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[Chrono Trigger] The black wind howls...

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Posts

  • WillisIVIIXWillisIVIIX Registered User
    edited June 2009
    ASimPerson wrote: »
    While this debate is likely to be as productive as every other CT vs. CC debate ever (read: not productive at all) at least try to include actual criticisms and not "hurr no one likes [insert game here]" please.

    That said, going back to SE's stance on more Chrono games I sort of understand it and I sort of don't. Did CT:DS sell well or not? I pre-ordered it but I never owned CT as a kid so this was really my first chance to buy a non-shoddy port. On the flip side, I can also understand why people don't want to pay $40 for it, though I wonder at price point would still buy a DS game over waiting for a VC version.

    CT came out when SNES carts started down the $60 path towards the end of it's hay day, I've read in some areas in the USA $75 was becoming the standard after around DK Country and FFVI came out. I'm sure that trend followed around the globe, I think it was also in a low production cycle making it rarer but that I'm not sure of.

    And now we're hit with a 14 year old port that they want $40, because SE's stance is to milk their re-releases with small bonuses and charge full price for it instead of just doing a VC, XBLA, or PSN release. Although that isn't so with games that have a small interest to "enhance" or would just cost to much to port, see Secret of Mana VC and FFVII on PSN. It's sad really because doing it through digital means would make them a hell of a lot more money to dictate another game made with WiiWare XBLA and PSN in mind almost like FFIV's continutation.

    WillisIVIIX on
  • Darth_MogsDarth_Mogs Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    ASimPerson wrote: »
    Did CT:DS sell well or not?

    I think somebody in this thread mentioned that CT: DS sold 800K units. Don't know the truth to that, and I can't think of where to look for numbers off-hand, but I wouldn't be surprised.

    Darth_Mogs on
    Kupowered - It's my Blog!
  • JaysonFourJaysonFour Classy Monster Kitteh Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Chrono Cross was an obvious Suikoden rip-off that somebody over at Square thought they could use as the Chrono sequel by dropping small hints, plugs, and minor characters from Chrono Trigger.

    As someone else said before: By itself, a good game. The true Chrono Trigger sequel fans were looking for? Hell, no.

    JaysonFour on
    steam_sig.png
  • Zephyr_FateZephyr_Fate Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    JaysonFour wrote: »
    Chrono Cross was an obvious Suikoden rip-off that somebody over at Square thought they could use as the Chrono sequel by dropping small hints, plugs, and minor characters from Chrono Trigger.

    As someone else said before: By itself, a good game. The true Chrono Trigger sequel fans were looking for? Hell, no.

    Oh do not even go there. Chrono Cross is tied to Trigger waaaaaay more than you guys make it seem. The events in Cross would not have happened had it not been for Trigger.

    Zephyr_Fate on
  • DeathPrawnDeathPrawn Registered User
    edited June 2009
    And now we're hit with a 14 year old port that they want $40, because SE's stance is to milk their re-releases with small bonuses and charge full price for it instead of just doing a VC, XBLA, or PSN release. Although that isn't so with games that have a small interest to "enhance" or would just cost to much to port, see Secret of Mana VC and FFVII on PSN. It's sad really because doing it through digital means would make them a hell of a lot more money to dictate another game made with WiiWare XBLA and PSN in mind almost like FFIV's continutation.

    My issue with Square-Enix isn't that they charge full price. I'd be perfectly fine with S-E charging 'full price' for CTDS. My beef is the so-called "Square-Enix Tax". You can't reasonably charge ~$10 more than standard MSRP on a console ($30-35 for a normal DS game versus $40-45 for a S-E game) and then complain when you don't get the sales numbers you wanted.

    DeathPrawn on
    Signature not found.
  • Pure DinPure Din Boston-areaRegistered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Hi, I have a question
    I forgot to pick up the Crono doll earlier in the game, now Crono is dead, so I went to the tent but I was only able to get a Lucca doll. It's been a long time since I've played this game, and I don't remember what to do next.

    Pure Din on
  • RBachRBach Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    You need to talk to
    Belthasar's Nu in 2300AD first
    if you haven't already.

    I'm assuming you already spoke with
    Gaspar
    . If not, do that first.

    RBach on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Darth_MogsDarth_Mogs Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Pure Din wrote: »
    Hi, I have a question
    I forgot to pick up the Crono doll earlier in the game, now Crono is dead, so I went to the tent but I was only able to get a Lucca doll. It's been a long time since I've played this game, and I don't remember what to do next.
    Did you go to the dome where Balthazar is in 2300 A.D. yet? I don't know if there's a step between that and going to the tent. Maybe check with the Old Man at The End of Time if nothing else?
    Oh do not even go there. Chrono Cross is tied to Trigger waaaaaay more than you guys make it seem. The events in Cross would not have happened had it not been for Trigger.

