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The Palm Prē: Whatever the Touchstone touches stays touched

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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2009
    multiple personality disorder.

    Obs on
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    SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Barrakketh wrote: »
    archonwarp wrote: »
    ben0207 wrote: »
    JohnDoe wrote: »
    Natheo wrote: »
    Seriously Obs you can be such a stupid fucking idiot sometimes.

    More like all the time.

    Its funny that he came back to this thread after having a cry and running off earlier.

    Just stick him on your ignore list. he never says anything relevant anyway.

    If I ignore him, won't I still be stuck looking at quote trees with his name in them?

    If you use Greasemonkey you could install the script in my sig, change the ignored user from Clawshrimpy (it was made primarily for the denizens of the anime thread) to Obs, and it'll nuke the quote trees as well as his posts. It won't even show the "post by <user> was ignored" bullshit. You don't have to put him on your PA ignore list, either (in fact, it won't work if he is). So you open it up in a text editor (a plain text editor) after it's installed, find the line that says:
    var users = new Array("Clawshrimpy")
    

    and change Clawshrimpy to Obs. The current version is a beta, but I've been using it for about two weeks and so have a couple of testers who volunteered and it hasn't raped anyone's dog or something of that nature.
    Thanks, I was having a dilema trying to decide who to take off my ignore list. 3 people is really too few.

    Spoit on
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    ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Fats wrote: »
    So, how about a video with Palm's Vice President of design? Looks neat.

    I finally got around to watching this, and there were two things I didn't notice before that now stood out to me.

    First, you can slide the "cards" or whatever they like to call them off the standard menu to kinda keep it down to the stuff you really use a lot and/or are running currently. That's a really cool idea that they don't force you to use those cards and flip through ALL of them.

    Secondly, the off-screen touch gestures seems to hail back to the Palm/PDA writing area below the actual screen, and it's an awesome way to take "wasted space" and turn it into something worthwhile. It looked like he pulled up a quickmenu ("return to my contacts screen") from it one time and then brought up the main menu screen (with icons) the second time. Just an awesome idea.

    On a patent-related note, and Engadget fairly covered this already. Seeing the menus again highlighted it that Palm seems to have focused on either vertical or horizontal scrolling for each screen, and not really "mixing" them so the patent Apple has for detecting whether the user wants horizontal or vertical scrolling based on the first gesture really doesn't seem to apply. It also keeps things very intuitive and "basic" for end-users as well. It's a very good UI move.


    Just saw this decent read at Engadget. Nothing revealed or groundbreaking though.
    In a recent interview with Elevation Partners' Roger McNamee, the Palm investor explained that Palm knew it had to step up its game after RIM launched the BlackBerry Pearl, which he described as "the first real consumer electronics product in the smartphone category." The Pearl launch served as the coming out party for the BlackBerry brand among consumers as RIM began stepping up its advertising, and the product's narrower hardware design was a noticeable break with the staid stylings of previous BlackBerry devices.

    Indeed, back in November of 2006 as Palm rolled out the somewhat consumer-focused Treo 680, I wrote a Switched On column noting that the Pearl broke with the evolutionary path that RIM had been on and served as an example for the kind of hardware shift Palm needed to make.

    Palm finally answered the Pearl with the Centro, a compact, inexpensive, and successful smartphone that has apparently served as the final resting place of the original Palm OS architecture. However, between the release of those two devices, the entry and subsequent SDK of Apple's iPhone proved a far more significant turning point in the evolution of consumer smartphones. The iPhone's resonance and popularity have provoked responses from many competitors, but there is a particular contrast in the flagship CDMA touchscreen handsets released by RIM and Palm --- the other two smartphone developers that grow their own operating systems -- since then.

    This time it has been Palm, with its back against the wall, that has made the clean break from the past and created an experience that looks modern, clean and elegant. At this point, the Pre appears to sacrifice some discoverability versus the iPhone and Palm has had to accept tradeoffs without as much marketplace power as Apple to drive as deep an SDK or proprietary connectors as Apple has. However, Palm's webOS rewards with a fluidity evident in both the multitasking navigation among applications and the potential for seamless integration of Internet data into its core applications.

