My point is this: The rules define the rules. Enforcement doesn't define anything. Ignore the enforcement, follow the rules, and you'll have nothing to complain about.
And Branduil, if you really think a rule against posting in a thread that is obvious spam is such a horrible thing, then I don't know what to tell you. If you really just have a problem with the enforcement of this rule, then please see above. Enforcement isn't something you should ever worry about, because it has nothing to do with the rules. The rules are there to be followed, period. A track record of enforcement doesn't define the "actual rules" and frankly I prefer inconsistent moderation. It usually scares the uppity vaginas into acting in accordance with said rules, fearing that the hammer "might" come down upon them.
It would be nice if people could respect and follow the rules for their inherent value toward fixing an ailment in this community but of course that's not how it works here, huh?
I guess I'm one of those that's not getting the drama on this one
1.) Why would you want to post in a spammer thread? Why would somebody choose to post in a thread that is 100% sure to get locked, as there are no comments that can really be made on the topic? It's one thing in SE, as you can always try to make a witty bon mot (or cock joke), but in an on-topic forum there is no room for a reply, as the forum is for games and technology, and the spam threads don't allow for comments on either that are on topic.
2.) Why would it matter how it gets enforced if you don't post in it? I mean, if you know that posting in there carries anywhere from a certainty of jailing to a high possibility of jailing, why would it matter which it is? If you're stupid enough to post in one, then you're welcome to take your chances.
My point is this: The rules define the rules. Enforcement doesn't define anything. Ignore the enforcement, follow the rules, and you'll have nothing to complain about.
And Branduil, if you really think a rule against posting in a thread that is obvious spam is such a horrible thing, then I don't know what to tell you. If you really just have a problem with the enforcement of this rule, then please see above. Enforcement isn't something you should ever worry about, because it has nothing to do with the rules. The rules are there to be followed, period. A track record of enforcement doesn't define the "actual rules" and frankly I prefer inconsistent moderation. It usually scares the uppity vaginas into acting in accordance with said rules, fearing that the hammer "might" come down upon them.
It would be nice if people could respect and follow the rules for their inherent value toward fixing an ailment in this community but of course that's not how it works here, huh?
that is not how things work.
When exceptions are made by people in authority towards one person or group of people, and there is no defining difference between that person/group of people and the rest of the community, the community will take that as a sign that the exception is universal.
That's simply how communities function, and it is completely logical.
Lanz on
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited November 2006
I am with a duck and Drez on this one. You have been told don't do it, and so you should not do it.
If a mod tells you not to put your hand on the burner of an electric stove, because it might be turned on, are you going to turn around and put your hand on the burner of an electric stove because it might be turned off?
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
My point is this: The rules define the rules. Enforcement doesn't define anything. Ignore the enforcement, follow the rules, and you'll have nothing to complain about.
And Branduil, if you really think a rule against posting in a thread that is obvious spam is such a horrible thing, then I don't know what to tell you. If you really just have a problem with the enforcement of this rule, then please see above. Enforcement isn't something you should ever worry about, because it has nothing to do with the rules. The rules are there to be followed, period. A track record of enforcement doesn't define the "actual rules" and frankly I prefer inconsistent moderation. It usually scares the uppity vaginas into acting in accordance with said rules, fearing that the hammer "might" come down upon them.
It would be nice if people could respect and follow the rules for their inherent value toward fixing an ailment in this community but of course that's not how it works here, huh?
that is not how things work.
When exceptions are made by people in authority towards one person or group of people, and there is no defining difference between that person/group of people and the rest of the community, the community will take that as a sign that the exception is universal.
That's simply how communities function, and it is completely logical.
Wow. That's just...very, very wrong. It is not logical and it is not how communities function. Or maybe how stupid communities function.
Take two different bars. Both have poker tables in the basement for illegal gambling. One bar and its patrons get busted twice within a year and a half while the other is scott free. Six months after the second bust, the third bar gets busted.
They are close enough to each other and off-duty cops drink at both and there is no reason to believe that the cops were oblivious to either bar for all two years.
You're saying that the third bar and its patrons would have a legitimate gripe because the law was being inconsistently enforced there?
