Considering the original RDR was purposely set at the veeeeeeeeery end of the days of the Old West, I'd prepare for disappointment.
Possibly. But on the other hand, you could make a Red Dead game set in a lot of different eras. "Western" is as much a stylistic and tonal choice as it is a chronological setting.
One of my pipe dreams has always been that they would make a "Red Dead" game set in the gangsters-and-G-men era of the depression, with the old-school automobiles and what have you. Or they could even go full-blown modern a la Cormac McCarthy/No Country For Old Men. Not that I think they're doing that with this release, but it's an interesting hypothetical.
i'd much prefer that they keep the series in the Old West, if only because there's a complete lack of games set in that time period. RDR was set towards the end of the era, but there's still a lot of ground they could cover in the setting.
Oh, on an R* release schedule I don't disagree. Like I said, pipe dream.
On an Ubisoft release schedule there's a lot of interesting things they could do with an IP like Red Dead. It's the sort of thing I think it'd be fun to fund anonymously if I won the powerball.
If RDR 2 is the story of Dutch's gang, it's entirely possible that Marston would be an incredibly minor background character. I don't think people need to assume that Rockstar is going to George Lucas that shit. They're pretty smart.
Considering the original RDR was purposely set at the veeeeeeeeery end of the days of the Old West, I'd prepare for disappointment.
Possibly. But on the other hand, you could make a Red Dead game set in a lot of different eras. "Western" is as much a stylistic and tonal choice as it is a chronological setting.
One of my pipe dreams has always been that they would make a "Red Dead" game set in the gangsters-and-G-men era of the depression, with the old-school automobiles and what have you. Or they could even go full-blown modern a la Cormac McCarthy/No Country For Old Men. Not that I think they're doing that with this release, but it's an interesting hypothetical.
i'd much prefer that they keep the series in the Old West, if only because there's a complete lack of games set in that time period. RDR was set towards the end of the era, but there's still a lot of ground they could cover in the setting.
Oh, on an R* release schedule I don't disagree. Like I said, pipe dream.
On an Ubisoft release schedule there's a lot of interesting things they could do with an IP like Red Dead. It's the sort of thing I think it'd be fun to fund anonymously if I won the powerball.
yeah, well there's almost nothing* that Ubisoft can't/wont drive into the ground. but still, while you can do a (quasi-)Western in other time periods, it can also be difficult to pull off. for example it would be really easy for a 20s set gangser/G-men game to just become another gangster/mafia type game. so for me, i think its best to just stick to the Old West for Westerns. at least until there's more of them, and developers have a better idea of what makes a Western game and can then translate that into other time periods and settings.
of course, if someone wants to take a crack at a modern or even 20th Century Western, i'm not going to complain.
*their latest BG&E tease better lead to something or so fucking help me God.
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DemonStaceyTTODewback's DaughterIn love with the TaySwayRegistered Userregular
Come to think of it, there's veeeeeeery little overlap in the characters from the GTA games, is there? I doubt RDR2 will get Lucas'd.
It depends on how you look at it. There is almost no continuity in the GTA series from generation to generation, but within those generations there was a shitload of overlap. So, the PS2 games (GTA3, Vice City, San Andreas) had lots of overlapping characters, as did the GTA4 games and GTA5. But the protagonists and overall story were different from game to game.
Red Dead has a much smaller reference pool (only 2 games), so it's harder to notice a pattern. There were tiny references in Redemption to events that happened in Revolver, but they were very obscure and only the sort of thing you'd notice if you were OCD or spent a lot of time reading the wiki. For the most part Redemption was entirely its own story with no overlap at all with its predecessor, other than a pack of DLC multiplayer skins.
I'm personally not expecting the plot or protag to have anything to do with Marston/Dutch until I hear otherwise (which may be about 48 hours from now). By the time RDR2 comes out, Redemption will be nearly 8 years old. We know the ending of the story, and we know everything we really need to know about how it began. I'm sure they can make a good story about Marston and Dutch's early outlaw days if that's what they decided to do, but it's not a story that really cries out to be told, and in a brand new game there's no real incentive not to focus on another set of new and interesting characters. The West was a big place.
there's also the general world links in the GTA games. the BAWSAQ and Pisswasser, along with the locations themselves. beyond that the games are pretty much stand alone with a few threads linking them here and there. would not be at all surprised if they handle the RDR games in a similar fashion.
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Absurdity MatrixTumbledown GloryOn the OutskirtsRegistered Userregular
Possibly. But on the other hand, you could make a Red Dead game set in a lot of different eras. "Western" is as much a stylistic and tonal choice as it is a chronological setting.