    Whether or not it actually does have more connections than we make it seem in the whole of it, I think the general consensus would be that it doesn't have enough connections where it needs it.
    I personally didn't want [strike]108[/strike] 45 characters that meant fuck all when you consider the first game. "Glenn" wasn't Glenn, and Guile(?) wasn't Magus. They simply were not the same characters, and they meant nothing to the story.

    What Cross completely fails to do as a sequel, is capture anything from Trigger so you know, when you're playing it, that you are actually playing a sequel to the game. And because of that, when the references to Trigger show up, it feels more like the Chocobo in Parasite Eve; a reference. Nothing more. Sure, they're spouting plot. But it's not attached to anything but Cross.

    And that's my other problem with Cross. You have Trigger, and you have Cross, and then you have an entire games-worth of backstory that is explained in Cross and basically non-existant in Trigger. The vague attempt in CT: DS to bridge that with Dalton was borderline insulting and it's still as vague a gesture as it was before.

    Basically, what my problem amounts to with Cross as a sequel is that there's just too much between the two games that is only explained in the second and never even hinted in the first. So when you start Cross and nothing makes sense and doesn't make sense until more than halfway through the goddamn game it fails as a sequel.

    Darth_Mogs on
    Kupowered - It's my Blog!
  • DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    I personally thought the plot in CC was just too damn complicated.

    CT was one of the few JRPGs that gets it right - it was always clear what the team was trying to do, and why. All the crazy identity swaps and paradoxes and alternate dimensions and shit we got in CC was a poor subsitute for a good consistent narrative and a few well-developed characters.

    It was a decent enough game, and I had fun playing it, but that's all it was. CT was one of the best games of its era.
    The fact that you had to spend half of the game as Lynx without the team you got in the first of the game was bullshit as well. What was the point of all that?

    Duffel on
  • Spectral SwallowSpectral Swallow Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    JaysonFour wrote: »
    Chrono Cross was an obvious Suikoden rip-off that somebody over at Square thought they could use as the Chrono sequel by dropping small hints, plugs, and minor characters from Chrono Trigger.

    As someone else said before: By itself, a good game. The true Chrono Trigger sequel fans were looking for? Hell, no.

    Sequal or not, the scene with Lenne's bell was too good for words.
    The orphanage scene was also pretty good.

    I also liked the idea that people from the destroyed future would be mad at Chrono and Co.

    Spectral Swallow on
  • pablo_pricepablo_price Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    JaysonFour wrote: »
    Chrono Cross was an obvious Suikoden rip-off that somebody over at Square thought they could use as the Chrono sequel by dropping small hints, plugs, and minor characters from Chrono Trigger.

    As someone else said before: By itself, a good game. The true Chrono Trigger sequel fans were looking for? Hell, no.

    Oh do not even go there. Chrono Cross is tied to Trigger waaaaaay more than you guys make it seem. The events in Cross would not have happened had it not been for Trigger.

    I could write a shitty star wars fanfic that kills off luke and han like a month after RotJ and takes place exclusively on an island on a planet we've never seen before. just because my story "would not have happened" without star wars doesn't make it episode 7

    pablo_price on
  • Zephyr_FateZephyr_Fate Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    JaysonFour wrote: »
    Chrono Cross was an obvious Suikoden rip-off that somebody over at Square thought they could use as the Chrono sequel by dropping small hints, plugs, and minor characters from Chrono Trigger.

    As someone else said before: By itself, a good game. The true Chrono Trigger sequel fans were looking for? Hell, no.

    Oh do not even go there. Chrono Cross is tied to Trigger waaaaaay more than you guys make it seem. The events in Cross would not have happened had it not been for Trigger.

    I could write a shitty star wars fanfic that kills off luke and han like a month after RotJ and takes place exclusively on an island on a planet we've never seen before. just because my story "would not have happened" without star wars doesn't make it episode 7

    Yes because that is totally the same thing as what Cross did to Trigger (which was diddly squat, by the way). The archipelago IS on the same planet as Trigger.

    If anything, the 'entire backstory' explained in Cross adds depth to the eras and places you visited in Trigger whose development was, at times, meager. We get an explanation behind the Reptites, behind 2300 AD, and the ongoing events of the 'present time'. I honestly had no problem understanding Cross's plot, in relation to Trigger especially. I especially enjoyed the parallel dimensions created entirely through a paradox.