    In fact, if its capabilities match to the promise extolled in the McNamee interview, the Pre will live up to its name literally by taking -- or at least suggesting -- actions on your behalf in anticipation of your needs. The venture capitalist gives as an example that the phone might offer to email people you have a meeting with when it detects that you are running late. This level of active assistance would leverage the power of inputs such as GPS and the Internet that were not broadly available at the advent of the Newton, the first digital handheld that sought to take a more active role in managing your life. Since then, most PDAs and smartphones -- and even the iPhone -- have been more passive pocket computers. The imperfect information often provided by these inputs may make this more of a novelty for the near-term, but Palm is certainly ceding nothing on the ambition front.

    In contrast, while the Storm has certainly done the iPhone one better in many respects, with a higher-resolution autofocus camera that can shoot video, microSD, Bluetooth stereo, integration with turn-by-turn directions and unlimited music (if you take advantage of those services), and of course, excellent mobile e-mail capabilities for those who have a BlackBerry server. But by keeping the basic popup menu-driven operation of previous BlackBerry products intact, the overall user experience is fractured between the worlds of swiping and typing.

    The Storm may have strong appeal to those accustomed to the BlackBerry experience and who want a larger touchscreen. But RIM, like Microsoft, now needs to make more significant changes in this new competitive landscape that includes the approachable finger-driven experience with which Apple broke ground and the richness of knowledge that Palm is pouring into a foundation. It's great to have a Pearl, but when taking advantage of a gestalt that marries new interfaces to the new Internet, the world is your oyster.

    ArcSyn on
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    DBReedDBReed Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Any ideas on how well this would integrate with the Mac side of things? I use iCal, Address Book and iTunes for calendars, contacts and MP3s and videos. I was thinking about getting an iPhone this summer, but I'm liking what I see with the Pre. If it can offer better battery life and a web browser that doesn't crash as much as Safari does, then I would be sold. Plus my fiance is on Sprint and has been bugging me to go over to them, so that's an added bonus.

    DBReed on
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    JAEFJAEF Unstoppably Bald Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Palm has historically been very Mac friendly in terms of their syncing software, I don't see them stopping that trend now. Kind of up in the air what the compatibility will be at launch though, and the battery life is a complete mystery until hardware is finalized.

    JAEF on
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    stigweardstigweard Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Missing sync or Syncmate will likely have support very quickly after release. Missing sync is a bit buggy for my phone, but it keeps call logs and has a few other nice goodies I really like.

    stigweard on
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    RhapsodyRhapsody Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    DBReed wrote: »
    Plus my fiance is on Sprint and has been bugging me to go over to them, so that's an added bonus.

    This raises my question, sorry if it's been asked already, but is there any chance of this becoming available to non-Sprint customers?

    Rhapsody on
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    Big DookieBig Dookie Smells great! Houston, TXRegistered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Rhapsody wrote: »
    DBReed wrote: »
    Plus my fiance is on Sprint and has been bugging me to go over to them, so that's an added bonus.

    This raises my question, sorry if it's been asked already, but is there any chance of this becoming available to non-Sprint customers?
    I believe there is supposedly an unlocked GSM version coming out (in Europe only maybe? not sure) a few months after Sprint's version comes out. After that, who knows?

    Big Dookie on
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    The Reverend Dr GalactusThe Reverend Dr Galactus Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Big Dookie wrote: »
    Rhapsody wrote: »
    DBReed wrote: »
    Plus my fiance is on Sprint and has been bugging me to go over to them, so that's an added bonus.

    This raises my question, sorry if it's been asked already, but is there any chance of this becoming available to non-Sprint customers?
    I believe there is supposedly an unlocked GSM version coming out (in Europe only maybe? not sure) a few months after Sprint's version comes out. After that, who knows?

    The thing it always comes down to, though, is something like:

    "Hmm. $229 on Sprint, or $599 imported unlocked + $44.51 international shipping to get it on AT&T."

    If the difference doesn't turn out to be quite so big, I suppose it might almost be worth importing to go to T-Mobile for what you'd save on the monthly plan over the course of the contract, but even there I imagine the savings would be pretty slim.