I've seen cops look the other way or give someone a warning (which is what a jailing is, mind you) for speeding or smoking weed or drinking in public and turn around and give someone else a ticket for the same thing. The law is the law and rules are rules regardless of enforcement.
Communities do not ever function on complete 100% enforcement of the law. Maybe shitty places I'd never live, like Iraq or China, do. But not good communities.
I think another thing to remember is that oftentimes new policies can be as much trouble for mods to adapt to as forumers. I remember times when there were changes in policy and some mods (oftentimes Loser) just plain did not follow them, which isn't always a bad thing. Just give it time to shake out and stop being reactionary.
I think another thing to remember is that oftentimes new policies can be as much trouble for mods to adapt to as forumers. I remember times when there were changes in policy and some mods (oftentimes Loser) just plain did not follow them, which isn't always a bad thing. Just give it time to shake out and stop being reactionary.
Man, how has this turned into a big fucking argument.
Spam threads do not serve a purpose. Posting in them does not serve a purpose.
What is the problem? Why would you want to post in there? Seriously, why are we giving our Mods shit over this? I hate to break it to you but every single joke in those fucking threads is not funny. Period. They are just incredibly fucking stupid. Don't post in the threads and our problem is solved.
Talonrazor on
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
I think another thing to remember is that oftentimes new policies can be as much trouble for mods to adapt to as forumers. I remember times when there were changes in policy and some mods (oftentimes Loser) just plain did not follow them, which isn't always a bad thing. Just give it time to shake out and stop being reactionary.
I think I am in love with you.
And my awesome stove analogy gets no recognition. I am hurt.
Or was that a metaphor?
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I think another thing to remember is that oftentimes new policies can be as much trouble for mods to adapt to as forumers. I remember times when there were changes in policy and some mods (oftentimes Loser) just plain did not follow them, which isn't always a bad thing. Just give it time to shake out and stop being reactionary.
I think I am in love with you.
And my awesome stove analogy gets no recognition. I am hurt.
Or was that a metaphor?
Man, fuck stoves.
Vikings are cooler.
Talonrazor on
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
I think another thing to remember is that oftentimes new policies can be as much trouble for mods to adapt to as forumers. I remember times when there were changes in policy and some mods (oftentimes Loser) just plain did not follow them, which isn't always a bad thing. Just give it time to shake out and stop being reactionary.
I think I am in love with you.
And my awesome stove analogy gets no recognition. I am hurt.
Or was that a metaphor?
Man, fuck stoves.
Vikings are cooler.
I believe the viking thing was already addressed though. Too many exceptions to be a good analogy.
Or was that a metaphor?
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
My point is this: The rules define the rules. Enforcement doesn't define anything. Ignore the enforcement, follow the rules, and you'll have nothing to complain about.
And Branduil, if you really think a rule against posting in a thread that is obvious spam is such a horrible thing, then I don't know what to tell you. If you really just have a problem with the enforcement of this rule, then please see above. Enforcement isn't something you should ever worry about, because it has nothing to do with the rules. The rules are there to be followed, period. A track record of enforcement doesn't define the "actual rules" and frankly I prefer inconsistent moderation. It usually scares the uppity vaginas into acting in accordance with said rules, fearing that the hammer "might" come down upon them.
It would be nice if people could respect and follow the rules for their inherent value toward fixing an ailment in this community but of course that's not how it works here, huh?
that is not how things work.
When exceptions are made by people in authority towards one person or group of people, and there is no defining difference between that person/group of people and the rest of the community, the community will take that as a sign that the exception is universal.
That's simply how communities function, and it is completely logical.
Wow. That's just...very, very wrong. It is not logical and it is not how communities function. Or maybe how stupid communities function.
Take two different bars. Both have poker tables in the basement for illegal gambling. One bar and its patrons get busted twice within a year and a half while the other is scott free. Six months after the second bust, the third bar gets busted.
They are close enough to each other and off-duty cops drink at both and there is no reason to believe that the cops were oblivious to either bar for all two years.
You're saying that the third bar and its patrons would have a legitimate gripe because the law was being inconsistently enforced there?
I've seen cops look the other way or give someone a warning (which is what a jailing is, mind you) for speeding or smoking weed or drinking in public and turn around and give someone else a ticket for the same thing. The law is the law and rules are rules regardless of enforcement.