    Zephyr_Fate on
  • kurokazekurokaze Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Out of curiosity, is the 'Suikoden ripoff' comment based on anything except the fact that both games have a stupid amount of characters?

    I found the first few hours of Suikoden utterly dull and put it down, so I can't claim any real knowledge of it, but I certainly can't call any other similarities to mind.

    Seems a pretty silly comment if that's all there is behind it. Then again, I realized after saying that Cross shared many similarities to Xenogears that the only similarities between the two that I could actually call to mind was that they both had battle systems with seven 'moves' per turn with physical attacks taking one, two, or three of these; and that they both had convoluted plots that didn't entirely make sense unless you really paid attention. Oh, and I guess they both have Yasunori Mitsuda soundtracks, except that one of those soundtracks is fuckawesome and the other is... well, decidedly not fuckawesome, at least.


    I'm not sure why anyone would want to rip off the idea of having a stupid number of characters. I actually was about to buy a (bargain bin) game recently - a PS2 title I'd never heard of with Squenix and Tri-Ace logos on it - but the back of the box said it had 132 characters or some crap and that was detrimental enough that I went home and looked it up online first, and determined that I almost certainly would have hated it with a burning passion. What's the appeal of party members with two lines of character development?

    kurokaze on
    atehim.jpg
  • Zephyr_FateZephyr_Fate Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Uhhh... both Mitsuda soundtracks for Xenogears and Chrono Cross are nothing short of amazing.

    Oh and that game you almost bought was Radiata Stories. It's terrible.

    Zephyr_Fate on
  • unknownsome1unknownsome1 Registered User
    edited June 2009
    I got the DS version of the game probably back in December. Needless to say, it really kept me occupied in college.

    unknownsome1 on
  • BlackjackBlackjack Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Radiata Stories is about 5000 times better than Cross, at least.

    Blackjack on
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    3DS: 1607-3034-6970
  • exisexis Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Two weeks of holiday starting Saturday, and I have Chrono Trigger ready and waiting. If I make it through this will be the first JRPG I've ever played start to finish. Figured I'd at least try this before giving up on the genre entirely.

    exis on
  • WillisIVIIXWillisIVIIX Registered User
    edited June 2009
    DeathPrawn wrote: »
    And now we're hit with a 14 year old port that they want $40, because SE's stance is to milk their re-releases with small bonuses and charge full price for it instead of just doing a VC, XBLA, or PSN release. Although that isn't so with games that have a small interest to "enhance" or would just cost to much to port, see Secret of Mana VC and FFVII on PSN. It's sad really because doing it through digital means would make them a hell of a lot more money to dictate another game made with WiiWare XBLA and PSN in mind almost like FFIV's continutation.

    My issue with Square-Enix isn't that they charge full price. I'd be perfectly fine with S-E charging 'full price' for CTDS. My beef is the so-called "Square-Enix Tax". You can't reasonably charge ~$10 more than standard MSRP on a console ($30-35 for a normal DS game versus $40-45 for a S-E game) and then complain when you don't get the sales numbers you wanted.

    Ahh that's another case against them then. I forgot about the price gouge they like to put on. Seriously their marketing team needs shot and quartered otherwise their going to get cannibalized by another company, again.

    WillisIVIIX on
  • DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    kurokaze wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, is the 'Suikoden ripoff' comment based on anything except the fact that both games have a stupid amount of characters?

    I found the first few hours of Suikoden utterly dull and put it down, so I can't claim any real knowledge of it, but I certainly can't call any other similarities to mind.

    Seems a pretty silly comment if that's all there is behind it. Then again, I realized after saying that Cross shared many similarities to Xenogears that the only similarities between the two that I could actually call to mind was that they both had battle systems with seven 'moves' per turn with physical attacks taking one, two, or three of these; and that they both had convoluted plots that didn't entirely make sense unless you really paid attention. Oh, and I guess they both have Yasunori Mitsuda soundtracks, except that one of those soundtracks is fuckawesome and the other is... well, decidedly not fuckawesome, at least.


    I'm not sure why anyone would want to rip off the idea of having a stupid number of characters. I actually was about to buy a (bargain bin) game recently - a PS2 title I'd never heard of with Squenix and Tri-Ace logos on it - but the back of the box said it had 132 characters or some crap and that was detrimental enough that I went home and looked it up online first, and determined that I almost certainly would have hated it with a burning passion. What's the appeal of party members with two lines of character development?
    That's basically where the criticism lies - way too many characters. Personally I don't think Cross is all that similar to Suikoden, either thematically or in terms of gameplay.

