess they're probably too smart to run for office. I don't approve, but it just seems that's the way it goes. Bill Gates/Dr. Roger Tsien 2012.

    The qualities that make a good CEO or a good General and a good President aren't necessarily the same. GW Bush was supposed to be the CEO President. They goals of business and government are not the same and there aren't that many people who have brought start-ups to multi-billion dollar corporations. Of those, few want to be President and fewer still have that desire and the necessary skill set.

    And Grant was a terrible President. Twelve Generals have become President:
    Washington, Jackson, W. Harrison, Taylor, Pierce, A. Johnson, Grant, Hayes, Garfield, Arthur, B. Harrison, and Eisenhower. There are two, maybe three good Presidents on that list (to be fair W Harrison was barely President) and several terrible ones (Grant, A Johnson, Pierce, Taylor). Electing Generals did not work out well at all.

    And your example illuminates that point. Bill Gates would be a terrible President. He has no experience in government or policy. He managed a corporation in a niche market (computer software). He has no background in law. His people skills are limited. He treats his employees below average for his industry, produces mediocre products and engaged in illegal business tactics.

    Would you have Dr. Tsien design a bridge for you? Or act as your medical doctor? Or as a hostage negotiator? So why would you think a chemist, however brilliant, would be well suited to be President/VP?

    PantsB on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    I think there's some truth to this. I also think that trying to win over feminists by picking a woman who supports abortion clinic bombers might have been really dumb in its own right.

    Roll for feminist vote...need a 16 or better....

    ROLLED A 1! CRITICAL FAIL!

    Did I do that right? I haven't played D&D since Clinton was in office.

    Fuck if I know. I played Battletech because D&D didn't have mechs.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Not actually a mod. Roaming the streets, waving his gun around.Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    edited November 2008
    piL wrote: »
    We do not choose our leaders from business owners and CEOs who have brought start-ups to multi-billion dollar corporations. The rare few times we've had full fledged "General of the Army", we've had decent presidents (Eisenhower, Washington, and Grant), but once every 75 years is few and far between. Only one president has achieved a doctorate (Woodrow Wilson, Johns-Hopkins).

    man whut

    ElJeffe on
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    piLpiL Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    piL wrote: »
    I think Sarah Palin's nomination for VP is a telling symptom of the political process. I think it is rare that we actually do choose amongst the smartest, or those with the best leadership. We really vote almost primarily on ideaology, and so this sort of thing crops up.

    We do not choose our leaders from business owners and CEOs who have brought start-ups to multi-billion dollar corporations. The rare few times we've had full fledged "General of the Army", we've had decent presidents (Eisenhower, Washington, and Grant), but once every 75 years is few and far between. Only one president has achieved a doctorate (Woodrow Wilson, Johns-Hopkins).

    People who are these things exist in America, but I guess they're probably too smart to run for office. I don't approve, but it just seems that's the way it goes. Bill Gates/Dr. Roger Tsien 2012.
    Doctorates are not the only measure of great thinkers. Clinton is a Rhodes Scholar, Obama was president of Harvard Law Review, and so on. Yes, we have had presidents whose emphasis lay elsewhere, but we have had many smart presidents.
    That's a good point Fencingsax. I just wanted to illustrate that we're pulling canidates from politicians, not necessarily from the best and the brightest of America. To be honest, the reason Clinton and Obama do not have doctorates is because they chose to pursue politics instead of academic ones, and academia isn't the end-all-be-all of human ability.

    I do, however, feel that a senator's work and a president's work are much more different than the political process would suggest, since that seems to be the most common leap. It's more of a result of "can he make people like him" than "is he the best for the job". Since that's the means of selection for both fields, that's the kind of person you get, not doctors and CEOs.


    Edit: I thought people liked Grant. Did people not like Grant? Nevermind, I guess people didn't like Grant. Nothing to see here folks.

    Edit 2: I specifically mentioned "General of the Army", aka Washington, Grant, and Eisenhower.

    The skill set that a senator brings to the presidency is the skill of getting votes, not necessarily the skill of leadership I feel.

    Edit 3: And the "General of the Army" argument I tried to make doesn't really work because it's a sample size of 3. So you guys win.

    piL on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Not actually a mod. Roaming the streets, waving his gun around.Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    edited November 2008
    mcdermott wrote: »
    I think there's some truth to this. I also think that trying to win over feminists by picking a woman who supports abortion clinic bombers might have been really dumb in its own right.

    Roll for feminist vote...need a 16 or better....

    ROLLED A 1! CRITICAL FAIL!

    Did I do that right? I haven't played D&D since Clinton was in office.

    Fuck if I know. I played Battletech because D&D didn't have mechs.

    Depends on the DM. For skill checks you can't critically fail. For saving throws and attack rolls, you can if the DM so chooses. I always so chose, because it's funny to tell a player his sword flew from his hand and imbedded in his teammate's foot.

    ElJeffe on
    I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited November 2008
    Grant was the drunk.

    Fencingsax on
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    ElJeffeElJeffe Not actually a mod. Roaming the streets, waving his gun around.Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    edited November 2008
    piL wrote: »
    Edit: I thought people liked Grant. Did people not like Grant? Nevermind, I guess people didn't like Grant. Nothing to see here folks.

    Grant was an inept alcoholic with the most corrupt administration in American history. In his defense, I don't think he was a bad guy... just an inept alcoholic.

    ElJeffe on
    I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
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    DynagripDynagrip Break me a million hearts HoustonRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2008
    i would say the reason that many politicians don't have what you consider doctorates is because they come from law school backgrounds, and Juris Doctors are basically grad school degrees.

    Dynagrip on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited November 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    piL wrote: »
    Edit: I thought people liked Grant. Did people not like Grant? Nevermind, I guess people didn't like Grant. Nothing to see here folks.

    Grant was an inept alcoholic with the most corrupt administration in American history. In his defense, I don't think he was a bad guy... just an inept alcoholic.

    I give him a pass for killing some southerners. I mean anyone who shot up the good old boys can't be that bad in my book.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited November 2008
    ElJeffe wrote: »
    mcdermott wrote: »
    I think there's some truth to this. I also think that trying to win over feminists by picking a woman who supports abortion clinic bombers might have been really dumb in its own right.

    Roll for feminist vote...need a 16 or better....

    ROLLED A 1! CRITICAL FAIL!

    Did I do that right? I haven't played D&D since Clinton was in office.

    Fuck if I know. I played Battletech because D&D didn't have mechs.

    Depends on the DM. For skill checks you can't critically fail. For saving throws and attack rolls, you can if the DM so chooses. I always so chose, because it's funny to tell a player his sword flew from his hand and imbedded in his teammate's foot.

    I nominate ElJeffe to DM the next presidential election.

    ViolentChemistry on
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