    The Reverend Dr Galactus on
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    DratatooDratatoo Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Palm has historically been very Mac friendly in terms of their syncing software, I don't see them stopping that trend now. Kind of up in the air what the compatibility will be at launch though, and the battery life is a complete mystery until hardware is finalized.

    Hahahahaha. No you're wrong on this one. Palm fired their Mac team and ceased the mac support for all models in the past. (Around 2004) Why they would alienate a part of their user base which is looking for alternatives to Windows (mobile) in the portable and most likley in the "desktop computing world" is still beyond to me.

    The past 4 years Palm seemed to have lots of management and public relation related problems:

    The identiy crisis of the company: Palm - Palm Source - Palm again, the sell out of the OS development devision to an external company, suing or threatening fan sites with legal action which use the world "Palm" in their web adress / on their website, finishing + announcing Palm OS 6 but not releasing it for any devices for over 3 years and then later canning it, the reuse of the Palm 5.xx (Garnet) for the latest devices (which was a nice mobile OS at release around 2002 - 2003, but which is horrible outdated by now), the failure of the Foleo which was an addon desktop like "netbook" to the Treo (mobile phone) *rolles eyes* - thank good that somebody pulled the plug on this one, the usage of windows mobile in the latest Treo models which also means a loss of identity because Palm OS was the feature which defined the platform.

    Maybe the new Pre will be bring the company back on track.

    The first problem I see here is that Palm tries to copy the concept of Apples closed garden platform a bit to much. When Steve was announced that there are no 3rd party native apps for the iPhone at launch - and at this time it wasn't sure if there will be 3rd party apps in a official way - the crowd wasn't really cheering - and I feel the same way after I read about the app support of the Palm Pre "But hey, we can take bit of javascript and html and a database - Isn't that great, you can build adress book application and any from of database application you can imagine." :| Nope I don't think you can do the same things with html, a few lines of script and and maybe a database, compared to native code, even if you add some interfaces in order to interact with specific functions of the Pre phone.

    The nice thing about the Palm OS platform was that were lots of free apps, even late in its lifetime. Most apps were not bigger than a few KB too. Unfortunately because of Palms decision to not continue developing their OS and the most "undecidable" development strategy in history (do we continue, do we stall the development, maybe we should consider the new Linux OS from our OS devision which we just sold) the most active developers just wandered off. Ah, yeah being a prick to the fans / community didn't help things either.

    The 2nd problem I see is that Palm might try to hard get the iPhone crows. The guys who bought the iPhone most likely won't switch because they already spend money on the gadget + contract or paid the full price for the device.

    I think the smarter move would be to get the guys who were annoyed by the lack of the iPhones features - copy + paste for example. Another target demographic would be the people which don't want to be bullied into contract with a phone company they don't use / prefer - so offer the phone at a reasonable price standalone or give the people choices regarding the phone plan.

    BTW, it would be nice if this phone would be available in a greater quantity at local shops. The Treo was a bitch to get in my region (Germany - but most US / japanese based enterprises seem to hate EU as most people noticed, so no surprise here). I had to settle for an online store.

    Dratatoo on
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    JAEFJAEF Unstoppably Bald Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Well my phone knowledge only extends back to 2006, so it beats me on Palms inner workings but in terms of Palm's available software and syncing their Palm OS to macs, that shit works. That was what I was going off of.

    funny you should mention people with contracts, the original iPhone was released in early June of 2007, meaning the June/July release of the Pre is coming up just when those fuckers are out of contract. I don't expect to see any sort of appreciable AT&T to Sprint leap of course, but the option is there. In the US Sprint is notoriously bad at keeping a good supply of their high end phones in stock, although I'm not sure if that's just HTC being the slowest manufacturers ever when it comes to shitting out their phones.

    JAEF on
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    DratatooDratatoo Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Well my phone knowledge only extends back to 2006, so it beats me on Palms inner workings but in terms of Palm's available software and syncing their Palm OS to macs, that shit works. That was what I was going off of.

    Yeah - in regards of Mac Syncing working - the Palm Mac software hasn't updated since Mac was a PowerPC platform and even if it does work now, for whatever miraculous reason, you will have a) issues because the sync protocol and iSync (Apple's syncing software end) have undergone lots of changes b) its PowerPC based and Apple will soon or later drop support for this emulation (rumors say as early as the release of Snow Leopard, the next major release of OSX). c) there are restriction and limitation how emulated PowerPC software can interface with drivers and certain elements of the OS (for example you can't compile a PowerPC only preference panel and install it on a Intel machine)

    If you are speaking of Missing Sync - that is one solution a 3rd party developer created, sure it will work if you pay 'em to use this software. If the enterprise of Missing Sync goes belly up, then so will their support. If the app breaks afterwards for whatever reason you have to search for another solution in the meantime you can't interact with your Phone - Mac.

    Before someone suggests virtualisation, that is like storing a motor cycle in my car's trunk because I am not able to drive to the destination with said car and a certain kind of tires (sorry for the pathetic analogy)

    Addition: I took a look at the install achieve of Palm's site. Its still version 4 (PowerPC), last updated in 2005.

    Dratatoo on
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    JAEFJAEF Unstoppably Bald Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Man what are you talking about?

    http://kb.palm.com/SRVS/CGI-BIN/WEBCGI.EXE/,/?St=1064,E=0000000000267172595,K=5157,Sxi=3,case=obj(33219)

    Right there at the bottom.
    System Requirements
    Palm devices

    * Centro; Treo 755p , 700p, 680, 650, 600
    * Zire 72, 71, 31, 21, original Zire
    * Palm TX, Z22; Tungsten E2; Zire 72, 71; LifeDrive

    Mac versions

    * Mac OS X (version 10.1.2 or higher)
    * Not compatible with Mac OS 9 or earlier.

    Computer

    * 65 MB free hard disk space
    * One available USB port for synchronization


    PowerPC and Intel Core Duo

    Palm Desktop and HotSync Manager software works with both of these processors. We have found no significant new issues using our software with the Intel Core Duo processors found in Macs such as the MacBook Pro.

    For all their latest devices, Palm 650 and up, their HotSync software works. It works for macs.

    Whether this is compatible with future Mac product doesn't really matter considering Palm is moving to a new OS which I can't imagine them not having Mac support for. Maybe not at launch, but shortly thereafter. Even RIM has a shitty watered down Mac software for syncing information for their Blackberries.

    JAEF on
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    The Reverend Dr GalactusThe Reverend Dr Galactus Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    It's good that the "current" HotSync still "works," but "we have found no significant issues" isn't going to fly in competing with the iPhone.

    That said, I don't think they're going to go the "hey, you can futz with this and then it will work on your MAC-in-tosh" route this time. They're gunning for the Mac users and the design-savvy folks with the Pre. If they really want to sell these people a phone, they're going to build a transparent sync utility for OSX that simply does its stuff in the background between iCal and Address Book without a big, garish "manager." Quite possibly over BlueTooth.

    As for audio and video management, that's probably just going to be over USB mass storage. Which is fine.

    The Reverend Dr Galactus on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2009
    What's the general feeling in this thread?

    Do people think Pre will pull it off?

    Obs on
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    iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Pull what off?

    iTunesIsEvil on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2009
    This

    Obs on
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    iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Obs, you're being a dick. Just a heads up.

    Pull what off?

    iTunesIsEvil on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2009
    If I'm being a dick then I'm just going to log off and come back tomorrow.
    Peace out for now.

    Think about it.

    Obs on
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    FatsFats Corvallis, ORRegistered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Do people think Pre will pull it off?

    Yep.

    Fats on
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    SeeksSeeks Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    What's the general feeling in this thread?

    Do people think Pre will pull it off?


    If by "pull it off" you mean "beat out the iPhone," then I doubt it very much.

    If by "pull it off" you mean "make a smartphone that lots of people will buy," then I'd say yeah.

    Just guesses, though. I know I'd get one if I could somehow use it with tracfone's service... which is another way of saying that I probably won't get one, but wish I could.