One of my pipe dreams has always been that they would make a "Red Dead" game set in the gangsters-and-G-men era of the depression, with the old-school automobiles and what have you. Or they could even go full-blown modern a la Cormac McCarthy/No Country For Old Men. Not that I think they're doing that with this release, but it's an interesting hypothetical.
I'm with you on style and tone being key to a Western, even if the setting might not fit a "Red Dead" game. For a chronological sequel, my dream was to set it in the Russian Civil War and name it "Red Dead Revolution".
Possibly. But on the other hand, you could make a Red Dead game set in a lot of different eras. "Western" is as much a stylistic and tonal choice as it is a chronological setting.
One of my pipe dreams has always been that they would make a "Red Dead" game set in the gangsters-and-G-men era of the depression, with the old-school automobiles and what have you. Or they could even go full-blown modern a la Cormac McCarthy/No Country For Old Men. Not that I think they're doing that with this release, but it's an interesting hypothetical.
I'm with you on style and tone being key to a Western, even if the setting might not fit a "Red Dead" game. For a chronological sequel, my dream was to set it in the Russian Civil War and name it "Red Dead Revolution".
I WANT IT TO BE THIS NOW.
Based on what I'm hearing, this game will be a Marston prequel. I'm not super excited about going back when John's story's already been told, but I trust these folks to do good work with it. Personally, I wanted the chronology to advance a bit, past where we ended up with Jack, where people are starting to switch to M1911s.
Just give me the leather duster right from the start so I don't have to wear anything else. That was my favorite outfit in the first game. Looked so badass.
Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
Possibly. But on the other hand, you could make a Red Dead game set in a lot of different eras. "Western" is as much a stylistic and tonal choice as it is a chronological setting.
One of my pipe dreams has always been that they would make a "Red Dead" game set in the gangsters-and-G-men era of the depression, with the old-school automobiles and what have you. Or they could even go full-blown modern a la Cormac McCarthy/No Country For Old Men. Not that I think they're doing that with this release, but it's an interesting hypothetical.
I'm with you on style and tone being key to a Western, even if the setting might not fit a "Red Dead" game. For a chronological sequel, my dream was to set it in the Russian Civil War and name it "Red Dead Revolution".
Just give me the leather duster right from the start so I don't have to wear anything else. That was my favorite outfit in the first game. Looked so badass.
Just let me be a zombie saloon gal right from the start so I don't have to be anything else. That was my favorite outfit in the first game. Looked so badass.
I'm kind of wondering how they'll do the map in the sequel. RDR was a pastiche of pretty much EVERY environment we'd consider western, from the swampy bits near Louisiana to the rocky wilderness of Wyoming.
I'm kind of wondering how they'll do the map in the sequel. RDR was a pastiche of pretty much EVERY environment we'd consider western, from the swampy bits near Louisiana to the rocky wilderness of Wyoming.
There was that map leak from a few months back. Whether or not it's real is anyone's guess right now:
Well, we'll know it's fake if RDR2 even mentions Mexico.
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
Interesting region names. Roanoke and Cumberland are cities in VA and MD, respectively, though Cumblerland is right on the MD/WV border. That would keep in line with RDR's compressed America.
Though Rockstar tends to be less on-the-nose than that when it comes to naming.
Honestly I don't give a shit what the map is. We're getting RDR2!
Here's a more readable version of that map, combined with RDR's territories of New Austin and Nuevo Paraiso for comparison. The new territory is noticeably bigger, but not unbelievably so. Although the it's kind of silly in a way, since we have no idea how the scale of the respective games would compare (ie, West Elizabeth, which is in both maps, might be bigger or smaller on the new map even if it was shaped just exactly the same), but it's interesting to look at at least.
Who knows if the leak is even genuine; I wouldn't be surprised if it isn't. And even if it was genuine at the time it was leaked, some of that content might get cut or changed by the final release. And it may be nothing but a mockup or a fake.
It sure looks like the kind of map Rockstar tends to make, though, with the names changed just enough that you understand what they reference, variation in the (presumed) biomes, settlements spaced out at regular intervals, and what have you. And it was leaked several months ago, before there was anything but rumors that they were working on an RDR sequel.
New Bordeaux, the big city that Mafia 3 is going to take place in, is also on the map, for what that's worth. RDR, GTA, and Mafia are all published by Take-Two Interactive, so that kind of cross-pollination isn't impossible, but that's not how R* usually likes to do things, which makes me a little more skeptical of it. And it seems a little weird that the railroad doesn't reach Blackwater, the second-largest settlement judging by green space.
its worth noting that the bottom left corner is the last area you open up in RDR, Tall Trees and the Great Plains. not sure if that makes it more likely to be legit, or less so, but interesting that its in there.