Communities do not ever function on complete 100% enforcement of the law. Maybe shitty places I'd never live, like Iraq or China, do. But not good communities.
I'd say given your scenario that those were some crappy cops for not enforcing the law when they could have and should have (since, you know, they job of a police officer is law enforcement).
Well, if you guys want, I'll just start going through the spam threads in the trashcan, jailing everyone I don't recognize, and banning everyone I do (since, y'know, the regulars should know better). I mean, I can do it a few times a day, and do it totally uniformly.
I'd say given your scenario that those were some crappy cops for not enforcing the law when they could have and should have (since, you know, they job of a police officer is law enforcement).
The next time you get pulled over, you need to tell the cop "hey, listen, I was doing 83 in a 65, and that's what you need to write me a ticket for. I insist."
Thanatos on
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
Well, if you guys want, I'll just start going through the spam threads in the trashcan, jailing everyone I don't recognize, and banning everyone I do (since, y'know, the regulars should know better). I mean, I can do it a few times a day, and do it totally uniformly.
Would that make you all happy?
Evidently it would make Lanz happy, so if you see his name in there feel free to ban away!
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Well, if you guys want, I'll just start going through the spam threads in the trashcan, jailing everyone I don't recognize, and banning everyone I do (since, y'know, the regulars should know better). I mean, I can do it a few times a day, and do it totally uniformly.
I'd say given your scenario that those were some crappy cops for not enforcing the law when they could have and should have (since, you know, they job of a police officer is law enforcement).
Man dude, as a guy going into law enforcement and actually BEING a cop, I can say that is a really shitty attitude. If we laid the smackdown on every jay walker, we would really suck as cops.
I'd say given your scenario that those were some crappy cops for not enforcing the law when they could have and should have (since, you know, they job of a police officer is law enforcement).
Man dude, as a guy going into law enforcement and actually BEING a cop, I can say that is a really shitty attitude. If we laid the smackdown on every jay walker, we would really suck as cops.
I'd say there's a difference between J-Walking and Running illegal gambling.
I'll go on record as stating that I was arguing on Drez's terrible metaphor for the situation.
Hey guys I heard that we were starting some meaningless forum drama over nothing of great importance that can only lead to disaster and decided to pop in for a moment.
The splinter forum wasn't made to comment on what happens here, Drez. That just happens to occur a lot there. The place was basically just made so that we could continue having a chat thread.
Come on, Lanz. You can say those things over here if you want.
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Or "Drez awkwardly tries to confront people without using their names" forum.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
A) That wasn't what it was made for and you know it. Please, tell me how on earth I'm being illogical. There is, quite frankly, no logical excuse for there not to be a unified stance on how to handle the breaking of a rule. This is not to say I demand mods to be omnipotent and know every infraction, no, I simply expect all of them to be handled in the same way. A rule is, as you said, a rule, but varying styles of handling that rule (in this case, some people are jailed, others not) is only asking for people to question that rule and breed contempt for the situation.
Come on, Lanz. You can say those things over here if you want.
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Or "Drez awkwardly tries to confront people without using their names" forum.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
Drez, take a class on logic before talking about it. Because I have, and I know everything you have said to be logical or illogical is complete bull. All you've ever done on this forum is troll. Everytime you post you manage to start an arguement. Why you're still here is beyond me.
Come on, Lanz. You can say those things over here if you want.
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Or "Drez awkwardly tries to confront people without using their names" forum.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
A) That wasn't what it was made for and you know it. Please, tell me how on earth I'm being illogical. There is, quite frankly, no logical excuse for there not to be a unified stance on how to handle the breaking of a rule. This is not to say I demand mods to be omnipotent and know every infraction, no, I simply expect all of them to be handled in the same way. A rule is, as you said, a rule, but varying styles of handling that rule (in this case, some people are jailed, others not) is only asking for people to question that rule and breed contempt for the situation.
I think it works fine. Just like how some cops will let you off with a warning for speeding, while another cop will have the ticket prepped and ready to go.
Come on, Lanz. You can say those things over here if you want.