    However, in Suikoden they usually have the good sense to develop a small handful of your main characters despite having dozens of relatively meaningless ones in the roster. Also, in the Suikoden games they actually have a use for all those extra people - the big battle sequences being one of them, and the many fights in-game where you have to use multiple six-person parties being another.

    In Cross the many characters were entirely pointless; we never use, or have need, for more than three at a time. The only reason they probably got away with it at all is because you lose the characters you've accumulated about a third of the way through the game and don't get them back until nearly the end. Most of the characters are lucky if they get half an hour or so of screen time; some of them probably don't get any more than ten. This was damaging to the script, as well; the dialogue was interchangeable depending on who was in your party, the only difference being the accents they displayed.

    I honestly have no idea why Square decided the game needed that many characters in it. It's like they decided that every NPC you interacted with should be able to join, or something.

    Duffel on
  • BlackjackBlackjack Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Duffel wrote: »
    kurokaze wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, is the 'Suikoden ripoff' comment based on anything except the fact that both games have a stupid amount of characters?

    I found the first few hours of Suikoden utterly dull and put it down, so I can't claim any real knowledge of it, but I certainly can't call any other similarities to mind.

    Seems a pretty silly comment if that's all there is behind it. Then again, I realized after saying that Cross shared many similarities to Xenogears that the only similarities between the two that I could actually call to mind was that they both had battle systems with seven 'moves' per turn with physical attacks taking one, two, or three of these; and that they both had convoluted plots that didn't entirely make sense unless you really paid attention. Oh, and I guess they both have Yasunori Mitsuda soundtracks, except that one of those soundtracks is fuckawesome and the other is... well, decidedly not fuckawesome, at least.


    I'm not sure why anyone would want to rip off the idea of having a stupid number of characters. I actually was about to buy a (bargain bin) game recently - a PS2 title I'd never heard of with Squenix and Tri-Ace logos on it - but the back of the box said it had 132 characters or some crap and that was detrimental enough that I went home and looked it up online first, and determined that I almost certainly would have hated it with a burning passion. What's the appeal of party members with two lines of character development?
    That's basically where the criticism lies - way too many characters. Personally I don't think Cross is all that similar to Suikoden, either thematically or in terms of gameplay.

    However, in Suikoden they usually have the good sense to develop a small handful of your main characters despite having dozens of relatively meaningless ones in the roster. Also, in the Suikoden games they actually have a use for all those extra people - the big battle sequences being one of them, and the many fights in-game where you have to use multiple six-person parties being another.

    In Cross the many characters were entirely pointless; we never use, or have need, for more than three at a time. The only reason they probably got away with it at all is because you lose the characters you've accumulated about a third of the way through the game and don't get them back until nearly the end. Most of the characters are lucky if they get half an hour or so of screen time; some of them probably don't get any more than ten. This was damaging to the script, as well; the dialogue was interchangeable depending on who was in your party, the only difference being the accents they displayed.

    I honestly have no idea why Square decided the game needed that many characters in it. It's like they decided that every NPC you interacted with should be able to join, or something.
    Another way in which Suikoden is better: the characters will actually say different things instead of talking with a wacky accent and trying to pass that off as a personality.

    Blackjack on
    camo_sig2.png

    3DS: 1607-3034-6970
  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Blackjack wrote: »
    Duffel wrote: »
    kurokaze wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, is the 'Suikoden ripoff' comment based on anything except the fact that both games have a stupid amount of characters?

    I found the first few hours of Suikoden utterly dull and put it down, so I can't claim any real knowledge of it, but I certainly can't call any other similarities to mind.

    Seems a pretty silly comment if that's all there is behind it. Then again, I realized after saying that Cross shared many similarities to Xenogears that the only similarities between the two that I could actually call to mind was that they both had battle systems with seven 'moves' per turn with physical attacks taking one, two, or three of these; and that they both had convoluted plots that didn't entirely make sense unless you really paid attention. Oh, and I guess they both have Yasunori Mitsuda soundtracks, except that one of those soundtracks is fuckawesome and the other is... well, decidedly not fuckawesome, at least.


    I'm not sure why anyone would want to rip off the idea of having a stupid number of characters. I actually was about to buy a (bargain bin) game recently - a PS2 title I'd never heard of with Squenix and Tri-Ace logos on it - but the back of the box said it had 132 characters or some crap and that was detrimental enough that I went home and looked it up online first, and determined that I almost certainly would have hated it with a burning passion. What's the appeal of party members with two lines of character development?
    That's basically where the criticism lies - way too many characters. Personally I don't think Cross is all that similar to Suikoden, either thematically or in terms of gameplay.

    However, in Suikoden they usually have the good sense to develop a small handful of your main characters despite having dozens of relatively meaningless ones in the roster. Also, in the Suikoden games they actually have a use for all those extra people - the big battle sequences being one of them, and the many fights in-game where you have to use multiple six-person parties being another.

    In Cross the many characters were entirely pointless; we never use, or have need, for more than three at a time. The only reason they probably got away with it at all is because you lose the characters you've accumulated about a third of the way through the game and don't get them back until nearly the end. Most of the characters are lucky if they get half an hour or so of screen time; some of them probably don't get any more than ten. This was damaging to the script, as well; the dialogue was interchangeable depending on who was in your party, the only difference being the accents they displayed.

    I honestly have no idea why Square decided the game needed that many characters in it. It's like they decided that every NPC you interacted with should be able to join, or something.
    Another way in which Suikoden is better: the characters will actually say different things instead of talking with a wacky accent and trying to pass that off as a personality.

    Arrr...wat you talkin' 'bout, Sergey?

    Nightslyr on
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    Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
  • kurokazekurokaze Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Blackjack wrote: »
    Another way in which Suikoden is better: the characters will actually say different things instead of talking with a wacky accent and trying to pass that off as a personality.

    I actually read something from someone who would likely know (heavily involved in the technical PSX aspects of fan translation) that Chrono Cross actually included a software function that would automatically add their silly accents to a generic line, rather than have each of the variants of the line be manually translated. It's as if they already knew their character cast was stupid and just accepted it and went on to make the rest of the game awesome.


    My opinion on Xenogears' soundtrack is very complex - I could write essays - but I can't see how it could be considered to be remotely on a quality level with Chrono Cross. Since it's off topic, I'll just say this: any views on the individual songs' quality are certainly subjective opinions. However, objectively, Xenogears' soundtrack was ridiculously short for a very long game, resulting in way, way too much repetition. Without making any judgements on the actual songs themselves, this alone disqualifies the soundtrack as a whole from fuckawesome status.

    I'd also like to observe a weirdness with the Chrono Cross soundtrack: the battle music. As a general rule, RPG battle music should be among the best tracks in the soundtrack, because you listen to it so often. Even beyond this, it should probably avoid at all costs any chance of getting repetitive or annoying, while trying to be catchy in a non-annoying way.

    Subjective, of course, but IMO the Chrono Cross battle music (Gale) is one of the weakest tracks on the soundtrack (we'll just pretend Magical Dreamers doesn't exist). It also gets annoying relatively fast.

    Trigger has its own battle music weirdness: some 'trash' battles use different music code than others, though they play the same song. There's a cheat floating around the internet that changes the battle music to another track on the soundtrack, but only some battles (a bit more than halfish). There's also a second 'trash' battle theme that is played nowhere in the game but appears on both the cartridge and the OST. This second theme is maybe a bit short and maybe lacks a bit of polish but it's awesome anyway. The original is merely serviceable (again, one of the weaker tracks on the soundtrack IMO). Adding the second theme through the cheat pretty much improves the game quite a bit and I really have to wonder why they didn't go ahead with two battle musics like they apparently planned at one point.

    kurokaze on
    atehim.jpg
  • DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    kurokaze wrote: »
    I actually read something from someone who would likely know (heavily involved in the technical PSX aspects of fan translation) that Chrono Cross actually included a software function that would automatically add their silly accents to a generic line, rather than have each of the variants of the line be manually translated. It's as if they already knew their character cast was stupid and just accepted it and went on to make the rest of the game awesome.


    My opinion on Xenogears' soundtrack is very complex - I could write essays - but I can't see how it could be considered to be remotely on a quality level with Chrono Cross. Since it's off topic, I'll just say this: any views on the individual songs' quality are certainly subjective opinions. However, objectively, Xenogears' soundtrack was ridiculously short for a very long game, resulting in way, way too much repetition. Without making any judgements on the actual songs themselves, this alone disqualifies the soundtrack as a whole from fuckawesome status.

    I'd also like to observe a weirdness with the Chrono Cross soundtrack: the battle music. As a general rule, RPG battle music should be among the best tracks in the soundtrack, because you listen to it so often. Even beyond this, it should probably avoid at all costs any chance of getting repetitive or annoying, while trying to be catchy in a non-annoying way.

    Subjective, of course, but IMO the Chrono Cross battle music (Gale) is one of the weakest tracks on the soundtrack (we'll just pretend Magical Dreamers doesn't exist). It also gets annoying relatively fast.