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SteevLWhat can I do for you?Registered Userregular
So Brad Shoemaker mentioned on twitter how great the soundtrack to RDR was, and this guy replied with this interesting series of tweets about it:
...set it in the Russian Civil War and name it "Red Dead Revolution".
Honestly not sure if serious.
Oh, I kinda am. Considering the previous game touched on the demise of the "old west", I tried to think of other takes or alternate settings that might be fun or interesting. That was my favorite that wasn't derivative of Last Man Standing or The Good, the Bad, the Weird, but I admit a big part of my amusement is the joke in the title.
(Disclaimer: I did chose my username to basically mean "orderly presented nonsense".)
We know all we need to of John's story, so I kinda hope he's relegated to a bit role if so. Dutch's might be interesting, but there's no easy cutoff between his story and John's, and a lot of thematic similarities anyway.
Could support the prequel theory? Or is it confirmed to be a prequel?
I also thought that one character looked an awful lot like Bill Williamson. Of course, all those guys have bushy facial hair, and the real similarity is in the hat, which could be meaningless. Also, none of the men look like Javier Escuela, and I don't think the "John" looks particularly like Marston.
A little speculation:
According to the original game, Dutch's gang began more idealistic than it turned out in the end. Dutch taught John basic literacy, for instance, and we know he (Dutch) was sort of a radical anarchist/primitivist/would-be revolutionary. But over time Dutch started going the Kurtz route and became more interested in destroying everything, and the rest of his gang was caught up with him in his madness (kind of like Blood Meridian, now that I think about it).
If they do revisit that story, they could do some interesting stuff with it. Say, we have multiple protagonists who are in the gang for different reasons - some idealistic, some venal. That could culminate in forcing some pretty powerful choices on the player, and both GTA5 and GTA4 (to a lesser extent) got their climax by making the player choose the ultimate fate of their allies. So, if it does focus on Dutch's gang in its heyday, our protagonists may be new members of that gang, with the old ones as crucial NPCs, with the crucial choice being to stay or to leave when the spiral of violence begins to get worse. There's a lot they could do with that.
I'm still hoping for all-new characters. I like the original RDR story, and I feel it's complete as-is. But a prequel might still be pretty cool in its own right.
Duffel on
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
The very first time I saw the silhouettes I immediately saw the one right of center and never even questioned for a second that it was Bill Williamson.
I could be down for playing as Dutch. I'd prefer it keeps to 1 character but I fear it's going to jump around like GTAV.
I wouldn't mind multiple characters. That made for some really fun missions in GTAV, like the heists or that mission where you pull that poor bastard out of that government building.
Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
Speaking of Dutch, the ONLY thing that bugged me about the original game was that Marston's final confrontation with the actual guy who shot him was kinda anticlimactic.
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
PSN: Waybackkidd
"...only mights and maybes."
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SteevLWhat can I do for you?Registered Userregular
Posts
well find out on Thursday. maybe.
Oh, on an R* release schedule I don't disagree. Like I said, pipe dream.
On an Ubisoft release schedule there's a lot of interesting things they could do with an IP like Red Dead. It's the sort of thing I think it'd be fun to fund anonymously if I won the powerball.
yeah, well there's almost nothing* that Ubisoft can't/wont drive into the ground. but still, while you can do a (quasi-)Western in other time periods, it can also be difficult to pull off. for example it would be really easy for a 20s set gangser/G-men game to just become another gangster/mafia type game. so for me, i think its best to just stick to the Old West for Westerns. at least until there's more of them, and developers have a better idea of what makes a Western game and can then translate that into other time periods and settings.
of course, if someone wants to take a crack at a modern or even 20th Century Western, i'm not going to complain.
*their latest BG&E tease better lead to something or so fucking help me God.
Not sure if you think you're making a point but we're saying we hope it's not a prequel because we don't know what the story is soooo... try again?
It depends on how you look at it. There is almost no continuity in the GTA series from generation to generation, but within those generations there was a shitload of overlap. So, the PS2 games (GTA3, Vice City, San Andreas) had lots of overlapping characters, as did the GTA4 games and GTA5. But the protagonists and overall story were different from game to game.
Red Dead has a much smaller reference pool (only 2 games), so it's harder to notice a pattern. There were tiny references in Redemption to events that happened in Revolver, but they were very obscure and only the sort of thing you'd notice if you were OCD or spent a lot of time reading the wiki. For the most part Redemption was entirely its own story with no overlap at all with its predecessor, other than a pack of DLC multiplayer skins.