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Or "Drez awkwardly tries to confront people without using their names" forum.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
A) That wasn't what it was made for and you know it. Please, tell me how on earth I'm being illogical. There is, quite frankly, no logical excuse for there not to be a unified stance on how to handle the breaking of a rule. This is not to say I demand mods to be omnipotent and know every infraction, no, I simply expect all of them to be handled in the same way. A rule is, as you said, a rule, but varying styles of handling that rule (in this case, some people are jailed, others not) is only asking for people to question that rule and breed contempt for the situation.
A) I don't know or care. I wasn't involved in the creation of the forum and have no desire to post there or read it, ever, so you can go tell the folks there that I won't rain on their little parade if you like. I've checked it twice because people have brought it up twice, and it really just comes off as a very spite-filled forum, particularly if you search for certain names - Drez, Uriel, CT, Duck, Whippy, TFS...30+ pages of hatred for some people...really. The chat threads seem to oscillate evenly between random topics and complaining about mods, specific forumers, and specific threads on PA. But, whatever, I don't care...you guys can go talk about whatever you want. It's just amusing.
You are being illogical because you are not thinking within the realm of logic. Hence, illogical. "but varying styles of handling that rule (in this case, some people are jailed, others not) is only asking for people to question that rule and breed contempt for the situation" you keep restating this very ugly and silly observation as if it is some sort of universal truth (it isn't). Adults recognize that rules are rules and try to live by them for the peaceful continuation of a community. The enforcement is completely unimportant.
Not to mention that "jailing" here is little more than a slap on the wrist. I would go so far as to say that jailing shouldn't even be considered enforcement of a rule, only banning is, so the rule is actually being enforced consistently - other than the spammers themselves, I don't think anyone was outright banned just for posting in a spam thread (I think two or three people were banned as a result, but only because of actions surrounding it or prior infractions).
Jailing is just a warning. And warning certain people acts toward warning others, by display, so I think it's doing its job.
Drez on
Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
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Favlaudjust straight up awfulRegistered Userregular
Come on, Lanz. You can say those things over here if you want.
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Or "Drez awkwardly tries to confront people without using their names" forum.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
Drez, take a class on logic before talking about it. Because I have, and I know everything you have said to be logical or illogical is complete bull. All you've ever done on this forum is troll. Everytime you post you manage to start an arguement. Why are you still here?
Perhaps the same could be said of all splinter forumers
Come on, Lanz. You can say those things over here if you want.
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Or "Drez awkwardly tries to confront people without using their names" forum.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
Drez, take a class on logic before talking about it. Because I have, and I know everything you have said to be logical or illogical is complete bull. All you've ever done on this forum is troll. Everytime you post you manage to start an arguement. Why you're still here is beyond me.
Posts
And Branduil, if you really think a rule against posting in a thread that is obvious spam is such a horrible thing, then I don't know what to tell you. If you really just have a problem with the enforcement of this rule, then please see above. Enforcement isn't something you should ever worry about, because it has nothing to do with the rules. The rules are there to be followed, period. A track record of enforcement doesn't define the "actual rules" and frankly I prefer inconsistent moderation. It usually scares the uppity vaginas into acting in accordance with said rules, fearing that the hammer "might" come down upon them.
It would be nice if people could respect and follow the rules for their inherent value toward fixing an ailment in this community but of course that's not how it works here, huh?
1.) Why would you want to post in a spammer thread? Why would somebody choose to post in a thread that is 100% sure to get locked, as there are no comments that can really be made on the topic? It's one thing in SE, as you can always try to make a witty bon mot (or cock joke), but in an on-topic forum there is no room for a reply, as the forum is for games and technology, and the spam threads don't allow for comments on either that are on topic.
2.) Why would it matter how it gets enforced if you don't post in it? I mean, if you know that posting in there carries anywhere from a certainty of jailing to a high possibility of jailing, why would it matter which it is? If you're stupid enough to post in one, then you're welcome to take your chances.
that is not how things work.
When exceptions are made by people in authority towards one person or group of people, and there is no defining difference between that person/group of people and the rest of the community, the community will take that as a sign that the exception is universal.
That's simply how communities function, and it is completely logical.
If a mod tells you not to put your hand on the burner of an electric stove, because it might be turned on, are you going to turn around and put your hand on the burner of an electric stove because it might be turned off?