    Seeks on
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    JAEFJAEF Unstoppably Bald Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Now I feel like I have to ask why you're using Tracfone

    JAEF on
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    SeeksSeeks Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Because I hate contracts, and don't talk enough to use more than 100 or so minutes a month.

    Seeks on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2009
    Seeks wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    What's the general feeling in this thread?

    Do people think Pre will pull it off?


    If by "pull it off" you mean "beat out the iPhone," then I doubt it very much.

    If by "pull it off" you mean "make a smartphone that lots of people will buy," then I'd say yeah.

    Just guesses, though. I know I'd get one if I could somehow use it with tracfone's service... which is another way of saying that I probably won't get one, but wish I could.

    There we go.

    Obs on
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    jhunter46jhunter46 Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    I'm actually pretty excited about this phone. We're due up for a 150$ off an upgraded phone now. Our current Sprint contract expires in April. I'd really like to give one of these a go.

    jhunter46 on
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    FatsFats Corvallis, ORRegistered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Seeks wrote: »
    If by "pull it off" you mean "make a smartphone that lots of people will buy," then I'd say yeah.

    Which is, of course, all they need to do to succeed.

    Fats on
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    RonenRonen Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Fats wrote: »
    Seeks wrote: »
    If by "pull it off" you mean "make a smartphone that lots of people will buy," then I'd say yeah.

    Which is, of course, all they need to do to succeed.

    The real thing they need to succeed is developer support; that's where being late to the game is going to hurt them. By the time the Pre comes out with its App Store, lots of devs have already rallied behind the Apple and Google's App store, plus the promise of one from MS.

    So in all my post boils down to "we'll see."

    Ronen on
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    Ghostly ClockworkGhostly Clockwork Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    In order for the Pre to beat, or even compete with the iPhone, it has to break the "Cult of Cool" that Apple has surrounding it's products, it'll have to figure out a way to convince people that a) losing a lot of money from iTunes purchases are worth it or b) That carrying a iPod and a phone is alright, and it'll have to be cheap.

    Personally, I think the iPhone is heading towards a wall. I'm sure we all remember the Razr or Razor, however you spelled it. It was THE phone, all people had, in all movies, and regarded as the most common phone around, unless I'm mistaken (Likely). Now? It's not. I think the iPhone is going that way as well, riding the cool wave is good, but that's a fickle group...we'll have to wait and see.

    I don't know if the Pre can really pick up any customers from Apple, in my rookie view, there's not enough "Wow!" factor to get people to consider switching. What I'm waiting for is a combination of those sunglasses that have a MP3 player built in, and some sort of HUD overlayed on the glasses.

    Ghostly Clockwork on
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    RonenRonen Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Dragon6860 wrote: »
    In order for the Pre to beat, or even compete with the iPhone, it has to break the "Cult of Cool" that Apple has surrounding it's products, it'll have to figure out a way to convince people that a) losing a lot of money from iTunes purchases are worth it or b) That carrying a iPod and a phone is alright, and it'll have to be cheap.

    Personally, I think the iPhone is heading towards a wall. I'm sure we all remember the Razr or Razor, however you spelled it. It was THE phone, all people had, in all movies, and regarded as the most common phone around, unless I'm mistaken (Likely). Now? It's not. I think the iPhone is going that way as well, riding the cool wave is good, but that's a fickle group...we'll have to wait and see.

    I don't know if the Pre can really pick up any customers from Apple, in my rookie view, there's not enough "Wow!" factor to get people to consider switching. What I'm waiting for is a combination of those sunglasses that have a MP3 player built in, and some sort of HUD overlayed on the glasses.

    The difference between the RAZR phenomenon and the iPhone is that the RAZR was great hardware with shitty software, but the iPhone better balanced: it has ok hardware and great software (for the most part). It has expanded people's perception of what a phone can do beyond "omg it's really thin."

    Just saying.

    Ronen on
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    autono-wally, erotibot300autono-wally, erotibot300 love machine Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    phones have deadly hardware cycles. it's much closer to a fashion accessory than a regular tech gadget really

    autono-wally, erotibot300 on
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    OremLKOremLK Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Ronen wrote: »
    Dragon6860 wrote: »
    In order for the Pre to beat, or even compete with the iPhone, it has to break the "Cult of Cool" that Apple has surrounding it's products, it'll have to figure out a way to convince people that a) losing a lot of money from iTunes purchases are worth it or b) That carrying a iPod and a phone is alright, and it'll have to be cheap.