    Trigger has its own battle music weirdness: some 'trash' battles use different music code than others, though they play the same song. There's a cheat floating around the internet that changes the battle music to another track on the soundtrack, but only some battles (a bit more than halfish). There's also a second 'trash' battle theme that is played nowhere in the game but appears on both the cartridge and the OST. This second theme is maybe a bit short and maybe lacks a bit of polish but it's awesome anyway. The original is merely serviceable (again, one of the weaker tracks on the soundtrack IMO). Adding the second theme through the cheat pretty much improves the game quite a bit and I really have to wonder why they didn't go ahead with two battle musics like they apparently planned at one point.
    Weren't those alternate Trigger battle songs used in the demo or something?

    People keep raving about how great the soundtrack was for Cross but I honestly can't remember much about it. There was a few tracks I really liked - the one in the Dead Sea/Dead Dimension where time was stopped was nice and eerie, and the Chronopolis and Terra Tower themes were suitably apocalyptic. And I think both overworld/boat themes were pretty good. Other than that, though, I don't remember much about it. Of course, it's been several years since I played Cross on any kind of regular basis so that probably has something to do with it.

    Duffel on
  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Duffel wrote: »
    kurokaze wrote: »
    I actually read something from someone who would likely know (heavily involved in the technical PSX aspects of fan translation) that Chrono Cross actually included a software function that would automatically add their silly accents to a generic line, rather than have each of the variants of the line be manually translated. It's as if they already knew their character cast was stupid and just accepted it and went on to make the rest of the game awesome.


    My opinion on Xenogears' soundtrack is very complex - I could write essays - but I can't see how it could be considered to be remotely on a quality level with Chrono Cross. Since it's off topic, I'll just say this: any views on the individual songs' quality are certainly subjective opinions. However, objectively, Xenogears' soundtrack was ridiculously short for a very long game, resulting in way, way too much repetition. Without making any judgements on the actual songs themselves, this alone disqualifies the soundtrack as a whole from fuckawesome status.

    I'd also like to observe a weirdness with the Chrono Cross soundtrack: the battle music. As a general rule, RPG battle music should be among the best tracks in the soundtrack, because you listen to it so often. Even beyond this, it should probably avoid at all costs any chance of getting repetitive or annoying, while trying to be catchy in a non-annoying way.

    Subjective, of course, but IMO the Chrono Cross battle music (Gale) is one of the weakest tracks on the soundtrack (we'll just pretend Magical Dreamers doesn't exist). It also gets annoying relatively fast.

    Trigger has its own battle music weirdness: some 'trash' battles use different music code than others, though they play the same song. There's a cheat floating around the internet that changes the battle music to another track on the soundtrack, but only some battles (a bit more than halfish). There's also a second 'trash' battle theme that is played nowhere in the game but appears on both the cartridge and the OST. This second theme is maybe a bit short and maybe lacks a bit of polish but it's awesome anyway. The original is merely serviceable (again, one of the weaker tracks on the soundtrack IMO). Adding the second theme through the cheat pretty much improves the game quite a bit and I really have to wonder why they didn't go ahead with two battle musics like they apparently planned at one point.
    Weren't those alternate Trigger battle songs used in the demo or something?

    People keep raving about how great the soundtrack was for Cross but I honestly can't remember much about it. There was a few tracks I really liked - the one in the Dead Sea/Dead Dimension where time was stopped was nice and eerie, and the Chronopolis and Terra Tower themes were suitably apocalyptic. And I think both overworld/boat themes were pretty good. Other than that, though, I don't remember much about it. Of course, it's been several years since I played Cross on any kind of regular basis so that probably has something to do with it.

    http://bluelaguna.net/music/cc/mp3s.php

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  • Zephyr_FateZephyr_Fate Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    Blackjack wrote: »
    Radiata Stories is about 5000 times better than Cross, at least.

    No.

    Zephyr_Fate on
  • BlackjackBlackjack Registered User regular
    edited June 2009
    If you say so, Chief.

    Blackjack on
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  • kurokazekurokaze Registered User
    edited June 2009
    Duffel wrote: »
    People keep raving about how great the soundtrack was for Cross but I honestly can't remember much about it. There was a few tracks I really liked - the one in the Dead Sea/Dead Dimension where time was stopped was nice and eerie, and the Chronopolis and Terra Tower themes were suitably apocalyptic. And I think both overworld/boat themes were pretty good. Other than that, though, I don't remember much about it. Of course, it's been several years since I played Cross on any kind of regular basis so that probably has something to do with it.

    I suppose the style of song isn't as memorable and catchy as Uematsu's work, or Mega Man, or Castlevania, or a few other top tier soundtracks. It is, however, consistently very good (as long as we properly accept that some segments of the game, particularly ones involving Sneff and/or Nikki, do not actually exist and are merely shared nightmares, and their soundtrack counterparts likewise - a similar counterpart is the You're Not Alone segment and song that isn't in Final Fantasy IX) and contains many songs that stand out on their own (both overworlds and boat themes, at least half of the dungeons) plus many moments where the music just was perfect and perfectly awesome (the battle with Miguel is the most prominent IMO).

    To top it off, almost every single song is pretty much excellent when listened to on its own from the OST outside of the game, including a metric fuckton of 'sad' or 'emotional' pieces that don't really stick out during the game but are among the best of their type when compared outside.

    And finally, it's one of the best soundtracks that I've heard on the PSX technically; it appears to (like most PSX soundtracks) be a MIDI variant since it has been directly ripped as .psf, but most of it sounds as good as most real recordings. For me, this is one of the largest things that pushes it beyond games with perhaps better-composed soundtracks (including Trigger). SNES and earlier PSX music just has that 'this is from a game' sound that keeps it from attaining pure beauty.

    Edit: Oh man I forgot about the songs that were in the FMVs and so weren't in the .psf soundtrack I have but are on the link above. Man that shit is good. Too bad the rips are pretty iffy.

    kurokaze on
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  • BrianBrian Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    http://www.gametrailers.com/player/52400.html

    Looks like a full Orchestral Chrono Trigger soundtrack coming our way. Fuckin sweet.

    Brian on
  • ZerokkuZerokku Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Nice! I don't tend to buy standard OST's, but remakes and mixes are some of my favorite albums to get. Hell, Chrono Trigger: Brink of Time was one of the first gaming-music related CD's I bought. I love seeing music like this get redone in any form, especially rock and orchestral though.

    Zerokku on
  • BurtletoyBurtletoy Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I've never actually played this. As a kid I grew up with a friend that had a SNES and we used to play all the RPG's togther, me normally watching him play through them mostly.

    I ended up buying this for SNES off eBay this weekend, along with FFIII and Earthbound (didn't get Supper Mario RPG...yet)

    So this might be the wrong place to ask, but, which one should I start first G&T? I'm much more familar with the other three games than this one as I played all of them much more than this Chrono Trigger, which was the reason I didn't start Chrono last night.

    Burtletoy on
  • ZerokkuZerokku Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    If you've never played this, but have played the others, then play this first.

    Zerokku on
  • MindLibMindLib Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I've never actually played this. As a kid I grew up with a friend that had a SNES and we used to play all the RPG's togther, me normally watching him play through them mostly.

    I ended up buying this for SNES off eBay this weekend, along with FFIII and Earthbound (didn't get Supper Mario RPG...yet)

    So this might be the wrong place to ask, but, which one should I start first G&T? I'm much more familar with the other three games than this one as I played all of them much more than this Chrono Trigger, which was the reason I didn't start Chrono last night.

    Earthbound, definitely should be a first play. It's an easier and simpler game to get into, somewhat shorter, and I think once you start either FFIII or CT you won't want to play anything else but those games for some time.

    *oh yeah, if you've played the others, fuck em. Chrono Trigger puts me into a state of awe.

    MindLib on
  • BurtletoyBurtletoy Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Zerokku wrote: »
    If you've never played this, but have played the others, then play this first.

    The problem being that the only ones I played all of were Super Mario RPG (which I can hardly remember) and Earthbound, which I adore and am fine playing through again.

    Burtletoy on
  • HeartlashHeartlash Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    kurokaze wrote: »
    Duffel wrote: »
    People keep raving about how great the soundtrack was for Cross but I honestly can't remember much about it. There was a few tracks I really liked - the one in the Dead Sea/Dead Dimension where time was stopped was nice and eerie, and the Chronopolis and Terra Tower themes were suitably apocalyptic. And I think both overworld/boat themes were pretty good. Other than that, though, I don't remember much about it. Of course, it's been several years since I played Cross on any kind of regular basis so that probably has something to do with it.

    I suppose the style of song isn't as memorable and catchy as Uematsu's work, or Mega Man, or Castlevania, or a few other top tier soundtracks. It is, however, consistently very good (as long as we properly accept that some segments of the game, particularly ones involving Sneff and/or Nikki, do not actually exist and are merely shared nightmares, and their soundtrack counterparts likewise - a similar counterpart is the You're Not Alone segment and song that isn't in Final Fantasy IX) and contains many songs that stand out on their own (both overworlds and boat themes, at least half of the dungeons) plus many moments where the music just was perfect and perfectly awesome (the battle with Miguel is the most prominent IMO).

    To top it off, almost every single song is pretty much excellent when listened to on its own from the OST outside of the game, including a metric fuckton of 'sad' or 'emotional' pieces that don't really stick out during the game but are among the best of their type when compared outside.

    And finally, it's one of the best soundtracks that I've heard on the PSX technically; it appears to (like most PSX soundtracks) be a MIDI variant since it has been directly ripped as .psf, but most of it sounds as good as most real recordings. For me, this is one of the largest things that pushes it beyond games with perhaps better-composed soundtracks (including Trigger). SNES and earlier PSX music just has that 'this is from a game' sound that keeps it from attaining pure beauty.

    Edit: Oh man I forgot about the songs that were in the FMVs and so weren't in the .psf soundtrack I have but are on the link above. Man that shit is good. Too bad the rips are pretty iffy.

    And let's not forget how awesome the music made one particular boss fight:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbEoTownSrA

    Seriously, they could've ended the game after that song and I would've been happy.

    Heartlash on
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  • NickTheNewbieNickTheNewbie Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Brian wrote: »
    http://www.gametrailers.com/player/52400.html

    Looks like a full Orchestral Chrono Trigger soundtrack coming our way. Fuckin sweet.

    It's actually just a reprint of the snes sountrack. The orchestra stuff is just the main theme, and a medley, on an extra dvd.

    NickTheNewbie on
  • ZerokkuZerokku Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Burtletoy wrote: »
    Zerokku wrote: »
    If you've never played this, but have played the others, then play this first.

    The problem being that the only ones I played all of were Super Mario RPG (which I can hardly remember) and Earthbound, which I adore and am fine playing through again.

    Still play through chrono trigger first :P

    Zerokku on
  • BrianBrian Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    It's actually just a reprint of the snes sountrack. The orchestra stuff is just the main theme, and a medley, on an extra dvd.

    Ah fuckers. Guess we can't expect the Actraiser treatment for everything.

    Brian on
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Chantry of NightmaresRegistered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Heartlash wrote: »
    kurokaze wrote: »
    Duffel wrote: »
    People keep raving about how great the soundtrack was for Cross but I honestly can't remember much about it. There was a few tracks I really liked - the one in the Dead Sea/Dead Dimension where time was stopped was nice and eerie, and the Chronopolis and Terra Tower themes were suitably apocalyptic. And I think both overworld/boat themes were pretty good. Other than that, though, I don't remember much about it. Of course, it's been several years since I played Cross on any kind of regular basis so that probably has something to do with it.

    I suppose the style of song isn't as memorable and catchy as Uematsu's work, or Mega Man, or Castlevania, or a few other top tier soundtracks. It is, however, consistently very good (as long as we properly accept that some segments of the game, particularly ones involving Sneff and/or Nikki, do not actually exist and are merely shared nightmares, and their soundtrack counterparts likewise - a similar counterpart is the You're Not Alone segment and song that isn't in Final Fantasy IX) and contains many songs that stand out on their own (both overworlds and boat themes, at least half of the dungeons) plus many moments where the music just was perfect and perfectly awesome (the battle with Miguel is the most prominent IMO).

    To top it off, almost every single song is pretty much excellent when listened to on its own from the OST outside of the game, including a metric fuckton of 'sad' or 'emotional' pieces that don't really stick out during the game but are among the best of their type when compared outside.

    And finally, it's one of the best soundtracks that I've heard on the PSX technically; it appears to (like most PSX soundtracks) be a MIDI variant since it has been directly ripped as .psf, but most of it sounds as good as most real recordings. For me, this is one of the largest things that pushes it beyond games with perhaps better-composed soundtracks (including Trigger). SNES and earlier PSX music just has that 'this is from a game' sound that keeps it from attaining pure beauty.

    Edit: Oh man I forgot about the songs that were in the FMVs and so weren't in the .psf soundtrack I have but are on the link above. Man that shit is good. Too bad the rips are pretty iffy.

    And let's not forget how awesome the music made one particular boss fight:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbEoTownSrA

    Seriously, they could've ended the game after that song and I would've been happy.

    Shame the real final battle's BGM was nowhere near as good.

    cj iwakura on
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  • SeptusSeptus Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Septus on
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  • Zephyr_FateZephyr_Fate Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Dilemma, the track that plays when you're doing the monster battles in Janice's arena, is an amazing track too.

    Also, Time's Scar is the best VGM ever made.

    Zephyr_Fate on
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