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Wow. That's just...very, very wrong. It is not logical and it is not how communities function. Or maybe how stupid communities function.
Take two different bars. Both have poker tables in the basement for illegal gambling. One bar and its patrons get busted twice within a year and a half while the other is scott free. Six months after the second bust, the third bar gets busted.
They are close enough to each other and off-duty cops drink at both and there is no reason to believe that the cops were oblivious to either bar for all two years.
You're saying that the third bar and its patrons would have a legitimate gripe because the law was being inconsistently enforced there?
I've seen cops look the other way or give someone a warning (which is what a jailing is, mind you) for speeding or smoking weed or drinking in public and turn around and give someone else a ticket for the same thing. The law is the law and rules are rules regardless of enforcement.
Communities do not ever function on complete 100% enforcement of the law. Maybe shitty places I'd never live, like Iraq or China, do. But not good communities.
I think I am in love with you.
Spam threads do not serve a purpose. Posting in them does not serve a purpose.
What is the problem? Why would you want to post in there? Seriously, why are we giving our Mods shit over this? I hate to break it to you but every single joke in those fucking threads is not funny. Period. They are just incredibly fucking stupid. Don't post in the threads and our problem is solved.
And my awesome stove analogy gets no recognition. I am hurt.
Or was that a metaphor?
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Man, fuck stoves.
Vikings are cooler.
I believe the viking thing was already addressed though. Too many exceptions to be a good analogy.
Or was that a metaphor?
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I'd say given your scenario that those were some crappy cops for not enforcing the law when they could have and should have (since, you know, they job of a police officer is law enforcement).
Would that make you all happy?
Evidently it would make Lanz happy, so if you see his name in there feel free to ban away!
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
We could call it "The Purge: Thanatos' Crusade"
or we can take it to PM and not get off the subject at hand.
Up to you. I just find the stuff you guys write about me to be hilarious.
Man dude, as a guy going into law enforcement and actually BEING a cop, I can say that is a really shitty attitude. If we laid the smackdown on every jay walker, we would really suck as cops.
I'd say there's a difference between J-Walking and Running illegal gambling.
I'll go on record as stating that I was arguing on Drez's terrible metaphor for the situation.
God, are they up to it again? They have an infatuation with us, don't they.
Heh, I just did a quick egosearch over there.
Right, because making splinter forums to comment about what happens on this forum is such a bold way of confronting me, isn't it?
It really doesn't surprise me that the people arguing illogical nonsense in this thread post over there too.
I've got some great hot chocolate.
Wait.
I have to click it again.
Bye, fuckers.
A) That wasn't what it was made for and you know it.
Drez, take a class on logic before talking about it. Because I have, and I know everything you have said to be logical or illogical is complete bull. All you've ever done on this forum is troll. Everytime you post you manage to start an arguement. Why you're still here is beyond me.
I think it works fine. Just like how some cops will let you off with a warning for speeding, while another cop will have the ticket prepped and ready to go.
He means the people on the treehouse forums are trolls and start arguements.
If they have, I haven't seen it.
I mean, some of them are, but that could be said of all forumers period.
A) I don't know or care. I wasn't involved in the creation of the forum and have no desire to post there or read it, ever, so you can go tell the folks there that I won't rain on their little parade if you like. I've checked it twice because people have brought it up twice, and it really just comes off as a very spite-filled forum, particularly if you search for certain names - Drez, Uriel, CT, Duck, Whippy, TFS...30+ pages of hatred for some people...really. The chat threads seem to oscillate evenly between random topics and complaining about mods, specific forumers, and specific threads on PA. But, whatever, I don't care...you guys can go talk about whatever you want. It's just amusing.
Not to mention that "jailing" here is little more than a slap on the wrist. I would go so far as to say that jailing shouldn't even be considered enforcement of a rule, only banning is, so the rule is actually being enforced consistently - other than the spammers themselves, I don't think anyone was outright banned just for posting in a spam thread (I think two or three people were banned as a result, but only because of actions surrounding it or prior infractions).
Jailing is just a warning. And warning certain people acts toward warning others, by display, so I think it's doing its job.
Mankind ill-needs discussion boards like you!
:arrow:
Gah.
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