    Personally, I think the iPhone is heading towards a wall. I'm sure we all remember the Razr or Razor, however you spelled it. It was THE phone, all people had, in all movies, and regarded as the most common phone around, unless I'm mistaken (Likely). Now? It's not. I think the iPhone is going that way as well, riding the cool wave is good, but that's a fickle group...we'll have to wait and see.

    I don't know if the Pre can really pick up any customers from Apple, in my rookie view, there's not enough "Wow!" factor to get people to consider switching. What I'm waiting for is a combination of those sunglasses that have a MP3 player built in, and some sort of HUD overlayed on the glasses.

    The difference between the RAZR phenomenon and the iPhone is that the RAZR was great hardware with shitty software, but the iPhone better balanced: it has ok hardware and great software (for the most part). It has expanded people's perception of what a phone can do beyond "omg it's really thin."

    Just saying.

    Eh, the Razr is all right, slim and good build quality, but I hate the keypad. As in, loathe it. The camera sucks, too.

    OremLK on
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    EvanderEvander Disappointed Father Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Ronen wrote: »
    Dragon6860 wrote: »
    In order for the Pre to beat, or even compete with the iPhone, it has to break the "Cult of Cool" that Apple has surrounding it's products, it'll have to figure out a way to convince people that a) losing a lot of money from iTunes purchases are worth it or b) That carrying a iPod and a phone is alright, and it'll have to be cheap.

    Personally, I think the iPhone is heading towards a wall. I'm sure we all remember the Razr or Razor, however you spelled it. It was THE phone, all people had, in all movies, and regarded as the most common phone around, unless I'm mistaken (Likely). Now? It's not. I think the iPhone is going that way as well, riding the cool wave is good, but that's a fickle group...we'll have to wait and see.

    I don't know if the Pre can really pick up any customers from Apple, in my rookie view, there's not enough "Wow!" factor to get people to consider switching. What I'm waiting for is a combination of those sunglasses that have a MP3 player built in, and some sort of HUD overlayed on the glasses.

    The difference between the RAZR phenomenon and the iPhone is that the RAZR was great hardware with shitty software, but the iPhone better balanced: it has ok hardware and great software (for the most part). It has expanded people's perception of what a phone can do beyond "omg it's really thin."

    Just saying.

    I don't know that I'd call the iPhone balanced. It has some features which are novel, but serve no real purpose, and there are some features that it lacks entirely.



    What the iPhone has going for it that the RAZR didn't is a previous base of recognition. The RAZR built its own reputation, but the iPhone is just the iPod that is a phone. This MIGHT be enough to carry it through for a while, or it might mean that the iPhone could peter out even quicker than the RAZR did when the next big thing comes along, or both factors might fight each other giving us something in the middle.



    What the iPhone WON'T do is have the exact same staying power as the iPod, at least, without changing the phone significantly and often. The key factor in the success of the iPod is the fact that it was the first widely recognized mp3 player. Apple's marketing campaigns and other factors have definitely played in to its success, but ultimately the fact that the iPod is all that many people know, when it comes to mp3 players, is more valuable than anything else. It's the reason why folks claim that iPod are easier to use than other devices (because they are already used to iPods) and it is the reason why everyone has their mp3s set up in iTunes already, and may even have iTunes purchased songs which are unplayable on other devices. It is the reason why when people look at an mp3 player, they excpect it to look like an iPod, even just in physical appearance.

    On the other hand, the iPhone is an entry in to a market that people are already familiar with. People know Treos and Blackberrys and RAZRs. People know LG and Nokia and Samsung and Sony Erickson. People had their files set up to sync with WinMo or Palm OS in the past, so switching away from an Iphone wouldn't leave them completely in the dark about how to use any other device. There is no doubt in my mind that HTC or Palm or somebody CAN make a device that would take attention away from the iPhone, it's just a question of how long it will take them to figure it out (first step, IMO, is to stop trying to make every device look just like an iPhone, which only serves to strengthen the iPhone's brand.)

    The one area where the iPhone stands a chance to garner any kind of staying power that the iPod has is in users who went directly to the iPhone from a "dumb phone" without ever owning a smart phone or other feature phone. These people may be genuinely unaware of what other phones have to offer that the iPhone doesn't do. I suspect, though, that if some other phone comes along to dethrone the iPhone in media attention, these people would also follow along to the next trendy phone, like they have in the past.


    edit: also, the RAZRs (and all other popular phones) were eventually gven away for extremely cheap, and then free, with a two year contract. I doubt we'll see the iPhone go in this direction, because that might have a significant impact on the perceived value of iPods, but if the iPhone doesn't do this, then it faces even stiffer competition when the Pre, and whatever else comes along, end up dropping to a lower price point than the iPhone itself.

    Evander on
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    ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2009
    You completely underestimate the potential of an iPhone.

    Someday, people may use advanced iPhones as desktops.

    Stop thinking of it as a phone, start thinking of it as a tiny computer that is with you at all times.

    Obs on
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    autono-wally, erotibot300autono-wally, erotibot300 love machine Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    the better smartphones all can do that

    autono-wally, erotibot300 on
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    EvanderEvander Disappointed Father Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    You completely underestimate the potential of an iPhone.

    Someday, people may use advanced iPhones as desktops.

    Stop thinking of it as a phone, start thinking of it as a tiny computer that is with you at all times.

    You mean like the Treo 700wx that I had before the iPhone launched?

    Or the HTC Touch Pro that I have now?

    Or the iPAQ that I had ages ago, back when the first generation 5 gig iPods were just coming out?



    Obs, have you ever used any Pocket PCs or PDAs in the past? Are you aware of the history of Windows CE, or the old Palm and Handspring rivalry. Hell, how about the Apple Newton?



    edit: by the way, my desktop can cut and paste.

    Evander on
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    stigweardstigweard Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    Someday, people may use advanced iPhones as desktops.

    Obs wrote: »
    And I cannot believe you absolutely need all those apps up and running and ready to go at the drop of a hat in order to function. You do not need all those apps wasting processing time and battery life. Seriously, what the fuck are you doing? There are not many situations where using applications one at a time in sequential order is not sufficient.

    stigweard on
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    autono-wally, erotibot300autono-wally, erotibot300 love machine Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    It's only cool if it's apple, people

    autono-wally, erotibot300 on
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    EvanderEvander Disappointed Father Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Here is your portable desktop:

    osborne1.jpg

    Evander on
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    Lord JezoLord Jezo Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    Evander wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    You completely underestimate the potential of an iPhone.

    Someday, people may use advanced iPhones as desktops.

    Stop thinking of it as a phone, start thinking of it as a tiny computer that is with you at all times.

    You mean like the Treo 700wx that I had before the iPhone launched?

    Or the HTC Touch Pro that I have now?

    Or the iPAQ that I had ages ago, back when the first generation 5 gig iPods were just coming out?



    Obs, have you ever used any Pocket PCs or PDAs in the past? Are you aware of the history of Windows CE, or the old Palm and Handspring rivalry. Hell, how about the Apple Newton?



    edit: by the way, my desktop can cut and paste.

    It doesn't matter.

    The iPhone has the Apple brand on it and that makes people wet. The majority of people don't give a crap about cutting and pasting and non drm locked down devices. They want Koi Pond, the iFart, and games. They also want sexy advertisements and hip stores. All those other devices were aimed at business people, the iPhone is marketed at teenagers, adults who aren't technical, and people who like toys. No other device can give them the sex that the iPhone can.

    The Pre can be as good as it gets but the Apple has advertisements with people dancing and billboards in Times Square. That's all that matters to people.

    Lord Jezo on
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    I KISS YOU!
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    autono-wally, erotibot300autono-wally, erotibot300 love machine Registered User regular
    edited February 2009
    yeah, but how long does that work
    it "only" takes someone to copy that scheme half-competently to ruin the original, too

    autono-wally, erotibot300 on
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