I'm personally not expecting the plot or protag to have anything to do with Marston/Dutch until I hear otherwise (which may be about 48 hours from now). By the time RDR2 comes out, Redemption will be nearly 8 years old. We know the ending of the story, and we know everything we really need to know about how it began. I'm sure they can make a good story about Marston and Dutch's early outlaw days if that's what they decided to do, but it's not a story that really cries out to be told, and in a brand new game there's no real incentive not to focus on another set of new and interesting characters. The West was a big place.
I'm with you on style and tone being key to a Western, even if the setting might not fit a "Red Dead" game. For a chronological sequel, my dream was to set it in the Russian Civil War and name it "Red Dead Revolution".
DO IT
I WANT IT TO BE THIS NOW.
Based on what I'm hearing, this game will be a Marston prequel. I'm not super excited about going back when John's story's already been told, but I trust these folks to do good work with it. Personally, I wanted the chronology to advance a bit, past where we ended up with Jack, where people are starting to switch to M1911s.
Honestly not sure if serious.
Just let me be a zombie saloon gal right from the start so I don't have to be anything else. That was my favorite outfit in the first game. Looked so badass.
Also, if it is a prequel, it should totally be about Nigel West Dickens ;P
There was that map leak from a few months back. Whether or not it's real is anyone's guess right now:
Though Rockstar tends to be less on-the-nose than that when it comes to naming.
Honestly I don't give a shit what the map is. We're getting RDR2!
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
Who knows if the leak is even genuine; I wouldn't be surprised if it isn't. And even if it was genuine at the time it was leaked, some of that content might get cut or changed by the final release. And it may be nothing but a mockup or a fake.
It sure looks like the kind of map Rockstar tends to make, though, with the names changed just enough that you understand what they reference, variation in the (presumed) biomes, settlements spaced out at regular intervals, and what have you. And it was leaked several months ago, before there was anything but rumors that they were working on an RDR sequel.
New Bordeaux, the big city that Mafia 3 is going to take place in, is also on the map, for what that's worth. RDR, GTA, and Mafia are all published by Take-Two Interactive, so that kind of cross-pollination isn't impossible, but that's not how R* usually likes to do things, which makes me a little more skeptical of it. And it seems a little weird that the railroad doesn't reach Blackwater, the second-largest settlement judging by green space.
I'll copy and paste them here so you don't have to click on twitter:
One of the guys who actually worked on the music also chimed in, which was interesting, but I'll leave it at that.
Oh, I kinda am. Considering the previous game touched on the demise of the "old west", I tried to think of other takes or alternate settings that might be fun or interesting. That was my favorite that wasn't derivative of Last Man Standing or The Good, the Bad, the Weird, but I admit a big part of my amusement is the joke in the title.
(Disclaimer: I did chose my username to basically mean "orderly presented nonsense".)
Could support the prequel theory? Or is it confirmed to be a prequel?
there are no 'cel shading' rumors.
Still looking forward to the trailer though.
Red Dead Redemption? More like Cel Ceal Celcemption.
I also thought that one character looked an awful lot like Bill Williamson. Of course, all those guys have bushy facial hair, and the real similarity is in the hat, which could be meaningless. Also, none of the men look like Javier Escuela, and I don't think the "John" looks particularly like Marston.
A little speculation:
According to the original game, Dutch's gang began more idealistic than it turned out in the end. Dutch taught John basic literacy, for instance, and we know he (Dutch) was sort of a radical anarchist/primitivist/would-be revolutionary. But over time Dutch started going the Kurtz route and became more interested in destroying everything, and the rest of his gang was caught up with him in his madness (kind of like Blood Meridian, now that I think about it).
If they do revisit that story, they could do some interesting stuff with it. Say, we have multiple protagonists who are in the gang for different reasons - some idealistic, some venal. That could culminate in forcing some pretty powerful choices on the player, and both GTA5 and GTA4 (to a lesser extent) got their climax by making the player choose the ultimate fate of their allies. So, if it does focus on Dutch's gang in its heyday, our protagonists may be new members of that gang, with the old ones as crucial NPCs, with the crucial choice being to stay or to leave when the spiral of violence begins to get worse. There's a lot they could do with that.
I'm still hoping for all-new characters. I like the original RDR story, and I feel it's complete as-is. But a prequel might still be pretty cool in its own right.
I could be down for playing as Dutch. I'd prefer it keeps to 1 character but I fear it's going to jump around like GTAV.
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
"...only mights and maybes."
Protip to make this more bearable in two easy screenshots:
Step 1:
Step 2: